# Under the lid of a Barisa Express



## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Finally fitted a new felt washer as I'll be using some different beans shortly - not too sure how short shortly will be. I'll probably wait until I've tried 3 roast levels of the same bean.









It can be changed without taking the lid off. If needed again I don't think I'll bother removing it next time. Long nose pliers are needed to get down to it either way to remove the part that exposes it.

The pipes to the shower screen that I bought that turned into a shower head can be seen. One of the connections is used to feed the pressure gauge. The other is water in to the grouphead. The thermoblock output roots to a solenoid and then to the shower head.

As I have always worked in product d&d I find looking interesting. Masses of wires go to the front panel with the switches etc on it. All tidy inside though and some impressive quality control. The black "strip" running across between heat and the grinder looks to be a heat shield.

While I was at it I checked the burr settings. On finest setting they are rubbing slightly, just enough to slow the motor down a touch. I also meant to check how much the burr moves from finest to coarsest but forgot. No point really unless some one can tell me how much of a turn on say a Super Jolly takes to cover the espresso range.

John

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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Unless the pitch and the diameter of the threaded adjuster is the same then it would be meaning less, also unless the burr's where the same again it would be meaningless.

If you wish to know the movement per notch for the Mazzer Mini A look at past posts as I calculated this.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

True but it will give me some idea and a conical would be a better bet but I do have a grinder that is rather similar to a super jolly. Main point really is how much to cover typical espresso grinds. Tried to find your post but no luck at all.

John

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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Another point to bear in mind is that the grind can and will vary considerably depending on type of bean , roast level, age/ freshness , humidity type and condition of burr's


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

El carajillo said:


> Another point to bear in mind is that the grind can and will vary considerably depending on type of bean , roast level, age/ freshness , humidity type and condition of burr's


That's the question really - how much. I'd guess on something like a Mazzer and other similar grinders it's a faction of a turn to cover the entire range but just how big a fraction.

John

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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

ajohn said:


> That's the question really - how much. I'd guess on something like a Mazzer and other similar grinders it's a faction of a turn to cover the entire range but just how big a fraction.
> 
> John
> 
> -


Across the whole gamut I would guess 30 - 40 deg possibly a touch more.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Thanks.It's a bit academic really but I had seen a comment that the grinder built into a Sage Barista Express just covers the espresso range and wanted some way to check. That should give me a rough idea.

John

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## Missy (Mar 9, 2016)

ajohn said:


> Thanks.It's a bit academic really but I had seen a comment that the grinder built into a Sage Barista Express just covers the espresso range and wanted some way to check. That should give me a rough idea.
> 
> John
> 
> -


But what's the adjustment mechanism on a BE? What do you mean by "just covers" do you mean "won't grind for French press" or "barely grinds fine enough for espresso"?

Is there anyone nearby with a broader range of kit that you could visit for a play? That way you could compare what you have with what other people have, and see how different techniques can ease and improve taste and workflow.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Missy said:


> But what's the adjustment mechanism on a BE? What do you mean by "just covers" do you mean "won't grind for French press" or "barely grinds fine enough for espresso"?
> 
> Is there anyone nearby with a broader range of kit that you could visit for a play? That way you could compare what you have with what other people have, and see how different techniques can ease and improve taste and workflow.


It's set up to grind for espresso and nothing else and will grind more than fine enough for that. I'd assume that coarser than is likely to be needed at the other end as well. The burrs are moved via gears so Sage could make them move as much as they like - similar to the grinders that are sometimes called magic roundabouts except the range is limited and it has graduations.

The reason I asked the initial question is just curiosity. I will at some point measure how much the burrs move from finest to coarsest. In part because people sometimes choose a DTP on the basis that some other grinder has more steps - true but those cover all methods. The BE shouldn't and very probably doesn't. I'd like to know out of curiosity. I don't have any problems with it. They use the same burrs on some far more expensive machines.

I've already concluded that workflow discussion are totally out with you. As I said previously in real terms I do exactly what you do but in a different way.

John

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## Rakesh (Jun 3, 2017)

ajohn said:


> The reason I asked the initial question is just curiosity. I will at some point measure how much the burrs move from finest to coarsest. In part because people sometimes choose a DTP on the basis that some other grinder has more steps - true but those cover all methods. The BE shouldn't and very probably doesn't. I'd like to know out of curiosity. I don't have any problems with it. They use the same burrs on some far more expensive machines.
> 
> -


I find the reason some people choose grinders such as a Mazzers or other ex-commercials to pair with their dtp instead of the BE is not because it has more steps but rather smaller steps or no steps, this means they can reach grind sizes that wouldn't be possible on a BE. Your barista express has small conical burrs, these actually wont be used on far more expensive grinders.

The other grinder you have may not be as similar to the super jolly as you think, even if it runs 64mm flats it may run at a different rpm and be built differently, perhaps the burrs are poorly aligned due to poor construction. This could mean even the grinder in the BE outperforms it.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Rakesh said:


> I find the reason some people choose grinders such as a Mazzers or other ex-commercials to pair with their dtp instead of the BE is not because it has more steps but rather smaller steps or no steps, this means they can reach grind sizes that wouldn't be possible on a BE. Your barista express has small conical burrs, these actually wont be used on far more expensive grinders.
> 
> The other grinder you have may not be as similar to the super jolly as you think, even if it runs 64mm flats it may run at a different rpm and be built differently, perhaps the burrs are poorly aligned due to poor construction. This could mean even the grinder in the BE outperforms it.


The only way to check a grinder really in the end is how easy it is to tune using it's adjustment mechanism. My impression of the BE adjustment is that 1/2 steps wouldn't be a bad idea but not entirely sure i need them really as I manage. The 64mm grinder I have is the Doge,







Pity it's not the 83. They claim to have taken some trouble to ensure the burrs are parallel. Speed wise it's the same as all of them seem to be circa 1200rpm. Maybe that gets lower as the burr diameter goes up.

There are various views on conical versus flat burrs. This is a popular view


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## Missy (Mar 9, 2016)

There's a world of difference between the big (commercial style) and the small (home user) conicals. The real way to test the efficacy and wonderment of a grinder is with a set of sieves (search on here for kruve sieves) and potentially a refractometer, to see how the grind distribution affects the end product.

There's a reason people pay out for extremely expensive grinders, or sacrifice style for functionality with a big commercial machine... It's because it makes a coffee that tastes better in the cup. To me the different between a home grinder and my superjolly is massive, and those differences continue up the scale (though probably to a lesser degree the more you spend, as you pay for things like OD or single dosing or the name on the badge, or the style, or other ease of use functions) but near the bottom end the differences are massive and obvious.


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