# Bottled water - Coop's Fairbourne



## evoman (May 13, 2014)

I'm thinking of trying some bottled water and I have read the endorsement of various options - sounds like Volvic gets a lot of support, but I am trying to see if I can find something that I can buy near my office. The shop (supplied largely by Coop, though they are not a Coop!) carries Volvic, but only flavoured waters from what I have seen. The have a few brands (I think Buxton) and the Coop branded one labelled as Fairbourne. I did a forum search and don't see a single reference to this option - anyone have any experience that they can share?

Cheers

(p.s., I am currently using water from a purifier that measures as very soft, but I am not sure how good an option it is, other than as a prevention for scale)


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

I'm no expert but if you have the opportunity it's worth either posting a link to a site which has the breakdown of the water contents for minerals etc. or taking a photo of the label. Also one of the forum members sites (Xpenno) has other helpful hints, should you wish to "help yourself" http://grindscience.com/category/articles/ and perhaps specifically http://grindscience.com/2015/02/interpreting-water-bottle-labels/


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Too soft isn't ideal either - makes the coffee taste funny (technical term!) and if it's *really* soft apparently it can leach metal from the boiler, from what I've read.

From memory Buxton is a "mineral water" in the true sense and has a very high content of calcium which will contribute to scale. (I don't have the Buxton analysis in front of me so I might be thinking of another brand) but if you can find a water with a similar composition to Volvic, or at least similar Total Dry Residue figures, that'll get you somewhere!


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## evoman (May 13, 2014)

hotmetal said:


> Too soft isn't ideal either - makes the coffee taste funny (technical term!) and if it's *really* soft apparently it can leach metal from the boiler, from what I've read.
> 
> From memory Buxton is a "mineral water" in the true sense and has a very high content of calcium which will contribute to scale. (I don't have the Buxton analysis in front of me so I might be thinking of another brand) but if you can find a water with a similar composition to Volvic, or at least similar Total Dry Residue figures, that'll get you somewhere!


This is the reason I am interested in trying something bottled - i.e., that the water I am using is simply too soft (given we get basically no limescale at all!), and I agree, Buxton is presumably too hard to bother with (so I had written it off). I am tempted to measure the dry residual value myself if I cannot find it! But I assume it is on the label...


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

evoman said:


> This is the reason I am interested in trying something bottled - i.e., that the water I am using is simply too soft (given we get basically no limescale at all!), and I agree, Buxton is presumably too hard to bother with (so I had written it off). I am tempted to measure the dry residual value myself if I cannot find it! But I assume it is on the label...


No Tesco nearby? Their Ashbeck is good.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Should find most of the info you need in this report

http://www.buckscc.gov.uk/media/137448/food_water_survey.pdf

Edit: According to this, a high Cal content, which wont be great for your machine.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

I think it should be on the label, at least on the larger sizes. I'd expect (but don't know) that there's some sort of legal requirement to advise customers on the composition of anything sold as "mineral water". I personally use either volvic or Tesco Ashbeck. Volvic tastes a bit nicer but Ashbeck is sold in 5l bottles in the Tesco Express next door to me so I go for the easy option sometimes. Some people on here don't like it but I think it's acceptable and should hopefully not be scaling up my Rocket.

TDS is 80mg/l, of which calcium is 10. It's slightly more acidic than volvic at pH6.2

By contrast my tap water is 300+ mg/l TDS so even if Ashbeck isn't "the connoisseur's choice" it beats tap water by a country mile.


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

@Xpenno - have you seen this before? It's a pretty decent review of many bottles of water for certain content, including Fairbourne Springs Still Natural Mineral Water http://www.buckscc.gov.uk/media/137448/food_water_survey.pdf - the appendix shows information but the only thing I don't know is if any of the figures correlate to Bicarbonates mg/L (or ppm) that you mention in your article?


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## evoman (May 13, 2014)

Thanks for all the info - there is a Tesco that I can stop in, though it is one of their smaller local ones, so might not carry the large bottles.

The table of water content is really useful - the Volvic is certainly very low in most minerals (and low colony count!). The Co-op one is much higher, so clearly not a great option.

The Ashbeck has a very different profile than Volvic, so interesting that the two are typically both recommended (especially since the Ashbeck is basic/alkaline, while Volvic is almost perfectly neutral).

Inspired by this thread, I just re-tested the water here using a kit I picked up on the weekend. It tests as being as low as the kit will go in terms of hardness (which is 20ppm), so clearly VERY soft.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

evoman said:


> It tests as being as low as the kit will go in terms of hardness (which is 20ppm), so clearly VERY soft.


Same as my Manchester tap water!


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

Buxton is "carp" for making coffee with from my own non scientific testing of different waters for brewed and to go in the Silvia, where I tried it and dependant on the face pulled rejected or accepted until settled on either Waitrose essential or Ashbeck or a BWT MG2+ filter jug which is quite passable.

Apparently the only other water to make me gurn to the same level as Buxton was Morrisons own.

Volvic is nice but just hideously expensive. Currently working through a stash of Waitrose essential having cleared out the Stratford upon Store whilst passing last Saturday ( a whole tolley full of water and 1 packet of vermicelli., manager took pity and scenned them all in the trolley, didn't seem fazed so clearly other caffeine addicts frequent that branch!)

John


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## forzajuve (Feb 2, 2011)

Volvic has by far the best Mg/Ca ratio of any bottled water although the total Mg ion content is fairly low (maybe 1/4 of a possible target range). However any elevated Mg content will come with increased Ca also which is almost always more abundant which is not desired from scale build up. So as an off the shelf solution Volvic is probably the best out there but you will not be extracting as much as you could given the low ionic content of Mg/Ca.


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## Drewster (Dec 1, 2013)

johnealey said:


> Volvic is nice but just *hideously expensive*.


Hideously expensive?? Really?

FFS it is 60p for 1.5 litre bottle or 2 for a quid at the moment

and even cheaper if you buy a pack.

OK Waitrose essential is cheaper... but you could use VOSS and get a pretty bottle!


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

When you buy it 40 bottles at a time the difference mounts up, and then theres the size difference to take into account: 2 x1.5l volvic for a £1 (33.3p/l when on offer) or 4x 2l Waitrose for £1.50 (18.75p/l). That to me is hideously expensive given the difference is not almost twice the amount and probably crucially still doing lots of flush's on the silvia.

John


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

?


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

apologies all, sent the thread a bit squirly, defending my own view of something that was not intended to cause any offence or comment especially as OP was asking about co-op fairbourne 

John

p.s. next machine will need to be plumbed in so question of what is best bottled wise will become to me, less of an issue.


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## evoman (May 13, 2014)

Dylan said:


> Same as my Manchester tap water!


After living for a while in Manchester the topic of water hardness was foreign to me, and it was thrust starkly back into my life when moving to an area with super hard water. I never knew how well I had it in Manchester!


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Xpenno said:


> ?


That's a first, posted form my pocket!


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## Phil104 (Apr 15, 2014)

Xpenno said:


> That's a first, posted form my pocket!


By thought alone?


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

jlarkin said:


> @Xpenno - have you seen this before? It's a pretty decent review of many bottles of water for certain content, including Fairbourne Springs Still Natural Mineral Water http://www.buckscc.gov.uk/media/137448/food_water_survey.pdf - the appendix shows information but the only thing I don't know is if any of the figures correlate to Bicarbonates mg/L (or ppm) that you mention in your article?


Yeah have a copy in my water folder, no bicarb = useless..... There is no way to even guesstimate it....

Pretty sure I looked at the coop water last week and it has decent hardness but alkalinity is high which isn't good.

If you want something textbook on paper but shocking in the cup then Asda Value water is pretty much bang on SCAA spec. Tastes grim









Water options are

Bottles - Use volvic for spro and volvic or waitrose for brewed.

Filter - If you have hard water, get a decent filter. IMHO this is better than any bottled.

Make your own - PITA but makes the best coffee I've tasted.


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Phil104 said:


> By thought alone?


Haha, doubt it, not much going on up there...


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## Phil104 (Apr 15, 2014)

Xpenno said:


> Haha, doubt it, not much going on up there...


Dunno, the mind works in mysterious ways&#8230;..as you and 24,000 readers of this thread realised.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Xpenno said:


> Make your own - PITA but makes the best coffee I've tasted.


Very worth the effort ; )


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

For those of us with Rockets, any suggestion we make our own water might tempt us to combine elemental oxygen and hydrogen. See you in the next galaxy chaps!


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

johnealey said:


> Currently working through a stash of Waitrose essential having cleared out the Stratford upon Store whilst passing last Saturday ( a whole tolley full of water and 1 packet of vermicelli., manager took pity and scenned them all in the trolley, didn't seem fazed so clearly other caffeine addicts frequent that branch!)
> 
> John


Maybe he figured you're one of those end of days storing up for the apocalypse types and its best not to challenge them on anything. Little did he realise that's just a weeks worth of coffee


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