# Leaking around portafilter



## johnlevon

What does it imply when my Piccino leaks water around the head whilst brewing?

I've noticed this happen when my grind is finer - and pretty much always with the single portafilter.

For example, I ground 15g into the double basket, and tamped relatively gently (AFAIK).

It took around 4 seconds for the first coffee to come through, and saw the slightly translucent colour after 15s,

giving 45g of liquid.

Since I'm supposed to aim for 25 seconds, I'd presume my grind isn't fine enough, but the head

is already leaking a little water at that point - any finer and it starts spraying.

Suggestions? Thanks!


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## froggystyle

New o seal?


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## Tewdric

Yeah just needs a new group o ring - very straightforward to fix.


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## El carajillo

Check the existing seal and make sure that it is clean and no coffee grounds sticking to it.

Always worth replacing as they harden through continual heating /use.


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## marcuswar

As an emergency measure until you get a new seal, you could always try flipping the seal over to use the other side.


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## johnlevon

Thanks, but just to clarify: are you all saying that it should *never* leak even if the grind is too tight to get water through? So if it ever leaks then the seal is bad?

I've only had it a few months.

Is there a guide? I'm rather nervous I'd just damage the thing.


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## Kyle548

Generally, if the seal is fresh and the right size it shouldn't leak even with a backing plate in.

You should have stopped the pour long before the any of the seals start to leak.


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## froggystyle

The seal is there to keep the water under pressure where it should be, between group head and basket.

Should never leak out of the side of the PF, ever.

Just get a flat screwdriver and gently ease the old gasket out, you will more than likely end up sticking the screwdriver through the gasket, but if you get a new one first, no matter!


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## froggystyle

Is the machine new?


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## marcuswar

A dentist pick is useful for getting the seal out. You can sort of hook it into the side of the rubber seal and pull it downward. You can usually get one cheaply as part of a set ( pick, mirror etc). I got mine from the pound shop.


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## El carajillo

johnlevon said:


> Thanks, but just to clarify: are you all saying that it should *never* leak even if the grind is too tight to get water through? So if it ever leaks then the seal is bad?
> 
> I've only had it a few months.
> 
> Is there a guide? I'm rather nervous I'd just damage the thing.


No matter how tight the grind it should not leak. It should also not leak with a blind (back flushing basket) in. If it leaks either the seal is faulty /damaged, hard and aged, has coffee grounds stuck to it or you may have a dink (dent) in the edge of your basket. (caused by knocking out puck against metal container.


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## Drewster

That reminds me-

I did speak to someone who was going to send me a new seal...

I'd forgotten about that (as I haven't had any more issues)....

Obviously the person I spoke to also forgot :-(

Oh well I guess I should just buy one!!!


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## Kyle548

I just did two seals, the seal for the group head bell and then the group seal.

Its not hard to replace seals, but it is maddening.


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## johnlevon

It's a few weeks old...


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## johnlevon

I tried with the blank filter and it leaks like buggery after about 10 seconds, so definitely something wrong with the seal I think. I tried cleaning the whole surroundings as well to no effect. Thanks.


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## El carajillo

Does the porta- filter lock in at about 6 oclock or does it go past closer to 5 0/clock. According to parts list it should be a 8.5 mm group seal.

Try removing the seal, use a sharp pointed awl or similar, press it into the edge and try to "flick"/lever" it down and out. Examine it for damage and check thickness.


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## gwapenut

I was supplied a spare seal when i received my brand new cherub


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## johnlevon

It in fact went past nearer 5 o clock as you suggest. I got a replacement seal from Espresso Underground. I've removed the old one (didn't seem too hard to me), but I cannot for the life of me get the new one back in. Even oiled it won't go in no matter what force I apply - the housing flexes instead so I can't provide any leverage. Not yet to the point where I can get the portafilter back in. Any ideas or this is going to have to back to somebody who knows what they're doing


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## johnlevon

Just realised the existing washer was 8mm and the replacement is 8.5mm which might explain it...


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## johnlevon

Can't get the 8mm in either. Am I supposed to remove the "filter holder washer locking plate" (FC104B) ? The name would imply so, but I don't know how...


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## El carajillo

Yes remove that then try again, insert as far as possible then use P/F and basket to fully install then replace plate. What oil did you put on ? should go in without lubrication but IF you do use Molycote 111 sparingly. This is suitable for most needs on coffee machines


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## johnlevon

How do I remove it? There is no service manual and no indication of how to do so...

I had veg oil on it as mentioned in various places.


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## El carajillo

If you remove the centre screw will it release the screen and the block behind or there may also be fixings behind the screen same as on the Classic


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## urbanbumpkin

johnlevon said:


> How do I remove it? There is no service manual and no indication of how to do so...


How did you remove the old one? Something like a dentist pick might be good to hook it out. On some machines the filer screen has a slight ridge on it that allows you to carefully lever it out. I don't know your machine though.

Ignore my post I've just seen El Carajillo's


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## johnlevon

Thanks, but I don't think it's that - I had already removed the screw and the screen as part of removing the seal, but the brass part (the locking plate as the parts manual calls it) is still solid. You can see it here:









it forms a lip over the well where the seal fits back in and that seems like part of the problem...


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