# Online Shopping



## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

Hi,

I am after a Bezzera BZ10 and the only UK based shop that stock it is Bella Barista. Otherwise I've found it on espressocoffeeshop.com in Italy and diecrema.de in Germany, both stock this model at a much lower price but they are oversea!

Can you suggest any good online UK-based shop that sells Bezzera or any other semi-commercial brand?

Thanks


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

I think BB are the only UK importer and distributor of Bezzera.

What are the delivery costs if you buy from the other 2 sources? Remember if something goes wrong, returning the machine will be more of a pain to these places than to BB, and BB you can probably go see the machine and talk to them about it before you buy.


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

aaronb said:


> I think BB are the only UK importer and distributor of Bezzera.
> 
> What are the delivery costs if you buy from the other 2 sources? Remember if something goes wrong, returning the machine will be more of a pain to these places than to BB, and BB you can probably go see the machine and talk to them about it before you buy.


That is also my fear! But then the Italian website, which turns out to be in the same village where the Bezzera factory is (coincidence?), sends the machine for free at £787 against the £949 of BB, the German website sells it for £787 + 30 delivery.......so....?!?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Service from bella is first rate and many happy forum members have bought from there. Peace of mind., great after sales service, and being uk based with an impeccable reputation are worth the extra money in my opinion.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

BB will simply receive the machine at cost a, add their mark up and sell at cost b. They might not sell as many machines and receive a smaller volume discount. But, they have built up a fantastic reputation over the years and not just on this forum for customer service. I am not saying that you will not receive the same service overseas, but I would urge you to check the cost of returning your machine at least once within the 2 years, then the gap will not be so small. An insurance policy is the biggest waste of money, until you need to make a claim, so do not be fooled on price alone.

Can I also ask why you are selecting this machine? One of our forum members has the Miticia and he likes it. I had a Stega and quite liked it.


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

dfk41 said:


> BB will simply receive the machine at cost a, add their mark up and sell at cost b. They might not sell as many machines and receive a smaller volume discount. But, they have built up a fantastic reputation over the years and not just on this forum for customer service. I am not saying that you will not receive the same service overseas, but I would urge you to check the cost of returning your machine at least once within the 2 years, then the gap will not be so small. An insurance policy is the biggest waste of money, until you need to make a claim, so do not be fooled on price alone.
> 
> Can I also ask why you are selecting this machine? One of our forum members has the Miticia and he likes it. I had a Stega and quite liked it.


RE BB: yes! I agree on everything......I already bought my Vario from them and service was excellent!

RE BZ10: because it's a HX that doesn't cost a fortune (as in below £1000)!....alternative would be the Expobar Leva on BB for £899.....but between the two I would be inclined towards the Italian machine rather then the Spanish Expobar....


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Interesting, but I can tell you that there are a lot more Expobar owners on this forum than Bezzera. I am not knocking it at all but Bezzera are not huge over here, hence the fact I think BB are their sole UK representative. It is horses for courses but I doubt very much if someone blindfolded you are made you a drink on either machine, you could identify which one!


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

dfk41 said:


> Interesting, but I can tell you that there are a lot more Expobar owners on this forum than Bezzera. I am not knocking it at all but Bezzera are not huge over here, hence the fact I think BB are their sole UK representative. It is horses for courses but I doubt very much if someone blindfolded you are made you a drink on either machine, you could identify which one!


Indeed, they seem pretty much the same! Still, Italians have a huge tradition for espresso while Spanish don't and surely that must account for something! Also majority of machines out on the market are Italian, if I could afford it I would get a Rocket or Izzo or if I won the Lotto even a La Marzocco...but do I need one of those anyway?...NO!

Expobar might be big here because shops get good returns from selling it and the same might not be said for Bezzera. I don't know! Maybe Expobar is really that good and Bezzera is not and that's why one has been around the UK market and the other not. Still Bezzera is the oldest manufacturer of espresso machine in Italy and, again, that must account for something!

I have kind of reached the conclusion that ordering from Italy or Germany is big risk! So, I might wait for BB to put either one on offer and I'll let price dictate my decision!


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

But you need to realise, that in order to offer such high levels of service, BB have to have their pound of flesh! You cannot say if a machine is not Italian it is no good!

Go up to Bb and try them out or ring Claudette. She has one on test and may be thinking of moving it on, but mention the forum so she knows the source if your info.


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

dfk41 said:


> But you need to realise, that in order to offer such high levels of service, BB have to have their pound of flesh! You cannot say if a machine is not Italian it is no good!
> 
> Go up to Bb and try them out or ring Claudette. She has one on test and may be thinking of moving it on, but mention the forum so she knows the source if your info.


Would love to go there but I'm 5h drive away!

Re Italian: I'm from Milan so between the two I would have to get the one with the Milanese serpent on the badge


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Where abouts is 5 hours away


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

dfk41 said:


> Where abouts is 5 hours away


Edinburgh.....................!


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## glevum (Apr 4, 2013)

The BZ10 looks like a nice compact machine, I bought my Bezzera Mitica from BB at a knock down price of £1000 when they first stocked them. very happy with mine..though looking to getting a lever soon.


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

Agreed! I could spend £800 immediately or stretch it to £1000 later on in the year...so, I'll keep an eye out for promotions on BB and buy when an Italian fits the budget. Something in my guts tells me not to go near Spanish or English (no offense!) or German machines!

The Mitica looks nice! I was also considering the Unica but then I realized it's a glorified thermoblock (I think!) with a PID........


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

Or you could try MachinA Espresso in Edinburgh and see what they have in store. I think you would be better off stretching your budget to around £1k


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Noangel72 said:


> Agreed! I could spend £800 immediately or stretch it to £1000 later on in the year...so, I'll keep an eye out for promotions on BB and buy when an Italian fits the budget. Something in my guts tells me not to go near Spanish or English (no offense!) or German machines!
> 
> The Mitica looks nice! I was also considering the Unica but then I realized it's a glorified thermoblock (I think!) with a PID........


Yeah there are no good English machines .......


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

Mrboots2u said:


> Yeah there are no good English machines .......


Yeah and ECM from Germany are such utter crap I mean I wouldn't have a Contravento if they were giving them away .......


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

With you being an Italian I understand your allegiances to the home country am I'm really only pulling your leg but most of the e61 machines are made from bits from a limited number of suppliers anyway ( yes probably. Italian ) . The English machine beginning with L is put together by a man with an Italian sounding name in Birmingham , with a group from somewhere in Europe ( Switzerland ? ) Each to their own , the Italians know a thing or two about machines.

. The yanks make rubbish machines too , I wouldn't want a slayer .......


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## glevum (Apr 4, 2013)

Most ECM parts ( boiler, casing) are made by Bezzera. So its a made in Italy, assembled in Germany machine. Unless ECM have now gone all in house. The ECM Technika almost resembles the BZ Mitica.

I think Glenn recommended the ECM Heidelberg at BB. Good price too.


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

Charliej said:


> Or you could try MachinA Espresso in Edinburgh and see what they have in store. I think you would be better off stretching your budget to around £1k


Thanks! I didn't know the shop existed!

Re machine's maker: if they gave me an ECM for free I wouldn't refuse it either but if I have to pay £800-1000 out of my pocket I'd rather buy an Italian! After all, it is a reality that ECM and Francino both started their business after reselling Italian machines for many years and have been in the manufacturing business for a relatively short time when compared to Italian companies that have been around for well over a century now! I am not saying these do not make good machine, I have no direct experience anyway, but buying from the historical manufactures of espresso surely must make a difference.....that's all!


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

Mrboots2u said:


> With you being an Italian I understand your allegiances to the home country am I'm really only pulling your leg but most of the e61 machines are made from bits from a limited number of suppliers anyway ( yes probably. Italian ) . The English machine beginning with L is put together by a man with an Italian sounding name in Birmingham , with a group from somewhere in Europe ( Switzerland ? ) Each to their own , the Italians know a thing or two about machines.
> 
> . The yanks make rubbish machines too , I wouldn't want a slayer .......


Thanks! I didn't know that! To be honest I am relatively new to "proper" espresso making thus my inclination towards big Italian names....and then, of course! I am from Milan so I'd love to have a Milan-made machine in my kitchen rather than a German one.....


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Noangel72 said:


> Thanks! I didn't know that! To be honest I am relatively new to "proper" espresso making thus my inclination towards big Italian names....and then, of course! I am from Milan so I'd love to have a Milan-made machine in my kitchen rather than a German one.....


Like i said Italians know a things to to album machines ( Bosco family typify this ) .If your Italian then , why aren't you getting a lever machine , and being very traditional ....


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

And wasn't there some tie up between ECM and Rocket I know I have seen EC Giotto machines on ebay for example, and I'm using a rather expensive Chinese made machine. I guess what we are trying to say is all the European brands mentioned have great reputations no matter which country they come from.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

I think ECM made machines in the 80's , then the rights to the designs bought by the people from what became rocket , with one of the Italian guys staying on. ECM then became German ?


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

Mrboots2u said:


> With you being an Italian I understand your allegiances to the home country am I'm really only pulling your leg but most of the e61 machines are made from bits from a limited number of suppliers anyway ( yes probably. Italian ) . The English machine beginning with L is put together by a man with an Italian sounding name in Birmingham , with a group from somewhere in Europe ( Switzerland ? ) Each to their own , the Italians know a thing or two about machines.
> 
> . The yanks make rubbish machines too , I wouldn't want a slayer .......


I hear some Dutch bloke makes some ok ish machines too


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## Noangel72 (Dec 5, 2013)

Mrboots2u said:


> Like i said Italians know a things to to album machines ( Bosco family typify this ) .If your Italian then , why aren't you getting a lever machine , and being very traditional ....


I'd be happy with a well built, easy-to-use, and good looking machine! Now I have a Gaggia Classic, it's easy to use and it makes amazing coffee...but it looks cheap, the drip tray is a wobbly piece of plastic and the Silvia wand works well but it sits too low, it doesn't swivel ....etc! If I could get the same ease-of-use in a well-built, reliable and good-looking package then I would be happy!! Well!....the Gaggia struggles with the second coffee, so even a better, more performing boiler would be nice!


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Neill said:


> I hear some Dutch bloke makes some ok ish machines too


Yeah bit he started by fixing Italian ones and using the spares I think .......


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Mrboots2u said:


> I think ECM made machines in the 80's , then the rights to the designs bought by the people from what became rocket , with one of the Italian guys staying on. ECM then became German ?


There were two ECMs to make things confusing - the German one set up in the '90s collaborating with the longer established Italian ECM company which only produced, I believe, commercial machines at the time. The joint venture was to focus on the domestic market. Sadly the two halves fell out several years ago with the Rocket company acquiring the rights but they didn't read the small print - bit like VAG when it thought it was buying Rolls Royce and Bentley and only ended up with Bentley. ECM Germany produce machines that look identical to the Rockets.


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

Mrboots2u said:


> Yeah bit he started by fixing Italian ones and using the spares I think .......


I think you're right. The original speedster had a gs group on it?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Neill said:


> I think you're right. The original speedster had a gs group on it?


I think he was a la marzocco service engineer or worked for them In some capacity .


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## Machina Espresso (Aug 14, 2013)

Noangel72 said:


> Thanks! I didn't know the shop existed!


We do indeed! We have a shop in Tollcross with a few machines from Expobar and Rocket on display. We're happy to arrange demos if you're interested in particular machines and happy to advise on what could be best for you.

Give us a call on 0131 229 3495 or pop into the cafe for a chat!

Cheers

Michael


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