# which classic!



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

about to buy a classic as I've seen one for £145 but is this model the one to buy as I keep seeing them with different ref numbers Gaggia Classic RI8161?

I see some with a plastic cover over the steam wand,the one I'm looking to buy has a SS wand,are there different Classics?


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

Hi

As far as I know there is only 1 classic being made now. I got mine off Amazon for £165 which was an absolute steal. I did see some discussion recently on this as I think some are made in Italy and some in Romania. Either way the Philips Uk site shows the model I have.

You can get a stainless steel panerello wand for it if you search but many don't bother and get the Rancillio Silvia wand as it gives better results for micro foam.

Here's the SS wand.

http://www.seattlecoffeegear.com/Seattle-Coffee-Gear-Panarello-Replacement-Wand-p/scgp227431321.htm

and here's the silvia wand

http://www.happydonkey.co.uk/hdr0001.html

cheers


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

cheers for that,the wand info was needed too.

how long ago were they on Amazon at that price? they are out of stock with Amazon at the min price seems to be £199 or a returned one for around £150 but no warranty,think I might wait and see what the price is once they are back in stock as I think a warranty one would be better.

P.S think the price difference at some places had me wondering if it was the same model too currys £299 comet £350!!!!


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

hi

The price dropped around the start of December and stayed that way right through to January. I haven't checked in a while but see they are out of stock at £204.97.

However they are selling at £215, although sold by a third party it is fulfilled by Amazon which means you get the same customer service on this item, which in my opinion is a deal clincher.

As an example I got my first classic from them and suspected that the steam thermostat wasn't operating correctly so I returned it, completed the return form and they sent me a new one the next day. No questions asked, no hassle and I had 30 days to return the "faulty" unit. I can only imagine the pain trying to do this with any other on line retailer.

When I placed the original order they were also out of stock but I got an email off them saying it had been dispatched a couple of days after even though the main site still said out of stock.

One other thing, if you are serious about ordering off them, make sure someone is going to be around if you select the free shipping offer. Not sure if they still use them but mines was delivered by HDL ( home delivery network ) and the guy handed it to me & didn't need a signature. Of course if it should go "missing" Amazon will send you another no problem.

cheers


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

yeah my waiting seems to have the price going up not down,was only £199 a day ago,didn't know that about fulfilled by Amazon!

thing is,I was looking at the Silia which is about £430 and as the Gaggia is said to be as good or not far off I thought I might as well save some money but if I pay £215 for the Gaggia and then buy the new want as I need really good microfoam and a PF and basket as the Gaggia seems to get bad reviews,then I'm not far of Saliva money lol not easy the coffee lark!


----------



## Milesy (Mar 8, 2012)

It was 145 just before Christmas in currys. I had it my basket ready to order and went to sleep. No joke, the very next day it went up full price. I was nearly crying. held off In case it went up in jan but it didn't. So got from amazon but it shipped from Italy.


----------



## matsnor (Jan 20, 2012)

I got mine for 199 a month and a half ago roughly, and that was the absolute cheapest I was able to find them at that time.


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

snegger said:


> yeah my waiting seems to have the price going up not down,was only £199 a day ago,didn't know that about fulfilled by Amazon!
> 
> thing is,I was looking at the Silia which is about £430 and as the Gaggia is said to be as good or not far off I thought I might as well save some money but if I pay £215 for the Gaggia and then buy the new want as I need really good microfoam and a PF and basket as the Gaggia seems to get bad reviews,then I'm not far of Saliva money lol not easy the coffee lark!


I agree with you, I had the same thoughts myself and wanted the Silvia but the price drop on the Gaggia was too good. The Silvia is not 3 times better than the Gaggia and therefore wasn't worth almost 3 times the price. I've never used a Silvia but I'd still be reluctant to say it was even two times better.

Having said all that I do understand your logic, but remember, the only thing you really need to upgrade on the Gaggia right off is the basket and this will set you back about six pounds from happy donkey.

http://www.happydonkey.co.uk/hd0182-gaggia-single-filter-basket.html

Then you can buy the rest of the things you want at your leisure as your technique improves, maybe a naked porta filter would be next ( which you'd need to buy for the Silvia as well), then perhaps the steam wand upgrade if you fancied proper micro foam but this is not essential as it doesn't impact directly on the coffee produced.

If you are not desperate right away then hold off and check Amazon daily for a few weeks, the price may come down once it's back in stock, I know from experience that the prices on a lot of items can fluctuate daily.

cheers


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

thanks Ripley and CoffeeGeek,

think I will wait a couple of weeks and see if the price of the Gaggia comes down to a price I can't resist, to be honest CoffeeGeek's advice was in the back of my mind as a really important part of this buy is the machine's microfoam making ability,some advice and reviews put the two machines near enough equal on their steaming but others put the Silvia clearly in front.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

yeah I'm swaying more the Silvia way now after thinking I ruled it out,but Gaggia + want upgrade £27.50 + basket £6.50 = £249 so the Salvia at an extra £186 is tempting but still a big chunk more lol...come on Silvia put a sale on!!!


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

Hi

It is important that you are happy with what you are buying. You sound very much like I was before I took the leap. I'll be honest with you and say that when I got the classic, I had to persuade my brain that this would be a stop gap until I saved for the Silvia because that's the machine I really wanted. If I hadn't done that I wouldn't have given myself a chance to "love" it.

Now I'm no longer suffering from "Silvia envy" after getting a grinder and am content with my purchase, however, I do confess that I am looking to upgrade at some point by the end of the year.....problem is,I am addicted, I have a scorching case of upgrade itus. the tablets aint working and the Silvia isn't shiny enough LOL

There was a thread I read on here about upgrades. A lot of peeps sell their old equipment to part fund their new purchases once they decide on an upgrade but someone posted and I can't remember who saying they took a different route and plunged straight in with a high quality machine in the region of £900 saying that it was cheaper in the long run. This made total sense to me and it's what I am intending to do next. I'll never know if I had waited for the Silvia whether I would have wanted to upgrade after having it for months, I do suffer from machine envy and my brain does tend to try and justify spending ridiculous amounts of cash on coffee equipment and I worry it will never end....as my shots get better, I find myself drawn to the bella barista web page where I can spend hours licking the screen while looking through love heart eyes at all their lovely machines.

Good luck with your decision. Remember, you don't choose the machine. The machine chooses you


----------



## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

There's a degree of truth in that







You're unlikely to find any scale in a lot of Scottish machines due to the soft water.


----------



## contrary (Feb 2, 2012)

there is a silvia v2 ad on gumtree as well. (it is not mine though)


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

the ebay one is at £260 with a day to go,bet it at least makes £300,at that price I would prefer new with a warranty.


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

hiya again

meant to say, if you do decide on the Silvia don't be tempted to get it off the place that has the first result on a google - that guy is complete ck.

call up Steve at hasbean and get it off him.

http://www.hasbean.co.uk/products/Rancilio-Silvia-Espresso-Machine-%28New-Model%29.html

let us know what you decide.

cheers


----------



## Spooks (Feb 20, 2012)

Been reading this thread with great interest, was going to go down the route of a Classic then upgrade wand but I do like the Silvia a lot. Appreciate it's double the price but is it worth the extra for, realistically a beginner espresso fan. It does seem to be more an intermediate machine so would prevent upgraditus hitting early


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

Spooks said:


> Been reading this thread with great interest, was going to go down the route of a Classic then upgrade wand but I do like the Silvia a lot. Appreciate it's double the price but is it worth the extra for, realistically a beginner espresso fan. It does seem to be more an intermediate machine so would prevent upgraditus hitting early


hiya,

Depending on the price you pay for a classic I would say no. You don't need to upgrade the wand, you get perfectly acceptable foam from the one supplied. It may not full on micro foam but you can get close with practise.

I'd say the classic is perfect for a beginner. It will give you a really good coffee, should last for years and you can practise and improve your coffee making skills to your hearts content then move to a better machine when you are ready. More importantly though - should you decide that this home barista stuff isn't worth the hassle then you've not got such a large hole in your wallet sitting on your counter.

Price is relative though, if there was something like 100 odd quid difference in price I'd say go for the Silvia, 150 quid, save for another month, 200 quid can get a lot of beans, 250 quid can get a grinder. There was a £265 difference in price when I got mine maybe I should have got two









cheers


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

Spooks said:


> Been reading this thread with great interest, was going to go down the route of a Classic then upgrade wand but I do like the Silvia a lot. Appreciate it's double the price but is it worth the extra for, realistically a beginner espresso fan. It does seem to be more an intermediate machine so would prevent upgraditus hitting early


my thinking too,if I get the Silvia then thats one upgrade out the way lol,my thing is super microfoam so paying the extra to me will be worth it if the Silvia is better at foam and most reviews say it is,if your not too into microfoam then I would be going for the Gaggia.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

ripley said:


> hiya again
> 
> meant to say, if you do decide on the Silvia don't be tempted to get it off the place that has the first result on a google - that guy is complete ck.
> 
> ...


yeah think I know who you mean,and yes he is cheaper but checked the reviews and will not be using him.

yes I agree Hasbean has great service,I have used them for awhile now for coffee and even tea lol so yes he will be getting the order.


----------



## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

Having both a Silvia and a Classic, I can tell you there is very little difference IMO. I am an espresso drinker only and have no need to steam milk. I am also the only coffee drinker in the house. Yes, the Silvia has a brass boiler, but contrary to what many believe, there are said to be health risks with brass too due to the copper and lead content. It's all swings and roundabouts but in California (I believe) shops put health warnings on machines with brass boilers.

Finding the link ... http://www.home-barista.com/advice/health-warning-on-espresso-machines-t20177.html


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

xiuxiuejar said:


> Having both a Silvia and a Classic, I can tell you there is very little difference IMO. I am an espresso drinker only and have no need to steam milk. I am also the only coffee drinker in the house. Yes, the Silvia has a brass boiler, but contrary to what many believe, there are said to be health risks with brass too due to the copper and lead content. It's all swings and roundabouts but in California (I believe) shops put health warnings on machines with brass boilers.
> 
> Finding the link ... http://www.home-barista.com/advice/health-warning-on-espresso-machines-t20177.html


you say very little difference,does that go for the steamer too? I'm hoping the Silvia is a lot better at steaming for microfoam.


----------



## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

snegger said:


> you say very little difference,does that go for the steamer too? I'm hoping the Silvia is a lot better at steaming for microfoam.


I didn't make that clear, sorry. I don't steam but everyone says that the Silvia steamer is better. I think it's something to do with the air intake at the top of the steam wand on the Gaggia (one of my friends used to tape the top of the wand and he made good microfoam). The thing is, for espresso, these machines are great but I have my doubts about milk based drinks. Saying that, I can't really tell you as I hate milk!!!!

I think the Silvia should have better steam pressure as the boiler is 3 times bigger


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

xiuxiuejar said:


> (one of my friends used to tape the top of the wand and he made good microfoam).


I'm going to try that, I don't make milk based drinks much now either - I've morphed into an Americano blue jeans and chinos kinda guy but I do like a little steamed moo on the top....if only so I can draw lovely patterns in it


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

crap,I've seen a classic now for £140! really temped but CAN IT PRODUCE GREAT MICROFOAM that is the question,anyone use the Gaggia classic for flat whites?


----------



## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

Yes if you buy the Rancilio steam wand to replace the gaggia one.

Think these are only £20 and make a huge difference.

Extremely happy with my microfoam, same can't be said for my artistic flare with said microfoam.


----------



## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

fatboyslim said:


> Yes if you buy the Rancilio steam wand to replace the gaggia one.
> 
> Think these are only £20 and make a huge difference.
> 
> Extremely happy with my microfoam, same can't be said for my artistic flare with said microfoam.


I'm happy Fatboyslim saw your question as I know he likes his milk!!!! He can also give you his opinion on the Classic in general but at 140 quid, you can't lose!!!


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

fatboyslim said:


> Yes if you buy the Rancilio steam wand to replace the gaggia one.
> 
> Think these are only £20 and make a huge difference.
> 
> Extremely happy with my microfoam, same can't be said for my artistic flare with said microfoam.


ok on that I'm about to click the buy it button but just one question,have you ever had a flat white from costa and how does the gaggia foam compare to that (I know costa can be hit and miss with their microfoam but on a good day,I would be happy if I can get to that level on a gaggia)


----------



## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

snegger said:


> ok on that I'm about to click the buy it button but just one question,have you ever had a flat white from costa and how does the gaggia foam compare to that (I know costa can be hit and miss with their microfoam but on a good day,I would be happy if I can get to that level on a gaggia)


You basically mean how does it compare to a commercial machine? Having never tried one myself (soon to be remedied) I can't compare but it is possible to get great microfoam from a Gaggia Classic.

This won't come straight away as it is down to technique but I have steam power to spare on my Classic (PID steam control does help a bit).


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

fatboyslim said:


> You basically mean how does it compare to a commercial machine? Having never tried one myself (soon to be remedied) I can't compare but it is possible to get great microfoam from a Gaggia Classic.
> 
> This won't come straight away as it is down to technique but I have steam power to spare on my Classic (PID steam control does help a bit).


I was meaning if you ever bought a flat white from costa how does yours compare,but thanks for the info.

just ordered the Gaggia and am going to order the wand now,my thinking is,give this a try or I will never know,here's hoping.

cheers all for putting up with my toing and froing.


----------



## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

Make sure it's the v2 Rancilio steam wand as the v3 has a ball joint and won't fit


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

fatboyslim said:


> Make sure it's the v2 Rancilio steam wand as the v3 has a ball joint and won't fit


is this one any good, http://www.myespresso.co.uk/product.php/419/rancilio-frothing-arm-2008-version-fits-gaggia-classic seems a lot cheaper than other places?


----------



## hemo (Mar 5, 2012)

I bought steam wand from happy donkey and fit on gaggia classic without any modification (street way) without cut old steam wand. But if you bought it from myespresso you need to modified it.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

hemo said:


> I bought steam wand from happy donkey and fit on gaggia classic without any modification (street way) without cut old steam wand. But if you bought it from myespresso you need to modified it.


went for the Happydonkey one,I'm no good at DIY lol


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

snegger said:


> went for the Happydonkey one,I'm no good at DIY lol


Quite right as well. I tried to get one from that other site -but all I got for my twenty quid was an empty jiffy bag and an additional postage charge.

You'll need to let us know how you go with the wand and how you found fitting it. I've yet to get order another one due to the above & doubt whether I will bother if this tape thing works. The foam I get is fine enough for my needs at the moment.

I've enjoyed this thread, I hope you enjoy your machine.

cheers


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

no fear,you will be sick of me,by the time I keep this thread updated with my Gaggia trails.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

all the vids I have watched on youtube are using a flat bottom tamper,my is rounded,do I need to buy a new one?


----------



## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

I was speaking to my friend yesterday - he used to put a sheath (not tape) around the air intake on the Gaggia wand but he says that what he does now is take off the long black plastic leaving a black plastic stum and he says this makes a real ripping sound makes the milk swirl and produces lovely foam. It could be worth a try.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

xiuxiuejar said:


> I was speaking to my friend yesterday - he used to put a sheath (not tape) around the air intake on the Gaggia wand but he says that what he does now is take off the long black plastic leaving a black plastic stum and he says this makes a real ripping sound makes the milk swirl and produces lovely foam. It could be worth a try.


thanks,just slashed out on the Silvia wand,ordered yesterday from Happydonkey and came today!!! thought I might as well give the Gaggia a fair go,just waiting for the machine,it's on it's way!


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

snegger said:


> thanks,just slashed out on the Silvia wand,ordered yesterday from Happydonkey and came today!!! thought I might as well give the Gaggia a fair go,just waiting for the machine,it's on it's way!


OH oh careful now, you're standing on a slippery slope hehe

I'm going to try that stump thing as the sellotape kinda got soggy


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

tell me about it,just bought a water filter jug and been looking at some posh cofee cups,didn't see any cups I fancied,might just get a couple of Costa cups to be getting on with,till I buy some decent ones.

Will give my tamper a try,if no good I need a tamper too,thats if my grinder works with the Gaggia...the list is never ending,just thought of a few other items but they can now wait lol


----------



## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

snegger said:


> tell me about it,just bought a water filter jug and been looking at some posh cofee cups,didn't see any cups I fancied,might just get a couple of Costa cups to be getting on with,till I buy some decent ones.
> 
> Will give my tamper a try,if no good I need a tamper too,thats if my grinder works with the Gaggia...the list is never ending,just thought of a few other items but they can now wait lol


But I promise, once you get your technique right, you won't look back! Just a word of caution, don't expect it to go right at the start, but with patience and practice, you will soon be making great coffee!


----------



## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

ripley said:


> OH oh careful now, you're standing on a slippery slope hehe
> 
> I'm going to try that stump thing as the sellotape kinda got soggy


I sent my mate an e-mail and he said you need to make sure of three things. First, angle the jug a little, second, the stump should only just enter the milk and third, between the angle of the jug and the shallowness of the black stump, you should get a whirlpool effect with a loud ripping sound similar. Sounds like hard work to me but he says it's easy. Next time I'm in UK I'll ask him to show me! I think I'm just lucky I hate milk!


----------



## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

Forget the loud ripping sound and go for a quiet sst.... [spin]... ssst ...[spin]. Too much air too quickly will be impossible to reintegrate as microfoam.


----------



## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

MikeHag said:


> Forget the loud ripping sound and go for a quiet sst.... [spin]... ssst ...[spin]. Too much air too quickly will be impossible to reintegrate as microfoam.


I would be inclined to take Mike's ideas on board as he really knows what he's talking about. As he's not reading, I wouldn't mind betting my friend's technique is not up to much.

So what is the idea then Mike? To introduce air slowly and get little bubbles? I know my question sounds simplistic and maybe silly, but I have seriously never paid any attention to mik in coffee. Maybe I will actually have a go this weekend to see if I can do it. I'll have to get someone to act as the lab rat though!


----------



## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

Well I'm not expert but happy to share. I've found that with the Classic, which of course doesn't have huge steam power, you have to make up for it with technique. That means (in my experience) a combination of the following:

1. Having the right amount of milk in the pitcher, and the right size pitcher for the quantity of milk used. If the pitcher is too small it will go everywhere when it expands. Too big and you can't get the tip in the right position without putting too much milk in. Too much milk means the limited steam power will run out before getting good quality microfoam, or at best will just make it more difficult. For a single 10oz cup a 0.3L is good, or you can do two 6oz cups with a 0.5L. (This is different for more powerful machines!)

2. Having a cold jug and cold milk, to give you more time to get it all integrated.

3. Having a rough idea how long it takes for your machine to reach steam temperature i.e. when the red light comes on. I would typically do a quick purge at around half way through that heating cycle to test whether it had started generating a bit of steam (and to get rid of the small amount of water in the wand). Don't wait until it is at full steam, or it will run out later. Start steaming when it is at around 60-70% of the way up. This helps avoid the red light ever coming on, which means it produces steam for longer.

4. Tip position. I used to put it to the side and bounce off the pitcher wall. This can help, but I then found it best to put it just slightly to the left of the centre, and angle the pitcher backwards. The angle of the steam jet is what makes it start to spin in a circular motion. Stay fairly central. Don't start stretching the milk yet.

5. Tip height. So you've got a swirling vortex, which kinda has walls, and the milk at the centre or the vortex is lower in the pitcher than the milk at the sides. It's like a V shape. Great. So you may need to lower the tip or the wand a bit, towards the centre, otherwise the milk in the centre will be too low and you'll hear a big "Glung" sound as the milk swallows too much air. So keep moving the tip to maintain its position just under the surface. NOW you can stretch. Just raise the tip a bit to let a tiny bit of air in... sssst. Then lower it again, to keep the milk spinning. Wait a few seconds. Raise again... ssst... lower... spin. Keep repeating, so you're only introducing a small amount at a time, and every time you do, that air is integrated before you bring in any more.

5. Plunging. When the milk hits around 90F (no more than 100F) stop stretching and focus solely on spinning. No more air. I actually find that the milk still expands during this stage, so don't worry if you think you haven't introduced enough air yet. Just keep spinning. With regards to the word 'plunge'... actually, DON'T! If you go too deep then the milk will stop spinning properly. Just drop the tip to a little lower under the surface to ensure no air gets in. Eventually it will stop spinning because of the increased volume, and will seem to just wobble. It should have a smooth surface by now, with no bubbles. Stop at 140-155F (say 65C).

6. Spin/tap on the table to remove any little bubbles remaining.

7. Pour asap.

WIth the Classic always remember to purge the steam through the group head after steaming, to bring the temperature and pressure back down to normal.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

ordered the Gaggia on the 11th ordered the filter jug on the 14th,guess which one is showing out for delivery today...a clue it's not the Gaggia! both with good old Yodel!


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

heard Yodel were bad but didn't think they would mess up on both my orders with them! first time I have used them too,both the Gaggia and filter jug were due today and not one of them turned up,the Gaggia is still showing delivery today,so that gives them about 50 mins! fingers crossed,the filter jug is now showing the 20th!

(just letting off steam lol)


----------



## Earlepap (Jan 8, 2012)

I had a bad experience with Yodel too, from an amazon order. FedEx are bull crap also.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

well they got their finger out,just recieved it today! tried a shot and not too bad considering the tamper is far too small and made of plastic,so need a new one asap,my hand grinder worked a treat though,had it on it's lowest setting and got a 33 second shot,so still some room to dial it in a bit more if needed,ordered some scales too,off to buy some cups today for the correct measure.

the streamer on first try was better than I thought it was going to be so with some more experience should be great.

(just treating this as a diary,feel free to comment though)


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

just to update this thread,seems the Gaggia needs at leat 30 mins to warm up and a second shot can not be pulled untill another 2-3 heat cycles,even if the light is telling you it's at temp,you can speed things along a bit with the steam button or just wait.

just made a half decent flat white,the microfoam was better than Costa produce most of the time but not as good as when they are on foam,need to play around with full fat and semi to see which I prefer.

Leaving the espresso treaking untill the scales arrive and I get a decent tamper,as I'm not timing the shot or know the amount I'm putting as yet so no point.

Drank more coffee today than I do in a week lol round 2 tomorrow, hope I'm ready for it!


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

well I have decided the Gaggia classic is not for me,really wanted great microfoam for a flat white,guess I could have gave it longer but I feel no matter how much I try the microfoam will just not be as good as I want it-the search continues...


----------



## Earlepap (Jan 8, 2012)

Steaming milk correctly to get good foam isn't that easy. It takes a lot of practice, and while the Classic isn't as proficient as other machines, it's still capable, especially to a standard of Costa foam which in my experience isn't that great.


----------



## funinacup (Aug 30, 2010)

you will get prefect microfoam using the Silvia steam wand on the classic, but if the machine is in warranty then you should keep the original one to refit in case you have to send the machine back for any reason.

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk


----------



## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

Steaming milk seems like hard work!


----------



## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

Steaming well on a small boiler machine is a process. It does take time to learn that process so you can do it well. There are minute movements that can only be learned by repetition, or spending time with someone who will show you exactly how to do it right. I was getting OK milk after three or four months, and good bubble-free milk for latte art after around ten months. I doesn't have to take this long, but just shows that it isn't immediate. Like I've mentioned previously, a more powerful machine will help but you still need to learn the technique otherwise all you'll get with a big machine is a faster way to make big bubbles.


----------



## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

The rancilio steam wand on the Classic makes such a difference.

Its definitely possible to get great microfoam using this wand and a few tips and techniques.

It took me awhile to work out a technique, putting milk + jug in freezer for 8 minutes and religiously following the temperature on my frothing thermometer.

Stretching until 40 degrees then plunge and heat till 65-70 degrees.

Don't give up just yet.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

funinacup said:


> you will get prefect microfoam using the Silvia steam wand on the classic, but if the machine is in warranty then you should keep the original one to refit in case you have to send the machine back for any reason.
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk


I did the swap,my results were hit and miss,most times I got an exellent layer of microfoam on the top but the rest was warm milk,maybe expecting foam all through the drink was too much,also I must have been heating too much? was stopping at 140F but with full fat milk it was turning the milk very sweet,didn't like that at all.


----------



## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

snegger said:


> maybe expecting foam all through the drink was too much


nope, you should expect that, but if you don't learn to do it you will never achieve it


----------



## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

snegger said:


> well I have decided the Gaggia classic is not for me,really wanted great microfoam for a flat white,guess I could have gave it longer but I feel no matter how much I try the microfoam will just not be as good as I want it-the search continues...


WOW- if you bought from Amazon then you have time to adjust your frothing technique - I'd stick with it , play with it, then if you decide that it isn't for you and you can't get the foam you require, then fill in the returns. I think you have 30 days from date of purchase.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

ripley said:


> WOW- if you bought from Amazon then you have time to adjust your frothing technique - I'd stick with it , play with it, then if you decide that it isn't for you and you can't get the foam you require, then fill in the returns. I think you have 30 days from date of purchase.


lol,I probably acted in haste,I kepted making a great flat white only to find the foam was only on top and I don't know if it's normal but the taste of the milk was turning my stomach,maybe I was over heating? was pulling out the wand at 140 but I guess the milk was still raising in temp so turned sour? I've read and watched vidoes for ages now so don't know what else I could have done technque wise.

think me not drinking espresso I thought why go to all this trouble for an Americano when I could make a filter,would have been different if I was getting the foam right though.


----------



## Spooks (Feb 20, 2012)

snegger said:


> well I have decided the Gaggia classic is not for me,really wanted great microfoam for a flat white,guess I could have gave it longer but I feel no matter how much I try the microfoam will just not be as good as I want it-the search continues...


So have you now decided to keep it, if ya don't what machine will you try next?


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

Spooks said:


> So have you now decided to keep it, if ya don't what machine will you try next?


getting returned tomorrow,pickup all arranged.

just been looking at the Rancillio Silvia,the steamer looks a lot stronger?


----------



## Spooks (Feb 20, 2012)

snegger said:


> getting returned tomorrow,pickup all arranged.
> 
> just been looking at the Rancillio Silvia,the steamer looks a lot stronger?


Yeh thats what Im going for also, once Hasbean have em again, remember though there is still a process to get the best from this machine also.


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

Spooks said:


> Yeh thats what Im going for also, once Hasbean have em again, remember though there is still a process to get the best from this machine also.


what made you pick the Silvia?


----------



## Spooks (Feb 20, 2012)

snegger said:


> what made you pick the Silvia?


Better steam and recommendations etc from a few people. There is a small difference from Classic but once you know what your doing its the small differences that make the coffee, I cannot afford the HX or double boiler machines so as a compromise the Silvia seemed to do well in everything I read/saw. I dont expect the Silvia to make me a barista but realistically this is better than I should need for many years to come.


----------



## funinacup (Aug 30, 2010)

To be honest the Silvia probably won't cure your milk steaming problems! The Gaggia has more than enough pressure (with the silvia wand fitted) to steam perfect milk. As said before you need to learn the technique, then apply it to whichever machine you use, albeit with some tweaks here and there.

Skip to 55secs in this video I made for a look, it might help.


----------



## Earlepap (Jan 8, 2012)

I believe there's an idiom about tools and workman. Frothing milk to a high standard with fully integrated microfoam is hard. A better machine will make it easier but you're still going to have to practice and get through a lot of milk until you crack it. If it was just down to the machine why would most high street chains churn out such badly crafted milk?


----------



## snegger (Dec 15, 2010)

funinacup said:


> To be honest the Silvia probably won't cure your milk steaming problems! The Gaggia has more than enough pressure (with the silvia wand fitted) to steam perfect milk. As said before you need to learn the technique, then apply it to whichever machine you use, albeit with some tweaks here and there.
> 
> Skip to 55secs in this video I made for a look, it might help.


that looks great! can I just check tho,if you were to stick a finger in that drink would you be able to move the foam to one side and see just milk? or would it all be foam? also how long would that foam last in the drink?


----------

