# La Pavoni espresso flow issues



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Morning all,

I've had my La Pavoni for a while now, and have suffered with these issues most of the time, but switching to decaf seems to have exacerbated it.



No matter my dose, my grind, my tamp pressure - espresso always comes from the outer circumference of the basket first (donuting), and fairly quickly.

I though that maybe this is to do with a bad fitting tamper but it is no worse than on my Gaggia Classic, and I do not suffer the same issues there.



During pre-infusion espresso will start to come out of the basket very quickly (almost immediately sometimes) - however when I pull the espresso I think that the pressure I'm having to use is too much. If I adjust the grind so that the espresso doesn't immediately start coming out of the basket, then the pull is impossible (or maybe possible but with worry of breaking something).


It's the stock basket, a cheap tamper (but fit seems reasonably ok), stock screen, and cleaned regularly.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Harry


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## KTD (Dec 28, 2017)

haz_pro said:


> Morning all,
> 
> I've had my La Pavoni for a while now, and have suffered with these issues most of the time, but switching to decaf seems to have exacerbated it.
> 
> ...


What coffee are you using and how old is it? And what grinder do you use?

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## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Hi @KTD.

The beans are a few weeks old - but I've found the same with 1 day old beans and 3 month old beans.

Grinder is the Made by Knock Feld2, manual hand grinder - 38mm conical burrs.


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## Mr Kirk (Oct 5, 2017)

I've never used a la pav, so might be a long way off, but are you using a ridge-less basket? If not, could the ridge be effecting the tamp pressure on the outer edge?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Try lifting the tamper out gently , lifting out quickly can cause suction sometimes.

But... how does it taste, lots of visual commentary and clues there but are you unhappy with what's in the cup.

Naked pf's are good tools but sometimes they can actually distract you from what's important , the taste and you can start picking up on visual clues that colour the actual cup.

" Oh it's a donut pull , it will taste bad "

I had soem horrible visual espresso that tasted good to me :0


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

I've used this setup before - Feld2 and Pav - for a while without issues. Are you distributing your grinds in the basket well, maybe with a toothpick or similar, and levelling before tamping?

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## Mr Kirk (Oct 5, 2017)

Mrboots2u said:


> Try lifting the tamper out gently , lifting out quickly can cause suction sometimes.


Can lifting the lever too quickly do the same?


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

Potentially yes but comes down to definition of quickly.

_Try a more gentle lift of the lever and pause at the top before pulling down. There is a thread on here somewhere about best / better methods but if tastes ok, as stated above by MrBoots then let sleeping dogs lie  _

_if however you want to change things up, do one thing at a time so you can tell what is working and what is not ensuring your taste buds are the final arbiter ._

_Hope you find your happy place_

_John_


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## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Thanks all for the responses. It doesn't taste very good at the moment.

If I grind fine enough that the espresso doesn't come out instantly, then the pill is extremely hard, and it's over extracted (I feel).

If I grind course enough that the pull takes a reasonable force, then the espresso is coming out almost instantly and is just horrible - under extracted.

Im going to grab some recently roasted caffinated beans and see what I can do. Feel like I'm going mad 

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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

Was that a decaf bean? I've found decaf can be a bit more work to dial in. Get your new beans dialled in and report back. Have you posted a vid of what you're doing yet, it may help us give some pointers


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## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

To answer questions I missed, the basket is standard (I believe) and ridgeless.

I distribute the grounds using 3 little needles in a cork, I've also tried with a latte art stick, no difference.

Yep this is with decaf beans, they're about a month old now. I've tried dialing them in but just can't get them to a point that I can enjoy them - nearly finished the bag now and have been having in milk to somewhat mask the taste.

Will try and take a video later. Thanks all.

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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

haz_pro said:


> To answer questions I missed, the basket is standard (I believe) and ridgeless.
> 
> I distribute the grounds using 3 little needles in a cork, I've also tried with a latte art stick, no difference.
> 
> ...


Decaf beans are notoriously difficult to master. They age faster and they require a much finer grind. Do you drink decaf exclusively?

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## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

I'd heard they need a finer grind but didn't know they age faster.

I have been drinking it exclusively as I think caffeine had been giving me headaches (which have now stopped).

Im going to give caffeine another go though as this is causing me a headache any way 

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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

haz_pro said:


> I'd heard they need a finer grind but didn't know they age faster.
> 
> I have been drinking it exclusively as I think caffeine had been giving me headaches (which have now stopped).
> 
> ...


I can't remember who told me that Decaf perish/age faster. Not sure if it was in this forum, one of the blogs online or someone at Rave.


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