# Sage DTP & Smart Grinder Pro?



## AndyJH (Apr 25, 2017)

Considering this combo as a good base starting setup. I only drink espresso or americano so the milk side is fairly redundant so the DB seems like a waste. I had considered the Barista but assume the machine is no better than the DTP?

Been considering a s/h Gaggia and grinder but this feels fresher and less hassle with modding to get similar results??

Thoughts?


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Espresso doesn't have an x in it.

But your thoughts are relatively sensible. The Dual Boiler has many advantages over the DTP other than milk steaming, like programmable preinfusion, temp control and a more thermally stable system in general but its a lot more money, competing with machines in the £1k+ price range.

The Classic (especially an older one) is likely to be more reliable, and easier to fix if it goes wrong, but more of a faff to use to get the temp of the shot right.

The smart grinder pro is likely the best in its price range, you can do better but you either need to go ex commercial grinder or double your budget.


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## filthynines (May 2, 2016)

That is precisely my set up and I am happy with it. BUT I will eventually move on to a different machine with higher spec and with a higher propensity for getting the very best from my coffee.

At £300 the DTP is a good machine as far as I'm concerned. I get good shots from it, and I put any inconsistencies down to my low skill levels. It's pretty much plug and play, heats up quickly, and make a good brew. I would endorse it!

Grinder is good too. Others will say there are better out there, and I have no doubt about that. However, I've just discovered the shim on my Smart Grinder Pro and so I can go even finer if I really want to. For a no-fuss set-up you'll be happy.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

For it's cost and size the SG pro will do the job. It looks neat - especially next to other Sage gear, has really good electronic functionality. Just don't expect the earth in terms of grind consistency. I like them.


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## AndyJH (Apr 25, 2017)

Thanks for the prompt feedback and sorry for my poor spelling, that'll teach me to type whilst trying to shop!! 

Just had a very poor demo of a Sage Barista just to get an idea of the machine. Took them several attempts to get a shot out whilst hitting the right pressure and the resulting drink was pretty horrible! Now having to sit in Costa to take the taste away  This highlighted one concern I have as a newbie with the DTP, lack of pressure gauge. Would you consider this important or is it just getting used to weighing and timing?


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

AndyJH said:


> Thanks for the prompt feedback and sorry for my poor spelling, that'll teach me to type whilst trying to shop!!
> 
> Just had a very poor demo of a Sage Barista just to get an idea of the machine. Took them several attempts to get a shot out whilst hitting the right pressure and the resulting drink was pretty horrible! Now having to sit in Costa to take the taste away  This highlighted one concern I have as a newbie with the DTP, lack of pressure gauge. Would you consider this important or is it just getting used to weighing and timing?


It sounds worth asking for a demo just for the entertainment value









Weighing in, out, and timing it, all the way


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

What MildredM said. I've stopped looking at the gauge now. It's pointless.


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## AndyJH (Apr 25, 2017)

Right thanks  New scales on the list also 

I was tempted to take over as I thought I probably knew more than they did!


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## AndyJH (Apr 25, 2017)

DTP & SG bought  I was running between a local shop who had the grinder in stock and JL who had the DTP in stock. Bought from both and now have it all at home  An afternoon of frustration and caffeine highs I think


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

AndyJH said:


> DTP & SG bought  I was running between a local shop who had the grinder in stock and JL who had the DTP in stock. Bought from both and now have it all at home  An afternoon of frustration and caffeine highs I think


Well done! Now let the fun and games begin.. Let us know how you get on......


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Congratulations on your purchase - never simple is it!

Let us know how you get on with it


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

What beans are you using?


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## AndyJH (Apr 25, 2017)

Ta  Mentally I've been all over the place with this one! Started my thoughts with the Sage Barista as an all in one machine, then almost purchased SJ grinder from eBay, then thought about a s/h Gaggia, then looking at the Sage DB and finally settle on this combo.

I'm really hoping that I can get some good base results from it and it will teach me the basics before I consider any other machines. Just got to get my head around the weight ratios, brew times etc. so I can actually drink what I create from this setup


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## AndyJH (Apr 25, 2017)

lake_m said:


> What beans are you using?


I just picked up some from Waitrose whilst in JL buying the machine. I know they re not going to be the best but I looked for some that actually had a 'roasted on' date to at least see if they were any good. Trouble is everything is new so I have no idea what will be causing the bad shot so I figured running these through the grinder at first might be a plan, had read somewhere that it needs some time to bed in also.

Will get some beans ordered during the week.

Right now I'm trying to work out whether to use the timer on the grinder to control the dose or measure the beans and just do it manually? I only have scales that measure to the gram so probably not the best starting point but some more will be ordered later.

Must go read the forum more for starting point on weights vs brew times.....


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

They'll all be slightly different (the SG pros that is), and different beans will change things too, but as a starting point try setting 6 on the fine scale. 14.5 seconds grind time should give you roughly 18g of coffee into the portafilter. Tweak it for there based on you shot weight / time. Try 1:2 to start off with so 36g brew weight. Again, it's only a starting point, adjust the grind to get somewhere in the region for 25 to 30 seconds. Taste it. Check bitter/sour balance etc. You'll probably waste a tonne of coffee but persevere.


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

You will be a bit all over the place in the first few days! Don't worry, I expect most of us have been there









Keep reading and digesting and remember to weigh in, our and time it. Tasting espresso is an art all in itself, imho. I think Has Bean has a really good guide to tasting your coffee.


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

https://www.thecoffeecompass.com/how-to-drink-espresso/


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

MildredM said:


> You will be a bit all over the place in the first few days! Don't worry, I expect most of us have been there
> 
> 
> 
> ...


And some still are there! All good fun though, at leasable that's what I keep telling myself.

on the plus side I think I'm going to have shares in most roasting companies around the globe :-D


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## AndyJH (Apr 25, 2017)

lake_m said:


> They'll all be slightly different (the SG pros that is), and different beans will change things too, but as a starting point try setting 6 on the fine scale. 14.5 seconds grind time should give you roughly 18g of coffee into the portafilter. Tweak it for there based on you shot weight / time. Try 1:2 to start off with so 36g brew weight. Again, it's only a starting point, adjust the grind to get somewhere in the region for 25 to 30 seconds. Taste it. Check bitter/sour balance etc. You'll probably waste a tonne of coffee but persevere.


Thanks for this, I was going to ask for a starting point as I was choking the machine with most of my early attempts! I've just walked away from it but I'm at least getting a shot through with a crema and a semi-reasonable taste







To manage this I ended up with approx. 16g coffee, grind setting on 15 which was taking around 17 seconds. Into the machine and flow starts in just under 10 sec, run for about 30 sec total.

As I say, I was choking the machine at first with little of nothing coming out after 30-40 seconds! I don't think I was tamping hard enough at first plus the grind wasn't right, so many variables!!! With a harder tamp and the above grind settings I was getting flow and a decent looking drink in 30 seconds. I ran this a few times so at least I know its repeatable







Next to work on variations and see how that varies the taste, trouble is there is only so much of this you can do before you realise that sleep is not going to be an option, lol.


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