# Fun with La Pavoni!



## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

The gorgeous little 1975 Pavoni from fellow member TR6Greig arrived last Friday and I've had a little time to play with it now. I think its fair to say I now realise what people say about the need to learn your machine and refine the process!

I actually started really well and was pulling good shots right from the start, but having just opened some new beans from the DSOL its totally turned things on their head. Rave IJ was easy to dial in on the Mignon and just needed a tad finer grind than for the Classic to get that lovely 'knife through frozen butter' pressure. Shots were sweet and thick and lovely crema and immediately comparable to the best I was achieving on the Classic side by side. Totally different process and technique between the 2 machines so I was very glad I wrote down every step as trying to remember how to get the best from the Gaggia and then the LPE was a challenge. Small PF basket, relatively small water tank and steam hissing from the valve at times was certainly enough to make me realise I was playing a different game here.

Swapping to the DSOL beans today I first tried the Classic again and pulled a lovely shot immediately. Trying the LPE and the first 2 were were straight down the sink! Even with the lightest tamp it was almost impossible to pull the shot and the cup was sludge







Adjusted the grind a little coarser and almost no difference. Coarser grind again and this time a little too far with slightly too little pressure. Sweetness was finally evident in the cup but still a long way from what I managed immediately on the trusty Classic. 1 very mediocre shot out of 3 was not a good evening...but fun experimenting.

Sadly my digital thermometer and thermocouple arent here yet so judging the temperatures is still guesswork, but following the tips on here and other forums at least is getting me in the ballpark. Looking forward to that arriving by the time I get back at the end of the week and then some more information will be available and hopefully more control over when to pull the shot. A 49mm lens hood should also be here soon and that will hopefully make the WDT technique a little easier and I wish I had a naked PF to help see whats going on in there, but baby steps...

Definitely feels like the start of a journey but at least already I know that when its good its really good!


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Great write-up BP. I must say I was quite envious when you bought the LP. Although I couldn't have accommodated it and also I don't think I really have the patience to learn a fully manual lever machine. But it really looks the part and I would love to be able to pull shot after shot of lever goodness, but simply don't have the patience for the learning curve! Anyway the fact that your first few shots were great is a really good bit of encouragement to persevere. One of my mates has got one similar (a bit newer maybe?) but he doesn't even have a grinder, so I keep hinting that he should bring it round so I can have a play for an afternoon.

Enjoy!


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## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

cheers - lever envy is a terrible thing! Already had a coffee geek friend round for dinner last weekend and we spent ages in the kitchen messing with the peacock. I suspect he might also end up with one very soon....

I havent even really started on milk with it yet. 1 poor attempt the other evening and I realised the 3 hole wand needs a different technique to the Silvia wand but I suspect once mastered it will be a better machine for that.


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## Soll (Nov 10, 2013)

Bigpickle Your post reminds me of the frustration I suffered with my old EP which has now been sold on thanks to my lovely wife ! Among all the sink shots I made, now and again the god shot would be created by some small degree of a variable change, but it was so worth it. Not very practical when guest's were around though which was why it had to go in the end......


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## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

OK, so more practice and about 50-50 with the new beans. Learning that grind and tamp is EVERYTHING here. The slightest change in grind in particular can be the difference between watery and tasteless and chocked and a cup of sludge









So, question now is how do you vary the volume of the final cup? I can imagine the 'fellini' move will allow a little extra water into the pull and make a slightly longer drink, but what about a shorter drink? So far my pulls have come out about 1:1.5 but I read a lot of people talking about the LPE being good for ristretto. So how do you make a 1:1 - just take the cup out earlier and not pull the pull range of the lever? Seems like you might also impact taste doing it that way and lose the sweeter finish?


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## Richard Penny (Nov 14, 2014)

You are definitely doing better than me! Managed an even spread of undrinkable to acceptable so far. Until today, when I finally discovered how this machine is going to be much better than the classic







My temp strip arrived today so I stuck it on. Whoever predicted that most newbies would be pulling cold shots was bang on for me.

For a bit more volume, I have ordered an Elektra double basket. Not sure if that would fit in your PF though.


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## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

That's very interesting Richard. I'm still waiting for my digital thermometer to arrive and currently have no dam idea what temps I'm using!

What changed in the cup when you got re temp right? Mine are too thin most of the time and lacking sweetness with the new beans. I'm also thinking some blends are just 'easier' like my Rave IJ. That might also be roast/age related as well though.


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## Richard Penny (Nov 14, 2014)

Thin and sour would be my description. Process currently is leave machine on for 20 mins then flush through PF twice to heat group. That seems to get me between 90 and 95 indicated.


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## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

I havent been leaving it on that long as it seems to steam quite a lot so I'm a little worried about it bleeding out too much water from the tank. I have aways done some hot flushing though and the group is damn hot when I pull a shot. Might experiment further tomorrow and see what happens with a longer warm up time.


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## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

OK - fired it up again just now as I had a few mins after lunch. This time I wanted to leave it a lot longer to see if it helped with the results I've been getting so far.

So, heated on power II and waited until it started steaming, released a little steam through the wand, raised to lever to let a little water flow through the group into the cup and switched power to I. Left it about 15 mins and it quietly steamed in the corner. Just a very slight amount of steam escaping and my fear of losing too much water was unfounded as the level barely changed in the sight glass.

12.5g fairly find DSOL (the beans I've had a nightmare with in the LPE so far) and medium tamp. 6 sec pre-infusion and a lovely pressure in the lever for a 25 sec pull









Result in the cup had much more flavour and sweetness than I've managed to get recently with these beans. Much closer to the flavour from the Gaggia. Not quite as thick crema as I would have hoped and it didnt last very long, but the shot itself was pretty tasty and easily the best so far with these beans.

It seems the warm up time DOES make a significant difference despite the group seeming to get warm after the first warming flush. Sadly my digital thermometer hasnt yet arrived but hopefully it will be here by next weekend and I'll be able to be a little more controlled. Thanks Richard for the suggestion about temperature!


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## Richard Penny (Nov 14, 2014)

Got the Electra basket today so managed to get 14g in. Happy with the result, but then I got distracted and pulled the PF too soon. BOOM! Red hot grinds all over the place!

I think it was on here, but I read a great post saying the La Pavonis are inconsistent beasts but only if you don't pay close attention. Following a set routine once you have got used to the machine seems to be the way forward. I tended to time and measure output by guesswork, not getting away with that now...


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## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

Well after a week off the digital thermometer arrived today so time to experiment!

First issue was the alu tape I bought that was supposed to be eat resistent clearly wasnt up to the job so the glue melted and it was really hard to get the thermocouple to stay fixed to the group. I eventually managed to tape the hell out of it and get it fixed to the 'bell' just above the ridge where is flares out in size to accept the PF.

Watched temp rise as it heated and I pulled a first hot flush through. By the time I had everything ready it had shot up to showing 110 deg C. This was my usual routine so I pulled a shot and tasted - pretty much a sink shot really. Grind on the IJ was a little too coarse and it was a little light on lever pressure but crap crema which barely lasted 30 secs and taste was pretty crap.

Switched it all off, cold rinsed the PF and put a cold wet cloth on the group and watched the temp fall quickly. Tried a slightly finer grind, same dose of 12.5g and switched back on to position I and watched the temp rise. This time as it hit 102 deg C it stabilised and I pulled the shot. Same process of 5 sec pre-infusion, 22 sec steady pull with what I think was pretty much perfect pressure, and THE BEST SHOT YET from the little beauty! Rich thick crema, lovely texture and a sweetness I havent had from the Rave IJ before. Really enjoyable sweet espresso - very happy









So, need to find some better heat resistant tape and then try to repeat the process. If I can nail this down exactly and make it a repeatable process I hope I can really start to enjoy this machine and experiment to fine tune it further.

Update

Tried again - taped on the thermocouple while it was cold and it stayed put this time. Interesting to watch the temp rise from cold this time. Boiler comes to the boil while the group shows 62 deg C and first flush takes that up to 90 deg almost instantly. Then it climbs more steadily and didnt take long to reach 103 degs so I switched it off while I ground the coffee and dosed. As it dropped a little below 102 degs I switched it back on to power I and when it hit 102.5 degs I pulled the shot exactly as before - same dose, same tamp, same 5+22 sec pull. Only thing is that the total warmup time was probably only 10 mins compared to the 20 I have been using. Another really good result though. Not quite so sweet but then I did just have a little ginger cake so maybe my palette was not clean beforehand? Same good crema and texture though.

Seems like I am getting a repeatable process but next time I'm going to see what happens if I leave it for longer and still pull at the same temperature.


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## "coffee 4/1" (Sep 1, 2014)

seems like your almost there, many years since i played with a pavoni, this might help 1/16 teflon gasket on group, pstat 0.8bar

group temp reached to 85c

pre-infusion 98c after 10sec pre-infusion

puck-temp at end 92c-93c

have everything ready to go coffee&milk


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## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

getting the temp dialled in for taste now after a weekend experimenting, but there isnt much crema and when it does look good it doesnt last long... I suspect this might be because I'm using older beans that were frozen in small portions immediately on receipt and I'm now defrosting and using them. Roast date was something like 17th Nov or around then. Going to have fresh Coffee Compass beans waiting for me when I'm back next weekend so see if that makes a difference?


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## davemellis (Jan 6, 2015)

How have you been getting on?

i just read the bonkers post, whats the verdict?


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