# Final shortlist - EK43, Compak R120, Mythos One Clima - which one ???



## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Well, I 'think' I am nearly there with my grinder selection&#8230;&#8230;

After many hours of research and taking on board the advice received from the good folks on this forum, I have narrowed my options down to the following 3 grinders ( I gave up on my height restriction as all of the grinders with the best reviews seem to be BIG ):


The EK43 - it's been around for a very long time and seems to get glowing reviews. The design is simple and seems to be bullet proof.

The Compak R120 - not been around so long, gets good reviews, is mechanically more complicated than the EK43 (a negative in my opinion). Seems like there is a waiting period of 5 weeks to get hold of one of these grinders at the moment.

The Mythos One - gets great reviews but again, is maybe too 'over engineered' for my needs as I have no use for the heated burrs feature (added complexity for my home usage).


So, I am thinking of an EK43 ( I can get a new one for the same price as the R120 ) and have one in my hands within days.

*My final question to all of the grinder experts on this forum - Am I doing the right thing if I go for the EK43 ??? *

*
It's is a lot of money (well, it is to me) and I don't want to ever have to buy another grinder ever again!!*

Thanks for all the previous advice and guidance.


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## Scotford (Apr 24, 2014)

Go for the EK and prepare for a learning curve that will start a fire in you.


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

EK is big but the R120 is bigger. Mythos is a great grinder but not sure you'd see the best of it in a home environment. The EK has a big following - look how many you see in coffee shops. Biggest plus is the ones being shipped now have a burr set somewhere between the original coffee and Turkish and give you more wiggle room for espresso when grinding lighter roasts. Ability to switch effortlessly from grinding fine for espresso and coarser for pour over and still get amazing grind consistency is what makes the EK a stand out. Retention is minimal too.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Do you like a clean and tidy kitchen ...... If you do don't get an Ek









Will you weight in and out every shot .

Will you be happy pulling longer shots with a little less mouthfeel ...

Do you actually drink espresso ( not just milk drink)

Answer yes to all three and then move on to my next set of questions


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Do you want to dose tamp and go ....

Do you want pretty naked extractions

Do you want thick gloopy shots

Do you want a clean and tidy kitchen

Yes to any of there buy another grinder than an ek43


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## Jason1wood (Jun 1, 2012)

Mrboots2u said:


> Do you want to dose tamp and go ....
> 
> Do you want pretty naked extractions
> 
> ...


Answered yes to all of them, I'll just stick with my Mythos. Haha


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## Scotford (Apr 24, 2014)

Boots really needs to work on his technique. My M1 makes more mess than my EK during service!


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I think personally, I would forget the Clima Pro and just buy a Mythos. Far more flexible though arguably not as good as the other 2. Do you own a refractometer? .


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## Scotford (Apr 24, 2014)

dfk41 said:


> I think personally, I would forget the Clima Pro and just buy a Mythos. Far more flexible though arguably not as good as the other 2. Do you own a refractometer? .


Arguably more different. Not better or worse.


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## Jason1wood (Jun 1, 2012)

Scotford said:


> Arguably more different. Not better or worse.


That's good to hear as haven't had experience with the other two but I'm loving the Mythos and can't see me wanting anything else, ever!!!!


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Jason1wood said:


> That's good to hear as haven't had experience with the other two but I'm loving the Mythos and can't see me wanting anything else, ever!!!!


except a Mahlgut?


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

OMG, was just about to click send on placing an order for an EK43 then read the above....

I only drink espresso or espresso with 2 parts water (Americano like)

I do like thick, syrupy shots with lots of crema.

I'm not bothered if I have to weigh in and out.

Why is this sooooooo difficult ?


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## bronc (Dec 10, 2012)

Why don't you try an EKspresso somewhere first? Do you prefer lighter or darker roasted beans?


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

bronc said:


> Why don't you try an EKspresso somewhere first? Do you prefer lighter or darker roasted beans?


Darker roast


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## bronc (Dec 10, 2012)

Sounds to me like the EK43 might not be the best option for you as it is better suited for lighter, fruiter coffees and it produces a drink that lacks the thick mouthfeel of the espresso (think more of a lungo).

caveat: I've never had an EK43 shot so this is based only on what I've read others say. I might be completely wrong.


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## dwalsh1 (Mar 3, 2010)

Buy whatever puts a smile on your face when you see it first thing in the morning


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Father_Java said:


> Darker roast


Wouldn't bother with a Ek . Get a conventional grinder


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Father_Java said:


> OMG, was just about to click send on placing an order for an EK43 then read the above....
> 
> I only drink espresso or espresso with 2 parts water (Americano like)
> 
> ...


Don't buy an Ek ...


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

dwalsh1 said:


> Buy whatever puts a smile on your face when you see it first thing in the morning


I picked up that item for free







- although, the running cost are huge!!!! - oh, and she drinks milked based coffees most of the time


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Mrboots2u said:


> Don't buy an Ek ...


Thank You


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Father_Java said:


> Thank You


Recommendation for thick, syrupy espresso with lots of crema ??


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Many dark roast fans like conical grinders. Robur, K10 etc... Might be worth a shot.


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Do you have a favourite coffee shop? What do they use?


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## mfortin (Mar 19, 2014)

Why don't you consider single dosing Monolith conical or soon flat burr version?

http://www.kafatek.com/index.php/monolith/


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Xpenno said:


> Many dark roast fans like conical grinders. Robur, K10 etc... Might be worth a shot.


Thanks, I'm looking for zero - or, very low retention


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Xpenno said:


> Do you have a favourite coffee shop? What do they use?


Mostly Mazzer - I think....


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Father_Java said:


> Mostly Mazzer - I think....


Do you switch beans most shots?


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Mazzers can be modded for single dosing but work better with a full hopper.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Buy a Mythos. How many times must you be told!! Please if there is anyone on here apart from Jon who has had one

And disliked it, speak now


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## dwalsh1 (Mar 3, 2010)

Father_Java said:


> I picked up that item for free
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I was referring to the grinder


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

The r120 is looking favourite out of your choices


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Xpenno said:


> Do you switch beans most shots?


No, I tend to buy 1kg at a time and switch when the 1kg runs out


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## Scotford (Apr 24, 2014)

This is flip flopping more than the footwear of the same name


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

If you are happy to use up a kg at a time then buy something like the Compak E8 and don't worry about having to purge a few grams, as it will be about £750 cheaper than the other options. That's a lot of purges.


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## SmithStCoffeeRoasters (Feb 23, 2016)

watch this






Download Daft Punk & buy a EK you know you want to


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

SmithStCoffeeRoasters said:


> watch this


Thanks, very interesting video, he makes using the EK very easy


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## malling (Dec 8, 2014)

It is not that hard when you first get a decent routine, but as someone already mentioned it doesn't deliver a thick, creamy body and the pulls aren't exactly eye candy.

Conicals is very good at darker roasts, I have also heard dark roast fanatic saying good things about anfim SC and Mythos. So these might also be worth the try.

I don't find the ek particularly messy, my former k10pb where just as messy. it also comes down to how you use it, how often you clean down the surface around it etc.

But with your preference I would defiantly look elsewhere


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

Why doesn't it deliver gloopy shots ?? .... If you bought Turkish burrs and ground finer than the espresso ones offer, would this not work ?


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

coffeechap said:


> The r120 is looking favourite out of your choices


What are the R120 shots like compared with the Mythos One please?

I do like thick, syrupy shots with plenty of rich crema and body which seems to rule out the EK


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Is there a grinder that will deliver all that you seek? I do not know about the R120. If that gloups then perhaps it is your baby.......except, you do not single dose so whats the point. Conicals on the whole are well suited to darker roasts. All I drink is darker roasts. I have had quite a few grinders. As much as I love the taste from conicals, retention is on the whole a problem. To counteract this, you could look at a K10 PB. This is a dosered model and because of this there are endless mods you can do to deal with retention, but, they are all extra faff. The E10 has the least retention I have come across, although if you look back through for DaveC's assessment of the Ceado conical, he has cut the retention right down on this and in his opinion, it is the bees knees.

So, this brings me back to the start. Even though I only drink darker roasts, I have abandoned the conical route. I want to put coffee in, press and grind and go....I do nt want any extra faff in my routine. SO, based on that (And I do not ever single dose either), I have suggested the Mythos which retains very little and the CEado E37S. I have not measured the retention on this as all I do is two half second purges before the first shot. I understand your theoretical thoughts on retention but I think you are letting the tax tail wag the investment dog


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Father_Java said:


> What are the R120 shots like compared with the Mythos One please?
> 
> I do like thick, syrupy shots with plenty of rich crema and body which seems to rule out the EK


The r120 is more traditional in the texture of the espresso than the ek43 it will better suit your preference. The shots are very transparent and thick cream can be achieved. The plus side is it is zero retention, so zero waste from purging


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

coffeechap said:


> The r120 is more traditional in the texture of the espresso than the ek43 it will better suit your preference. The shots are very transparent and thick cream can be achieved. The plus side is it is zero retention, so zero waste from purging


If FJ sticks with the same beans for a kilo then he should get a low retention on demand and just load the hopper. Getting a single dosing grinder like the R120 if you don't switch between beans or brew methods is wanton


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

jeebsy said:


> Getting a single dosing grinder like the R120 if you don't switch between beans or brew methods is wanton


Not really wanton l, the shot quality is better, i don't think it much more if at all to buy than a Mythos clima! Now if we are suggesting looking around the grand mark then I am in agreement.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

OP doesn't need a Clima Pro, regular Mythos, E8 etc would all do a fine job.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Haven't read back through if that's the case then don't waste the money get a solid on demand


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Ok another question, do you use the grinder for any other brew methodology?


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

coffeechap said:


> Ok another question, do you use the grinder for any other brew methodology?


When at home, I only drink espresso/Americano although my other half likes her daily morning latte

When travelling/camping I use AeroPress and French Press - I buy bags of ready ground coffee for these as my Mignon just isn't up to the task.

I tend to buy my beans by the 1kg bag but I only ever keep about 100 grams or so in the grinder hopper as I keep the remainder of the beans in their bag to keep them fresh.

Although I don't single dose at the moment, perhaps the option with the R120 would be nice to have. I don't think I would find the extra step much of a hassle.

Price wise, I can get a new R120 for £2018 inc VAT (with a 5 week delivery time!!) or a new Mythos One for £1800 inc VAT.

As far as the other grinders in the Mythos range are concerned, I'm sorry but I just don't like the look of them.....I could be tempted with the slow RPM Mythos Barista but it doesn't seem to be available any more.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Personally, if I was that bothered, having done my homework I would go and locate the grinders and try them. Are you really going to spend 2k on other peoples opinion with looking at pictures? When I buy something, I base my decision on what it produces, not its aesthetics


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Well, I now have a matt black R120 on order through Londinium........

I have explained to SWMBO that it is just a little bit larger than the Mignon - and, maybe a bit wider and deeper - seems like I have 5 weeks left to live before the grinder arrives and I get murdered!!!

On the plus side, I think the R120 is too heavy for her to pick it up and hit me with it !


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Father_Java said:


> Well, I now have a matt black R120 on order through Londinium........
> 
> I have explained to SWMBO that it is just a little bit larger than the Mignon - and, maybe a bit wider and deeper - seems like I have 5 weeks left to live before the grinder arrives and I get murdered!!!
> 
> On the plus side, I think the R120 is too heavy for her to pick it up and hit me with it !


Sure is, it nearly ruined my back lugging one if those about!!!

Enjoy.


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## Missy (Mar 9, 2016)

"Hell hath no fury like a woman lumbered with an aesthetically pleasing but otherwise useless grinder " I think that's how the saying goes.


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

dfk41 said:


> Personally, if I was that bothered, having done my homework I would go and locate the grinders and try them. Are you really going to spend 2k on other peoples opinion with looking at pictures? When I buy something, I base my decision on what it produces, not its aesthetics


That's the reason why we need the EG-1 to be released ASAP.


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## malling (Dec 8, 2014)

Kafatek line looks more home friendly then the Eg-one, unfortunately those 3 grinders aren't really an option for Europeans unless you have a loaded bank account.

All of them is going to be above the £2000 mark


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

You forgot sexiness factor.


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## Missy (Mar 9, 2016)

PPapa said:


> You forgot sexiness factor.


Yeah if she's a bit past her best, get the grinder and if she leaves then fair enough...


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## risky (May 11, 2015)

malling said:


> Kafatek line looks more home friendly then the Eg-one, unfortunately those 3 grinders aren't really an option for Europeans unless you have a loaded bank account.
> 
> All of them is going to be above the £2000 mark


Try over £3000 for the EG-1.


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## 4515 (Jan 30, 2013)

Reading this post and the opinions of the grinder short list, is it time for the grind off II forum day ?

Think the last one was over two years ago


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## MarkyP (Jan 10, 2013)

Don't rule the ek43 out... There are plenty here, me included, who prefer the Darker Side of Life, and get on just fine with their EK43s.

Yes, there is a loss of mouthfeel, but the benefits far outweigh the losses in my opinion.

Sweetness

Single dosing ease and very small retention

Espresso to brewed adjustment range

And one other thing - it's bulletproof!


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Indeed


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

Father_Java said:


> seems like I have 5 weeks left to live before the grinder arrives and I get murdered!!!
> 
> On the plus side, I think the R120 is too heavy for her to pick it up and hit me with it !


Just remember the hopper opening is big enough to be fed into...she won't need to hit you with it, just mince you 

John


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

johnealey said:


> Just remember the hopper opening is big enough to be fed into...she won't need to hit you with it, just mince you
> 
> John


OMG - What have I done - I didn't realise I was going to end my days being fed into a coffee grinder - S*%T.....


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## UbiquitousPhoton (Mar 7, 2016)

So, just because I am trying to get this straight in my head....

The group mind does NOT recommend an EK if you drink americano or milk drinks? Out of interest why is this? I have tasted an EK shot and it was sweet, fruity and a touch wine-y (single origin) - do I take it this magic does not dilute down well then?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

UbiquitousPhoton said:


> So, just because I am trying to get this straight in my head....
> 
> The group mind does NOT recommend an EK if you drink americano or milk drinks? Out of interest why is this? I have tasted an EK shot and it was sweet, fruity and a touch wine-y (single origin) - do I take it this magic does not dilute down well then?


I drink 50/50 milk and espresso . But I like subtle milk drinks , not a fan of coffee " punching though " .

Again - No reason why you wouldn't be able to take an Ek shot and dilute it to an Americano .. You are just changing the strength of the shot ( not the extraction yield ) you just might wanna add a little less water if the shots are brewed with a bigger brew ratio and less strength to start with


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

EK shots are great as Americanos. Milk is just a little more problematic as if you pull a 45-50g shot it doesn't leave you much room in the cup for milk. If you split the shot, it's a little too weak in milk (for me). You could maybe do 15 to 40 for a milky drink.


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## UbiquitousPhoton (Mar 7, 2016)

Ahhhhh right ... I think I'm beginning to get it now - yes, the R120 shot was much more full on 'raw coffee' (albeit incredibly detailed) whereas the EK shot was certainly more subtle, but also more diverse.


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## UbiquitousPhoton (Mar 7, 2016)

I know lungo is where it is at with the EK, but how *does* it fare with more conventional shots (1:2)


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

UbiquitousPhoton said:


> So, just because I am trying to get this straight in my head....
> 
> The group mind does NOT recommend an EK if you drink americano or milk drinks? Out of interest why is this? I have tasted an EK shot and it was sweet, fruity and a touch wine-y (single origin) - do I take it this magic does not dilute down well then?


EK is perfectly capable of holding its own with lattes. Just finished some Bolivian that produced loads of sweet lime notes through milk. Recommend, with lighter roasts, to dose around 18-20grms at 1:2 to hit the tasting notes.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

UbiquitousPhoton said:


> So, just because I am trying to get this straight in my head....
> 
> The group mind does NOT recommend an EK if you drink americano or milk drinks? Out of interest why is this? I have tasted an EK shot and it was sweet, fruity and a touch wine-y (single origin) - do I take it this magic does not dilute down well then?


The forum folk really rate the ek43, the op was very specific in his requirements and thus was given specific advice about the best route to take.


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

I make all types of espresso,darker & lighter beans, with my EK43 all the time. Always sweet results

Its important to have the newer style coffee burrs


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## UbiquitousPhoton (Mar 7, 2016)

Yes, apologies for the thread hijack, but I'm trying to get my head round the whys and wherefores of the same two grinders as they both fairly much fit my requirements to a tee.

I think I would agree the R120 was a much better choice for the OP, now I just have to make my mind up for myself. And win the lottery.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Any questions drop me or Spence a pm . Ek's aren't for everyone - good to try or read up as much as you can


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

UbiquitousPhoton said:


> I know lungo is where it is at with the EK, but how *does* it fare with more conventional shots (1:2)


I was dialling in beans at the weekend and the 1:2 shot was absolutely rank. Tasted very under. 1:2.5 was so much better. It's not been as pronounced as that before.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Lungo is 1:4 for me . I just make brown drink from beans ...


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

I think largely it depends on roast development and the origin of the coffee. Not to mention what machine and water you're using.

As an example with pretty much ideal water and the Sage DB at 64%PP : Last weeks IMM Brazil is stunning in the range from 17g->40g (2.35) up to a max of (2.8), whereas other coffees have not hit reasonable sweetness until at least 50g from the same 17g dose (2.95).

I think the lowest ratio I have ever experienced an '' OMG this is good'' moment from an EK on the same set-up was 18g->38g (TDS 10.2%) with a medium roast Costa Rican honey process. Rare for a coffee to give up its delicousness so easily


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

After waiting for 5 weeks, just heard a moment ago that there were problems with my R120 order and that it did not arrive with Londinium as expected yesterday, possibly because Compak failed to build it









Any way, order now cancelled and a full (and very prompt) refund received from Reiss - thanks.

I have been without a grinder for 5 weeks now as my Mignon is at a friends place in the French Alps......now in panic buying mode, looking for an alternative to the R120 that is readily available.......


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Ek43.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

The Systemic Kid said:


> Ek43.


He said readily available


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Mrboots2u said:


> He said readily available


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

I thought Machina Espresso had some in stock, no?


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Well, as they say, All's well that ends well









The day started with disappointment at not receiving the Compak R120 I had ordered from Londinium and ended with a second hand Compak R120 sitting in my kitchen.

Reiss at Londinium pulled out all the stops and managed to source me an 'as new' second hand R120 at a very attractive price. All I can say is thanks Reiss, I am well pleased and should I ever be in the market for a Lever, I will be knocking at your door again.


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

More good news, an Aeropress funnel fits the mouth of the burr chamber perfectly so no need for the hopper as I intend to single dose the beast.... She has already been accepted by SWMBO and has been nick named Big Bertha, can't think of why she chose that name


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

Welcome to the club!

You might want to check consistency using the aeropress funnel. When I tried it I started seeing some retention when single dosing. When I checked it was because the odd bean was being thrown up into the gap between the grinder throat and the bottom of the funnel. That was enough to give a 0.2-0.4g drop. Didn't happen every time, but when I put the hopper back on it was back to 0.0g difference.

Enjoy - it is certainly a beast


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

NickdeBug said:


> Welcome to the club!
> 
> You might want to check consistency using the aeropress funnel. When I tried it I started seeing some retention when single dosing. When I checked it was because the odd bean was being thrown up into the gap between the grinder throat and the bottom of the funnel. That was enough to give a 0.2-0.4g drop. Didn't happen every time, but when I put the hopper back on it was back to 0.0g difference.
> 
> Enjoy - it is certainly a beast


Many thanks, I will keep an eye on it


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## Father_Java (Apr 24, 2013)

Well, I have now enjoyed several shots from the R120 and can honestly say that it is some of the best coffee that I have ever produced.

I was somewhat sceptical about all of the stories about how the grinder can make such a difference - I am now convinced that the grinder really is the most important component in the espresso system and wish I had made the investment sooner.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Haha, well going from a Mignon to an R120 should certainly show you the difference... what a beast.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Does the R120 have a shot timer?


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## UbiquitousPhoton (Mar 7, 2016)

No. It's a tad quick for that!


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