# Mazzer SJ - espresso grind



## Mr O (Jan 14, 2015)

I took my burrs out last weekend and gave Mr Jolly a good ole clean. Put the burrs back in and got me a marker for where the burr touch point was...

The question is, how many 'marks' back from the touch point would an average espresso grind be? I know all beans are a bit different but I'm just after a rough starting point. I can't keep tipping espresso down the sink









My LSOL beans are due next month and I definatly don't wanna be throwing them down the sink...

Mr O

(not a Tamper Master)


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Mr O said:


> I took my burrs out last weekend and gave Mr Jolly a good ole clean. Put the burrs back in and got me a marker for where the burr touch point was...
> 
> The question is, how many 'marks' back from the touch point would an average espresso grind be? I know all beans are a bit different but I'm just after a rough starting point. I can't keep tipping espresso down the sink
> 
> ...


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## grumpydaddy (Oct 20, 2014)

With a little guidance to begin with I found that starting 1/8th of a turn open, grind a double shot, tamp and time this into the cup at either a 1:1.6 or 1:2 ratio allowing 1 sec per g seems to be a good starting point.

18g in and 29g out in as close as you can to 29 seconds for the 1:1.6 ratio

or

18g in and 36g out in close to 36 seconds for the 1:2 ratio should be the target.

You can either creep towards your target or step past and then back in ever smaller steps. By this I mean, with reference to the zero point, first try = 22.5°, second try = 45°, third = 34°, fourth = 28°....etc (Figures for demonstration only)

If the grind is the same weight in and the tamp is always the same weight then making the grind finer to go slower or coarser to go quicker is the variable you are looking for from the grinder.

I have less experience than most here but the reasoning is as follows: Stopping the shot at the shorter 1:1.6 time or letting it run longer to the 1:2 time seems to be dependent on the level of roast, the beans and the taste from them. The guidance about targeting for 1 sec per gram out was found on the Londinium site by the designer Riess. I am not certain this works with pumps too but I don't see why not.


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Agree with El Carajillo. I've found overall approx 13 notches from touch is a good ballpark.


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

I've just counted where the Major is at the moment and it's also 13 notches too. Weird


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## Orangertange (Jul 4, 2013)

Like said above, pay attention to flow rate, Unfortunately always have to chuck some down the sink when changing beans, unless you're really lucky, just count yourself lucky your dealing with 20gs retention like I am


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## Mr O (Jan 14, 2015)

thanks for the replies everyone... My SJ setting isn't too far out (which I didn't think it was) but I had to confirm this so I could look at other possible problems. My setting is at 12.5 as I type...

So, I'm now thinking that my tamp method is causing the problems. The problems being a too quick shot. I'm getting 16g in and 32g out in circa 10 seconds. If I let it run for the 32 seconds I'm getting 70/80g...


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## Orangertange (Jul 4, 2013)

Don't worrie too much about tamp pressure just keep it consistent, try grinding a bit finer,


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

+1 on going finer. Defo


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## grumpydaddy (Oct 20, 2014)

I would say try going to ~11-11.5 and if you don't already try nutating.

I could not find a definitive answer on how and when to nutate but when NSWE helped some, nutating has seemingly ended any channeling I had. I currently use a convex tamper if that makes a difference

nutate first then tamp works for me but I have watched a tamp then nutate video

I just checked my Mazzer... I am at 10.5-11 notches


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## Mr O (Jan 14, 2015)

Thanks again everyone, I will report back tomorrow


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## Mr O (Jan 14, 2015)

I'm now down to about 9 notches... It was better but still not fine enough according to my shot weight / time..


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Keep going finer


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Sorry....Are these new burrs? The nearer the burrs are to the espresso point from the touch point is and indication of how worn the burrs are.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Be a bit more cavalier with your adjustments, sounds like you're being very gradual and potentially wasting coffee (as well as taking you days to dial in). As long as you adjust with the grinder running you'll get an audible alarm if you start getting too fine...


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

Interesting read. Just checked and I've been running my SJ at 6 notches from the touching point.

still waiting on the new burrs that I ordered from eBay at the beginning of the week. Looks like they are definitely needed!

I have been trying out a bottomless pf and have seen quite a bit of spritzing and jetting sideways. It is my understanding that this is often linked to inconsistent tamp or grind. Hopefully the new burrs will definitively rule out the grind and then it is just down to me!


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## Mr O (Jan 14, 2015)

urbanbumpkin said:


> Sorry....Are these new burrs? The nearer the burrs are to the espresso point from the touch point is and indication of how worn the burrs are.


No they are not new. So i could need some new ones.. I did strip and clean them....


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## Mr O (Jan 14, 2015)

jeebsy said:


> Be a bit more cavalier with your adjustments, sounds like you're being very gradual and potentially wasting coffee (as well as taking you days to dial in). As long as you adjust with the grinder running you'll get an audible alarm if you start getting too fine...


I'm about there now..

but the same as NickdeBug i am down to 6 notches from touch point.

I just put 18g in, got 15g out in 28 seconds. so i can back off a cpl of notches.

The coffee i've been wasting is only very cheap supermarket espresso beans. But i did want to get sorted before i was wasting decent beans (and thanks to you folks it looks like i'm ready to go)

I might order some new burrs in the near future though....


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

You'll need to adjust again when you change to 'good' beans but shouldn't be as dtrastic now you're in the ballpark


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## Mr O (Jan 14, 2015)

jeebsy said:


> You'll need to adjust again when you change to 'good' beans but shouldn't be as dtrastic now you're in the ballpark


The good beans arrived yesterday from Rave. I just need to wait for the 7-10 days for them to degas...

I just pulled another shot:

17g in - 33g out in 32 seconds and it's the best ive made yet (with stale beans) i can't wait to try the new ones


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## Mr O (Jan 14, 2015)

LATEST UPDATE:

It would appear my stale dutch supermarket beans were the problem.

I've just ground 17g of my 9 day old Rave IJ.

The results were as follows - 17g in - 11g out in 32 seconds.....whoops!!

That was at the same grind setting as above ^

So, perhaps about 9 notches will be about right and i don't need new burrs....


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Dam those stale Dutch beans! Glad to hear it's working for you.


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