# Clumping issue with Mignon



## m4lcs67 (Mar 16, 2014)

As I am new to the Mignon, I have read loads about the grinder, and one of the things that pops up regularly is the clumping issue with it. Yes, it even does it with mine. The ground coffee comes out in little cubes which can be an irritant when you want an even distribution into the portafilter. Many recommend stirring the ground coffee with something like a cocktail stick. I have given that a go myself, but I have just discovered my own method of dealing with the clumping. I have pretty much nailed setting the timer so the correct weight of coffee comes out at the time set by me with the timer.

However instead of grinding straight into the portafilter, I grind into a small plastic cup first, then tap the coffee and stir it around in order to break the clumped coffee up, then pour it into the portafilter, level it and tamp it as normal. It may seem a bit long winded, but if it works then hey!!! Just one of those little things that we Mignon owners have to live with.


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## Billywiz1307 (Aug 21, 2013)

I too have a Eureka Mignon and it clumps also. What I do is dose straight into the portafilter and tap twice, grind a little more then tap agin and sweep across the top of the grinds to level the coffee. Then tamp. I wouldn't bother to break up the clumps.

I got a Giotto last August and dropped across Jamie Callaghan on YouTube. He describes dosing and using a Giotto but his method is dosing and arriving at the optimum dosing method is foolproof and works every time perfectly, no weighing, measuring, just consistent dosing.

Having said that, my Eureka Mignon V2 has packed in this morning, 8 months old and completely dead. BellaBarista, help!!!


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Do you mean Scotty Callaghan? Leveling works to a degree but if you change grind size its going to effect how much coffee is in there when you level. I think he used he own bespoke dosing tools also. If your coffee is good and you happy with taste then don't change what your doing. Good luck with the grinder btw


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

It will also change if you change beans as well, clumping is generally a sign that you are grinding a bit too far on the fine side, you could try grinding a little coarser and then nutating lightly before you tamp.

Tapping the pf either when partially full or full is generally considered to be a bad idea as it can create fault lines which fracture the puck, weighing the grinds and then the espresso output is by far the best method to achieve consistency and doesn't really add that much time to making a coffee, after all it's not like we have a huge queue waiting for their orders in our kitchens is it.

Glevum has said more than once ( and he's on his 3rd set of burrs) that some of the clumpiness (is that even a word lol) goes once the burrs are fully seasoned.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Charliej said:


> It will also change if you change beans as well, clumping is generally a sign that you are grinding a bit too far on the fine side, you could try grinding a little coarser and then nutating lightly before you tamp.
> 
> Tapping the pf either when partially full or full is generally considered to be a bad idea as it can create fault lines which fracture the puck, weighing the grinds and then the espresso output is by far the best method to achieve consistency and doesn't really add that much time to making a coffee, after all it's not like we have a huge queue waiting for their orders in our kitchens is it.
> 
> Glevum has said more than once ( and he's on his 3rd set of burrs) that some of the clumpiness (is that even a word lol) goes once the burrs are fully seasoned.


Clumping is notorious with the Mignon, as soon as you get anywhere near the espresso grind it chucks out rocks. Lighter the roast the worse it is. Its totally unavoidable by making the grind coarser (that is to say, you get way too coarse before it stops).

Tapping is only negative after the tamp, when you can crack the tamped puck and as you said, create 'fault lines'. When freshly ground into the portafilter, a bit of a shake and a few taps are a great way to break up the grinds.

I think you are right about the burrs, I seem to remember the clumping being shockingly bad when I first had the grinder, but less so now its been in use a while.


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## daveevans (Jul 5, 2014)

Mine clumps, i just level it off in the portafilter with my finger. Should i be breaking it up inbetween grinder and portafilter?


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

daveevans said:


> Mine clumps, i just level it off in the portafilter with my finger. Should i be breaking it up inbetween grinder and portafilter?


Do you have a naked portafilter?

If your distribution is off then you will be able to see this with a naked portafilter and you will see it extracting at one point more than others.

If you can observe an even distribution, and more importantly if your shot tastes good, then your technique is probably working fine.


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## Wombat (Nov 12, 2013)

I've been spending a lot of time (about a minute or more) grinding, distributing, levelling and tamping.

Then the other day I tried to streamline my process as much as possible, distributing quite hurriedly, a settling tap and multi tasking to flush the group as I did so. I managed this twice on the bounce and the shots were the best I've ever pulled - they tasted much richer and complex. I wasn't able to reproduce this effect again in the last 3 days, but it's certainly given me food for thought about over complicating my process


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## JojoS (Oct 1, 2014)

I have a Mignon Manual (Doser type) and the vendor who sold it to me warned me about clumping and told me the best way to avoid clumping is to dose as fast as you can as you grind. I single dose directly to my naked portafilter with an IDR by Costas and still do the WDT just as an extra step. I weigh my dose (19 grams) and target a 40 gram espresso in 28~32 seconds on a Gaggia Classic with Auber PID.


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## Wombat (Nov 12, 2013)

Possibly a silly question but what's an IDR?


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## JojoS (Oct 1, 2014)

IDR is short for Intelligent Dosing Ring made by Costas of Sweden.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

JojoS said:


> IDR is short for Intelligent Dosing Ring made by Costas of Sweden.


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## Wombat (Nov 12, 2013)

Ahhh, like the OE dosing funnels. I was about to buy one of those but I'll look at an IDR too. Thanks


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## charris (Feb 17, 2014)

JojoS said:


> and the vendor who sold it to me warned me about clumping and told me the best way to avoid clumping is to dose as fast as you can as you grind


What exactly do you mean by this? If you grind directly into the pf don't you dose at the same time?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

charris said:


> What exactly do you mean by this? If you grind directly into the pf don't you dose at the same time?


He has a doser version , not the on demand version , judging by his earlier post

he might be refering to how fast he thwacks the doser?

Thwacking the doser fast will break up clumps


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## JojoS (Oct 1, 2014)

Thwacking the doser is the perfect phrase for it. Yup! That is what I do.


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## Underking (Dec 1, 2014)

Mine clumps like crazy. I've tried breaking the cubes up with a toothpick and that seems to work. I'm now grinding into a bowl and using a small whisker to break up the cubes before dosing into portafilter.

To top it off I found LOADS of coffee caked into the chute. Ended up using pipe cleaners and the blower for my camera to dislodge it all (the grinder was holding onto atleast 12g of grounds!!)


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## Bigpikle (Oct 14, 2014)

Mine clumps a bit as well but I followed some advice here that has helped:

1. grind into a tall beaker so the coffee falls further and the clumps break up more (also handy for weighing the dose into the PF)

2. use a 58mm camera lens hood in the PF and stir lightly with a cocktail stick

Only takes a few seconds extra and I have no channeling issues or any other problems showing with the naked PF. Weekly clean out with a hoover over the burrs and chute and I dont have any issues.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

The clumping gets much better after the burrs have been broken in, when new its terrible for clumping.

Into an aluminium container and a good shake normally does the job of declumping. I would regularly hoover mine out as well to remove the retained grinds, although it had been mentioned that it makes the hoover smell of old coffee.


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## El Cabron (Nov 23, 2013)

At least it saves on the Shake n Vac heheh











Dylan said:


> it makes the hoover smell of old coffee.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Better than not doing it and having your coffee taste like an old hoover!


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## El Cabron (Nov 23, 2013)

Or maxwell house


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## Big Tony (Dec 18, 2012)

I have a Mignon and it also clumps. I did the same as everyone else and stirred it, tapped it etc... Then I read somewhere that I should just tamp straight over the top of the clumped mound. I did so and watched the bottom of the naked pf to see whether I could see anything unusual. If anything, I got a perfectly central mouse tail! I never changed my method since.

that said, I was using a LM basket and Gaagia Classic. I have just ordered an Expobar Brewtus with naked Portafilter and genuine VST basket. I'll be using the same method to see if the upgraded kit produces the same quality output.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Well Tony I have largely come to the same conclusion. Although I never really had much trouble with clumps, except maybe with the MC2 sometimes, I have noticed that the less I faff around with the grinds the better. This was very much contrary to expectation where so much store is set by good prep (which I feel disinclined to dispute). But those days when I was in too much of a hurry to tap and stir and level and weigh and generally fanny about were also quite often the days when the shot came together really well. Go figure! I had a naked PF with the Classic, but since getting the R58 and Zenith I've been using the spouted PF because my naked is wrapped up under the (non-existent) Christmas tree. However the results I've had with just grinding straight into the VST from the Zenith, a quick bump or two on the tamping mat to turn the Matterhorn into the Malvern Hills and then a straight tamp and polish lead me to expect that when I try out the new naked PF, it will be just as good.


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## Big Tony (Dec 18, 2012)

Some people won't like me saying this, but I think that some of the prep that gets mentioned on here is a bit over the top. Fair enough if you can notice every minor difference, but lets face it, most of us can just tell the difference between a good and bad coffee. Grinding into beakers, stirring, placing into PF's, levelling, tamping, polishing etc... can be a bit over the top IMO.

I would be willing to bet my bottom dollar that most people wouldn't know the difference between the two cups if they did the blindfold test with coffees made both ways.


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## Daren (Jan 16, 2012)

Yeah - but where the fun in that! Just buy a Nespresso machine if you want easy. The faff is as rewarding as the coffee imho


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## Big Tony (Dec 18, 2012)

my point is... you want a good coffee made with freshly ground beans. Sometimes the faff if overhyped and the result is the same. I feel like a I follow the same process everytime and get a slightly different cup everytime!


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Big Tony said:


> Some people won't like me saying this, but I think that some of the prep that gets mentioned on here is a bit over the top. Fair enough if you can notice every minor difference, but lets face it, most of us can just tell the difference between a good and bad coffee. Grinding into beakers, stirring, placing into PF's, levelling, tamping, polishing etc... can be a bit over the top IMO.
> 
> I would be willing to bet my bottom dollar that most people wouldn't know the difference between the two cups if they did the blindfold test with coffees made both ways.


Hi tony, just put of interest l what's your preferred drink ? Espresso ? Latte ? Americano .

Agree where possible least faff to get good prep is more repeatable and more desirable

Would disagree you couldn't tell difference between an under , over and super tasty extracted shot ( as espresso ) .

Had a 23.4% ey shot tonight , like melted chocolate treacle And toffee , so so sweet , so Intense , different to the 19 ey shot this morning both good .

Yeah that all figures and boffin but really what im saying in simple terms is same coffee , different extractions changes taste quite dramatically


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## Big Tony (Dec 18, 2012)

That wasn't what I meant

I meant that most people wouldn't tell the difference between a shot that had been stirred with a toothpick, versus one that hadn't.


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## Big Tony (Dec 18, 2012)

Oh, and...

I like a mix of drinks tbh. I like milk based drinks such as latte, but also really like a good Americano. My morning coffee is a cortado or straight espresso.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Big Tony said:


> That wasn't what I meant
> 
> I meant that most people wouldn't tell the difference between a shot that had been stirred with a toothpick, versus one that hadn't.


Fair point , sorry misunderstood you

I Suppose though it the depends if you think the toothpick technique takes a shot from under extracted to tasty....or has any effect .

I don't and never did use WDT btw ...


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## Daren (Jan 16, 2012)

Psychologically it tastes better to the person making it.... Whatever makes you happy is what I say.

Speaking personally I prefer to simply grind and tamp - keeping it simple


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

No nutation?


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## Daren (Jan 16, 2012)

urbanbumpkin said:


> No nutation?


Oops - forgot that, yes normally nutate (although the 2 shots I tried with the new tamp tonight we're straight down no nutatating and were bang tidy, maybe the dawn of a new era?)


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Less faff the better seems to be the prevailing view here now I think. Some of the shot prep videos from days gone by were outrageous


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## Phil104 (Apr 15, 2014)

I don't get much clumping with my mignon....am I doing something wrong?

(When I spoke with Claudette soon after I got it, she suggested some clumping was a good sign that the grind was about right for the beans).


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## charris (Feb 17, 2014)

I am with Big Tony but in a different way:

I refuse to do any basket/distribution preparation other that tapping or shaking or finger wiping which take a second or less i.e no wdt, no needles, no toothpicks, no knifes, no scott callaghan tools, e.t.c because enough is enough.

I "pre and after" weigh and time my shots but taking more time to do more in basket distribution it is just too much for me. I am not saying everybody should do the same. But personally I always prefer the fastest and most efficient way (especially for something I do every day).


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## charris (Feb 17, 2014)

Tony, regarding the other things you mentioned: leveling, tamping polishing.

I think these 3 can be done without taking time or thinking too much about them if you invest in the right equipment: a nice tamping stand (there goes the levering part) and a nice tamper (there goes the tamping and polishing part other than this will require practice).


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## jj_glos (Dec 27, 2014)

Sorry if I missed it (it is new years eve, so a couple of drinks may have been consumed), but what is wdt?


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## Sctb78 (Dec 8, 2014)

Here ya go

http://www.home-barista.com/weiss-distribution-technique.html


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## jj_glos (Dec 27, 2014)

Sctb78 said:


> Here ya go
> 
> http://www.home-barista.com/weiss-distribution-technique.html


Excellent, many thanks. It sounded quite ominous, but really quite straightforward


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