# Changing ratio



## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Morning everyone

I am going to have my first go at changing by extraction ratio later on and I'm after a bit of advice.

I am currently at 18g in, 36g out in c.33 seconds. If I want to try a 1:2.5 ratio, so 45g out, do I adjust my grind to still hit c.33 seconds or leave it alone and just run the shot longer?

thanks in advance


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

You can do either of those.

I'd probably leave the grind setting and let it run longer first. See what it tastes like.

If it tastes better go with that (and make a note of the setting).

If you want to change the grind later keep the dose and the extraction the same and see if it improves the taste of the shot.

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## Marocchino (May 1, 2019)

@itguy It's pretty good practice to only change one thing at a time and see where you are with the taste. As you have a reference point from your current dialled in position, incrementally extracting longer and seeing how that affects the taste is probably a good way to go.


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Thanks - have just pulled a shot keeping the grind the same but 45g out. Tastes a degree bitter and more 'flat'. I must admit I am still struggling to really tell the difference between sour and bitter, although I think I am developing this as I taste more. The sweetness is the bit that throws me I think as sour sometimes tastes like that to me?


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## Marocchino (May 1, 2019)

@itguy You now have another reference point to work with - 45g out; with everything else remaining the same, ( grind, dose weight, puck prep) why not try 40g out and see how that compares with your previous shot - being guided by how the flavour changes with the shot extraction time.

Fully appreciate your comments about the subtleties between sour and bitter. I'm probably the last one to make comments on tasting as my old tastebuds are no longer that keen.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

itguy said:


> Thanks - have just pulled a shot keeping the grind the same but 45g out. Tastes a degree bitter and more 'flat'. I must admit I am still struggling to really tell the difference between sour and bitter, although I think I am developing this as I taste more. The sweetness is the bit that throws me I think as sour sometimes tastes like that to me?


 Think less about sour & bitter. Neither of these are things you generally want.

There is almost no sucrose in roasted coffee, so perceptions of sweetness must come from something else, like acids.

If the shot is more "flat", this may be down to the grind being too fine for that ratio. This can kill brightness & any clarty.

To make sure this is the case try a 1:4 shot (same grind). If this is worse regarding flatness, go back to 1:3 at a slightly coarser grind and see if it clears up.

Don't fret over the time, nor aim to the second (actually unhelpful, because different coffees brew at different speeds). Concentrate on the grind setting, ratio & taste...even if you struggle with bitter & sour, you must be able to recognise something you like? So keep pushing coarser until everything starts to taste bad, then go back finer to the good range.


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