# L1 pre-infusion question



## Doggycam (May 9, 2013)

Hi all,

Do you L1 users pre-infuse till the coffee starts dripping ?

I've been giving it 6 seconds, when I release the lever it jumps slightly and makes a wee shooshing noise (technical term !) Get a short pour as well, about 1 fl 0z.

Theres no leaks, so its not a seal issue.

I reckon its the puck getting fully saturated quickly by the increased pressure.

If I wait till it starts to drip, this doesn't happen. I can be waiting for what seems like an age though. Get a full pour too, approx 2 oz

The coffee tastes good whichever way I do it, but I'm not far down the lever machine path, so have a bit of learning to do.

Maybe I'm grinding too fine ? 15g grinds in, light tamp, 1 and a bit oz out in approx 30 secs.

Hope this make sense ?

I did a forum search, and the general consensus is 6 to 10 secs. But no-one else mentions the wee jump of the lever.

Thanks,

Cameron


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Strange did you assemble the lever group exactly as per the instructions?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Clip perhaps. ...


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## Doggycam (May 9, 2013)

coffeechap said:


> Strange did you assemble the lever group exactly as per the instructions?


Yes. I'm an aircraft engineer, so not too bad with my hands. Though some of my colleagues may question that ;o)

If the seals were leaking water would be coming out around the bolted face of the group.

Also,it only does it with the short pre-infusion. If the seals had blown, it would probably do it all the time.

I'll try and make a video soon. At work at the moment.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

It's not about the seals going, I think you have air in the group. What angle is the lever at when it bites against the spring? Really long preinfusion is not advised as when the lever is in the dropped position the thermosyphon does not cycle and if left in a paused state for to long may stall, I preinfuse anywhere between 6 and 20 seconds depending on what I want to achieve


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## Doggycam (May 9, 2013)

coffeechap said:


> It's not about the seals going, I think you have air in the group. What angle is the lever at when it bites against the spring? Really long preinfusion is not advised as when the lever is in the dropped position the thermosyphon does not cycle and if left in a paused state for to long may stall, I preinfuse anywhere between 6 and 20 seconds depending on what I want to achieve


Could be air. Need to wait till I get home to check the angle. At work now. Off the top of my head about 2 o'clock and jumps to half past 1.

Can you bleed it ?


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## MarkyP (Jan 10, 2013)

That sounds very high - and similar to the issue I was getting...

Have you tried re-lubing the seals and the cylinder walls?


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## Doggycam (May 9, 2013)

MarkyP said:


> That sounds very high - and similar to the issue I was getting...
> 
> Have you tried re-lubing the seals and the cylinder walls?


No. Its only becoming apparent now that I may have an issue with the machine. I put it down to my inexperience.

Got some Molykote on order.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

This will give you an idea of where the lever catches etc .


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

Yeah that doesn't sound normal at all!

I pre-infuse for 3 seconds and don't generally see first drips at this point, they start a second or two after I release the lever and it bites.


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## CamV6 (Feb 7, 2012)

I presume you've not tried contacting Reiss and asking him for advice specifically? I doubt there's an issue with the machine, its bound to be something really simple.

Also, have a look at the Londinium form as there is a whole section there that will have you answer for sure http://londiniumespresso.com/forum/com_kunena_categories/list#.Utw8k2xFBjo

Reiss is often online on Skype via his website and he's extremely helpful

Not having this machine personally I'm not 100% sure what you're describing but if the lever is catching high or skipping then this may be due to insufficient greasing in the bore. So, maybe try removing the top half of the group, wipe a thin film of silicone grease over the entire surface of the bore, trying not to gunk up the 4 tiny inlet ports, and then using a torch shining up from the bottom of the group check for any dry ungreased areas in the bore, replace the top half of the group as per original instructions, pump the lever about 25 times or so BEFORE refitting the shower screen to drive any excess grease out of the bottom of the group, wipe clean any excess grease that comes out, replace shower screen and with any luck, voila, sorted!


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## Doggycam (May 9, 2013)

CamV6 said:


> I presume you've not tried contacting Reiss and asking him for advice specifically? I doubt there's an issue with the machine, its bound to be something really simple.
> 
> Also, have a look at the Londinium form as there is a whole section there that will have you answer for sure http://londiniumespresso.com/forum/com_kunena_categories/list#.Utw8k2xFBjo
> 
> ...


I'll have a look at this tomorrow.

I'll contact reiss, if we get stuck.

Thanks for all the help everyone. We'll get to the bottom of this.


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## Doggycam (May 9, 2013)

Whipped the lever and piston out. Seals looked good. Don't have the molykote yet, but sprayed liberally with some foodsafe silicone grease spray I had.

Re-assembled and washed through twice with some stale beans.

Didn't video the 1st "real" shot, and it did its jumping thing.

Made 8 shots since, all on camera, and its been absolutely fine. Bloody thing is camera shy !!

I'm flying higher than a kite at the moment, even though I did pour a lot down the sink!









Coffee chap, been thinking about the air thing. Could be drawing air in from above the seals during lever pull down. Then seating properly when under pressure.

This would explain the short measure when it jumps and the lack of water above the seals.

Theres nothing worse than trying to trouble shoot an intermittent fault.

I'll report further when I need another hit of caffeine!


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## Doggycam (May 9, 2013)

Been on the Londinium forum and read this

"As a bit of data, I've had my machine on a timer since late last November, and it has run ~15 hours a day except for a two week period. Over that time I've pulled anywhere from 6-12 shots per day (usually around 6). I relubed once because I wanted to have done it once after about 3 months, maybe sooner (I can check HB to be sure). Since then I've done it twice -- once when the lever started "hopping"/skipping during extraction and once when the extractions squelched a bit when I unlocked the lever (sponginess). That last time was this weekend."

There's a few others had this issue, it is down to the lack of lube on the seals.


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## Doggycam (May 9, 2013)

All lubed up and sorted now. Thanks for the help?


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

Great to hear!


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