# From a Classic to a Cherub - a novices view



## series530

As a few of you will know, I bought my Gaggia a year or so ago. Following a packet of beans as part of a Christmas present I found coffee Forums as part of my quest to buy a grinder. A Eureka Migon later and a huge step up in coffee enjoyment got me frustrated with the time required to produce two milk based coffees. Queue my next upgrade: a better espresso machine.

Much as I would love to buy a Londinium or a fancy Italian design I struggle to justify the cost and with so much positive praise on here for Fracino, the decision was either a Heavenly or a Cherub.

Our kitchen is a mix of oak fronted units with black granite worktops. My wife isn't keen huge areas of shiny metal and I would like the facility of hot water on demand for heating cups or producing tea at the same time as coffee. Thus, the choice was made for go for a Cherub with the standard black sides.

We bought our machine through Espresso Underground. I'm always keen to offer praise where praise is due and Peter (at EU) has been excellent. He's been very approachable, friendly and his prices have been very competitive. Last Monday I ordered the unit and Peter said it could take up to ten days to arrive. He did say that the courier company that Fracino use could be troublesome but that this was outside his control.

On Thursday, on her way back from the shops, my wife noticed a white delivery van outside our house. The driver was on his mobile and a nice big Fracino box was on our doorstep. We weren't in and the driver was phoning head office asking what to do. In this day and age, courier companies can notify a recipient with a one hour wide slot. This has to be a more convenient and cost effective approach than simply turning up and possibly having to come again several times. Anyway, the delivery driver kindly carried the unit inside and it was left for me to install over the weekend.










As the picture shows, it's a pretty decent box which is attached to a solid pallet. Given the weight (about 24Kg), the pallet is necessary. The box is solidly made and properly sealed with Fracino tape. The whole is then strapped on to the pallet. The unit sits nicely inside the box with polystyrene packaging around the outside. The machine is inside a large plastic bag and can be lifted out reasonably easily once the side packaging is removed provided the purchaser is reasonably strong. For the less able, it may prove a little awkward on account of the weight. It's a shame that polystyrene is used for packaging. It's perfectly fit for purpose but not especially recycle friendly. This, however, is a minor point.










The machine is fully pre assembled with the exception of the portafilter. This comes in a box which sits on the drip tray. Also contained with this box is a pair of baskets and a blank basket for back flushing. There is a metal spoon for coffee and a plastic tamper. For most neither of these latter items will be used. They are a step above the offering that came with the Gaggia but not by far. This isn't a big deal as it makes no sense to pay over the odds for something which will probably be replaced with a better unit anyway.

The unit is stunning in its look. It is beautifully painted with a rich black fleck paint finish to the back and sides while the front and top are stainless steel. Most of the stainless steel surfaces are covered in a protective plastic coating. This protects the surface during manufacturing and transportation. It appears to withstand laser cutting and, for this reason is as tough as nails and equally difficult to remove. Removing it from the drip tray is relatively easy provided you can find an edge with a nail and gradually pull it off. The top surface is more difficult. In the end I removed the top plate (four allen screws) and took it off starting at the corners (which would otherwise be hidden within the frame of the unit).










One of my biggest concerns was the size of the unit. While the websites give dimensions and weight its still pretty difficult to sense how big something will be in its working environment. With this in mind, I have taken a few pictures and those people who are aware of the size of a Gaggia Classic or a Eureka Mignon can use this to get some idea of how much room it will take up on a suitably robust work surface.










Limit of four pictures per post, please be patient, more will follow:


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## Glenn

The Eureka Mignon looks good next to the Fracino Cherub


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## series530

Continuing on:

The other consideration for this unit is water. Water for filling and waste water. As a typical domestic installation it is not mains attached but it does come with a fairly large tank (more on this later). With an E61 style group head the unit does benefit from flushing before expressing a shot (or so I understand). This causes the drip tray to fill reasonably rapidly. I was concerned about the volume of the tray as I am not a person who empties it after every shot. The picture shows a Gaggia tray beside the Cherub unit.










Its bigger in volume by a reasonable amount. The drip tray cover is pleasing on the eye and the hole has been cut in the correct position for the E61 exhaust. At about 14cm front to back it isn't especially deep. In fact, the E61 head is almost the same width so flushing with no portafilter can cause a bit of a mess on the work top.

With mine, and as the picture shows, coffee is espressed toward the back of the portafilter and there isn't a huge amount of space for large cups.










The unit comes with a large tank but, even taking into account the priming of the boiler, I'm amazed how quickly it empties. As the picture shows, water is filled by removing the black hatch. The tank can be lifted out and really needs to be in order to fit the water filter. I'm not crazy about the water tank lid. It's a piece of black plastic which is adequate. It would have been a nice touch to have used a piece of metal painted the same colour as the sides. It is, however, perfectly functional.

What is something of a problem is the fact that I cannot easily see when the tank is empty. There is an audible buzzer to alert the user but, as I found today, it is far from perfect: While the boiler still had water there was insufficient water in the tank to drive the group head. At first I thought it was too fine a grind (it was new coffee) and it took several erroneous attempts for me to realise that the problem was a lack of water through the coffee. The buzzer did not sound. If like me, the unit is under a kitchen wall cupboard, with the tank fill being at the back, it's quite difficult to fill or check the water level without pulling the unit out. It's something that I will have to do. Luckily, it isn't difficult to pull out as the feet allow it to slide.

I noticed that some of the earlier newer designs had slots cut in the top for cooling of the internals. On mine the slots have been moved to the back of the unit and the top is a beautifully finished solid surface. It's too nice to pile cups on top of it so the guard rails will serve no useful purpose in our household.

So, first power on: as the instructions state, once the filter is installed, fill the tank with water, turn it on and let the pump prime the boiler. It's a large boiler and it will deplete much of the tank. There is a note in the manual (which is pretty professionally written) stating that if the boiler fails to fully fill it will not turn on and will sound the buzzer. This happened on mine (so I know that the buzzer works). It's necessary to turn off the machine, top up the tank and turn it again. The boiler will continue to fill and after a while the heating noise similar to a kettle will start. Various lights tell you the stage of heating. It's suggested that you wait at least 15 minutes before pulling a shot.

Having read about the steam train steam wand I purchased a two hole version and fitted this straight away. More on that in a bit.

The baskets are the same size as the ones I use in the classic and are of similar quality. I have relatively cheap non pressurised versions (the perfect crema pressurised ones... you can imagine). I filled to the same level as with the Gaggia and tamped with about the same pressure.

It's great to be able to warm the cups with a proper hot water outlet.

The E61 style head is far more robust than that of the Gaggia. It takes a bit of experimentation to fit the portafilter into the head because the handle is angled slightly downward so as to form a tripod when filling and tamping. I tended to hold the handle horizontal which made the rim of the portafilter angle downward and not engage in the group head. No big deal though, I easily got used to holding the handle at a slight angle.

Unlike a true E61, the pump is started by pressing a weighty switch to the left of the head. This turns on the pump. It isn't the quietest pump in the world but it sounds "solid".










I don't feel proficient enough to steam milk while espressing a shot at the moment but it's great to have the option to be able to do so. On the strength of other threads I purchased a two hole steam tip from Peter and installed this by default. I've found it perfectly adequate for a single cappuccino and a little slow for a double cup. Still faster than the Gaggia but its the same old story: that Austin Allegro seemed zippy until the Ferrari purchase and now the Ferrari seems a little sluggish (a figure of speech and not personal experience, in case you are wondering). I suspect that I will revert to the four hole tip at some point or even consider one of the three hole tips which seem to be mentioned. One word of caution: with the Gaggia I would routinely wipe the Rancilio wand with a cloth and my finger may experience the jet occasionally. One this one, if that happens, it hurts! This unit, even with a two hole tip pushes out some serious steam. A few mentol crystals and my cold could be knocked in to touch... just a shame that my nose would end up there as well!

I can already see improvement in the microfoam. Thanks to Glenn, I wasn't doing that badly before. This machine, especially with the two hole tip is pretty forgiving and I can see an improvement. Who knows, I may even do some latte art in the not to far distant future.

So far at least, I cannot comment with regard to the quality of my shots. I've messed up a few because of the empty water tank but the others are coming out quite nicely. I need to properly calibrate the grind with shot glasses and scales. I don't believe that I am a million miles away but I need to have a little more practise first.

If there is sufficient interest I will add a bit more to this thread as I get more experienced with the machine.

In summary for now, if I was asked if it is a good purchase my answer would be that it is a resounding success, is very well built, feels solid, looks solid and has the makings of a great partnership with a little more practice.


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## shrink

Get some cups on the top of it







completes the look nicely. I you don't wanna scratch it, get one of those rubber anti slip kitchen mats to put on top first hehe

I tried using the standard four hole tip today, on a 500ml jug half filled. It literally exploded milk pretty much everywhere. It's just too rowdy a tip. I've used four hole tips on commercial machines, and they have much smoother delivery of steam. IMHO it just doesn't work on the cherub.

Can't wait for my 4x1mm to come


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## Steve_S_T

Blimey Shrink, I thought you'd already received your 4 x 1mm tip, I seem to recall you ordering it days ago.

Steve.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


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## 4515

A good balanced review of your new arrival.

I'm hoping that mine will turn up this week and I can claim a bit more of the kitchen space


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## gman147

Yeah get the cups on top man! It's a cup warmer up there, that's its purpose! No anti slip mats etc, cos you want them to heat your cups


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## GS11

nice write up


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## mookielagoo

Great read!......looking foward to part two..!


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## Yes Row

Thanks for doing this. I think I will be pulling the trigger on a Cherub in the next week or so. Going to pop into Fracino later this week, hopefully, to compare it against a Heavenly as I have not seen one of these in the flesh, so to speak

I have contacted Fracino direct regarding the purchase. They would not move on the price which was about £900 incl VAT!


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## shrink

Random given how cheap it is from other suppliers


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## coffeebean

Great write up!


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## gman147

Just shows how much of a great deal I got on my new FC!


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## Maidop

Poona - where did you get your cherub from?


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## series530

Go to Espresso Underground. Both he and I and many others bought our machines from there.


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## Jon V

Hi,

Interesting to read this thread as I am also looking at getting the Cherub.

It will be on a kitchen worktop much like yours which means I wouldn't be able to fill it without moving it away from the units above. You mention that it's possible to slide it forward on its feet which is surprising given its weight. How are you finding this after owning the machine for some time?

Any other thoughts on the machine after using it for a while?


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## series530

Jon V said:


> Hi,
> 
> Interesting to read this thread as I am also looking at getting the Cherub.
> 
> It will be on a kitchen worktop much like yours which means I wouldn't be able to fill it without moving it away from the units above. You mention that it's possible to slide it forward on its feet which is surprising given its weight. How are you finding this after owning the machine for some time?
> 
> Any other thoughts on the machine after using it for a while?


I find it surprising how quickly the reservoir empties. Given the size compared to the Gaggia Classic which came before it, it gets through it really fast. Perhaps this is a function of the steam capability, who knows?

Anyway, sliding it forward is no big deal and the machine does make pretty decent drinks for the money.

Back when I wrote the review I was employed and working from home. These days I am self employed and find it difficult to find time to make a decent cup of coffee with it. I shouldn't grumble as my business has taken off at an alarming rate. I do find now that when I get to use the Cherub I really appreciate the coffee that it produces.


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## Wobin19

To aid sliding you can fit some adhesive felt pads on the feet. Works a treat. I have them on the grinder too.


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## Jon V

Wobin19 said:


> To aid sliding you can fit some adhesive felt pads on the feet. Works a treat. I have them on the grinder too.


Nice tip. Is your cherub still for sale? I am too new to the forum to post on the for sale forum / send PMs.


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## Jon V

series530 said:


> I find it surprising how quickly the reservoir empties. Given the size compared to the Gaggia Classic which came before it, it gets through it really fast. Perhaps this is a function of the steam capability, who knows?
> 
> Anyway, sliding it forward is no big deal and the machine does make pretty decent drinks for the money.
> 
> Back when I wrote the review I was employed and working from home. These days I am self employed and find it difficult to find time to make a decent cup of coffee with it. I shouldn't grumble as my business has taken off at an alarming rate. I do find now that when I get to use the Cherub I really appreciate the coffee that it produces.


Thanks. Stupid question perhaps, but does the entire drip tray part detach from the machine to allow the thing to slide forward that much more?


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## series530

Jon V said:


> Thanks. Stupid question perhaps, but does the entire drip tray part detach from the machine to allow the thing to slide forward that much more?


Not a stupid question, don't worry. The drip tray will detach but it sits in a metal receptacle and this doesn't give you any additional front to back lattitude because the receptacle is the same size as the tray.


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## AliC

You will find that the water tank will empty much sooner than you expect when pulling many shots when dialling in a new grinder as I found. Also be surprised how much water you get through if doing a lot of steaming.

I can get to the top of my tank and make sure it's topped up each morning. You might want to pick up a cheap long spouted watering can to use exclusively for filling the coffee machine.

It takes the tank to be properly empty before the alarm sounds and if not careful the machine can draw in air when empty.

I love my machine and its all a learning process. I have just bought a Mazzer Super Jolly grinder and got the grind just right this pm. What a difference!!!!! Made the most spectacular flat white ever, and I thought I had made some pretty decent ones to date.

If I were to change from the Cherub it would probably be for a L1, but that ain't happening any time soon.


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## Wobin19

Jon V said:


> Nice tip. Is your cherub still for sale? I am too new to the forum to post on the for sale forum / send PMs.


Sorry Cherub was sold to Poona but thanks for the interest. Need to get thread title updated.


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## fatboyslim

Glad to hear Peter at EU (who sold me my Cherub back in April 2012) is still providing the outstanding service I experienced. Even well after my warranty has run out (from Fracino) Peter is approachable to ask for disassembly advice.

I also made the leap from Classic to Cherub and will never ever ever go back to a single boiler machine. Waiting for the boiler to get up to temp after making a shot is the most ridiculous thing ever!


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