# Fish in Coffee



## 4515 (Jan 30, 2013)

Strange question and it may be my taste buds have gone mad but .....

Has anyone tasted a coffee and thought that it tastes of fish ? I'm not talking big, in your face flavour or Grimsby docks aroma, more a hint / suggestion of fish

The coffee is good and has no fishy taste / aftertaste, just a reminder of fish


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Mentioned the other day on the DSOL thread, the CC bean smelt of fish to me.


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

I had a "Fish Pie Latte" last week - kept meaning to post about it.

I left some open milk in a jug in the fridge with an uncovered fish pie for a day or two.

It was with a naturally processed coffee - and, well, it was very very funky...

(Beyond that; not really.)


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

oooh, scary ..... what is the bean .. .is it the DSOL one ?

Where are you storing your beans .... Froggy stores his on a boat, which could explain the fish .... but you ? .... is it in the freezer next to the fishfingers ?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

working dog said:


> Strange question and it may be my taste buds have gone mad but .....
> 
> Has anyone tasted a coffee and thought that it tastes of fish ? I'm not talking big, in your face flavour or Grimsby docks aroma, more a hint / suggestion of fish
> 
> The coffee is good and has no fishy taste / aftertaste, just a reminder of fish


You can sometimes get this funkiness on over roasted natural (dry processed) coffees that may initially look dry, but develop and oily sheen on the surface of the beans after 2-5 weeks. You are tasting the slight funkiness from over roasting and slight rancidity of the oil on the outside of the bean. This rancidity normally shows itself after 2 weeks.

As you have given absolutely no idea of the coffee type, roast level, age of the coffee or preparation method, I could be completely wrong as to the cause of your "fish"taste....but I was forced to guess


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Yeah the dsol one, storing them in the bags they came in, and the hopper.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

DavecUK said:


> You can sometimes get this funkiness on over roasted natural (dry processed) coffees that may initially look dry, but develop and oily sheen on the surface of the beans after 2-5 weeks. You are tasting the slight funkiness from over roasting and slight rancidity of the oil on the outside of the bean. This rancidity normally shows itself after 2 weeks.
> 
> As you have given absolutely no idea of the coffee type, roast level, age of the coffee or preparation method, I could be completely wrong as to the cause of your "fish"taste....but I was forced to guess


This makes sense, the DSOL bean has vastly produced oil after two weeks of roasting.

Think i may empty my hopper tonight...


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## 4515 (Jan 30, 2013)

Didnt see the DSOL comments as I dont subscribe to DSOL now so dont tend to read the threads

I didnt want to put info out about the bean but here goes ....

It is Coffee Compass Burundi Kayanza Codemu that are about 5 weeks old and have been stored in the original bag in a cool dark cupboard

As for prep. I put them through the Mythos Clima Pro and pulled through the L1 - got most of the fish hint in espresso


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## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

What you've pulled there is the extremely rare 'Cod shot'!! I dof my cap to you sir..


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

working dog said:


> Didnt see the DSOL comments as I dont subscribe to DSOL now so dont tend to read the threads
> 
> I didnt want to put info out about the bean but here goes ....
> 
> ...


So I was pretty much 100% correct then...although it's even worse in a dry processed. Burundis are normally wet processed, but if you go quite dark e.g. your DSOL it will happen with those as well. Funny enough I was roasting a Burundi on Saturday.

*The 2 ways you can get a lot of oil on the surface is with a dark roast and then the oil comes out fairly fast and rancidity sets in quick IMO. The other way is more subtle and deceptive.* You can have a coffee that doesn't go particularity dark, but still develops oil after a few weeks. i don't mean the tiny spotting you sometimes get I mean a lot more or they go shiny. This is usually the sign of a coffee that has been roasted far too fast. These can also taste fishy when older than 3 weeks.

I think you might see more of this latter type of coffee as new commercial roasters, with minimal experience start to buy in to what they see on the "world roasting" championships e.g. the sub 8m and slightly over 8 min winning roasts! Also the Zeitgeist developing on many forums where people are checking if a roaster can roast in 10 or 11m. The roaster I am testing can bring a coffee to 2nd crack in under 10m, but I assure you, you wouldn't want to drink it. Also for commercial roasters time is money and roasting coffee very fast gives more batches per hour. New entrants with small roasters obviously find the very fast roast school of thought very appealing.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Rhys said:


> What you've pulled there is the extremely rare 'Cod shot'!! I dof my cap to you sir..


Ha ha ha! I can't believe I was beaten to it. When the chips are down, you win!


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## ShortShots (Oct 2, 2013)

blah


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## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

hotmetal said:


> Ha ha ha! I can't believe I was beaten to it. When the chips are down, you win!


Hook, line and sinker..









Better check my DSOL beans


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## 4515 (Jan 30, 2013)

Thanks All

Seems that my taste buds are functioning and I'm not going mad


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## sjenner (Nov 8, 2012)

Bit of a long shot, but Rwandan coffees are susceptible to something called the "potato defect"... it is a bacterial infection, and is generally detected during drying, but it can make it through the roast...

I experienced this with some excellent coffee that Reiss had when he was still in London...

http://londiniumespresso.com/forum/londinium-beans/282-interesting-experience-with-the-last-of-the-rwanda#4177

I mentioned it on his blog, one bean amongst all those beans can make a cup of coffee taste absolutely revolting. One bean is all it takes... I don't know what sort of a grinder WD uses, but when I encountered it, I was single dosing, so I got the full monty. I guess if you are using a commercial grinder with a flipper, or if you manage to get a broken bean that is infected... It is possible that rancid potato can taste a bit fishy...

JimSeven discusses this on his blog back in 2009 and I note that he mentions Burundi's as being affected too.

http://www.jimseven.com/2009/02/05/phantom-potato/

He then brought the subject up on the coffeed forum here:

http://www.coffeed.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1402


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## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

I guess it's like having an off pint, that one pint can leave you feeling ill all night and rubbish the next day..









(..harks back to student days







)


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Rhys said:


> I guess it's like having an off pint, that one pint can leave you feeling ill all night and rubbish the next day..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I find 5 or 6, what must always be "off" pints, leave me feeling like this.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

I had a mate who would go on all nighters, drink his age in pints, but swear blind it was an iffy kebab that made him sick.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

hotmetal said:


> I had a mate who would go on all nighters, drink his age in pints, but swear blind it was an iffy kebab that made him sick.


No...I'm sure it was the Kebab. Good old rotting week old Doner on a spit, carved off with a dirty spoon, wrapped in a Pitta and always with too much of that red hot sauce (stuff that burns your ringpiece a few hours later)...mmmm.


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## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

Funny how it's usually only when you've had a few, do you fancy a kebab. Although I always just ordered the garlic mayo as I couldn't stand the chilli. I feel hungry now..


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## 4515 (Jan 30, 2013)

The good old compass kebab - the mystical food that can guide you home after a night on the beer


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

Rhys said:


> Funny how it's usually only when you've had a few, do you fancy a kebab. Although I always just ordered the garlic mayo as I couldn't stand the chilli. I feel hungry now..


That's breakfast sorted.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Rhys said:


> Funny how it's usually only when you've had a few, do you fancy a kebab. Although I always just ordered the garlic mayo as I couldn't stand the chilli. I feel hungry now..


I lived in Denmark for a year and there'd be queues out the kebab shop at lunchtime....proper shawarma they were. Incredible. Not like the standard post-club fayre. There's a few quality Turkish places here i'd go sober too.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

The Keebabs in the uk have to be the worst in the world, Germany, you can get them at the side of the road at a little shed that sells beer and newspapers.. Awesome!

We have a little restaurant near me that does proper keebabs, lovely!!


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## FullBloomCoffee (Mar 19, 2015)

had some cascara once with an espresso at TAP in London, and that was very fishy for some reason. :/


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

froggystyle said:


> The Keebabs in the uk have to be the worst in the world, Germany, you can get them at the side of the road at a little shed that sells beer and newspapers.. Awesome!
> 
> We have a little restaurant near me that does proper keebabs, lovely!!


No.....your completely wrong, our Kebabs are the best in the world and I can explain why. A normal Kebab only performs 1 function...it feeds you. In the UK our Kebabs perform 2 functions, they not only feed you, but also act as a fantastic drug free laxative, that's second only to a full colonic irrigation.

Our kebabs are the gift that just keeps giving.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

I've noted "tuna" as a tasting note in a couple of blends which contained a small percentage of robusta . I won't name them


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Germany has a high % of Turkish, hence the better quality of kebabs compared to here. You try getting a decent ruby over there though. Absolutely the only way of getting any spice at all is to explain that you're from the UK. Only then will they actually put any chilli in. None of my German friends can tolerate chilli in any quantity.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Love the german ale though!!


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

froggystyle said:


> Love the german ale though!!


That's a bit of a one way street - plenty of Brits enjoy German beer, but a lot of the Germans I know really struggle with traditional English ales. My mate Dietmar is always up for trying stuff but I can still hear him saying "bitte nie wieder Hobgoblin!"


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Schwarzbier all the way!


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Köstritzer ftw


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Ever had underberg?

Man that stuff is grim!


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

froggystyle said:


> Ever had underberg?
> 
> Man that stuff is grim!


In the olden days it used to come on something that looked like a bandolier, a bandolier of home made shotgun shells hanging up at the back of the bar....I always thought it was just for show and people only drunk it because they thought it would clear a hangover, and/or they were stupid. never ever really knew what it was...just assumed it was some herby drink with lots of alcohol in it.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Its the cloves in it, good for your guts so they say....


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

Had one hanging up behind the bar for the best part of 10 months untouched, then came christmas and the inevitable combination of "try everything in the evening" and the following lunchtime "try the hair of the dog that bit you"....

Didn't buy any more after that, a bandolier behind the bar may be a talking point but not much use if not selling any 

John


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## michaelg (Jul 25, 2013)

jeebsy said:


> I lived in Denmark for a year and there'd be queues out the kebab shop at lunchtime....proper shawarma they were. Incredible. Not like the standard post-club fayre. There's a few quality Turkish places here i'd go sober too.


What ones? I had my first ever kebab in Germany, loved it and tried one here near Union St thinking I'd been missing out all along. Ended up binning it mostly uneaten!

The only decent Turkish place I know was Diableros off Sauchiehall Street - used to go there for lunch in 6th year for pizzas or burgers (and after The Shack - ah those were the days!)


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

michaelg said:


> What ones? I had my first ever kebab in Germany, loved it and tried one here near Union St thinking I'd been missing out all along. Ended up binning it mostly uneaten!
> 
> The only decent Turkish place I know was Diableros off Sauchiehall Street - used to go there for lunch in 6th year for pizzas or burgers (and after The Shack - ah those were the days!)


Did to go to St Als? That was my sixth year lunch (and after-Shack much) haunt too. Babylon Cafe on Commerce Street and Shawarma King down off Briggait are tops.


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## michaelg (Jul 25, 2013)

jeebsy said:


> Did to go to St Als? That was my sixth year lunch (and after-Shack much) haunt too. Babylon Cafe on Commerce Street and Shawarma King down off Briggait are tops.


I did, yes! Left in 2000. What about you? Will check out the Turkish recommendations - could use a decent kebab! Poland actually have some good kebab places too - always on my list whenever I am over to visit the in-laws if I can persuade my mother-in-law not to cook for ONE night


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Left in 2002. Diableros was superb. Thursday nights in the Shack, kebab at 3am then back in the burger and chips on Friday lunchtime.


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## Drewster (Dec 1, 2013)

DavecUK said:


> No...I'm sure it was the Kebab. Good old rotting week old Doner on a spit, carved off with a dirty spoon, wrapped in a Pitta and always with too much of that red hot sauce (stuff that burns your ringpiece a few hours later)...mmmm.


Dave - you are a poet!! No really a true poet! 

Somewhat surprisingly my best Kebab experiences were in Saudi Arabia.... The most common restaurants I saw in Jeddah all did versions of Kebab and were all pretty decent (and you won't be that shocked to learn that I wasn't drunk for any of them)


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

> Back to the LSOL fold after epic fail with DSOL :-(


now I read the tagline with interest...so super dark roasting not for you....I completely agree and dislike very dark roasts.

I think to be honest the forum should start an "Appropriately Roasted Side Of Life".....I think that's the best way to have coffee roasted, but perhaps people might think I am one for suggesting this.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Missing the point of the dsol and lsol, these are done so that we can approach roasters and have do something different to the norm, if you desire nothing but appropriately roasted beans then you don't need it, you just go to any roaster and purchase normal beans. I like you roast my own and very rarely buy from roasters unless something catches my eye, but the dsol gives me the opportunity to try new stuff taken further in the roast.


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

Nicely put froggy ... Sums it up perfectly ... I would hate the coffee culture to stagnate in the same way that coffee shops have done, with all the roasters just doing the same thing.

dsol, lsol, art vs science, etc etc, it keeps it fun and exciting


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

All I want from my beans is something tasty. Pigeon holing roasters as dark or light does none of em any favours in the long term - and it isn't always a great way to describe what they are trying to achieve with their roast profiles ... Coffee smelling of fish though isn't appetising


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

DavecUK said:


> to be honest the forum should start an "Appropriately Roasted Side Of Life"...


Hahaha very good! ARSOLe subscription anyone? Roasted to just beyond first crack?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

hotmetal said:


> Roasted to just beyond first crack?


Heh...heh...


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## Vieux Clou (Oct 22, 2014)

Dunno about fish, but quite often when I open a new bag and the first fragrance departs I notice a residual smell of onion.


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## 4515 (Jan 30, 2013)

ARSOL would be good for me.

Ive had great coffees from DSOL and LSOL and none have been to either extreme of roasting. For my money, DSOL shouldnt be burn the bejeysus out of the bean and LSOL shouldnt be supply a just off green bean. Roast the bean to showcase its full potential.


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## grumpydaddy (Oct 20, 2014)

Is Cafe di pesce then an acquired taste?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Fish in coffee in China too.


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## hariboselecta (Dec 1, 2015)

This thread reminds me of that scene in Twin Peaks









[video=youtube;iSxNP-1VpjE]


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