# Hear ye, the first crack!?



## Dieter

I have been roasting using a Gene Cafe 101 since August 2017, mostly with quite drinkable results. However, there is a fundamental issue that I'd like to understand better so as to guide my roasting practice more effectively: how to identify the beginning and end of the first crack using my hearing. So far I have observed increased chaff, change of colour and visual cracks on the beans as an indicator of the first crack. All of these are evolving phenomena without a clearly defined beginning. Hence the desire to detect the first crack aurally which would be a distinct guiding event. I admit I have not felt capable of hearing it due to the noise of the roaster.

Therefore, here is my question:

Have any of you coffee lovers developed any strategies or use any aids/tools to facilitate hearing the first crack?

I'd be very grateful for any suggestions!


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## ashcroc

Automotive Stethoscope maybe?


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## johnealey

Hi @Dieter

Kitchen roll tube on the shoulder of the chaff collector nearest where the exhaust from the drum (and a finger in your other ear)

Looks amusing, worked for me. If it does work and you are self conscious about the above @ashcroc suggestion above slightly more elegant









John


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## MediumRoastSteam

@Dieter - same here.

I tried kitchen roll, toilet roll, mechanic's stethoscope, doctors stethoscope, voodoo and praying to the gods. None of which worked for me.

Now, i haven't tried it with blocking the other ear. I'll give that a go.

As an experiment, I've recently roasted with the chaff collector completely removed. It's a mess, but you do hear first crack


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## Dieter

MediumRoastSteam said:


> @Dieter - same here.
> 
> I tried kitchen roll, toilet roll, mechanic's stethoscope, doctors stethoscope, voodoo and praying to the gods. None of which worked for me.
> 
> Now, i haven't tried it with blocking the other ear. I'll give that a go.
> 
> As an experiment, I've recently roasted with the chaff collector completely removed. It's a mess, but you do hear first crack


Very interesting, @MediumRoastSteam! I will remove the chaff collector for the second batch of my next roast...in the garden







)


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## Dieter

johnealey said:


> Hi @Dieter
> 
> Kitchen roll tube on the shoulder of the chaff collector nearest where the exhaust from the drum (and a finger in your other ear)
> 
> Looks amusing, worked for me. If it does work and you are self conscious about the above @ashcroc suggestion above slightly more elegant
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> John


Hi @johnealey,

never self-conscious about looking amusing or foolish, I will definitely try your suggestion with the first batch of my next roast and @MediumRoastSteam 's with the second batch. Beans will be Costa Rica Aquiares from Small Batch Roasting. I'll report back next week.


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## Batian

Some beans are louder (and more vigorous?) at 1st C than others. I have looked through my roasting notes and there is possibly a pattern.

From my notes, it is mainly the larger beans from high altitude have been marked as "loud 1C" and "Vigorous". Those from lower altitudes, typically Central and South American beans have often been noted as "Quiet 1C". For me, the worst offender has been Australian Skyberry, a small low altitude bean. The first couple of roasts (in the Gene) I missed 1st completely.

So, if perhaps you have been using typically quiet beans from low altitudes, consider trying, say a Kenyan AA. Then, all being well, you will have a firm idea of what it is you are listening out for when you roast a bean that is "quiet".

One bean that I have consistantly marked as " Very loud 1C" is Monsooned Malabar, but that would not be a good bean to try if you are still searching for the 'pop'!


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## ashcroc

Batian said:


> Some beans are louder (and more vigorous?) at 1st C than others. I have looked through my roasting notes and there is possibly a pattern.
> 
> From my notes, it is mainly the larger beans from high altitude have been marked as "loud 1C" and "Vigorous". Those from lower altitudes, typically Central and South American beans have often been noted as "Quiet 1C". For me, the worst offender has been Australian Skyberry, a small low altitude bean. The first couple of roasts (in the Gene) I missed 1st completely.
> 
> So, if perhaps you have been using typically quiet beans from low altitudes, consider trying, say a Kenyan AA. Then, all being well, you will have a firm idea of what it is you are listening out for when you roast a bean that is "quiet".
> 
> One bean that I have consistantly marked as " Very loud 1C" is Monsooned Malabar, but that would not be a good bean to try if you are still searching for the 'pop'!


Have you noticed any correlation between volume of 1st crack & how the bean was processed (natural, washed etc)?


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## Batian

ashcroc said:


> Have you noticed any correlation between volume of 1st crack & how the bean was processed (natural, washed etc)?


I thought there might be as I went through the roasts looking to help the OP in picking a coffee as a good noisy one! But as I ploughed through a couple of years worth I felt that it was 50/50 and that bean size and altitude seemed more influential.

At first I thought there may have been a difference, but the mental note said no, but I didn't write it down, so it is only an inspired guess!


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## DavecUK

Be careful with that kitchen roll, if it goes up it will be like a *huge Hopi ear candle*....doing a rough calculation, the increased diameter "may" be enough to suck your temporal lobe right out of your ear. Of course it's a very cheap way to get a plus sized session of "Thermo Auricular Therapy" for free. In fact I have just fired up my 1 kg roaster, I have a 125cm diameter cardboard tube....going to go for a Hopi ear candling record.









Another thing to try might be this, or something similar.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Personal-TV-Sound-Amplifier-Listen-Megaphone-Hearing-Aid-Assistance-Device-Elder/372347993032?hash=item56b1ab7bc8%3Ag%3Afy8AAOSwBUpbMfJA&LH_PrefLoc=1&_sacat=0&_nkw=sound+amplifier&_from=R40&rt=nc

I am actually being serious now


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## MildredM

DavecUK said:


> Be careful with that kitchen roll, if it goes up it will be like a *huge Hopi ear candle*....doing a rough calculation, the increased diameter "may" be enough to suck your temporal lobe right out of your ear. Of course it's a very cheap way to get a plus sized session of "Thermo Auricular Therapy" for free. In fact I have just fired up my 1 kg roaster, I have a 125cm diameter cardboard tube....going to go for a Hopi ear candling record.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another thing to try might be this, or something similar.
> 
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Personal-TV-Sound-Amplifier-Listen-Megaphone-Hearing-Aid-Assistance-Device-Elder/372347993032?hash=item56b1ab7bc8%3Ag%3Afy8AAOSwBUpbMfJA&LH_PrefLoc=1&_sacat=0&_nkw=sound+amplifier&_from=R40&rt=nc
> 
> I am actually being serious now


This reminds me of a useful gadget (from Tandy probably) we used years ago to try and locate a knocking noise in an engine or a rattle under a dashboard. It was amazing for listening to all the different birdsong!


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## Dieter

Batian said:


> Some beans are louder (and more vigorous?) at 1st C than others. I have looked through my roasting notes and there is possibly a pattern.
> 
> From my notes, it is mainly the larger beans from high altitude have been marked as "loud 1C" and "Vigorous". Those from lower altitudes, typically Central and South American beans have often been noted as "Quiet 1C". For me, the worst offender has been Australian Skyberry, a small low altitude bean. The first couple of roasts (in the Gene) I missed 1st completely.
> 
> So, if perhaps you have been using typically quiet beans from low altitudes, consider trying, say a Kenyan AA. Then, all being well, you will have a firm idea of what it is you are listening out for when you roast a bean that is "quiet".
> 
> One bean that I have consistantly marked as " Very loud 1C" is Monsooned Malabar, but that would not be a good bean to try if you are still searching for the 'pop'!


Of course, roast beans with a noisy 1st crack! Excellent idea. You are suggesting large beans from high altitude which, I have read, produces harder, denser beans.

As it happens, I had seen your very useful entries on an online Roast Log Information page. The bean varieties that you mentioned having a vigorous 1st crack are:

Monsooned Malabar, Papa New Guinea Kimel plantation, Indonesia Java Bayukidul Estate, Tanzanian Tweega and Vietnamese arabica.

I must admit I generally prefer South/Central American beans, but Kenyan AA or Tanzanians sounds quite alluring.

Does, in your experience, the build-up to the 1C play a role? E.g. if you don't spend time dehydrating the beans, say 5mins at 160°C, but go straight to 240°, might the bean create more steam at 1C and thereby crack more noisily? (This is just my conjecture as I don't have the necessary knowledge or experience!)


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## Dieter

DavecUK said:


> Be careful with that kitchen roll, if it goes up it will be like a *huge Hopi ear candle*....doing a rough calculation, the increased diameter "may" be enough to suck your temporal lobe right out of your ear. Of course it's a very cheap way to get a plus sized session of "Thermo Auricular Therapy" for free. In fact I have just fired up my 1 kg roaster, I have a 125cm diameter cardboard tube....going to go for a Hopi ear candling record.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another thing to try might be this, or something similar.
> 
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Personal-TV-Sound-Amplifier-Listen-Megaphone-Hearing-Aid-Assistance-Device-Elder/372347993032?hash=item56b1ab7bc8%3Ag%3Afy8AAOSwBUpbMfJA&LH_PrefLoc=1&_sacat=0&_nkw=sound+amplifier&_from=R40&rt=nc
> 
> I am actually being serious now


Many thanks for the "Hopi ear candle" warning! And I may well come back to your recommendation of a "Personal-TV-Sound-Amplifier-Listen-Megaphone-Hearing-Aid-Assistance-Device".


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## Batian

Dieter said:


> Of course, roast beans with a noisy 1st crack! Excellent idea. You are suggesting large beans from high altitude which, I have read, produces harder, denser beans.
> 
> As it happens, I had seen your very useful entries on an online Roast Log Information page. The bean varieties that you mentioned having a vigorous 1st crack are:
> 
> Monsooned Malabar, Papa New Guinea Kimel plantation, Indonesia Java Bayukidul Estate, Tanzanian Tweega and Vietnamese arabica.
> 
> I must admit I generally prefer South/Central American beans, but Kenyan AA or Tanzanians sounds quite alluring.
> 
> Does, in your experience, the build-up to the 1C play a role? E.g. if you don't spend time dehydrating the beans, say 5mins at 160°C, but go straight to 240°, might the bean create more steam at 1C and thereby crack more noisily? (This is just my conjecture as I don't have the necessary knowledge or experience!)


 A word of caution, I tend to jot a note on my logs when the crack is exceptional for one reason or another, so that does not mean coffees not on the list are necessarily hard to hear. Sort of a case of Rock and Roll or Sotto Voce!

If you bought the Gene from Bella Barista you will have an additional user manual written by Davecuk on this forum.

I would suggest you pick one of the suggested profiles in that manual and work with that.

So then you can concentrate on what you can see, hear and smell without the added stress of the finer points. Dave has done all the hard work with drying and stuff so you can concentrate!

Hearing that 1stC is so important, because without that knowledge, you can not do all the other whizzbang stuff! It can be a bit elusive, but once you have heard it, it will unmistakable when quieter. You will not be wondering if the slightest sound difference 'was it'!

Just a thought, your hearing is regarded as normal?


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## mattpitts74

I must say that I also struggle to hear first crack with the Gene Cafe, I have been roasting Brazil Santos and El Salvador Finca San Ernesto both of which seem to be fairly quiet at 1st crack. I have used the cardboard tube which helps  but I may try without the chuff collector on next time.


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## MediumRoastSteam

mattpitts74 said:


> I must say that I also struggle to hear first crack with the Gene Cafe, I have been roasting Brazil Santos and El Salvador Finca San Ernesto both of which seem to be fairly quiet at 1st crack. I have used the cardboard tube which helps  but I may try without the chuff collector on next time.


Just make sure you do that outside... it's messy


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## DavecUK

mattpitts74 said:


> but I may try without the chuff collector on next time.


whooo, whoo!


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## MediumRoastSteam

@Dieter, how did your experiments go? Any success on hearing F.C.?


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## Dieter

MediumRoastSteam said:


> @Dieter, how did your experiments go? Any success on hearing F.C.?


@ MediumRoastSteam, thank for your interest.

It was a resounding success!!

I roasted 2x250g of Costa Rica Aquiares from Small Batch Roasting. I followed the "Gentle rise, Gentle finish" profile from the "Hints & Tips" booklet which comes with the Gene Cafe purchased from Bella Barista (it doesn't mention its author, but imparts extremely useful advice, a lifesaver for the novice). According to information in that booklet, I was expecting the F.C. at about 238°. It did arrive at 236° with three isolated but loud and clear pops and then turned into a continuous chorus lasting a little over 60secs. At that point I liked the colour and therefore terminated the roast.

How was I able to hear the F.C.? I followed your suggestion and removed the chaff collector - loud and clear pops! I then knew what the 1st crack sounds like. On the second batch, I waited till I heard the beginning of the F.C and then inserted the collector to test whether I could still hear it. Indeed I could, particularly when holding my ear close to the opening at the top of the collector.

Many thanks for your valuable help! I now feel I will be able to achieve more consistently a decent level of roasting.


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## MediumRoastSteam

The author is DavecUK, also a member of this forum (see a few posts above).


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## Batian

Now you have 'orgasmed' you will go from strength to strength!


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## Dieter

Batian said:


> Now you have 'orgasmed' you will go from strength to strength!


Thank'ee, kind sir, for the optimistic prophecy! (It's an interesting linguistic amalgam of Cosmopolitan style and Biblical utterance.)

I do feel identifying the 1st crack is the beginning of the way forward for me. I still have some unresolved questions in my mind such as: whether to preheat the roaster, the merits or otherwise of a slow approach to the 1st crack, when(if at all) to lower the temp during the 1st crack, achieving as light a roast (which I prefer) as is appropriate/possible for each type of bean, etc.

At the risk of sounding adolescent, I'm excited by the prospect of a foodie's adventure ahead.


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## DavecUK

MediumRoastSteam said:


> The author is DavecUK, also a member of this forum (see a few posts above).


I just checked and I wrote that guide over 11 years ago....how time flies.


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## ajohn

Dieter said:


> Thank'ee, kind sir, for the optimistic prophecy! (It's an interesting linguistic amalgam of Cosmopolitan style and Biblical utterance.)
> 
> I do feel identifying the 1st crack is the beginning of the way forward for me. I still have some unresolved questions in my mind such as: whether to preheat the roaster, the merits or otherwise of a slow approach to the 1st crack, when(if at all) to lower the temp during the 1st crack, achieving as light a roast (which I prefer) as is appropriate/possible for each type of bean, etc.
> 
> At the risk of sounding adolescent, I'm excited by the prospect of a foodie's adventure ahead.


I'm rather unhappy about not being able to hear cracks.

The cardboard tube does seem to work according to some sources. Health risks are low really as I doubt if anyone would put it directly over the outlet.

Another idea is similar to the one @DavecUK mentioned. An amplifier with a microphone. The basic idea is to use some sort of tube to get the exhaust outside and place the microphone close to the outlet of that. I'm going to give that a whirl using a portable unit intended for tour guides off amazon.







The mic lead is probably going to be a bit short. Having thought that might work I found a video where some one demonstrated that it does with a similar style of amp.

I've also wondered about stethoscopes. The usual type have diaphragms close to the end so heat might upset them. The mechanics type have a metal rod that also ends up on a diaphragm. There are some wooden foetal ones about but going on Amazon there are many complaints about them not working well. Wood doesn't conduct heat well so given something suitable might work out -







a bit short though. LOL Maybe Joey will make some foot long ones.

I did come across a video suggesting preheating. Ran empty up to 150C and then ran the cooling cycle. The basic idea is to get standard starting conditions when several batches are going to be roasted on the trot. - Pass, seems to be full of holes to me as the chamber is empty but it might preheat the heater somewhat.

John

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## MildredM

Have you tried an assortment of different beans @ajohn


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## ajohn

MildredM said:


> Have you tried an assortment of different beans @ajohn


Nope, just this Peruvian one. There are other reasons why the crack might be quiet other than the bean so will carry on seeing if I can hear this one. At some point that may be outside with the chaff collect off but not yet.

If some one wants to try doing by sight this might help

https://legacy.sweetmarias.com/library/using-sight-to-determine-degree-of-roast/

I'd assume those are from a commercial roaster but might give some one an idea.

John

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## MildredM

ajohn said:


> Nope, just this Peruvian one. There are other reasons why the crack might be quiet other than the bean


I hadn't thought of that.



> so will carry on seeing if I can hear this one. At some point that may be outside with the chaff collect off but not yet.
> 
> If some one wants to try doing by sight this might help
> 
> https://legacy.sweetmarias.com/library/using-sight-to-determine-degree-of-roast/
> 
> I'd assume those are from a commercial roaster but might give some one an idea.
> 
> John
> 
> -


Oh. I hadn't thought of that either.


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## ajohn

MildredM said:


> I hadn't thought of that.
> 
> Oh. I hadn't thought of that either.










Say I put some forum members head in the roaster, Their brains would boil. Say I could do it at various power levels. At some power their skull might just crack gently. At some higher power it would explode and make a very loud bang.

John

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