# Thoughts



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

When measuring the volume of a shot, as opposed to weight, comparing it to a pint of beer, should the one fluid ounce line count the head or just the body?


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## Steve_S_T (Dec 7, 2012)

I always work on it including everything which, if you're pulling a single, can mean a really short shot of actual coffee (as opposed to coffee and crema).

Steve.


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## suferick (Jul 19, 2011)

I always pull by weight rather than volume - you never know how much crema there will be


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

I use a mixture of techniques. I usually get a new coffee dialed in by weighing the input and output accordingly. Once i've got it pretty much set up, i tend to do the rest by eye. So i'll dose roughly the same each time, tamp the same and then watch the output, aiming to cut it off just as it starts to blonde. I couldn't be bothered weighing every time, and volume is such a poor measure of coffee quality (especially when many 1oz shot glasses really have the line at nearer 1.2-1.3oz).


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## mike 100 (Jul 15, 2010)

As suferick says the crema varies so much, I have just started on some Union Gajah Mountain beans which produce a lot of crema, so measuring by weight seems more accurate


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

When you are pulling a 20 to 23 second ristretto or single, if you have everything else set right, crema ought not be too much of a problem, but going back to the question asked, is an ounce shot an ounce plus the crema or including


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## funinacup (Aug 30, 2010)

I would never pull shots by volume alone for the reasons given above, but if you were to do it this way then I'd include the crema in the total volume because that way you'll be closer to a good brew ratio. I'd be surprised if there were any coffees that you could make a double espresso with that would be well extracted at 60ml.


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

David, seeing as it was the BAFTA awards last night, I think you deserve an award for generating thought provoking coffee related conundrums!


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Patrick, even though I have been into coffee for many years, these thoughts and questions still come to me. I think, if you forget weighing, and for example pull a ristretto, then that is approximately 3/4 of one fluid ounce. If you include the crema, then you are not going to get much liquid!


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Keep 'em coming, David.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

funinacup said:


> I'd be surprised if there were any coffees that you could make a double espresso with that would be well extracted at 60ml.


So from that, do we assume that UKBC judges regard capps & signature drinks as palate cleansers to wash away the taste of the espressos?


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Dont forget UKBC is 20g VST baskets which can hold 21g easily


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## Big Tony (Dec 18, 2012)

Someone remind me how I do this? I dose 18g of coffee beans... How much should that weigh?


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

I've never really weighed shots but I think it's the dose weight by times by approx 1.6. which would make 18g =28.8g (if my logic and maths are correct)

Having said that I've heard people quoting far greater output ratio's


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

Big Tony said:


> How much should that weigh?


18 grams in should be approx 27-35 grams out in around 25-27 seconds as a general rule. As with all things coffee try it & go with what you like best


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

It's very much dependent on the coffee and your own tastes. I find some of the modern styles of coffee roasting work best as almost a 1:1 brew ratio. Redchurch blend works superbly at 18g in 20g out. Where some others work well at the 1:1.6 end of things. I like the sweet intensity of ristretto generally though, so tend to pull my shots quite short.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

its all coffee dependant.

Read this http://colonnaandsmalls.wordpress.com/2013/04/04/dont-change-a-thing-the-set-recipe-ideal/

(hopefully not too many of you find it boring)


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

I gotta say its all there but a bit much for someone new to coffee to take in at one gulp.


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## Big Tony (Dec 18, 2012)

I feel bad because I've started a separate discussion on David's thread.... Sorry

I'll start a new one because I've got a few more questions


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Tony, I have no problem mate!


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