# Sage Dual - Solenoid Part Number?



## jerryseabridge (Dec 12, 2015)

Hi all!

Like a number of others have experienced, my Sage Dual solenoid is starting to play up - sometimes it makes a rattling noise and once or twice I've experienced a brief
loss of pressure. Mostly it still works fine though. I've got plenty of experience of tinkering with Gaggia SBDU units (Classic and Babys with the three-way solenoids and aluminium boilers) but to date I haven't opened up my Dual (if it ain't broke don't fix it). On the basis that at some point I'm going to have to open her up and possibly replace the solenoid I've been doing a spot of research and wondered if anyone with more experience than me can shed some light on my confusion below...

To understand more about the solenoid in the Dual I downloaded the OLAB catalogue from olabitaly.com (click on "Download The General Catalog" at the top), since all the replacement solenoids sold on eBay are marked as OLAB ones. On eBay all of the images of solenoids advertised as compatible replacement solenoids for the Sage Dual (BES920) are marked as OLAB 9000...

First thing I realised is that the model number OLAB 9000 refers to the type of coil used, not the actual solenoid. Looking at p618 of the OLAB catalogue it states the 9000 series coils are 22mm coils with a "10mm sleeve hole" and this model is "usable with the solenoid valve series 6000 and 9000".

However, when I look the images (in the same catalogue) of the 6000 and 9000 series solenoids, none of the options look anything like the part in the eBay images. Looking further through the catalogue, on p567 ("8500 series") there is an image which DOES look like the part sold for the Sage Dual - on p572 there is the 8500/7 and 8500/9 models which look exactly like images of the underside of the solenoid used in the Dual that I've seen in various places on the web (the only difference between the /7 and /9 is the /7 has a exhaust for a 7mm rubber hose, the /9 has an exhaust for a 1/8" male thread - not sure which is used on the Sage Dual). However, the 8500 series is 14mm in diameter and is stated (p571) as requiring an 8000BH series coil (which has a 14.3mm sleeve hole, see p622).

Alternatively, there is the 8254/5 (p540) - also looks like the same part on eBay but it too is 14mm in diameter and is also stated (p535) as being compatible with the 8000BH series coil.

Can anyone who has either examined the actual solenoid (not the coil) tell me what the series or part number of it is please? I'm wondering if the actual solenoid isn't an OLAB one or if the pictures on eBay etc are of a different part, or the parts used in the Dual are no longer marketed by OLAB...? I hope someone can shed some light on this for me please!

Thanks in advance!

Jerry


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Google cleaning espresso solenoids. Description not a video but there may be one of those too. It's easy to dismantle and and get rid of the bit of scale etc slush that is causing it. I made a post on this a while ago but no idea where it is now.

Unplug the machine if you take the entire solenoid out. Not tried but you may be able to undo the nut on top you can see and lift the coil off. Then remove the rest - 4 screw in the base. The spade connectors they use latch so are not easy to get off. It's possible to feel what needs pushing in with your fingers *but do unplug the machine.*

As an alternative which may work crush up 2 cleaning tablets and use them like that with the cleaning cycle.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Actually I am not sure that the DB solenoid has ever been made by Orlab. Make should be on the coil  afraid I didn't look when I took mine out.


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## CoffeeTim (Nov 23, 2020)

ajohn said:


> Google cleaning espresso solenoids. Description not a video but there may be one of those too. It's easy to dismantle and and get rid of the bit of scale etc slush that is causing it. I made a post on this a while ago but no idea where it is now.
> Unplug the machine if you take the entire solenoid out. Not tried but you may be able to undo the nut on top you can see and lift the coil off. Then remove the rest - 4 screw in the base. The spade connectors they use latch so are not easy to get off. It's possible to feel what needs pushing in with your fingers *but do unplug the machine.*
> As an alternative which may work crush up 2 cleaning tablets and use them like that with the cleaning cycle.


Agree with turning off/unplug the machine when we need to touch any electrical component.

I dismentled and drop the TRIAC board on the body and short the board. Was lucky I wasn't the one got short.


jerryseabridge said:


> Hi all!
> Like a number of others have experienced, my Sage Dual solenoid is starting to play up - sometimes it makes a rattling noise and once or twice I've experienced a brief
> loss of pressure. Mostly it still works fine though. I've got plenty of experience of tinkering with Gaggia SBDU units (Classic and Babys with the three-way solenoids and aluminium boilers) but to date I haven't opened up my Dual (if it ain't broke don't fix it). On the basis that at some point I'm going to have to open her up and possibly replace the solenoid I've been doing a spot of research and wondered if anyone with more experience than me can shed some light on my confusion below...
> To understand more about the solenoid in the Dual I downloaded the OLAB catalogue from olabitaly.com (click on "Download The General Catalog" at the top), since all the replacement solenoids sold on eBay are marked as OLAB ones. On eBay all of the images of solenoids advertised as compatible replacement solenoids for the Sage Dual (BES920) are marked as OLAB 9000...
> ...


@jerryseabridge , hope these picture helps. Solenoid valve taken out from my Breville BES920.























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## jerryseabridge (Dec 12, 2015)

CoffeeTim said:


> Agree with turning off/unplug the machine when we need to touch any electrical component.
> 
> I dismentled and drop the TRIAC board on the body and short the board. Was lucky I wasn't the one got short.
> @jerryseabridge , hope these picture helps. Solenoid valve taken out from my Breville BES920.
> ...


 Perfect - I was hoping someone might have a photo - so that one has a 9000BH - the ref after the "/" - L5FV - mean a 240V, 50Hz, 12.5W power (with "VDE" approval, whatever that means) - all this is on p618 of the OLAB catalogue.

Still the mystery - the only thing on the actual solenoid is the stamp 47-15 which doesnt seem to correspond to anything in the catalogue.

From memory, when you dismantled it and held the solenoid or coil, would you estimate it's a 10mm diameter for the part of the solenoid that goes through the coil? It must be 10mm, which leaves the mystery of the part number for the actual solenoid....


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## jerryseabridge (Dec 12, 2015)

ajohn said:


> Google cleaning espresso solenoids. Description not a video but there may be one of those too. It's easy to dismantle and and get rid of the bit of scale etc slush that is causing it. I made a post on this a while ago but no idea where it is now.
> 
> Unplug the machine if you take the entire solenoid out. Not tried but you may be able to undo the nut on top you can see and lift the coil off. Then remove the rest - 4 screw in the base. The spade connectors they use latch so are not easy to get off. It's possible to feel what needs pushing in with your fingers *but do unplug the machine.*
> 
> As an alternative which may work crush up 2 cleaning tablets and use them like that with the cleaning cycle.


 Thanks for the feedback, yup, I've stripped and cleaned up loads of the Gaggia SBDU solenoids (IIRC either CEME or OLAB, depending on year of manufacture), and sliced my fingers once or twice getting spade connectors off (there's a knack to it lol). I live in a very soft water area, hardly ever had scale build up on other machines (I've stripped down plenty so I can verify this) - the machine is regularly de-scaled too. Sometimes the solenoids on these machines do cause problems, even with a fanatical cleaning regime. And always done with the power off


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## CoffeeTim (Nov 23, 2020)

jerryseabridge said:


> Perfect - I was hoping someone might have a photo - so that one has a 9000BH - the ref after the "/" - L5FV - mean a 240V, 50Hz, 12.5W power (with "VDE" approval, whatever that means) - all this is on p618 of the OLAB catalogue.
> Still the mystery - the only thing on the actual solenoid is the stamp 47-15 which doesnt seem to correspond to anything in the catalogue.
> From memory, when you dismantled it and held the solenoid or coil, would you estimate it's a 10mm diameter for the part of the solenoid that goes through the coil? It must be 10mm, which leaves the mystery of the part number for the actual solenoid....


Refer to images.

They could be custom built. The solenoid could be designed by Breville and OEMed by OLAB. So, they are exclusive to Breville/Sage.

When(if) it really breaks down, try to remove the coil and soak the plunger in descale solution with slightly higher concentration. remove ot from solution and use a paper clip to push the plunger through the hole. U should feel the spring reaction. And soak it again. Then remove and dry it and install it again.

I am not sure if it's going to help. But no harm trying as long as you stay safe and unplug the machine.
















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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

To clean just unscrew the part on the base in the last photo with the tape


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## jerryseabridge (Dec 12, 2015)

CoffeeTim said:


> Refer to images.
> 
> They could be custom built. The solenoid could be designed by Breville and OEMed by OLAB. So, they are exclusive to Breville/Sage.
> 
> ...


 Thanks man - so a 10mm diameter solenoid pipe where it goes through the coil - must be a non-standard or Breville specific solenoid part. Good stuff. Will bear in mind. And thanks to the all the other responses!

Jerry


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

On mine it was a small collection of scale sludge that could be wiped off with a finger - all I did.  I now back flush more often.


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