# Amo la mia La Pavoni



## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

Thought I would remake my La Pavoni thread as the other became corrupted and had to be "sand boxed"

I think a lot of people ask the same sort of questions when deciding whether to get a La Pav, they tend to be, should I get the Europiccola or the professional? I have both

I'll put my observations and thoughts down it may help people when deciding. Please note these are just my thoughts you may agree or disagree.

The Europiccola:

First of all it is less expensive, it's extremely compact in size and heats up very quickly. I find it also over heats pretty quickly if you are pulling more than a couple of shots, this can be a little frustrating when you are new to the little leaver and trying to pull the perfect shot the first night it's out of the box, too much caffeine and inexperience can leave you a little disheartened to put it nicely lol.

The professional:

My personal preference. It has a larger boiler so takes a tiny bit longer to get up to temperature, it does have a pressure gauge which looks cool and is useful. The larger boiler size also helps control the temperature better and it won't over heat as quickly.

Should I buy second hand?

Yes there is no reason not to as both machines and built extremely well, put together by hand and servicing is a doddle. All seals and replacement parts can be bought on the web if it does need a little TLC. They also hold their value extremely well quality after all is quality.

What's the coffee like?

Amazing! the coffee the La Pavoni is capable of producing belies it's price tag, the fruits that will bounce out of the cup will astonish you I'm still amazed by mine, and a bean I might be struggling with on my Rancilio can soon be brought to life using the La Pavoni.

Is it easy to use?

The chances of you getting the coffee you are looking for or expecting straight out of the box probably won't happen.

You need to get to know your machine experiment and play with it. To me this is the best bit, the variables on the La Pavoni are near endless, from infusion times to pull times, you can take a bean from fruity to roasty just by making some minor changes to your method and I love this.

Is a naked portafilter a good upgrade?

Yes it is. I would say an essential upgrade, the less metal mass of a naked portafilter allows less heat retention and as such will improve your coffee.

Why is the tamper that comes with the machine so rubbish?

No idea. Buy a decent one lol.

And now some pictures


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## Jacko112 (Oct 29, 2015)

I love my little lever, Zacconi, which is very similar & agree half the fun is the learning curve. Wish I could get a naked portafilter for it though


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## Nopapercup (Nov 6, 2016)

Jacko112 said:


> I love my little lever, Zacconi, which is very similar & agree half the fun is the learning curve. Wish I could get a naked portafilter for it though


Get your current one chopped. I did with mine as I figured I would never want the spouts again.


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## Nopapercup (Nov 6, 2016)

Good thread @owain

I have a Europiccola and I love it. There is a steep learning curve but once mastered these little levers make great espresso. A good grinder is a must to get the best out of them.


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

Nopapercup said:


> Good thread @owain
> 
> I have a Europiccola and I love it. There is a steep learning curve but once mastered these little levers make great espresso. A good grinder is a must to get the best out of them.


Definitely get a good grinder I'm using a Modded Super jolly which I'm happy with


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

So I'm currently using these Micro Lot beans from Pact (I know pact don't seem to have a lot of fans on here but I'm about the coffee) and they are amazing the citrus notes from the cup are incredible at lower temperature and become more roasty at higher temperatures without becoming acrid can't recommend them enough.

This is at a lower temperature thicker lighter crema and beautiful fruit notes










At the higher temperature the crema is less thick but darker and a fuller roast flavour


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

So my new toy I had a CNC heat sink made for the La Pavoni .. 3 shots not rushing between each one beautiful coffee much more stable temperature than I would usually have .. I'm actually impressed.

The first shot is without a flushed group head, the other 2 shots pull 2 and 3 were super consistent in flavour and temperature 63 degrees in the cup


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## coffeeblog (Dec 9, 2015)

It took me a while to decide between the Europiccola and the Pro, the main reason I wanted the pro was for the pressure gauge - in the end I bought a restored millennium Europiccola with a pressure gauge fitted. It heats up in under 10 minutes, and I can produce two or three, maybe four Espresso and steamed milk before I need to turn it off and let it cool down before filling up again, so it's fine for me.

I couldn't agree more re the quality of Espresso - the first Espresso I made with it straight out of the box before I'd even began the learning curve, was probably one of the best tasting shots of Espresso I'd ever made at home! I think going from no Espresso making experience to a machine like this may be a shock to the system, but personally, I haven't found it all that big a learning curve going from semi-auto to this. I had the impression from what I'd read online while deciding on whether to get one of these, that pulling a shot with a manual lever was some form of dark art ;-), actually, I've found there's a lot less to it than it seems, the biggest thing as with semi auto machines, is getting the grind right.


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

coffeeblog said:


> It took me a while to decide between the Europiccola and the Pro, the main reason I wanted the pro was for the pressure gauge - in the end I bought a restored millennium Europiccola with a pressure gauge fitted. It heats up in under 10 minutes, and I can produce two or three, maybe four Espresso and steamed milk before I need to turn it off and let it cool down before filling up again, so it's fine for me.
> 
> I couldn't agree more re the quality of Espresso - the first Espresso I made with it straight out of the box before I'd even began the learning curve, was probably one of the best tasting shots of Espresso I'd ever made at home! I think going from no Espresso making experience to a machine like this may be a shock to the system, but personally, I haven't found it all that big a learning curve going from semi-auto to this. I had the impression from what I'd read online while deciding on whether to get one of these, that pulling a shot with a manual lever was some form of dark art ;-), actually, I've found there's a lot less to it than it seems, the biggest thing as with semi auto machines, is getting the grind right.


Good read nice to hear some others experiences


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## Syenitic (Dec 1, 2013)

Agree with earlier comment. Your passion for this machine is exemplary. I remember your first thread and it was that one that persuaded me to give the La Pav a go for myself. I got a a bargain, but needed to replace seals etc.

Each time I see yours and Jimbojohns posts I am put to shame. I need to get on with it! (choice of paint job on the base is my choke) I hate the oven dish look on the one I have, and am not going to go for a chrome plate. So a funky repaint will be the order...just need to decide which sort of funk.....I abandoned one already...which on paper looked good, but on application was an epic fail. Suggestions welcome!


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## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

Syenitic said:


> Agree with earlier comment. Your passion for this machine is exemplary. I remember your first thread and it was that one that persuaded me to give the La Pav a go for myself. I got a a bargain, but needed to replace seals etc.
> 
> Each time I see yours and Jimbojohns posts I am put to shame. I need to get on with it! (choice of paint job on the base is my choke) I hate the oven dish look on the one I have, and am not going to go for a chrome plate. So a funky repaint will be the order...just need to decide which sort of funk.....I abandoned one already...which on paper looked good, but on application was an epic fail. Suggestions welcome!


Powdercoat may work. There are certainly many colours to choose from to match your kitchen.


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

New micro lot beans arrived today, roasty with hints of fruit, lovely mouth feel and some pics


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## mathof (Mar 24, 2012)

If the Italian name of this thread is meant to mean, "I love my La Pavoni", it should be

"Amo la mia La Pavoni"

As it is, it means, "La Pavoni, I love myself"

Sorry to nit-pick, but this has been driving me crazy.

Matteo


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## rob177palmer (Feb 14, 2017)

mathof said:


> As it is, it means, "La Pavoni, I love myself"


If that is correct, then it is far funnier as it is!


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

mathof said:


> If the Italian name of this thread is meant to mean, "I love my La Pavoni", it should be
> 
> "Amo la mia La Pavoni"
> 
> ...


Lol oh well I can't edit the title, thank you though


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

owain said:


> Lol oh well I can't edit the title, thank you though


You want me to edit. Or you love yourself?


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

Jon said:


> You want me to edit. Or you love yourself?


An edit would be great thanks


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## jimbojohn55 (Jan 15, 2016)

Syenitic said:


> Agree with earlier comment. Your passion for this machine is exemplary. I remember your first thread and it was that one that persuaded me to give the La Pav a go for myself. I got a a bargain, but needed to replace seals etc.
> 
> Each time I see yours and Jimbojohns posts I am put to shame. I need to get on with it! (choice of paint job on the base is my choke) I hate the oven dish look on the one I have, and am not going to go for a chrome plate. So a funky repaint will be the order...just need to decide which sort of funk.....I abandoned one already...which on paper looked good, but on application was an epic fail. Suggestions welcome!


this is what I'm thinking of for my pre millennium to replace the black- but it has to be powder coated


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

owain said:


> An edit would be great thanks


Now: "Amo la mia La Pavoni"


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## houarno (Jan 24, 2019)

Looks very nice -- where did you have the CNC heat sink made?


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## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

I was reading a review from someone associated with Bella Barista yesterday who mentioned that the Pro isn't the one to get as it gets too hot too quickly, anyone else experienced this?


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Junglebert said:


> I was reading a review from someone associated with Bella Barista yesterday who mentioned that the Pro isn't the one to get as it gets too hot too quickly, anyone else experienced this?


No ! Interested to know what else was said about the La Pavoni by BB.


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## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

I googled 'la Pavoni professional review ' it was on the first page of hits, I can't link now as I'm about to serve up tea


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

coffeechap said:


> No ! Interested to know what else was said about the La Pavoni by BB.


Dave, there is an old review by DaveC

https://www.bellabarista.co.uk/pdf/LaPavoniStradivariLussocloserlookv1(1).pdf


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## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

That's the one.


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## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Dave, there is an old review by DaveC
> 
> https://www.bellabarista.co.uk/pdf/LaPavoniStradivariLussocloserlookv1(1).pdf


Ah, the stradivari.

Think I'll have to watch Jaws again!

Laissez les bons temps rouler


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Dave, there is an old review by DaveC
> 
> https://www.bellabarista.co.uk/pdf/LaPavoniStradivariLussocloserlookv1(1).pdf


And interestingly states that the standard of espresso from a La Pavoni cannot be replicated on a a similar priced vibe pump machine!


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

All La Pavoni get too hot at some point but this is nothing to do with the boiler size! It's to do with the fact that the boiler is directly attached to the group, however this can be minimised with a heat extrude on the group, or by simply using it as it is intended as a two or three shot machine then switch off.


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

I have both and would say the opposite is true in my experience, the pro has a larger surface area this allows for greater radiant heat dispersal and more consistent shots


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## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

owain said:


> I have both and would say the opposite is true in my experience, the pro has a larger surface area this allows for greater radiant heat dispersal and more consistent shots


I read that in a post you made some time ago, seemed to make sense to me.


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## jimbojohn55 (Jan 15, 2016)

For me the whole point about a lever is that it puts you in touch with the process, an electric pump wont tell you what's going on with the shot in the same way as when you pull a lever. Its a more a question of how you work with a machine a bit like driving a classic sportscar totally different immersive experience without ABS, stability control etc. A lot of people prefer the more modern controlled machine and not the experience of using a slightly more challenging older tech lever.

Its horses for courses, many try pavs and move on, some stick with them. Can you get an exceptional shot from a pav, yes but you need to work at it and be prepared that its going to be a challenge and in my view more enjoyable for that.


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

Love Sunday espresso


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## DanB (Aug 28, 2018)

@owain do you mind me asking where you got your cooling fins? Do you have contact details you could pass on? Thanks


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## owain (Dec 26, 2015)

DanB said:


> @owain do you mind me asking where you got your cooling fins? Do you have contact details you could pass on? Thanks


Hi a few people have enquired, I've sent him a message I'm just waiting for a response, I wouldn't pass his details on without his consent I'm afraid as it's not a business but a private individual


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## DanB (Aug 28, 2018)

That's great thank you


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## Hegnet (Mar 4, 2019)

owain said:


> Hi a few people have enquired, I've sent him a message I'm just waiting for a response, I wouldn't pass his details on without his consent I'm afraid as it's not a business but a private individual


 @owain I would also be interested in details on the machined part or even the model.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Hegnet said:


> @owain I would also be interested in details on the machined part or even the model.


It is pretty expensive at around £90


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Am currently trying to source the right heat sink to do a bunch of them


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## DanB (Aug 28, 2018)

coffeechap said:


> Am currently trying to source the right heat sink to do a bunch of them


I'd be interested if you do. Owain's chap replied quickly but said he has none to fit a pre-millennium group.

My pre-mil settles at 110C and I find the cold water ramekin method inelegant and imprecise.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Junglebert said:


> I was reading a review from someone associated with Bella Barista yesterday who mentioned that the Pro isn't the one to get as it gets too hot too quickly, anyone else experienced this?


 I think you have seriously misquoted me. I actually said something quite different than your out of context remark. The pro cost more and had the larger boiler, *but it got hot just as quickly making the extra boiler capacity relatively redundant and not worth paying for.*

I also had to comment on non modified machines, as they came from the manufacturer at the time. I couldn't really suggest user modifications in case something happened. The review was 11+ years old and I didn't really see anything else on the web which covered the machines at all at the time. It's possible both machines are different now and it's a very old review. it's another reason I am quite reluctant to do reviews, especially ones on .PDF. At least on the wordpress site I can update them or pull them when they are no longer relevant.




The lesson here is to not buy the more expensive professional machine for 2 reasons:



Although you have a bigger boiler, the machine is going to get far too hot for it to be of any use to you. So save a bit of money.


The professional models have a pressure gauge, but as you cannot adjust the pressure&#8230;.so what, because it serves no useful purpose apart from looking good.


What Pavoni could and should have done on the larger models, is to have had 2 thermostats and separate brew/steam switches. This would have allowed the boiler to be maintained at an ideal temperature for brewing coffee, and only switched to steam mode (hotter) when required.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)




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## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

DavecUK said:


> I think you have seriously misquoted me. I actually said something quite different than your out of context remark. The pro cost more and had the larger boiler, *but it got hot just as quickly making the extra boiler capacity relatively redundant and not worth paying for.*


 I don't think I have 'seriously misquoted you' I didn't even quote you, if I may be pedantic. I think at worst, I misunderstood your comment. This is probably the bit I was referring to, I've re read it, and my interpretation still seems valid, but it was so long ago, I'm not 100%

'The Stradivari gets quite hot fairly quickly and after 3 or 4 shots, is probably too hot to make decent espresso. In fact I often found the first shot was a little cool, the second and 3rd was just right and the last few were starting to get a bit hot'

Or, as I said, too hot too quickly.

The post of mine you quoted was one of my first in here, and at the time I certainly didn't know who'd written it.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Unless Pavoni radically redesigned their machines at some point in the last the 15 years then the second point about not being able to adjust the pressure is in fact not true. All La Pavoni professionals have an adjustable pressure stat in the base as do the standard post milenium models, however the key benefit to having the pressure gauge is that you can see where you are at on the pressure stat. Which you cannot see on the smaller model.

you can of course add a gauge, or take a reading from the steam wand using a pipe and gauge, however the ability to change the pressure means that you can influence the temperature of the shot.

The first point is still relevant though as all pavonis wil over heat, unless you use a cold towel or a heat sink on the group.


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## JonnieD (Mar 17, 2020)

I'd be interested to hear what temperature is considered too high?

I've got a pre millennium Professional and it looks like the boiler is fairly constant at around 110c and the grouphead in the mid to high 80's after pulling a number of shots. I'd like to know what folk think is too high to pull decent shots.

I am going to get a grouphead temperature gauge or strips added to mine so I can optimise things. I don't like the look of the cooling fins (mine machine is brass anyway) and I'd just turn the boiler off for a while to cool it down. It doesn't take long for it to drop back down after you do that.


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## jimbojohn55 (Jan 15, 2016)

JonnieD said:


> I'd be interested to hear what temperature is considered too high?
> 
> I've got a pre millennium Professional and it looks like the boiler is fairly constant at around 110c and the grouphead in the mid to high 80's after pulling a number of shots. I'd like to know what folk think is too high to pull decent shots.
> 
> I am going to get a grouphead temperature gauge or strips added to mine so I can optimise things. I don't like the look of the cooling fins (mine machine is brass anyway) and I'd just turn the boiler off for a while to cool it down. It doesn't take long for it to drop back down after you do that.


 Subjective however a forum member did some tests with a temp probe in the puck and measured the group temp at the same time, he found that to get the water on the puck at 94 c he found the group needed to b at 75 c - now the trick is that the pav group shows different temps at the same time depending on where your taking the reading, the lower part heating up first

the best bet is to be driven by taste. Using a pav to its best ability requires many variables, just change one thing a time, and keep reading

good luck


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