# The weighing method ???



## brun (Dec 26, 2011)

can someone outline this for me please as i thought i understood it but im getting far more, in less time, than i expected i would do, ive just had a go at it

as i understood it, 15g ground in the basket, i want the liquid that comes out to weigh about 22g ish, well im very quickly getting 30g+

ive been using shot glasses up to now, marked, and stopping it when they are at ~1oz each, in the 25-30s time thats recommended, ive weighed the odd one recently just out of interest and none have been anywhere near 22g, usually a lot more

i need your help guys lol, again

/edit

just read on another site, it seems you want roughly double coming out ?........from what ive read on here im sure that wasnt the case, very confused


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## brun (Dec 26, 2011)

Just had 15.2g in, 36g out, 24s


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

There is no right or wrong. Some people like 30g from 15g...others like 23g....others 18g and so on.

You need to find what works for your palate...and also what works for the coffee you are using

if you are getting 30g+ 'very quickly' then either tighten up the grind or use more coffee to create more resistance....

One other possibility - it could be you are getting channeling which would result in quick output (e.g if the puck cracks against the brew head) ..and also a very bitter extraction.

The weighing method is very simple and can be repeated , using volume or estimating by sight is easier when more experienced


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## jimbow (Oct 13, 2011)

Start with the half the weight of grounds to the weight of beverage and then adjust to taste once you are happy e.g. 14g of ground coffee would produce 28g of espresso. I myself tend to like a shorter brew ratio of 60% (the grounds weigh 60% the weight of the beverage produced) but this does depend upon the beans.

The reason for weighing rather than using volume to measure the quantity of espresso is for the following reasons:

- it is consistent with the measurement used for ground coffee and it is easier to weigh both in weight rather than one as weight and one as volume.

- Volumes are supposed to include the crema but volume can be inconsistent as the beans age and produce different amounts of crema. Weight remains consistent even as the beans age.

You may find that 28g of espresso looks like much less than 2 fl Oz of espresso. This could be, at least partly because your beans are degassing and so producing less crema.


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## brun (Dec 26, 2011)

Now got it to 24g in 23s from 15.2g in


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

brun said:


> Now got it to 24g in 23s from 15.2g in


How did it taste?


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

Not sure I understand the problem brun. If you're getting too much tighten up as Gary says. The vario should have no problem doing that. (Don't forget, it's not 22g per spout, it's 22g total.)


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

Aah cool.







.


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## brun (Dec 26, 2011)

MikeHag said:


> Not sure I understand the problem brun. If you're getting too much tighten up as Gary says. The vario should have no problem doing that. (Don't forget, it's not 22g per spout, it's 22g total.)


thats what i wasnt sure about at first, as mine seemed to weigh a lot more, but now i understand its the total i can play around now i understand it better

ive just got a naked PF from happy donkey and ive been using the basket that came with that, so i guess my grind had to change with the new basket, i hadnt really factored that in but ive adjusted finer and got it back around normal range


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## brun (Dec 26, 2011)

garydyke1 said:


> How did it taste?


i made an americano with it, and both me and my mum struggled to describe how it tasted, almost light marshmallow in texture in the mouth, very strange, it lacked flavour but that could be because it was an americano but maybe because it was more like a ristretto extraction, i think im gonna get back to 30g, and then pull one more like 22g and compare, i gave up tinkering in the end as its getting late, ill play around more tomorrow


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## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

hi Brun

you are using Lusty?

grind out enough beans to put 20g into the bottomless. Tamp it to 30lbs - use the bathroom scales ( if you can to do this) don't tap it and try to keep it level when tamping, put the portafilter on the side of a table or counter or something - its easier if this is lower so you are above it. Remember to do a 3/4 turn as you tamp and don't get too hung up if you do multiple turns, best to concentrate on keeping the 30llbs pressure throughout the turn. Push down to it hits the 30 mark and then twist it while keeping it at 30llbs.

run slightly more than a double shot through the classic as a pre flush and the light should go off.

Wait until it comes back on and then put in the bottomless and pull the shot.

Let it run for 25 secs and then switch it off.

taste or make your drink.

My shot glasses are marked so I never weigh the shot, I just aim to have the double in 25 secs and adjust the grind to make this happen.

Don't be afraid of grinding finer, I've found it easier to adjust up rather than down but thats just a personal thing.

I think Mike said in a previous thread that Lusty beans are best if the shot is shorter, I have definitely found this, the darker the bean the longer you can pull the shot for....

best of luck.


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## onemac (Dec 15, 2011)

Been trying to follow *MikeHag*s advice for the past couple of days. I'm using the HD nekkid PF with supplied basket (I didn't know it was so poo....) and am now getting reasonable results with Lusty Glaze. I still can't venture higher than 14.5g in the basket with my favoured 14g producing 21g in just over 22-23 seconds. I know that's fast but it tastes the best to me so my next move is to dose higher for a longer extraction in an attempt to get a decent cuppa. If I had my way I would drink my espresso in cappo-sized cups - full to the brim. One drawback is having the espresso cool enough to drink but hot enough to avoid the bitter taste from cooling









Al

PS - stirred in the crema today. It tasted ok but I like the idea of crema before intense liquid.


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## ripley (Jan 16, 2012)

hiya Onemac

why can't you go higher than 14.5g in the basket? The HD basket can take more than that for sure. I'm sorry, I don't weigh the final result so the figures don't mean much to me.

I had terrible trouble slowing the shot to get a double in 25 secs even after leaving the beans a week but when I finally tweaked the grind to do it within that time there was a big difference in taste. I must have used 750g of these beans with the result tasting sour- though never in an unpleasant way, the finer I ground trying to slow the shot, the more the taste changed from sour through to salty caramel to finally cocoa. These flavours though were in an Americano. I didn't see the point in tasting the actual shot as that wasn't my final drink....

Keep going and you'll get the taste you wish - just keep adjusting that grind down.

cheers


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

I like LG at 23-24 secs.

They are mostly low grown beans so less dense in structure and the solids are extracted quite readily, which means, from my experience anyway, I can afford a shorter time. But not too fast otherwise they become earthy.


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## brun (Dec 26, 2011)

at that timing Mike, how much are you getting out from how much in, cos im now at that kind of time zone for ~26g IIRC, from 15g in


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