# Espresso techniques - Taylor Street Baristas



## MiG (Jul 11, 2012)

Most of the time I get my espressos/flat whites from Taylor Street Baristas and I really like the taste.

I've been watching their technique and the way in which the espresso actually pours out of the machine. To be honest, I see very little technique, they grind directly into the basket and tamp lightly immediately after. Then the portafilter goes into the machine and that's it! The espresso always pours with a perfect "mouse tail" and shot timing/volumes look good as well. The actual espresso also looks and tastes really good, in my opinion (well, it tastes good most of the time. I've had the odd 1-2 shots which didn't taste like the other ones, but still not bad at all).

Now obviously they are using some high end equipment; Mazzer grinders and Nuova Simonelli machines. And the coffee beans are fresh too (Union Roasted Rogue).

I guess the above can be true for any good coffee shop, not just Taylor Street. Anyway, on to my point:

Even with all of the fussing around during preparation and the pour (weighing the coffee, adjusting grinder, stirring the grounds in the portafilter, timing/measuring shots, using fresh beans, etc., etc.), I've never been able to replicate their results for the espressos. I used the same beans they do (Union Roasted Rogue) along with an OPV modded Gaggia Classic and Iberital MC2 grinder. I've gotten very, very close to the taste and texture of their flat whites, but that's because the espresso is diluted with milk. If I did what they do (just grind, light tamp, pour), the results were even worse.

I guess my question is; Is good espresso down to having high-end equipment, and not so much the technique? What do people think?


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

The higher end machines are built to give absolute, repeatable results. Set it up correctly & it will produce espresso or milk based drinks all day long.

With a relative simple machine like a Classic you need to work on every single drink, temp surfing etc to produce the required result. Sometimes you can hit the mark & sometimes not. Likewise a top end grinder will remain consistent giving even grinds.


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## SimonB (Sep 12, 2013)

I would have thought it was down to technique, the better the machine the more it won't interfere with what the barista is trying to do. Take for example what you say about them lightly tamping, I assume that's down to them making sure their coffee is ground fine enough tamping like that gets the results they want out of the espresso machine.

If you're really curious couldn't you ask them when it's not that busy?


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

MiG said:


> I guess my question is; Is good espresso down to having high-end equipment, and not so much the technique? What does people think?


Good question. Commercial machines cost a lot of money - one reason for which is their ability to perform accurately within fine temp and pressure tolerances day in day out - subject to routine maintenance and cleaning. Replicating this at home is not difficult but is kit dependent. Domestic machines that rely on a basic thermostat to control temp can't begin to compete with the commercial machines but can still deliver great results with a bit of discipline - check out temperature surfing guides. The other big variable is quality and consistency of grind. For example, go into any MS store that has a coffee shop in it - you will see they use Eureka Mythos grinders at nearly £2k each. They don't use them because they are pretty but because they designed to deliver perfectly ground and measured doses - resulting in less waste and time lost. Whilst your MC2 is a fairly decent grinder for its price, a better grinder would, in all likelihood, get more out of your beans thereby delivering a better shot. That's why, on this forum, there is so much interest in using ex-commercial grinders in the home. Downside is, they have a biggish footprint but the upside is, they can be bought relatively cheaply and the hike in grind quality pays dividends in the cup.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

I'd agree with more expensive equipment basically removing the variables. Super top end grinders will deliver a nice mound in the middle you can just tamp straight away instead of something like a Mignon where you're grinding, stirring, levelling etc - all that pissing about is just inviting a wee channel for the water to run through. Similarly the machine will deliver consistent pressure and temperature whereas with a Classic and even an HX you're temp cycling or reliant on a very consistent cooling flush to get results. It's so nice getting a chance to play on commercial machines.

With a Classic you might get one shot in 20 where you think 'wow, that's what it's all about' then as the equipment gets better they get more frequent.


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

'Technique' is usually about overcoming the shortcomings of your equipment


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## MiG (Jul 11, 2012)

Hmmmm......all interesting observations. It's just frustrating to see them churn out good shot after good shot and I have to mess about just to produce one decent shot.

It does make me wonder though; If I went out and bought a Rocket or an Expobar, along with a Mazzer grinder, how much easier would it be to churn out good shots (as what you get in good coffee shops)? Would I be able to just grind, light tamp and pull a good shot without too much fuss?


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

Loads easier.

What you are seeing in that cafe is calibrated machinery. The grinder will almost certainly be set for a particular output weight. The espresso machine set for a pour length. The Batista will then set the grind accordingly, but of course those three variables work in conjunction so there will be an initial tweaking of each....and then that is it for the day.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Even during the course of the day the barista might need to adjust the grind if the cafe gets really warm/humid.


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

It'll be minor.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

You dont see the 30-60 min dialling in at the start of the day, where several shots go down the sink. Once dialled in its just a case of repeat repeat repeat. Thats where the good equipment comes in, grinders which throw out the correct amount of coffee everytime, machines with flow meters/restrictors and volumetrics


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## MiG (Jul 11, 2012)

Yes, maybe I do need to ask them about what they do on a daily basis.

I am starting to think that it's mostly down to equipment though and how consistently it can perform. Maybe not so much the espresso machine, but rather the grinder. I wouldn't imagine that the pressure on a machine like the Classic will vary wildly throughout a shot (when I measured the pressure while doing the OPV mod, it pretty much stayed right on. Also, the temp seems to pretty consistent (I've done the styrofoam cup test a bunch of times, and although not a perfect test, it did yield some pretty consistent result). So, what do more expensive machines have that is different? But you can ask the same question about grinders as well I guess; what makes more expensive grinders perform better than cheaper ones???? Maybe the alignment of the teeth in the burrs????

Arghhh....too many questions


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

I would be amazed if the temp on an un-pidded classic is stable


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

There is more to commercial espresso machines than pressure consistancy. Temperature stability & flow rate for example.

The Aurelia machine you mentioned will pull a reasonable shot with little attention to grind rdistribution and tamping. Infact at Coffee Collective Stourbridge I watched them pull a shot with no tamping at all and the shot finished in a reasonable time due to preinfusion, volumetrics and flow meter/restrictors.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

You can't compare your equipment - new £350 total to theirs. Grinder alone costs. £2500. Bigger burrs , better grind consistency , ability to grind finer , more taste profile. Robur has 71mm burrs ? Mc2 55 mm 58 ?


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## RoloD (Oct 13, 2010)

MiG said:


> I am starting to think that it's mostly down to equipment though and how consistently it can perform. Maybe not so much the espresso machine, but rather the grinder. I wouldn't imagine that the pressure on a machine like the Classic will vary wildly throughout a shot (when I measured the pressure while doing the OPV mod, it pretty much stayed right on. Also, the temp seems to pretty consistent (I've done the styrofoam cup test a bunch of times, and although not a perfect test, it did yield some pretty consistent result).


 The temperature, even on a PID'd Classic will vary significantly from shot to shot (depending how long it has been on, when you last used it to steam etc - there is just not enough mass of metal to keep it stable). And there is no pressure/temperture profiling as there is on a E61 or a lever machine (small lever machines like the Pavoni can make great espresso but consistency is a big issue). That's not to say you can't get great shots out of a Classic, just that they are much harder to come by. Just as in many areas, big professional machines make life easier.

And as others have said, the grinder is a huge factor in consistency and in the actual taste of the coffee. The more even the grind, the more evenly the water will pass through the coffee, getting the maximum flavour out. And the less clumpy the grind is, the less crucial is distribution and tamping. I never quite believed this until I found it out the hard way.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

The gaggia classic wont do all this :

http://nuovasimonelliusa.com/images/Aurelia%20Marketing%20Discription/Aurelia%20White%20Paper.pdf


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## RoloD (Oct 13, 2010)

garydyke1 said:


> The gaggia classic wont do all this :
> 
> http://nuovasimonelliusa.com/images/Aurelia%20Marketing%20Discription/Aurelia%20White%20Paper.pdf


Interesting. 'Soft infusion'... isn't that what levers do?


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## rodabod (Dec 4, 2011)

The only thing consistent with the Gaggia Classic is the average pressure, yet it still manages to vary across the coffee bed due to the grouphead design...

The PID only helps your starting temperature as I understand it, as the water temperature is unrecoverable once you start brewing, even with the element switched on.

(Note: I still use my Classic!).

Back to the original question, yes, I think it's much easier to brew consistently good espreesso on professional equipment.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

The key differences between the entry level equipment and the mid to high level equipment on here is repeatability, I wont go into the classic as this has been covered, but will explain things from the perspective of the machines I currently use. The expobar dual boiler with rotary pump affords me a very stable temperature platform to pull a shot of espresso, the rotary pump gives me a very steady and consistent flow rate, it doesnt have volumetric dosing but with practice you see when the shot should be killed. This machine is paired to a K10 grinder, which gives me super consistent espresso grade grinds, evenly distributed in a perfect mound into my portafilter and is repeatable once i have dialled a bean in, these factors combined to good consistent technique equates to fairly repeatable great coffee. Taking it a stage further with the L1 it becomes even easier to replicate the shots as the reduced pressure profile gives a more even extraction and the group by its nature almost gives me volumetric dosing as it is limited to the volume of water that can pass through it during each pull.

Anyway having this equipment makes great espresso A LOT easier, but not without effort and technique, which, as has been previously stated is going on in the coffee shop you frequent, you just dont neccessarily see that additional prep work that has already been done by a good barista.


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## xiuxiuejar (Jan 24, 2012)

This was one of the reasons I stuck with a Classic for so long - the knowledge that I'd have to pay a lot more money to get the results I wanted. The big differences I've noticed in the step up to the Expobar are:

1. Temperature control - I can tweak the temperature for each coffee. It is amazing what a difference 1 or 2º can make and I mean AMAZING!

2. Temperature stability - I'm no longer guessing. The Expo has a big boiler and can pull many shots without waiting cooling or warming.

3. Steam - I don't but I am assured that the machine has ample steaming capapbilty

4. Dual boiler allows you to do eveything without affecting the performance or result.

There are other cosmetic/ease of use issues too but the best thing a good prosumer model does is allow you to repeat your shots over and over and gives you great control over adjustments, pour etc.


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## MiG (Jul 11, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> The gaggia classic wont do all this :
> 
> http://nuovasimonelliusa.com/images/Aurelia%20Marketing%20Discription/Aurelia%20White%20Paper.pdf


Sounds like I need to get myself an Aurelia and a nice Mazzer!







Next step would be quitting my job and opening up a coffee shop from my house! Haha...

Anyway, it does sound like there is no real substitute for having some high-end equipment, if you want consistently great tasting shots.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Get yourself a dual boiler e61 (or L1) and a decent grinder . I would say my shots at home are often better than most shops ! But could I knock out 100-300 per day , erm no !


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## MiG (Jul 11, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> Get yourself a dual boiler e61 (or L1) and a decent grinder . I would say my shots at home are often better than most shops ! But could I knock out 100-300 per day , erm no !


I would love to get an e61 dual boiler and a nice grinder, but that sort of equipment is a bit out of my price range for now.


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