# Tightvac vs airscape



## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Has anyone owned both a tightvac and an airscape bean container and noticed any significant difference in bean ageing?

I've been using tightvac for a couple of years and although seem fine - given my coffee consumption I'd be up for spending on something else If I got another couple of weeks or so before the beans started to 'go'.

Beans can be in the container for 6 weeks sometimes and I notice quite a difference after they've been opened for a week even. I usually open the packet 6 days after roast date.


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## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

kennyboy993 said:
 

> Has anyone owned both a tightvac and an airscape bean container and noticed any significant difference in bean ageing?
> 
> I've been using tightvac for a couple of years and although seem fine - given my coffee consumption I'd be up for spending on something else If I got another couple of weeks or so before the beans started to 'go'.
> 
> Beans can be in the container for 6 weeks sometimes and I notice quite a difference after they've been opened for a week even. I usually open the packet 6 days after roast date.


Might multiple smaller containers be an option so you don't keep opening the beans up to the air?


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

I don't know ashroc - maybe. They are only open for 30 seconds at a time.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

I've used both but stopped using TightVac as they are plastic and they warn about oil etc. I mostly use beans coated in oil.

Airscape have a double lid. The one that makes the seal is pushed down onto the top of the bean valve open and then it's closed so there is less enclosed air when it's sealed than TightVac.

I tried conditioning my beans in an airscape. Bad news in my case. They gained an unusual smell. Usually they oil up over 5 days or so. That and smell tells when they are ready. They still oiled up but the nice smell went. So went back to me vented bean cans. I had being having a problem with those. They are pretty full so not much air. Turns out after cleaning the valves in them that the problem was oil over 12 months+ preventing the valve from working correctly. The valves use 2 pieces of thin springy plastic that must have been sticking together. Also some fine mesh which may have been blocked so ripped it off. Beans back to normal now. I may use the airscape for the can of beans i am using. I usually buy 3 250g packs into 3 cans. Each can holds about 16 shots so lasts just short of a week.







So from memory my cost of machine / number of drinks is rather less than yours so once matured you might be better of with an airscape as you take longer to use up a pack.

I fridge mine once they are matured and take out a day or so before a can has been used. Works for me maybe as it seriously thickens the coat of oil while they are in there.

Bean cellars - no way for me and probably in some cases more air than beans in each one. Thinking about preparing a weeks worth would give me nightmares, takes up more space, usually lets light in and etc.

If you are looking around for a change in this area seriously avoid the type where air can be pumped out. They have to be bad news for beans as each time the can is evacuated it will take some volatiles with it.







Unless you want tasteless smellless beans of course.

John

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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Thanks John - would you summarise by saying the airscape were superior than the tightvac at keeping them fresh?


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

I have an Airscape, bought the large one by mistake.

It's nothing really that special. It just a container which you reduce the available space inside of - not a new idea by an stretch. The valve is also manual, so should your beans still be degassing it wont let out anything unless you pop the handle up or remove the inner lid/seal.

The Tightvac just seems to be a 'sealed' container. So not sure that is any better really.

If they made an inner lid for the Airscape with a one way valve then my (perhaps unwarranted) concerns would be dismissed.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Dylan said:


> I have an Airscape, bought the large one by mistake.
> 
> It's nothing really that special. It just a container which you reduce the available space inside of - not a new idea by an stretch. The valve is also manual, so should your beans still be degassing it wont let out anything unless you pop the handle up or remove the inner lid/seal.
> 
> ...


They are not built to degass beans, but to store them, which they do very effectively


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

dfk41 said:


> They are not built to degass beans, but to store them, which they do very effectively


Beans degas for quite a while, but mostly in the shortly after roasting. There are umpteen containers on the market with press in lids so I'm not sure Airscape bring much different to the market really.

Seeing as beans can continue to degas as they are stored it certainly wouldn't hurt to have a valve to allow any gas to escape.


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Ok thanks guys - good info.

Dylan - have you had a tightvac too? Interesting to get your take on ownership of both


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Dylan said:


> Beans degas for quite a while, but mostly in the shortly after roasting. There are umpteen containers on the market with press in lids so I'm not sure Airscape bring much different to the market really.
> 
> Seeing as beans can continue to degas as they are stored it certainly wouldn't hurt to have a valve to allow any gas to escape.


ah, changing your argument. Beans degas for a period of time, but unless they are dark, they usually reach that state after 3 to 5 days. So at that point, you can put them into the airspace of whatever you choose. As I stated, the canisters are meant as a storage device, not a conditioning device


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Do you want to explain how you have read my 'argument' differently in each post? Considering I repeated what I said in different words.

Thanks for your opinion, got any links/evidence to suggest how long beans degas for?


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Sorry Kenny, I don't have a tightvac. I was just pointing out the differences as I perceive them as I'm not sure there is much between any containers - I would buy whichever seems nicest for my kitchen (which is actually the rather nice looking ceramic airscapes)


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I home roasted for many years, in the days that @DavecUK had his own coffee forum. We tried all sorts of things regarding storage and degassing. We used to buy a machine and bags with a one way seal that let you suck all the air out to vacuum pack. The beans would release gas then every day or so, you would suck out the gas. After a few days, bearing in mind when I home roasted with a gene cafe, I was aiming for a maximum of medium, and from memory, after 4 to 5 days the beans released no gas. if you opened the bag for any reason, then often the process would start again but to a lesser degree. No, it is not scientific research but does experience count for anything


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Sure experience counts for plenty, but without knowing the types of beans, how many were tested, how they varied etc etc etc its difficult to apply it to what someone might be using today. A written article is someting to refer to rather than now old memory which is highly fallible.

To be clear your experience counts for more than my lack of any experimentation at all, but I wouldn't trust it as gospel, nor wouild trust any experience or opinion as gospel unless it were backed up with experimentation to see.

Not trying to dismiss your opinion, but offer an explanation of why I don't believe it is enough to write off bean storage benefitting from a valve. Your insistence on stating "its storage not conditioning" is non-sequiter. A bag your coffee is shipped in is also storage, but also has a valve to release gas - even if we accept your stated opinion that a valve is only needed for a few days it may still be beneficial for someone who wishes to transfer beans just a day or two off roast to this container.

Something can, of course, be both container and "conditioner"


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Dylan said:


> Sorry Kenny, I don't have a tightvac. I was just pointing out the differences as I perceive them as I'm not sure there is much between any containers - I would buy whichever seems nicest for my kitchen (which is actually the rather nice looking ceramic airscapes)


Thanks Dylan - that seems to be what I gather from elsewhere.

Would be interesting to see if others have tried both over a period of time as even a small improvement may convince me to invest


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I am not suggesting that an airspace would not benefit from a valve being fitted. But why would it? The whole point being to remove the air contained within and the Airspace is not particularly aimed at storing coffee beans. Then, how does a one way valve work. It is only at the point that the bag has expanded so much, that the valve kicks in. It was designed to stop bags from exploding. it does not release gas as it is released so effectively, it does bot all!


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## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

Dylan said:


> Beans degas for quite a while, but mostly in the shortly after roasting. There are umpteen containers on the market with press in lids so I'm not sure Airscape bring much different to the market really.
> 
> Seeing as beans can continue to degas as they are stored it certainly wouldn't hurt to have a valve to allow any gas to escape.


Beans release CO2 while degassing which will push the 02 to the top as it's heavier. There's nothing to stop you manually pushing down the inner lid from time to time if you think it requires it.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

ashcroc said:


> Beans release CO2 while degassing which will push the 02 to the top as it's heavier. There's nothing to stop you manually pushing down the inner lid from time to time if you think it requires it.


Yea, I am not suggesting there is anything wrong with the Airscape - it's just no different to an other food storage container out there with a press in lid.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> Thanks John - would you summarise by saying the airscape were superior than the tightvac at keeping them fresh?


Yes maybe but in my case it seems it isn't a good idea to condition beans in them. I am going to try using a small one on the beans I am using to see if they help with grinder setting changes as the beans age but haven't done that.







Want to see what happens with my normal cans and Niche first. To be honest I wouldn't expect it to help much as they are opened 3 times a day. If they sat around unopened for long periods maybe but the only way to find out is to try.

John

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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

I have 4 Airscape containers now and have found them the best and most convenient packaging for beans....if that counts for anything. Personally I think they are exactly right and perform better than anything else I have tried in the last 15-18 years.


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

DavecUK said:


> I have 4 Airscape containers now and have found them the best and most convenient packaging for beans....if that counts for anything. Personally I think they are exactly right and perform better than anything else I have tried in the last 15-18 years.


Valuable empirical data - thanks Dave.

Maybe someone on the forum has tried both of them over a period time and have collected enough experience data to know if there's any real difference in performance.

Otherwise I may well invest based on the comments so far


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

They are so cheap, in the scheme of things (e.g. Lynn Webber test tubes, walnut whatever doodads, beans covered in cat crap, and a Starbucks coffee desert drink, or special coffees from special roaster, or some of the other overpriced coffee paraphernalia...., just go for it....you won't look back.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Actually if beans gas in an airscape they could just push the stopper up a bit more so pass on the problem i had resting me beans in them. They aren't run of the mill beans though. 2nd crack monsooned is literally coated with oil when they have rested. My idea was one airscape for a bulk store and a smaller one for daily use to top up from that. It doesn't fit in well with the use of a fridge though. Some say don't fridge, some say it might spoil the beans. I don't try and use it for long term storage, just a few weeks.

John

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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> Valuable empirical data - thanks Dave.
> 
> Maybe someone on the forum has tried both of them over a period time and have collected enough experience data to know if there's any real difference in performance.
> 
> Otherwise I may well invest based on the comments so far


I'd say in your case as your usage rate is rather low they probably are a good idea. TightVac - I've always used the same oily beans and their comment about oil bugged me. Resting etc not as careful as I am these days and I was getting more variability for all sorts of reasons.

John

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## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

I have the stainless airscapes , which I have been using for a year .. They keep the moisture sunlight and any new air entering .. They seem to work, I don't have to change the grind settings and the coffee taste doesn't change over a week . I have never had one of the tops lift off the top of the beans because of excess gas . I have just pushed down one of the tops on an empty one with the handle in the locked position to the bottom and air comes through the two holes in the top . So I guess any off gassing can escape .

I also use some vacuum canisters with a pump and they work well , again no change in grind settings or taste when the beans have been in around two weeks . I am using mainly medium roasts now and see now oiling on the beans .


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## Inspector (Feb 23, 2017)

Double post


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## Inspector (Feb 23, 2017)

I have tested both, left beans in them for about two weeks, tightvac needed finer grind to get the same amount of espresso in 30 seconds if that makes sense.

So what i am doing now is using airscape to keep the beans until i run out the ones in tightvac. Because if you do open-close all the time you introduce oxygen in it, then no point to keep the beans in airscape







lately i bought a kg of mytery beans, been about a month i think or maybe longer, didn't need to change grind setting.


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## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

airscape:whistle:


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Inspector said:


> I have tested both, left beans in them for about two weeks, tightvac needed finer grind to get the same amount of espresso in 30 seconds if that makes sense.
> 
> So what i am doing now is using airscape to keep the beans until i run out the ones in tightvac. Because if you do open-close all the time you introduce oxygen in it, then no point to keep the beans in airscape
> 
> ...


Bingo - thanks. Right better find some pennies and get on to BB website


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## HBLP (Sep 23, 2018)

Dylan said:


> Yea, I am not suggesting there is anything wrong with the Airscape - it's just no different to an other food storage container out there with a press in lid.


 @Dylan

Could I ask what the other food storage containers are with a press in lid? Asking this pretty genuinely. I saw Evak but they seem more expensive than Airscape and potentially worse quality (the plastic ones at least)


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## Wolvesnev (Nov 11, 2018)

I've had an air scape for about a month now, and I'm really impressed with it. I go through a 250g per week, and I've had very little grind adjustment to do since I started using it. Much better than the tin that I used to use. Would thoroughly recommend.


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Just looked on BB - they're not cheap are they!

Most people getting the ceramic?


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## Wolvesnev (Nov 11, 2018)

I've got the stainless steel... there is a forum discount code for them on BB (10% I think) if you search the forum.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

HBLP said:


> @Dylan
> 
> Could I ask what the other food storage containers are with a press in lid? Asking this pretty genuinely. I saw Evak but they seem more expensive than Airscape and potentially worse quality (the plastic ones at least)


Hey HBLP, as I made that original post I had found a generic one on Amazon, but cannot now find it, I have seen similar things in the past but as far as I can tell in terms of UK suppliers just the Evak is the only other option.


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