# 270W going back, what now (new)? Atom?



## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Hi Everyone

After some thoughts if possible please.

My Sette is going back so I will have £500 in my bank a/c soon.

What machine next?

Decent taste/grind performance in the cup, Doserless, timer preset, accurate adjustment mechanism, reliable, small(ish).

Max £600, maybe £625 if I need to.

I'm thinking Eureka Atom (matt black seems to be £600 inc VAT) - but any other thoughts?\

Thanks


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## Tiny tamper (May 23, 2014)

With that budget it's what I'd buy new, very nice little grinder or there are Mazzer roubers e's going on ebay atm for that but that's used of course.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Roburs are massive and have pretty massive retention !


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I would buy a Fiorenzato F64 Evo from the importer, Caffe Vinci on Teeside. Ring them and ask for Eugene


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Do you want to buy new? There's a Mazzer Major up for sale in the for sale section.


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## Tiny tamper (May 23, 2014)

dfk41 said:


> I would buy a Fiorenzato F64 Evo from the importer, Caffe Vinci on Teeside. Ring them and ask for Eugene


Or this dfk knows his sh1t when it comes to gear..... Not worthy..... Not worthy...


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## Tiny tamper (May 23, 2014)

Mrboots2u said:


> Roburs are massive and have pretty massive retention !


Yeah they are, and they do have it was just a suggestion as it's a great price off new and some people can forgive certain traits if the money's right.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

The F64 Evo is as good as a SJ but it is doserless, quick and flipping good.

http://www.caffevinci.com/machines-equipment-c1/grinders-c8/fiorenzato-f64-evo-on-demand-coffee-grinder-p170

Tell Eugene I told you to ring him. He will advise you. There is a cheaper F64 and I cannot remember the difference now

The Atom had problems initially. I do not know if they are now sorted but claudette at BB will tell you


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

That does look like a nice grinder, the F64 Evo. Could well be a toss up between that and the Atom then.

Whats the retention and cup taste like on the F64 vs the Atom (not sure if you've had one of those yet dfk)


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

never had an atom. they seem well respected but i think only a couple are owned on here. Like any grinder, the F64 will have a little retention but t me, anything under 10 grams or so is just the usual morning purge. I know there are a few F64 owners on here. I have had a couple and they have character. I have also had the F83 and really liked that a lot. I would happily go back to Fiorenzato if I dumped the Mythos


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Ok thanks everyone

So wisdom seems to be either a Eureka Atom @ around 599 or the Fiorenzato F64E (or F64 Evo) for about 599 or 650ish respectively.

It looks like the only difference between the Evo and non-Evo model of the F64 is the thermostatically controlled cooling fan for the burrs. My guess is I wont need this as i only pull 1 or 2 double shots a day so they won't be getting warm.

A few thoughts / questions though;

1) Reliability - are they both likely to be the same? Bella Barista are close to me so I can go there in person (atom) but i think I'd be buying the Fioorenzato mail order so any returns might be a pain

2) Relative rareity - the Fiorenzato is a bit unknown, but looks v nice. Should I be worried or is this more of a UK thing and they are just not as widely imported?

3) Grind retention - as i only pull a few shots a day I don't want to waste tonnes of beans all the time with flushing, but are they reasonably similar or quite different?

Decisions, decisions.

Atom - i like the compact size, smaller hopper, quiet grinding and apparent lack of retention. I can also buy it locally. Not that keen on the grind adjustment mechanism and the burrs are very slightly smaller than the F64

F64 - i like the extra info on the display, bigger burr size, nicer looks, better grind adjustment. Not that keen on the big hopper or the mail order given my experience with the Sette. Greater grind retention from the little reading I've done?

Probably leaning towards the Atom unless there are cries of 'but the F64 tastes better in the cup'....


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## MatBat (Feb 15, 2017)

Agree F64 would be a great choice. Could you stretch up to a Zenith 65E? Both are pretty big - is size an issue? There was a 65E on the BB clearance sale for £100 cheaper but not sure if it sold.


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## MatBat (Feb 15, 2017)

itguy said:


> 2) Relative rareity - the Fiorenzato is a bit unknown, but looks v nice. Should I be worried or is this more of a UK thing and they are just not as widely imported?
> 
> ....


Fiorenzatos are turning up in loads of cafes nowadays (including good ones) and are definitely gaining in popularity in the U.K. - at least that's my sense


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I do not think there will be many people who have tried the two. I would say for your fears and the fact that BB give the Atom a 2 year warranty and that they are local, thats what I would go for


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Fiorenzatp are aimed at cafes rather than retail. That is why they appear good value as their website has only one price. It is also why the Evo has the fan. caffe Vinci do a lot of take our grinder and our beans deals to cafes.


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Well, have just found that my favourite coffee shop in Cornwall (gwenna tea rooms, porth, Newquay) uses an F64 Evo.

Had a decent look at it this morning and it's also super quiet. They're really happy with it too.

Just need coffeehit to confirm the refund and I'll be ordering one


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## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

The Fiorenzato is nice,very fast and has a nice display. Why aren't you keen on the grind adjustment of the Atom? IMO it is better than Fiorenzato's, true stepless and you can take the top off easily for cleaning, the Fiorenzato uses a securing clamp which makes it effectively stepped, of course you can leave the setting between two 'clicks' or dents. You also have to unscrew the whole top for cleaning, losing the setting.


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## joey24dirt (Jan 28, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> I would buy a Fiorenzato F64 Evo from the importer, Caffe Vinci on Teeside. Ring them and ask for Eugene


Have you been to this place? Do they have a showroom? I only live about 15 mins away


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

joey24dirt said:


> Have you been to this place? Do they have a showroom? I only live about 15 mins away


They have a showroom, look on their website for details. They supply all sorts of stuff to the trade including coffee beans, they import from Italy....call them and ask for Eugene!


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## joey24dirt (Jan 28, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> They have a showroom, look on their website for details. They supply all sorts of stuff to the trade including coffee beans, they import from Italy....call them and ask for Eugene!


Yeah I've had a look  Wonder if they can get me a mignon lol


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

They do not deal with Eureka


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Stanic said:


> The Fiorenzato is nice,very fast and has a nice display. Why aren't you keen on the grind adjustment of the Atom? IMO it is better than Fiorenzato's, true stepless and you can take the top off easily for cleaning, the Fiorenzato uses a securing clamp which makes it effectively stepped, of course you can leave the setting between two 'clicks' or dents. You also have to unscrew the whole top for cleaning, losing the setting.


I said this because I've had a Simonelli MDX previously which had the same type of adjustment and I found it really stiff and also hyper sensitive with only the very slightest adjustment required to make quite a big extraction change. Maybe the atom is different / has a finer thread on the adjustment bar under the knob?


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

dfk41 said:


> Fiorenzatp are aimed at cafes rather than retail. That is why they appear good value as their website has only one price. It is also why the Evo has the fan. caffe Vinci do a lot of take our grinder and our beans deals to cafes.


Well after seeing pretty much every single coffee outlet in Newquay having a Fiorenzato F64 Evo as their grinder (I've counted 4 so far!), it's obvious it is the grinder of choice for the local trade supplier Cornico down here, and if they are happy to supply as part of a La Marzzoco coffee machine package then it's good enough for me.

I also found out that the F64e has different burrs to the F64 Evo and that the Evo burrs are quicker grinding, and the Evo obviously has the cooling fan built in too.

Given I now decided an F64 Evo is the way to go, looking round online there was only 1 place that had an evo in stock at a really good price.

http://www.theespressoshop.co.uk/en/Fiorenzato-MC/b-24.aspx

They are also giving 10% discount if you sign up to their mailing list.

Given that they had black and red both in stock when I started looking yesterday morning and then at lunchtime they only had 1 red left, I have pulled the trigger. I know @dfk41 you mentioned Eugene, but I just couldn't see them coming down to this price. I have paid £637 delivered inc VAT for an EVO, which I think is pretty much unbeatable. The F64e would have been £593 delivered.

Really can't wait to get my hands on it, I just will want to look at alternative hoppers as soon as really


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## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

itguy said:


> I found it really stiff and also hyper sensitive with only the very slightest adjustment required to make quite a big extraction change.


Not too different from the Fiorenzato then as far as I can compare to the Mignon, with the added difficulty of desire to make a fine adjustments and turning the whole collar which is quite stiff..definitely easier to just turn the knob of the Eureka


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Ahh well, a change is as good as a rest isn't it eh! I'll have to see how I get on...


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Well done. I am sure you will be quite happy with it!


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## mcrmfc (Sep 17, 2016)

@itguy as an owner of an F64E I can assure you that these are quality both in terms of build and grind quality. The UI is also good and a pleasure to use.

As alluded to the only slight faff is adjusting grind finer as you need to run the motor, drop the catch and make the adjustment all at once.

Interesting about the difference in the burrs...

Would @dfk41 or @coffeechap be able to offer any wisdom about why they are cut differently? You can actually see the difference in this pic...


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

That's great to hear and very reassuring. A few years ago before I really got in to coffee I remember being in a coffee beans place in Venice and seeing a grinder that I said 'wow, that's cool' behind the counter. Guess what it was!! A LCD model of some kind of Fiorenzato in Red!! Now I'll own one









re the burrs - I wonder if they designed the Evo to just be the more commercial one, with faster grinding and associated cooling to go with it. I have also seen in Europe there are companies that sell the F64 Evo with red speed burrs too.

Id be almost certain that you can just buy the Evo burrs and put them in a F64E, but just not for constant shot after shot after shot cafe use. (Then it would need the fan etc on the Evo).


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

One question I do have though - do you actually use the temperature and humidity display to change your grinder or affect what you are doing or are they just "oh it's hot today" info?!


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Re burrs, they are cut differently as the faster Evo model requires a more aggressive cut, so if you swopped them with a 64E either way the performance would diminish.

Re the display. My grinders catch the sun as it moves across the sky and I find that I have to adjust slightly as the day goes on. For the home user the displays offer good info but I doubt it will get that hot, unless you have a lot of friends coming round!


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Wow!! Got my new Fiorenzato F64 Evo delivered this morning and wow, what a grinder. Super quiet, very very quick grinding and no boulders or static. Really very impressed. I'll tell you all what it tastes like when I've got back off my holidays and fired up the Expobar!!

I do need a short hopper for it though..


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## mcrmfc (Sep 17, 2016)

@itguy assume you have seen this thread:

https://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=38780

Looks like there is an adaptor you can get to fit a small hopper.

http://www.elektros.it/sa/en/coffee_grinder/coffee_grinder_fiorenzato/

Or go the perspex tube route as I did.


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## itguy (Jun 26, 2015)

Very, very helpful. That's just what I am after - the adaptor ring looks perfect and the short Mazzer hopper is ideal.

Nice one


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