# Lido 2 v Hausgrind



## 4085

There is a discussion or test going on on HB for the above. It is not a long thread but makes good reading. I found the two videos good to watch as well!

http://www.home-barista.com/grinders/knock-hausgrind-vs-orphan-espresso-lido-2-double-blind-test-t29251.html


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## Mrboots2u

Yep although the lido2 is a Proto type and not the finished production model . It was sent our for beta testing so improvements could be made . So in some respects not a fair test ....


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## 4515

That Lido 2 is huge !


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## Neill

Thanks for posting. An interesting comparison. Both sound excellent grinders.


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## 4085

Prototype it my be but it is really only for brewed coffee, is enormous, nd seems difficult to grind and adjust. Seems odd bringing it to the market which such problems"


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## Charliej

Lido 2 is made of glass as well not one to drop. I think that if you are based in the UK or Europe then the Hausgrind is a no brainer as it works out far cheaper and if you do have any problems with it, it only needs to go back to Edinburgh.


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## fatboyslim

From a purely aesthetics point of view, how can glass compare to that beautiful walnut! Its stunning to look at!


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## Mrboots2u

dfk41 said:


> Prototype it my be but it is really only for brewed coffee, is enormous, nd seems difficult to grind and adjust. Seems odd bringing it to the market which such problems"


That's why it's a pro type , it's not the market finished version yet( re adjustment ) .......yeah it's massive though your right , funnel. Looks good though


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## urbanbumpkin

Glass does seem a bit nuts from a durability point of view, not keen on the look of it either. Looks like some Victorian contraption.


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## DavidBondy

working dog said:


> That Lido 2 is huge !


Interesting. It is good to see them side-by-side to see the comparative sizes. It is huge!

It seems to me that there are two different classes of hand grinder: those which are for static or home use such as the Lido 2, the Pharos or HG-One and those which are portable and suitable for travel use such as the Hausgrind, the Rosco, the Porlex and all the rest.

You need to be sure that you're comparing apples with apples otherwise the comparisons may be superfluous.

David


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## 4515

And if the lido is more of a static grinder maybe it's design should reflect that


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## 4085

Nah, don't agree on that analysis mr boots......they rushed this out to get to market first. No amount of tinkering with will do much to alleviate the problems mentioned and I believe the Lido is widely available now, so not sure if prototype is really an accurate label. According to OE, the prototype was finished on August 30th last year,


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## The Systemic Kid

The way the Lido's handle doubles as a chute for pouring in the beans is a very good idea. Can see a few beans going AWOL on the Hausgrind whilst loading.


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## 4085

I say widely available as there seem to be loads in circulation, even though the website says pre order


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## Monkey_Devil

I can't imagine it will be long before Knock design a funnel add-on for their grinder to be honest, so not too concerned about that.

I opened that thread worried that I would end up lusting after a Lido, but I am pleased that I have my order in for the Hausgrind now







I think as an all rounder it came out on top.


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## DavidBondy

That's where the Rosco's design is good. The entire top comes off to fill it and you can fill a shot glass or espresso cup with beans. Place the Rosco upside-down on top and invert the whole thing to fill it with no spillage.

DB


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## Mrboots2u

dfk41 said:


> Nah, don't agree on that analysis mr boots......they rushed this out to get to market first. No amount of tinkering with will do much to alleviate the problems mentioned and I believe the Lido is widely available now, so not sure if prototype is really an accurate label. According to OE, the prototype was finished on August 30th last year,


According to the other thread on HB the one they are using is a pro type for beta testing ( Doug from OE posted this, not me ) . I ordered a hausgrind , just saying one is not entirely the market product( according to the guy who makes it ) one is .


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## 4085

Agree but Doug's post was last august!!....the link I sent was posted today, which would make you think the recipient had a recent Lido 2 to play with!


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## urbanbumpkin

The Systemic Kid said:


> The way the Lido's handle doubles as a chute for pouring in the beans.


Or could double as a hammer to smash its self with









Seriously though I do like multi function design features. Good idea Lido.


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## Mrboots2u

Sorry preproduction not pro type , see link 7th August,he makes reference to different adjustment posibiltiee . I don't think many are a being beta tested currently , less than 10 . I can't find the link where he says this .

Like I say I've ordered a hausgrind , just being accurate .

http://www.home-barista.com/grinders/madebyknock-knock-hausgrind-t28566-120.html#p337796


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## fatboyslim

The Systemic Kid said:


> The way the Lido's handle doubles as a chute for pouring in the beans is a very good idea. Can see a few beans going AWOL on the Hausgrind whilst loading.


Yes unfortunately this is one of the design flaws I mentioned to Peter. I believe he intends to make something based on the US-improvised-funnel-technology-systems.


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## Mrboots2u

Looks good hopefully not too expensive an add on .


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## The Systemic Kid

Thought long and hard about whether to go for a Lido over the Hausgrind but have no reservations about deciding on the Hausgrind. Beautifully crafted - the enamelling on the adjustment nut is testament to this. Wrapping the grinder in bespoke wood is the icing on the cake. Peter deserves a design award.


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## The Systemic Kid

Mrboots2u said:


> Looks good hopefully not too expensive an add on .


I'll make my own - like a challenge.


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## Charliej

It's so good to see a small British craftsmanship led company doing so well, hats off all round to Peter, he's a top bloke as well. I'd buy a Hausgrind purely on the principle that it's British made, not machined in China, which some people held against the Sage DB. It's interesting to note that Peter's initial idea was for the Hasugrind to be literally just that a grinder for use at home and the smaller Feldgrind or Field grinder to be the one aimed at travel use. I think I'm going to be saving my pennies to buy a Hausgrind and then ditch the Porlex and my trusty old but good Zassenhaus.


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## MWJB

dfk41 said:


> Prototype it my be but it is really only for brewed coffee, is enormous, nd seems difficult to grind and adjust. Seems odd bringing it to the market which such problems"


OE already make an espresso grinder, the Lidos were aimed at brewed coffee from the off.


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## MWJB

Charliej said:


> Lido 2 is made of glass as well not one to drop. I think that if you are based in the UK or Europe then the Hausgrind is a no brainer as it works out far cheaper and if you do have any problems with it, it only needs to go back to Edinburgh.


Only the catch cup, the hopper is a synthetic material.


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## 4085

MWJB said:


> OE already make an espresso grinder, the Lidos were aimed at brewed coffee from the off.


That is as maybe, but the thread was comparing the Lido 2 to the Hausgrind which does do espresso


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## MWJB

dfk41 said:


> That is as maybe, but the thread was comparing the Lido 2 to the Hausgrind which does do espresso


Yes, and the same thread seems to say that for cupping, Lido 2 was preferred & a slightly more even grind, then the Lido lost out with the CCD in that test. They are different products, different burrs, I'm sure there will be things (& people) that one suits better than the other (both are a big leap from Porlex & Hario). There have been a couple of comparisons on HB, the consensus seems to be that they both have their strengths & choice (that we're lucky to have) will come down to application & aesthetics. Indeed, if espresso grind is what you want then the Hausgrind seems to have the edge, between these 2, but I bet the novelty will wear off for espresso, drinking the number of shots you make in a day? ;-)

I don't see why we have to kick one guy, when praising someone else. I'm sure they'll both have happy customers.


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## 4085

Who is kicking who please?


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## MWJB

dfk41 said:


> Who is kicking who please?


Your post didn't give a fair appraisal of the brew methods described in the H-B thread, you made derisory comments about a pre-production model in beta testing. Hausgrind is available for sale to the public (lucky few so far), Lido 2 is only on pre order. You weren't being balanced.

"But seeing how both of these grinders (for me at least) would only be used 95% of the time for pour over style brewing, I think it's nearly a dead heat neck and neck comparison since the Lido 2's materials inspire so much confidence and strength, I'd be less worried about it jostling around. But on the flip side, the Hausgrind is so much easier and quicker to use, I put it slightly ahead." TomC's round up appraisal - one of the handful of people who has access to both.


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## 4085

A bit touchy, as usual MWJB, but you always are when commenting on my posts. Still, you are as entitled to your opinion as much as the next person, be that as it may. My thread was to inform people that there was a. Thread on HB where two owners put the things side by side, which is quite natural, even though they are different beasts.

I have no interest in a Lido, or in putting it down. Mr B came out and started to defend the Lido and it went on from there. I think that is called forum debate, a bit like your accusations over anything I haves said.

I have not stuck up for the Hausgrind, even though I have bought one, merely pointed out the fact that it can do espresso and drip which. Seems a better option than having to have two OE grinders


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## MWJB

Touchy, not at all, most of your posts go without any comment from me, there's no personal aspect to this - it's not about you, or me. I'm not sticking up for the Lido 2. You made incorrect assertions about the market readiness of a grinder in this comparison. We are lucky to have 2 such companies aiming to provide us with a choice in this bracket, both have invested hard work on these projects, surely that's something we can be happy about.


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## Nimble Motionists

It's next to useless having a hand grinder that can do both. I'm very happy with my Pharos but there's not a chance I'd want to try and move it between espresso and brewed! Given the good experience I've had of the Pharos 1) Cup Quality, 2) Build quality & 3) Ease of use I'll definitely be considering the Lido.


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## fatboyslim

Nimble Motionists said:


> It's next to useless having a hand grinder that can do both. I'm very happy with my Pharos but there's not a chance I'd want to try and move it between espresso and brewed! Given the good experience I've had of the Pharos 1) Cup Quality, 2) Build quality & 3) Ease of use I'll definitely be considering the Lido.


No it's not next to useless, it's next to awesome. Probably the best option in fact for someone who splits their coffee drinking experience between heavenly brewed coffee and tasty espresso. Not many grinders out there that can do such a good job at both.


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## dsc

I don't really understand this whole espresso + brewed action going on, surely if a conical burr set produces a grind good enough for espresso and for brewed at coarser settings, it means all conical can do the same. Unless I'm missing something?

Regards,

T.


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## kikapu

dsc said:


> I don't really understand this whole espresso + brewed action going on, surely if a conical burr set produces a grind good enough for espresso and for brewed at coarser settings, it means all conical can do the same. Unless I'm missing something?
> 
> Regards,
> 
> T.


What I have seen mentioned is the fact that espresso grinders tend to create a large number of 'fnes' which are ok for espresso but if you have a large number of 'fines' in brewed coffee these over extract quickly and removes clarity from the cup


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## dsc

Indeed, that is why I said I don't understand how a conical burr set can be good both for espresso and brewed. The principle was always loads of fines for espresso and very uniform grind for brewed coffee. Somehow now anything from a conical burrset is good for all methods.

Regards,

T.


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## kikapu

dsc said:


> Indeed, that is why I said I don't understand how a conical burr set can be good both for espresso and brewed. The principle was always loads of fines for espresso and very uniform grind for brewed coffee. Somehow now anything from a conical burrset is good for all methods.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> T.


Ok me neither but then I guess then it must be similar to the fact that if you have two different makes of grinder with the same type and size of burrs yet one might produce a 'better' grind than the other, other subtle factors must come into play I guess more than just burr type!! Be interested to know though


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## Mrboots2u

Don't brink it's same burrs though in this case . The hausgrind I think is using burrs set very similar , if not the same to that used in the lido1 , the lido 2 is a different ? ( Although how different burrs set is debatable I suppose . ) .

Both are really designed for brew , it would appear that the in doing so the hausgrind would appear more adept at an espresso grind than the current model being tested ( lido 2 ) .


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## MWJB

dsc said:


> I don't really understand this whole espresso + brewed action going on, surely if a conical burr set produces a grind good enough for espresso and for brewed at coarser settings, it means all conical can do the same. Unless I'm missing something?
> 
> Regards,
> 
> T.


I'm sure that the Lido 2 burrs are perfectly espresso capable in whatever grinder they were conceived to be placed in, yes, I agree ...either burr should "work" for espresso & should make less fines at coarser settings & work for brewed.

Lido 1 had the same burrs as the Hausgrind (please correct me if I'm wrong), you can grind espresso fine with these in that grinder, but it's an effort (compared to, say, the much slower Porlex - not comparing grind quality here, just an illustration on effort required), especially with light roasted, hard beans. Doug Garrott made the decision to use a more aggressive burr set in the Lido 2 to facilitate faster grinding at the expense of a little more resistance over Lido 1....Lido 2 handle looks shorter (but overall a better design) than the long handle setting on Lido 1 too, so it seems that it would follow that Lido 2 takes more physical effort at very fine settings. Dark roasts & Monsooned Malabar might be much easier to grind? Lido concept is aimed at a portable cupping style grinder at ~1.5-2.5 turns out, Lido 1 makes short work of any bean at these settings and can be hand held. Under 1 turn out on Lido 1 you get more resistance (one of the girls in the office asked to have a go at grinding some beans at fine drip...no go), large beans like Pacamara don't feed as well at fine settings...Lido 2 should feed better, but again, more resistance from the burr set at finer settings.

The observations seem more about physical effort required and stopping the grind adjustment from slipping at "espresso" settings (this was also an observation on the Hausgrind but I think there's been a component change to help here? Spring change?)...but then that wasn't the Lido's anticipated MO.


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## MWJB

kikapu said:


> What I have seen mentioned is the fact that espresso grinders tend to create a large number of 'fines' which are ok for espresso but if you have a large number of 'fines' in brewed coffee these over extract quickly and removes clarity from the cup


As you go coarser you get less fines, as you go finer the peak in the grind distribution becomes a flatter hill, or pair of humps - see the OE Lido grind distribution charts.

There are various ways to make "brewed" coffee, incidence of fines may have a greater/lesser bearing on one over the other.


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## fatboyslim

The burrs in the hausgrind are the same as the ones in MC2, so you would expect it to do a capable espresso grind. Why the hausgrind is better than MC2 at brewed settings relates to the much slower RPM of hand grinding. Pretty sure I saw a discussion on this somewhere. I'll try to find it.


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## Nimble Motionists

fatboyslim said:


> No it's not next to useless, it's next to awesome. Probably the best option in fact for someone who splits their coffee drinking experience between heavenly brewed coffee and tasty espresso. Not many grinders out there that can do such a good job at both.


Do you genuinely plan to switch between espresso and brewed on the Hausgrind? (Not meaning to be antagonistic - genuinely curious)


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## lookseehear

I've been switching between espresso and brewed on my Hausgrind for the last couple of weeks and it's definitely doable. It's not perfect for espresso but it's capable. I've had quite a few very pretty, very tasty pours but I've found I need more practise to get back to my espresso setting each time so that I don't get as much variability. I'll take it to the Birmingham bash if anyone wants to have a look.


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## Nimble Motionists

lookseehear said:


> I've been switching between espresso and brewed on my Hausgrind for the last couple of weeks and it's definitely doable. It's not perfect for espresso but it's capable. I've had quite a few very pretty, very tasty pours but I've found I need more practise to get back to my espresso setting each time so that I don't get as much variability. I'll take it to the Birmingham bash if anyone wants to have a look.


Interesting, roughly what weight of beans do you reckon you waste each time you switch?


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## lookseehear

Half a gram maybe? There's very little retention. If you want to make a really good shot you might waste a shot's worth but you can get ball park on the first go.


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## 4515

mine will be for V60 and aeropress only so for me the the ability to perform as espresso and pour over wont be an issue

(and it looks sooooo much better than its plastic competitor


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## The Systemic Kid

Second that......


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## Mrboots2u

A kind of video resposte on how hard it is to grind espresso on the lido 2


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## Charliej

Hmmmmmmmmmm how hard is it to grind a single scoop of what appeared to be a very dark roast bean on any hand grinder and to not show the grinds?


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## Mrboots2u

Wow your not digging the lido are u Charlie


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## Charliej

Well I think it's fugly for starters and it's two supposedly respected members of HB ( a bit like giving them to Glenn and Coffeechap to play with on here) who have compared the two and made the observations they have and provided pictures and results and video. Doug and Barb decide to post an as you call it riposte to this in which they use a single scoop so 10g max probably less of what looked to be a fairly dark roast bean, which we all know are lighter and easier to grind, that she then takes ~35 seconds to grind through without showing the setting or the resulting grinds.

So yeah colour me suspicious, it's not like I'd be the 1st person throwing stones at a brand new product from someone with only a short history of manufacturing their own coffee related products and getting them made in China to save on labour.

Plus the whole ethos of Peter's company appeals to me and it's completely made in the UK too other than the burrs and a damn sight prettier.


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## Nimble Motionists

Charliej said:


> Well I think it's fugly for starters and it's two supposedly respected members of HB ( a bit like giving them to Glenn and Coffeechap to play with on here) who have compared the two and made the observations they have and provided pictures and results and video. Doug and Barb decide to post an as you call it riposte to this in which they use a single scoop so 10g max probably less of what looked to be a fairly dark roast bean, which we all know are lighter and easier to grind, that she then takes ~35 seconds to grind through without showing the setting or the resulting grinds.
> 
> So yeah colour me suspicious, it's not like I'd be the 1st person throwing stones at a brand new product from someone with only a short history of manufacturing their own coffee related products and getting them made in China to save on labour.
> 
> Plus the whole ethos of Peter's company appeals to me and it's completely made in the UK too other than the burrs and a damn sight prettier.


13 seconds (from 0:20 to 0:33) but why let the facts get in the way of self-justification









Agree it would be more helpful if they showed the resulting shot.


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## Charliej

Nimble Motionists said:


> 13 seconds (from 0:20 to 0:33) but why let the facts get in the way of self-justification
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Agree it would be more helpful if they showed the resulting shot.


I wasn't watching the time but it makes me curious I'll have to get the Zassenhaus set to an espresso grind and whack through a single scoop of a dark roast just to see how long it takes.


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## Mrboots2u

Another this time Ethiopian light roast 20g . Both grinders .


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## 4085

I would think, that Doug and Barb would be plain stupid to post a video which showed their investment as anything but fantastic.


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## kikapu

about 28 second Lido 2 and 35 sec for Hausgrind.


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## The Systemic Kid

Should he be doing that in public??


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## fatboyslim

That moment when you get down to those last few beans is immensely satisfying! The hausgrind has a longer crank arm (handle) so what isn't shown (methodically) in that video is exertion.

Lido 2 looks a little awkward to grind and stalls more often?


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## kikapu

The Systemic Kid said:


> Should he be doing that in public??


 I found it strangely hypnotic!!


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## Charliej

Certainly looked like the Lido 2 took more effort to grind and stalled more than once which always then requires more effort to get it going again, also from the way the Lido wandered around on his thigh that looked a little dangerous to me and too close for comfort at times. At then end of the day I would rather take easier to use than harder work for the sake of 7 seconds. The Lido2 just doesn't do anything for me, support UK industry god knows we need to. I think the Lido when seen in the same video looks cheap next to the Hausgrind, plus as I've previously said one is largely made in China and the other entirely UK made apart from the burrs.


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## Mrboots2u

I hope both products do well as OE have put a lot of effort into hand grinders and making great modern ones , paving the way for people like Peter to jump into a market they enlarge with things like the pharos .


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## jbviau

The Systemic Kid said:


> Should he be doing that in public??


^^^ That got a laugh from me. It's exactly what I was thinking when I was grinding!

First post here. I see some of you are following my beta-testing thread on HB; I'll continue to post updates (like this one) there. My time with the hausgrind is almost up, but I'll have the LIDO 2 beta unit in my possession indefinitely. Feel free to ask if you have questions that aren't addressed in the thread.

Cheers!


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## Mrboots2u

jbviau said:


> ^^^ That got a laugh from me. It's exactly what I was thinking when I was grinding!
> 
> First post here. I see some of you are following my beta-testing thread on HB; I'll continue to post updates (like this one) there. My time with the hausgrind is almost up, but I'll have the LIDO 2 beta unit in my possession indefinitely. Feel free to ask if you have questions that aren't addressed in the thread.
> 
> Cheers!


Thanks for positing ,sorry to steal and repost your clips here, hope you don't mind ..........


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## jbviau

No worries at all.


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## Mrboots2u

jbviau said:


> No worries at all.


Have you had a chance to try Dougs recommendations on "hip grinding method yet ? "


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## The Systemic Kid

jbviau said:


> ^^^ That got a laugh from me. It's exactly what I was thinking when I was grinding!
> 
> First post here. I see some of you are following my beta-testing thread on HB; I'll continue to post updates (like this one) there. My time with the hausgrind is almost up, but I'll have the LIDO 2 beta unit in my possession indefinitely. Feel free to ask if you have questions that aren't addressed in the thread.
> 
> Cheers!


Welcome to the forum - look forward to more feedback....and clips


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## jbviau

Thanks. Re: hip grinding, yes, positioning the grinder more to the side (but still resting the base of the catch jar against the hip) and getting the holding hand more involved does make a difference.


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## Mrboots2u

jbviau said:


> Thanks. Re: hip grinding, yes, positioning the grinder more to the side (but still resting the base of the catch jar against the hip) and getting the holding hand more involved does make a difference.


On the clips you took , had one of the grinders , had more beans though out its life cycle than the other ?


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## jbviau

Mrboots2u said:


> On the clips you took , had one of the grinders , had more beans though out its life cycle than the other ?


No, they were equally broken in.


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## grimpeur

Well, it appears that the Lido 2 and Hausgrind threads have reached fever pitch over on Home Barista. Both threads locked for a cooling down period. It's unbelievable that manual grinders can polarise opinion but I am not surprised that is has happened on HB; it really does seem to be the epicentre of coffee zealotry (in the nicest possible way of course).

Whatever ones opinions on the aesthetics or perceived economic benefits of any of the new generation manual coffee grinders, we should be truly glad that Peter from Portobello and Doug and Barb Garrott are putting so much effort into designing and building (by hand) the very best kit and enabling us to make great coffee relatively cheaply.

It's a blessing really.

When I bought my Lido, I discovered it was possible to make fantastic coffee in my own kitchen. What an epiphany! When I met Peter and he allowed me to borrow, experience and critique the Hausgrind prototype last November, I knew something special was happening (in the admittedly niche world of speciality manual brewed coffee grinders) and only 30 minutes from my house! It's a great time to be a coffee lover.

I am excited to hear more constructive opinions and see more detailed photographs of these fantastic devices and hopefully less ill-informed speculation and thinly veiled sniping!


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## dsc

grimpeur said:


> Well, it appears that the Lido 2 and Hausgrind threads have reached fever pitch over on Home Barista.


Typical for HB, some members there tend to over-dramatise and go a bit too far. Thank God this bunch is a bit more friendly









It's good to see movement in the manual grinder market, lets hope it brings something new to the motorised grinder market as well.

Regards,

T.


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## Charliej

So I was bored this morning so I dug out some of the dark roast beans I've got stashed for running through the RR55 when I change the burrs, weighed exactly 10g and stuck them in the Zassenhaus, a 67 year old hand grinder, at an espresso grind level and proceeded to grind away whilst timing myself and going at the sort of speed Barb did in the OE Lido video it took me 12 seconds and wasn't hard work at all. I guess the oldies can still get the job done and zero static issues as well no RDT needed.


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## grimpeur

dsc said:


> Typical for HB, some members there tend to over-dramatise and go a bit too far. Thank God this bunch is a bit more friendly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's good to see movement in the manual grinder market, lets hope it brings something new to the motorised grinder market as well.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> T.


I agree!

I think the recent developments in the manual grinder market WILL open up the motorised grinder market. Mainly due to the fact so often so many forumites list the shortfalls and disappointments of the current crop of motorised grinders. It will only take a few forward thinking, imaginative and practical folks like you Tom to shake things up and do what the likes of Orphan Espresso have done to the world of hand grinding but with motors attached!


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## dsc

grimpeur said:


> It will only take a few forward thinking, imaginative and practical folks like you Tom to shake things up and do what the likes of Orphan Espresso have done to the world of hand grinding but with motors attached!


I wish things were so easy







lets see what the future brings









Regards,

T.


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