# Vesuvius review - function over form



## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

There are several people on this forum that have forgotten more about coffee than I'll ever know, so the opening caveat is that this is a review from an 'average User'

Having sold the Lelit and shifted stuff around in the kitchen to make space I headed off and collected the V.

Kitchen placement -

it was *not *love at first sight, and no it's not because it's black instead of shiny chrome. It's just a bit, I'll spit it out.....ugly. The light wood on the black machine was a complete no no (more on them later).

The Mara was a slim machine so it was going from one extreme to the other, but it's bloody big too. No coffee that night as I was late home, felt a bit deflated ?

Start fiddling -

Tank filled, machine heated, let's see what this puppy can do. I start where no man has done so before, on the instruction manual!

Which on the whole is helpful, the eco mode section though, what??? Is the steam boiler on? Is it in eco mode if both are illuminated? At this stage I've got a bloody massive ugly machine that has unintuitive settings, should of got a bloody Sage and the orange screen.

Make some bloody coffee already -

Got some profiles set up, slap some coffee in, lift the lever...

The sound, or lack of, really quiet machine. Gear motor sounds completely different to any other coffee machines. I for one love it.

Obviously with a lever profile my pour is going to be perfect, er nope. Took a few attempts, tightened the grind before I got something vaguely resembling an espresso.

This is getting boring now, tell me if the coffee is any good-

Someone reading this tell me if they found on lever, or the V the pour looks a bit thinner?? I can't articulate exactly what I mean, just that it hasn't _looked_ as 'creamy/thick/light' whilst pouring. Mouthfeel in the cup is just as good, purely an aesthetic thing.

*Blimey it tastes good*, everyone advocates that the grinder makes all the difference. To compare in TV terms the grinder takes it to HD, this machine makes it OLED 4K. There is depth and sweetness in the cup that I have _never _tasted.

Getting steamy

She's powerful, wet and steamy. There is no denying it, it is quite a wet steam. Certainly workable and you can get great 'microbubblez'.

That said, it's a finekecty wand setup. The wand itself is fine but the ball joint freedom is severely limited, meaning positioning your wand in the jug is a pita. I think, due to frequency of use, this is my most disliked feature of the V.

What's 'wrong with it' (summary)...

- The supplied wood detail is cheap and ugly. That said super easy to remove and get a talented forum member (@nicknack) to make some high quality ones. This makes a *huge* difference to look and feel of the machine.

- It is big and not sexy. Sorry it's just...not.

- The wand positioning is infuriating. Plus if you forget to get it warming from eco mode you have to wait for steam to be up to temp after pulling your shot.

- The drip tray is shallow and a bit weird (bit like me from the sound of this review!).

- The water tank is wired in and annoying to remove and clean.

What's 'right with it' (summary)...

- It makes fantastic, amazing coffee (I suppose that's all that really matters).

- Built in on/off timer.

- So flexible! You want hotter steam, you got it. You want lower brew temp, no problem. You want pressure profile to suit any style bean, no problem.

- Temperature stable, shot after shot.

Tell me what I need to know without reading all that bo****s above-

The Vesuvius is all about what's in the cup. Function over form. It'll make the best coffee you've ever drunk, just with a few niggles.

p.s does anyone else think of the Phil Collins song 'Sussudio' when they think of the word Vesuvius? No?

Just me then...


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Just to add one positive and one negative...

The displayed shot timer, brilliant. I don't have scales with a built in timer so this makes a huge difference.

On the L.H.S is a status bar for how full the water tank is, clearly just a screen filler... goes from full to empty instantly. That said the red screen empty tank warning is far superior to any audible alarm (in part because it doesn't scare the dog).


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Great reading img - thanks

I share a lot of your views - especially the taste of the coffee bits!

Night and day isn't it, and a new learning curve as most of what we read online re shot times, grind settings etc doesn't apply.

For example I found it impossible to over extract! Amazing. Coffee I've never been able to get anything out of cannot beat this machine.


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> Night﻿ and day isn't it, and a new learning curve as most of what we read online re shot times, g﻿rind settings etc doesn't apply. ﻿﻿﻿


 Yes it really is, I suppose some parts of the review could seem a bit negative, but your quite right it is night and day.

I didn't think a machine could have _that much_ of a difference in the cup.

Definitely still learning regarding shot times... I had a 1:2.5 shot on Wednesday that took 51 seconds. I thought this will be a sink shot, whilst it wasn't the best the machine has produced it was better than most shots the ol' Lelit made.


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## Les996 (Jan 8, 2019)

I must admit I found the shear size of it a bit daunting! Wife thought it looked like a coffee shop so it's in my office. I personally love the look of it though 

I'm quite amazed how you can vary the taste so much from one bean...very rarely a bad shot unless I'm messing about to see where it goes lol

The only problem I have at the moment is soggy pucks which is a pest when the taste is good


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## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

What would be interesting to me is how often do the V V V Vesuvius owners change the profiles . ?

Do you have to dial in for different Profiles for the same bean ?

Is There a way to know what Profile suits a different bean , or is it practice practice ?

I did think of one of these when I bought my machine and it is one of two machines I would change mine for .

Need pictures on here ..


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## Les996 (Jan 8, 2019)

Nicknak said:


> What would be interesting to me is how often do the V V V Vesuvius owners change the profiles . ?
> 
> Do you have to dial in for different Profiles for the same bean ?
> 
> ...


 I'm still quite new to it but have been experimenting with different profiles on Rave Fudge at the moment...so it's practice practice for me ?


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## tohenk2 (Oct 11, 2017)

Looks are &#8230; very subjective. The Londinium is in the same category for me as the Vesuvius for the outer design wise - functional, angular (and in my case shiny).

I remember "the angular era in automotive car design". It didn't stay. And the big frames of American car before that (La Marzocco Rondine?). Oh boy, what did I dislike the first (French) cars without chrome fenders sticking out.

Personally I usually like the designs that are a derivative from nature best. Luigi Collani designs like the Cannon T90.


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Les996 said:


> I must admit I found the shear size of it a bit daunting! Wife thought it looked like a coffee shop so it's in my office. I personally love the look of it though
> I'm quite amazed how you can vary the taste so much from one bean...very rarely a bad shot unless I'm messing about to see where it goes lol
> The only problem I have at the moment is soggy pucks which is a pest when the taste is good


You probably have tried this Les - though for me soggy pucks went away when I went back to stock shower screen


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Les996 said:


> I must admit I found the shear size of it a bit daunting! Wife thought it looked like a coffee shop so it's in my office. I personally love the look of it though
> 
> I'm quite amazed how you can vary the taste so much from one bean...very rarely a bad shot unless I'm messing about to see where it goes lol
> 
> The only problem I have at the moment is soggy pucks which is a pest when the taste is good


 On any declining pressure profile, there is the potential for soggy pucks and especially if you let the pump stop...*then* raise the lever to depressurise the basket (I am sure you probably do this most of the time). Doing this doesn't properly vent the basket (physics).

Pro tip: I always raise the lever just before the pump stops and add a couple of seconds to the last phase of the profiles to cater for this.


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## Planter (Apr 12, 2017)

Great review from a personal perspective. I want to see some pics of the new wood though.


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## tohenk2 (Oct 11, 2017)

Taste and profiles: I don't nearly play around as much as I did a few years back. But - not much is just that: I can and do change things from time tot time.

It's just &#8230; a little while go I had a Huila SO bean (Medellin Secret microlot). Dialed it in, tweaked a bit on the Niche and the Vesuvius and got amazing coffee. I just don't change it then anymore because I like it so much. (Shots where so syrupy, ginger-y sweet that it was hardly coffee anymore. Extreme. I had trouble to stop making and drinking it, like 6 or more in 2 hours?)


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## tohenk2 (Oct 11, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> You probably have tried this Les - though for me soggy pucks went away when I went back to stock shower screen


 You can also try a little bit more coffee and grind a bit coarser.


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Nicknak said:


> What would be interesting to me is how often do the V V V Vesuvius owners change the profiles . ?
> 
> Do you have to dial in for different Profiles for the same bean ?
> 
> ...


 (Credit must go to @Obnic) I have found 2 bar pre-infusion, until first drips, followed by:

- flat 6 bar for light roasts

- flat 9 bar for dark roasts

has worked really well for both. Yet other beans respond really well to the x-profile.


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

@Nicknak more pictures then:









The instructions say when the steam but at the bottom is illuminated then the steam boiler is on, yet it also says to select eco steam button at the top to enable eco steam, do I need both illuminated? I guess...







Nice wood









Limited steam arm movement


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Planter said:


> Great review from a personal perspective. I want to see some pics of the new wood though.


Here you are...

It truly is amazing


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## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

The dark wood really suits the machine .. They look great on it ..?...


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## Planter (Apr 12, 2017)

Nicknak said:


> The dark wood really suits the machine .. They look great on it .....


Great work mate.


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Nicknak said:


> The dark wood really suits the machine .. They look great on it .....


It's all on you


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## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

igm45 said:


> It's all on you


 Enough , enough ?.. Back to the review ?.... Not really .. more more


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## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

igm45 said:


> (Credit must go to @Obnic) I have found 2 bar pre-infusion, until first drips, followed by:
> 
> - flat 6 bar for light roasts
> 
> ...


 So I guess , you can try lots of different pressures all from the LCD screen instead of keep adjusting the OPV on a normal E61 ?

Has anyone done/ tried a lever profile similar to an LR ?

A side by side would be interesting..


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

igm45 said:


> (Credit must go to @Obnic) I have found 2 bar pre-infusion, until first drips, followed by:
> - flat 6 bar for light roasts
> - flat 9 bar for dark roasts
> has worked really well for both. Yet other beans respond really well to the x-profile.


How do you change to another pressure mid-shot img?


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> How do you change to another pressure mid-shot img?


 Profile 2 = constant 2 bar. Profile 3 = constant 6 bar. Profile 4 = constant 9 bar.

Set profile 2, start the shot, wait for 1st drip in cup, stop shot.

Set profile 3 (or 4 dependent on roast level) start shot. Wait for desired weight, stop the shot, enjoy


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Nicknak said:


> So I guess , you can try lots of different pressures all from the LCD screen instead of keep adjusting the OPV on a normal E61 ?
> 
> Has anyone done/ tried a lever profile similar to an LR ?
> 
> A side by side would be interesting..


 Yep that's where this machines strengths lie, plus you can decrease temp for dark roasts or increase for light roasts.

If people do 'settle on one profile' it seems to be lever profile. That's what the x profile is based on.

As for side by side I've never had a lever so can't comment on how similar they taste.


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Nicknak said:


> A side by﻿ side would be interesting..


 @coffeechap is your lever man, ever done one? Next forum day maybe?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

igm45 said:


> Profile 2 = constant 2 bar. Profile 3 = constant 6 bar. Profile 4 = constant 9 bar.
> 
> Set profile 2, start the shot, wait for 1st drip in cup, stop shot.
> 
> Set profile 3 (or 4 dependent on roast level) start shot. Wait for desired weight, stop the shot, enjoy


 Bianca is a a it cheaper if your gonna use the V that way. I used to bye, I just found it a slightly strustrating way to achieve on the fly adjustments


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

igm45 said:


> Profile 2 = constant 2 bar. Profile 3 = constant 6 bar. Profile 4 = constant 9 bar.
> 
> Set profile 2, start the shot, wait for 1st drip in cup, stop shot.
> 
> Set profile 3 (or 4 dependent on roast level) start shot. Wait for desired weight, stop the shot, enjoy


 Bianca is a a it cheaper if your gonna use the V that way. I used to bye, I just found it a slightly strustrating way to achieve on the fly adjustments


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Mrboots2u said:


> Bianca is a a it cheaper if your gonna use the V that way. I used to bye, I just found it a slightly strustrating way to achieve on the fly adjustments


 I don't doubt it is a workaround.

I realise the Bianca can do that, for me the V's strength still remains in its flexibility. It can do that _and _it can repeat a complex pressure profile with the flick of a lever whilst you prepare milk (or biscuits, or cake, God I love food)


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## Stevebee (Jul 21, 2015)

DavecUK said:


> Pro tip: I always raise the lever just before the pump stops and add a couple of seconds to the last phase of the profiles to cater for this.


 This is what I use all the time, lever profile, aim to stop shot at 44s but programmed for 52 seconds.

No soggy pucks- dry as a bone.


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## tohenk2 (Oct 11, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> How do you change to another pressure mid-shot img?


 It is surprisingly simple: start the shot with profile X as you normally would - and then just tap the display (bottom-righthand corner) to select the profile you want to switch to.

(You even can tap the display in advance and still start with the first preset profile.)

For example a Slayer-style shot:

Put a 90sec 2 Bar on profile 1. (Or 7 steps of 90 sec 2 Bar, doesn't matter for the example).

Put some 90sec 8Bar steps in profile 2.

Select profile 1, start the shot, tap the display (bottom-righthand corner) and when the coffee starts to be visible select profile 2.

(If you want you can even switch back to profile 1 at the end).


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

tohenk2 said:


> It is surprisingly simple: start the shot with profile X as you normally would - and then just tap the display (bottom-righthand corner) to select the profile you want to switch to.
> 
> (You even can tap the display in advance and still start with the first preset profile.)
> 
> ...


 Being pedantic here. But the water debit for a slayer pre infusion or needle valve is signifantly less than a V at 2 bar.

Getting into the flow v pressure profile debate and you can argue they achieve no different results in the cup but mechanically are doing different things to the puck over those seconds.

Somewhere on my V thread I measured the lowest water, debit I got. I had changed the jet at this point too.

I couldn't get it near the 1.5 ml a second flow of the slayer.


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## tohenk2 (Oct 11, 2017)

Mrboots2u said:


> Being pedantic here. But the water debit for a slayer pre infusion or needle valve is signifantly less than a V at 2 bar.
> 
> Getting into the flow v pressure profile debate and you can argue they achieve no different results in the cup but mechanically are doing different things to the puck over those seconds.
> 
> ...


 Thanks, I have never measured the debit of either. (But then again, I think the "style" is the same, if not the actual precise quantities?)


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Mrboots2u said:


> Being pedantic here. But the water debit for a slayer pre infusion or needle valve is signifantly less than a V at 2 bar.
> 
> Getting into the flow v pressure profile debate and you can argue they achieve no different results in the cup but mechanically are doing different things to the puck over those seconds.
> 
> ...


 How exactly did you measure the debit?


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## Les996 (Jan 8, 2019)

DavecUK said:


> On any declining pressure profile, there is the potential for soggy pucks and especially if you let the pump stop...*then* raise the lever to depressurise the basket (I am sure you probably do this most of the time). Doing this doesn't properly vent the basket (physics).
> 
> Pro tip: I always raise the lever just before the pump stops and add a couple of seconds to the last phase of the profiles to cater for this.


 Many thanks @DavecUK I always stop the shot short of the profile, something I found out in the early stages of getting the 'V' but I will try raising the pressure at the tail end as that makes a lot of sense. I suppose because I'm getting such a great flavour I've just excepted it...always good to have a play with the 'V' though! GREAT MACHINE ?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

I'm still interested in how the minimum water debit figures were measured.


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## Les996 (Jan 8, 2019)

kennyboy993 said:


> You probably have tried this Les - though for me soggy pucks went away when I went back to stock shower screen


 Thanks @kennyboy993 I don't have a stock screen as only came with IMS. I will try Dave's suggestion and see how it goes. I did see you had changed on previous posts, could you not find remedy at all with the IMS?


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Planter said:


> Great review from a personal perspective. I want to see some pics of the new wood though.


What machine you running these days@planter?


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## Planter (Apr 12, 2017)

Currently using a mates LR as he is working in the middle East for a couple months and told me to try it. Gives me a chance to have a think on what I actually want. Still not got a clue but the LR is good and easy.


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Planter said:


> Currently using a mates LR as he is working in the middle East for a couple months and told me to try it. Gives me a chance to have a think on what I actually want. Still not got a clue but the LR is good and easy.


So you may be able to answer@nicknak question...

In the cup how does the V lever profile compare to the real McCoys?


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Planter said:


> Currently using a mates LR as he is working in the middle East for a couple months and told me to try it. Gives me a chance to have a think on what I actually want. Still not got a clue but the LR is good and easy.


So you may be able to answer@nicknak question...

In the cup how does the V lever profile compare to the real McCoys?


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Les996 said:


> Thanks @kennyboy993 I don't have a stock screen as only came with IMS. I will try Dave's suggestion and see how it goes. I did see you had changed on previous posts, could you not find remedy at all with the IMS?


I couldn't get going with it Les - it was easy to clear residual coffee though other than that it created soggy pucks and 80% of the time they stuck to screen.

Went back and all is good


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Just out of interest what are people using as a lever profile now.

Given the l1 profile is different to a lr profile etc etc.


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## Planter (Apr 12, 2017)

igm45 said:


> So you may be able to answer@nicknak question...
> 
> In the cup how does the V lever profile compare to the real McCoys?


In all fairness not too badly at all. The V is a great machine for being able to manipulate or mimic what you want.

I'm not putting myself on a pedestal and saying I know everything there is to know but it worked well for me. And allowed me to experiment and learn more about what I did or didn't like as much.

The whole lever profile was always a preference for me. And I must admit it is nice and simple using a lever to get what you are after.


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> I couldn't get going with it Les - it was easy to clear residual coffee though other than that it created soggy pucks and 80% of the time they stuck to screen.
> 
> Went back and all is good


I've avoided installing mine due to your findings.

To save me from giving it a go, when you were getting soggy pucks, was that after finishing at a low or high pressure?


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

igm45 said:


> I've avoided installing mine due to your findings.
> 
> To save me from giving it a go, when you were getting soggy pucks, was that after finishing at a low or high pressure?


Both matey - sometimes even when I overdosed too


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> Both matey - sometimes even when I overdosed too


 Cheers, I shan't bother then ?


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## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Just a quick follow up,

This machine has really sold itself to me. Most of the time I find that I stick to the 'X profile' and that produces tasty shots.

Recently I had a bean that I just could not get a tasty shot on this profile, trial and error ensued. When all else failed I gave it a go with my take on a 'traditional e61' profile.

Wow, completely different taste, could scarcely believe it was the same bean. Really impressed! ?


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## PaulL (May 5, 2014)

I once went into a bike shop wheel-in-hand trying not to swear at how tight a particular tyre/rim combination was, I had snapped levers and on one ride given up after 30 mins and called the team car (sic). The manager took a tyre off by hand and put it back on in front of me and it was a salutory lesson in technique.

With that contect all machines I had previously owned had a preferred personal technique and I have had 1, 2 and 3 hole steam tips. The Vesuvius 4 hold tip is the fastest I have ever used and I was aware of the criticism of the wand before buying. Cue DaveC calling in in my first week and 20 seconds later perfect milk. He should probably put up one of his typical videos as his approach has stood me in good stead ever since.


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## Rom (Jan 20, 2017)

@igm45

I'm loving that new wood mate, very, very classy ??

I never put any steam through the steam a so it's interesting that it has it limitations..

but on the whole I said at the time that I already thought I was drinking amazing coffee (from my ECM / Royal combo) but when I got the V and the Mythos I found out I was actually only drinking good coffee. Nice to see it's working for you too ?


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## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

Just picked up a V, reading all these old threads for the first time.

@igm45 your first 24 hours mirrors mine exactly, I think this is a very fair/familiar impression.

Who's good for new wood nowadays? @Nicknak are you still in the game? ?


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## Planter (Apr 12, 2017)

catpuccino said:


> Just picked up a V, reading all these old threads for the first time.
> @igm45 your first 24 hours mirrors mine exactly, I think this is a very fair/familiar impression.
> Who's good for new wood nowadays? @Nicknak are you still in the game?


Nick is definitely your man for wood. 

Sent from my LYA-L09 using Tapatalk


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## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

catpuccino said:


> Just picked up a V, reading all these old threads for the first time.
> 
> @igm45 your first 24 hours mirrors mine exactly, I think this is a very fair/familiar impression.
> 
> Who's good for new wood nowadays? @Nicknak are you still in the game? ?


 Yes still here, PM me when you want ..


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## Jony (Sep 8, 2017)

I would say @joey24dirt


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Reignited my recent desire for a Vesuvius.

I'm definitely into function over aesthetics any day of the week!

I may take the plunge 'again' shortly?!


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## Jony (Sep 8, 2017)

Be quick with only 3 machines left at the shocking cheap price


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## tohenk2 (Oct 11, 2017)

aesthetics ... beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I quite like the V.


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## John Yossarian (Feb 2, 2016)

I have had the V for almost a month now. It was a step change in terms of taste. I greatly enjoy the coffee and the process of making it.

One niggling thing I have been observing the last few days (most likely I have not paid enough attention before) is the fact that the temperature of the brew boiler drops from 94 deg C to 93 or even 92 during brewing, i.e. when brewing about 40 ml at very low flow rate. The machine has usually been on for almost 40 minutes before a shot and I assume that this should be enough to have PID taking care of a constant 94 deg C. I am surprised by this observation and I have tried to look for/find an explanation. As I am not using steam the service/steam boiler is permanently off. One of the schemes made by DavecUK when reviewing the Vesuvius prototype shows a pipe coming from the pressure transducer, passing through the heat exchanger in the service/steam boiler and entering the brew boiler afterwards. In my case with the steam boiler at room temperature the water coming to the brew boiler is not pre-heated up and thus reduces the boiler temperature. I still find this surprising as I pull ca. 40 ml to 800 ml boiler at 107 deg C (with the 13 deg C offset).

Is my line of thinking right or should I look for another explanation of the temperature drop during a shot?

Should I reduce the range of PID from 3 to 2 or 1?

Another question, more out of curiosity, is how do you do firmware update? My V. is v.17 and I do not feel the urge of changing/doing anything but I suspect people have been bringing their machines up to date so far. I cannot see any USB port to do it but to be honest I have not looked.

Thanks for chipping in!

Cheers,

John


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Nothing functionally has changed with firmware updates, no advantage to upgrading. I'm on a really early version.

Don't worry about the temp the sensor shows during the shot, shot temp is rock steady to what you set. Temp sensor is near cold inlet. Group takes water from top and bottom thiemrd of boiler (gold std for E61 dual boiler machines).

I had a vested interest in ensuring the temp setup and tuning of the was v good as I have one.

Firmware update requires a main board flash and some expensive kit from Gicar plus a display. The board has to be powered and flashed outside the machine with a device from Gicar and a display connected. I have such a device and the rest of the kit but not needed to use it yet.


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## John Yossarian (Feb 2, 2016)

DavecUK said:


> Nothing functionally has changed with firmware updates, no advantage to upgrading. I'm on a really early version.
> 
> Don't worry about the temp the sensor shows during the shot, shot temp is rock steady to what you set. Temp sensor is near cold inlet. Group takes water from top and bottom thiemrd of boiler (gold std for E61 dual boiler machines).
> 
> ...


 Thanks Dave.

The shots are great and I was simply wondering whether it was something more serious. I did some calculations and at 1000 W heating element it should take 3 ms to compensate the temperature difference due to the water not being pre-heated.

I do not fancy doing a firmware update ?

Cheers,

John


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

Not sure if this is the best thread to post in - but here goes;

Having just taken delivery of a new Vesuvius I may have a few questions as I come to grips with it. Just two for now

Firstly; how does this machine detect low water in the reservoir? I have had the "red screen" warning twice now, yet the tank has been around 2/3 full in both instances.

Secondly; what happens when the final phase of a profile finishes while the lever is still up? For instance, if my target weight is 38gm out, and the profile gets to the end when the weight is say 32gm, what is the machine actually doing once the profile finishes? Is there a default pressure for any run-on? Apologies if this is a dumb question. If this happens, then would i be right in thinking that the solution is to add time to one (or more) of the phases.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

RDC8 said:


> Not sure if this is the best thread to post in - but here goes;
> 
> Having just taken delivery of a new Vesuvius I may have a few questions as I come to grips with it. Just two for now
> 
> ...


 1. It's part of something I invented for the prosumer industry years ago with Quickmill, it's called "Last shot protection" (LSP)The system detects low water during he shot before the tank really is empty...so there is always enough water to complete the last shot. The Vesuvius then ensures the low water signal does NOT stop the shot has the full monty of LSP, as it also disables autofill activity.

This happens for a period of about 1 minute or so, after that it will stop the shot...safety protocol. So sometimes the low water warning comes up a short period after the shot, but even if you attempted another shot before that warning had time to show...the system won't let you start another shot until you have filled up.

If your reservoir is 2/3 full, the water level detection tube in the tank (has a little float thing and sensor on the end) may either be not fully in the tank, or some tube is inside the body of the machine and needs pulling through to the sensor sits lower.

2. The pump will stop. The way I make sure this is never a problem is to ensure the final phase is 5 or 10 seconds longer than I need.


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

Thanks

I'll make a point of checking the tubes next time it needs to be refilled.


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

Can I please check with anyone who has bough a new Vesuvius recently; - both the drip-tray and the cupwarmer shipped with mine are of a completely different design compared to that which I have seen on every video posted online. Image of drip tray attached. Is this the new standard?

Thanks in advance


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

RDC8 said:


> Can I please check with anyone who has bough a new Vesuvius recently; - both the drip-tray and the cupwarmer shipped with mine are of a completely different design compared to that which I have seen on every video posted online. Image of drip tray attached. Is this the new standard?
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> View attachment 60899


 It does seem they've moved away from the wire grid for a cleaner look.


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## GrahamSPhillips (Jan 29, 2021)

My V is about 18months old. I much prefer your drip tray not only for aesthetic reasons but also its a much better base for coffee scales. Hope you are loving the machine. I really struggled with mine at the start because there are so many options..I think I've sussed it now and love it.


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

GrahamSPhillips said:


> for aesthetic reasons


 Thanks.

I guess aesthetics are a matter of preference; I actually like the look of the "wire rack" - although I do take your point about stability issues for coffee scales.

What bugs me about the drip tray is the lack of a larger hole directly under the group-head venting tube. The discharge seems to hit the flat surface and creates a significant splatter. Given the length of the exhaust pipe it is a right PITA to wipe up. The drip tray on my Cellini has such a larger hole and I don't get half the mess!

You are right - lots of options with this machine! I am staying with P1 at the moment (which I believe is a typical lever profile). And I think I have finally sorted out the "Eco" settings!


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@RDC8 I agree a hole should be under the vent tube area....probably omitted it because the same tray is being used on Vesuvius Evo Leva and they thought it would not look as good. I have let Paolo know.


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## Paolo_Cortese (Jul 11, 2014)

Sorry as mentioned from Dave this tray was made for the Evo due of delay of one of our supplier and in order to ship also the standard Vesuvius we have used this metal ones. When we will receive the wire ones we will ship to our customers that have received the wrong tray

Paolo


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@RDC8 Don't forget to cut a square of (holey) grip mat and place it on the tray to keep it from scratching. You will see it used in a lot of my videos and photos, where I forgot to remove it for the photo.


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

DavecUK said:


> @RDC8 Don't forget to cut a square of (holey) grip mat and place it on the tray to keep it from scratching. You will see it used in a lot of my videos and photos, where I forgot to remove it for the photo.


 Do you mean the drip tray? or the cup warmer?

Grip mat for the cup warmer was one of the first things i did! Regret not doing with my Cellini six years ago, that is now quite scuffed on the warming tray (only cosmetic, but still annoying). Cups go on scales, which have rubber feet, not directly onto the drip tray. Would you still recommend a piece on non-slip mat?


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

ok - appreciate all the help in making the transition to the Vesuvius, it's a bit like learning to walk again.

Two more questions

1: warm-up time (mornings). I had a timer on the Cellini to give it an hour to warm up before breakfast coffee. Would this still be an appropriate amount of time for the Vesuvius?

2: Grind settings. This one perplexes me (perhaps I am over-thinking). On a standard machine running at a constant 9bar it is easy to see if the flow is too fast or too slow. With the pressure profile, I feel that all my usual cues may not be reliable. ie shot times can be longer (or shorter!) and flow rate is affected by pressure. So I guess I'm looking for some thoughts around how to determine if the grind size is "right" (yes, I know that taste is king, but any other thoughts around visual cues would be appreciated). Hope this makes sense.

Thanks in advance


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@RDC8 Unless you are super careful, I find it keeps trays in pristine condition. I always used it on review machines, so they would go back to the retailer in the same condition as I recieved them.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

RDC8 said:


> ok - appreciate all the help in making the transition to the Vesuvius, it's a bit like learning to walk again.
> 
> Two more questions
> 
> ...


 1. 35 min is fine

2. try and keep the preinfusion phase to around 10-12 seconds...grind will be OK, if you "just" see drips coming at the end of preinfusion.


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## Gagaryn (Oct 21, 2021)

RDC8 said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I guess aesthetics are a matter of preference; I actually like the look of the "wire rack" - although I do take your point about stability issues for coffee scales.
> 
> ...


 I've been watching this thread with interest as I have a Vesuvius on order. I think I prefer the look of the wire tray too, so good to hear that customers who receive the 'splashy' Evo tray due to supply constraints will receive the wire tray at some point. In the meantime...


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

Gagaryn said:


> as I have a Vesuvius on order


 Just a quick warning; I was almost scammed by a fraudulent email (not) from DHL wanting payment of HMRC customs duties. They had my mobile number, my email, provided a genuine tracking number (checked it on the real DHL site and it related to a consignment leaving Naples!) and the amount was ball-park. Suspicion aroused when the Waybill number didn't match the genuine consignment notification from DHL. The Bona fide request for customs duty arrived around 48hrs later. It pays to be alert.

I did notify the DHL fraud department (they have a dedicated email!) - not really expecting to hear anything back.


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## Gagaryn (Oct 21, 2021)

RDC8 said:


> Just a quick warning; I was almost scammed by a fraudulent email (not) from DHL wanting payment of HMRC customs duties. They had my mobile number, my email, provided a genuine tracking number (checked it on the real DHL site and it related to a consignment leaving Naples!) and the amount was ball-park. Suspicion aroused when the Waybill number didn't match the genuine consignment notification from DHL. The Bona fide request for customs duty arrived around 48hrs later. It pays to be alert.
> 
> I did notify the DHL fraud department (they have a dedicated email!) - not really expecting to hear anything back.


 Thanks, I'll remain vigilant. I had a spate of false requests for delivery fees a few months ago, all of which were obvious scams from the outset. Weird that the one you received included a tracking number originating from the same place as your pending order, but I presume that's how these scams work - send out thousands of emails and one might be coincidentally similar enough to a genuine purchase that the recipient pays. Glad you spotted it.


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## GrahamSPhillips (Jan 29, 2021)

Paolo_Cortese said:


> Sorry as mentioned from Dave this tray was made for the Evo due of delay of one of our supplier and in order to ship also the standard Vesuvius we have used this metal ones. When we will receive the wire ones we will ship to our customers that have received the wrong tray
> 
> Paolo


 Hi Paolo: I actually much prefer the Evo version: it looks far nicer plus on the wire version its really hard to use a coffee scale when pulling the shot because the wire grid makes an unstable base. Could you not simply cut a hole for the vent? Is so I'd like to order one for my Vesuvius! Thanks, Graham


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## GrahamSPhillips (Jan 29, 2021)

@RDC8 If you search in files there's a whole list of profiles in a pdf

Profiles.pdf


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

As an upside to putting a square of grip mat on the drip tray, the "splashy-ness" has been significantly reduced. It seems to have absorbed and re-distributed the impact of the water from the exhaust pipe.


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## hutchys (Feb 11, 2019)

RDC8 said:


> Just a quick warning; I was almost scammed by a fraudulent email (not) from DHL wanting payment of HMRC customs duties. They had my mobile number, my email, provided a genuine tracking number (checked it on the real DHL site and it related to a consignment leaving Naples!) and the amount was ball-park. Suspicion aroused when the Waybill number didn't match the genuine consignment notification from DHL. The Bona fide request for customs duty arrived around 48hrs later. It pays to be alert.
> 
> I did notify the DHL fraud department (they have a dedicated email!) - not really expecting to hear anything back.


 Hi,

Could you tell me how much import duty do you pay on this machine please?


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## Paolo_Cortese (Jul 11, 2014)

GrahamSPhillips said:


> Hi Paolo: I actually much prefer the Evo version: it looks far nicer plus on the wire version its really hard to use a coffee scale when pulling the shot because the wire grid makes an unstable base. Could you not simply cut a hole for the vent? Is so I'd like to order one for my Vesuvius! Thanks, Graham


 Yes I can already modified the actual model in order to use on the standard Vesuvius.


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## GrahamSPhillips (Jan 29, 2021)

Thanks @Paolo_Cortese could I order one please?


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## darkstefano (Jan 19, 2020)

Hello, someone use the Vesuvius with the Eureka Specialty grind? Does it work? Thanks


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

it will, but the Vesuvius will definitely reward more expensive grinders even more.


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## GrahamSPhillips (Jan 29, 2021)

FWIW Niche plus Vesuvius seems to work really well.. I think @DavecUK remains a big fan of the Niche!


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## GrahamSPhillips (Jan 29, 2021)

Hi @DavecUK been reading the thread on optimising the PID settings on the EVO .. Could you advise optimum settings on the Vesuvius? TIA!


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

GrahamSPhillips said:


> Hi @DavecUK been reading the thread on optimising the PID settings on the EVO .. Could you advise optimum settings on the Vesuvius? TIA!


 They are in the user guide I wrote.

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/vesuvius/vesuvius-evo-leva-online-userguide-t498.html


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## GrahamSPhillips (Jan 29, 2021)

DavecUK said:


> They are in the user guide I wrote.
> 
> https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/vesuvius/vesuvius-evo-leva-online-userguide-t498.html


 Sorry Dave I meant for the original Vesuvius (non lever)


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## Like Medium Strong Coffee (Feb 18, 2021)

@GrahamSPhillips I thought, for a moment, you're










????


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

GrahamSPhillips said:


> Sorry Dave I meant for the original Vesuvius (non lever)


 My bad, I quoted the wrong link

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/vesuvius/owners-manual-version-11-t122.html


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## rogher (Nov 22, 2020)

(sorry if this is a bit late, I'm a casual passer-by of this forum)

I have a Vesuvius and use three main profiles:

I have one 'flat' 9bar profile, that I use for setting-up. Because I am not loyal to one particular roast, I'm always changing my coffee and grind. Once I am 'about right' I shift to using two other profiles to take advantage of the machine's profiling ability:

I first use one at 2bar, rising after 15sec (or something like that) for pre-infusion. The time taken to get the first drips gives me a clue as to how well prepared everything was.

After the first drips come through, I stop and switch to my preferred profile (a modified form of what what the machine was supplied with). I then stop when I have the correct weight in my cup. The time that takes can vary, but it's also confirmation that things are not drifting too far. You can switch the profile 'on the fly' but I consider separate timings to provide better feedback.

I did plan to merge the pre-infusion with the main profile (one is waiting to be used) but have not made that part of my routine for the reasons above.

Note that there is a delay between what you program in (ask for) and the actual pressure provided (as shown on the display and what I assume to be 'coming out'). I took a video of the displayed pressures whilst the machine was operating and adjusted the settings to get closer to my target. The target were readings from another video of a lever machine in operation. In spite of such care, the actual pressures are sensitive to puck preparation but good enough for me at the moment...


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## GrahamSPhillips (Jan 29, 2021)

rogher said:


> (sorry if this is a bit late, I'm a casual passer-by of this forum)
> 
> I have a Vesuvius and use three main profiles:
> 
> ...


 Hi : yes that's very interesting.. I do somewhat similar plus I've adopted a couple of profiles recommended by others on the site.. which I tweak according to circumstances! Would be good to have the details of your profile and better still upload a video? BW Graham


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