# L1 Routine



## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

So after 7.5 years of faithful service from my Classic, I've realised my lever dream this week. Cheers to Lee @foundrycoffeeroasters.com for sorting us.

Where has this been all my life? Totally enamoured.

First four or five shots were really promising, although now it's started slipping and catching high, drawing only about 20g. I'm guessing the seals just need regreasing; there seemed to be plenty on there from the factory, but I've some loxeal on order now so I can put a fresh coat on.

Question is, have I broadly got this right in terms of a routine? Must have read just about every Londinium thread going over the past 12 months, so I'm just making sure I've got this straight in my head...

1. Fill water tank, switch on, allow boiler to come to temp/pressure.

2. Either leave for an hour for group to come to temp, or pull through the group for a few seconds.

3. Warm cup from tap.

4. Grind/basket prep/lock in PF.

6. Short steam vent, bring to pressure.

6. Preinfuse and pull the shot.

7. Unlock PF, flush group, and back to point 3.

Does that sound about right?


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## fluffles (Sep 4, 2012)

Pretty much matches what I do. In terms of heating the group by flushing water through, I seem to remember reading that 500ml was the recommended amount.


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## mathof (Mar 24, 2012)

fluffles said:


> Pretty much matches what I do. In terms of heating the group by flushing water through, I seem to remember reading that 500ml was the recommended amount.


Here are some instructions for heating the L1 group from cold that Reiss posted on the Londinium Forum:

"as soon as the boiler pressurises and the element turns off pull the lever down so water just trickles out until the pump turns on. stop the flush. let boiler repressurise after refilling completes. repeat this cycle 6 times and you will be ready to pull a shot."

Matt


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Seem to recall Reiss suggesting a short pull - around 60ml between shots to keep the thermosyphon circuit happy.


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

Cheers guys.

Yep, I'll pull with a quick brush of the screen after a shot for the TS.

Given that I'll probably stick with bottled water (very soft tap water), I might look at Wemo-ing an hour before I get up in the morning instead of the quick warm-up routine.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

Sounds fine.

Personally I tap the steam toggle to bring the boiler up to pressure, empty warm water from cup, then lock the PF when the boiler light clicks of and pull the lever but there isnt much in it.


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## Snakehips (Jun 2, 2015)

Fran,

I feel that the major factor in the 'high lever grab' on your new machine s going to be seals / lubrication.

Are you registered as an owner on the Londinium forum?

Once you are registered you will have access, via 'Support', to the 'Permanent File' within the Londinium Owners Forum.

There, currently on page 2, you will find a thread 'What determines when the lever grabs'. It's 12 pages long and maybe of interest to you.

On page 11 of that thread there is a post from Reiss in which he restates his willingness / desire to be contacted via FaceTime so that he can, virtually hands on, help to resolve 'high grab' / seal issues.

(Reiss has also posted instructional videos on the Owners Forum that cover seal changing.)

When I first had my L1 I had 3/4 hugely frustrating weeks experiencing nothing other than high grab' which resulted in poor 20g shots.

I resisted FaceTiming Reiss which may not have been such a good idea although I did have email contact and was given help.

Ultimately I resolved my own problem in away that I believe Reiss may well not endorse.

Once you get that lever grabbing at 45 degrees the L1 is a different beast and produces great coffee.


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## iroko (Nov 9, 2012)

Put It on a timer for for 1 hour before you get up , then I'ts ready to go as soon as you get up.


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## Yes Row (Jan 23, 2013)

Make sure your shower screen is not blocked/part blocked with Loxeal on the inside. This happened with mine when I first had it and resulted in short shots


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

Yes Row said:


> Make sure your shower screen is not blocked/part blocked with Loxeal on the inside. This happened with mine when I first had it and resulted in short shots


I've had a check and it looks alright. I drove down any excess grease when I fit the group head and wiped it off; however, I'm wondering if I might have taken a bit too much off and left the bore dry.

Gave a longer preinfusion / slightly coarser grind (as I went very fine very quickly) / lighter tamp a go, but I'm still seeing drip through from the start of the preinfusion, and then slip in the lever's grab.

Some loxeal on the way next week, will give that a go next. Thanks for the tips!


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## Yes Row (Jan 23, 2013)

If the machine is new surely it came with Loxeal?

However my guess is you need to regrease the cylinder but I'm not an expert

Reiss is very approachable!


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## Snakehips (Jun 2, 2015)

Was going to ask the same question re grease as new machines should ship with a tube.

Please keep us informed as to your progress on this. I for one will be interested in the outcome.


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

Ah, no I didn't get any loxeal with the delivery, just the water filter and spare seals.

The inside surface of the bore did seem quite dry, so will give it a wipe down and grease and see if that improves things.


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## NickR (Jul 1, 2011)

The high grabbing issue is really annoying. My perception is that the seals fitted in the factory are harder than the ones Reiss sells. Many new owners put up with this for a while then give up and sell their machines. I was nearly one of them. New seals, and a good lube, transforms the machine. I did mine well over a year ago and its still better than it was in my first few months of owner ship. Stick with it, its a great machine.


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

FranD said:


> Ah, no I didn't get any loxeal with the delivery, just the water filter and spare seals.
> 
> The inside surface of the bore did seem quite dry, so will give it a wipe down and grease and see if that improves things.


See you're in Manchester. I'm not far away - Preston. If you want any assistance, let me know. I've got some Loxeal grease too which I would strongly recommend.


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

The Systemic Kid said:


> See you're in Manchester. I'm not far away - Preston. If you want any assistance, let me know. I've got some Loxeal grease too which I would strongly recommend.


You're a star, much appreciated!

Hopefully I can nip this in the bud with a regrease, not particularly discouraged to be honest, well expected there to be a bedding in period.


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

So... my loxeal arrived today so I set about removing the group head and checking the inside of the bore. As I imagined, it was pretty dry, with most of the factory grease on the seals (not very evenly) rather than inside the cylinder. I put a generous amount of loxeal on the inside of the bore, both top and bottom, nutated the group head in and levered out the excess grease. I then fit my new IMS screen, switched on and did my routine.

The first shot, like the last couple of 'first shots', caught nicely but was a bit fast. I expected as much as I was running down a bean I'd opened up the grind for pulling on my Classic. That said, I was quite encouraged.

However, from the second shot onwards the lever started slipping again. As per the advice Reiss' gave me, I've lengthened the preinfusion to between 7-10secs to make sure the puck is soaked, but each time the skipping motion of the lever is quite pronounced, like it is slipping on something. See the not-very-good-video below:






For reference, this was 16.8g in (18g VST) with the grind tightened a couple notches finer than I would have it usually (E8 redspeed). WDT, following by nutate and light tamp with finger pressure.

Now, clearly I shouldn't be getting drips before the end of the preinfusion should I? This hasn't happened on every shot, but I've still had the skipping on shots that looked like they were going to be better.

I've tried going finer on the grind, but it's making distribution tricky as introduces some clumping. Moreover, I'd be surprised if this was the problem, as I've had reasonable pulls from coarser grinds in any case (as per the first above).

I can try replacing the seals, but before I do that, I'm wondering if this is likely to be down to poor basket prep?


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## forzajuve (Feb 2, 2011)

Are your seals fitted correctly? Mine came fitted backwards. Another issue could be lack of grease on the inside of the seals where they fit against the piston. Check out the video from Reiss on changing seals as a guide.


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## iroko (Nov 9, 2012)

Have you got a spare set seals, If so try fitting them to see If that helps. The original seals might be damaged.

As above check out video on londinium website.


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

How much did you pull into the cup - looks quite a lot.


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

About 35g, maybe a tad more with the drips. I've had as much as 50g on better pulls, and as short as 20g.

Seals are on correctly, not sure about how well greased they are. I've had a watch of the video in the event I change them (I've two spare sets now), but I want to make sure this just isn't user error first...


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Checking your vid, you lock the lever at 16secs, first drips appear around 21-22secs but you don't let the lever go until 31secs.

Try this: lock the lever for pre-infusion and let it go six secs later irrespective of whether any drips have hit the cup and see where the lever bites.


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

Gave it a shot... Pics of distribution after WDT and tamp first.









...and then the pull, with a six sec preinfusion.






Drips appearing pretty much instantly this time. Considered whether it might be the beans? I'm fourth week with these, although only opened today. Seems odd though that I can get the lever to grab once or twice but then not at all.


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

OK. Try 18grms in the VST and then try 19grms. Keep pre-infusion at 6 secs and let lever go. If drips appear before 6 secs is up, let lever go when first drip hits the cup.


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## Snakehips (Jun 2, 2015)

Patrick, just out of interest, as a long time L1 user have you ever experienced persistent high lever grabbing that IMHO effectively renders the L1 impotent?


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Snakehips said:


> Patrick, just out of interest, as a long time L1 user have you ever experienced persistent high lever grabbing that IMHO effectively renders the L1 impotent?


Not persistent but have experienced high grabs which were caused by distribution issues. Went to direct dosing using a brush to level grinds - OKish but not perfect.

For last few weeks, been trying a new approach. Now dosing into a cocktail tumbler. I put my palm over the top and give a good shaking to mix the grinds. Drop grinds into portafilter basket fitted with a Cofffecacha - tap on bench - and finish with light tamp. Dose is 19grms into 20grm VST. Brew ratio is always 1:2+. Pre-infusion is 9-10 secs and shot complete in 35-45 secs inc pre-infusion. Lever grabs at 45 degrees.

Here's the weird bit. Grind settings on EK are remaining more or less the same - 5 on the 3Fe dial. I've barely moved it over 10 different bean offerings - all are lightish roasts. Only thing that alters a bit is shot time but not by much. Shots have excellent depth and flavour and pours are very even (always use a naked).


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## Orangertange (Jul 4, 2013)

are you sure your grinding fine enough? Looks like the coffees pouring out on pre infusion, shouldn't even get a drip for at least a few seconds


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## Yes Row (Jan 23, 2013)

Yes Row said:


> Make sure your shower screen is not blocked/part blocked with Loxeal on the inside. This happened with mine when I first had it and resulted in short shots


Without sounding like a scratched record it may be Worthing checking this again


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## Snakehips (Jun 2, 2015)

The Systemic Kid said:


> Not persistent but have experienced high grabs which were caused by distribution issues. Went to direct dosing using a brush to level grinds - OKish but not perfect.
> 
> For last few weeks, been trying a new approach. Now dosing into a cocktail tumbler. I put my palm over the top and give a good shaking to mix the grinds. Drop grinds into portafilter basket fitted with a Cofffecacha - tap on bench - and finish with light tamp. Dose is 19grms into 20grm VST. Brew ratio is always 1:2+. Pre-infusion is 9-10 secs and shot complete in 35-45 secs inc pre-infusion. Lever grabs at 45 degrees.
> 
> Here's the weird bit. Grind settings on EK are remaining more or less the same - 5 on the 3Fe dial. I've barely moved it over 10 different bean offerings - all are lightish roasts. Only thing that alters a bit is shot time but not by much. Shots have excellent depth and flavour and pours are very even (always use a naked).


Thanks for that. Sounds like your routine involves everything bar doing the Hokey Cokey and turning around !!

Don't rule out the possibility that that might help


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

Cheers very much all for your advice. I gave Reiss a quick Skype last night and we tried a few things with the grind and preinfusion, he was very helpful.

Changed the seals this morning and the first three pulls have behaved much more as expected - touch wood! Not perfect shots, but certainly in the ballpark, and I can hopefully start to tinker with the dose and try narrow it down a bit more over the weekend.


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## Snakehips (Jun 2, 2015)

Great news.... enjoy!


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Snakehips said:


> Thanks for that. Sounds like your routine involves everything bar doing the Hokey Cokey and turning around !!
> 
> Don't rule out the possibility that that might help


*bar* the Hokey Cokey?? - that's an essential tip I picked up from MP


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## Snakehips (Jun 2, 2015)

FranD said:


> I gave Reiss a quick Skype last night and we tried a few things with the grind and preinfusion, he was very helpful.


Any key pointers that you would care to share?


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## FranD (Nov 25, 2015)

Snakehips said:


> Any key pointers that you would care to share?


Not specifically, but we focused on making sure that the lever skip wasn't down to factors determined by me, so we tried a number of variables, grinding finer, dosing up and pre-infusing for longer. We eventually decided upon replacing the seals, and then starting with a lower dose and working up while I familiarise myself with how the machine behaves.

Didn't help that I had to change bean halfway through, but I've got a kilo of Rave signature that I can use for my learning curve now.


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## MarkyP (Jan 10, 2013)

it's good to know that you're getting there... I know it can be a frustrating experience - when it happened to me we checked everything... including dismantling my K30 and sending t to @coffeechap to test!

A new set of seal and I have never looked back!


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## Thecatlinux (Mar 10, 2014)

The Systemic Kid said:


> Here's the weird bit. Grind settings on EK are remaining more or less the same - 5 on the 3Fe dial. I've barely moved it over 10 different bean offerings - all are lightish roasts. .


HAve most of these been from the same roaster ? As I have experienced similar with my IMM sub over the past few weeks


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Thecatlinux said:


> HAve most of these been from the same roaster ? As I have experienced similar with my IMM sub over the past few weeks


Mostly - but not all. Whilst making Mrs Systemic a flat white this morning, got distracted and didn't shake the grinds in the tumbler before dumping them into the portafilter. Result was a spritzer - first in months. Left me scratching my head until I realised I hadn't shaken the grinds.


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## NickR (Jul 1, 2011)

Sounds like your getting there. Just a point, when you blow some steam off you want the red light to come on and the boiler pressure to reach its max point before pulling the shot. This gives max pressure during pre infusion, I find this helps a lot, particularly when pulling multiple shots.


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