# Single origin issues



## PreCoffeeCantankerousness (Dec 14, 2014)

Hi I'm having difficulty trying to get a drinkable single origin espresso.

I think the problem is down to not being able to grind fine enough. Can someone take a moment to check my experiments and conclusions and see if I'm on the right track or have missed something?

Thanks

*Set up*

La Pavoni Europiccola Millennium

porlex mini.

*Notes*: Upon recent purchase of this, my first espresso machine, I was able to get consistently good espresso using Steampunk Velos blend.

I then wished to experiment by purchasing a range of single origin beans from Steampunk and HasBean.

I have experienced nothing but disgusting, undrinkable coffee since.

I have done a lot of experiments and a lot of research since then.

First I had to learn how to better describe what was wrong with the taste.

To check for bitter vs sour I did the following:

Bitter:- I roughly ground some beans and left them in a cafetiere for an hour.

Sour - I made an espresso at a low (80C) temperature.

Now I could describe the taste I was getting as acidic and bright. Almost sour.

*The starting point* for the parameters I had established with the last set of beans were:

Temp: approx 85C This is the starting point on the group head. By the end of the pull I am reaching about 95C on the temperature strips.)

Dose: 13.5g ( in the double basket)

Tamp: Light

grind - finest setting

Results with single origins beans = Crema good. Taste incredibly bright/acidic.

Conclusion: Experiments to conduct vary tempoerature, tamp, dose.

Research indicates too bright a flavour can be countered by an increase in temperature, a decrease in dose, an increase in tamp pressure

*Todays experiments:*

*Test 1* - much higher temp temp = 95C start

parameters: Temp 95C, Dose:13.5g, tamp: lightest. Grind: Finest.

result 1 = bitter coffee

*Test 2* = a little higher temp = 90C start

parameters: Temp 90C, Dose:13.5g, tamp: lightest. Grind: Finest.

result = slightly less bright than 85C start. No hint of sourness.

*Conclusion* - slightly higher temperature better for brighter beans

*Test 3* - decrease dose from 13.5 to 12g

parameters: Temp 90C, Dose:12g, tamp: lightest. Grind: Finest.

result 3 = less bright at 1:2 ratio in 20 seconds. faster extraction time. more watery. little crema

At 1:3 ratio in 30 seconds was less bright and almost drinkable

*Test 4 *- increase dose to 16g

parameters: Temp 90C, Dose:16g, tamp: lightest. Grind: Finest.

result 4 = much brighter/acidic taste

*Conclusion*: lower dose subdues brighter beans

*Test 5*: return to best dose and tamp heavier to try to increase extraction time

parameters: Temp 90C, Dose:12g, tamp: heaviest. Grind: Finest.

result: little crema, not as fast an extraction time, less acidity. almost drinkable in terms of taste but on the watery side.

*Test 6*: lower dose to 10g

parameters: Temp 90C, Dose:10g, tamp: heaviest. Grind: Finest.

result: no crema, little acidity, little taste, very fast extraction 1:4 retraction ratio in 15 seconds

*Conclusions*:

lower dose = less brightness

too low a dose = little flavour

Higher temperature before turning bitter helps remove any hint of sourness

heavier tamp = slower extraction time

From previous experiments and research, a finer grind increases the extraction time to produce a smoother drink.

Therefore, for these single origin speciality beans I believe I would need to be able to grind finer to be able to extract any flavour without the brightness.

So&#8230; better grinder or have I missed something?


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Better grinder, for blend or single origin

then work on the rest,

the porlex isnt really suitable for espresso , especially not for a lever....


----------



## PreCoffeeCantankerousness (Dec 14, 2014)

OK thanks.

Can you suggest what would be a good starting point for a lever then?

Mignon perhaps?


----------



## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Mignon is OK but a bigger burr set grinder will do a better job.


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

How much cash do you have...

There may be other lever ones that can diagnose , temps and doses , techniques you should be pulling at

But in reality until you get something that is more adjustable and has a more consistent fine grind than a porlex you wont move the taste on a great deal .Mignon would be the minimum.

Second hand 64 mm gridner ( Sj etc ) would be better and around the same price as a new mignon


----------



## PreCoffeeCantankerousness (Dec 14, 2014)

The height seems to be the determining factor.

The sj is 61cm tall.

My cupboards give me only 41cm clearance.

Any mods you know of for a smaller basket? Preferably ones that don't involve cutting holes in my worktop or cupboards!


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

PreCoffeeCantankerousness said:


> The height seems to be the determining factor.
> 
> The sj is 61cm tall.
> 
> ...


Mini mazzerr with 64 mm burrs then any better Are the heights your mentioning without hopper>?


----------



## PreCoffeeCantankerousness (Dec 14, 2014)

the diagram on mazzers site showed 61cm including hopper


----------



## PreCoffeeCantankerousness (Dec 14, 2014)

mazzer mini is 47cm.

I can manage 45cm if I tilt the blender under the lip of the cupboard


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

PreCoffeeCantankerousness said:
 

> the diagram on mazzers site showed 61cm including hopper


camera lens hood mod will reduce that a lot


----------



## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Mazzer SJ without the hopper is 36.5cm. Lens hood is only about 4-5cm


----------



## PreCoffeeCantankerousness (Dec 14, 2014)

In trying to get away from the acidity, I tried a different bean today - a blend from Rave called 'The Italian Job'.

I set my defaults of 13.5g, medium tamp, finest grinder setting on the porlex, 8 second pre infusion.

The machine pretty much choked up taking a minute for a 1:1 (a second minute into another glass which I separately sampled and later added in got me to 1:2) so the porlex is too fine for this blend.

However, this is the first time I have encountered the robusta bean. Slightly bitter and with a lingering stench of burnt rubber which cannot be subdued by sugar and milk.

So I could make a coarser grind, tamp lighter & decrease the dose but I wonder if its even possible to get past it? For as long as I have this dreadful taste in my mouth I really don't even wish to try!

What does make me smile though is that I have got past all my coffees tasting acidic. It is possible!!!


----------



## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Coffee, if brewed properly, shouldn't taste acidic.


----------



## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

What Gary says...people confuse "acidic" (sharp, unpleasant, tart) with "acidity" (juicy, sweet, ripe fruit). Beans have neither attribute, until we mix them with water, then we blame the beans for what we have done to them.

If your Italian Job is too pungent at 1:1 but you're avoiding sharp/tart flavours, try cutting it with some hot water to dilute it (Americano/long black)...it won't make the Robusta taste like Arabica, but it can be OK in a longer drink.


----------



## PreCoffeeCantankerousness (Dec 14, 2014)

So acidity is not equal to acidic when describing taste.

I didn't know that. Thanks.

So, to clarify, a lot of the beans I have been using have been very acidic.

Also, I'm not blaming the previous batches of single origin beans for being acidic/sharp. I had reached the point where the limitations of my equipment, knowledge or technique were unable to extract the best out of the beans. I believed the weakest link in the equation was the blender which everyone else in the thread has also pointed to.

So I placed those beans in the freezer with a view to trying them again once I get another blender and seeing if I can detect a difference.


----------

