# Titus Grinders Decision



## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Hey all,

Hoping to get some advice. I currently own a niche zero with a DE1XXL, and I would like to upgrade to the so called endgame grinders.

I have been speaking to Frank at Titus, as his grinders are Europe based (I am English but living in Romania atm so I would prefer European options). He has been giving me info on the classic Titus grinder, the Nautilus and the Nimbus.

I was wondering if anyone here has any thoughts or advice on the decision of whether to buy the Titus, or buy a Nautilus or Nimbus?

I tend to drink light-medium roast espressos, sometimes darker (decaf daily), and I am experimenting with pour over/filter with the Decent, but that's not my main focus and may not remain part of daily drinking. I tend to drink an Allonge in the morning, then make my gf and I a latte each in the afternoon, then a couple of decaf allonges or espresso throughout the eve&#8230;

I'm looking to do this once and buy right first time, rather than the constant chopping and changing, would really appreciate any insight on which grinder might fit best&#8230;I am totally fine with the PSU and foot switch of the Nautilus/Nimbus as I have my setup on a cart where I can easily hide these.

I did look at the Bentwood as another European option, but after speaking to the Romanian distributor, the price comes out to not that much under the Nautilus.

Thanks so much in advance!


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## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

think you may struggle to get peoples opinions on this as there such a costly grinder,

only person i can think of who may have experience with them is @Denis S


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

This is an interesting topic. Luckily for me, in the day when I was one of those who had everything going, the Versalab M3 was about the most exotic grinder. There are lots of issues to consider. Firstly, what coffee do you drink? Iff you put milk in, then forget it! Next, are your taste buds so fine tuned that you would notice the difference between 15.03 and 15.23 grams. Some people can, a lot of people cannot. The Frank grinder you mention.......he takes a Versalab and makes it work, re-engineering it as he goes. From all accounts he makes a wonderful job of things, but at a cost.

Let us just say for arguments sake, grinder A costs 10k and is considered by many to be top of its game. Grinder B costs £1000. At what point do you say A is worth 9k more than B on taste and workflow? Are you just buying one because you can? If so, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that at all.

If I want something, I try to visit and see one in action and make my own mind up. If you ask for an opinion, be very careful what you listen to


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## pj.walczak (Sep 6, 2017)

I use Titus Nautilus with 98 mm SSP HU burrs.

It will be brilliant for this use case:

" drink *light*-medium roast espressos. " drink an Allonge in the morning, then make my gf and I a latte each in the afternoon"

It is very simple machine, think about EK43, but just designed for home and with high-end quality.

You might struggle however with dark roasted decaf. I would keep Niche for this, if budget allows.

If by any chance you are not happy with Nautlius, you can return it, just check with Frank under what terms.


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Thank you all for the advice! I particularly appreciate your insights @dfk41, wise words on listening to online opinions 

That is great to know @pj.walczak, and so cool that you have the Nautilus! I wasn't planning on keeping the Niche, but maybe I should&#8230;Frank says the Titus (the classic design like the Versalab), is more of an all rounder, and might be better for covering light roasts up to the darker decaf beans I drink&#8230;I also saw someone with 2 Nautilus with different burrs to cater for all these differences&#8230;

Part of me just wants to lump it all in, sell the Niche, and invest it all in buying the Titus and not needing anything else&#8230;


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## pj.walczak (Sep 6, 2017)

Titus (DRM) is very expensive.

For light roasted coffees, the SSP 98 HU burrs in Nautilus might be better then the DRM grinder.

Niche is good enough for decaf IMHO.

Good quality DRM is https://www.hedone.com/honne-home/. Much cheaper then Titus.


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Thanks @pj.walczak, I have seen the Honne online a bit...looking at them and the M4 alongside of the Titus. I have been doing a lot of research on the DRMs and I just can't seem to find anyone with a bad thing to say about them (I'm sure there is somewhere)...I tried to find some comparisons or articles discussing the differences or benefits of the DRMs over the flats, and vice versa...

Frank at Titus suggested that the DRMs are more of an allrounder, and the flats like the Nautilus more of a specific use...

I really would like to make this decision once (famous last words lol) and get my 'endgame' grinder....

The Titus costs 5 times as much as the Honne, but it is a beautiful machine and seems very well engineered...


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## pj.walczak (Sep 6, 2017)

well, just go for it 

If you have the budget, you will be happy. I had the Honne, (cheap version of Titus), and you are correct, no bad words about DRMs.


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

ha yes I think I need to go ahead and make a decision lol

I think what I'm trying to work out is why someone would go for a DRM over the flats and vice versa? I have read a lot of forums threads on them read articles, and watched some videos on YouTube...I read a very informative article on Home Barista that talked more about the different grinder styles however I haven't been able to discern too much regarding the difference in taste and 'mouthfeel' I could expect on the DRMs vs the flats.

I have noticed for instance on the Decent Diaspora, I think there are about 5 DRM users and the rest seems to be generally either the Niche, P64, or P100, etc...I guess I might just have to get a DRM and a flat and compare for myself! 😂


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

@pipedreams86 You are brave! You are about to spend a few thousand quid based on web based video reviews? Seriously?


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## Denis S (Jul 31, 2020)

dfk41 said:


> @pipedreams86 You are brave! You are about to spend a few thousand quid based on web based video reviews? Seriously?


 Didnt you do the same with the Evo Leva? come on, that's life.

You buy you use you like you keep, you dont like you sell. Welcome to hobby land.

Honne is much cheaper than the Titus Grinder that is probably 4-5k. Honne improved over the last years, they added extra features, a better non slippery belt, an back rotation spin at the end, and it is truly a single dose grinder. The later model is all black no more red and it looks better. So if you buy one at 1250 euro black friday or 1350 euro and you use it for 6-12 months and sell with some loose is not the end of the word. Why are you so scared of buying something?

A Titus grinder is 4-5k and if you try to sell it you gonna sell it at 50-60% max, so go figure the lost. Is the Titus grinder better than the Honne? on the long run might be, but out of the box dont think so. Both aligned, with good burrs, grinds light roasts too, easy to use, and max 0.1g retention and the most beautiful feature about all these drm grinders is the fact that you need almost no puck prep. It grinds in a donut shaped that is centered and you just tap once or twice and tamp pull.

On a grinder like lagom p64 or lagom p100, or ek43 or nautilus you will never be able to do that, even on darker roasts.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

@Denis S Nope! I did not do that with the Evo. I was in on the the Evo project right from the start although I had absolutely no input into its design etc. I did not ask a bunch of randoms for their opinion on kit they might own! There is a big difference.

*You buy you use you like you keep, you dont like you sell. Welcome to hobby land.*

Yep, some of us do, whereas some folks think they are going straight for an end game bit of kit. When I used to get new kit, if I did not like it and lost ,one, I just pretended that I had rented it......


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Thank you so much again @Denis S for your insights! I had seen the same thing about puck prep/the donut grinds...I think I will try the DRM and see how they work for me, and perhaps try flats in the future. I have emailed Hedonne for more info so will see where that goes

@dfk41I would much rather be able to see these machines in person and try them, and indeed Frank invited me to come to his workshop and try them out and learn more, however living in Romania makes that a little hard right now, and I don't have immediate plans to drive home to the UK, so having to base a lot of this online for now. I figure like Denis says, if I buy well I can try things out and sell on anything I don't get on with.

I was speaking to someone who was selling their Titus DRM on Kaffee-netz last night, and I just missed it; they had already sold it for only a few hundred euros under the 'retail' price he had originally paid for it, after 8 months of use.


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Thought I would come back to let you all know what I decided, I have ordered the Honne grinder and it will be delivered tomorrow. I am looking forward to trying out the DRMs! I figured it was a cheaper way to get into the DRMs and see how they fit my tastes and workflow, and I can always move up to the Titus if I enjoy the Honne and feel the upgrade itch.

Thanks all for your insights and advice!


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## pj.walczak (Sep 6, 2017)

Let us know how it works (photos and videos are mandatory). Enjoy!


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

pj.walczak said:


> Let us know how it works (photos and videos are mandatory). Enjoy!


 thanks, I will be back shortly with some photos, videos and hopefully experiences of a good espresso!

It was 1250 euros but 10% discount atm for Black Friday...that's with all the new features/upgrades they have added, I don't believe they sell it without those now...


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

pipedreams86 said:


> thanks, I will be back shortly with some photos, videos and hopefully experiences of a good espresso!
> 
> It was 1250 euros but 10% discount atm for Black Friday...that's with all the new features/upgrades they have added, I don't believe they sell it without those now...


 I think a few times a year they sell at the discounted price including on a particular forum.


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

So it appears I spoke too soon, tomorrow the Black Friday orders open and they will then start shipping grinders based on the order of payments received...doesn't seem like it'll be too long of a wait either way but incase anyone was thinking to order one in the Black Friday sale it would be good to get your order in and paid as soon as you can.


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Got the order placed successfully today, and I must have been one of the early orders as Diana from Hedone just let me know that it will be shipping Monday so I should have it Tuesday/Wednesday&#8230;will be back with some photos and thoughts once I start to use it


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Managed to snag a Levercraft Ultra which should be incoming this week along with the Honne, looking forward to starting the taste testing process! Thanks all for the insights and help to get to this point


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## Nightrider_1uk (Apr 26, 2020)

dfk41 said:


> I just pretended that I had rented it......


 🤣🤣🤣 Love it; Great philosophy.


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

The Honne arrived today! Will be setting it up this evening, thought I'd try some of Hedone's coffee too,


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## Denis S (Jul 31, 2020)

pipedreams86 said:


> The Honne arrived today! Will be setting it up this evening, thought I'd try some of Hedone's coffee too,
> 
> View attachment 61077


 That was fast. Please keep us updated with some pictures with the new model, how it grinds, how you like it.


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## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Oohhhhh i nearly got one of these


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Just got it setup and did a few grinds, my first thoughts are that it is super quiet when not grinding and super loud when grinding which confirms some of the reviews I had read. It is reassuringly heavy & solid, the grounds were fluffy and I didn't find one clump. The donut shape as the the grounds mound up in the portafilter is awesome and the few test pucks I made didn't seem to need any wdt at all. It's too late here for me to get too caffeinated so will do more testing and dialling in tomorrow.

Good job that I have a set of shelves coming tomorrow to go next to the table, as the Ultra should appear here soon and I'm running out of space


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Denis S said:


> That was fast. Please keep us updated with some pictures with the new model, how it grinds, how you like it.


 Will do! Impressed so far, excited to get some taste testing started properly tomorrow...thanks so much for all your help and insight getting me here Denis and all!


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## Denis S (Jul 31, 2020)

It looks really good. Get some anti-vibration pads for it, it will reduce 30-40% of the noise.

I think saw these at the guys with Honne, it's from dedeman (the store in Romania), but you can also find something similar:


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Denis S said:


> It looks really good. Get some anti-vibration pads for it, it will reduce 30-40% of the noise.
> 
> I think saw these at the guys with Honne, it's from dedeman (the store in Romania), but you can also find something similar:
> 
> View attachment 61103


 Oh cool, I am actually headed to Dedeman in Oradea tomorrow morning so I will make sure to grab some of these!


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## Viernes (Dec 10, 2011)

pipedreams86 said:


> Just got it setup and did a few grinds, my first thoughts are that it is super quiet when not grinding and super loud when grinding which confirms some of the reviews I had read. It is reassuringly heavy & solid, the grounds were fluffy and I didn't find one clump. The donut shape as the the grounds mound up in the portafilter is awesome and the few test pucks I made didn't seem to need any wdt at all. It's too late here for me to get too caffeinated so will do more testing and dialling in tomorrow.
> 
> Good job that I have a set of shelves coming tomorrow to go next to the table, as the Ultra should appear here soon and I'm running out of space


 The noise while grinding I would say it must be equal for those grinders - VL, Titus and Honne. It's that kind of design.

No need to WDT. It will be probably worse.

Your honne right now looks very nice. Also your cart. So cool. Congrats.


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

BilliumB said:


> Looking good. Did it come with the dosing funnel and the controller to reverse the spin direction to minimise retention?
> 
> Cheers Bill


 Yes it came with both Bill, the anti retention reverse is pretty cool, keeps taking me by surprise at the end of grinding atm!

I wanted to clean the funnel before mounting it, and thought how much can it really be needed? So I did some test grinds while it was drying and as beans and half grounds flew everywhere I realised it's pretty important lol


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## pipedreams86 (Mar 12, 2021)

Viernes said:


> The noise while grinding I would say it must be equal for those grinders - VL, Titus and Honne. It's that kind of design.
> 
> No need to WDT. It will be probably worse.
> 
> Your honne right now looks very nice. Also your cart. So cool. Congrats.


 Thank you! I will get a video of it grinding into the portafilter later


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

pipedreams86 said:


> So it appears I spoke too soon, tomorrow the Black Friday orders open and they will then start shipping grinders based on the order of payments received...doesn't seem like it'll be too long of a wait either way but incase anyone was thinking to order one in the Black Friday sale it would be good to get your order in and paid as soon as you can.


 So what do think of the honne?


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