# Coffee Steamers



## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

I'm considering buying a coffee steamer, although there doesn't seem to be many to pick from the most common one on sale been the Dualit Cino at around £200 ish.

Anybody had any experience of using one or any information regarding them or there reliability?

It would be used along with my moka pot and for the kids hot chocolate.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Wuyang said:


> I'm considering buying a coffee steamer, although there doesn't seem to be many to pick from the most common one on sale been the Dualit Cino at around £200 ish.
> 
> Anybody had any experience of using one or any information regarding them or there reliability?
> 
> It would be used along with my moka pot and for the kids hot chocolate.


 Available from Nisbetts, for £186 and free delivery.

https://www.nisbets.co.uk/dualit-cino-milk-steamer/cn452?vatToggle=incvat

I must admit to being curious how good it is, definitely feed back on how you find it and some typical milk steaming times/volumes.

Might make a nice pairing with a machine like the ECM Puristika.....


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Same here. I wonder how it works and how good it is. It could even be a good pair to a single boiler machine.


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## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

The only thing I know about that Dualit is they use one in Wagamamas at Gatwick airport.

....another fine forum contribution I think you'll agree.


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## hhgclark (Oct 2, 2016)

This is the kind of content I'm here for.



catpuccino said:


> The only thing I know about that Dualit is they use one in Wagamamas at Gatwick airport.
> 
> ....another fine forum contribution I think you'll agree.


 Check out James Hoffman's "No machine required" video. It covers a few options and their pros and cons.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

It doesn't cover the Dualit Cino at all?


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

Well...I do own a classic and enjoy a latte and I believe I'm not too bad at making a decent ish one, but I'm enjoying the flavour of my moka and microwaved milk more. I could steam the milk using my classic, but I fancy buying a single item that hopefully does the job well. From what I've read they heat up in a couple of minutes so would suit me fine....so tempted.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Wuyang said:


> Well...I do own a classic and enjoy a latte and I believe I'm not too bad at making a decent ish one, but I'm enjoying the flavour of my moka and microwaved milk more. I could steam the milk using my classic, but I fancy buying a single item that hopefully does the job well. From what I've read they heat up in a couple of minutes so would suit me fine....so tempted.


 Go for it....


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Wuyang said:


> Well...I do own a classic and enjoy a latte and I believe I'm not too bad at making a decent ish one, but I'm enjoying the flavour of my moka and microwaved milk more. I could steam the milk using my classic, but I fancy buying a single item that hopefully does the job well. From what I've read they heat up in a couple of minutes so would suit me fine....so tempted.


 The alternative to this is one made by QuickMill. It does however looks like the right hand side of a dual boiler machine.... 3x as much too! £580!

https://www.coffeeitalia.co.uk/quick-mill-foamer-mod-0961.html

if this works well (can't see why not) this is the best of both worlds in a way, to the point that, if you ever want to upgrade your coffee machine, all you need is something which makes good coffee, without the need to look into DB or HX territory!


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## hhgclark (Oct 2, 2016)

DavecUK said:


> It doesn't cover the Dualit Cino at all?


 My bad, read steamer but thought frother. 🤦‍♂️

Ignore me.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

hhgclark said:


> My bad, read steamer but thought frother. 🤦‍♂️
> 
> Ignore me.


 OK...


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

Back in stock on 16th. Think I might treat myself.


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## lee1980 (Jul 25, 2017)

Browsing costco saw this if member cheaper, or can get online membership in stock to.

https://www.costco.co.uk/Appliances/Small-Kitchen-Appliances/Coffee-Coffee-Capsules/Dualit-Cafe-Cino-Milk-Steamer-84850/p/252780


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## Deidre (Aug 13, 2019)

@Wuyang Have you seen these milk steamers? Would pair nicely with your moka pot. ☺☕(Shipping costs from Indonesia might be costly?🤷‍♀️)


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

Deidre said:


> @Wuyang Have you seen these milk steamers? Would pair nicely with your moka pot. ☺☕(Shipping costs from Indonesia might be costly?🤷‍♀️)
> 
> View attachment 42768


 Yes.......looks great....I could knock one up in garage with some copper tubing and a plumbing isolation valve, I was tempted, but I splashed out......and it's just arrived.....not tried it yet though.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

Not tried it yet.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)




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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)




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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Video or it didn't happen....how long can it take to heat the water...it's a thermocock innit?


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Video or it didn't happen....how long can it take to heat the water...it's a thermocock innit?


 Haven't had time to try at moment......will update.


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## -Mac (Aug 22, 2019)




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## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

Oh it looks neater next to the Classic than I thought it would.

..not to undermine my aforementioned experience of the machine....where, I did forget the mention, they combine it with a commercial nespresso machine...an Aguilla 440 I believe.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Too many breaks and subtle edits...also never showed the wand tip when purging....so I'm waiting to see @Wuyang video and full report. I'm even thinking of taking one for the team and buying one.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Too many breaks and subtle edits...also never showed the wand tip when purging....so I'm waiting to see @Wuyang video and full report. I'm even thinking of taking one for the team and buying one.


 Video......I'm the least technical person I know.

It's a one hole steam tip. The machine heats up very quickly 1-2 mins at a guess. I'll time when I next use. After cleaning the necessary bits I tried steaming just a small amount of milk....220ml. It comes with three water filters that attach to the filling container....it advises these should be changed monthly for heavy use and once every two months for less use.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)




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## Deidre (Aug 13, 2019)

Wuyang said:


> Video......I'm the least technical person I know


 If you knew me, you wouldn't be able to make that claim!😂😂😂


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Wuyang said:


> View attachment 42807


 Excellent! Good stuff. Let us know how it goes. Also, at least a few photos of the latte art would be great! 🙂


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Video or it didn't happen....how long can it take to heat the water...it's a thermocock innit?


 I think from what I read it's a thermoblock.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Too many breaks and subtle edits...also never showed the wand tip when purging....so I'm waiting to see @Wuyang video and full report. I'm even thinking of taking one for the team and buying one.


 30 day return I believe.


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## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

Wuyang said:


> It's a one hole steam tip.


 What's the thread? Be curious if this could be changed.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

catpuccino said:


> What's the thread? Be curious if this could be changed.


 Maybe 8mm?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

catpuccino said:


> What's the thread? Be curious if this could be changed.


 It probably won't work if you do, the old thermocock or small steam boiler instant heaters need quite a restrictive tip.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Too many breaks and subtle edits...also never showed the wand tip when purging....so I'm waiting to see @Wuyang video and full report. I'm even thinking of taking one for the team and buying one.


 Heated up ready time was 47 seconds.


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## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

DavecUK said:


> It probably won't work if you do, the old thermocock or small steam boiler instant heaters need quite a restrictive tip.


 Could be yeah, depending on the stock tip a smaller diameter 2 or 3 hole might be interesting to try.

I'd seen WPM's branded version, thought it was a clone/rebadge but it seems they've got a lot going on:

https://www.duefratellicoffee.co.uk/product/wpm-ms-130t-milk-steamer/?gclid=Cj0KCQjw0rr4BRCtARIsAB0_48NTc_V3LGJxjP6Zkk_Is816ZyFHC_NrY7bpkh5csiSOCCtRqHMk03EaAv11EALw_wcB


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@Wuyang So what happened, is it any good, how fast does it steam 200ml of milk......It's been a few weeks now?

I still need to know if I should buy one or not.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> @Wuyang So what happened, is it any good, how fast does it steam 200ml of milk......It's been a few weeks now?
> 
> I still need to know if I should buy one or not.


 Hello Dave,

I'll time it for you.

I bought it to steam milk for my moka pot, but at the minute I just use it for steaming milk for the kids and wife's hot chocolate.

I generally pour my moka coffee into half a mug of microwaved milk and it's lovely, however steaming the milk and adding it to the coffee doesn't tase half as good. It does taste better if you add the coffee into the steam milk and don't add too much air.

The machine heats up incredible fast, think I mentioned 40 something seconds from cold. It has plenty of power, I can't compare to espresso machines as I've only used a couple. For home use there's plenty of power on tap. I would certainly recommend one for gaggia classic owners etc as it does the job well, doesn't take up much kitchen space and it i heats up ridiculously quick and with a bit of practice I should imagine you could make great micro foam.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Wuyang said:


> Hello Dave,
> 
> I'll time it for you.
> 
> ...


 Do you have anything with a little more detail, where I can relate it back.

e.g. time to steam 400ml of water from room temp to 75C, something like that...so a comparison can easily be done?


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Do you have anything with a little more detail, where I can relate it back.
> 
> e.g. time to steam 400ml of water from room temp to 75C, something like that...so a comparison can easily be done?





DavecUK said:


> Do you have anything with a little more detail, where I can relate it back.
> 
> e.g. time to steam 400ml of water from room temp to 75C, something like that...so a comparison can easily be done?


 I'll get back to you later with some figures.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Wuyang said:


> I'll get back to you later with some figures.


 Thanks


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Thanks


 Switch on to ready.......47 seconds

Temperature ...... 17.5 Celsius to 75 Celsius........400ml water .........1 minute 13 seconds


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Wuyang said:


> Switch on to ready.......47 seconds
> 
> Temperature ...... 17.5 Celsius to 75 Celsius........400ml water .........1 minute 13 seconds


 Sounds pretty good, thanks for testing....If I buy one and it doesn't foam milk well....I'll blame you!


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## Stevebee (Jul 21, 2015)

Wuyang said:


> Switch on to ready.......47 seconds
> 
> Temperature ...... 17.5 Celsius to 75 Celsius........400ml water .........1 minute 13 seconds


 Not as bad as I thought. My L1 took 1 minute 4 secs for the same qty of water to 75, although with milk I don't go above 65 so will obviously be quicker for that.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Stevebee said:


> Not as bad as I thought. My L1 took 1 minute 4 secs for the same qty of water to 75, although with milk I don't go above 65 so will obviously be quicker for that.


 Your milk will be at 4C it's why I asked from room temp (17-21 ish or whatever the tap is) and 400ml to 75C... I actually do start temp + 60C when I test machines to give me an easy consistent standard. The Dualit on my standard and his results, slips into the medium steamer class....which is not too bad.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

So that's all good... But what's the quality of the steam produced? And, more importantly, can the steam wand + tip produce good microfoam? That's more important than time, in my opinion. For instance, let's cite the stock Pavoni as an example: It will heat up the boiler and be ready for steam in a matter of over a couple of minutes (4 I think). However... It will heat up 235ml of milk from 4C to 65C in no time too... BUT.... Whatever it produces, with that stock 3 hole steam tip, is awful. The only solution, unless you are the Guru of latte art, is to source a single hole steam tip.

Personally, I'd like to see someone steaming milk and pouring into a cup of coffee. As per @Wuyang 's comment, I'd like to see that one day.😉



> with a bit of practice I should imagine you could make great micro foam.


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## stockportman (May 15, 2020)

Looks like WPM are doing an auto version too....

https://www.wpm.hk/en/products.php?c1id=91


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> So that's all good... But what's the quality of the steam produced? And, more importantly, can the steam wand + tip produce good microfoam? That's more important than time, in my opinion. For instance, let's cite the stock Pavoni as an example: It will heat up the boiler and be ready for steam in a matter of over a couple of minutes (4 I think). However... It will heat up 235ml of milk from 4C to 65C in no time too... BUT.... Whatever it produces, with that stock 3 hole steam tip, is awful. The only solution, unless you are the Guru of latte art, is to source a single hole steam tip.
> 
> Personally, I'd like to see someone steaming milk and pouring into a cup of coffee. As per @Wuyang 's comment, I'd like to see that one day.😉


 I don't have my gaggia anymore to do latte and I'm not someone who's experienced at latte art, although I did do a tiny bit a few years back. I wish I could be of more help to you. I will say you can get a good swirl going in the milk. As a guess I reckon it will produce good micro foam, but unfortunately at the minute it's just a guess.....I love it, it's a very convenient machine to use.

Fella on the YouTube advert for the machine does a demonstration of latte art near the end if that helps, but it's hardly groundbreaking latte art, but it does demonstrate it can I suppose.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Wuyang said:


> I don't have my gaggia anymore to do latte and I'm not someone who's experienced at latte art, although I did do a tiny bit a few years back. I wish I could be of more help to you. I will say you can get a good swirl going in the milk. As a guess I reckon it will produce good micro foam, but unfortunately at the minute it's just a guess.....I love it, it's a very convenient machine to use.


 You are making me want to buy one...sad because I only want it to stick next to the little ECM Puristika (which I can't even review).


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> You are making me want to buy one...sad because I only want it to stick next to the little ECM Puristika (which I can't even review).


 I'm sure most people would be happy with it, but I suppose it depends on experience and expectations. I'm happy with it, only thing I'd say like a lot of steel surfaces it picks up fingerprints etc easy and just needs a regular wipe. I was impressed with the start up time, I didn't expect it to be so quick. Don't know if I mentioned before it has little water filters which you insert in the filling chamber which need changing in relation to usage.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

Wuyang said:


> I don't have my gaggia anymore to do latte and I'm not someone who's experienced at latte art, although I did do a tiny bit a few years back. I wish I could be of more help to you. I will say you can get a good swirl going in the milk. As a guess I reckon it will produce good micro foam, but unfortunately at the minute it's just a guess.....I love it, it's a very convenient machine to use.
> 
> Fella on the YouTube advert for the machine does a demonstration of latte art near the end if that helps, but it's hardly groundbreaking latte art, but it does demonstrate it can I suppose.


 Don't know if you've seen this.....


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Yeah...but I'm not sure how much I trust it..  Nothing like trying one and comparing it against my other machines.


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## Stevebee (Jul 21, 2015)

DavecUK said:


> Yeah...but I'm not sure how much I trust it..  Nothing like trying one and comparing it against my other machines.


 Sounds like you're going to take one for the team 😁


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Stevebee said:


> Sounds like you're going to take one for the team 😁


 It means spending £185, that's quite a lot... Especially as I don't need one so I'm conflicted.


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## Custodian (Jul 29, 2020)

I'm very tempted with the Cino. Might take the plunge so my single boiler Rocket has less work to do. I'll report back.


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## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

DavecUK said:


> It means spending £185, that's quite a lot... Especially as I don't need one so I'm conflicted.


 Same here, I have been looking this milk steamers for long time.. so here is my 2 cents

I will guess (we don't know for sure) WPM use same technology in there Thermo-block Espresso Machine https://www.wpm.hk/en/products_detail.php?id=310 they use in there Milk Steamers MS-130D / MS-130T https://www.wpm.hk/en/products.php?c1id=91

I think and guess (again dont know) dualit cino milk steamer is same product (OEM) https://www.dualit.com/products/cino

If all same maybe its will steam like this WPM KD-310

200 ml milk 35 second to reach 53 degrees and it absorbs 15 grams of water as the milk weighs 215 grams after steam


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## Stevebee (Jul 21, 2015)

Quick video of the Cino in action.

200ml of milk. Start temp 8, end temp 65/66 in 46 secs

Vesuvius with the steam boiler at 130 / 1.8 bar took 29 secs . I believe the Vesuvius is one of the better steamers, especially at these boiler settings but @DavecUK is in a better position to know where the V sits.

The pulsing noise is strange at first but soon get used to it. Less than 50 secs to get up to temp and the steam doesn't drop off like it would on an espresso machine so would cope with larger qtys ok I guess. Produces nice 'wet paint' milk with good micrfoam and a fairly small footprint.

For 400ml it took 77 secs from 8 to 65 degrees.

I'm starting to use this for hot chocolates and babycinos at 2 Farmers Markets at the weekend so if anyone would like to try it or see it in action I'm at Barnes Farmers Market SW13 9HG on Saturday and Stroud Green Farmers Market N4 3HB on Sundays.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

WPM also sells the Niche Zero in Asia I believe, rebranded as WPM.


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## Wuyang (Mar 21, 2014)

> 2 hours ago, Stevebee said:
> 
> Quick video of the Cino in action.
> 
> ...


 I'm very impressed with mine....it's mainly used for hot chocolates for the wife and kids at the moment.....don't regret buying it at all.

47 secs from off to ready....that amazed me.

Perfect match for gaggia classic.


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## Stevebee (Jul 21, 2015)

Will probably only use this at the weekend Markets as I only drink either Espresso or Americano during the week.

Simple to use, the one hole tip suits the machine and easy to get a good vortex going. Would be nice to have the WPM one that enables you to set the temp but I haven't got this with my espresso machines so it's not something I miss. Use my hand or Temptag to get to 65 and seems to work so far. Whilst it's a little bit slower than either of my machines, it's still plenty quick enough. When it runs out of water it just stops mid steam. It may have flashed different colour lights beforehand as a warning but if it did I missed it! Once refilled it's go to go almost immediately.


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