# New L1



## aphelion

So, i'm making the switch to Levers..

Anything tips I should know when purchasing a new L1?

(options you'd recommend etc?)

Cheers


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## 4515

I bought no options with mine and I'm totally happy with it 'as is'

No real tips, either. I found that I was all fingers and thumbs for a few shots, getting used to the lever and timing / weighing the shot but soon got used to the idea.

I added a bit more of the supplied grease to the piston and cylinder before assembling.

Enjoy the simplicity and some great coffee


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## The Systemic Kid

Naked portafilter perhaps? Definitely a good idea to get some Loxeal grease as you will need this for servicing. Might be an idea to lay in a set of seals too.


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## aphelion

Apparently they come with a single bottomless PF now, so guess I'll buy another at the same time..


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## The Systemic Kid

Think LI is supplied with double spouted portafilter - singe and naked are listed a 'related accessories'.


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## aphelion

The Systemic Kid said:


> Think LI is supplied with double spouted portafilter - singe and naked are listed a 'related accessories'.


Yeah that's what I thought too..will have to double check that with Reiss...anyone switched their steam wand to the left?


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## MarkyP

What about the four hole steam tip?


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## aphelion

Do you guys use 18g VST baskets? what is the recommended dosing these days? I use lighter roasts generally..


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## Mrboots2u

I used a vst 18g as my go to basket , I prefered to work with 18-36g ratios . you can use 20g vst and dose up if pulling beyond 40g you may need to do more than one pull. I found doses above 19g a little muddier in taste than the lower ones.

16 g Max in the stock basket


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## 7493

I believe it comes with a tube of Loxeal and enough spare seals to keep you going for at least a year.


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## Mrboots2u

Thought it had changed now to a naked pf only.....


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## The Systemic Kid

aphelion said:


> Do you guys use 18g VST baskets? what is the recommended dosing these days? I use lighter roasts generally..


For medium plus roasts, i.e. Londinium beans, Reiss recommended dosing a tad under 16grms. Above that, there's a drop in flavour clarity IMO. With lighter roasts, I dose to anywhere between 18-20grms using VST baskets.


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## The Systemic Kid

Mrboots2u said:


> Thought it had changed now to a naked pf only.....


Yep, just checked - you're right - shipped with a naked which seems kind of odd as this isn't to everyone's tastes.


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## The Systemic Kid

MarkyP said:


> What about the four hole steam tip?


Reiss posted here: http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?20590-1-0mm-4-hole-tip-for-l1 that there will be a new four hole tip in January - better texturing qualities.


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## aphelion

Thanks Glenn for reopening thread.

Looks like I'll be going ahead with my L1 purchase now.

Very excited to start something new after a few years of pump machines. Here's hoping it's a good fit!


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## coffeechap

You will love the l1 any questions please asj


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## aphelion

coffeechap said:


> You will love the l1 any questions please asj


Thanks dude, might need some tips on shot pulling!


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## The Systemic Kid

aphelion said:


> Thanks Glenn for reopening thread.
> 
> Looks like I'll be going ahead with my L1 purchase now.
> 
> Very excited to start something new after a few years of pump machines. Here's hoping it's a good fit!


LI is the dog's bollocks - supremely capable and simple to maintain. You won't regret it.


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## 7493

Hmmm. Tempted now. Just hate the wooden handles/knobs.


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## mathof

aphelion said:


> ...anyone switched their steam wand to the left?


I ordered an L1 last week with the steam wand switched to the left. I expect to receive it later this week or next. If you have any questions, I'll be happy to try to answer them after I get it up and running.

Matt


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## The Systemic Kid

Rob666 said:


> Hmmm. Tempted now. Just hate the wooden handles/knobs.


If that's putting you off, think I've got a set of the original black plastic handles you could have for nothing.


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## Orangertange

Rob666 said:


> Hmmm. Tempted now. Just hate the wooden handles/knobs.


Strange thing to hate, the grain in them and feel is lovely, think they are "ethically" sourced as well if that's what's bothering you


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## aphelion

Really can't wait to have a go now.

Had a brief go on (one of) Dave's L1's late last year, and he was pulling memorable shots of jampit. Very nice.

I also really like the wood handles!


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## aphelion

The Systemic Kid said:


> LI is the dog's bollocks - supremely capable and simple to maintain. You won't regret it.


Very exciting









I tend to steer towards lighter roasts these days, so it sounds like a larger dose is the way to go..like 18g+ maybe longer pre-infusion, any thoughts?


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## aphelion

mathof said:


> I ordered an L1 last week with the steam wand switched to the left. I expect to receive it later this week or next. If you have any questions, I'll be happy to try to answer them after I get it up and running.
> 
> Matt


Cheers Matt, I'm sure there will be plenty of questions


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## Mrboots2u

18g max for higher extraction yields with lighter roasts

i tended to go around 17.5-18g, used hasbean with the l1 for the last few months before it went ...

Fine grind , 17 > 34-36g perhaps , depends what the grinder is capable of ......

Finer grind , allows longer preinfusion , higher extraction yield, tastier ,sweeter more balanced lighter roast

At that brew ratio you might loose a little mouthfeel but gain some sweetness


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## The Systemic Kid

I'm using LSOL for shots at the moment. Went up to 19grm in 20grm VST - ground fine and tamped light. Pre-infused for 10-12secs and let the shot run to around 35secs - wonderful grapefruit punching through flat white. So, don't be afraid of updosing with light roasts but geind fine.


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## aphelion

Thanks for the tips guys, i've purchased an IMS 26.5 to allow some updosing over the stock basket.

Sounds like you need minimal tamping right? Any nutation?


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## The Systemic Kid

I'm using 58.55mm tampers in VSTS baskets and don't need to nutate - just a light pressure and good to go.


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## aphelion

Nice, I notice most are using flat bases, i've got a slightly convex Torr which I'm hoping will still work fine..


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## aaronb

aphelion said:


> Very exciting
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I tend to steer towards lighter roasts these days, so it sounds like a larger dose is the way to go..like 18g+ maybe longer pre-infusion, any thoughts?


No refractometer here but doing 18g of fairly light roasts (caffenation mostly) in the IMS h26.5 basket fine grind flat tamp 3-4 sec preinfusion tasty results.


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## 7493

Systemic, thanks for the offer. I may be swimming against the tide here but the wooden handles/knobs look really naff to me. Especially since they are that particular wood! Ebony, maybe but that one NO!


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## coffeechap

Jens will be doing done wood kits for the l1 !!, I too have some plastic handles if need be


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## gryphon

Systemic, You just said no nutating with your EK! It's new for me, maybe it's your tamper do the difference. Are You still using the turkish Burr?


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## aaronb

Rob666 said:


> Systemic, thanks for the offer. I may be swimming against the tide here but the wooden handles/knobs look really naff to me. Especially since they are that particular wood! Ebony, maybe but that one NO!


Agree, but its all personal choice isn't it and a lot of people rate the wood.

I love my black plastic handles though, and know a few others on here agree with me.


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## aphelion

Another quick question guys - planning to use volvic only in the tank (until plumbing becomes an option for me).

Do you 'tank fed' peeps use the additional filter in the bottom of the tank aswell?

Thanks


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## Mrboots2u

You used to get a tank filter with it when it came ...


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## 4515

You still do get the filter. I think the question was more around do you need to use the filter with volvic water

I use the filter in addition to using brita filtered water but I'm not sure of this is really needed


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## Mrboots2u

working dog said:


> You still do get the filter. I think the question was more around do you need to use the filter with volvic water
> 
> I use the filter in addition to using brita filtered water but I'm not sure of this is really needed


Sorry

I didn't use the filter with bottled water

I have no idea if this is right thing to do though or not


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## MarkyP

aphelion said:


> Nice, I notice most are using flat bases, i've got a slightly convex Torr which I'm hoping will still work fine..


I find that the convex base just helps to centre the pour when using a naked portafilter and also helps with shoddy prep!

I've switched to the Torr Titan and have found that I need to pay a bit more attention to prep... and grind a few notches coarser!


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## aphelion

MarkyP said:


> I find that the convex base just helps to centre the pour when using a naked portafilter and also helps with shoddy prep!
> 
> I've switched to the Torr Titan and have found that I need to pay a bit more attention to prep... and grind a few notches coarser!


Great, I've found the Convex Goldfinger a joy to use on my Brewtus.

I was debating the Londinium button tamper, but its another ££ outlay I could do without (at least before Christmas!







)


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## aphelion

Mrboots2u said:


> Sorry
> 
> I didn't use the filter with bottled water
> 
> I have no idea if this is right thing to do though or not


Yeah, I don't know if it's a belt and braces kind of thing

I probably won't bother with volvic and the filter together


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## The Systemic Kid

On is blog moons ago, Reiss endorsed a Volvic as water of choice for LI - no additional filtering.


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## aaronb

aphelion said:


> Another quick question guys - planning to use volvic only in the tank (until plumbing becomes an option for me).
> 
> Do you 'tank fed' peeps use the additional filter in the bottom of the tank aswell?
> 
> Thanks


I used the filter for the first 9 months or so then chucked it in the bin, I only ever use volvic in it. I don't think its needed for filtration purposes really, although it would prevent anything unwanted being accidentally sucked into the boiler.


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## aphelion

Yeah I was thinking purely limescale.

I've found volvic is nice and gentle anyway (certainly I've had no issues with the brewt).


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## aphelion

Right now, the only thing concerning me is the group assembly, and ensuring I don't nick any of the gaskets etc.

Reiss is shipping with the new Loxeal, so i'll need to remove all the old stuff from the bore, remove shower screen etc.

and apply the new Loxeal, replace shower screen, nutate the top section into the bore, and pump 30 times to drive any excess Loxeal out.

Sounds like a bloody nightmare haha, anyone had issues with this?

Seems simple enough, and i'll just take it slowly I guess!


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## Mrboots2u

If I can do it anyone can , seriously , anyone

It's really not as hard as you think


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## aaronb

Mrboots2u said:


> If I can do it anyone can , seriously , anyone
> 
> It's really not as hard as you think


Yep this. I was scared the first time I did a service on the L! (i.e. dismantle group and clean and relube) but its easy, just follow the instructions and remember not to over tighten anything.


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## aphelion

Thanks guys, will take my time and get it right


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## NickR

Rob666 said:


> Hmmm. Tempted now. Just hate the wooden handles/knobs.


I thought I wood hate wooden handles too, but having used them now for well over six months I love them. The wooden handle particularly on the lever really give a really wonderful tactile feel to the machine. I've grown to like the look too. My plastic handled naked porta filter feels very cheap and souless in comparison.


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## The Systemic Kid

Undo the four bolts securing the group diagonally a little at a time. Apply a liberal coating of Loxeal to bore and seals and, as you lower the piston, rotate to spread the grease inside the bore. Tighten up the bolts a little at a time, again diagonally, and tighten to 'pinch tight' which is no more than resistance you feel when they don't tighten with minimal effort. Then pull the lever to cocked position several times. This will drive the excess grease to the end of the bore and you can remove it with your finger - don't want it clogging your shower screen.


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## aphelion

NickR said:


> I thought I wood hate wooden handles too, but having used them now for well over six months I love them. The wooden handle particularly on the lever really give a really wonderful tactile feel to the machine. I've grown to like the look too. My plastic handled naked porta filter feels very cheap and souless in comparison.


Yep, I think the wood handles make it for me personally..

I've ordered some nice beeswax oil to keep them conditioned


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## aphelion

The Systemic Kid said:


> Undo the four bolts securing the group diagonally a little at a time. Apply a liberal coating of Loxeal to bore and seals and, as you lower the piston, rotate to spread the grease inside the bore. Tighten up the bolts a little at a time, again diagonally, and tighten to 'pinch tight' which is no more than resistance you feel when they don't tighten with minimal effort. Then pull the lever to cocked position several times. This will drive the excess grease to the end of the bore and you can remove it with your finger - don't want it clogging your shower screen.


Good advice, thanks.

Seems like I need to do this for original installation too, although only to clean the current grease from the bore and replace with Loxeal.

Do I need to clean the piston off and put Loxeal on too?

Thanks


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## MarkyP

aphelion said:


> Thanks guys, will take my time and get it right


As others have said, once you've done it once it becomes easier... Even replacing the seals isn't as daunting as it looks!


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## lespresso

Rob666 said:


> Systemic, thanks for the offer. I may be swimming against the tide here but the wooden handles/knobs look really naff to me. Especially since they are that particular wood! Ebony, maybe but that one NO!


hi rob

i can see where you are coming from, and truth be told i tried hard to source Ebony, but the price was just crippling and supply was by no means assured

the handles all come off so it is possible for you to fit whatever handles take your fancy - there is no shortage of guys offering custom wood turning services, and resin too if that is your preference

kind regards

reiss


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## 7493

Thanks Reiss! Wenge just isn't me. SO last year!


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## 2971

Also, I was talking to a chap about ebony and he told me that the wood is prone to cracking. Something to bear in mind.


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## 7493

I love the rubberised plastic finish on the portafilter handles on my current Vibiemme. Non slip even when damp/wet and easy to keep clean. I also like the top of the range ECM handles.

These machines seem to me to fit into the Art Deco tradition and therefore 'new' materials seem more appropriate than wood.

Although, each to his own as somebody said a few posts back.


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## aphelion

Machine arrives tomorrow...party!!


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## aphelion

She's arrived...


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## 4515

Looking good


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## Phil104

And ready to go judging by the blue light. You will enjoy it very much with presumably time to play over the holiday period..


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## The Systemic Kid

Great set up - will reward you with stonking coffee and remember - grind fine, tamp light


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## Phil104

The Systemic Kid said:


> grind fine, tamp light


I know it's too late now,, but that would have made another good slogan for the T-shirt, either side of a lever coming up from the bottom of the T-shirt....


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## Thecatlinux

Father Christmas has been early to your house Andy , great and enviable setup ,I am sure there will be great coffees in your house this festive season.

Nice one


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## NickR

Doesn't look like an ideal position - what's in the cupboard above? and isn't the work surface in the way when you pull?


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## stevogums

Nice!


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## drude

L1 & HG One - very nice. You will enjoy the new setup for sure - congratulations.


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## aphelion

Thanks everyone, very happy with the purchase.. even the wife likes this one!


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## aphelion

So, my first impressions are very good..

Build quality is a great, it looks nice, and I love the wenge handles!

The shots I've been getting are tasting pretty special (I've certainly not perfected things yet).

Certainly I've found the prep requires some attention, grinding, distribution, tamping are all very sensitive.

Overall, i'm finding it really satisfying to work with, the preparation with the HG One and Lever lends a nice

"analog" approach to things, which I really like. It makes the whole experience very hands on and enjoyable.

The steaming is very powerful coming from a 1 hole brewtus tip, it actually shocked me a bit!

I've ordered a 2 hole to drop down the power a little. I blew a small jug out in 5 seconds...

I think the HG One needs breaking in a bit more, so I've ordered some of that weird american rice.

Hopefully that will only improve things further.

I am getting quite a lot of hissing - mainly when coming up to pressure from cold, and once switched off.

I'm assuming this is normal though? any experiences there?

Overall, the L1 is a seriously nice bit of kit, and i'm glad to have made the jump









Cheers for all the advice


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## 4515

I had hissing whilst the machine was switched on - a regular hiss, hiss, hiss

A sharp tap to the top of the pressure release valve got it seated correctly and no further issues since then


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## The Systemic Kid

aphelion said:


> I am getting quite a lot of hissing - mainly when coming up to pressure from cold, and once switched off.
> 
> I'm assuming this is normal though? any experiences there?
> 
> Cheers for all the advice


There's a pressure valve on top of the boiler - when LI comes up to operating pressure, the valve closes with a hiss. If you pop the top panel off, you can see this operating. Check to see if there is any dripping caused by it not seating properly.


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## aphelion

working dog said:


> I had hissing whilst the machine was switched on - a regular hiss, hiss, hiss
> 
> A sharp tap to the top of the pressure release valve got it seated correctly and no further issues since then


Right yep, just spoke to Dave C, sounds like it's not seated quite right.

He's recommended tapping down onto the top with a hammer, so will give that a go.

Should I wait until it's up to temperature?

Cheers


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## aphelion

Total false alarm, pressure release behaving as normal


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## aphelion

Been getting some really fantastic shots from the L1 today, just wondering if you guys approach lighter roasts differently to darker roasts? dose, timings etc. I've been sticking with 18g in an IMS basket, 6-10 seconds preinfusion, then 27 secs, 27g out.

I'm pretty happy with the taste, but interested in experimenting further..

Any thoughts?

Cheers


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## The Systemic Kid

With darker roasts, I dose around 16grms - with lighter I am dosing at 18-18.5grms in 20grm VST - grinding as fine as I can and tamping as lightly as possibly - no pressure - just letting the tamp weight do the job. Been getting fantastic shots with last LSOL offering.


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## aaronb

I'm pretty much always lighter roasts, 18.0g dose in the IMS basket. I tend to preinfuse for 3-5 secs.

So in answer to your question: totally depends on the coffee!

Some really benefit from running long, anything up to 36g out in 36 secs or they just taste nasty. Another blend I quite like you really need to run it short or it goes horribly bitter. These are all from the same roaster.

Just gotta experiment.


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## The Systemic Kid

Been experimenting with longer pre-infusing - up to 10-15secs.


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## aaronb

The Systemic Kid said:


> Been experimenting with longer pre-infusing - up to 10-15secs.


what's the verdict?

Does it ever stall the thermosyphon? (or do you just make sure you do a quick flush after you've finished?)


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## gryphon

The Systemic Kid said:


> With darker roasts, I dose around 16grms - with lighter I am dosing at 18-18.5grms in 20grm VST - grinding as fine as I can and tamping as lightly as possibly - no pressure - just letting the tamp weight do the job. Been getting fantastic shots with last LSOL offering.


Is it grinding with turkish burr?


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## The Systemic Kid

gryphon said:


> Is it grinding with turkish burr?


Yes - running Turkish burrs.


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## The Systemic Kid

aaronb said:


> what's the verdict?
> 
> Does it ever stall the thermosyphon? (or do you just make sure you do a quick flush after you've finished?)


Wasn't getting much out of the LSOL beans - touch of grapefruit - grinding really fine brought out tons of lovely sweet grapefruit that cut through milk to make fantastic flat whites. Pretty sure the long pre-infusion was instrumental in achieving this. No probs, so far with the thermosyphon stalling - always flush after making a couple of flat of flat whites.


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## gryphon

The Systemic Kid said:


> I'm using 58.55mm tampers in VSTS baskets and don't need to nutate - just a light pressure and good to go.


I always intended to use the nutating technique for the EK? There's a relation with your new tamper?


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## aphelion

Cheers for the tips everyone, i've been getting some mind blowing shots out of the L1 this morning.

Seriously happy right now


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## fluffles

What's the theory in using a higher dose for light roasts? That seems counter intuitive to me... Light roasts are harder to extract so more coffee would only add to the chance of under extraction. Enlighten me please


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## The Systemic Kid

Harder to get the dissolved solids out of lighter roasts than darker. That's why you grind fine - to increase the extraction yield. But this can lead to uneven extraction with the water flow through the puck finding the path of least resistance. You need to be more meticulous with your prep routine to ensure the puck is very even distributed and not over compacted. Pre-infusing allows the puck to soak up and begin giving up its bounty before being blasted with full pressure which completes the process.


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## The Systemic Kid

aphelion said:


> Cheers for the tips everyone, i've been getting some mind blowing shots out of the L1 this morning.
> 
> Seriously happy right now


Excellent


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## Mrboots2u

Agree with above but massively dependent on the quality of your grinder... going fine on some grinders will lead to increased range of particle size = uneven extraction across these = fines over extracting...


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## Phil104

Mrboots2u said:


> Agree with above but massively dependent on the quality of your grinder... going fine on some grinders will lead to increased range of particle size = uneven extraction across these = fines over extracting...


 Did you have the Mignon in mind or is that okay enough?


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## Mrboots2u

Phil104 said:


> Did you have the Mignon in mind or is that okay enough?


Okay is in the eye of the taster.... ( ????? )

AS you know Phil , whats a good or the best grinder is endlessly debated on here .

Whether a grinder will be better in the cup also.

I would expect the mignon to perform and have the particle distribution of any grinder in that price and with it s burr size..

Make of that what you will


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## Phil104

Mrboots2u said:


> Okay is in the eye of the taster.... ( ????? )
> 
> AS you know Phil , whats a good or the best grinder is endlessly debated on here .
> 
> Whether a grinder will be better in the cup also.
> 
> I would expect the mignon to perform and have the particle distribution of any grinder in that price and with it s burr size..
> 
> Make of that what you will


Okay, got it... and the mignon is working well enough for me in the absence of knowing anything better (that's not quite true- coffee chap pulled shots for me using a versalab and then on something else - can't remember what that was other than it blocked out the light...and there was the kit at Has Bean towers).


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## coffeechap

There are people who are happy with the mignon and l1, my personal thoughts on the subject are that the mignon just does not do the l1 justice at all!


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## The Systemic Kid

coffeechap said:


> There are people who are happy with the mignon and l1, my personal thoughts on the subject are that the mignon just does not do the l1 justice at all!


Found that when I moved from a Vario to HG One - revelation.


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## Phil104

coffeechap said:


> There are people who are happy with the mignon and l1, my personal thoughts on the subject are that the mignon just does not do the l1 justice at all!


 Sadly for my financial planning, I agree - you spoilt me Dave. I didn't even need to drink it to know - I saw the quality of the grind that came out of your versalab and thought wow!


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## Phil104

The Systemic Kid said:


> Found that when I moved from a Vario to HG One - revelation.


 Groan.... get ye behind me temptation.


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## coffeechap

Phil104 said:


> Sadly for my financial planning, I agree - you spoilt me Dave. I didn't even need to drink it to know - I saw the quality of the grind that came out of your versalab and thought wow!


A decent step up in grind quality can be had you almost mignon money though


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## Phil104

Had I known what I know now... but next year's target is a different grinder. (Realise this has gone slightly off the thread but only ever so slightly because it's all related to how to get the best from the LI).


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## Viernes

The Systemic Kid said:


> Yes - running Turkish burrs.


Don't you use the coffee burrs? Perger recommends them AFAIK.


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