# Dose control pro real world??



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Hi guys

So im doing a bit of reading as you do and i know the forum tend to not like the sage stuff, and most say the sage grinders are rubbish

Then i speak with users of the sage gear and they tend not to have an issue?

So is it chinese whispers in terms of people saying its rubbish without using or is there actual hands on that the dose control wont go fine for espresso? And did people realise the top burr could be adjusted to fine up the grind?


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## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Just asking.

I know you lot all have big wallets😂😝

Im quite happy hand grinding 😂


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## BlackCatCoffee (Apr 11, 2017)

I am not keen on Sage as you may have seen however my issue with them is not down to performance. They can produce great results.

On paper I think they are an attractive proposition. I do not recommend them however because they use lots of proprietary components which they are not particularly keen on distributing widely. This leads to more expensive parts and mostly locks you in to their service which I gather is very expensive. It also creates lots of waste as people tend to dispose of them rather than repair which I feel is a model we need to move away from as a society.

This is a particular problem with the BE as you get two bits of gear in one. Seems like a great idea but if the espresso machine fails then your grinder is a junker along with it! Not good.

Anecdotally I believe they are not hugely reliable either which exacerbates the waste / costly repair issue.

I know I bang on about the Classic, heck I even bore myself, but there are plenty of 20+ year old examples knocking about which are still going strong. I suspect that in 20 years time this will not be the case with Sage machines. I genuinely hope I am wrong however.

In terms of the grinder, I have had little hands on time with it, but I have read reviews and spoken to people I trust and as I understand it is not up to scratch. Some members say it can be altered to achieve fine enough for espresso but I really feel like you shouldn't need to fiddle with a grinder to get it to a useable state when it is sold expressly for the purpose!


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

Here's my 2C having used a few sage machines and owning a built in SGP and played with a stand alone one. 
Firstly the sage stuff is better than most people give it credit for. I strongly suspect most of the people who are against it have never owned it. They have great temp stability, steam power and make great espresso. 
As BCC says above there are reliability issues and there is always a problem with putting a grinder and espresso machine in the same unit. 
I actually have a 20 year old classic that's still going strong

The grinder is a different thing however. It is ok. It can grind fine enough for espresso, but when it does grind fine, particularly for lighter, denser beans, it tends to get irregular. This may not be a problem, but for some beans you just end up never being able to get a good extraction, and end up with a sour flavour. 
If you feed it medium Brazilian it will do you fine all day long and give it traditional dark roasts and it will give you a nice bitter espresso.

Yes, you can adjust the burr, but that doesn't help the irregularity. It produces LOTS of fines and boulders, visually. I can imagine if someone used the Kruve on it then you wouldn't end up with much usable espresso in the middle. 
You can help with the fines by using the filter paper Scott Rao trick. 
But not much you can do about the boulders unless you sieve it.

The grinder is much worse when single dosing and it doesn't much like oily beans either.


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## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Great replies guys

I think the sage are a good entry into coffee. I had a classic and couldn't get used to it, im thinking it was temperature related issuse

Im still very new into my coffee journey and always learning. My pallet isnt the best so fancy beans can be a waste on me

Personally and with good advice of key member's on the forum i was steered towards hand grinding and ive been very happy with my purchase, id imagine alot buy the sage and struggle.


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