# Niche users, what DON’T you like?



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

You can't move round here for people raving about the Niche. But I'm interested in what people don't like about it. I think I might need one, in as much as I'd like to try single dosing, and I'd appreciate being able to change the grind size easily, so I don't think there are many options.


----------



## Planter (Apr 12, 2017)

The negatives are minimal. For single dosing and a small footprint, at a decent price, its hard to beat, which is why you don't see many people criticising it.


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

1. It looks like a ken wood

2. Feels a little cheap

3. Grind is a little inconsistent (hence the shake and stir)

However if you want brand new and have less than £750 to spend then there is only one option for you, the niche. Used is a different matter! You can read my thoughts her

https://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?47170-My-observations-on-the-Niche-Zero-grinder&p=639212#post639212

It's a little less fanboy than other reviews


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

It's not a flat burr...









It suffers from the same issue of single dosing that any non augur fed grinder would, so depending on how picky your are needs wdt.


----------



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

coffeechap said:


> 1. It looks like a ken wood
> 
> 2. Feels a little cheap
> 
> ...


thanks, I'll give that a read later, if I did have 750 to spend, what would I be buying?


----------



## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

Second hand Ceado/Compak, if you drink light roasts AND happy to run an on demand grinder.


----------



## jimbojohn55 (Jan 15, 2016)

My only concerns are, the motor and gearing / bearing long term, but may not be an issue, the plastic lid, it looks a bit top heavy, better suited to darker roasts as its conical.


----------



## jimbojohn55 (Jan 15, 2016)

PPapa said:


> Second hand Ceado/Compak, if you drink light roasts AND happy to run an on demand grinder.


agree I would get a Ceado E37S for the money


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Junglebert said:


> thanks, I'll give that a read later, if I did have 750 to spend, what would I be buying?


Is this how much they are going from new now? It says £499 on their website / indiegogo.


----------



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

I'm replying to coffeechaps comment inferring it's the best thing for under 750 new


----------



## Planter (Apr 12, 2017)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Is this how much they are going from new now? It says £499 on their website / indiegogo.


Yep that was always the cost. But there was just discounted or early bird rates.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Planter said:


> Yep that was always the cost. But there was just discounted or early bird rates.


Yeah. I thought they'd gone up to £750!


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

jimbojohn55 said:


> My only concerns are, the motor and gearing / bearing long term, but may not be an issue, the plastic lid, it looks a bit top heavy, better suited to darker roasts as its conical.


It will make a tasty drink with a lighter roast.


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Junglebert said:


> I'm replying to coffeechaps comment inferring it's the best thing for under 750 new


Be clear in your head head what you want ..

Single dose and capability to do brewed - niche , Negs = workflow

Just espresso and you have the room and you are happy to run with a decent amount of beans in a hopper then a good flat burr espresso grinder, may be more tempting .

If you are going to single dose on demand grinder you are back to WDT with that to get a decent poor from it. SO it's swing and roundabouts.

People will rave about the Niche often coz they have moved from a lower end grinder to it ( say mignon or sage ) and it kicks there arse a bit .

Some will not rave about it as they have more expensive flat burrs grinders and prefer that taste and workflow with em.

Alot will come down to preference on workflow and space.


----------



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

Mrboots2u said:


> Be clear in your head head what you want ..
> 
> Single dose and capability to do brewed - niche , Negs = workflow
> 
> ...


Im not sure the Niche is what I want, I'm currently using a reasonable 58mm flat burr grinder (Macap M5D) it's a pain to change grind size, but I usually use my Feldgrind when I'm having something other than espresso. I think the Ceado E37S might be more what I want. Thanks as usual everyone for the thoughts


----------



## Headgoboomboom (Apr 21, 2013)

There is nothing that I really dislike about the Niche. If I had my way the retractable cord is not that useful. I would use a longer regular cord. Also, the little red light doesn't add anything and is unnecessary, IMO.


----------



## Nick1881 (Dec 18, 2018)

It's my first proper grinder so I'm happy with everything about mine, I don't have anything to compare it to though.

The size and look is perfect for me, also the single dosing suits me very well, I can't imagine any other way.


----------



## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

The jumpy last few beans, we know this causes inconsistency so they annoy me a bit, but they certainly dont make enough difference to ruin the grind.

I pull one shot a day most days, so I like to get out what I put in on the first grind, this means smacking the plastic lid a bit and tapping the cup on the exit tube - although it actually feels solid I do worry I will crack the lid one day or scratch the paintwork by the exit chute. That said, once I have given it a few smacks the output is usually within 0.1g of the input, which is better than nearly any other grinder out there, especially for the price range.

Oh and I would quite like a lid to make the shake after the grind a bit easier, I like to give it a good shake with my hand over the top, would be easier with a little lid that could sit underneath the catch cup. That may just be my workflow however.

I got it on an early bird, but even at full price for the money there isn't anything else as good and as kitchen friendly as the Niche. Even with the money to get a more expensive grinder I wouldn't change (at least not until the VERY expensive single dosers) I wouldn't change as very few of them are single dose as they are based on commercial settings - for a one drink a day person having beans sat in the grinder means you get worse coffee.


----------



## joey24dirt (Jan 28, 2017)

Where are you based? Could you possibly have a loan of one for a few days to see how you feel about them?

I personally don't have any issues with mine. My only criticism would be it can sometimes be messy. Seems to expel chaff from under the lid. A neat rubber seal could have solved that perhaps.


----------



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

joey24dirt said:


> Where are you based? Could you possibly have a loan of one for a few days to see how you feel about them?
> 
> I personally don't have any issues with mine. My only criticism would be it can sometimes be messy. Seems to expel chaff from under the lid. A neat rubber seal could have solved that perhaps.


Cheers Joey, messy was one thing I was hoping to avoid, I'm finding my current set up too messy, so though single dosing might stop that.


----------



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

And thanks for the offer, but I'm miles from you.


----------



## joey24dirt (Jan 28, 2017)

Junglebert said:


> Cheers Joey, messy was one thing I was hoping to avoid, I'm finding my current set up too messy, so though single dosing might stop that.


It's not enough to put you off, but was just slightly more than I expected. A weekly sweep takes care of it


----------



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

Every week!


----------



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

Joey, you like it comparing to your compak?


----------



## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

It's one of the lest messy grinders I have ever owned, if that helps... the bits that escape from under the lid are very few and far between in my experience.


----------



## igm45 (Mar 5, 2017)

Junglebert said:


> Cheers Joey, messy was one thing I was hoping to avoid, I'm finding my current set up too messy, so though single dosing might stop that.


Why would single dosing be less messy?


----------



## Junglebert (Jan 7, 2019)

igm45 said:


> Why would single dosing be less messy?


Thats not what I meant to infer.


----------



## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

joey24dirt said:


> My only criticism would be it can sometimes be messy. Seems to expel chaff from under the lid. A neat rubber seal could have solved that perhaps.


PM me your address & I'll send you a jelly bean lid that should solve that.


----------



## joey24dirt (Jan 28, 2017)

ashcroc said:


> PM me your address & I'll send you a jelly bean lid that should solve that.


A what? Is this genuine?


----------



## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

joey24dirt said:


> A what? Is this genuine?


It's the lid to one of these (a byproduct of a slight addiction of mine) & works the same way as DaveCUK's pringles lid but with more style. 

Just place it above the beans before lowering the lid to reduce popcorning etc.


----------



## MrOrk (Apr 17, 2018)

@coffeechap does the monolith conical behave in the same way with regards to the inconsistent grind?


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

MrOrk said:


> @coffeechap does the monolith conical behave in the same way with regards to the inconsistent grind?


I have not owned or had the monocon on the bench but @MildredM and @Snakehips have them


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

ashcroc said:


> PM me your address & I'll send you a jelly bean lid that should solve that.


This. Also Nutella small glass jar lids do the trick.


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

coffeechap said:


> I have not owned or had the monocon on the bench but @MildredM and @Snakehips have them


Are the monos auger fed


----------



## 7493 (May 29, 2014)

The niche is a little messy but that is cured by an Azera lid on top of the beans. (Other lids are available...) It does feel a bit domestic and flimsier than a commercial grinder but that's just what it is. If I had the money, I'd have a Mythos but you also need the room. As it is, I alternate between the Niche and a Eureka 65e. They both have workflow disadvantages and advantages. I reckon the Niche is marginally better in the cup but seems to generate more static.


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

MrOrk said:


> @coffeechap does the monolith conical behave in the same way with regards to the inconsistent grind?


Monolith and inconsistent don't fit in the same sentence


----------



## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Consistency is probably not the right word. Functioning grinders are consistent, in that they break up beans in a repeatable & predictable manner at a given setting.

If the gravity fed, conical burr Monolith has a tighter particle distribution than the Niche, this can easily be tested. But both grinders have nothing to prevent the last beans from jumping about before being ground.


----------



## Snakehips (Jun 2, 2015)

Mrboots2u said:


> Are the monos auger fed


The conical certainly is not. Direct gravity feed as is, I suspect, the flat.


----------



## Snakehips (Jun 2, 2015)

MrOrk said:


> @coffeechap does the monolith conical behave in the same way with regards to the inconsistent grind?


I can't imagine that the Monoliths defy the laws of physics when it comes to crunching a few grams of gravity fed beans with a conical burr set. If it is the nature of that process that particle size and shape will vary slightly then, yes the Monoliths give an inconsistent grind.

What you will get, thanks to the superb engineering quality of the Monoliths, is very consistent inconsistency.

I have never been troubled by the output from my conical. I do, habitually, stir with a Londinium distribution tool which, I tend to use while grinding directly into the portafilter.

You may find this thread worth a read.


----------



## MrOrk (Apr 17, 2018)

Snakehips said:


> I can't imagine that the Monoliths defy the laws of physics when it comes to crunching a few grams of gravity fed beans with a conical burr set. If it is the nature of that process that particle size and shape will vary slightly then, yes the Monoliths give an inconsistent grind.
> 
> What you will get, thanks to the superb engineering quality of the Monoliths, is very consistent inconsistency.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that, it was the point I was trying to make. The main notable functional flaw is the grind inconsistency, the inconsistency seen with the Niche isn't a flaw with the Niche, it's inherent in the design and seen on grinders 4 times the price.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Just remember, it takes an experienced scientist with all the right gear, the ability to split the atom....


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

MrOrk said:


> Thanks for that, it was the point I was trying to make. The main notable functional flaw is the grind inconsistency, the inconsistency seen with the Niche isn't a flaw with the Niche, it's inherent in the design and seen on grinders 4 times the price.


No it's a flaw when trying to single dose a conic burr set, it will pretty much happen to them all unless you feed the beans in one by one! Inconsistent in my opinion is the right word as the grind particle size increase (very marginallly) throughout the grinding process on the niche (fact). However this is probably the same for all gravity fed single dosing conics.


----------



## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

One thing I don't like about it is people reading across problems that occur on flat bur grinders to a low reving conical grinder where it wont be anywhere near as noticeable. Trouble is anyway that it can be minimised on flat and people can do a and b drinks and compare. Much better option than people just accepting that it will be different.

One thing I wasn't keen on initially was the spread in shot weights as I use a fixed 30sec shot time. It seems to be improving with use, My brand new mazzer mini did the same thing. Only time will tell if it can reach the same level of consistency as that one did. It's currently acceptable going purely on taste for me and only maybe 10% variation in total not +/-.

Rest. Difficult. I see grinders as a compromise. Timed grinders wont give consistent dose weights. Beans can be weighed in on all grinders. On some what went in can match what comes out to the same level as Niche. Retention that matters and is left can also be very low. Lot of fiddling about where as they are just dumped in on Niche. That in a fashion has it's consequence hence shake and stir etc. Do something about that and it would probably loose it's advantages which is convenience and we are told a high quality grind. I am getting more out of slightly less coffee. The slightly less turned out to be important.








I don't like the pitch of the adjustment thread. I'd like finer as currently I make final adjustments based on the width of the indication dot - part of the width of it. It is very easy to do though unlike others were it isn't. No complaints really as design again. If I had what I would like people who use it for other methods would hate it.

John

-


----------



## jimbojohn55 (Jan 15, 2016)

Interesting calculator here for someone qualified in physics to use and compare centrifugal force on a single bean at 0.1g with various bur (radius) not diameter - and spin speeds, no idea what the results mean or if even relevant, or if it effects the feed pressure on the beans as the are ground - Interesting if someone who works in physics can say if relevant or not

https://www.omnicalculator.com/physics/centrifugal-force


----------



## Nopapercup (Nov 6, 2016)

I used a La Cimbali Magnum before the Niche so large ex commercial flat burr. The taste in the cup is slightly different but I wouldn't say one is significantly better than the other. The big advantages of the Niche are workflow and size. My only slight gripe is the red light on the side so I feel the need to pull the plug out each time other than that I can't really fault it.

As I prefer light roast I would like another large flat grinder but I think single dosing is well suited to home use. My concern with the Ceado or Mythos is retention so the next step up is a significantly priced one with the EK. I'm not sure there is the perfect grinder for home use but for the money I can't see any better than the Niche


----------



## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

jimbojohn55 said:


> Interesting calculator here for someone qualified in physics to use and compare centrifugal force on a single bean at 0.1g with various bur (radius) not diameter - and spin speeds, no idea what the results mean or if even relevant, or if it effects the feed pressure on the beans as the are ground - Interesting if someone who works in physics can say if relevant or not
> 
> https://www.omnicalculator.com/physics/centrifugal-force


I did the sums out of curiosity and was a little amazed by how high the g can be.







A bean doesn't see it until it gets there though. Argument is that the weight of beens in a hopper helps it get there smoothly rather than by bouncing about. Also the force from beans coming in adds to the grinds coming out. Conical have some degree of a built in auger, rather a lot on some. That must help.

But as I mentioned try a flat weighing in plus a weight over the beans. Then stick too many beans in and still use the weight and grind a dose so no beans bounce about.Then do a Sansbury's and taste the difference of the 3 ways of using the gear. No weight weighing in, weight and weighing in and the a dose with the weight on. It takes a lot of brushing to get weighed in doses to match what comes out and more than one grinder spin up. Niche just does it but less grinds compaction.

John

-


----------



## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Nopapercup said:


> I used a La Cimbali Magnum before the Niche so large ex commercial flat burr. The taste in the cup is slightly different but I wouldn't say one is significantly better than the other. The big advantages of the Niche are workflow and size. My only slight gripe is the red light on the side so I feel the need to pull the plug out each time other than that I can't really fault it.
> 
> As I prefer light roast I would like another large flat grinder but I think single dosing is well suited to home use. My concern with the Ceado or Mythos is retention so the next step up is a significantly priced one with the EK. I'm not sure there is the perfect grinder for home use but for the money I can't see any better than the Niche


LOL I just leave mine plugged in. Deep down I probably feel that if I can't do that it shouldn't be on the market. Time to disconnect from the mains is when the switch breaks. Switches until that happens are reliable - good job too. Does anyone disconnect the lights etc from the mains every night?

John

-


----------



## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

There is no need to disconnect. This light had to be brighter, on the front of the machine and to shine when Niche is working.


----------



## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

I think it's worth noting that 'inconsistency' is not a flaw in and of itself - inconsistent grind particle size is actually what creates a varied flavour profile. Something like the EK43 has a very tight particle distribution unlike nearly any other grinder and produces a drink unlike any other grinder - but even that has a distribution of particle sizes.

I would agree with MWJB that consistency is a misnomer. All you are really trying to avoid is having particles that are significantly different from the norm, some basic experiments show popcorning seems to do this - however all that said when you single dose a Mazzer SJ you get noticeable inconsistencies in the shot, even after a good stir (in my experience) where as with the nice the shots themselves are very consistent.


----------



## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

You can't feed the Niche when motor is running, cause its will stop when you open the lid


----------



## Planter (Apr 12, 2017)

JackHK said:


> You can't feed the Niche when motor is running, cause its will stop when you open the lid


Why would you though when single dosing?


----------



## Mesmer (Jul 2, 2017)

The only downside i see of the Niche is that you need to do a bit of extra puck preparation.

My routine is like this: Grind with Niche, transfer to PF with the cup (portafilter on top and invert the cup), add portafilter collar, use wisk to stir grounds, apply leveler, tamp.

Sounds like a lot but once you know what you're doing it takes like time and for me it results in VERY consistent shots, no channeling, tasty.

I'm sure some steps can be skipped, probably wisk and leveler parts.

I tried stirring in the cup directly, but getting unevenness when transferring from the cup to portafilter. Maybe i need some more practice.

For 2-4 coffees per day the single dose routine highly outweighs the drawbacks in my opinion.


----------



## joey24dirt (Jan 28, 2017)

I tend to do without the cup and just use pf funnel and straight into pf. Similar thereafter though, stir, knock level then tamp. Nice and quick.


----------



## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

Dylan said:


> The jumpy last few beans, we know this causes inconsistency so they annoy me a bit, but they certainly dont make enough difference to ruin the grind.
> 
> I pull one shot a day most days, so I like to get out what I put in on the first grind, this means smacking the plastic lid a bit and tapping the cup on the exit tube - although it actually feels solid I do worry I will crack the lid one day or scratch the paintwork by the exit chute. That said, once I have given it a few smacks the output is usually within 0.1g of the input, which is better than nearly any other grinder out there, especially for the price range.
> 
> ...


It's not the jumpy beans that are causing a wider particle spread (or less fines, or whatever happens when you run the chamber empty), it's the no load scenario where you have nothing pushing on the beans. With a hopper, the bean feed is consistent, beans follow burr cuts and get gradually smaller, producing a more consistent grind. With single dosing, the grind gets gradually coarser as the burr chamber empties.

T.


----------



## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

Mesmer said:


> The only downside i see of the Niche is that you need to do a bit of extra puck preparation.
> 
> My routine is like this: Grind with Niche, transfer to PF with the cup (portafilter on top and invert the cup), add portafilter collar, use wisk to stir grounds, apply leveler, tamp.
> 
> ...


I do this with my EK43 as I use the Niche cup with it.



joey24dirt said:


> I tend to do without the cup and just use pf funnel and straight into pf. Similar thereafter though, stir, knock level then tamp. Nice and quick.


I use the Niche with a La Pavoni and put a portafilter collar on, then hold under the chute. After that I use a home-made Londinium tool which is basically a cork with 3 paper clips shoved in it (thinking of calling it an Eboracum tool as I'm from York..







)

And who wants to expose the burrs when they're running.. that's the whole point of the safety device with the lid. I doubt chewed finger ends would make an espresso taste any better


----------



## dan1502 (Sep 8, 2012)

I use an EK43 and a niche. Both are convenient to single dose. The EK is more messy. I use the lid from the aluminium screw top pot I use to weigh single doses to reduce popcorning. In terms of technique I just give the cup a rotating shake before emptying into the basket using a funnel then a horizontal plane shake to distribute evenly before tamping. Takes a bit of practice but no need for WDT. Negligible retention and displacement means the 2nd shot is consistent with the first. I find it very easy to dial in.


----------



## ooglewoogle (Oct 2, 2018)

Has anyone had any issues with the threads on the hopper of their Niche? I am in talks just now with Niche (who have been fantastic in customer service with several issues) regarding a problem with my new Niche, whereby the hopper wasn't rotating very well. On taking it off to examine/clean the burrs, the threads got a very "metal on metal" feel....and examining the hopper threads showed there was some apparently pre-chrome damage to the hopper side.

I'm sure this could well be a one off, but examining this area has me wondering about the longevity of chrome hopper threads running in aluminium body threads. The hopper threads seem to be quite rough after chroming, and (alongside the aluminium damage from the corrupt threads on my unit) seem to be generating quite a bit of dust from the aluminium in general. I was just wondering if there are any thoughts on this....long term, it would appear to be an area of possible issue?

Apart from this the unit has been pretty great. I would like to see perhaps a finer reference scale and needle pointer and a lockable collar, but apart from that it seems a great starting point for hopefully a long Niche line.

<svg class="SnapLinksHighlighter" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg"><rect width="0" height="0"></rect></svg>


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Similar set up in Mazzer doesn't seem to cause problems?


----------



## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

It does if you crossthread it.

T.


----------



## ooglewoogle (Oct 2, 2018)

DavecUK said:


> Similar set up in Mazzer doesn't seem to cause problems?


 Thanks....I have never seen the Mazzer units internally, but that is interesting to know. It was only when taking the macro shot of the thread damage on the hopper to send to Niche that I noticed that the chromed hopper threads ran quite rough. Cleaning out the threads revealed quite a bit of aluminum dust. I thought at first that this may either be graphite grease (it may have been this also?), but on regreasing with clear silicone grease, it dirtied up with aluminum straight away. I have no idea if it would be a problem long term or not, I just thought it a point of note. I guess even if they did wear down the line, the top part of the case could be replaced.

As a side note, and being new to the forum, many thanks for the work you have done informing both here and on your blog. I particularly found the detailed Niche review and the E61 service info very helpful. Cheers.


----------



## ooglewoogle (Oct 2, 2018)

dsc said:


> It does if you crossthread it.
> 
> T.


 Is it possible to crossthread it? I'm not sure it is (easily)....you would need some force and intent. See above for more detail on what I am referencing. Thx.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

He was talking about Mazzers, they are easy to crossthread because the thread is quite fine and you have a lot more spring pressure. Niche is not easy to crossthread.


----------



## ooglewoogle (Oct 2, 2018)

DavecUK said:


> He was talking about Mazzers, they are easy to crossthread because the thread is quite fine and you have a lot more spring pressure. Niche is not easy to crossthread.


 Ah, thanks....apologies dsc, I misunderstood.


----------



## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

Planter said:


> Why would you though when sin﻿gle dosing?


 To get more even grind ? I never load my EG-1 with out motor is spinning, with conical grinder its even more important


----------



## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

ooglewoogle said:


> Is it possible to crossthread it? I'm not sure it is (easily)....you would need some force and intent. See above for more detail on what I am referencing. Thx.


No idea how easy it is on the Niche, but it is possible on any threaded collar. As Dave mentioned, Mazzer has four springs which push the collar upwards to reduce slack in the thread (good idea) but it also means that you have to push on the collar quite hard to engage the thread and this makes it prone to crossthreading.

T.


----------



## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

My main not like is the on/off switch on the side as most kitchen utensils are front mounted, and if space is tight it sticks out and can get caught when you are moving things next to it.

I'd rather it was somehow incorporated into the front badge and lit up the logo when powered on. It might cast a niChe logo shadow onto the workspace.

And the other thing - no Niche SubForum, yet... :good:


----------



## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

Agentb said:


> ...
> 
> And the other thing - no Niche SubForum, yet... :good:


 Oooh look ... a new Niche SubForum has adopted this thread. :good:


----------



## Rakesh (Jun 3, 2017)

With regards to popcorning and single dosing causing a wider grind distribution has anybody else had a read of this: https://coffeeadastra.com/2019/04/12/grind-quality-and-the-popcorning-effect/ (although its a forte that is used i'm pretty sure results could be likened to other flat burr grinders) seems to make a fair bit of sense and has decent data to back it up. I single dose my mazzer royal, with a modded doser I get like 0.3g retention on average, I did have a little anxiety about the effect my single dosing was having on grind distribution due to the lack of weight above the last couple of beans but I've never noticed much of a difference in the cup or pour when running a full hopper and this seemed to back that up.


----------



## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

Rakesh said:


> With regards to popcorning and single dosing causing a wider grind distribution has anybody else had a read of this: https://coffeeadastra.com/2019/04/12/grind-quality-and-the-popcorning-effect/ (although its a forte that is used i'm pretty sure results could be likened to other flat burr grinders) seems to make a fair bit of sense and has decent data to back it up. I single dose my mazzer royal, with a modded doser I get like 0.3g retention on average, I did have a little anxiety about the effect my single dosing was having on grind distribution due to the lack of weight above the last couple of beans but I've never noticed much of a difference in the cup or pour when running a full hopper and this seemed to back that up.


It's based on a filter sized grind which is way coarser than espresso, so single dosing affects it less. Also, the photo analysis method used is not proven and has never been compared to any other particle analysis method.

T.


----------



## Rakesh (Jun 3, 2017)

dsc said:


> It's based on a filter sized grind which is way coarser than espresso, so single dosing affects it less. Also, the photo analysis method used is not proven and has never been compared to any other particle analysis method.
> 
> T.


Cheers, must've missed the part where it says it was ground for filter.


----------



## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

Rakesh said:


> Cheers, must've missed the part where it says it was ground for filter.


I don't think it does (or I missed it myself), but Jonathan mentioned somewhere in the comments (in reply to my comment) that it was filter grind.

T.


----------



## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

I thought of a teeny "not like" that could easily be fixed with a marker pen.

My espresso grinds usually fall between 13 to 18. I'd like the mark for the 15 (and all the other 5s like 25,35 etc etc) to be a longer mark ( no need for a number) so it's easier to see them at a glance.

:good:


----------



## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

My early model has begun to 'creep' towards coarse during grinding. Only very slightly but needing to keep an eye on it. Is there a known fix for this?


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

lake_m said:


> My early model has begun to 'creep' towards coarse during grinding. Only very slightly but needing to keep an eye on it. Is there a known fix for this?


 Ask Niche to post a set of stronger springs, it will solve the issue. You must have a close fitting grinder where the burr slides up and down, although if it has only just started happening some lubricant may have got on the top plate pusher, even so, the springs will stop it.

Temporarily you can put a couple of small hard drive screws, one in the top of each spring to increase the length by 1.5mm which will also stop it while you wait...but be careful not to drop them into the chamber without realising when you screw the top on.


----------



## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

DavecUK said:


> Ask Niche to post a set of stronger springs, it will solve the issue. You must have a close fitting grinder where the burr slides up and down, although if it has only just started happening some lubricant may have got on the top plate pusher, even so, the springs will stop it.
> 
> Temporarily you can put a couple of small hard drive screws, one in the top of each spring to increase the length by 1.5mm which will also stop it while you wait...but be careful not to drop them into the chamber without realising when you screw the top on.


 Thanks Dave, I'll drop them a line.


----------



## joey24dirt (Jan 28, 2017)

There's spare springs under the wood isn't there.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

joey24dirt said:


> There's spare springs under the wood isn't there.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 How do you get to them?


----------



## joey24dirt (Jan 28, 2017)

lake_m said:


> How do you get to them?


Just remove that Allen bolt holding the wooden plate down. Should be under there 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

lake_m said:


> How do you get to them?


----------



## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

lake_m said:


> My early model has begun to 'creep' towards coarse during grinding. Only very slightly but needing to keep an eye on it. Is there a known fix for this?


Think someone else experienced this recently & cured it by cleaning it.


----------



## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

ashcroc said:


> lake_m said:
> 
> 
> > My early model has begun to 'creep' towards coarse during grinding. Only very slightly but needing to keep an eye on it. Is there a known fix for this?
> ...


 I've a had a response back from James at Niche (already!). Suggested cleaning in the first instance and then if that does not work he'll send me some stiffer springs as Dave already mentioned. Impressed with the level of support - both on here and at Niche HQ.


----------



## nicholasj (Nov 11, 2013)

Mine is fantastic.....why buy anything else!

However, it would be nice to have a slightly larger max bean weight.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

nicholasj said:


> Mine is fantastic.....why buy anything else!
> 
> However, it would be nice to have a slightly larger max bean weight.


 You could always weigh out say 80 or 100g if you want and then tip half of them in, then open the lid again and tip the other half in?


----------



## nicholasj (Nov 11, 2013)

DavecUK said:


> You could always weigh out say 80 or 100g if you want and then tip half of them in, then open the lid again and tip the other half in?


 Hmmm! Why didn't I think of that? ? cheers


----------



## PaulL (May 5, 2014)

When I grind someone 100g/150g (e.g. friends) that's exactly what I do, or I put a sandwich bag on the scales and top up to the point I have ground enough across 3 or 4 casual fills.


----------



## Ursego (Oct 18, 2018)

What I DON'T you like in my NZ? In fact, only one thing - if you grind directly into a portafilter, the coffee doesn't go directly to the basket center like a laser beam (as in other grinders, even much cheaper!). Instead, it flies around, making everything dirty. Why did the engineers do that??? Of course, the 58 mm cup saves the situation, but I would like to grind into my portafilter to remove extra steps from the process.

That is my only complaint, so the grinder is pretty close to being perfect. ???


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Ursego said:


> What I DON'T you like in my NZ? In fact, only one thing - if you grind directly into a portafilter, the coffee doesn't go directly to the basket center like a laser beam (as in other grinders, even much cheaper!). Instead, it flies around, making everything dirty. Why did the engineers do that??? Of course, the 58 mm cup saves the situation, but I would like to grind into my portafilter to remove extra steps from the process.
> 
> That is my only complaint, so the grinder is pretty close to being perfect. ???


 It wasnt designed to grind into a pf.


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

Mrboots2u said:


> ﻿ It wasnt designed to grind into a pf.


 It's still a fair complaint if you want take advantage of all the other Niche selling points but find yourself wanting to grind into the portafilter - wouldn't be my workflow but to each their own. It's quite interesting to see people hacking the base by adding the decent portafilter holder and other bits to make it work this way, which the construction of the bass makes very straightforward.


----------



## nicholasj (Nov 11, 2013)

catpuccino said:


> It's still a fair complaint if you want take advantage of all the other Niche selling points but find yourself wanting to grind into the portafilter - wouldn't be my workflow but to each their own. It's quite interesting to see people hacking the base by adding the decent portafilter holder and other bits to make it work this way, which the construction of the bass makes very straightforward.


 I agree. Is there anything on the market which is like the "Decent" portafilter holder or funnel but cost something reasonably acceptable?


----------



## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

nicholasj said:


> I agree. Is there anything on the market which is like the "Decent" portafilter holder or funnel but cost something reasonably acceptable?


 Buy a gridner not designed to use with a pf and complain it can't be used with a pf.

I mean hack it by all means but genuine complaint, words fail me sometimes.


----------



## Slowpress (Jun 11, 2019)

If one comes from a hand-grinding background, doing a cocktail shake &/or a WDT stir of grinds prior to pouring grinds into the portafilter is standard procedure. On the Niche, I've done it both ways... jerry-rigging a portafilter support (with funnel), which is not hard to do at all. However, I prefer using the supplied cup. Interestingly, some of the espresso gurus are now recommending doing the cocktail shake & stir in a cup, over dosing directly into a portafilter. ?‍♀


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Slowpress said:


> If one comes from a hand-grinding background, doing a cocktail shake &/or a WDT stir of grinds prior to pouring grinds into the portafilter is standard procedure. On the Niche, I've done it both ways... jerry-rigging a portafilter support (with funnel), which is not hard to do at all. However, I prefer using the supplied cup. Interestingly, some of the espresso gurus are now recommending doing the cocktail shake & stir in a cup, over dosing directly into a portafilter.


Wasn't the recommendation for the Niche always to use the cup? Grinding into the PF directly is something people chose to do, not the intended usage. I don't understand your last statement.


----------



## Slowpress (Jun 11, 2019)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Wasn't the recommendation for the Niche always to use the cup? Grinding into the PF directly is something people chose to do, not the intended usage. I don't understand your last statement.


 Sorry if I was unclear. My comment was not about Niche's recommendations. If anything, it was in support of Niche's recommendations.

I was referring to articles I have read (about single-dose grinders in general) that promote dosing from a grinder using a cup to stir grinds, rather than dosing directly into Portafilter. @ursego was indicating annoyance that the Niche did not supply a support for the pf... I was suggesting he might consider trying a different & recommended method than the one he was previously using. (Single-dose grinders can benefit by mixing the grind output in the dosing cup, or so I' e been told by espresso gurus.)

(I should have quoted ursego's earlier comment along with my post; might have been less confusing)


----------



## dopefish (Aug 13, 2019)

After having spent a week with my grinder I have a few comments on their quality control, which needs to improve a bit for product in this price range:

1. The wood is very rough to the touch at several spots and needs sanding + oiling. I know this can happen if it dries out during transport/storage, but since the machine was produced not that long ago it should not be the case.

2. One of the wooden feet is loose and spins around. Upon closer examination, it seems to have been carved out more aggressively than the other feet, resulting in a gap between the grinder casing and the wood.

3. There is a ~1 cm blemish on the bezel. Looks like dried paint residue. I have not been able to remove it, its bonded to the chrome quite strongly, and I don't know if a strong cleaner will damage the chrome.

4. The lid moves around a bit at the hinge. Makes it feel a kind of cheap and fragile.

Minor notes/suggestions:

In my opinion, they should draw less attention to the logos. Reduce the size of the huge emblem and remove the 'Niche' from the lid. Currently, they're being a bit too smug 

A larger funnel/more accomodating lid would be nice for grinding larger amounts of beans.

The magnet that keeps the lid closed is painted over. Looks a bit strange. I've seen models where this was not the case and it looked better.

Grind quality - no real complaints. Popcorning can be a bit annoying. Also, I have a hard time dialing in grind settings for coarse french press, going almost all the way counter-clockwise back to 'fine' to get decent results. Does anyone have a suggested setting for press?


----------



## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

dopefish said:


> After having spent a week with my grinder I have a few comments on their quality control, which needs to improve a bit for product in this price range:
> 
> One of the wooden feet is loose and spins around. Upon closer examination, it seems to have been carved out more aggressively than the other feet, resulting in a gap between the grinder casing and the wood.
> 
> Grind quality - no real complaints. Popcorning can be a bit annoying. Also, I have a hard time dialing in grind settings for coarse french press, going almost all the way counter-clockwise back to 'fine' to get decent results. Does anyone have a suggested setting for press?


 All 4 of my feet spin, I don't really see it as a problem.

Go as fine as you need for good result in French press, but not so fine that you get a silty cup. Finer for a small uninsulated brew (30-40?), coarser for a longer, insulated brew (I'd be surprised if you had to go coarser than middle of the hinge for a long steep in a double wall steel press).


----------



## Slowpress (Jun 11, 2019)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Wasn't the recommendation for the Niche always to use the cup? Grinding into the PF directly is something people chose to do, not the intended usage. I don't understand your last statement.


 It just now dawned on me one possible reason you may not have made any sense of my reply! ??‍♀ My portafilter is not sized to match the Niche cup diameter, so I always have to pour from the Niche cup into my pf; I can't do the "flip over" of cup directly into my pf, as so many of you can do. So, I stir in the Niche cup, then pour into my smaller diameter portafilter (and can do even more excessive WDT once the grinds are in my pf, should I choose to do so on my all too many "OCD" days!?.☺


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Slowpress said:


> It just now dawned on me one possible reason you may not have made any sense of my reply!  My portafilter is not sized to match the Niche cup diameter, so I always have to pour from the Niche cup into my pf; I can't do the "flip over" of cup directly into my pf, as so many of you can do. So, I stir in the Niche cup, then pour into my smaller diameter portafilter (and can do even more excessive WDT once the grinds are in my pf, should I choose to do so on my all too many "OCD" days!.


I see! Makes sense now. I think Niche will have some different size cups around d October time, so this will make life easier for those, like myself, don't have a 58mm basket to grind into.

I do, however, have a 58mm to 51mm funnel adapter. I use it everyday, works wonders!


----------



## -Mac (Aug 22, 2019)

Curious about the Niche - never used one or seen one in the flesh. Could a 30g (say) frustum of metal be made that you put on top of the beans, which would self-feed to weigh them down and stop popcorn-ing?


----------



## GrowlingDog (Apr 10, 2016)

For transferring coffee from Niche cup to portafilter, mine is 49mm all you need is a funnel.

A pringles lid helps reduce popcorning.


----------



## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

-Mac said:


> Curious about the Niche - never used one or seen one in the flesh. Could a 30g (say) frustum of metal be made that you put on top of the beans, which would self-feed to weigh them down and stop popcorn-ing?


A pringles lid reduces it somewhat.


----------



## Slowpress (Jun 11, 2019)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> I see! Makes sense now. I think Niche will have some different size cups around d October time, so this will make life easier for those, like myself, don't have a 58mm basket to grind into.
> 
> I do, however, have a 58mm to 51mm funnel adapter. I use it everyday, works wonders!


 Oh, smaller cup size would be great! Although I would have to be persuaded to change my well-established routine!?? (And, I'm at an age where that is easier said than done! LOL...


----------



## Polly (Jun 20, 2019)

Parallax between the pointer and the scale becomes a problem for espresso grinds. For users who buy one bag of beans and see it through to the end it is probably not much of an issue. For users who have several roasts on the go, one needs to remember to try to view the scale from the side at right angles to it. I estimate parallax introduces 3/4 division error.

The black ring could be rotated so the marker is to the front, on some arbitrary number, or I could add another marker, I suppose. But whenever I try this I erroneously move the calibration setting of the silver ring; it's pretty hard not to.. But a neater solution would be for re-design to include an easily moveable scale and pointer after calibration.


----------



## -Mac (Aug 22, 2019)

I don't like the popcorning (for aesthetics) but there's a fix coming for that (and a Pringles lid will do until then). Apart from that, it's all good AFAIC.


----------



## Gavin (Mar 30, 2014)

-Mac said:


> I don't like the popcorning (for aesthetics) but there's a fix coming for that (and a Pringles lid will do until then). Apart from that, it's all good AFAIC.


 Hi. Popcorning doesn't really bother me but I'm curious to hear what the fix is. Where did you hear about it?

Cheers


----------



## Inspector (Feb 23, 2017)

Gavin said:


> Hi. Popcorning doesn't really bother me but I'm curious to hear what the fix is. Where did you hear about it?
> 
> Cheers


 https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/2019/11/18/niche-flow-control-disk/


----------



## Polly (Jun 20, 2019)

The swaging on the neck of the stainless steel cup could usefully be a little further down the cup. If I use a 21g basket I find, if I am over-enthusiastic with my tap on the base, the cup sticks, by the swage, to the basket.


----------



## truegrace (Jan 29, 2014)

Inspector said:


> https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/2019/11/18/niche-flow-control-disk/


 Apparently these are going into manufacture at the start of this year, so will keep a look out for one


----------



## shodjoe1 (Apr 25, 2018)

Hi. Im wondering, is it a good grinder for light medium roast ? Cheers


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

shodjoe1 said:


> Hi. Im wondering, is it a good grinder for light medium roast ? Cheers


Works for me. I use it exclusively for such roast levels. I do think a few of us here do so too!


----------



## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

I'm wondering when the anti popcorning disk will be available. Even though it has an effect on grinder settings I just wont accept that conical has the same problem as flat in this respect. A lot of it can be stopped on flat anyway by putting a weight over the beans even when weighing in.

The main problem I found directly into the portafilter is insufficient clearance behind the spout also grinds being scattered around the grinder. Not many but in need of a hoover from time to time. This was early on for some of the time when Niche was in it's grinds with static mode. Not the early one where there is a lot of it. I fixed the scatter by folding over some aluminium foil a few times to get a strip about 25mm wide. Wrapped it around the spout and stuck a bit of sellotape on in to stop it unwinding.  It stayed in place and I could move it up and down. Bit of an increase in space for the portafilter as well. To really do anything about that the angle of the spout would need changing. Personally when I start looking at taste and shot consistency I think the cup is better. If a nice central heap came out into the portafilter that might not be the case but might still be due to other factors.

I had a month or so of cocktail shaking a several months ago - no thanks. It did look good for some runs of shots but would go really haywire at times. I always try anything for at least a month.

Stirring grinds doesn't look to be a good idea on the bean I use most often. I don't get clumps in the grinds but do if I stir - pretty firm ones and even a dissecting needle doesn't help. Better but it doesn't really achieve anything for me. This could be just down to very oily beans. Currently I've switched to a heavier tamp one at "traditional" levels. This might relate to not stirring so need to revisit that. Result is a better god shot via a cleaner taste. I do mostly get those for the prep method I find work but this one is better and surprisingly hasn't reduced taste but does need a coarser grind setting.

I have had a few funnies of late so will be keeping a close watch on the grind setting. My spring pressure is likely to be higher than others. I'm currently grinding at 5. It's drifted down as the burrs have run in. Was a little under 10 initially, went to 7-8 over a few months. I need to check if the ring has moved. If it has not done by me. My roaster is very consistent in this area. Often new batches don't need any change at all and tiny ones if they do. An airscape helps keep things consistent until the beans run well down to the bottom and fridge before they go in that, helps keep things stable. The last few shots out of the airscape often need a grinder tweak.

The fridge might be working out as it congeals the coating of oil on the beans.  They go very dull.

If some one is using it with smaller baskets the grind can off a cheap hand grinder might be an option. They are likely to go entirely into a Sage basket but could be a better option than tipping them in from the standard can. Some people might be able to make a ring to fit to prevent them going right in.

The only thing I don't like about Niche is having to level the grinds when they are in the filter basket. Shaking them about sometimes levels and sometimes doesn't. As I use 30sec fixed shots this can change the output so need to be rather careful when I level it manually. If truly suitable for use straight into a portafilter I suspect it would need a new casting kit. I don't think something on the end of the spout would help unless we got the brushes out again.

John

-


----------



## tohenk2 (Oct 11, 2017)

For leveling the grinds you can use any OCD-type. For distributing I use the BPlus LaPavoni stirrer, it is way finer than other stirrers - and I never had any clumps or holes because of it. https://www.bplus.biz/products/the-stirrer-for-la-pavoni-machine-owner-4k-members-limited-edition (If I feel the need to stir in the cup I use the Londinium one, that one is a bit longer).

I do look forward to playing with the Nurri device to distribute and level the grinds.


----------



## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

I obviously get a little popcorning on the Niche but was round a fellow coffee 'nut's' and noticed a lot more popcorning and for a much longer period than I've ever had on mine.

I never asked (being a relative newbie, though I should have!) and have since wondered whether it could have been lighter roasted beans than I ever use on mine, that are harder and more prone to bounce, or could it be using a finer grind setting than I usually use on mine?

On the original question, there is nothing I don't like about my 'mantis' so far.


----------



## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

ratty said:


> I obviously get a little popcorning on the Niche but was round a fellow coffee 'nut's' and noticed a lot more popcorning and for a much longer period than I've ever had on mine.
> 
> I never asked (being a relative newbie, though I should have!) and have since wondered whether it could have been lighter roasted beans than I ever use on mine, that are harder and more prone to bounce, or could it be using a finer grind setting than I usually use on mine?
> 
> On the original question, there is nothing I don't like about my 'mantis' so far.


 Could be due to physically bigger beans like Pacamara.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I was just wondering how many other threads there are that are active, where people are asked to criticise a product? I would hazard a guess that there are more happy Niche customers than unhappy, so perhaps someone who wants to, can start a counter thread to this?


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

dfk41 said:


> I was just wondering how many other threads there are that are active, where people are asked to criticise a product? I would hazard a guess that there are more happy Niche customers than unhappy, so perhaps someone who wants to, can start a counter thread to this?


 Hmm. This thread was started because of the near-universal praise/hype/admiration the Niche gets, often against key buying considerations like price and (lack of) competition. I take your point that the thread concentrates criticism in a way that some other products don't receive, but the fact this thread was started at all is quite an endorsement of the Niche.

@Polly I agree re parallax errors with the factory marker. When I added my secondary marker at the 180degree point I made it an arrow which helps though this is more or less of a problem depending where you place your grinder (mine's offset to the right).


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

@catpuccino

No one minds criticism, as after all, without it, how could anyone expect to improve? Assuming that the Niche Zero was not 100% perfect, looking at it from a design/functionality point of view, then anything that can suggest a fault or improvement would be most welcome. The discussion on here for example around pop corning has led to a design improvement so that hopefully, within a few weeks something will be available for owners that deals with that problem. Thats a good example!

I wonder when Kafatek or Versalab or other single dose grinder manufacturers will realise that pop corning is a feature of single dose grinding and offer their loyal customers a really inexpensive remedy!


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

dfk41 said:


> @catpuccino
> 
> No one minds criticism, as after all, without it, how could anyone expect to improve? Assuming that the Niche Zero was not 100% perfect, looking at it from a design/functionality point of view, then anything that can suggest a fault or improvement would be most welcome. The discussion on here for example around pop corning has led to a design improvement so that hopefully, within a few weeks something will be available for owners that deals with that problem. Thats a good example!
> 
> I wonder when Kafatek or Versalab or other single dose grinder manufacturers will realise that pop corning is a feature of single dose grinding and offer their loyal customers a really inexpensive remedy!


 All agreed, I just thought you were suggesting a counter thread as you put it for things people *do* like about the Niche which I thought was well trodden ground.

Send me over either one of those grinders and I'll see they get the message ?


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

catpuccino said:


> All agreed, I just thought you were suggesting a counter thread as you put it for things people *do* like about the Niche which I thought was well trodden ground.
> 
> Send me over either one of those grinders and I'll see they get the message ?


 Ha! is all I have to say to you......LOL I thought you had a Niche? If you want to drive up to Newcastle I will gladly lend you my CP for a week or so. Just say the word matey


----------



## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

dfk41 said:


> @catpuccino
> 
> No one minds criticism, as after all, without it, how could anyone expect to improve? Assuming that the Niche Zero was not 100% perfect, looking at it from a design/functionality point of view, then anything that can suggest a fault or improvement would be most welcome. The discussion on here for example around pop corning has led to a design improvement so that hopefully, within a few weeks something will be available for owners that deals with that problem. Thats a good example!
> 
> I wonder when Kafatek or Versalab or other single dose grinder manufacturers will realise that pop corning is a feature of single dose grinding and offer their loyal customers a really inexpensive remedy!


 I can say that the Versalab does popcorn and often find bits of beans dotted around my work-top. The only difference I can see though is the conical burrs in the M3 don't actually grind but are pre-breakers which feed the flat burrs under them. I doubt that anything that gets to the flats is going to popcorn. I'm guessing the conicals have the same effect as the auger on the Mythos.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Rhys said:


> I can say that the Versalab does popcorn and often find bits of beans dotted around my work-top. The only difference I can see though is the conical burrs in the M3 don't actually grind but are pre-breakers which feed the flat burrs under them. I doubt that anything that gets to the flats is going to popcorn. I'm guessing the conicals have the same effect as the auger on the Mythos.


 I had a Versalab once! Me and Bondy bought them at the same time and they were delivered on the same day! I used it extensively for a week then realised me and single dosing really did not like each other very much, so 10 out of 10 to you Rhys for sticking with it!


----------



## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

dfk41 said:


> I had a Versalab once! Me and Bondy bought them at the same time and they were delivered on the same day! I used it extensively for a week then realised me and single dosing really did not like each other very much, so 10 out of 10 to you Rhys for sticking with it!


 Mine is Bondy's old one with the 'Franked' bit on. I think one of the 'Franked' bits is the rotating collar/bean feeder/adjuster bit as it's designed to reduce popcorning.

At one point I couldn't get on with it and just used the EK with doser. Then I started using it more as I got used to it and stopped using the EK. So much so I have now sold the EK so have no choice now :classic_rolleyes: . I only do single dosing anyway so works for me tbf. I think if I just stuck to one bean I would've bought a Mythos and had done with it.

I still have the Niche, though not at mine; although I do still have my Major if I'm desperate for a larger flat.


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

While this thread is regarding the Niche it seems everyone is mentioning other grinders . . .

The MAX doesn't popcorn. My Flat didn't either.


----------



## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

MildredM said:


> While this thread is regarding the Niche it seems everyone is mentioning other grinders . . .
> 
> The MAX doesn't popcorn. My Flat didn't either.


 Do you mean MY Flat ?


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

MildredM said:


> While this thread is regarding the Niche it seems everyone is mentioning other grinders . . .
> 
> The MAX doesn't popcorn. My Flat didn't either.


 Genuine question M, as I have never seen a Kafatek product. What does it do to avoid pop corning. I just presumed that wherever there was a lack of weight you would suffer to some degree


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> Genuine question M, as I have never seen a Kafatek product. What does it do to avoid pop corning. I just presumed that wherever there was a lack of weight you would suffer to some degree


 MAX has an impeller, or more correctly, a bean turbine. It helps feed the beans in more evenly.


----------



## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

dfk41 said:


> I had a Versalab once! Me and Bondy bought them at the same time and they were delivered on the same day! I used it extensively for a week then realised me and single dosing really did not like each other very much, so 10 out of 10 to you Rhys for sticking with it!


 Why did you buy two Niche then ? .. Do you fill it up ..?


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

Nicknak said:


> Do you mean MY Flat ?


 I do ?


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Nicknak said:


> Why did you buy two Niche then ? .. Do you fill it up ..?


 Thats easy to answer.....one for me and one for my son of course. Plus they were kind of a special deal if you backed them as an early bird......plus I wanted to support Martins venture since he and I had chatted extensively pre production, though I must stress, I had absolutely Zero to coin a phrase input into it......LOL


----------



## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

dfk41 said:


> Thats easy to answer.....one for me and one for my son of course. Plus they were kind of a special deal if you backed them as an early bird......plus I wanted to support Martins venture since he and I had chatted extensively pre production, though I must stress, I had absolutely Zero to coin a phrase input into it......LOL


 Sorry Dave .. I was pulling your leg over Single dosing and you not getting on ?


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

MildredM said:


> MAX has an impeller, or more correctly, a bean turbine. It helps feed the beans in more evenly.


 I am intrigued! Could you post a short video. The Mythos has an auger which is supposed to pull beans into the grinder but it still needs weight behind it. What is the most amount of beans you can get into it? Just thinking for example, if it held 60 gm, you could put that amount in and them grind 4 lots of 15 gm and compare the grind size.

Pop corning does not really bother me as I just view it as a necessary evil but it would be nice to see how they have overcome it M


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Nicknak said:


> Sorry Dave .. I was pulling your leg over Single dosing and you not getting on ?


 I know.....I was just being facetious.....as my health improves, so does my mind!


----------



## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

dfk41 said:


> I know.....I was just being facetious.....as my health improves, so does my mind!


 Are you sure ????


----------



## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

shodjoe1 said:


> Hi. Im wondering, is it a good grinder for light medium roast ? Cheers


 not for me compared with flat burs and drm, but for medium and above is good


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> I am intrigued! Could you post a short video. The Mythos has an auger which is supposed to pull beans into the grinder but it still needs weight behind it. What is the most amount of beans you can get into it? Just thinking for example, if it held 60 gm, you could put that amount in and them grind 4 lots of 15 gm and compare the grind size.
> 
> Pop corning does not really bother me as I just view it as a necessary evil but it would be nice to see how they have overcome it M


 Denis has a vid:

https://forums.kafatek.com/t/monolith-max-new-feature-bean-turbine/732/10


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

dfk41 said:


> I am intrigued! Could you post a short video. The Mythos has an auger which is supposed to pull beans into the grinder but it still needs weight behind it. What is the most amount of beans you can get into it? Just thinking for example, if it held 60 gm, you could put that amount in and them grind 4 lots of 15 gm and compare the grind size.
> 
> Pop corning does not really bother me as I just view it as a necessary evil but it would be nice to see how they have overcome it M


 Not sure what this would prove? It's a single doser


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

MildredM said:


> Denis has a vid:
> 
> https://forums.kafatek.com/t/monolith-max-new-feature-bean-turbine/732/10


 Thanks M but it requires an account to log in. I understand how a mechanism might aid getting beans into the grind chamber in a uniform manner, but I do not understand how that can also have an impact on the last beans to go through, becoming coarser as there is nothing to push them through


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

coffeechap said:


> Not sure what this would prove? It's a single doser


 All it proves (or not) is that the Kaffatek suffers from the same problems all other single losers do, which is the last beans to go through have nowt behind them to push, therefore affecting the grind. M assures us that the Max etc does not popcorn. That is hard to understand for the likes of me who does not own one and has not really looked into them at all. SO I wondered if M could show us


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> Thanks M but it requires an account to log in. I understand how a mechanism might aid getting beans into the grind chamber in a uniform manner, but I do not understand how that can also have an impact on the last beans to go through, becoming coarser as there is nothing to push them through


 Ohhh sorry about that. Denis posted his vid on Insta a while ago. I will try and take a vid tomorrow though


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

It doesn't prove a thing? The versa;ab does not popcorn and when run off is sorted, it's a fantastic single doser the kafatek has a proven fan base as well, the r120 has nompopcorning or grind degradation nor the Ek43


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

coffeechap said:


> It doesn't prove a thing? The versa;ab does not popcorn and when run off is sorted, it's a fantastic single doser the kafatek has a proven fan base as well, the r120 has nompopcorning or grind degradation nor the Ek43


 Rhys says his M3 popcorns......just because you have a fan base, does not make it a good product, or that seems to be your thoughts in reverse when comparing the Kaffatek to the Niche? Never tried an R120 or EK. Presumably they have a very wide aperture designed to munch through kilos at a time, so a relatively small dose of beans simply goes straight in...?


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Still comparing a £500 quid domestic grinder to heavyweights I see......


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

Struggling to hold torch, press the button and video. Here's a photo showing the turbine, the 'chutes' fling the beans off to the edges/sides meaning they don't get chance to bounce up. Don't go picking over my words, I know what I mean!!


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

dfk41 said:


> Still comparing a £500 quid domestic grinder to heavyweights I see......


 Not at all, the hg 1 is the match of the niche and can be bought from China direct for 400! The heavy weights have heavy weight materials and motors and not a £10 motor (just saying)


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

MildredM said:


> Struggling to hold torch, press the button and video. Here's a photo showing the turbine, the 'chutes' fling the beans off to the edges/sides meaning they don't get chance to bounce up. Don't go picking over my words, I know what I mean!!
> 
> View attachment 35617


 Only 10 grind settings? Rubbish, better off with a Baratza.

:classic_ninja:


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

dfk41 said:


> Rhys says his M3 popcorns......just because you have a fan base, does not make it a good product, or that seems to be your thoughts in reverse when comparing the Kaffatek to the Niche? Never tried an R120 or EK. Presumably they have a very wide aperture designed to munch through kilos at a time, so a relatively small dose of beans simply goes straight in...?


 The m3 popcorns in the first phase which is not the finishing phase as you are fully aware of having owned an m3, the romanian copy does the same job at £1000, my chopped mythos produces much better grind quality than the niche, cost less too!


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

As has been pointed out to me by someone who is far more knowledgeable, KafaTek had already realised that popcorning was a feature of single dose grinding. However, they do not need to offer their loyal customers a retrospective, really inexpensive remedy. They actually had the foresight to address this already by suspending an anti-popcorn deflector above the rotating burr of the conical.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

MildredM said:


> As has been pointed out to me by someone who is far more knowledgeable, KafaTek had already realised that popcorning was a feature of single dose grinding. However, they do not need to offer their loyal customers a retrospective, really inexpensive remedy. They actually had the foresight to address this already by suspending an anti-popcorn deflector above the rotating burr of the conical.


 All looks very nice M. All I am doing is asking questions. AM not out to suggest or prove that your grinder is Better or worse than any other. Whilst I can see that the playground roundabout (takes me back) device will certainly help feed evenly beans in, that has to be with a weight behind it. If you dose at 15 gm, then once there is nothing left to push them through, or probably more accurately, once there is not enough beans to cover the device, then those remaining beans are not influenced at all and left to their own devices. Which is why you must get hubby to help you take a video of it grinding a single dose for us.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

coffeechap said:


> my chopped mythos produces much better grind quality than the niche, cost less too!


 Pretty irrelevant unless you can supply and sell for the same price matey......and in the same sentence Romanian and Chinese copies.....I bought some Cadburys chocolate the other day. It was really beautiful and cheap, but I am sure it was spelt with a 'K'


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

dfk41 said:


> Pretty irrelevant unless you can supply and sell for the same price matey......and in the same sentence Romanian and Chinese copies.....I bought some Cadburys chocolate the other day. It was really beautiful and cheap, but I am sure it was spelt with a 'K'


 Not really as I will produce detailed instructions on how someone could do it themselves! Mine when I have completed it will be around £700 To someone so not that far away, and it will last a lot longer I can assure you


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

coffeechap said:


> Not really as I will produce detailed instructions on how someone could do it themselves! Mine when I have completed it will be around £700 To someone so not that far away, and it will last a lot longer I can assure you


 Of course it is irrelevant! Niche have successfully sold a lot of grinders off the shelf, all over the world.....not given some diy instructions to follow, always assuming that you can find a donor machine to cannibalise and praying to the grinder gods that it does not have anything wrong with it or needs burrs or any spare parts as we all know how much anything Mythos related costs......but there again it is a commercial.......so, it really is an irrelevant comparison, to me anyway!


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> All looks very nice M. All I am doing is asking questions. AM not out to suggest or prove that your grinder is Better or worse than any other. Whilst I can see that the playground roundabout (takes me back) device will certainly help feed evenly beans in, that has to be with a weight behind it. If you dose at 15 gm, then once there is nothing left to push them through, or probably more accurately, once there is not enough beans to cover the device, then those remaining beans are not influenced at all and left to their own devices. Which is why you must get hubby to help you take a video of it grinding a single dose for us.


 Maybe just get a MAX and see for yourself


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Sorry, is this a five minute argument or the full half hour. Ok, put me together 125 chopped Mythi please for 2 weeks tomorrow.......oops, you cannot.......I am simply countering your argument so it is actually you who are counter arguing my statement! I see the eventually word has now crept in as well. Simple truth is you have been able to produce a nice looking one off Mythos and no one could argue with that. But, whilst you might indeed be able to produce the odd one from time to time, it will never go beyond that because you are not able to control the process, whereas Niche, since that is who we are discussing, are fully in control and supplying a brand new grinder with warranty and brand new parts for £500. Shortfalls it may've, though I am not aware of any of the alleged £10 motors breaking down yet etc etc etc.....


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

MildredM said:


> Maybe just get a MAX and see for yourself


 At one time I would have M, but cannot afford it now so I rely upon the generosity of other owners to show me their claims


----------



## Hasi (Dec 27, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> At one time I would have M, but cannot afford it now so I rely upon the generosity of other owners to show me their claims


also you couldn't afford 125 chopped Mythi within two weeks mate  please cancel your order before it's too late!!


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

dfk41 said:


> Sorry, is this a five minute argument or the full half hour. Ok, put me together 125 chopped Mythi please for 2 weeks tomorrow.......oops, you cannot.......


 Perhaps niche can't either! And the eventually statement is I want to at least have a play with the mini mythos before moving it on, surely not even you would begrudge me that pleasure?


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> At one time I would have M, but cannot afford it now so I rely upon the generosity of other owners to show me their claims


 The fact that you won't take my word for it tells me everything.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Hasi said:


> also you couldn't afford 125 chopped Mythi within two weeks mate
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Actually, I could with ease if I really wanted to, and in cash without borrowing one penny


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

coffeechap said:


> Perhaps niche can't either! And the eventually statement is I want to at least have a play with the mini mythos before moving it on, surely not even you would begrudge me that pleasure?


 I don't begrudge you anything matey. I would have had a play to make sure it was as good as you hope, before making bold claims.......


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

MildredM said:


> The fact that you won't take my word for it tells me everything.


 Interesting.....Einsteins Theory of relativity.....Please explain that to us Mr Einstein......no, just take my word for it........works every time!


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

dfk41 said:


> Pretty irrelevant unless you can supply and sell for the same price matey......and in the same sentence Romanian and Chinese copies.....I bought some Cadburys chocolate the other day. It was really beautiful and cheap, but I am sure it was spelt with a 'K'


 Isn't niche made in China? The hg1 is made in China too and it is not a copy that the can buy the same grinder without the logo.


----------



## Hasi (Dec 27, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> At one time I would have M, but cannot afford it now so I rely upon the generosity of other owners to show me their claims





dfk41 said:


> Actually, I could with ease if I really wanted to, and in cash without borrowing one penny


well then...  Dave there's work to do!

I'm in for the fun of it, btw happily sold my Niche in due course


----------



## KingoftheHeath (Nov 22, 2019)

Hate to go off on a tangent from the ongoing debate...

After a month of use I have two minor niggles, both of which could be fixed by Niche pretty easily I'm sure:

1. Markings - easy to go cross eyed trying to figure out the dots. An earlier post recommended adding a longer line at each halfway point; I've just done this using a white chalk pen and I can already see that it's going to make things easier. See photo

2. Red light is slightly annoying. Though now I think about it, the TV has a constant red light and I think nothing of it... Think I might just have had an epiphany to help me get over that niggle! Will be easier just flicking the switch in the morning and having action, rather than forgetting each time and having to reach for the plug socket.









Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk


----------



## 7493 (May 29, 2014)

coffeechap said:


> the one that i will eventually sell, will be perfect, immaculate and £700, which you fail to acknowledge! But never let a good counter argument get in the way of facts


 My Niche cost me £350, half the price of your customised Mythos. I'd love a Mythos and it would suit me at least as well as the Niche. It might or might not do a better job and it would certainly last longer but for me, now, it's an economic no-brainer.


----------



## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> Interesting.....Einsteins Theory of relativity.....Please explain that to us Mr Einstein......no, just take my word for it........works every time!


 Shared my video over on my 'How things look here' thread seeing as it's not really relevant to this thread


----------



## Slowpress (Jun 11, 2019)




----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

> 20 minutes ago, Slowpress said:


 Many thanks for that......yep, definitely no pop corning (if you close your eyes!)


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Rob666 said:


> My Niche cost me £350, half the price of your customised Mythos. I'd love a Mythos and it would suit me at least as well as the Niche. It might or might not do a better job and it would certainly last longer but for me, now, it's an economic no-brainer.


 Apologies was quoting current prices


----------



## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

Popcorning isn't actually an issue though is it, it's flow rate into the grinder. If you feed a bean at a time into the grinder it'll skit over the burrs and pop out but they'll all do that and you'll get a tighter range of sizes than if you dump the whole dose in and grind away. I think people tend to focus on what they can see or perceive through other sense (like taste for instance) when things are very difficult to measure. To really measure your grinders distribution you probably need some lab equipment like an electron microscope(?), sieves would probably not be adequate...but I was thinking, if it's established that the flow rate into the grinder is the thing that determines whether or not it'll produce a tight distribution (a weight pushes them down at an even rate, the NFC drops one in at a time and stops the burrs filling, an auger feeds bean in steadily) surely you can just measure flow rate out to get an idea of how steadily the beans are being ground? The logic being if the flow rate out is steady then the burrs are not filling with coffee at the start any more than they are at the end which is surely what affects grind consistency?

Some of us have scales that allow flow rate tracking. Any grinder with a verticle or angled grind path could really be tested in this way. You would of course only have something correlative and have to accept the presupposition that the tightest grind distribution (for that grinder with its alignment and burrs) is achieved when flow rate out is consistent through the dose...


----------



## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

Because topic went to different direction this rotor works best with beans flow and anti-popcorning.


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

L&R said:


> Because topic went to different direction this rotor works best with beans flow and anti-popcorning.
> 
> View attachment 35624


 Ah the versalab burr set!


----------



## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

As far as I know they are Invented and patended by DRM, implemented in Cimbali grinders, after them Versalab, Titus etc. but the idea is the same.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I posted on another thread, that the Monolith obviously popcorns as much as most single dose grinders do, and the result was that Dennis came up with a solution, much the same as Niche did which was to aid/control the flow of beans into the grinder. This might solve pop corning but it does nothing to solve grind quality deteriorating. The Niche thing offers a better solution as it restricts the bean flow into the grinder in a uniform way, whereas the Monolith solution seems to merely stop pop corning.

Either way, it is a good grinder, without doubt. I am not trying to knock it and I understand why owners defend it in the same way as Niche and Decent owners protect their items....they believe in them


----------



## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

It was easy to do this in the end, just had to remove the two wooden bits and stick the scales on the base. I tried yesterday just removing the screw but the vibrations moved the bottom wood bit and the scales and cup with it and the readings were everywhere. I tested the grinder empty first to make sure vibrations didn't cause the reading to fluctuate and luckily it constantly read zero. No idea how relevant this is at all, but the hypothesis is pretty simple: a given grinder will produce its tightest grind distribution when grind speed remains consistent. There are a number of indicators that this is true, a full hopper ensures a consistent feed rate as does a weight on a smaller dose when single dosing, alternatively an auger system can feed the burrs steadily or the burrs can be so large that a small dose sits almost entirely in the breaker zone and gets ground in a couple of seconds. With variable speed grinders on the market there's a possibility to test this idea further simply by grinding two doses at different speeds and checking to see if shot time changes, though confirming changes to particle distribution would require specialised equipment, it would seem safe to assume that by changing only speed you wouldn't see shot time change if it has no effect on distribution as the burrs remain the same distance apart.

The graph from my scales app shows that the grind speed is very consistent for the Niche, though at the start there is obviously a void to fill once that is taken care of it grinds consistently through the dose at about 1.5g/s until 6 seconds in you see a small spike in speed, this could be due to a small amount of clumping but the the Niche doesn't clump a lot at all, and at this point it has ground about 7g of a 17.2g dose so I think at this point you see the burrs are filling up. On 11 seconds you see an identical spike to the one on 7 seconds so these two small spike I'm attributing to clumping and the two larger on 6-8 I'm betting the burrs are full and are therefore grinding at their max speed. Then of course you see a drop off from 12 seconds as the last 2g are ground.

So to sum up:

Burrs empty, filling consistently until 6 seconds when they are full, they grind at a faster rate until 8 seconds, from 9 seconds the burrs start to empty again and then you see a drop off in speed as the dose drops to its last 2 grams from 12-15 seconds.

When I get the NFC I'll test again. Given total grind time doesn't significantly change I'll expect to see the spike at 6-8 seconds disappear, a speed of slightly less than 1.5g/s throughout the dose. The slowdown will happen because the grind chamber has to empty but I should think it will be a less gradual decline.

EDIT: Thinking about it the grinder chamber filling and emptying could skew measures a little, at the start for example the grind chamber will have a small void to fill and at the end it will slowly empty. This should correlate to what is happening with coffee between the burrs. Maybe the slight drop on 12 seconds is a significant indicator that the burr chamber is starting to empty around 13/14g in to a 17.2g dose. Regardless of how the burr chamber might influence things I'd expect the peaks between 6-9 seconds to disappear. *This test is not supposed to mean anything by itself, DaveC's testing of splitting doses is far superior, allowing testing of results, and can be done on any grinder. This is just an alternative to the very poor visual measure of 'popcorning' and is quantifiable and comparable whereas "I can see beans jumping around" isn't.*


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Incredible spelling on your scale app!


----------



## KingoftheHeath (Nov 22, 2019)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Incredible spelling on your scale app!


I think it's the Australian spelling.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk


----------



## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Incredible spelling on your scale app!


 I didn't even notice! ? to be fair though I never look at that, just the bars. It's a terrible app.


----------



## Inspector (Feb 23, 2017)

Rob1 said:


> I didn't even notice! ? to be fair though I never look at that, just the bars.


 Apparently developer did the same


----------



## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

If I was looking for an alternative to Niche and was as rich as M I would be buying one of the grinders she uses and not one of the others that are about.

I don't seem to get as much pop corning as some I have seen but achieved near zero the other day.  I decided to try grinding my beans straight from the fridge so the oil on them was congealed. None starter really as the can will pick up moisture each time it's opened. One interesting feature was that I would have to set a coarser grind if I carried on doing this - change of about 3~4 secs at the end of the flow.  Makes me happier about what the disc is effectively doing - evenly loading the burrs.

John

-


----------



## tonnesofquestions (Feb 21, 2020)

The oak clashed with the Lelit Bianca, a couple of hours later and some Briwax (Walnut) got me the desired look! To those who have done the same to their machines thanks for the inspiration


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

Looks great @tonnesofquestions


----------



## Northern_Monkey (Sep 11, 2018)

tonnesofquestions said:


> The oak clashed with the Lelit Bianca, a couple of hours later and some Briwax (Walnut) got me the desired look! To those who have done the same to their machines thanks for the inspiration
> 
> View attachment 36494


 @tonnesofquestions - Looks awesome, I might need to do similar to match my Mara walnut bits. Did you apply on the out the box finish or did rub down at all?


----------



## tonnesofquestions (Feb 21, 2020)

Northern_Monkey said:


> @tonnesofquestions - Looks awesome, I might need to do similar to match my Mara walnut bits. Did you apply on the out the box finish or did rub down at all?


 I used ultra fine grade steel wire wool to apply the Briwax directly on to the out of the box finish. And then buffed off with a lint free cloth. The main wooden plate needed 3 or 4 passes. Everything else was good with 1-2 passes of briwax.

For the feet though, I used sandpaper lightly because mine were a little on the rough side. Only remove one back foot at a time, they have much longer screws and look like they hold parts of the machine together.


----------



## Northern_Monkey (Sep 11, 2018)

@tonnesofquestions Cheers for that, will get a tub ordered as I have some ultra fine wire wool already.


----------



## Carlo (Dec 6, 2019)

What I don't like: the dosing cup. It's a great idea but badly executed. The "lip" that goes inside the portafilter is far too long, leaving a deep gap at the edge of the puck. The ridge fills with coffee which sticks inside and even tapping doesn't help. It could be so much better (see the Acaia small size).


----------



## KingoftheHeath (Nov 22, 2019)

That's strange, I get the ridge but it is immediately sorted by a couple of downwards taps of pf on tamping mat then a few palm taps to distribute the bed evenly.

Do you get edge channeling?


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

Yeah I tap downwards and wdt with a tool so this doesn't bother me, personally feel niche benefits from wdt more than just a shake in the cup especially at finer end so is part of my workflow


----------



## Carlo (Dec 6, 2019)

I mainly use dark roasted Italian blends, they tend to stick unless RDT. I don't get edge channeling but only because I do a lot of tapping and prepping. Also, when using the single basket the ridge doesn't seal the edge of the basket because the edge of the cup hits the bottom of the basket, leaving the ridge 2-3 mm from the edge of the basket


----------



## Michael87 (Sep 20, 2019)

My minor irritation is that about 0.2-0.4g is stuck in the chute every time and I need to tap the machine a few times to get it out. It just makes the workflow a little cumbersome. Emailed the makers who said it's normal behaviour, but I didn't hear anything about this issue reading online before I bought it.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Michael87 said:


> My minor irritation is that about 0.2-0.4g is stuck in the chute every time and I need to tap the machine a few times to get it out. It just makes the workflow a little cumbersome. Emailed the makers who said it's normal behaviour, but I didn't hear anything about this issue reading online before I bought it.


 I would immediately ask for a refund on wha can only be considered a major design flaw.....unless the beans you are using have static which might be down to a number of factors. If that irritates you, then for goodness sake do not join in the CV threads or the MC2 owners thread!


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Michael87 said:


> My minor irritation is that about 0.2-0.4g is stuck in the chute every time and I need to tap the machine a few times to get it out. It just makes the workflow a little cumbersome. Emailed the makers who said it's normal behaviour, but I didn't hear anything about this issue reading online before I bought it.


Is this a joke? Have you had any other grinders to compare against? I kind of understand if this is your first grinder and you just assume this is the norm. Trust me, 0.4g is nothing. Suggestion: don't tap the machine. Just leave it alone.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Is this a joke? Have you had any other grinders to compare against? I kind of understand if this is your first grinder and you just assume this is the norm. Trust me, 0.4g is nothing. Suggestion: don't tap the machine. Just leave it alone.


 It's exactly what happens when a thread like this is created.....


----------



## Michael87 (Sep 20, 2019)

Well it annoys me a little because it's a lot of money for a grinder with a clear USP of no retention.

It's not a huge amount but enough to need to correct for because it's giving me +/- 1g of variability. I think that makes a difference.

And the value of this thread for me is finding out if anyone else has the same experience.


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

Michael87 said:


> Well it annoys me a little because it's a lot of money for a grinder with a clear USP of no retention.
> 
> It's not a huge amount but enough to need to correct for because it's giving me +/- 1g of variability. I think that makes a difference.
> 
> And the value of this thread for me is finding out if anyone else has the same experience.


 That's not my experience, no. If I put 18g in, I get between 17.95 and 18g out reliability, certainly never up to 1g.

Stop knocking grinds out of the chute though, there'll always be a buildup in and around there just like the rest of the nooks and crannies of the grinder. Old grounds will settle there and actually reduce the retention for doses that follow.

..

Reminds me....I need to order that NFC disk.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Michael87 said:


> Well it annoys me a little because it's a lot of money for a grinder with a clear USP of no retention.
> 
> It's not a huge amount but enough to need to correct for because it's giving me +/- 1g of variability. I think that makes a difference.
> 
> And the value of this thread for me is finding out if anyone else has the same experience.




How is 0.2g - 0.4g stuck in the chute giving you +/- 1g of variability


In what way is it making a difference (you said think)?


How are you correcting for it?


Does your scale measure down to 0.01 of a gram?


That information might get a response of value to you. If not and you are still not happy, sell it and get one of the magical grinders for 2-3K.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

catpuccino said:


> Reminds me....I need to order that NFC disk.


 Contact me via pm, send an SAE and I will send you one for nothing.


----------



## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

Its actually a cheap grinder for what it does, imo


----------



## Michael87 (Sep 20, 2019)

Leads to 1g variability because it sometimes all falls out. Sometimes I find a pile in the cup because it's fallen out between uses.

I think it makes a difference because everyone here says measure to 0.1g. I correct by tapping the machine for about 5s each grind (a bit annoying). And no a 0.1g scale.


----------



## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Zero retention (0.00g) in anyone's realistic book is less than +/- 0.5g 95 times out of 100. Remember, in the past grinders have routinely held a few whole grams in the chute after grinding. You can't dose to 0.00g in, so it's not reasonable to expect a difference of 0.00g out.

I measured my Niche with 0.01g scales and found I got +/-0.18g to one standard deviation over 30 grinds with typical adjustments, so about 2/3 of the time. You might extrapolate that to +/-0.4g 95/100.

0.18g is about a bean's worth and 1% of an 18g dose...it won't make any difference.

You can't use 0.1g scales to determine consistency to 0.1g.

Either:

tap after grind finishes,

don't tap,

tap & discard just before the next grind, after static has dissipated,

or add another bean before grinding and trim your dose before transferring to PF

...or, easiest, weigh out your dose precisely as you can (which can only be to +/-0.05g anyway without chopping individual beans) grind, remove the cup straight away & brew. It's far more likely that inconsistency will come from other aspects of prep/brewing which you can eliminate quite easily.


----------



## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

There isn't a single grinder that's zero retention/zero exchange.

The burrs will always be able to hold on to some. Even the OE Pharos with no sweeper arms of grinds chamber where coffee can collect has up to 0.25g retention. Anyone who has ever taken one apart will have fond coffee under the outer burr and on the axle and bushings.

The retained grind you're complaining about is not really relevant. Stop tapping the grinder. Pull two shots back to back and try to identify the one with 0.2g day old grinds...


----------



## GaryM (Aug 1, 2016)

Michael87 said:


> Leads to 1g variability because it sometimes all falls out. Sometimes I find a pile in the cup because it's fallen out between uses.
> I think it makes a difference because everyone here says measure to 0.1g. I correct by tapping the machine for about 5s each grind (a bit annoying). And no a 0.1g scale.


You have 1g variability and a "pile" of grounds falls out in between uses? You have a fault of some sort. Even if I bump mine to get any residual to fall out it's a tiny amount, a fraction of a gram.

Sent from my MI 8 using Tapatalk


----------



## ZiggyMarley (Jan 9, 2019)

I think given my needs i'll end up with a Niche, but am i the only one that can't stand all the wooden bits; the feet and platform. What i'd give for some nice cast or turned aluminium parts.....


----------



## Blue_Cafe (Jun 22, 2020)

Michael87 said:


> a grinder with a clear USP of no retention.


 Quite so.


----------



## mmmatron (Jun 28, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> How is 0.2g - 0.4g stuck in the chute giving you +/- 1g of variability
> In what way is it making a difference (you said think)?
> How are you correcting for it?
> Does your scale measure down to 0.01 of a gram?
> That information might get a response of value to you. If not and you are still not happy, sell it and get one of the magical grinders for 2-3K.


Those magical grinders also have grounds in the chute too. Every shot on the monolith conic needs a tap on the chute, it's magnetically attached for that purpose. Don't get me started on the compak grinders I've had!
What's 0.2g? One bean or so? Pfft!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## mbenney (Apr 18, 2020)

Niche users... is it enough to WTD in the grind cup before tipping into the portafilter?

I feel like this would be quicker and less messy.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

mbenney said:


> Niche users... is it enough to WTD in the grind cup before tipping into the portafilter?
> 
> I feel like this would be quicker and less messy.


 If you want to...do it, I don't bother.


----------



## mbenney (Apr 18, 2020)

You don't WDT at all?


----------



## mbenney (Apr 18, 2020)

Another question for those of you who are swapping between multiple different beans... e.g. regular and decaf, or going between espresso and other brew methods.

Is there a neat way of marking/saving a grind setting that you've dialled in?


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

mbenney said:


> Another question for those of you who are swapping between multiple different beans... e.g. regular and decaf, or going between espresso and other brew methods.
> 
> Is there a neat way of marking/saving a grind setting that you've dialled in?


 There is: you could simply have another label next to the main one for the specific coffees you are using, or just get a small whiteboard and pen.


----------



## olivier (Jan 4, 2016)

Not Niche-specific, but chalk pens on Airscape canisters work well, too.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

olivier said:


> Not Niche-specific, but chalk pens on Airscape canisters work well, too.


 That's what I use, works well


----------



## lhavelund (Dec 28, 2018)

mbenney said:


> You don't WDT at all?


 I also don't. Tip cup upside down, tap gently, shake and tap portafilter, done. I used to stir with a chopstick, but find that the quality of my espresso hasn't reduced since I stopped, although that's probably around the time I fitted the NFC disc.



olivier said:


> Not Niche-specific, but chalk pens on Airscape canisters work well, too.


 I need to look into this. I decided to go for the white ceramic ones (w/bamboo lids), and I wonder if a whiteboard marker will do the trick...


----------



## olivier (Jan 4, 2016)

lhavelund said:


> I need to look into this. I decided to go for the white ceramic ones (w/bamboo lids), and I wonder if a whiteboard marker will do the trick...


 Haven't tried regular markers, but I guess it should work? Some can be a bit more annoying to completely wipe off though.

By the way, even if it seems obvious, liquid chalk pens work on ceramic as well as metallic Airscape canisters. In case anyone was wondering...


----------



## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

mbenney said:


> You don't WDT at all?


 I use my in-cup WDT spinning technique. (this is v1)










????

... and the more i look at the hex bolt the more i want to change it. I keep thinking a hex drive in a circular bolt.


----------



## KTD (Dec 28, 2017)

Spotted this earlier, wouldn't mind having a go at a colour change myself

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

KTD said:


> Spotted this earlier, wouldn't mind having a go at a colour change myself
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 Wow, that photo could get a few people triggered....


----------



## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

KTD said:


> Spotted this earlier, wouldn't mind having a go at a colour change myself
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 Well, that's the primer on. Wonder what colour it's going to be?


----------



## Dang24 (Apr 20, 2014)

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but the grind cup only being made to fit 58mm portafilters is a pain!

Kind of goes against the Niche ethos of not wasting coffee 😆

Other than that, it's a dream!


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

KTD said:


> Spotted this earlier, wouldn't mind having a go at a colour change myself
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 Saw that too, think the colour looks great personally


----------



## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

Don't like the Black, give us new color


----------



## Dang24 (Apr 20, 2014)

JackHK said:


> Don't like the Black, give us new color


 Ferrari red?!! 🤔


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Dang24 said:


> Not sure if this has been mentioned, but the grind cup only being made to fit 58mm portafilters is a pain!
> Kind of goes against the Niche ethos of not wasting coffee
> Other than that, it's a dream!


I think it's in their plans to have different cups - they even have prototypes (I spoke to Martin and James last year in the CFUK lever day about this) - But it's not their top priority at the moment.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## facboy (Dec 13, 2019)

i'm actually not sure that eg a 54mm cup would work that well. i have one of the 3d-printed etsy funnels and when i dump the cup into the funnel it overflows the basket and is well into the funnel space (like almost 5mm). if i did that with a 54mm cup straight into the basket i'd end up with coffee everywhere when i took the cup off.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

facboy said:


> i'm actually not sure that eg a 54mm cup would work that well.


It does. Trust me. If you want to use the cup, having the right diameter works well. With the disk, I'm finding it's really nice to dose directly into the portafilter, providing you have a suitable PF funnel which is, ideally, 3cm tall and fits under the Niche chute nicely.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Dang24 (Apr 20, 2014)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> I think it's in their plans to have different cups - they even have prototypes (I spoke to Martin and James last year in the CFUK lever day about this) - But it's not their top priority at the moment.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 Yeah, they sell well anyway! It would have been a nice touch or maybe an adapter like the funnel even if it was extra.

Do you not find it's too staticky grinding straight into the portafilter?


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Dang24 said:


> Yeah, they sell well anyway! It would have been a nice touch or maybe an adapter like the funnel even if it was extra.
> 
> Do you not find it's too staticky grinding straight into the portafilter?


 Not with the disk. I find it gets staticky if the grinds form a mound and it's too close to the chute. Otherwise I find it's ok for the beans I use (roasted on the lighter side).

but if you have a taller funnel, like, 3 or 3.5cm, it works very well. For me at least.


----------



## jaffro (Oct 6, 2015)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Not with the disk. I find it gets staticky if the grinds form a mound and it's too close to the chute. Otherwise I find it's ok for the beans I use (roasted on the lighter side).
> 
> but if you have a taller funnel, like, 3 or 3.5cm, it works very well. For me at least.


 Ah I just ordered a 60mm funnel from black cat rather than the 40mm... Maybe that was a mistake! Figured it was better to go too deep rather than too shallow! Sure it'll work fine either way 😊


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

jaffro said:


> Ah I just ordered a 60mm funnel from black cat rather than the 40mm... Maybe that was a mistake! Figured it was better to go too deep rather than too shallow! Sure it'll work fine either way 😊


 Sorry to disappoint you... but I tried. It doesn't work with the Niche, unfortunately. This is because the Niche is angled, and the funnel has a tapered shape, the chute doesn't really align with the middle of the basket. The 40mm *should* work.


----------



## facboy (Dec 13, 2019)

Dang24 said:


> Yeah, they sell well anyway! It would have been a nice touch or maybe an adapter like the funnel even if it was extra.
> 
> Do you not find it's too staticky grinding straight into the portafilter?


 yes, i find there's too much static, i end up with grinds all over the side of the grinder too. perhaps that's because my funnel is a plastic 3d-printed one.


----------



## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> I think it's in their plans to have different cups - they even have prototypes (I spoke to Martin and James last year in the CFUK lever day about this) - But it's not their top priority at the moment.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 So did I funnily. I suggested a 49mm cup to suit the La Pavoni. Doing a 49mm means it would also fit the 51mm as well, and other baskets less than 58mm. Anything less than 49mm would be pretty limited I would've thought.


----------



## Dang24 (Apr 20, 2014)

facboy said:


> yes, i find there's too much static, i end up with grinds all over the side of the grinder too. perhaps that's because my funnel is a plastic 3d-printed one.


 It almost seemed that the chute itself is causing the static, but I entered up clearing up grinds all over the place!

If you've got a 58mm portafilter it all works fine, but if not, expect to lose some coffee!! 😆


----------



## facboy (Dec 13, 2019)

Dang24 said:


> It almost seemed that the chute itself is causing the static, but I entered up clearing up grinds all over the place!
> 
> If you've got a 58mm portafilter it all works fine, but if not, expect to lose some coffee!! 😆


 i haven't been bothered to try grinding into something else, but it doesn't happen at all with the Niche cup.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

facboy said:


> i haven't been bothered to try grinding into something else, but it doesn't happen at all with the Niche cup.


 I've been grinding directly into an aluminium PF funnel, 51mm wide (for a La Pavoni) straight from the Niche for about 6 months. No issues with static. But as I said above, it needs to be 3cm or taller, so any static is kept at bay. If you look closely, there's static in the Niche cup too, but it never clings all the way to the top (because it's tall enough).

i have tried doing RDT (moistening the beans before grinding, with literally 1 drop of water from the back of a spoon) and then there's no static at all. But that was an one off experiment. I have absolutely no interest in doing this every single time, as, to me, defeats the purpose of convenience.... And adding moisture/water into a grinder, no matter how minuscule amount it is, just feels wrong.


----------



## facboy (Dec 13, 2019)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> I've been grinding directly into an aluminium PF funnel, 51mm wide (for a La Pavoni) straight from the Niche for about 6 months. No issues with static. But as I said above, it needs to be 3cm or taller, so any static is kept at bay. If you look closely, there's static in the Niche cup too, but it never clings all the way to the top (because it's tall enough).
> 
> i have tried doing RDT (moistening the beans before grinding, with literally 1 drop of water from the back of a spoon) and then there's no static at all. But that was an one off experiment. I have absolutely no interest in doing this every single time, as, to me, defeats the purpose of convenience.... And adding moisture/water into a grinder, no matter how minuscule amount it is, just feels wrong.


 ah i see what you mean, perhaps i didn't have it all the way up to the chute. in the interest of science i guess i could wipe up some more coffee grounds, if necessary!


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

facboy said:


> ah i see what you mean, perhaps i didn't have it all the way up to the chute. in the interest of science i guess i could wipe up some more coffee grounds, if necessary!


 You don't need it all the way up to the chute. Just a certain height above the lips of the basket, so, as the basket gets full, there won't be static clinging/flying out.


----------



## Dang24 (Apr 20, 2014)

I did see someone makes portafilter holders out of wood which was really interesting and was interested in, but with the static spray I think it'd be a nightmare!!

I'll look into the funnel then, but might wait to see what happens with my machine.

If I do though, I'll get a tall one@MediumRoastSteam 😉

I don't think I'd be up for adding water to the brand each time either. Like you say, it goes against the aim of the niche.


----------



## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

I read somewhere not to add any water to the beans as it can cause more retention in the Niche.

Sorry can't remember where now.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Dang24 said:


> I did see someone makes portafilter holders out of wood which was really interesting and was interested in, but with the static spray I think it'd be a nightmare!!
> 
> I'll look into the funnel then, but might wait to see what happens with my machine.
> 
> ...


 Just mind the portafilter you use! Make sure there's head space AND, the tapered shape, as it might be you won't be able to keep the basket central to the chute. Straight walls are better, IMO.

if you do find anything suitable, please let me know. I've been unsuccessful thus far.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

ratty said:


> I read somewhere not to add any water to the beans as it can cause more retention in the Niche.
> 
> Sorry can't remember where now.


 Yes. That's true, and makes the coffee more prone to caking inside (yuck). Hence why, IMO, it just feels wrong. 😊

I think the manual says you should never add water. Mind you, we are talking about a minuscule amount. Still, still feels wrong.


----------



## Dang24 (Apr 20, 2014)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Just mind the portafilter you use! Make sure there's head space AND, the tapered shape, as it might be you won't be able to keep the basket central to the chute. Straight walls are better, IMO.
> 
> if you do find anything suitable, please let me know. I've been unsuccessful thus far.


 Cheers, I'll look out for this 👍

Will do, I'm sure some genius on here will come up with some great design for a portafilter holder that works!


----------



## facboy (Dec 13, 2019)

not something i "don't like" per se, but i've been quite surprised at how 18g of coffee from the Niche takes up a lot more volume in the basket than 18g of coffee from my previous Baratza Encore. possibly to do with consistency of grind size.


----------



## thusband (Nov 19, 2015)

facboy said:


> not something i "don't like" per se, but i've been quite surprised at how 18g of coffee from the Niche takes up a lot more volume in the basket than 18g of coffee from my previous Baratza Encore. possibly to do with consistency of grind size.


 So we're talking about the same coffee right? My wife's decaf Colombian takes up quite a bit less space than my Ethiopian.


----------



## facboy (Dec 13, 2019)

same coffee, same weight. just more volume.


----------



## Dang24 (Apr 20, 2014)

facboy said:


> not something i "don't like" per se, but i've been quite surprised at how 18g of coffee from the Niche takes up a lot more volume in the basket than 18g of coffee from my previous Baratza Encore. possibly to do with consistency of grind size.


 I've found this too, although the grind is much finer.

Definitely makes it tricker getting into the portafilter! 😵


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

facboy said:


> not something i "don't like" per se, but i've been quite surprised at how 18g of coffee from the Niche takes up a lot more volume in the basket than 18g of coffee from my previous Baratza Encore. possibly to do with consistency of grind size.


 Were you single dosing the Encore? 
Its most likely static effect in the coffee due to single dosing. If you try 1 drop of water into a cup, mix the beans, and then grind in the Niche, they land in the basket rather nicely. I don't recommend you do this every time, but as an experiment only.


----------



## facboy (Dec 13, 2019)

no, normal hopper usage. i don't mean on initial grind, i mean even tamped it takes up more volume.


----------



## Jony (Sep 8, 2017)

Depends on the bean.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Jony said:


> Depends on the bean.


 Same coffee is being used. So as the grinders are different, they are producing a different profile.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

facboy said:


> no, normal hopper usage. i don't mean on initial grind, i mean even tamped it takes up more volume.


 Interesting. I don't understand enough about the physics of coffee grinds to be able to comment any further. 😊

mskes sense to me that the hopper fed grinder fills he basket more evenly and more "compact" than s single dose one.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Dang24 said:


> Yeah, they sell well anyway! It would have been a nice touch or maybe an adapter like the funnel even if it was extra.
> 
> Do you not find it's too staticky grinding straight into the portafilter?


 This is what it looks for me.

the funnel is off eBay. It's 18mm tall (I wish it was 30!) of which 3mm go inside the basket. It's 58.3mm wide (inner diameter). Makes of stainless still and weights a whopping 100g. The aluminium one I have weights 14g. 😊

18.3g in into an 18g VST basket. Coffee is a Costa Rican from BlackCat, light/medium roasted. Just left the naked PF at the bottom of the Niche where the cup normally sits at. I just moved/angled the portafilter accordingly to fill the basket nicely.

Highly recommend it, and you can choose different diameters. It is important to me that it doesn't go too far into the basket.

link below If it's of interest:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/124207880719


----------



## Dang24 (Apr 20, 2014)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> This is what it looks for me.
> 
> the funnel is off eBay. It's 18mm tall (I wish it was 30!) of which 3mm go inside the basket. It's 58.3mm wide (inner diameter). Makes of stainless still and weights a whopping 100g. The aluminium one I have weights 14g. 😊
> 
> ...


 Thanks, that's really handy. I'm starting to get fed up of the mess!! 😤


----------



## stockportman (May 15, 2020)

What don't I like?

Specifically the gap behind the black output chute and the casing is rather small, and depending on the way I put the dosing cup onto the wooden shelf, it can easily catch the rear body. I'm slightly nervous that will cause the paint (ok powder coat) to chip over time. I did see someone selling one that had quite a bit of wear in that area, which reenforced my thought about it.

Also the wood finish - I've paid £500 for the thing - I don't really want to faff around protecting the wood. James reassured me it IS protected already - but I'm going to be applying some Danish Oil, just to be sure.

If I'm being micro-picky, a slight bit extra length on the mains lead would also be very useful

Other than that, LOVE it!


----------



## Doram (Oct 12, 2012)

stockportman said:


> depending on the way I put the dosing cup onto the wooden shelf, it can easily catch the rear body.


 A small square of clear helicopter tape behind the output chute will protect the body from this and is hardly visible (got the idea from someone who sold a protected NZ here).

I used this one: https://www.toolstation.com/all-weather-tape/p64699 - still have 14.98 metres for other uses, lol.


----------



## NJD1977 (Dec 16, 2014)

I think the dosing area is needlessly too small and with it being angled forward it takes a little bit of care when dosing 20g in. Despite it saying it could accommodate 55g, I just can't see this being realistic.

It's a minor gripe but I would've made the dosing area larger (and ideally not leaning forward).

Otherwise a great grinder.


----------



## VeryFastTrack (Sep 19, 2020)

I cannot prevent the cup from touching the machine when putting it in place to receive the coffee. As the cup is made of metal it may leave a mark in the machine.


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

VeryFastTrack said:


> I cannot prevent the cup from touching the machine when putting it in place to receive the coffee. As the cup is made of metal it may leave a mark in the machine.


 Yes this is a nuisnace and over time it does leave a mark. I had always intended to put a little square of clear sticky back plastic there to prevent damage.


----------



## VeryFastTrack (Sep 19, 2020)

catpuccino said:


> Yes this is a nuisnace and over time it does leave a mark. I had always intended to put a little square of clear sticky back plastic there to prevent damage.


 Agreed a plastic tape would prevent damage. Hopefully I have a clear tape - will check in the morning.


----------



## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

it was one of the first things I did, put a tiny bit of tape in that area


----------



## richwade80 (Aug 25, 2017)

you need some bike frame protection stickers! wish i had thought of putting some on.... it's too late for me now.... save yourselves.

https://www.merlincycles.com/lizard-skins-patch-kit-frame-protectors-92957.html?utm_source=PHG&utm_medium=AffiliateMarketing&utm_campaign=phg-GB&ucpo=33665&source=PHG


----------



## allyburns (Sep 27, 2020)

Stanic said:


> it was one of the first things I did, put a tiny bit of tape in that area


 My Niche in not due until December, so doing some research. Is it pretty obvious which area needs a bit of tape? Do you have a picture of the bit you taped? Ta!


----------



## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

allyburns said:


> My Niche in not due until December, so doing some research. Is it pretty obvious which area needs a bit of tape? Do you have a picture of the bit you taped? Ta!


 It is just behind the output chute

Here is a pic from Internet where I marked the area


----------



## allyburns (Sep 27, 2020)

Stanic said:


> It is just behind the output chute
> 
> Here is a pic from Internet where I marked the area
> 
> View attachment 46505


 Ah yes, perfect! Will get it protected from day 1, I might have a clear bike frame protector sticker somewhere actually. Many thanks for annotating the picture, I will sleep easily tonight now I know exactly what needs done 🤣


----------



## Inspector (Feb 23, 2017)

Even tho I was careful, mine has a bit of paint damage too.

And also put a tape on where I pictured. Magnet on the lid rubs the paint off otherwise


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Maybe the Black Niche is less susceptible to paint damage? Mine is from the first batch, used daily and not a single sign of discolouration of paint damage, at all!


----------



## catpuccino (Jan 5, 2019)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Maybe the Black Niche is less susceptible to paint damage? Mine is from the first batch, used daily and not a single sign of discolouration of paint damage, at all!


 I think that may well be the case, I sometimes see pictures of damage around the magnet like @Inspector shows whereas mine (black) shows no sign of start nor anything like it. I do have some pitting around the grinds cup but that's from the sharp edge of the cup hitting against the paint, I imagine that'd happen no matter the paint.


----------



## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

maybe they used a different paint back then before it went to mass production..just a wild guess


----------



## stockportman (May 15, 2020)

Doram said:


> A small square of clear helicopter tape behind the output chute will protect the body from this and is hardly visible (got the idea from someone who sold a protected NZ here).
> 
> I used this one: https://www.toolstation.com/all-weather-tape/p64699 - still have 14.98 metres for other uses, lol.


 Good idea. I've put a few layers of invisible tape there, but I've got a roll of that stuff in the house too - I'll swap out the protection


----------



## tonejac (Oct 10, 2020)

Slowpress said:


> It just now dawned on me one possible reason you may not have made any sense of my reply! ??‍♀ My portafilter is not sized to match the Niche cup diameter, so I always have to pour from the Niche cup into my pf; I can't do the "flip over" of cup directly into my pf, as so many of you can do. So, I stir in the Niche cup, then pour into my smaller diameter portafilter (and can do even more excessive WDT once the grinds are in my pf, should I choose to do so on my all too many "OCD" days!?.☺


 Yes, I wish they offered the Niche cup in different diameters. (even if you had to buy them separately). I'd love to see a 49mm option for the cup.


----------



## tonejac (Oct 10, 2020)

dfk41 said:


> Pop corning does not really bother me as I just view it as a necessary evil but it would be nice to see how they have overcome it M


 Does the new NFC disk attachment plate make the popcorn'ing issue go away?


----------



## tonejac (Oct 10, 2020)

NEVERMIND. I just saw plenty of other posts adressing this one. Please disregard the above post.


----------



## tonejac (Oct 10, 2020)

ZiggyMarley said:


> I think given my needs i'll end up with a Niche, but am i the only one that can't stand all the wooden bits; the feet and platform. What i'd give for some nice cast or turned aluminium parts.....


 That would look pretty damn sharp in my opinion, having the white Niche Zero with a chrome base plate and feet.


----------



## tonejac (Oct 10, 2020)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> i have tried doing RDT (moistening the beans before grinding, with literally 1 drop of water from the back of a spoon) and then there's no static at all. But that was an one off experiment. I have absolutely no interest in doing this every single time, as, to me, defeats the purpose of convenience.... And adding moisture/water into a grinder, no matter how minuscule amount it is, just feels wrong.


 Interesting approach. Is that tiny amount of moisture bad for the grinder?


----------



## tonejac (Oct 10, 2020)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Yes. That's true, and makes the coffee more prone to caking inside (yuck). Hence why, IMO, it just feels wrong. 😊
> 
> I think the manual says you should never add water. Mind you, we are talking about a minuscule amount. Still, still feels wrong.


 James Hoffman demonstrated the "no more static hack" of dipping the handle part of a spoon into water then stirring your beans with it, pre-grind. He claims that the water gets evaporated as you stir and as the beans get jostled around in the hopper.


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

> 2 hours ago, tonejac said:
> 
> James Hoffman demonstrated the "no more static hack" of dipping the handle part of a spoon into water then stirring your beans with it, pre-grind. He claims that the water gets evaporated as you stir and as the beans get jostled around in the hopper.


 I don't have static problems, so no idea why you quoted me with this video! As I said, it's not my thing. Also, on the Niche, the grinds may get caked inside the chamber if you over do it. I've been using the Niche without RDT since day one, for years I did use on my Kinu M68 when I had it - I'm not s fan).


----------



## tonejac (Oct 10, 2020)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> I don't have static problems, so no idea why you quoted me with this video! As I said, it's not my thing. Also, on the Niche, the grinds may get caked inside the chamber if you over do it. I've been using the Niche without RDT since day one, for years I did use on my Kinu M68 when I had it - I'm not s fan).


 That's fair.

BTW, I'm not intending to implicate you on the static part of this but rather just referring to the RDT part.


----------



## jaffro (Oct 6, 2015)

tonejac said:


> That would look pretty damn sharp in my opinion, having the white Niche Zero with a chrome base plate and feet.


 A couple of people on the Niche Facebook group have put up pictures of a Niche with a square metal base.

Each to their own (of course!) but personally I think it looks absolutely hideous haha.

But then I bloody hate chrome... Also, white and wood for me is a perfect combo and I'd never change it!


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

jaffro said:


> A couple of people on the Niche Facebook group have put up pictures of a Niche with a square metal base.
> 
> Each to their own (of course!) but personally I think it looks absolutely hideous haha.
> 
> But then I bloody hate chrome... Also, white and wood for me is a perfect combo and I'd never change it!


 Snap! I'm not a fan either!


----------



## Bobbrown (Sep 16, 2020)

Taped mine up yesterday using clear bike frame protection stickers as suggested by @richwade80. Seems to have worked a treat.


----------



## Sean63 (Jan 28, 2015)

Inspector said:


> Even tho I was careful, mine has a bit of paint damage too.
> 
> And also put a tape on where I pictured. Magnet on the lid rubs the paint off otherwise
> 
> ...


 cheers. Good tip thanks.


----------



## Faffing (May 3, 2020)

The static is a little tricky, not a problem, but does require some daily tlc


----------



## Pablosammy (Oct 14, 2018)

Faffing said:


> The static is a little tricky, not a problem, but does require some daily tlc


 I find the beans used heavily dictate how much static there is. Most have none for me, but some get quite 'clingy'. I'm not sure what the variable is.


----------



## olieolieolieolie (Nov 21, 2020)

Recieved mine this week, only criticism is that it doesn't feel as sturdy as my super jolly (but it is smaller/lighter/cheaper, so can't have it all!)


----------



## Zeak (Jun 12, 2017)

After a few months of use I pretty much only have one nitpick. It's the whole dosing cup/stand array. It feels...like a workaround..An afterthought..A patch? That wooden puck is finnicky and I can't help but think if there was a different way of designing that whole bit. Understandably making these pucks is dirt cheap, quick and easy, but is it actually necessary at all? Or are those 2cm crucial for transferring grounds into the cup? I almost want to unscrew that nut underneath and try using it without the puck. If it is crucial, then maybe it's a design flaw?


----------



## PartySausage (Aug 6, 2020)

Zeak said:


> After a few months of use I pretty much only have one nitpick. It's the whole dosing cup/stand array. It feels...like a workaround..An afterthought..A patch? That wooden puck is finnicky and I can't help but think if there was a different way of designing that whole bit. Understandably making these pucks is dirt cheap, quick and easy, but is it actually necessary at all? Or are those 2cm crucial for transferring grounds into the cup? I almost want to unscrew that nut underneath and try using it without the puck. If it is crucial, then maybe it's a design flaw?


 The puck sitting on the hex bolt and recess in the puck does prevent the dosing cup from sliding off the base with the vibration when grinding so you would have to hold on to it

As the dosing cup sits quite deep in the basket when I empty the contents leaving a gap in the coffee around the walls, I wanted to find a hands free way of grinding direct into basket. I'd have bought a decent stand but they don't work with ECM portafilters so I had a couple of oak bits lying around & made a little stand, which seems to fill good enough so that all I need to do is a quick spin with a leveller, tamp & away we go


----------



## MarkHB (Jun 12, 2020)

As most others, just a small nitpick! It would be nice if the markings were more like the markings on a ruler. With a halfway mark and then smaller and longer marks in between. I find it hard to keep track of where I am! Love the Niche though!


----------



## Zeak (Jun 12, 2017)

PartySausage said:


> The puck sitting on the hex bolt and recess in the puck does prevent the dosing cup from sliding off the base with the vibration when grinding so you would have to hold on to it


 The bottom plate theoretically could have that same recess which would eliminate the need in the puck altogether, simplify the look/production/logistics (in some way). It must be there to decrease the distance between the chute and the dosing cup, but then why couldn't they design the stand part of the grinder in such a way that would eliminate the need in the puck from the get go..?


----------



## PartySausage (Aug 6, 2020)

Zeak said:


> The bottom plate theoretically could have that same recess which would eliminate the need in the puck altogether, simplify the look/production/logistics (in some way). It must be there to decrease the distance between the chute and the dosing cup, but then why couldn't they design the stand part of the grinder in such a way that would eliminate the need in the puck from the get go..?


 True, I think only James can answer that one. It probably does make production easier.

I'm a mere keeno coffee novice learning his trade. Through my amateur eyes (& taste buds) I'm chuffed with my Niche. Certainly knocks the burrs off the ECM grinder I was loaned until the Niche arrived, which was pants


----------



## richwade80 (Aug 25, 2017)

Zeak said:


> The bottom plate theoretically could have that same recess which would eliminate the need in the puck altogether, simplify the look/production/logistics (in some way). It must be there to decrease the distance between the chute and the dosing cup, but then why couldn't they design the stand part of the grinder in such a way that would eliminate the need in the puck from the get go..?
> <img alt="PXL_20201204_175530425.thumb.jpg.a45c0dd4b85675a9d6ba2798711d354e.jpg" data-fileid="49140" data-src="<fileStore.core_Attachment>/monthly_2020_12/PXL_20201204_175530425.thumb.jpg.a45c0dd4b85675a9d6ba2798711d354e.jpg" src="https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png">


That wooden puck is very useful when you inevitably forget to put the cup under the chute and end up with a small Vesuvius shaped pile of grinds to deal with.

Plenty of examples in the muppetry thread.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## profesor_historia (Sep 1, 2020)

olieolieolieolie said:


> Recieved mine this week, only criticism is that it doesn't feel as sturdy as my super jolly (but it is smaller/lighter/cheaper, so can't have it all!)


Cheaper than Super Jolly? I had in the past several doser models, bought second hand in Spain for about 50€ - 100€ maximum. You must be talking about a new one.

Sent from my ALP-L09 using Tapatalk


----------



## FrustratedBarista_1976 (May 19, 2020)

Really enjoying my niche after a couple of weeks of use. I've been managing the static (relatively low) with a quick couple of taps on the tamping mat before I put the portafilter on. And really enjoying the consistency. Weird one though - the front wooden feet are loose and spin round - is this normal or should I just try and screw them tighter?


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

FrustratedBarista_1976 said:


> Really enjoying my niche after a couple of weeks of use. I've been managing the static (relatively low) with a quick couple of taps on the tamping mat before I put the portafilter on. And really enjoying the consistency. Weird one though - the front wooden feet are loose and spin round - is this normal or should I just try and screw them tighter?


 It's normal for the feet to do that....they are fixed in such a way that they are not compressed and the grinder sits on the padded metal bolts that secures them. Just check the bolts are not loose and if they are not, don't worry about it.


----------



## Doram (Oct 12, 2012)

Zeak said:


> That wooden puck is finnicky and I can't help but think if there was a different way of designing that whole bit. Understandably making these pucks is dirt cheap, quick and easy, but is it actually necessary at all?


 I like that it is removable for cleaning when a little coffee falls from the chute and the cup isn't there to catch it. Keeps the main machine cleaner. 🙂


----------

