# Newbie here looking for advice on what to buy ?



## PAULWT84 (Mar 24, 2021)

Hi all

I am just starting out on my coffee adventure and after a lot of reading and watching YouTube videos I have decided on purchasing the following

Gaggia classic pro and a sage pro grinder to go with it , I was looking at getting the sage barista pro but I seem to read a lot of people have problems with them with reliability of the machine .

I am just wondering if I have made the correct choice on my future purchase or is there anything else out there which is better value?

also is there anything else I should purchase to go along with my choice ?

Thanks for any advice.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

The Gaggia's are popular and interesting to note they have gone Pro,  must be trying to catch up with some company.

Machine comes down to choice really and budget. A separate grinder is never a bad idea as it can be sold if some one wants to upgrade. My personal view having used several grinders is that the SGP isn't that easy to beat and it's rather convenient. So in some ways having that is a better option than a machine with a built in grinder. Many people used to buy a Sage DTP and an SGP because the SGP has more steps than the grinder built into the Barista Express. That is true but most of the extra ones on the SGP are not suitable for espresso however they do allow people to grind for other brewing methods if they want.

Sage and reliability. Thermo type machines do scale more easily than boilers but any machine used with tap water will generate scale. Before buying it;s not a bad idea for people to check their water supplier to see how hard their water is. *Certain *brands of bottled water may be the best answer in some cases. Sage sell lots of machines. Scale figures in some problems and sometimes people check things the wrong way. Brew water temperature for instance. Due to parts availability they are sort of disposable but can be professionally repaired. Some parts can be bought and diy fixes are also sometimes possible. Pro repair is never a cheap option on any machine. The cheapest option with Sage is keep the box and send it to them. They have a 2 year warrantee and will call and fix but covid is probably messing that up currently. Some people run the machines for a long time without problems.

Some people lusted after a BE without the grinder. There was one and a seller in the UK but along with an SGP it worked out significantly dearer. I suppose a similar option now is a Bambino and an SGP. The thermo machines do have a quirk. What I would do if I used one now is flush, select, steam, turn that off as soon as the pump pulses and then pull the shot as soon as the machine allowed. It might pay to allow a bit of wet steam to escape. These machines are ready for use very quickly but notice that by going back to the small boiler Gaggia now reckons 45sec. Users on the Gaggia section may be able to comment on that. Sage do their best to prevent the portafilter from taking away heat and it does work pretty well.


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## 27852 (Nov 8, 2020)

My first consideration would be use case - the Gaggia is great if you are making one drink at a time, but the boiler is very small which can impact workflow.

Think of the Gaggia Classic as the Ford Fiesta of espresso machines. Cheap, reliable, easy to maintain, and a very solid base for modifications - there are well looked after machines that have provided 10+ years of service. As standard it is quite basic, but if you're a tinkerer and willing to play around with the machine, you can modify it to be a great machine for a single user, but it will involve c.£150 of additional cost to achieve that level of performance which can also serve as a crash course of how espresso machines work (fun if you've got the money and time).

There is a great mini industry of refurbing and selling used GCPs. You could pick up a unit with a PID (temperature control) for £250ish, if memory serves. Note the 2015 version (without 3-way solenoid) is much unloved so be wary of the model. Monitor the for sale section of the forum and have a look at the Gaggia section for more ideas.

With hindsight, I could have saved a lot of money by buying a used GCP, just make sure you ask the right questions or get pictures evidencing the rebuild. It is a bit of a punt, but given the wide availability of replacement parts and the health of the modding community, there is a decent level of peer support if things were to go wrong.


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## PAULWT84 (Mar 24, 2021)

Thanks very much with the replies so far .


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## jonnycooper29 (Apr 11, 2018)

I've gone through 3 machines since going down this rabbit hole 3 or so years ago, starting with the sage DTP, which I enjoyed using. I wanted a bit more interaction so I got a la Pavoni, but even with mods I put in place, got fed up when I needed to make more than one. I then went for the bambino plus, which is super straight forward to use. Mine recently had a problem so I have a brand new one on the way which I will be selling. I thought this is my opportunity to upgrade to something a bit more capable so will be getting the lelit Elizabeth to pair with my niche.

Out of the three, I'd say the bambino was the easiest to use and removes some of the headaches of a non pid gaggia!


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## 27852 (Nov 8, 2020)

jonnycooper29 said:


> I've gone through 3 machines since going down this rabbit hole 3 or so years ago, starting with the sage DTP, which I enjoyed using. I wanted a bit more interaction so I got a la Pavoni, but even with mods I put in place, got fed up when I needed to make more than one. I then went for the bambino plus, which is super straight forward to use. Mine recently had a problem so I have a brand new one on the way which I will be selling. I thought this is my opportunity to upgrade to something a bit more capable so will be getting the lelit Elizabeth to pair with my niche.
> 
> Out of the three, I'd say the bambino was the easiest to use and removes some of the headaches of a non pid gaggia!


 Yup, beware upgraditis. The GCP lasted 3 months with me before I bought an Elizabeth. Having said that, I was the happy owner of a Delonghi Dedica for 5+ years, that machine breaking is what triggered the latest spiral into the abyss...

There is a lot to be said for "buy once, buy right". I did a lot of incremental mods to my GCP trying to nudge it one step better, but the fundamentals of design can only take you so far. The right machine for me is a dual boiler and there's no way around that.

None of this is to knock single boiler machines, I think the GCP is fantastic. My use case just does not fit its spec.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Take a look at the Eureka Mignon Crono as an alternative to the SGP. Heard some positive things and would be my choice at that price point all day long.

https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/56011-eureka-mignon-crono/?do=embed

And a bit more info here...

https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/59000-50mm-eureka-grinder-specs-compared-crono-filtro-manuale-facile-silenzio-perfetto/?do=embed


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## Zatogato (Feb 27, 2021)

I am also a fledgling in the coffee space, I started with a DeLonghi Dedica (don't laugh) and SGP, very quickly sold in favour of a Crono and GC. Already getting great results and don't see myself upgrading anytime soon (not until I upgrade my own skills anyway!)

I think this is hands down the best value for money beginner setup from my research and personally I'm very happy with it. (Disclaimer: not that experienced with alternatives!)

Having used both, the Crono is hands down a better choice and will produce better results.


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## dutchy101 (Jun 12, 2020)

My first set-up was a Bambino with the SGP. As a starter set up I think it's great personally.

After 9 months and a few wins on the nags at Cheltenham I've upgraded my grinder. I've just listed my SGP in the fir sale section of the forum if you are considering an SGP.


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## 24774 (Mar 8, 2020)

PAULWT84 said:


> Hi all
> 
> I am just starting out on my coffee adventure and after a lot of reading and watching YouTube videos I have decided on purchasing the following
> 
> ...


 There's no problems with the reliability of them, issue rate is sub 1% apparently. The issue is that if you do have a problem outside of the warranty your options are extremely limited. Basically one place in the UK controls that market and spares aren't easy to get. Sage do some, you can sources other bits, but it's not like older machines or manufacturers that will help you years down the line.


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## Kam760 (Feb 27, 2020)

I was new a year ago and got a gaggia which has now been modified (PID). But I'm getting an itch to upgrade as we drink a lot of milky drinks so want a dual boiler. To start off with, even with milk drinks, gaggia is the best. They also hold their value and so it's easier to sell and upgrade when you want.


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## BristolTom (Mar 30, 2021)

dutchy101 said:


> My first set-up was a Bambino with the SGP. As a starter set up I think it's great personally.
> 
> After 9 months and a few wins on the nags at Cheltenham I've upgraded my grinder. I've just listed my SGP in the fir sale section of the forum if you are considering an SGP.


 Hi new to the forum and starting out.

I think this is the combo I am going to try. I have is limited work surface space in my kitchen (and limited funds!), hence the need for something with a small footprint and the Bambino seems to fit this brief well whilst still being decent quality.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

CocoLoco said:


> There's no problems with the reliability of them, issue rate is sub 1% apparently. The issue is that if you do have a problem outside of the warranty your options are extremely limited. Basically one place in the UK controls that market and spares aren't easy to get. Sage do some, you can sources other bits, but it's not like older machines or manufacturers that will help you years down the line.


 This area isn't really as straight forward as people often think especially out of warrantee as things can often be fixed. It takes some thought and mechanical aptitude just like any machine. Pay some one else to do that on any machine and it wont be cheap. It's advisable to inspect the internals of all machines periodically. With Sage that means when it's out of warrantee. There are plenty of posts on here about various machines going hiss pop etc. It's best to spot problems early.

It's pretty clear that a lot of problems are down to maintenance - how often the machine is back flushed and descaled. Much later things can fail. Solenoid pipe connector seem to crop up. People are finding alternatives. The other option is keep the box and send to Coffee Classics. Their cheapest repair option. It avoids travel time charges.

Lakeland may offer 3 years warrantee on some Sage stuff. Past that point people should really replace O ring seals. An easy job to do really however the stand out machine that needs this is the DB and certain seals in particular.

Thermo type machines - best option really is to descale too often. It's pretty easy to do. Some people probably buy without any thought about how hard their tap water is. The best option may be certain brands of bottled water. Sage engineers say descale every month.


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