# 2 steam tip v 4 steam tip



## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

Well I have had a chance to compare both the 2 steam tip and the 4 steam tip. The tips can be easily removed as they simply screw on. Obviously you need to be careful if the steam wand is hot that you do not burn yourself.

The 4 steam tip is fast and there is little room for error. You need to be quick and the temperature rises very quickly. The 2 steam tip is much slower and better for latte art when you want to microfoam etc.

I do not have a preference as yet but think I am going to go back to the 4 steam tip for the time being just because its quicker.


----------



## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

If you decide to stick with the 4 I would be interested in trying or buying your 2 hole tip


----------



## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

I will be keeping both to alternate between the two for the moment. The 2 hole tips are fairly cheap around £3 but you need to factor in p&p so it might be worth waiting until you need to order something else. Peter from Espresso Underground told me he is going to start stocking them so he can send them out relatively quickly.

I would recommend you getting one so you can stretch the milk.


----------



## jimbow (Oct 13, 2011)

Here was another thread about 1, 2 and 4 hole tips on the Cherub:

http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=54631

I use a 4 hole tip on my Cherub and it took me a long time to get to grips with it but now I love it!


----------



## espressotechno (Apr 11, 2011)

Have recently supplied 2 hole nozzles to customers who found the 4 holers too difficult to master, especially for small milk volumes.

(for other make of machine)


----------



## thomss (May 9, 2011)

Good stuff guys, I think we should have some steaming videos with these different tips in action


----------



## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

I'm struggling with my new Cherub to get microfoam even with the 2-hole; rather than one smooth jug of microfoam, at the bottom of the jug I'm getting thin watery milk, with foam on the surface.

However I'm an absolute novice in terms of technique, so thinking the 1-hole as mentioned in post above might be more forgiving for me at this stage...

FWIW I'm using Cravendale semi-skimmed milk


----------



## jimbow (Oct 13, 2011)

Frothing the milk comprises two phases: stretching (adding air) and texturing (integrating the air with the milk).

All the while, during both these stages, the milk is heating so you need to work quickly and methodically. If you over heat the milk (beyond 65 degrees) then any microfoam you have created may separate and the milk will taste flat. You should not stretch the milk if it is hotter than body temperature as it will end up creating big bubbles that will be impossible to integrate with the milk. This gives you a very short window of time to stretch the milk. To increase this window you could try one or more of the following:

- use more milk - a larger volume of milk will take longer to heat

- refrigerate the milk and jug before you steam it (the colder it is to start with the more time you will have before it reaches body temperature).

- use a steam wand tip with fewer holes to reduce the amount of steam hitting the milk at once.

When stretching the milk, lower the jug so that the tip is close to the surface until you hear a chh-chh-chh sound. When the side of the jug no longer feels cool to the touch then raise the jug slightly to stop stretching. Position the tip close to the side wall of the jug (about 7 o'clock) and you should see the milk start to spin in the jug. When the jug feels almost too hot to touch then immediately raise the jug further and close off the steam. If you hear a sound like a jet engine then the milk is too hot and stop immediately.


----------



## SweeneyTodd (Jan 4, 2013)

Jimbow - nice succinct description - thank you


----------



## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

my two hole tip is on the way

i suspect the 4 hole tip can likely be tamed... but as i drink mainly latte's, the quality of the microfoam matters, so being able to slow it down and get better texturing is likely to be beneficial.


----------



## Foz (Jan 19, 2013)

Do those using the 2 hole tip manage to spin the milk? I have found spinning the milk difficult and concentrate on folding it in probably due to the two steam jets going in opposite directions.


----------



## jimbow (Oct 13, 2011)

The angle of the wand in relation to the milk is important regarding the number of holes and their positioning in the tip. If you have a tip with multiple holes you may need to angle the wand more vertically than with a single hole tip.

I find an angle of around 15 degrees off vertical works with the standard 4 hole tip i.e. so that the top of the wand, leaving the ball joint, is aligned with the ball joint housing. A more vertical angle allows the holes in the tip to do the work and get the milk moving in the right way.


----------



## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

I tried the two hole today. Not sure I like it. It just felt like it was holding the fracino back and seemed to feel rather strained. The 4 hole tip was just a bit more erm... Frothy lol


----------



## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

so the saga continues...

what ive noticed is that the holes on the 2 hole tip, are much much smaller than the holes on the 4 hole tip.

Meaning that you get much much less than half the steam power. As a result, its very hard to get a meaninful whirlpool.

What we need is a 4 hole tip with smaller holes, or a 2 hole tip with bigger holes.

Ive enquired about the availability of the 3 hole tip, as i cant get on with the 2 (far far too slow) or the 4 (too aggressive)


----------



## jimbow (Oct 13, 2011)

Try blocking one, or two, of the holes in the four hole tip with the end of a cocktail stick. Sounds naff but it works.


----------



## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

what i really want is a two hole tip, with holes the same size as the 4 hole









i might take to the two hole tip with a drill!


----------

