# Expobar Dual Leva what next?



## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

I think there will be a few of us getting these over the next few weeks or at least hoping to and was wondering what essential purchases should be made to go with/ complement this?

I have seen mention of handles to help access the tank any particular ones (do they fit pre-drilled holes?) or what about the cup cup bar from BB?

Was thinking about upgrading the portafilter to the ceramic portafilter http://cafe-kultur.de/collections/portafilter-1/products/portafilter-cg-e61-standard with the red handle and spouts to add a bit of vulgarity (colour) to it!!

Also maybe a new tamper but is there anything else to tweak or buy to compliment (pimp) the Brewtus?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Handles and cup holder for me too. Initially thought the light wood looked better but will be going for the dark.


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Any idea what the handles are or are they standard cupboard door handles?


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

kikapu said:


> I think there will be a few of us getting these over the next few weeks or at least hoping to and was wondering what essential purchases should be made to go with/ complement this?
> 
> I have seen mention of handles to help access the tank any particular ones (do they fit pre-drilled holes?) or what about the cup cup bar from BB?
> 
> ...


These are quoted as suitable for Expo

http://cafe-kultur.de/collections/portafilter-1/products/portafilter-cg-e61-7mm-1


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Also I seem to recall having read somewhere you changed the spouts on the standard portafilter? Changed to what?

Dont worry found it it was the ceramic ones by torr like the portafilter I am after


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Apparently you can get generic handles from diy shops that fit the expo too


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## rmcgandara (Feb 12, 2013)

naked portafilter if you don't have one.

and an upgrade from the handles on the expobar. I like the darkwood. BB has a set for 70. the guy from HB forum (Dave I think is his name) has a backlog of 4-5 months... Then there is DFK1 woodturner, but not sure if hew would make the water/steam knobs.


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## Fevmeister (Oct 21, 2013)

why would you want to fit diy handles to a brand new machine?


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

rmcgandara said:


> naked portafilter if you don't have one.
> 
> and an upgrade from the handles on the expobar. I like the darkwood. BB has a set for 70. the guy from HB forum (Dave I think is his name) has a backlog of 4-5 months... Then there is DFK1 woodturner, but not sure if hew would make the water/steam knobs.


My woodturner has a water knob as we speak. He is going to make some prototypes. The problem is that he turns wood and these are star shaped. I do ot see the shape as being relevant, as long as it works ok. I expect to have something to show you in the next week or so.

On the topic of handles for the top tray. here is my machine and I bought kitchen door handles from B & Q


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Not sure if we are getting ours knobs confused with handles?? I was meaning handles to get access the water tank? Not replacing the knobs on the front although once I get it I might change my mind! I dont like the look of any of the wood ones as yet anyway.


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

dfk41 said:


> My woodturner has a water knob as we speak. He is going to make some prototypes. The problem is that he turns wood and these are star shaped. I do ot see the shape as being relevant, as long as it works ok. I expect to have something to show you in the next week or so.
> 
> On the topic of handles for the top tray. here is my machine and I bought kitchen door handles from B & Q


Those handles look good did they fit the pre drilled holes?


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Yes, hence the fact I bought them!


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Fevmeister said:


> why would you want to fit diy handles to a brand new machine?


If they look good why not? Not sure I'll need handlesactually, won't need access to a tank but do think the rail looks quite nice


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Another thing I have seen that may need changing is the steam tip. How many holes come on the one with the Brewtus? 2? Read this might be a bit aggressive if you only steaming milk for one drink and a 1 hole would be better?


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

kikapu said:


> Another thing I have seen that may need changing is the steam tip. How many holes come on the one with the Brewtus? 2? Read this might be a bit aggressive if you only steaming milk for one drink and a 1 hole would be better?


Mine came with a single hole tip. Have bought a 3 hole tip to try.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

One hole! How do other expo users find this? I've got a four on my Oscar and it was a bit lively to start but used to it now .


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## rmcgandara (Feb 12, 2013)

I am not good at milk... if anyone wants to give me a lesson, pretty please?


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

1 hole is a dream for a beginner. Slower and forgiving , and, glorous milk texture, very easy to achieve. Perfect for 1-2 drinks

2 holes is RAPID & I mean RAPID. Its harder to get texture silky smooth without LOADS of practise. Its great for steaming a larger jug for 3-4 drinks if youre not concerned with perfect latte art.

Ive not tried a 3 hole but am happy to swap with anyone for the 2 hole, I just dont use it enough!


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Dont forget to set the steam pressure to 1.3BAR ! 1.1 BAR is for losers


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

1.1 for me then!!


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Also I guess I need to get some Teflon glide pads or similar so I can at least pull the unit out to fill the tank a bit easier!


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> Dont forget to set the steam pressure to 1.3BAR ! 1.1 BAR is for losers


How easy is it to do? Mine is set at 0.9.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Really easy. Take the back off and turn the black dial little by little until desired pressure achieved . If you google it there are pics somewhere


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

Don't go too high. 1.4 max when settled. It'll overrun by about 0.1 bar when it clicks off and you don't want it near 1.8 where the emergency valve kicks in. Also, remember that the Leva (calling it a Brewtus is strictly for losers) has an HX pipe that feeds the brew boiler via the steam boiler. High steam pressure=higher steam boiler temperature, and after a certain point it will start to interfere with the brew temp stability.

Gary knows this, which is why he keeps his under 1.4


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

Also why is there only one pipe with the softener attached going into the water tank? The wholelatelove video shows two? My isomac also had two pipes?


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

There should be two


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

There is only only one inlet pipe hook up on any machine, the filter should have feed in feed out.


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

I took the back off to check for any spare pipes loose, but couldn't find any? Thought it was strange seeing 2 on the wholelattelove vid though.


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

I've got two pipes going into the tank. One with the softener on


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

Expobarista said:


> I've got two pipes going into the tank. One with the softener on


Hmm why do I only have one then?


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Sorry hot this mixed up with darkens filter thread.


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

http://www.wholelattelove.com/support_docs/Expobar%20Lever-Style%20Machine%20Parts%20Diagram%20-%20Lever%20and%20Brewtus%20Rev%2011-2009.pdf

Looking at the above pdf diagrams there are different models and my machine isn't missing a tube.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Remember yours is the dual system, so able to be plumbed in at any time


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

Ah yes, one tube for you then. Its on pg 24 of the diagrams


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## David_Sweden (Oct 16, 2013)

Walter Sobchak said:


> http://www.wholelattelove.com/support_docs/Expobar%20Lever-Style%20Machine%20Parts%20Diagram%20-%20Lever%20and%20Brewtus%20Rev%2011-2009.pdf
> 
> Looking at the above pdf diagrams there are different models and my machine isn't missing a tube.


On page 6 markt with 15. Can I connect a plastic pipe and lead it back to the water tank?

What do you think?


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Got my expo now almost put my back out trying to get it out the box!!







just trying to get my pid offset correct looks like its 97 it stops flashing off steam and as the default offset is 10 meansvi need to change to 12 correct? Lastly struggling to get the pf locked in fully very stiff, wondering if this is cause the baskets are sitting up a bit proud from pf? Can't seem to get pf handle past 7 o clock aiming for 6 o clock pointing staight at me


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## GS11 (Feb 20, 2013)

kikapu said:


> Got my expo now almost put my back out trying to get it out the box!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Congrats and yes very heavy, I put out my arm getting box up flight of stairs

My PF was really stiff at first though ok with time. It would be nice if it locked at 90 mind (my classic did)

Will have to check my manual and get back to you regards pid.


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

GS11 said:


> Congrats and yes very heavy, I put out my arm getting box up flight of stairs
> 
> My PF was really stiff at first though ok with time. It would be nice if it locked at 90 mind (my classic did)
> 
> Will have to check my manual and get back to you regards pid.


So does your pf still not lock in at 90deg or 6 o clock ( handle straight towards you)


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Its a brand new gasket , it will give over time


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## GS11 (Feb 20, 2013)

kikapu said:


> So does your pf still not lock in at 90deg or 6 o clock ( handle straight towards you)


No where near







, not sure why maybe a build quality thing?.

I'm using the stock PF as well as a BB naked PF.


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Ok I wont panic just yet then!


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

Well if it's too heavy for you just put it back in the box and I'll be happy to relieve you of the burden lol


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Charliej said:


> Well if it's too heavy for you just put it back in the box and I'll be happy to relieve you of the burden lol


Sorry Charlie too heavy to put back in the box!


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

David_Sweden said:


> On page 6 markt with 15. Can I connect a plastic pipe and lead it back to the water tank?
> 
> What do you think?


Not sure, probably best not to ask a novice like me.



GS11 said:


> Congrats and yes very heavy, I put out my arm getting box up flight of stairs
> 
> My PF was really stiff at first though ok with time. It would be nice if it locked at 90 mind (my classic did)
> 
> Will have to check my manual and get back to you regards pid.


Mine is exactly the same, hopefully should loosen up.


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

It will, don't worry. New gaskets are usually like that. Don't try to force it.

If you don't clean the gasket for a few days the grinds will soon grind off the sheen and it'll loosen up. You'll find the same thing happens after you've back flushed with detergent...it'll get all stiff again for a wee while


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Still trying to decide what offset my pid needs at 100 it gurgles and steam rises straight up. 99 there is no gurgling but steam or vapor is present although doesn't rise straight up like it did at 100. 98 similar to 99. Should I literally get no steam or vapour coming off the water as it pours?


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Its the gurgle noise (flashing) which should be absolutely there @100, just about there @99 but not @98

If you've ever done a HX flush you'll recognise the sound


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Also , I would set the PID to 98 and then maybe the next day, from cold, allow the machine to warm up for 30 mins. Does it then gurgle?


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

So if no gurgling at 98 its ok and no need to change offset? Can then just set brew temp at 93/93


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

The bellabarista guide says no flashing should be at 99 and if so keep adjusting down till no flashing then adjust offset so at 99 no flashing! !


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

this is at 98 seemscto be a bit of gurgling so think its likely to be 97? This would mean I change my offset so 97 shows as 98?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

This is why I'm glad Santa is dropping mine off!


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Yeah without the bellabarista guide would be stumped but it is very good


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## GS11 (Feb 20, 2013)

kikapu said:


> Yeah without the bellabarista guide would be stumped but it is very good


I was very impressed with how much detail went into the BB manual. Very well written...if only I could find it

Are you going to adjust the other pid settings per BB?


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Already adjusted the others dont know if thats a good thing to do. Pid temp offset at 11.

Yes it is good see I will refer back to it re cleaning etc was going to scan in at work and put on here but I guess that would naughty as it is copyright ed although could email you it as you already have it


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Mine has a 'slight' gurgle at 99, however that was in summer with a higher ambient temperature. I have to allow +/- 1c & I would rather have a slightly cooler running machine , it will live longer save a bit of elec : )

My machine sits at 92 or 93 for 99% of the time.


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## GS11 (Feb 20, 2013)

kikapu said:


> Already adjusted the others dont know if thats a good thing to do. Pid temp offset at 11.
> 
> Yes it is good see I will refer back to it re cleaning etc was going to scan in at work and put on here but I guess that would naughty as it is copyright ed although could email you it as you already have it


Thanks think I know where it is but will involve another trip up to the loft



garydyke1 said:


> Mine has a 'slight' gurgle at 99, however that was in summer with a higher ambient temperature. I have to allow +/- 1c & I would rather have a slightly cooler running machine , it will live longer save a bit of elec : )
> 
> My machine sits at 92 or 93 for 99% of the time.


Good thinking about running cooler temps regards longevity and saving elec. When would you consider rising temperatures for a particular bean or blend?


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> Mine has a 'slight' gurgle at 99, however that was in summer with a higher ambient temperature. I have to allow +/- 1c & I would rather have a slightly cooler running machine , it will live longer save a bit of elec : )
> 
> My machine sits at 92 or 93 for 99% of the time.


So should there be no gurgle at 99 at current ambient if so will change my offset to 12


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

GS11 said:


> Thanks think I know where it is but will involve another trip up to the loft
> 
> Good thinking about running cooler temps regards longevity and saving elec. When would you consider rising temperatures for a particular bean or blend?


When it's bland . If it's overly acidic ill drop temps and run more water thru


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## gman147 (Jul 7, 2012)

Mine sat at 8 oclock for months. No big deal if it seals..


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Right after 36 hours of having the machine and faffing finally managed to pull a couple of shots this morning!

Lots to get used to the main one being that you continue to get output after you bring lever back down!! Caysed me to get about an extra 5g in my cup! However shot was neither overly bitter or sour. Used 20g vst and am still floating









The couple of pucks I have noticed have had layer of water sat on top after the shot and this one below looked like the surface of the moon! Well very undulating


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

That doesn't look good.Should be a nice tight solid dry puck. Try a smaller basket or more coffee maybe?

Also, I'm wondering why there is so much shite on the basket rim. Is your gasket clean?. Do you wiggle rinse it?


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Loosen the grind a tad up dose on the coffee, make sure you tamp is consistent, the coarser the grind the harder the tamp


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

What was dose 20g , what was the shot time ?


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Yeah I thought it looked bad!

Don't know why there was so much stuff on the basket rim only pulled 1 shot before it. 20g dose 32 seconds output about 38g as I left under the portafilter after I stopped shot at about 27 seconds and didn't realise how much would still come out!! Really need some time to mess around but not really that likely for the next few days! !


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

You are fully putting the lever down , ie not just cutting the pump ?

I find the latency on scales is the only factor which can make it hard to cut the shot at target yield , yes you do get a few drips post shot but you soon learn exactly how much


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> You are fully putting the lever down , ie not just cutting the pump ?
> 
> I find the latency on scales is the only factor which can make it hard to cut the shot at target yield , yes you do get a few drips post shot but you soon learn exactly how much


The short answer is no!







Gary you have sussed my level ! ! Thanks

I did 3 shots this morning making a grand total of 6 shots in 5 days! I ground coarser and up dosed tamped harder, tons of water in puck, ground finer nutated same same thing after third shot which I hsd videoed and was gonna upload just pushed the lever down a bit more and was shocked that it went back to vertical! The next two shots the puck was nice and dry!! N o b head!!

Now need to sort out grind setting and keep a consistent tamping routine! Will use the Bb coffee to do yhis so hopefully waste less of my rave coffee.


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Couple of questions re the Brewtus what pressure should it indicate on the dial during the shot?! Mine seems to stop at 8.5bar does this need adjusting up at all? Next question would be how?

Have found the point where lifting the lever lets a bit of water through before pump kicks in (pre-infusion) although I believe the E61 group head automatically does a bit of perfusion anyway, has anyone found this actually helps?

Certainly feel like have made a lot of progress since last weekend long may that continue!


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Does it stop at 8.5 with a blind basket? You can increase max pressure by adjusting the OPV screw behind the drip tray

The manual preinfusion only works properly when plumbed in, so youre best off letting the e61 do its thing, it has natural preinfusion. at the end of the shot tho you can kill the pump and let flow continue with declining pressure.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Tomorrow's the day!


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

jeebsy said:


> Tomorrow's the day!


whoop whoop excited ?


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> Does it stop at 8.5 with a blind basket? You can increase max pressure by adjusting the OPV screw behind the drip tray
> 
> The manual preinfusion only works properly when plumbed in, so youre best off letting the e61 do its thing, it has natural preinfusion. at the end of the shot tho you can kill the pump and let flow continue with declining pressure.


I havent let it go that high with the blank basket!! so just put blank basket in and wait and see what it stops at? didtn want to damage the pump as on the classic only ever let the pump run for about 4-5 seconds with the blank basket in!!

Noted


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Mrboots2u said:


> whoop whoop excited ?


Don't think I'll be this excited on Christmas eve


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## GS11 (Feb 20, 2013)

jeebsy said:


> Don't think I'll be this excited on Christmas eve


Nice one jeebs, rotary brewtus, bet you can't wait wait

have you figured how you are going to plumb in?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

I'm renting at the moment so can't plumb it in - just going to run it from an external tank for now. Trying to move back to Scotland at the moment though and buy a place so will get it properly installed then.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Oscar left me tonight...looking at the empty space where he used to sit is making me a bit sad.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Youre gonna love it mate


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Yeah reckon once Santa comes round tomorrow with a shiney replacement I'll forget all about Oscar. We had some great times but twas but a two month fling.


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> Does it stop at 8.5 with a blind basket? You can increase max pressure by adjusting the OPV screw behind the drip tray
> 
> The manual preinfusion only works properly when plumbed in, so youre best off letting the e61 do its thing, it has natural preinfusion. at the end of the shot tho you can kill the pump and let flow continue with declining pressure.


with blind basket it goes to 9bar is this ok?


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

kikapu said:


> with blind basket it goes to 9bar is this ok?


Mine was set a 12 out of the box with a blind basket in. I've lowered it to 10 now though.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Aim for 10 mate , with a flow you'll be losing 1 BAR give or take


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## kikapu (Nov 18, 2012)

Walter Sobchak said:


> Mine was set a 12 out of the box with a blind basket in. I've lowered it to 10 now though.


 is that when you opv kicks in?

I didn't get any discharge at 9bar it just seemed to stop there so I shut it down or should I run it till opv. Kicks in?? Paranoid about knackering the pump!


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

The pump is fine for 60 seconds mate , don't worry haha.


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## Walter Sobchak (Nov 29, 2012)

kikapu said:


> is that when you opv kicks in?
> 
> I didn't get any discharge at 9bar it just seemed to stop there so I shut it down or should I run it till opv. Kicks in?? Paranoid about knackering the pump!


I just let it run for roughly 20 seconds each time I backflush, just following the same backflush instructions I had with my isomac.

I need a new rubber gasket already, I noticed a small part of rubber after pulling a shot had fallen off. I must have tightened the portafilter on too tight.


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