# New machine help



## Mont (Feb 9, 2020)

Hi folks just joined the forum , Looking for a bit of help please . I've just bought a nuova Simonelli Oscar 2 and sage smart grinder pro after ditching the sage barista express due to age. I'm not getting any creama in my shots and tasting very weak . The porta filter is a lot bigger than the sage so I'm putting 20g fresh roasted beans into double basket to make two cups . But very poor extraction . I'm only a novice to be honest so any help on getting some good decent extractions with my new set up would be very much appreciated. 
cheers


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## Dalerst (Jan 22, 2020)

Im a novice myself so not 100% sure I will be helping, but whats your extraction time on the shot? I find when im over extracting i get very little creama.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

You might be overloading the basket - 20g seems a lot for a standard double unless you're using a VST with bottomless PF. There needs to be some head room above the coffee puck for the water to evenly distribute otherwise you'll get channelling. Try the 5p coin trick and place one the top of the puck, lock in the PF and take it back out again. There shouldn't be any indent. If there is, reduce the dose. You can always make two separate 17 or 18g shots.


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## KingoftheHeath (Nov 22, 2019)

More info will help in giving a possible diagnosis.What beans and how old? What does the shot taste like - sour or bitter? What's the shot time and what weight are you getting in the cup? How do you prepare the coffee in the basket (eg distribution, tamping)? Have you tried changing the grind setting? Is the grinder brand new and how many beans have you out through it?


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## ArisP (Dec 17, 2019)

Mont said:


> ...so I'm putting 20g fresh roasted beans into double basket to make two cups ....


 Well there's your problem, you should be grinding the beans before you put them in the basket ?


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

You need to wait a lot longer to allow the machine to heat up compared with the BE. People would normally do that with the portafilter and basket fitted. Remove and add grinds. I'm assuming it's a conventional HX machine - pretty sure it is. Reckon on 1/2hr but can be longer. @DavecUK may be able to shed some light on that and use such as flushing before pulling a shot.

As lake-m mentioned that aspect does matter.  Pointless posting about it some times but unless people start with a sensible dose they will never know what that and changes do.

They may do a triple basket. On sizes you can reckon on 7,14,21g and generally they will hold some more. How much varies. 6 and 12g is probably available as well. A commercial 58mm triple is not expensive.  IMS etc stuff generally is and the chances are that IMS will have made the baskets where ever they come from. Maybe the portafiler wont hold one.

Beans etc don't matter at the moment and as you have used a BE I doubt if that sort of area and others will cause you any problems as you will already know about the problems. Fact anyway none fresh roasted can brew without any problems. Just isn't always the case.

John

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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

ajohn said:


> You need to wait a lot longer to allow the machine to heat up compared with the BE. People would normally do that with the portafilter and basket fitted. Remove and add grinds. I'm assuming it's a conventional HX machine - pretty sure it is. Reckon on 1/2hr but can be longer. @DavecUK may be able to shed some light on that and use such as flushing before pulling a shot.


 It's very common to people new to prosumer kit to think that once the temperature is up, or steam is ready, you can simply pull a shot. As John says 30m is usually required and that's really the Minimum. Pull a shot on a machine that's not warmed up and you get quite poor results.

@KingoftheHeath mentioned more information...so for the original poster, if I summarise the information we have so far. It is



20g fresh roasted coffee of some sort


Poor extraction


NS Oscar II and smart grinder pro


It's not a huge amount to go on because it could be, the bean, the grind, the machine or the persons technique?


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

The machine may be a dipper so not sure how these are handled. They do provide parts lists and it may well be from what I can see. Nice parts list but as usual they don't show the plumbing only the parts.

The grinder can do it's job and the OP has been using a BE for some time. In some ways the grinder is convenient - easy to go back to settings that have been used before. Stepped just means that slight variations from the usual tuning bible that is screwball anyway may be needed. A change IMHO needs a "decent" increase in cash. Some might find it indecent.

One thing I have noticed since switching from a BE is changes in crema. Some one else mentioned the same thing as well. Less of it not something wrong with it. And probably less persistent in an americano. Might be down to lower diameter baskets which are deeper for the same dose or more likely brew pressure. I suspect most finish up brewing at very near 15bar on this range of machines. On DTP's even more likely.

I also found I needed a bit more coffee - or think I did but haven't really compared that way. My drinks are now stronger anyway.

John

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