# Sage DB and E61 Portafilter Compatibility



## AMCD300

I have read back in the archives but cannot find a definite answer to this... Does a standard E61 Portafilter fit the Sage DB? I fancy a nice wooden-handled PF so unless I can unscrew the bakelite handle from the stock PF and replace it I will have to get an E61 replacement. Anyone tried fitting a non-Sage PF to the DB?

Cheers


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## jlarkin

The one from my ECM, which I think is standard E61 doesn't fit the Sage DB. They seem to have different lugs (if that's the word) and maybe slight difference in size of outer side of the PF.


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## AMCD300

jlarkin said:


> The one from my ECM, which I think is standard E61 doesn't fit the Sage DB. They seem to have different lugs (if that's the word) and maybe slight difference in size of outer side of the PF.


Thanks - that's what I thought.


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## Drusy

Me, too, I'd love to add a custom handle to the PF, so let us know if you figure it out!


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## AMCD300

Drusy said:


> Me, too, I'd love to add a custom handle to the PF, so let us know if you figure it out!


Will do - although I already have 'knock heft envy' so I may keep it quiet, lol. Just kidding. If we can unscrew the handle from the PF head then we can swop them out...look here - it is obviously do-able:

How to remove a Portafilter Handle: 




Portafilter HandleRepair:






Who is going first?!?!?


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## Drusy

AMCD300 said:


> Will do - although I already have 'knock heft envy' so I may keep it quiet, lol. Just kidding. If we can unscrew the handle from the PF head then we can swop them out...look here - it is obviously do-able:
> 
> How to remove a Portafilter Handle:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Portafilter HandleRepair:


Husband is a keen woodturner, I'll see if I can get him interested in the project....


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## AMCD300

Drusy said:


> Husband is a keen woodturner, I'll see if I can get him interested in the project....


Any luck?


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## Dallah

Google it. Getting the handle off of a Sage pf is not for the faint hearted. There is every chance you will much it up and have to buy a new pf. It can be done and I have seen some pimped out Sage pf online. But even as someone who is a huge fan of Sage machines, they have a certain utilitarian look to them. I honestly think putting a fancy turned exotic hardwood on the pf is trying to make a silk purse out of a pig's ear.


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## Dallah

Oh and E61. Not compatible at all. The closest is a Gaggia but while it fits the handle ends up sticking out at a strange angle.

I know on the face of it, the pf are very expensive but they are high quality stainless steel. Check out the price for a similar pf on the LM GS3. Its not £60


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## AMCD300

ridland said:


> Google it. Getting the handle off of a Sage pf is not for the faint hearted. There is every chance you will much it up and have to buy a new pf. It can be done and I have seen some pimped out Sage pf online. But even as someone who is a huge fan of Sage machines, they have a certain utilitarian look to them. I honestly think putting a fancy turned exotic hardwood on the pf is trying to make a silk purse out of a pig's ear.





ridland said:


> Oh and E61. Not compatible at all. The closest is a Gaggia but while it fits the handle ends up sticking out at a strange angle.
> 
> I know on the face of it, the pf are very expensive but they are high quality stainless steel. Check out the price for a similar pf on the LM GS3. Its not £60


I hear you...I have my new naked PF to play with now but it is a shame we can't see a little walnut on our DB PFs...

One other unrelated point @ridland - do you use the stock basket? if so what dose do you use? 21g? Cheers!


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## Dallah

@AMCD300 I use VST baskets now but the stock are pretty darn close the the OE baskets. How much I dosed was (is) dependent upon the coffee. I definitely was able to dose up to 20g without problem.


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## AMCD300

ridland said:


> @AMCD300 I use VST baskets now but the stock are pretty darn close the the OE baskets. How much I dosed was (is) dependent upon the coffee. I definitely was able to dose up to 20g without problem.


I am using 18g in the OE basket at the moment and not getting the best from it (I suspect) so I will try 20g and see how that goes as a 'starter for 10'. Thanks...


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## Drusy

Drusy said:


> Husband is a keen woodturner, I'll see if I can get him interested in the project....


@acmd300

Hmm.. not sure how this will work? He asked if anyone has a source for threaded bushing (sleeve) and hex head machine screw to fit a wooden handle onto a portafilter?


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## AMCD300

Drusy said:


> @acmd300
> 
> Hmm.. not sure how this will work? He asked if anyone has a source for threaded bushing (sleeve) and hex head machine screw to fit a wooden handle onto a portafilter?


Not me I'm afraid, which is a shame as it sounds like a fun weekend workshop project. I wonder if anyone else out there has done a similar PF mod?


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## Dallah

I'm sure I have seen it done on the Home Barista boards in the USA.


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## jimbojohn55

Just a heads up - the Sage handle is a PITA to remove - the reason is that it is not threaded - it is a push fit of a unique profile - round with two keyways running down the metal tang !

the second issue is that it is held on with a type of silicon adhesive that is heat proof so you cant heat up the portafilter to remove it or twist it off.

currently I am trying some siliKill silicon remover poured down the inside of the handle to try and degrade the silicon from the rear - will update with pictures once done , hopefully!


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## 4085

God loves a trier, Jimbojohn!!


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## jimbojohn55

dfk41 said:


> God loves a trier, Jimbojohn!!


its coming off one way or another- but will try and persuade it off first by dangling a proper wooden handle in front of it!


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## dlight

That worked for me. Strangely, the coffee machine also changed, so I've now got a wooden handle and a VBM single group commercial machine!


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## jimbojohn55

here is a Sage porta filter with the handle removed - its not for the feint of heart


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## 4085

Trust Sage to be different to everyone else!


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## AMCD300

Great piece of cast metal work though - at least we know it is not made of cheap rubbish. Now the question is, who can get this 'all wooded up'?


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## 4085

AMCD300 said:


> Great piece of cast metal work though - at least we know it is not made of cheap rubbish. Now the question is, who can get this 'all wooded up'?


I know a man....... !


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## jimbojohn55

interestingly the handle is made from bakerlite, which is why it has a rubber washer at the end to stop the bakerlite edge chipping- I think -

sage should make them all from wood to add a touch of class,


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## AMCD300

jimbojohn55 said:


> interestingly the handle is made from bakerlite, which is why it has a rubber washer at the end to stop the bakerlite edge chipping- I think -
> 
> sage should make them all from wood to add a touch of class,


I agree completely. Still - it's a bloody good machine so I'm not complaining


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## dlight

Wooden handles would be hopeless from a robustness and longevity perspective. Really not suited to mass market or commercial environment. Brevillle would not be silly enough to consider it. I do love the feel and look of wood but it does require care in use.


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## 4085

dlight said:


> Wooden handles would be hopeless from a robustness and longevity perspective. Really not suited to mass market or commercial environment. Brevillle would not be silly enough to consider it. I do love the feel and look of wood but it does require care in use.


do you think the Sage product is in the commercial environment? I would suspect using wooden handles 3 or 4 times a day would be quite simple to maintain. It is going to depend on the top coat. If you have to apply a wax once a month, is that such a hardship?


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## dlight

I don't think you read my post. "Really not suited to a mass market...".

Look at the level of complaints that occur in the consumer environment and think about a wooden handle getting knocks over time. It is a recipe for complaints.

However, it is a great idea as an after-market item for people like you and me.

The problem with the Breville portafilter handle is that you can't remove the Bakelite handle. If there was a real demand someone would be offering an option.


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## jimbojohn55

My twopeneth - dependant on wood type and finish, Sage could supply durable wooden handles - here's one I just supplied to dfk41


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## Mrboots2u

jimbojohn55 said:


> My twopeneth - dependant on wood type and finish, Sage could supply durable wooden handles - here's one I just supplied to dfk41
> 
> View attachment 22950


They could but they don't , and they never will .

These are great machines but mass produced to keep the price down . If you want wood and aesthetics this might not be the machine for you . If you want something that has tons of functions and is at a great price , then


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## jimbojohn55

Breville do make cheaper products with wooden handles - the toaster I'm surprised by

http://www.foodanddrink.helpmeshop.org/product/Breville-TT27-Elements-Toaster-Wooden-Handle.html

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Breville-JK49-Elements-Brushed-Stainless-Kettle/dp/B0002TTJGK


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## Xavarion

jimbojohn55 said:


> My twopeneth - dependant on wood type and finish, Sage could supply durable wooden handles - here's one I just supplied to dfk41
> 
> View attachment 22950


Do you make this for people to purchase aftermarket? It looks fantastic!


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## 4085

Xavarion said:


> Do you make this for people to purchase aftermarket? It looks fantastic!


Yes!


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## jimbojohn55

I can do handles for pretty much any machine or shape - with Sage ones the originals are glued on and as a result very problematic to remove without damage to the black bakerlite part - which in my mind is ok as they deserve a real wood handle instead - ive got a cocobolo handle ready at the moment, and some Indian rosewood in stock - although I can source most woods if there is a particular preference.

cheers jim

Cocobolo wood


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## coffeechap

Handles come of no problem if you hear them up


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## jimbojohn55

coffeechap said:


> Handles come of no problem if you hear them up


Hi Coffeechap - I tried that, but found that the silicon adhesive on the one for dfk41 didn't respond to heat even when using a hotair gun, maybe I was not quite brave enough with the temp I was raising it to - I did remove some of the silicon and experimented with blasting it directly with heat and it just sat there, further research suggests that there are different levels of heat resistance dependant on silicon formulation, anyone here work for sage?


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## AMCD300

jimbojohn55 said:


> My twopeneth - dependant on wood type and finish, Sage could supply durable wooden handles - here's one I just supplied to dfk41
> 
> View attachment 22950


I think this looks great - the obvious question is, how much???


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## jimbojohn55

AMCD300 said:


> I think this looks great - the obvious question is, how much???


at the moment I'm pricing handles based on the following costs

Cost of wood - exotics are around £10 - native beach oak etc. are around £3-5

Making time 2 1/2 hours £20

Postage cost - £3 - £6 dependant on preferred service registered or standard.

So approx. prices £26 to £34 per handle for a made to order item

Cheers Jim


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## Sami

@dfk41 do you have a picture of yours in-situ?


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## jimbojohn55

hi Sami - dfk41 - posted a couple here http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?34088-Nice-bit-of-wood!&p=450614#post450614


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## Sconner

How's the situation with pf right now? I'm about to get DB and I fancy naked portafilter but there is nothing on Sage website or eBay.


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## lmulli

They are still listed on the sage website although don't appear to be in stock. Might be worth a phone call see if they are getting any in.

https://sageappliances.co.uk/products/58mm-naked-porterfilter?variant=41100906116


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## joey24dirt

marcin.mielniczu said:


> How's the situation with pf right now? I'm about to get DB and I fancy naked portafilter but there is nothing on Sage website or eBay.


You're best off ringing sage as their website is poop at the moment. Due to be upgrading it soon according to the guys on the phone. It's was a really strange experience ordering something over the phone like the old days before internet shopping haha


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## Sconner

Yeah, just got an email from them. Button responsible for putting it into basket doesn't work









Anyway, gaggia portafilter should work, just the "funny angle" it will be situated on. Can someone explain?


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## big_kitch

Reviving an old thread here I know but my Oracle Bakelite handle has fractured after 3.5 years knocking out and I am loathed to buy a whole new portafilter. I see from earlier in the thread that @jimbojohn55 makes rather nice wooden replacements. Seems I can't send a PM until I have made 5 posts so hoping he might see this.

Cheers.


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## jimbojohn55

big_kitch said:


> Reviving an old thread here I know but my Oracle Bakelite handle has fractured after 3.5 years knocking out and I am loathed to buy a whole new portafilter. I see from earlier in the thread that @jimbojohn55 makes rather nice wooden replacements. Seems I can't send a PM until I have made 5 posts so hoping he might see this.
> 
> Cheers.


I have got a cocobolo handle (very dark red / brown) available if your interested? cheers Jim


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## big_kitch

jimbojohn55 said:


> I have got a cocobolo handle (very dark red / brown) available if your interested? cheers Jim


Thanks for the reply Jim. Would be looking for something more towards black. Do you still make them?

Cheers

Nick


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## All_a_Mort

An ebony handle would look rather awesome.


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## big_kitch

All_a_Mort said:


> An ebony handle would look rather awesome.


Totally agree!


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## big_kitch

I see there is someone in Australia that makes them https://wilcoxcoffeeparts.eu/product-category/breville/ but was hoping for something closer to home.


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## big_kitch

Think I'm just going to have to bite the bullet and order a new PF ☹


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## joey24dirt

big_kitch said:


> Think I'm just going to have to bite the bullet and order a new PF


Let us know if sage have stock, they had took them all down recently


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## ashcroc

joey24dirt said:


> Let us know if sage have stock, they had took them all down recently


Surprised you haven't offered your services to whittle a new handle. You gotta have some stock with black stripes in it!


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## joey24dirt

ashcroc said:


> Surprised you haven't offered your services to whittle a new handle. You gotta have some stock with black stripes in it!


Haha I don't like to push myself on to people


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## big_kitch

I did phone them the other day. They said that although they were not showing on the website they can be ordered by phone.



joey24dirt said:


> Let us know if sage have stock, they had took them all down recently


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## big_kitch

big_kitch said:


> Thanks for the reply Jim. Would be looking for something more towards black. Do you still make them?
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Nick


 So it's been a bit of while making coffee with my cracked "detachable" handle but @jimbojohn55 has now done me a lovely replacement in African Blackwood. Looks very classy IMHO ?


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## ajohn

jimbojohn55 said:


> Hi Coffeechap - I tried that, but found that the silicon adhesive on the one for dfk41 didn't respond to heat even when using a hotair gun, maybe I was not quite brave enough with the temp I was raising it to - I did remove some of the silicon and experimented with blasting it directly with heat and it just sat there, further research suggests that there are different levels of heat resistance dependant on silicon formulation, anyone here work for sage?


 You probably need about 400C, maybe more.  Then silicone rubber products should revert to sand - plus what ever filler was used.

John

-


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## wacky32

Hello, This is my first post, I didn't realise that I joined the forum 4 years ago. Having had a 2nd hand jura for many years, I have recently changed to a refurbished sage oracle touch and would like to replace the handle on the portafilter and was wondering if @jimbojohn55 still has any handles available? Many thanks.


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