# Single tamp ?



## brun (Dec 26, 2011)

the other day i noticed on one of the Seattle Coffee Gear vids on youtube that when Gail tamps, she has ground up the side of the basket as the tamper doesnt quite fit, like mine, i got one from Happy Donkey and its always bugged me that its 1mm+ out on fit, what i usually do is tamp, tap the side the drop the grounds that are up the side and tamp again so its nice and flat and no grounds up the side, or sometimes ill tamp and then do the NSEW thing to get the edges

last night i made one, and i thought, ive been using 15-16g a lot lately, lets go back down see what happens, so i stuck 14.5g in, and i dispersed the grinds in the basket with a fork to get rid of any clumps, and i tamped once, not excessively either as i sometimes do, im on pre ground so ive been tamping hard to try and get a few extra seconds, i just left the bits up the side to see what happened

what came out was probably the slowest pouring shot ive had yet, but i couldnt figure it out, id used this ground a few days before (HasBean Jailbreak) and dosed more, tamped harder, yet it came out faster, the only thing i can think of is that by trying to make a perfect puck in the basket before it goes in the machine, im tapping it around too much and tamping 2-3 times isnt doing it any favours

im gonna try it again tonight and see if i can repeat it, otherwise it was just a fluke better shot


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## JohnnieWalker (Aug 24, 2011)

Yeah, I've found exactly the same thing, tapping the PF on the worktop during dosing the basket has a huge impact on my extraction time/shot.

I need to find the best method, as it dictates how fine I grind and how hard I tamp.

Tapping to settle the grinds compacts the coffee more than I thought it would, although I suppose it removes all of the air/space from around the coffee and makes it much denser, which in effect is what tamping does.

I suppose it's like everything else, find a technique that gives the best result and stick to it to try and make consistent coffee.

---

I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=53.821662,-3.026150

Costa Coffee Beans, Ground Coffee & Syrups available at http://CoffeeDelivered.co.uk


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## JohnnieWalker (Aug 24, 2011)

Thinking more about the whole thing, surely having a much bigger diameter basket/shower screen and a thinner puck of coffee would have been a better design.

I'd imagine it would require much less pressure to force hot water through a puck half the thickness of the average puck?

It would also be easier to ensure an even extraction as the difference in time between the coffee at the top of the puck and the bottom would be much less.

I'm sure there are many good reasons why the baskets and PF's and groupheads are the size they are, probably down cost and a compromise of different designs?

---

I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=53.821674,-3.026197

Costa Coffee Beans, Ground Coffee & Syrups available at http://CoffeeDelivered.co.uk


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## jimbow (Oct 13, 2011)

Pretty much my experience too. I found that the more I mucked around with the coffee, trying to perfect the puck or get grinds off the side of the basket, the more extraction issues and artefacts I introduced. I found that a single, simple straight and level tamp works best.


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## onemac (Dec 15, 2011)

There's a wealth of information out there and some of it contradictory to say the least. Some say the tamp is not important (although all agree level is the key) but to me it is. Amongst the reams of suggestions offered to me in my quest to get a decent shot one stands out - 'lay the tamper in the basket using weight only and level. Take the tamper out to check and tamp once to the required pressure'. I made all the tamping mistakes possible including levelling the grounds after a hard tamp but what works for me now is tamper weight to level and one tamp only - no NSEW and no tapping the side of the portafilter (as Gail suggests in her updated tamping video). I do find that I can extend the time of the shot if after filling the basket and doing WDT I tap the portafilter on the worktop to settle the grinds before tamping.

I'm using 14g for the first shot and 14.5g for the rest and whilst results vary, they are all close enough now not to throw the shot down the sink. For me, the less I bugger about with the grounds the better.

Al


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## SlowRoast (Sep 24, 2010)

I personally have learnt single tamping is bad, from my expierences at work. Normally get terrible channelling, wonky shots, the lot. If I make my own drink and tamp twice, which is agaisnt brand standard, I get a much more consistent, even shot and the puck knocks out cleaner.

At home, I grind two lots of coffee into my portafilter, after the first lot I tap the portafilter on the mat to break up clumps and level it out, then grind again topping up to the top. Distribute and level with my finger, light even tamp, wipe off the edges and tamp firmly. Never have any problems with this myself, I tried tapping the sides just out of curiosity, it shattered my puck.


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## rodabod (Dec 4, 2011)

I think it's good to give the portafilter a knock on the worktop to settle the grounds / fill gaps, but other than that I tend not to fanny about with it. I do splay my thumb and a couple of fingers over the edge of the tamper though; this lets me get it exactly level as I can feel the basket against them, and adjust.


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

I'm a single tamper (with a small polish). But I also do a little modified Stockfleth before the tamp. I know folks like Gwilym say it's unnecessary but I think perhaps they are basing that view upon using a grinder that distributes extremely well. I do taste my coffee, I have compared DOING twiddly finger movements with NOT doing them, and I find the taste and extraction better through DOING. A naked portafilter back this up. NOT DOING results in more channelling & blonding.

Anyway, single tamp Yes







Tap on side No. Settling tap on bench Yes.


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## seeq (Jul 9, 2011)

I have found my best shot is similar to mike with minor variations. I pour my grinds into a cup and use WDT method to avoid clumping, pour into the portafilter and a tap on the bench gets them level and then one single tamp and polish. Certain techniques suit different machines and grinders. However I am of the NEVER TAMP TWICE view. Once you have the grinds in place I don't see a need to move them again, and any further tapping or tamping is surely just going to create a channel.


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

Frankly, rather than dicking about with nonsense, if you really can't get a decent pour get a better grinder.

Stockfleth move, WDT, nutation. WTF? You are putting some ground coffee in a little metal basket, not creating a Michelin starred dish that needs a decade of honed skills to create. Get over yourselves









Load the basket, quick finger swipe to knock the top off, bang the spouts on the counter top a couple of times, one firm tamp with fingertips touching basket rim to gauge level, 1/4 turn to wipe off any shit off the tamper then lock.

Oh, and don't forget to fart over the portafilter before you load (pro tip)


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## seeq (Jul 9, 2011)

Expobarista said:


> Frankly, rather than dicking about with nonsense, if you really can't get a decent pour get a better grinder.


I assume you earn far more money than the rest of us, I'm saving up to pay the gas bill, £400m+ to upgrade is out the question



> Stockfleth move, WDT, nutation. WTF? You are putting some ground coffee in a little metal basket, not creating a Michelin starred dish that needs a decade of honed skills to create. Get over yourselves
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I assume you work for Starbucks then?


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

If the distribution is poor then no amount of tamping will correct it...you will have variable density in the puck and create channelling.

I got some great looking pours from my MC2 back last year, so cheaper grinders are no excuse


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

seeq said:


> I assume you earn far more money than the rest of us, I'm saving up to pay the gas bill, £400m+ to upgrade is out the question
> 
> I assume you work for Starbucks then?


Two assumptions there that contradict each other. Doh!


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## forzajuve (Feb 2, 2011)

I too have the Happy Donkey tamper which although is good for the price is slightly too small for my Gaggia Classic portafilter. This inevitably leads to a two tamp requirement although I find that after a small tap on the bench to bed in the grinds, a light first tamp followed by a slight readjustment for the edge effect and a firm second does the trick.

I suppose I should really invest in a tamper which is a snug fit. Any suggestions? However, as I am very happy with my extractions I am reluctant to change my methods which I guess means I don't need to. Any excuse to invest in some new coffee gear though I'll take!


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## rodabod (Dec 4, 2011)

I've never used a grinder with poor distribution. My Cunill commercial grinder has a doser which I guess breaks up clumps, and the Porlex is perfect in my opinion with respect to clumping too, plus no buggering about. Just tip it straight in.

I don't see how clumps would be a big problem unless they were really dense, to the point that they were still more dense than the rest of the coffee after tamping. You never see cafe workers prodding a portafilter with a bloody paperclip! "Boss! Where did we leave the yoghurt pot and the skewers?!".

Also, when do I get a "move" named after me?


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

On the basis that Stockfleths takes no longer than a finger swipe does (infact it IS a finger swipe... only circular in direction) and wastes less (if any) grinds, I don't think it's deserving of any criticism. Particularly if it makes the extraction better too. And it is used by many good coffeeshop baristas. But just my opinion


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

It is deserving of critiscism, not for being a simple wipe round the rim with your finger, but for the pretence of being called the 'Stockfleth Move'.

It's hardly a grandmaster chess move is it


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

I am a bad workman and I am blaming my tools.

I won't be happy with my tamps until I get a 58.35mm tamper


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## rodabod (Dec 4, 2011)

I wouldn't worry massively about loose grounds at the sides. I won't look like that once water has gushed over the top of the coffee.


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

Expobarista said:


> It is deserving of critiscism, not for being a simple wipe round the rim with your finger, but for the pretence of being called the 'Stockfleth Move'.
> 
> It's hardly a grandmaster chess move is it


Hehe. I can accept that!


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## jimbow (Oct 13, 2011)

seeq said:


> ...
> 
> I assume you work for Starbucks then?


I am not sure Starbucks even use portafilters - don't they use bean to cup machines?


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## JohnnieWalker (Aug 24, 2011)

Expobarista said:


> Two assumptions there that contradict each other. Doh!


oooohh, ( raises handbag to chin with both hands )


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## JohnnieWalker (Aug 24, 2011)

Expobarista said:


> It is deserving of critiscism, not for being a simple wipe round the rim with your finger, but for the pretence of being called the 'Stockfleth Move'.
> 
> It's hardly a grandmaster chess move is it


Frantically searches for an even bigger handbag......


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

Frantically searches for a sense of humour for JohnnieW


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## rodabod (Dec 4, 2011)

Glad to see this forum is forming some sort of character.


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## onemac (Dec 15, 2011)

Whatever works for you baby........


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## JohnnieWalker (Aug 24, 2011)

Oh don't worry Expobarista, it's in my handbag, and I have several versions available ( but not all kept in handbags ).

---

I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=53.821430,-3.026379

Costa Coffee Beans, Ground Coffee & Syrups available at http://CostaShop.co.uk


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## sicknote (Sep 5, 2011)

Single tamp and quick polish.

Recently I have started using the funnel supplied with the Aeropress to load the basket. I was sick of the waste/mess I was getting when grinding into the basket. I now grind into a small bowl, weigh, pour into funnel and slowly remove with a slight shoogle (couldn't think of a better word....lol). Perfect distribution and zero waste. Try it and tell me it doesn't work







.

http://stooryduster.co.uk/shoogle


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## jimrobo (Aug 5, 2011)

If I have a bit of a que on I literally dose into the portafilter, medium tamp straight away and lock in. If I am on my own I will grind into the portafilter, fanny around the grounds around the portafilter for perfect distribution, give it a finger swipe level, one good tamp and then lock it in.

If I use a naked portafilter I can tell the difference between the 2 different pours that come from the above but if I use the standard 2 spout portafilter there is practically no noticeable difference. Theres no way anyone who is round for coffee would be able to tell the difference. This is the bottom line for me. If glen was round for coffee I would opt for the fannying around technique because I know I will get the very best out of the coffee as I can, otherwise theres no difference to the normal person in the street.


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## Glenn (Jun 14, 2008)

Consistency is the name of the game.

Once you find a technique that works it can be applied to all drinks served.

Once you've got the grinder dialled in and the machine set up a consistent dose and tamp is only part of the routine

Choosing the equipment is a much bugger deal. This helps in the queue clearing scenario. With a consistent dose and tamp (that's not fussy or overly complicated) you should be able to use it no matter how many in the line.


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## SlowRoast (Sep 24, 2010)

Consistency is so important definitely, Glenn! I use the same tamp technique daily and never get problems, except obviously the grind needing the slightest adjustment.

Speaking of equipment, our CMA Marisa nearly died today as me and another person were at it, steam pressure dropped right below 0.5 bar and all I got out the steam wand on my side was just hot air, no actual steam ...

We got slammed all day though to say the least.


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## Jugglestruck (Nov 17, 2011)

Three days ago I read this thread and yesterday went for a single tamp, something I just don't do. It produced the best coffee from my machine yet.

I tried again this morning and got a glorious shot.

Wahay, the way to go I reckon.


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## brun (Dec 26, 2011)

Good to hear, I've learned everything on here so nice to know one of my numerous threads has helped someone out


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

Jugglestruck said:


> Three days ago I read this thread and yesterday went for a single tamp, something I just don't do. It produced the best coffee from my machine yet.
> 
> I tried again this morning and got a glorious shot.
> 
> .


You farted into the portafilter before loading, didn't you.

Told you it works.


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## onemac (Dec 15, 2011)

Expobarista said:


> You farted into the portafilter before loading, didn't you.


Yes but was it a single fart or did you go for multiples?????

Al


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## rodabod (Dec 4, 2011)

onemac said:


> Yes but was it a single fart or did you go for multiples?????


North, South, East, West, and all with a chopstick up his arse.


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## Spazbarista (Dec 6, 2011)

You don't need a chopstick if you've got a decent grinder.

Nutate your arse cheeks on the portafilter as you squeeze one out. There's a video somewhere on YouTube of Hoffmann demonstrating it at a lecture.


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## Jugglestruck (Nov 17, 2011)

Guys, this is a wealth of info you're sharing here, I'll try the chopstick tip tomorrow because I've got friends coming round.


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