# Bambino + Smart Grinder = just cannot get it right...



## barbik (May 2, 2020)

I have a Bambino Plus machine and after months of trying everything I read in the various posts, I still can't seem to get it right, so am finally posting this in the hopes of some advice. the relevent info:



I'm a beginner, and chose this machine for the expected simplicity. I have one coffee a day (sometimes two), usually an espresso or a flat white.


I get freshly roasted beans from Union (and wait a few days for degassing), and I grind them in the Sage Smart Grinder Pro.


The machine came with the dual wall baskets, but I called Sage and got an unpressurized one (but only the single, they didn't have stock of the double).


I warm up by running it once with a different empty basket, and then change to the basket I want to use with grinds


The default Grinder pro setting was 12, but that gave me just a very dark slow drip drip. I need to go all the way to 17 or 18 to get a flow (according to the booklet, espresso grind is anything up to 30).


I'm currently trying to get it right with the single unpressurized basket - I use around 10g (also tried 9,11).


No matter which grinder setting or the volume of grinds, the coffee starts coming out within 5 seconds of when the pumps start sounding.


It's also much too short. I tried using the double button for a longer extraction, but even that stops after less than 15 seconds.


Right now for 10g grinds I'm getting 15ml. I'm aiming for 1:2 or even slightly higher.


I have tried using the manual option or just changing setting for maximum length of shot - but then it still seems to start too soon and taste over-extracted.


I just can't seem to get the taste right! Would appreciate suggestions on what I should be doing. Thanks


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## BlackCatCoffee (Apr 11, 2017)

It is not clear from your post which combinations of things you have tried together so apologies if this is one but I would say make your life easier and use the double basket. It is much more forgiving.

Try 18g in the unpressurised double basket aim for 36g out in around 30 seconds. Use the manual settings. Forget the auto ones are there for now.


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## Adam.f (Apr 9, 2020)

Also how long are you leaving the beans after the roast date? You want them to be at least 7 days after roasting date before opening them.


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## barbik (May 2, 2020)

BlackCatCoffee said:


> Try 18g in the unpressurised double basket aim for 36g out in around 30 seconds. Use the manual settings. Forget the auto ones are there for now.


 thanks, but that's the only option I can't try - Sage didn't have the unpressurised double basket in stock when I called them. So it's only the dual walled (single and double) or the unpressurised single. I've been trying to focus on the latter, because I gather from all my reading that unpressurised produces a superior taste.



Adam.f said:


> Also how long are you leaving the beans after the roast date? You want them to be at least 7 days after roasting date before opening them.


 I wait around 10 days from roast date. I use fairly dark roasts (union revelation or foundation)


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## BlackCatCoffee (Apr 11, 2017)

Ahh ok. Well the single baskets are a bit of a pig to get right. You can get unpressurised baskets from elsewhere. I would suggest that should be a priority.


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

barbik said:


> I have a Bambino Plus machine and after months of trying everything I read in the various posts, I still can't seem to get it right, so am finally posting this in the hopes of some advice. the relevent info:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Ok: 
So first thing the volumetric doesn't work. 
Just do the dose manually. So press and hold for pre-infusion then let go.

I find the single works best with 10-11g and runs quite slowly. Hence why you need to manually pull it.

Have you reached the finest setting yet? If not then grind finer until you get enough resistance in the basket.

I don't know why everyone is against the single basket, I get great results from it in the Barista pro.


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## barbik (May 2, 2020)

TomHughes said:


> Just do the dose manually. So press and hold for pre-infusion then let go.
> 
> I find the single works best with 10-11g and runs quite slowly. Hence why you need to manually pull it.
> 
> Have you reached the finest setting yet? If not then grind finer until you get enough resistance in the basket.


 Thanks!

how long should the pre-infusion be? When I tried to press and hold, the water started after 3 seconds or so even before I let go. Is that normal?

On the grind, I assumed that if it is coming through in a very slow drip, then it's already too fine. This was happening on the #14 setting of the grinder. Are you saying that if I actually went much finer than that, then the this would block the water for longer, thereby increasing the infusion time and after which it might start streaming out at the wanted flow - did I understand correctly?


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## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

It shouldn't really drip in the pre-infusion stage, just bead across the basket. You'll get a few drops but you're not aiming for flow in that stage.


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

Rob1 said:


> It shouldn't really drip in the pre-infusion stage, just bead across the basket. You'll get a few drops but you're not aiming for flow in that stage.


 Mine does that sometimes. I suspect the pre-infusion of the Sages with thermojets is actually quite a high pressure!


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## barbik (May 2, 2020)

Thanks again! Just to check on my last question - On the grind, I assumed that if it is coming through in a very slow drip, then it's already too fine. This was happening on the #14 setting of the grinder. Are you saying that if I actually went much finer than that, then the this would block the water for longer, thereby increasing the infusion time and after which it might start streaming out at the wanted flow - did I understand correctly?


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

barbik said:


> Thanks again! Just to check on my last question - On the grind, I assumed that if it is coming through in a very slow drip, then it's already too fine. This was happening on the #14 setting of the grinder. Are you saying that if I actually went much finer than that, then the this would block the water for longer, thereby increasing the infusion time and after which it might start streaming out at the wanted flow - did I understand correctly?


 No, 
Could you be clearer as you say the machine stopped after 15 seconds?


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## barbik (May 2, 2020)

TomHughes said:


> No,
> Could you be clearer as you say the machine stopped after 15 seconds?


 Sorry, I wasn't clear enough.

There seem to be two problems I'm facing. The overall length of the shot is one of them - I'll experiment more with the manual approach, and hopefully get it to go longer than 15 secs.

The second problem is that the extraction seems to begin very quickly. With the grinder on a coarser setting (17-18 on smart grinder pro), it starts quickly and flows ok but clearly produces too thin a coffee. If I try a finer grind, it slows to a dark drip and yet still starts too quickly. The finest setting I've gone is 12. My question was whether it's worth trying to go much finer - would that prevent it from letting the water through as quickly in the initial stage? but wouldn't it be even more of a slow drip when it does come out?

I hope that's clearer, apologies, I'me a novice and am still learning the science of this all!


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

barbik said:


> Sorry, I wasn't clear enough.
> 
> There seem to be two problems I'm facing. The overall length of the shot is one of them - I'll experiment more with the manual approach, and hopefully get it to go longer than 15 secs.
> 
> ...


 @MWJBcould this be the impacted puck you mentioned?


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

TomHughes said:


> @MWJBcould this be the impacted puck you mentioned?


 Hard to say at this stage, we don't really have full figures from as much as 3 shots to see if there is a trend of any kind.

Once we have that, we can maybe go forward.


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## barbik (May 2, 2020)

BlackCatCoffee said:


> Ahh ok. Well the single baskets are a bit of a pig to get right. You can get unpressurised baskets from elsewhere. I would suggest that should be a priority.


 Thanks. Any idea where I can find alternative baskets that would fit?

Should I also be looking at a different portafilter?


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## idekov (Aug 21, 2019)

"I'm currently trying to get it right with the single unpressurized basket - I use around 10g (also tried 9,11)."

I'm using Bambino for my everyday coffee and cappuccino with Sage single dose unpressurized basket. The grinder however is not Sage, but Eureka Mignon MCI, so I can't advice on the grind setting. And yes it took me quite some time and frustration, but I can assure you now Bambino is working fine for me. Depending on the coffee the dose for that basket is between 10.5 and 11.5g., I do not use the razor tool, but just the tamper. I do not use manual preinfusion, and the first drip should be between 7-9 sec. The the total extraction time is between 35-42 sec. and the output volume between 40-50ml. I'm not an expert, but just sharing what works for me. And try to change only one variable at the time. You need a scale to learn to be consistent with the dose in first place. Than you need to have beans that are easy to work with - like Maromas Orphea, then start playing with the grind and look for the first drip between 7-9 sec. Then comes the total extraction time and output volume (use the scale). But not to forget once you manage to get all the above you need to start testing the difference and experiment what you like as taste (again the main variable to play with is the grind, but that's only and after you dialin the new beans). I have shared some videos. Again not pretending that that's the best way, but with Bambino that's what works for me.


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## barbik (May 2, 2020)

idekov said:


> I'm using Bambino for my everyday coffee and cappuccino with Sage single dose unpressurized basket. The grinder however is not Sage, but Eureka Mignon MCI, so I can't advice on the grind setting. And yes it took me quite some time and frustration, but I can assure you now Bambino is working fine for me.


 Thanks - good to hear that it is possible! I'll keep experimenting...


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