# Hello all.. another Gaggia newbie here!



## ajc-79 (Apr 18, 2010)

Good morning all..

Just thought i'd de-lurk and say hello. I've been reading the threads for a while and thought i'd tell you a bit about my set-up and where I am with my coffee. I've got a Gaggia Classic (hasn't everyone?) which i've had for a couple of years. I've also inherited a Gaggia MM burr grinder, to replace my cheap Morphy Richards rotary (is that the technical term?) grinder, which is now relegated to grinding spicies for curries. I'm generally pretty pleased with the Gaggia pairing, but since i've done a half day 'Barista basics' course, i'm now more aware of what i'm doing wrong and where to improve...

I can do a decent show of espresso, with the 1oz coming in at 26 seconds.. but i've having trouble doing it consistantly. Occasioanlly a shot that runs far too quickly, even though I haven't changed the grinder and i'm tamping with the same pressure.. i'm using the dregs of a 1kilo bag of Lavazza beans at the moment, then i promise to buy some freshly roasted local ones instead... but I can't see that's causing the problem?

Regarding my grinder - is the Gaggia MM considered a decent model, or should I think of replacing it at some point? What would the benefits be?

Milk steaming.. I think I need to replace my steam valve, as my wand leaks water.. and if I try to do more than a modest amount of milk, I run out of puff! From what others had written, this seems to be normal.. also, is there any reason NOT to change the wand to the Rancilio model? everyone seems to be doing this - what's the benefits?

And lastly, on cleaning.. i've been using the little sachets of Gaggia cleaning agent once every couple of months. i've read about back-flushing the Classic, and there's a lot of conflicting information.. could somebody tell me the right way to clean this machine?

Thanks all,

Adam


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## BanishInstant (Oct 12, 2009)

Hi Adam and welcome.

As beans age they soften and therefore grind quicker.

Are you weighing the amount of ground coffee in your portafilter? When I first start a new bag of beans, it takes time to get the grind and volume correct from the grinder. I use some scales to ensure that volume is consistent. If after all of the other factors are in line, I may adjust the volume.

Try http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?1372-Backflushing&highlight=flush for backflushing.


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## ChiarasDad (Mar 21, 2010)

BanishInstant pretty much said it all, but I'll reiterate anyway. As your beans age they change, and what was a good grind a couple days ago can become a loose and fast grind today. I find this to be particularly true of prepackaged beans like Lavazza, Illy, and so on - roasted weeks or months ago, they're very nice at the moment the bag or tin is opened, but they age speedily from that point. In my experience freshly roasted beans fall off in quality much less rapidly (though just like prepackaged beans, once they're done, they're done).

Also, in my experience, as beans age the "window" of acceptable grind/dose/tamp combinations gets narrower and narrower. In other words, I find fresh beans more forgiving of variations in grind and technique than old beans that are on their way out.

If you're getting massive shot-to-shot variation within the same day after carefully adjusting your grind, then here are the causes I'd suspect:

1) variation in dosage

2) variation in tamp

3) per my assertion above that older beans are less forgiving, the 'window' on yours has narrowed to the point where you just can't hit it reliably on successive attempts

In your case I'm tempted to imagine it's #3, but I confess to a blatant bias towards fresh beans, so best not take my word for it.


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## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

Hi Adam, welcome to Coffee Forums.


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## ajc-79 (Apr 18, 2010)

Thanks all. I didn't think of that, it's a good point. I'll try getting a small quantity of super-fresh beans and see how I go from there... the Lavazza ones have just been clipped shut, so probably not stayed as fresh as they could have been.

Any comments on my grinder and cleaning questions would also be gratefully recieved too.

Adam


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## BanishInstant (Oct 12, 2009)

The descaling sounds about right if you live in a soft water area. If your kettle is normally quite "furry" then I would increase the frequency.

I personally have no experience with the MM, but from what I have read is that there are not enough fineness settings and the quality of the burrs is quite low. You could step up a bit to the Iberital MC2, or even better step up a lot to Mahlkonig Vario or Mazzer Super Jolly.


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

ajc-79 said:


> Thanks all. I didn't think of that, it's a good point. I'll try getting a small quantity of super-fresh beans and see how I go from there... the Lavazza ones have just been clipped shut, so probably not stayed as fresh as they could have been.
> 
> Any comments on my grinder and cleaning questions would also be gratefully recieved too.
> 
> Adam


Note that beans off supermarket shelves are not fresh. Try an online supplier like hasbean, square mile etc. Fresh beans are key.

Get some puly caff from somewhere and it has the instructions for use on the side. That and a 58mm blind basket like this: http://www.happydonkey.co.uk/hd0184-gaggia-backflushing-basket.html and you're away.

Grinder is probably adequate, but I'd be looking to change it for the options as above, grinder being more important than the machine.


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## Glenn (Jun 14, 2008)

Make sure your beans are not too fresh as that can also have an adverse effect

5-15 days past roast is about right

We have produced a How to Backflush guide *here*


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## ajc-79 (Apr 18, 2010)

Thanks all. Ordered some puly caff and a blind filter from Happy Donkey. Wish me luck.. i'll let you know what emerges from my machine after it's first backflush!


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## DonRJ (Apr 3, 2010)

Don`t panic if the portafilter seems a bit tight when you lock it in after backflushing with Puly caff, the traces of coffee oils on the gasket have been cleaned off making it more grippy.


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## LeeWardle (Nov 16, 2008)

Hi and welcome!

With regard to espresso timing. The humidity and temperature of the air directly effects the extraction of flavours. Coffee is hydroscopic and as a result it is susceptible to even the environmental changes. Even a small increase humidity will cause the grinds to expand as water molecules from the air are absorbed. Heat or dry conditions cause them to shrink as the air sucks water content from them. If there is moisture in the air the bean will change mass. Making the grind courser/finer or tamping softer/harder will allow you to control the extraction of the espresso. Only adjust the grind when a change of 3 seconds or over is required. So, if you are dosing, distributing and tamping the same everytime and still getting inconsistant results then you may need to adjust the grinder a touch finer or courser.

Lee


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## BanishInstant (Oct 12, 2009)

While I am thinking about it, don't put a whole bag of beans into the grinder hopper unless you intend to use them immediately. Only keep sufficient for a couple of shots.


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## ajc-79 (Apr 18, 2010)

OK, will do. What's the preference for storing beans? Is a zip-lock bag OK? Is it worth investing in one of the vacuum tupperware things?


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## BanishInstant (Oct 12, 2009)

The bags from Has Bean have been good, as Sandy says, since you can squeeze most of the air out before fastening.

I have thought about the vacuum boxes but I've not felt sufficient motivation to get the purchase order passed at home


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## hashluck (Jan 11, 2011)

However well I think I have stored my beans (using bag with one way valve and squeezing air out and putting bag in an airtight container in a cool dry (but not too dry) place) it is clear that one never again seems to get that wonderful pungent aroma as when first opening a new bag. Now I have a decent grinder (see 'Eureka Mignon First Impressions') I noticed when my current batch of beans were really fresh that my grinder did react differently to them. I got a lot more grinds flying around (and clinging to the machine) and much more aroma first time out. When ground the coffee would leave a slight residue on the fingers when touched. Now it is an altogether 'drier' experience.

After all that waffle, my question is should one as a rule adjust the grind finer or coarser as beans get older? Under what circumstances would one go finer or coarser?

Extraction times would come into play here except my machine does not seem to vary much. The taste and crema does vary a lot though.


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## MonkeyHarris (Dec 3, 2010)

hashluck said:


> However well I think I have stored my beans (using bag with one way valve and squeezing air out and putting bag in an airtight container in a cool dry (but not too dry) place) it is clear that one never again seems to get that wonderful pungent aroma as when first opening a new bag. Now I have a decent grinder (see 'Eureka Mignon First Impressions') I noticed when my current batch of beans were really fresh that my grinder did react differently to them. I got a lot more grinds flying around (and clinging to the machine) and much more aroma first time out. When ground the coffee would leave a slight residue on the fingers when touched. Now it is an altogether 'drier' experience.
> 
> After all that waffle, my question is should one as a rule adjust the grind finer or coarser as beans get older? Under what circumstances would one go finer or coarser?
> 
> Extraction times would come into play here except my machine does not seem to vary much. The taste and crema does vary a lot though.


So many factors can affect the grind, humidity, ambient temp, age of beans, full moon







I generally find I will only grind finer (by just a smidge) as beans get older I can't remember going coarser after they're dialed in the first time. I did watch an amazing video once where a Barista was showing you how to dial in properly and he changed to a coarser grind and upped dose to cure channeling or something (I really can't remember) but there's certainly more to it. Does anyone know the video/s I'm talking about? I think Glenn may have posted them up. There was quite a few by the same guy covering all aspects of espresso making and other related beverages.

Edit: found it here


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