# Next (big?) step up from Mahlkonig Vario?



## Mike_Bike

I've had my Mahlkonig vario for about 18months now and I'm looking to upgrade to something that has an adjustment mechanism that is a little more precise and stable.

My only real requirements are that it has to be doserless and not look out of place in a domestic kitchen ... and of course that it is actually better than the Vario (my only real complaint is it's vague adjustment mechanism)

Along those lines I'd put together a list of likely candidates ... But I'm not sure what else there is available that would be an upgrade over the Vario so hence the post.


Mahlkonig Pro M Espresso - Nice size and uses the same burrs as a K30 so can't be too bad? But is it a good step up from the Vario?

HG-One - Should be a big step up in precision over the Vario as it so simple ... availability might be problem, production is delayed & there will be a mad rush when back in stock? Would I be annoyed by the stability when cranking + I'm not 100% sold on the look of it.

Compak K8 Fresh - Like the styling and the electronic interface but it is a big unit!

Compak K10 Fresh - Same as above + a price premium for the conical burrs


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## aphelion

I'd certainly put Mazzer Major-e in that category, and the Anfim Super Caimano (maybe OE pharos too)

As with all these grinders, there will be some tradeoff in practicality etc.

Vario is a very practical home grinder..

But if its quality of grind, then any of these are "probably" better


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## 4085

Go to the Grind Off event in June where all the possible contenders will be there. that said, you can only deal with one constraint at a time, so what is it!


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## Mike_Bike

Pharos didn't make the grade as I don't think it is all that practical, it looks awkward to use and a bit Heath Robinson in it's construction.

The Anfim Super Caimano also falls down on the very vain point that I don't like how it looks (if it's going to be a big brute on the side it has to at least look nice)

I'm not sure I'm keen enough to attend the grind off ... or even wait for it's outcome







At the moment I'm entertaining myself by weighing up my options, looking at reviews on the net and pondering what option best suits my needs with the least compromise.

The one key point that I want from a new grinder though is precision and repeatability ... if I adjust something I want it to do the same thing predictably each time. I don't get that feeling with the Vario, especially since I upgraded to a much more stable coffee machine and started to eliminate as many variables as I possibly can.


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## aphelion

Yep fair enough on the practicality (though a Pharos is £200)..

If it was a money no object kind of thing, i'd probably take a K10 Fresh or a Robur-E

They will give you precise, amazing tasting shots and are very repeatable (and are both huge/shiny/expensive







)


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## 4085

Would this interest you?


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## funinacup

dfk41 said:


> Go to the Grind Off event in June where *all the possible contenders will be there*. that said, you can only deal with one constraint at a time, so what is it!


Mahlkonig Pro-M? K10 Fresh? Those are his possible contenders.


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## 4085

The k10 will be there, the Mahlkonig definitely not, as you have obviously forgotten that the stipulation is that the cost of the unit has to be under £250


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## coffeechap

funinacup said:


> Mahlkonig Pro-M? K10 Fresh? Those are his possible contenders.


There is a k10 but not fresh, and a mazzer royal, mazzer major, alas all are doser versions. However the Brasilia rr550d will be there which is a great doserless grinder. Amazing what you can get for less than £250 isn't it funinacup?


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## coffeechap

And I money were no object, I am sorry but the elektra niño has my vote hands down both on looks and performance, it is the only grinder I would replace my eureka for, which coincidently is also an awesome on demand grinder


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## glevum

coffeechap said:


> And I money were no object, I am sorry but the elektra niño has my vote hands down both on looks and performance, it is the only grinder I would replace my eureka for, which coincidently is also an awesome on demand grinder


Im sure ive seen a member on here with a nino and KVdw speedster combo.....absolute stunning pair


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## aphelion

glevum said:


> Im sure ive seen a member on here with a nino and KVdw speedster combo.....absolute stunning pair


mmmm shiny


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## bubbajvegas

Yeah the niño is gorgeous,I want..

KvdW Speedster and Elektra Nino

http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showpost.php?p=53536


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## Mike_Bike

Not really interested in any grinder with a doser + I'm not even sure I want to upgrade from the vario unless I can convince myself that there is something out there that exactly matches what I want ... although I am very tempted by a Compak K8/K10 as they are ticking a lot of boxes.

What do people think about the real world differences between a K8 Fresh and a K10 Fresh (apart from £650). They share a hell of lot of parts apart from those directly associated with the burrs and driving those at an optimal speed. (See here, they share the same spares sheet http://www.compak.es/docs/osp/osp_K8_K10_Fresh.pdf ) I guess it will be down to the pros and cons of flat vs conical ... any pointers on that aspect?


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## glevum

Thanks Bubba....jeez, the size of that grinder makes the Speedster look small


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## funinacup

dfk41 said:


> The k10 will be there, the Mahlkonig definitely not, *as you have obviously forgotten that the stipulation is that the cost of the unit has to be under £250*


That was my point - some of the grinders the OP is considering aren't going to be at the grind off because their value is too high.

Coffeechap, absolutely you can get some cracking grinders for under £250, but you can also pay more and get some better ones


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## bubbajvegas

Yeah it's a monster but its just so shiney


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## 4085

funinacup said:


> That was my point - some of the grinders the OP is considering aren't going to be at the grind off because their value is too high.
> 
> Coffeechap, absolutely you can get some cracking grinders for under £250, but you can also pay more and get some better ones


Yes, that is Grind Off 2


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## coffeechap

funinacup said:


> That was my point - some of the grinders the OP is considering aren't going to be at the grind off because their value is too high.
> 
> Coffeechap, absolutely you can get some cracking grinders for under £250, but you can also pay more and get some better ones


Michael you must be best placed right now to give hime some advice on the mazzer major od


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## funinacup

Mazzer Major-E is quick (8.5secs for 20g while seasoning the burrs, 6ish post-seasoning), tidy and consistent! Distribution into the basket is great with only a gentle tap on the side of the portafilter required to settle the grinds from a heap to nice and level. Taste profile is clean and defined (paired with a 20g VST at the moment).

If you're in Glasgow or near then you're welcome to come give it a shot! As is anyone else local.


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## Mike_Bike

Not very local as I'm in Notts ... so quite a way off









It's a shame as I am considering some training, I figure I could do with some upgrading too as I am sure I am the biggest variable in the whole process!

The whole mention of the OE grinders has got me off on a mission looking at the OE Lido for my areopress/cafetiere at work. Thankfully it's out of stock otherwise it might have been an expensive tangent


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## aphelion

Just bought a Lido/Pharos pair from OE

As you say, Lido looks perfect for an aeropress combo (exactly my reason for getting one).

Took a punt on the Pharos, as they've ironed out most of the problems now..

Will be interesting to try for the money anyway.

If it grinds as well as they say, then its a complete bargain really (I'll take that over practicality for £200 quid)


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## CoffeeChris

Will follow this thread with interest as I'm in the same position.

Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


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## Southpaw

Casadio Enea?

K8/10 fresh is the only thing that is tempting me at the moment from my anfim lusso. Too many doser less grinders look like they whack a chute in place of the doser. I'd like to see a design like the versalab for sensible money.


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## Southpaw

Another one to consider Ceado E37S Espresso Grinder.


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## ziobeege_72

Southpaw said:


> Casadio Enea?
> 
> K8/10 fresh is the only thing that is tempting me at the moment from my anfim lusso. Too many doser less grinders look like they whack a chute in place of the doser. I'd like to see a design like the versalab for sensible money.


I have a K10 Fresh. If you are near Oxford feel free to try it out. Significant leap in performance over the M4 I also possess. You will be grinding finer than the flats. Dosing accuracy on the Fresh is consistently within 0.5g and mainly within 0.2g. Remarkably easy to dial in as well. The one issue for home dose is retention (around 10 grams I'd say) so if you change your coffees often then I couldnt recommend it. If however if you are pretty consistent with your coffees then it works well - the first shot of the day has definitely lost its sheen and you will need to purge. Or just give that shot to your wife in her cappa. She wont know the difference.

I had a Pharos too. Grind quality was excellent, on a par with the Fresh. Infact it is the same burr size. However the hassle of ground coffee access and distribution is not insignificant. As my patience has generally moved inversely to my age the Pharos just got to me in the end, despite being a joy to actually grind with (only takes circa 20-25 turns to chomp through about 15g). At least I know it has gone to a good owner.


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## RisingPower

Mike_Bike said:


> Not really interested in any grinder with a doser + I'm not even sure I want to upgrade from the vario unless I can convince myself that there is something out there that exactly matches what I want ... although I am very tempted by a Compak K8/K10 as they are ticking a lot of boxes.
> 
> What do people think about the real world differences between a K8 Fresh and a K10 Fresh (apart from £650). They share a hell of lot of parts apart from those directly associated with the burrs and driving those at an optimal speed. (See here, they share the same spares sheet http://www.compak.es/docs/osp/osp_K8_K10_Fresh.pdf ) I guess it will be down to the pros and cons of flat vs conical ... any pointers on that aspect?


One has big conical burrs, the other, flat burrs. The k10 is hugely consistent and quiet.

I'm sure you can look at home barista to see the difference between flat burrs and conical, one thing being the hugely long path the beans take in the k10's burrs.

Nino sure looks purty though.

Burrs aren't cheap to break in mind with the k10.


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## painty

I guess the Kony-E will be similar in spec to the Nino, and a wee bit cheaper, but nowhere near as purdy...

Definitely conical FTW.


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## coffeechap

ziobeege_72 said:


> I have a K10 Fresh. If you are near Oxford feel free to try it out. Significant leap in performance over the M4 I also possess. You will be grinding finer than the flats. Dosing accuracy on the Fresh is consistently within 0.5g and mainly within 0.2g. Remarkably easy to dial in as well. The one issue for home dose is retention (around 10 grams I'd say) so if you change your coffees often then I couldnt recommend it. If however if you are pretty consistent with your coffees then it works well - the first shot of the day has definitely lost its sheen and you will need to purge. Or just give that shot to your wife in her cappa. She wont know the difference.
> 
> I had a Pharos too. Grind quality was excellent, on a par with the Fresh. Infact it is the same burr size. However the hassle of ground coffee access and distribution is not insignificant. As my patience has generally moved inversely to my age the Pharos just got to me in the end, despite being a joy to actually grind with (only takes circa 20-25 turns to chomp through about 15g). At least I know it has gone to a good owner.


And your k10 fresh looks really nice on the counter too.


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## ziobeege_72

RisingPower said:


> One has big conical burrs, the other, flat burrs. The k10 is hugely consistent and quiet.
> 
> I'm sure you can look at home barista to see the difference between flat burrs and conical, one thing being the hugely long path the beans take in the k10's burrs.
> 
> Nino sure looks purty though.
> 
> Burrs aren't cheap to break in mind with the k10.


The general view is that flats bring out more of the chocolate/sweet tones whilst the conicals have a strength in acidity, tending to shine more on lightly roasted fruity so's. This difference was significant versus my M4, but I think it may be more subtle on a giant flat like the K8 given the slower rotation. However with a conical you will be grinding quite a bit finer than a flat for the same dose and flow rate as less fines are produced. This exposes the coffee more which means you get a bit more everything in it - acids, bitters, sweets. Also a conical is far easier to dial in coffees than a flat. You tend to be in far closer ball park much sooner with a conical. Once you are set with a coffee on a particular grind/dose, then you are done. A counterpoint is that the K8 Fresh would have - I suspect - less retention than the K10 Fresh


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## ziobeege_72

coffeechap said:


> And your k10 fresh looks really nice on the counter too.


Glad you approved. Just need now to a pair it with an appropriate machine


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## coffeechap

Go and see reiss


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## ziobeege_72

believe me it is on the personal agenda..


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## jimrobo

+1 for the pro M! Looks great, small footprint, really great grinds. Only drawback is the adjustment mechanism.


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## forzajuve

The one thing that makes me nervous about these Mahlkonnig is that they are belt driven motors, experience in other uses of belt driven equipment (turntables for example) makes me question the reliability and stability of the grinding potential. Note I have never used one, I am only going previous experience as stated.


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## garydyke1

coffeechap said:


> There is a k10 but not fresh, and a mazzer royal, mazzer major, alas all are doser versions. However the *Brasilia rr550d *will be there which is a great doserless grinder. Amazing what you can get for less than £250 isn't it funinacup?


I recon you could wait 12 months and you wouldnt see another one appear for that price : (


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## coffeechap

garydyke1 said:


> I recon you could wait 12 months and you wouldnt see another one appear for that price : (


Gary i have picked up three of these for less than £250, if you want i will keep my eyes peeled...


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## shrink

forzajuve said:


> The one thing that makes me nervous about these Mahlkonnig is that they are belt driven motors, experience in other uses of belt driven equipment (turntables for example) makes me question the reliability and stability of the grinding potential. Note I have never used one, I am only going previous experience as stated.


you could also argue that the majority of car engines use belt driven timing systems which are capable of spinning round at 7000rpm for around 30,000 miles.

I dont think the belt in a grinder will be a huge issue. Just replace it every 30,000 shots


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## CoffeeChris

How much are the Brasilia rr550d new?

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## garydyke1

coffeechap said:


> Gary i have picked up three of these for less than £250, if you want i will keep my eyes peeled...


Yes please, this is for Tutbury tearoom, not myself


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## coffeechap

inaboxmedia said:


> How much are the Brasilia rr550d new?
> 
> Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


They were £750 new


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## coffeechap

garydyke1 said:


> Yes please, this is for Tutbury tearoom, not myself


No probs I have one anyway that will be at the grind off, so might let you have hat one, otherwise I will try to source you one


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## CoffeeChris

I may put my name down for one. How good are they?

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## glevum

coffeechap said:


> They were £750 new


That is without the VAT....ive been looking since seeing Bubbas grind video (£898 after paying Osbourne)


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## coffeechap

inaboxmedia said:


> I may put my name down for one. How good are they?
> 
> Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


I really rate them, lovely fluffy grind and great fast performance, plus programable on demand. Wait until the grind off and you will see just how good these are.


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## CoffeeChris

Why do they go so cheap, used? Will take a look at there website. Are they easy to calibrate?

Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


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## bubbajvegas

glevum said:


> That is without the VAT....ive been looking since seeing Bubbas grind video (£898 after paying Osbourne)


Bonus...even bigger bargain I got 

http://www.caterkwik.co.uk/cgi-bin/trolleyed_cart.cgi?action=update_postage&country_id=229&postage_band=Standard


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## coffeechap

Yes you did, will take a special grinder to out do the rr55


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## coffeechap

inaboxmedia said:


> Why do they go so cheap, used? Will take a look at there website. Are they easy to calibrate?
> 
> Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


I suppose cheap is relative, a completely refurbished and serviced one will set you back around £350 which I still think is a complete bargain for this grinder, as I have said so man times before the popular consensus is mazzer are always the way to go, but there will be grinders at the grind off that will amaze at there used price point.


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## CoffeeChris

Anyone used the Casadio-Enea-On-Demand-Grinder. Noticed York Coffee are offering Included in the Price

- Delivery

- Installation

- Set up and staff training

- 12 Months Parts and Labour Warranty

looks a nice machine but not much info


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## coffeechap

Casadio are a subsidiary of la cimbali so have a good pedigree, however a word of warning, I currently have the casadio theo on my bench, athough a lovely design and probably the best throat for using without a hopper, ( holding around 100 grams on it own) the build quality feels a little on the cheap side, the one I have managed to get the switch smashed in transit, which I have never seen on another grinder, so go and have a look before you buy, as on paper it looks like a grat od grinder ( build quality nowhere near as good as the Brasilia.


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## CoffeeChris

Thanks for advice. I need a decent grinder after my troubles with vario. Do you sell various grinders?

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## coffeechap

I quite like the look of his and santos have a really good pedigree

http://www.catering-appliance.com/santos-55ra-cf601-coffee-grinder?gclid=CKSr4uqJircCFWfItAodfSUA2A


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## garydyke1

Used one of these at Extract coffee roasters (not sure which one)

http://www.sanremouk.com/grinders/on-demand-grinders/


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## coffeechap

What did you think, rave have one too


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## coffeechap

San remo grinders are made by fiorenzato, which was a breakaway from mazzer many moons ago.


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## garydyke1

I dont think it was the very top of the range but it was impressive.

Never seen a single model with so many burr choices


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## garydyke1

Southpaw said:


> Another one to consider Ceado E37S Espresso Grinder.


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## coffeechap

garydyke1 said:


>


Not sure on these just look like a poor attempt at copying mazzer, but not tried one so can't really comment


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## lookseehear

The short one looks more like a K30 Vario to me!


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## coffeechap

The e37 looks quite nice, would be great to get hold of one to try it, I think based upon the the size of the motor and spin speed, and the sizebofnthe burrs it sits right in sj territory.


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## Mike_Bike

The Caedo E37 looks interesting but I'm not that convinced by the adjustment mechanism. The Compaks mechanisms seems like a much nicer solution, and from the prices I've seen in europe the Caedo isn't exactly cheap, in fact I think it costs more than a compak K8 fresh.

My latest thoughts are still with the Compaks ... the price and the size puts me off (especially the K10 ... it's almost totally out of the question due to the price hike over the K8). But I have been looking harder at the Mahlkonig K30 as it is after all in the same price range as the compaks but more compact









I am intrigued by the Sanremo on demand range but they don't seem to have any prices listed anywhere ... I guess they are selling to retail only and not consumers?

I did have a bit of a measure up of the work surface around my coffee machine and all the machines would just about fit ... the "best" physical fit would be the Pro-M Espresso or the HG-One. I think if I looked at my prime requirement (precision/repeatability) and factored in the price and the size ... the HG-One would be the ideal.

As a spin off of this hunt I'm also patiently waiting for the OE Lido to come back in stock after justifying it to myself as being necessary for work use







(currently using a colleagues hario and having to switch between press and aeropress settings).


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## Southpaw

coffeechap said:


> The e37 looks quite nice, would be great to get hold of one to try it, I think based upon the the size of the motor and spin speed, and the sizebofnthe burrs it sits right in sj territory.


It does look good, is like to see one to see how it can be 3 times the price of a sj?


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## Southpaw

coffeechap said:


> The e37 looks quite nice, would be great to get hold of one to try it, I think based upon the the size of the motor and spin speed, and the sizebofnthe burrs it sits right in sj territory.


It does look good, is like to see one to see how it can be 3 times the price of a sj?


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## coffeechap

The compaks all share the same basic body, so the k6.k8,k10 are all the same size, the mechanism is nice on them and they do grind really well, will be interesting to see how the compak 10 fares against the mazzer royal and the la cimbali magnum at the grindoff! all beit they are doser versions

did not realise the caedo was so expensive certainly not worth that much money!! san remo are available and i have a contact that can get them if anyone is interested.


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## CoffeeChris

What are the price ranges on the San remo. Used one at extract

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## coffeechap

will check and get back tomorrow


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## CoffeeChris

Gary has got me some prices. Thanks though

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## garydyke1

http://www.yume-uk.com/coffee/coffee-grinders-water-filter/

any good?


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## shrink

Those are great, the dosers on them are fantastic.

Although the one I used had 64mm conical burrs

They are quite compact too. Also the evo model is so named because it has a fan to cool the motor down under heavy use. For normal home use this would be overkill and the non evo model is functinaly identical and likely cheaper


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## shrink

How about this: http://www.coffeedirect.co.uk/m80e-quamar-grinder-vatdelivery-included-p-93.html


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## coffeechap

these look quite tasty but not sure oon the quality, wish some more people here had this gear to give some more info on it.


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## shrink

The quamar m80e looks very tasty and is tempting me. Super jolly size burrs and motor, in a machine the size of a mini, with mini-e functionality and small hopper. All for about £475. It's a rebadged fioranzeto, so reliability shouldn't be an issue.

Right now, this model has just gone to top of my interest list.


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## shrink

.. If I can find a uk supplier for a polished black one with small hopper!


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## CoffeeChris

shrink said:


> .. If I can find a uk supplier for a polished black one with small hopper!


http://casabarista.com/espresso-equipment/coffee-grinders/quamar-m80e/

I'm liking the look of this machine. Not much info on it. Little thread on home Barista

Ignore...On my phone thought this was a uk shop...

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## shrink

yeah, plenty info in australia and US (as always) but not so much over here. Still, the pricing is keen, and its basically a Fiorenzeto T80, so parts should be in abundance.

I've fired off an email to a local supplier to see if he can do any other colour combinations!


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## aphelion

I know you're not so keen on the Super Caimano, but was playing with one in Kaffeine at the weekend (and their Robur-e).

In my opinion (and all the baristas there) it is a far superior grinder to a Robur.

The accuracy and distribution of that thing is insane!

Apparently the Robur is an absolute pain in the ar$e (blocking up, overheating the grounds, burr wear).

Looks aside (I quite like them) I'd be saving up my pennies for an SC personally

Just a thought


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## CoffeeChris

Have emailed Casa Barista store who stock the Quamar m80e. I was told the Quamar; in our opinion the best price - quality grinder in the market today.

I had read on home barista about clumping on the Quamar M80. I asked Casa Barista about this and if they would recommend a grinder. I was told that they found

the Macap M4D best in terms of the least clumping grinder.

Looking at the MD4 it looks a nice bit of kit. Small footprint also. Anyone used MD4?


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## shrink

the clumping on the M80e seems not to affect shot quality though, they are very loose clumps. By the time you've done a tiny sweep with your finger to level the basket and then tamp, I doubt the clumps would present any issue at all.

The reviews I came across of the normal M80 and a few of the M80E, suggest that the taste profile is superb, and one review stated they prefered the shots from the quamar over a super jolly.

I'd put up with a few clumps to get a doserless super jolly killer for £475 ish


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## coffeechap

Ok you are looking at low end grinders, if they are saying the md4 is a "great" grinder then they are just trying to sell you something. The md4 is a mediocre commercial spec grinder, and it would appear that the Quamar is probably at the same level, I can take an m4 to the grind off for you to have a look at will be the worst of the commercials in the lineup.


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## 4085

I would like to meet a person, other than coffeechap and I, who have had a good play with a Mythos. Be interesting when grind off 2 happens, where there will be several high end grinders coming.....lets call it Grind Off 2, clash of the Titans!


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## CoffeeChris

Im not sure they were trying to sell. It was just a email conversation. They are over in Europe somewhere. SCEA certified. Own coffee shops. I don't think it would be in his interest to sell me rubbish. Not when they sell a range of grinders.

I got told in there opinion the M80 is best price - quality grinder in the market today.

The problem is Im not in a commercial setting. Im at home. If I can pull Decent Shots to say and decent independent than I'm happy.

I have a height restriction of 23 inches (ish) I would love a Anfim Super Caimano dose-less Coffee Grinder. But the hopper is massive and I really dont want to start modding/putting a camera hood thing on the top of a grinder.

Im sure a guy a bella barista once told me that there are disadvantages of having commercial machines at home. Can't remember what is was some. Something about the lack of output if you are just pulling a few shots a day.

Its an interesting conversation. Im not sure whats best to do.!

Coffeechap...If you can get a M4 for the grind off or get me a good price let me know?



coffeechap said:


> Ok you are looking at low end grinders, if they are saying the md4 is a "great" grinder then they are just trying to sell you something. The md4 is a mediocre commercial spec grinder, and it would appear that the Quamar is probably at the same level, I can take an m4 to the grind off for you to have a look at will be the worst of the commercials in the lineup.


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## shrink

the M80E with 500gr hopper is pretty small though, smaller than a super jolly, and no taller than a mazzer mini with small hopper. Its quite a little grinder.

http://up.picr.de/9973142kwb.jpg


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## CoffeeChris

I know. Thats why its ticking boxes. (looks wise) But if its only an average grinder and no better than my vario. Then I will need to look again.



shrink said:


> the M80E with 500gr hopper is pretty small though, smaller than a super jolly, and no taller than a mazzer mini with small hopper. Its quite a little grinder.
> 
> http://up.picr.de/9973142kwb.jpg


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## shrink

it'll be better than a vario. Bigger burrs, much more solid adjustment mechanism (mazzer style), will be consistent, faster, more durable. etc etc.

To put it into perspective... ive been playing today (before it gets boxed up and sent away) with my NS MDX grinder. Also 63-64mm flat burrs, same kinda speed same kinda motor power. IMHO the shots are in a different league from the Vario. It's not a close fought thing!

The M80E is top of my list, and hopefully I can strike up a deal to get a hold of one.


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## coffeechap

I agree, I cannot comment on the m80 as I have never had one, but in terms of stepping up from the vario, I think it will be like night and day. So if it ticks the boxes then give it some consideration, would be great to have some different grinders on the forum.


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## shrink

well ones probably coming this way coffeechap. i expect performance to be similar to a super jolly-E


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## coffeechap

Good for you I look forward to seeing your comments, shame the beast didn,t work out for you but at least you now know what it is you want.


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## 4085

Shrink, how do you really know you are buying a VW and not a Hyundai? Do not get me wrong. I have bought enough non main frame things on my life, but it maybe the reason they are not well known, is...........


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## shrink

because its just a rebadged fiorenzato. They have been going around for years. The T80 that its based on has been around for ages. These arent non proven designs. The only bit thats new is the electronic doser. It seems well enough known in europe (tons of danish coffee sites using them).

Lets be honest, the vario is a bit of a Hyundai when it comes to build and design. Lots of plastic and convenience. For not much more money, you can get something with a much bigger motor, bigger burrs, more solid build and less chance of adjustment problems.


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## CoffeeChris

Where are you getting yours from? So why doesn't the Macap M4D tick any boxes?


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## shrink

plenty rumours that the M4D still clumps badly, its ugly, has smaller burrs, a smaller motor and costs more!

250w motor, 58mm burrs vs 300w and 63mm.


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## CoffeeChris

Thats that sorted then! Like it has been said on here the Clumping issues are not really a problem. Are you buying from this country? As looking to get something next month


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## shrink

im hoping to buy from coffeedirect. They are based not far from where i live. But I'm waiting to find out about availability of different finishes and a smaller hopper.


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## CoffeeChris

I can't see anything on the website? Would I need to call and put in an order?



shrink said:


> im hoping to buy from coffeedirect. They are based not far from where i live. But I'm waiting to find out about availability of different finishes and a smaller hopper.


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## shrink

I'm waiting on a call back and will let you know. The woman I spoke to was enormously friendly, just not the person with the knowledge. I suspect it's a husband wife partnership.


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## jimrobo

oooh super caimino doserless looks shiny........must stop looking at these threads........


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## CoffeeChris

shrink said:


> I'm waiting on a call back and will let you know. The woman I spoke to was enormously friendly, just not the person with the knowledge. I suspect it's a husband wife partnership.


Cheers that would be great. Do you know if they are easy machines to look after, calibrate etc

Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


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## shrink

The adjustment is basically the same as a mazzer... A threaded collar that rotates anti clockwise to go finer. It is technically stepped, but the steps are so close together that its pretty irrelevant. To adjust it, you pull out a little black retainer, adjust it, and then put the black clip back. Simple as that.

The burrs will remove by screwing clockwise for cleaning, meaning you can clear out the burr chamber now and then.

These things will be pretty low maintenance and adjustment should only be one or two notches at a time between beans so it'll be easy to keep it in calibration.


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## Southpaw

For the man that said the anfim hopper was too big.

http://www.kaffee-netz.de/zubeh-r/42750-v-anfim-lusso-timer.html


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## garydyke1

Southpaw said:


> For the man that said the anfim hopper was too big.
> 
> http://www.kaffee-netz.de/zubeh-r/42750-v-anfim-lusso-timer.html


Loving it !


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## coffeechap

Or even smaller!!

!
View attachment 2517


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## Southpaw

Cool. That's how mine will look when the post from Hong Kong arrives.


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## CoffeeChris

What hopper is used

Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


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## coffeechap

In gary's post it is the stock mazzer mini hopper, in mine it is the now world famous £1 cc micro hopper


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## CoffeeChris

Brasilia rr550d what would the mazzer equivalent be?


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## coffeechap

Super jolly in burr size but major in consistency


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## CoffeeChris

Will a small hopper fit on it?

Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


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## coffeechap

Like the micro hopper?


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## CoffeeChris

coffeechap said:


> Like the micro hopper?


Yeah. Are they pretty much standard fit

Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


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## coffeechap

No they are not standard fit, but I have ordered one that should fit, just waiting to check it out


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## Mike_Bike

After lots of thinking and few e-mails around various suppliers I have reached my own personal decision ... a Mahlkonig K30 Vario. It's slightly smaller footprint and the design of the grind adjustment sold it to me over the other options.

Of the final 4 real contenders the last 3 fell away for the reasons below:


Pro-M Espresso - Very nearly there but I don't like shape of the hopper and the electronic grind adjustment didn't fill me with confidence; mechanical, robust and analogue is what I wanted.

HG-One - lack of availability and shipping from the States, I might buy one at a later date purely out of interest.

Compak K8 Fresh - Size.


I bought the K30 from Coffee Omega (think they advertise on here) and its arrival is eagerly awaited to see if it meets my needs in reality. I did originally want one in the polished finish but the additional premium would have pushed it well into K10 Fresh territory ... a lot of money for vanity + I would have had to wait









Think I will hang on to the Vario home for now, but I might sell it if I get on well with the K30. Any suggestions as to a selling price for a 2nd hand Vario Home in excellent condition? I have a couple of friends interested already


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## CoffeeChris

Nice one mike. What espresso machine have you got

Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk 2


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## coffeechap

They look great and grind will be very nice good purchase


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## Mike_Bike

A Rocket R58, I upgraded from a Silvia a while ago and I am enjoying the simplicity of such a stable machine and not having to wait for steam etc. It has it's niggles too ... but they are minor (which is annoying I suppose, as it would be simple to sort them out). Overkill for home use, but it is the pleasure of using a nicely made bit of kit that is part of interest in coffee for me.

I also have the OE Lido to look forward to trying out at work, that package is currently weaving it's way around America vaguely towards the UK in the hands of USPS as I type ... ETA is ???? From what I read it will be around 2-3 weeks by the time customs have processed it.


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## jeebsy

Depends if it's shipped ground or air. Ground takes weeks, air five days or less. Customs hardly adds any time.


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## 4085

I had a k30 a few years ago. They are tried and tested as far as I am concerned and I am sure you will love her. Red or black? There was one on eBay a couple of weeks ago. The box was unopened and I nearly bought it at £975 but decided against it at the last minute. Hope you enjoy it!


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## Mike_Bike

I went for black, I really did love the look of the polished ones though







but the premium over the standard colours is quite


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## Shakey

Shrink,

I think we got our Cherubs at the same time - I would also be interested in the M80E so let me know how you get on. I wondered if Peter at EU could supply?


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## jimrobo

Mike_Bike said:


> Pro-M Espresso - Very nearly there but I don't like shape of the hopper and the electronic grind adjustment didn't fill me with confidence; mechanical, robust and analogue is what I wanted.


I don't know where you got this from but the adjustment mechanism ISN'T electronic. It is mechanical....its a dial on the side you turn.


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## shrink

Shakey said:


> Shrink,
> 
> I think we got our Cherubs at the same time - I would also be interested in the M80E so let me know how you get on. I wondered if Peter at EU could supply?


see my thread in the main forum.. peter pay be able to get them, but would be useful if we could get a few people interested. If you would like to get one, let me know and i can add you to the potential numbers to see what our price would be.


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## Mike_Bike

jimrobo said:


> I don't know where you got this from but the adjustment mechanism ISN'T electronic. It is mechanical....its a dial on the side you turn.


I got the wrong end of the stick by looking at these photos. The electronics I thought were part of the adjustment are just obscuring the view of the actual mechanism.

http://www.home-barista.com/grinders/mahlkonig-k30-es-vario-v-prom-v-baratza-vario-home-t12525-40.html I don't think it would have swayed my choice.


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## jimrobo

if cost isn't an issue I'd have gone for the k30 over the pro m espresso anyway. I got mine at a bit of a bargain price!

The electronic front section/touchscreen bit is basically timer and counter.


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## Shakey

shrink said:


> see my thread in the main forum.. peter pay be able to get them, but would be useful if we could get a few people interested. If you would like to get one, let me know and i can add you to the potential numbers to see what our price would be.


The only problem I've heard of with the Quamar m80e is that spares are difficult to get hold of.


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## Mike_Bike

Very pleased so far, I've only run about a kilo of old coffee through it. It is however dialed down close to zero on the scale so I might re-zero once I run through these old beans. The experiences I've read about on forums suggest that they tend to vary in calibration from the factory.

It fits very nicely on the side too, will look even neater when I get a short glass hopper (couldn't resist when looking at the Jorg custom woodworks site)


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## Mike_Bike

The big hopper lid does make for handy extra storage though!


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## shrink

very nice indeed, you have a fantastic little coffee area!


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## painty

Very nice set-up Mike, can imagine the smaller glass hopper will look even better.


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