# Host Milano 2019



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Finally got home late last night just after midnight. Really got a flavour for what it's like to visit and to exhibit at Host. It runs every two years and makes anything we have in the UK look tiny in comparison. The Coffee and Beverage area alone is huge and all the time I was there, I didn't get the chance to see the entire exhibition. I flew out last Tuesday evening and spent 7 days in Milan, all of it apart from evenings at Host.

*Tuesday evening* - Picked up by truck from Milan Airport and whisked to no not my hotel...but to an exhibition stand still being painted/constructed, as were all the others, with carpenters, electricians etc.. preparing all the booths. We unloaded all the stuff and went away.

*Wednesday and Thursday working from 7:00 until 7 and 8 pm* - Started setting up the stand with all the kit and getting everything looking (and working) correctly. It's a lot more work than it looks, especially as there was no plan as such. It was more of a concept held in a couple of Italian brains, that was quite fluid. Late on Thursday it was all ready. A walk around just 2 of the 8 pavilions confirmed how huge the whole thing was and it appeared to have mushroomed almost overnight from a bare hall to a fully fledged exhibition. The only thing missing was carpet, just a grey concrete floor. Met a few people who wandered over to say hello. Although I have communicated with them via e-mail I had never seen them. Michael who owns ECM was a lot younger than I expected but spoke perfect English and worked alongside his team the entire exhibition.

I did wander around that evening, seeing the final touches before opening and more than a few people recognised me?? I'm suspecting through reflections in Video and photos, as I try not to publish my photo on the web.

*Friday Morning - *Everything ready and working the exhibition sprang into life (Carpets laid during the night). Doors open and along come resellers, buyers and retailers from all over the world. Probably the least represented nationality was the UK and everyone commented that although not many from the UK attend, this year it was even less. There were a few vloggers and bloggers, daughters, sons and heirs...but in reality this was a trade show for the trade. It's not cheap to set up a stand there, some companies had obviously spent a huge amount to be there. It got busier and busier...Israel, Greece, Ukraine, Spain, Germany Holland, USA, Australia, Ireland etc.. Luckily we had enough of the languages within our group and many people spoke good English. I was required to translate for the Dublin and Australian guys of course because English speakers in our team couldn't understand them....the Irish guys from Dublin who were wandering around the exhibition were probably having the most trouble  The Coffee and just about everything else started flowing and Ripples who were next to us started the music! Thankfully this was in short bursts, but ripples was like 12 young people on speed having lots of fun, I really feared some of them were going to drop dead.

..............................

I only popped up to get an adaptor from upstairs and let the Crem One 2B finish warming up after it's firmware update (I had been running some older firmware or a few weeks while Crem made some changes I asked for and thought I could start on my thoughts about Host 2019. *More to come if people are interested, plus photos and video.*


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

Keep it coming ?


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## filthynines (May 2, 2016)

MildredM said:


> Keep it coming ?


 +1


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## 9719 (Mar 29, 2015)

+ 1


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

*Intermission*

So a brief interlude from continuing my diary entries for the exhibition. There was so much to see it made my eyes hurt. Some madness from Faber, which had a range of normal pod machines, but also these steampunk style pod oddities. I almost wanted one....but only if I could make my own pods.  I think they actually worked as the motorcycle (or lawnmower) cylinder one had a set of rubber gaskets on the cylinder and a heater plus other bits as well...









Also nice to see Macap finally fighting back...unless it's too expensive for the home market.....70mm burrs if I remember rightly. This is the Digital Model and there is the non digital version which they expect the home user to buy because of the price. It has a micrometric adjuster which can be dropped down to allow fast knob rotation to move to brew and back. They are prototypes so price not yet disclosed. Size wise that leaflet if a few cm larger than a postcard, so it's not a huge grinder. The hopper was from a domestic model, the actual hopper was much larger as they have not yet manufactured the mini hopper for this grinder (wasn't time).









Will they send me one for review......who knows...probably not but I live in hope.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

I also met Kees Van der Western on the last day, he popped over to our stand and I was introduced. A nice guy and it was especially interesting to learn more about his personal journey in producing Espresso machines from small production to now a much larger volume. Very much mirroring the journey of my friend and all the problems and issues were the same. Nice machines, but so expensive it puts them out of reach of most.....He had even heard of me...surprising because his machine range is well beyond what I deal with.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

My friends (from the UK) were there on the Rancillio stand slinging coffee on the RS1 for all 5 days. Seen some pics and it looks great.


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## matomoto (Jun 15, 2018)

MildredM said:


> Keep it coming


+1

Enviado desde mi VOG-L29 mediante Tapatalk


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## jj-x-ray (Dec 31, 2017)

What was your stand selling Dave? (excuse my ignorance).
Love the steam punk lever....

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


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## -Mac (Aug 22, 2019)

If someone could come up with an espresso machine with horizontal twin (boxer) cooling fins, it would sell hundreds of thousands to the BMW motorbike crowd.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

jj-x-ray said:


> What was your stand selling Dave? (excuse my ignorance).
> Love the steam punk lever....
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


 It was an industry event, so everyone was displaying what they had there were no actual sales of anything or taking of orders. Buyers would roam around as well as sellers to the industry and the exhibitors were all manufacturers or corporate entities. There were a few smaller entities sharing larger stands e.g. Decent Espresso (John) was only 30 feet away on the Ripples stand.

I was invited along by my friends Paolo and Antonio in ACS, so I thought I would help out making lattes and helping where good English was required. it also helped brush up on my Italian which I kept mixing up with my Spanish. Paolo also wanted to give me the chance to talk technical with some of the many suppliers of machine internals and to see some of the latest stuff. There is nothing like talking to a tech designer at Gicar, or CDL, or any number of internal component manufacturers. Especially when I want to see the envelope pushed, they have a pretty good handle on what needs to be done to prevent something going bang!

Bella Barista visited (Rodney and Pam) and flew a few of their people out. They own a retail park in Northampton and a few business within the park. I had not seen Rodney & Pam for years so it was great to see them and I met a guy Mike who does all the brewed coffee stuff and SCAA training courses/certifications for retailers. There were some dinners and stuff. It was really just a chance for me to touch base with all the different companies I have dealt with. ECM, Lelit, Crem, Ceado and many others. So although ACS invited me out, I was also there for myself to learn and just meet some of the people I have dealt with for years. I have had a couple of invites to go out to some other companies in Italy and Germany and work with their technical people as new designs come forward...but I am getting older, so we will see how that goes.

I was invited out 2 years ago, but was so overweight I felt self conscious about going, but at my sprightly 14 stone and 6ft 2", I have no such hang ups any more, and if anything the exhibition was a test of my self control as there was lots of booze and free foods (pastries, snacks, cakes etc..) but I was very good and did not succumb. Just in 2 of the larger dinners I had 1/2 a glass of wine at each one.

I will talk a bit more about the ACS stand and anything new. Ia lso have videos (exhibition walk throughs) as well to go through and publish.


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## Bicky (Oct 24, 2019)

Long time lurker, first time poster, so hello! ?

I'm sure I read that the new Lelit MaraX was going to be there, was that right? Did you happen to come across it? Would love to know your thoughts on it.

https://marax.lelit.com/index-eng.html


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Bicky said:


> Long time lurker, first time poster, so hello! ?
> 
> I'm sure I read that the new Lelit MaraX was going to be there, was that right? Did you happen to come across it? Would love to know your thoughts on it.
> 
> https://marax.lelit.com/index-eng.html


 I have had the prototype of that machine on the bench for 4 or 5 months now. I fed back a fair bit to Lelit which set production back a few months to make the improvements, especially some of those in the core thermal management software as it wasn't up to the standard it needed to be. It was good but not right. I think they have cracked it now and it's really quiet for a vibe pump machine. They have done some innovative things around the vibe pump but I can't say more than that (because it wouldn't be fair to). Think of it as a very quiet vibe pump machine that is a better HX. You have a switch behind the drip tray that allows you to set hot, med and cool brew temps all with no flushing, if there is a flush it would be minimal. It uses some clever algorithms to allow for this and still give good steaming using multiple thermal probes one of which is in the HX. Again I cannot share what the algorithms do exactly as it's confidential.

I do believe it will be a very popular machine!

P.S. I couldn't really say anything beforehand as it was confidential until launch....as was the Crem One 2B machine I have on test.


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## Bicky (Oct 24, 2019)

DavecUK said:


> I have had the prototype of that machine on the bench for 4 or 5 months now. I fed back a fair bit to Lelit which set production back a few months to make the improvements, especially some of those in the core thermal management software as it wasn't up to the standard it needed to be. It was good but not right. I think they have cracked it now and it's really quiet for a vibe pump machine. They have done some innovative things around the vibe pump but I can't say more than that (because it wouldn't be fair to). Think of it as a very quiet vibe pump machine that is a better HX. You have a switch behind the drip tray that allows you to set hot, med and cool brew temps all with no flushing, if there is a flush it would be minimal. It uses some clever algorithms to allow for this and still give good steaming using multiple thermal probes one of which is in the HX. Again I cannot share what the algorithms do exactly as it's confidential.
> 
> I do believe it will be a very popular machine!
> 
> P.S. I couldn't really say anything beforehand as it was confidential until launch....as was the Crem One 2B machine I have on test.


 Wow, thanks for the info, that's great. I don't want to hijack this thread further to be specifically about the Mara, so I'll create a thread in the Lelit forum. Ta


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Bicky said:


> Wow, thanks for the info, that's great. I don't want to hijack this thread further to be specifically about the Mara, so I'll create a thread in the Lelit forum. Ta


 No problem...this is the one I have...it has all the writing on the front because it is a prototype which of course they don't want sold. I'm hoping I can get the revised firmware for it. The pump has been revised further to make it even quieter on the production model, even though I thought the prototype was very quiet. The steel for the case is also different on the production model.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

The Crem One 2B which Launched at host plus a few freebies (portafilter ring and little containers) I got.


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## mctrials23 (May 8, 2017)

You've got all the tech going on there Dave. Is that tamping stand a pressure sensitive one? What the deuce is going on there!? Is it using vibration and rotation to settle and distribute the coffee?


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)




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## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

Is that thing providing distribution via vibration? If so why use it again after the shot?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

mctrials23 said:


> You've got all the tech going on there Dave. Is that tamping stand a pressure sensitive one? What the deuce is going on there!? Is it using vibration and rotation to settle and distribute the coffee?


 No it's not a tamping stand it's a...well it's a, I dunno what it is, it doesn't have a name yet. I'm not sure what it's doing, I know it's doing something, I thought 2 things, but it appears to be doing 4 things....possibly. It's very heavy, much heavier than it looks and it got the airport security very excited in Milan. Fortunately I didn't have to unwrap it in the end. It's a concept and I was asked to test it to find out what it actually does. The inventor is understandably convinced...but I said to him best test it in the real world before sinking any more money into it.

Yes the idea is to improve extraction, how it might do it, if indeed it does is interesting. It grades and settles, rotates (does it mix horizontally as well) it also creates a sort of whirlpool effect, where the centre drops slightly and the edges are higher...the coffee bed goes slightly concave. That's interesting because it seems to create a better edge seal when you tamp and it squeezes towards the middle. The fourth thing is it "might" be freeing the puck up after the shot for an extra clean knock out (my silly idea)?

I have a few internal parts that are more "squidgy" to try as well, because it is possible to get more movement....if that's helpful...or not.

Iv'e basically included it into my routine and once I am very familiar with using it will start tests, especially if I can get @MWJB to come over and help me test with the refractometer he lent me last year (and I have forgotten how to use). I do get offered odd tech to test from time to time, but this looked interesting especially from a home use perspective.


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## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

DavecUK said:


> The Crem One 2B which Launched at host plus a few freebies (portafilter ring and little containers) I got.


 @DaveC Do you find out what Crem means with (low flow pressure profiling?)


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

JackHK said:


> @DaveC Do you find out what Crem means with (low flow pressure profiling?)


 Not sure, I don't tend to read the marketing?


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## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

DavecUK said:


> Not sure, I don't tend to read the marketing?


 Little at BB
Crem One - Dual Boiler PID with Rotary Pump. LFPP (low flow pressure profiling)

https://www.bellabarista.co.uk/crem-one-dual-boiler-pid-r-lfpp-wt-wc.html


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## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

Agnieszka Rojewska introduced boiler less prototype espresso machine with in-line induction heaters at Carimali booth


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## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

Eureka did it again ? Future is comming "Eureka Zeuz"

Some outer parts are still 3D printed, so the design will maby be little differents when launch, look the Burr's direction, its very easy to open just remove the plastic cover outlet funnel, its simlar like the Lynweber EG-1

85 mm flat, diamond burrs, touch display, 1400 rpm, power 1,5 Kw., weight 25 Kg. / 55,12 lb, grind 5,5 to 6,5 grams /sek.


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

That's quite cool and exciting, although probably not the best for single dosing.

I take you meant DLC (Diamond-Like Carbon) rather than actually diamond burrs? I can't afford diamond burrs!


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## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

PPapa said:


> That's quite cool and exciting, although probably not the best for single dosing.
> 
> I take you meant DLC (Diamond-Like Carbon) rather than actually diamond burrs? I can't afford diamond burrs!


 DIAMOND INSIDE BURRS The new patented process for a superior crystal structure of the burrs

https://www.eureka.co.it/en/news/id/73.aspx


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## Slowpress (Jun 11, 2019)

DavecUK said:


> No it's not a tamping stand it's a...well it's a, I dunno what it is, it doesn't have a name yet. I'm not sure what it's doing, I know it's doing something, I thought 2 things, but it appears to be doing 4 things....possibly. It's very heavy, much heavier than it looks and it got the airport security very excited in Milan. Fortunately I didn't have to unwrap it in the end. It's a concept and I was asked to test it to find out what it actually does. The inventor is understandably convinced...but I said to him best test it in the real world before sinking any more money into it.
> 
> Yes the idea is to improve extraction, how it might do it, if indeed it does is interesting. It grades and settles, rotates ...


 Is this mystery tool akin to a dental vibrator, which shakes, vibrates & mixes compounds for plaster molds? I have heard of some curious coffee folk using dental vibrators to mix & settle the grinds in a portafilter.?‍♀?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Slowpress said:


> Is this mystery tool akin to a dental vibrator, which shakes, vibrates & mixes compounds for plaster molds? I have heard of some curious coffee folk using dental vibrators to mix & settle the grinds in a portafilter.?‍♀?


 It vibrates, but from memory it's not really anything like a dental vibrator in the movement it manages to impart to the coffee. I experimented with dental vibrators more than a decade ago. If you watch the Video below and then rewatch my video you will see the difference.


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## JackHK (Aug 26, 2017)

La Marzocco, Automatic milk steamer, expected quarter 3 2020


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

A machine for every job, needed or not. Pretty soon LM will come up with the 1 button concept...just select your drink and press a button....they will have then "arrived". A lot of the commercial equipment at Host left me cold but then I have little interest in the commercial side. Interestingly with all the "Innovation", it won't be long before prosumer kit users will always be able to make superior coffee at home....there will be no skillz left in the coffee shops.


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## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

So you pay a load of money (presumably) for a machine with moving parts that's going require maintenance to keep it producing consistent results and after that you still need to train somebody how to use it and clean after use....seems to make more sense to train somebody to actually steam the milk and do other tasks.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Rob1 said:


> So you pay a load of money (presumably) for a machine with moving parts that's going require maintenance to keep it producing consistent results and after that you still need to train somebody how to use it and clean after use....seems to make more sense to train somebody to actually steam the milk and do other tasks.


 But Rob, they are LM, I am not worthy to lick the floor upon which they tread.....they must be right.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

They are probably thinking of larger scale users. The "barista" shoves the milk in jug, sticks it on a machine, presses a button, moves to the portafilter, presses another button and pulls a shot and milk is ready and waiting. They still need the fancy pour. Even world champion baristas don't have to worry about weighing out.

Crap product though. It should dose refrigerated milk in the desired quantities and use induction heating to get it to a temperature suitable for foaming ideally into an automatically provide disposable jug for hygiene reasons and to save washing up.

 I think the Italian coffee lot are getting into the innovate to increase market share - about 30 years too late. Also a more recent idea - put it out without being sure that all is really ok and sort that out if people notice when it's sold.

John

-


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

I have edited some of the material from host, here is the video walkthrough, or one of them. I still have the more familiar domestic machines to do ECM, Lelit etc..

https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/activities-blog/


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## Saltydog (Jan 27, 2019)

Flippin eck it's HUGE


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Saltydog said:


> Flippin eck it's HUGE


 I know, it's a long video.

If course if you mean the exhibition, then that walkthrough only covered 7% of it or even less!

I think it's largest of its kind in the world. I'm definitely up for going again in 2 years time.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Added a new video (link below) covering the Setting up of the ACS stand. It's a lot of work to set up a stand and *very expensive* to get space in the exhibition. ACS are not a wealthy company but I think they made a good effort, especially considering how tough things are for the Italian economy at the moment. There were 3 fully working (producing drinks) espresso machines on the stand. A 3 Group Vostok Dual boiler lever (fabulous machine), Vesuvius pressure profiler and a Minima.

It was hard work...but I thoroughly enjoyed myself, met many people I had only ever e-mailed and had a fascinating 4 days. Very productive from a new technology standpoint as well, nothing like talking to the manufacturers and designers of all the bits different manufacturers use in their machines e.g. boilers, pumps, electronics, groups etc...

It only runs every 2 years but I hope I am able to attend Host 2021

https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/activities-blog/

Sorry about the music but youtubes free selection is....well free!


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## -Mac (Aug 22, 2019)

I know it's cheesy, but I kinda liked the neon lights on that machine.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

-Mac said:


> I know it's cheesy, but I kinda liked the neon lights on that machine.


 LEDs, guided through a plastic (internally reflected). The actual LEDs come with a controller, it was set to super duper flashing random mode, unfortunately, the 2 sides were not connected the same, so they were not always in sequence, it was only a display model. Production ones will have a system that can work as well as any other RGB LED system for many subtle and not so subtle effects.

Inside people were puzzled at how small the internals were....it was actually an mostly empty case with a fridge compressor inside for weight, a Gicar board so the PIDs on the front would work. It's intended to come on 2 configurations. A standard commercial HX and an individually group controlled PID triple boiler. The price point is designed to be super competitive, in fact less than many prosumer dual boilers!

The real star for me was actually the Vostok dual boiler machines...what a shame there isn't a 1 group yet....and if there is it might not use cartridge heaters, but another method for group temperature control in a dual boiler lever. The big problem is a Vostok 1 group was designed over a year ago but I thought it was too large for domestic use.


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## mctrials23 (May 8, 2017)

Did you see any game changers at the show Dave? Either features vs price or simply really good innovation.

I feel like the market is crying out for a really good single dose flat burr grinder that doesn't cost north of £2000.

I like the look of the new Crem machines as well. Will be interesting to see how they do when they are released.


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