# EK43 & Expobar DB Question



## JKK (Feb 19, 2014)

Hello

I am currenlty having problems getting a decent flow with my setup.

Using Foundry Rocko Mountain 18.5g in IMS 18/22 basket.

Comes out way too fast, about 40g in 20sec.

Grind setting on EK43 original dial 1.4 - 1.7 [not much difference betweem the two]

Grinder definately setup for scrape on 1.0, scared my wife with the noise !

Any help appreciated.

Thanks very much

-jKK


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Whats the taste like ?

40 g in 20 seconnds isnt a problem unless the taste is to your taste

You could updose and , lighter roasts i am currently around 20g > 45 g

Or you can go finer , there are times with those doses/bean combinations i have been at zero on the ek , this isn't an issue as long as the taste is ok


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Grind at zero, if you can't slow it enough to get your desired shot time (ultimately determined by taste) then as a last resort you can grind at zero and nutate.


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## Eyedee (Sep 13, 2010)

You are really at the bottom of the parameters for the IMS 18/22 basket, have you tried updosing to somewhere near the middle eg 20g and see if this makes a marked difference.

Ian


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

I was right at 0 with this a few weeks ago but recalibrated and now have some extra range. Not much but can get shots comfortably over 30 secs if required.

40 out in 20 tasted pretty good with these beans though.


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## robashton (May 9, 2015)

This is why MacIntyre always went for the Turkish (wonder if he'll switch to those new burrs..)

you tried perger's tamp technique to slow it down? Seems to work okay if you've got the wiggle room.

40 in 20 if that's what I had last week then







- might have to consider a coarsening myself..

(jees, trying to write replies on an iPad in the bath is fraught with danger)


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Where's the duck??


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

Shame you've got an EK43 and I have a Mythos (or vice versa, lol!) otherwise I could have shared some detailed thoughts of these beans also using an Expobar DB.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

I think you would be better pairing the Expobar with something like an MC7, in fact i may just have one that i would be more than happy to do a straight swap....

I know, its not ideal, but i am willing to take the hit.


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

@froggystyle

That aimed at OP or me?


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Depends, are you going to fall for it?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

robashton said:


> This is why MacIntyre always went for the Turkish (wonder if he'll switch to those new burrs..)


@xpenno on here had coffee and turkish burrs but ended up selling the turkish

Your shot was slightly over 30 secs last week, slow by EK standards


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

froggystyle said:


> Depends, are you going to fall for it?


It was a *tough* decision but...no!


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

DoubleShot said:


> It was a *tough* decision but...no!


Then it was aimed at the OP.


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

jeebsy said:


> @xpenno on here had coffee and turkish burrs but ended up selling the turkish
> 
> Your shot was slightly over 30 secs last week, slow by EK standards


New coffee burrs are my preferred. Never had an amazing shot from the turks. Patrick (Systemic Kid) uses them solely I understand.


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

Are Turkish burrs generally advantageous if grinding super fine (read as...fine like dust!)?


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Turkish burrs give you more grind wiggle room. Where you might be at or around zero with coffee burrs, you'll be at 4-5 (0-17 scale) with Turks.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Xpenno said:


> New coffee burrs are my preferred. Never had an amazing shot from the turks. Patrick (Systemic Kid) uses them solely I understand.


Although you did say between the coffee burrs there wasn't much in it once they were seasoned?


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## JKK (Feb 19, 2014)

Mrboots2u said:


> Whats the taste like ?
> 
> 40 g in 20 seconnds isnt a problem unless the taste is to your taste
> 
> ...


Hello

Thanks for the all the replies.

The taste is a bit on the sharp side.

I know these beans quite well from using them last year, and remember I could

get a bit more smoother-sweeter taste from them.

PS this is with a nutate.

I will try near-zero tomorrow !

Also perhaps a smaller VST basket.

Maybe it's the recent weather changes . . .

Sorry no swap-shop

Cheers

-jKK


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Bigger basket to slow the pour


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

jeebsy said:


> Although you did say between the coffee burrs there wasn't much in it once they were seasoned?


I would say you get about 1 major number on the dial which can make or break I guess.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Try some water with a higher calcium and magnesium content (I'm not kidding)


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## JKK (Feb 19, 2014)

garydyke1 said:


> Try some water with a higher calcium and magnesium content (I'm not kidding)


Hello.

Thanks, I am use Ashbeck Mountain.

Will check the label for minerals.

This morning I tried 19.5g will dial on 1.2 or.

Just of screech.

Seemed to do the trick, much slower pour.

-jkk


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

What are you grinding into?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

And how did it taste, sweeter?

Again EK43 flow rate isn't indcaitive of high or low extraction yields and tasty cups in themselves


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

JKK said:


> Thanks, I am use Ashbeck Mountain.
> 
> -jkk


Its a little too soft by itself IMO.


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## JKK (Feb 19, 2014)

garydyke1 said:


> Its a little too soft by itself IMO.


I'm too scared to use harder water - descaling the Expo DB is not a task for the faint hearted.

Any Supermarket water recommendations ?

No RO until I move house in 4 years time . . .

PS travelled to Japanese countryside recently, the

well water there made V60 coffee taste very different, very cocoa taste.

*MrBoots* - Yes tasted better, a bit more balanced.

*Jeebsy* - Grinding directly into porta with metal jam funnel, a bit of Stockfleth

and tapping for distribution, then medium hard tamp with nutate.

Also sometimes try a 5sec preinfusion with the half way lever trick.

-jkk


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

True but pointless if not enjoying the coffee


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Ok basket distribution and prep is also key on the ek43. Its hard to tell where you go wjth this without some visuak evidence. .....

Didn't find the stock fleth worked that well for me with the ek.. I was never convinced I ended up with a even distribution across the whole basket...be worth reading the barista hustle articles on distribution if you can


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## JKK (Feb 19, 2014)

Mrboots2u said:


> Ok basket distribution and prep is also key on the ek43. Its hard to tell where you go wjth this without some visuak evidence. .....
> 
> Didn't find the stock fleth worked that well for me with the ek.. I was never convinced I ended up with a even distribution across the whole basket...be worth reading the barista hustle articles on distribution if you can


Hello

i'm not sure what other distribution technique to use.

The jam funnel leaves gaps around the insude edge of the porta

so I need to tap to settle the grinds, then finger swipe (Stockfleth ?)

the grinds into a flattish distribution.

Any tips welcome.

*Garydyke1* - What is a better water choice, London tap has plenty of calcium ?.

-jkk


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

JKK said:


> Hello
> 
> *Garydyke1* - What is a better water choice, London tap has plenty of calcium ?.
> 
> -jkk


Try Waitrose essential 75% and your tap water 25% , see how it compares to 100% waitrose

You're better experimenting with cupping/french press remove other extraction issues


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

JKK said:


> Hello
> 
> i'm not sure what other distribution technique to use.
> 
> ...


http://baristahustle.com/distribution-test-results/

I dont grind into the pf , i grind into a pitcher and or shaker and tip it into the pf .

It seems to make a difference to extractions , there is no science reason for this though as other people grind straight into pf and are fine


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

I'd try Volvic instead of Ashbeck, I've never liked Ashbeck personally. Or as Gary said, you could try adding tap water to something like Waitrose.


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

I'm exclusively using Volvic in my Expobar DB mainly because I can source it easily locally.

But would very much like to try some of @Xpenno highly rated coffee water!


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## JKK (Feb 19, 2014)

Hello

So !

Realigned and reset burrs for zero.

19g into 40 in 25secs dial set to 1.3 [orig]

Tasted sweet and mellow fruit, very nice.

Seems Roko Mountain needs to be ground very fine, most other beans

I am useing are around 1.8 - 2.0 on the dial.

Water was about 50% Ashbeck 50% London Tap.

Thanks for the tip Garydyke1

Looked at Waittose water, but mineral content is near

identical to Ashbeck.

-JKK


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Waitrose essentials water should be different to ashbeck. Higher tds, higher hardness ect.

Just be mindful of the scale with a 50% tap water blend depending on your local water of course.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Yeah try 25%-33% tap, it might be enough to balance without causing boiler havoc.


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## JKK (Feb 19, 2014)

Hello

Sorry one more question . . .

My EK sometime makes a different noise when I switch it one.

Normally a nice quiet smooth whiir.

But sometimes a much much more noisey rattlely noise

It dissappears once the beans have gone through, and returns to the quiet whiir.

Any ideas.

Cheers

-jKK


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

Pretty standard I think. No idea what it is but I think most do it occasionally.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Mine used to do it, randomly stopped.


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## nostream (Apr 2, 2015)

I believe Matt Perger called it the EK Noise. It's a known thing, it's not the burrs, and it's not harmful. I believe it's power-related. Just turn it off and on again.


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## JKK (Feb 19, 2014)

Thanks for the replies.

-JKK


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

nostream said:


> I believe Matt Perger called it the EK Noise.


I want one, how much do they cost?


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