# Gaggia Classic struggling to push water through coffee. Is my grind simply too fine?



## yossarian (Dec 11, 2013)

Hi,

I got a used Gaggia classic for Christmas. So I have been playing around with all sorts of different settings and obviously have mixed results. I have been surprised how easy it is to 'block' the basket with grinds so that it either cant push the water through or it takes like 2 minutes and only comes out one end. At first I was using a Hario Skerton hand grinder and so this surprised me even more, I was told this wouldn't be able to grind finely enough for espresso. However I found that after I loosened it a bit the Gaggia was making quite nice espresso.

So now I am using a La Cimbali Max espresso grinder and so have the potential to go even finer. At first I had it dialled in at around 7 and was getting decent results if I barely tampted the coffee at all. I felt like this wasn't quite right though as I see people tamping quite firmly on tutorials. I have been trying different amounts of coffee too, and actually it seemed a bit better with 14-15gs rather than a bit more.

Since then I have cleaned the machine with Cafiza etc, replaced the rubber gasket and shower screen and got the following basket: http://www.coffeehit.co.uk/gaggia-double-filter-basket. (Incidentally, I did not have good service from coffee hit at all and will not use them again, but that is not relevant to this). I was hoping this would give the machine some more welly and let me tamp the coffee a bit more, but it actually seems to be struggling a bit more.

I have only just made all these changes and need to try it with different amounts of coffee I think so its early days still.

What I wanted advice about is, I appreciate the obvious change will be to increase the grind coarseness but how fine it should be? How can I check whether the machine is performing properly? Could it be something I did when replacing parts and cleaning it that meant it isn't coping as well with the same number 7 grind I had before? Also, the shower screen and basket in particular look finer than the old ones, is that making a difference?

Many thanks for any help. I suppose the last thing to mention is I change beans weekly while I wait for my hasbean subscription to run out. I will settle on a proper espresso blend later, I am just using the In My Mug subscription to experiment with in the meantime.


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## Nijntje (Oct 2, 2013)

I'm not an expert by any means, but I'm guessing you'll need a portafilter with a pressure gauge to see what is being produced?


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Cleaning and backflushing "could" have pushed a speck of debris back into the solenoid valve and be partially blocking it. Try running the M/ch without the P/F to check for decent flow ( this does not indicate pressure you will need the gauge for that). If this is OK does not sound like blockage. How full is the basket when tamped ? If you overfill the basket you can choke the M/ch even at full pressure setting. Fill the basket and tamp firmly, place a 1 p piece on top of coffee and insert P/F into M/ch, remove and check that there is NOT an impression in coffee. If there is you have overfilled it, use less coffee and repeat test.

Tamp pressure and grind fineness go hand in hand , finer grind /lighter tamp heavy tamp /coarser tamp.

Age of beans, type of bean, and atmosphere can affect grind. NB Try to change one thing /parameter at a time and note the change .


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## yossarian (Dec 11, 2013)

Thanks for the replies both. God I don't want to buy any more coffee equipment for a bit so hope to sort this out without it.

I ran through quite a few empty shots with no coffee after cleaning and backflushing just to make sure it was clear of any cafiza etc and it seemed ok flow wise as far as I can tell.

It does sound like I have been overfilling sometimes then, especially this last time. I say that because there was an impression of the shower guard in the coffee without a coin even being needed. I remember one of my best shots was using a smaller amount of coarser grind coffee and tamping heavier. I am going to try going that way for a bit and will report back in a few days.

On an unrelated note, this is going to sound kind of stupid but I find removing the bypass tube thing annoying each time I change the water. It can be hard to screw it back on without pushing the inside rubber tube back into the machine. Am I missing a trick here? Do people fix that in place with tape or something or just not change the water? Its really inconvenient.


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

yossarian said:


> Thanks for the replies both. God I don't want to buy any more coffee equipment for a bit so hope to sort this out without it.
> 
> I ran through quite a few empty shots with no coffee after cleaning and backflushing just to make sure it was clear of any cafiza etc and it seemed ok flow wise as far as I can tell.
> 
> ...


Are you talking about the metal tube from the solenoid or the silicone tubing inside the tank. If its the metal tube it just pulls out, no screwing required.


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## yossarian (Dec 11, 2013)

Neill said:


> Are you talking about the metal tube from the solenoid or the silicone tubing inside the tank. If its the metal tube it just pulls out, no screwing required.


Um, you have confused me a bit. Its the metal pipe that sits outside the main case that the extra water is sent through into the drip tray once pressure is released. The bit that is in the way of the water tank. The silicone tube pokes through the hole and the metal thing screws onto a metal thing on the end of that. It definitely screws on, it would just fall off without screwing it on.

I have found when trying to reattach the detachable metal pipe you can easily push the internal tube back into the hole and then have to take the top off the case to put it back. I recently found that I can prevent this by using a knife to hold the bit the metal pipe screws onto in place so its not the end of the world, I am just interested what other people do.


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

On mine the metal pipe is just a straight pipe that pulls out of the metal end below the machine. Pull down on the pipe without unscrewing it and the pipe alone should slide out.


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## yossarian (Dec 11, 2013)

Oh wait, sorry Neil, I just realised I have been unscrewing it unnecessarily all this time!

http://coffeegeek.com/forums/coffee/questions/608608

Quite looking forward to going home and confirming this later. Thanks for the explanation.


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## yossarian (Dec 11, 2013)

Ok, weird. I spent a while making the grind a lot coarser and putting less in and the problem got worse if anything. Taking 2 minutes to pull a shot with little crema, although it tasted okish. Eventually I put the old filter basket back in and instantly it was flowing through way too quickly. The new one must be too fine or something. I think I am ok with the old one, I am now able to adjust the grind a lot finer and tamp down a bit more to get to that sweet spot.

I wonder why the new filter basket I linked to makes such a difference? It says its suitable for a Gaggia classic. Maybe they sent me the wrong one or something.


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

What filter basket did you buy and where from?


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## yossarian (Dec 11, 2013)

http://www.coffeehit.co.uk/gaggia-double-filter-basket. (Incidentally, I did not have good service from coffee hit at all and will not use them again, but that is not relevant to this)


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

What happened? I've found them pretty good, used them quite a lot


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## yossarian (Dec 11, 2013)

Long story, they took ages to dispatch my order (ok it was around NYE but still took a whole week). Then their carrier sent me an email telling me the delivery was for the next day so I waited in all day. Nothing arrived so I rang up and a girl blamed the carrier, said she would ring back and didnt. The carrier insisted its because they printed the dispatch label and didn't load it when they picked up the parcels. I believe the carrier as their online tracking seemed to confirm this. I complained, they said they could post to my work instead if I would not be home. I responded, they ignored me, the carrier failed delivery to my home because of this. Then coffee hit carried on ignoring me, the carrier refused to redeliver to my work because they said the sender had to change the delivery address. I eventually gave coffee hit a 24 hour deadline or I would charge back and they finally changed the address without apology.

Best thing ever, they didn't put my name on the fing parcel when they changed the address so I had to wait till the end of the day and convince the post room at work to let me look through the unlabelled parcels they had left. I emailed them to express my utter annoyance and, surprise surprise they ignored me. I wasted much more time than the order of about 10 items was worth ringing coffee hit and the courier and waiting in for no reason. I think they are just incompetent arrogant people and I would never give them my money again.


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## yossarian (Dec 11, 2013)

Anyway, back on topic. It definitely seems to be the basket. I used a finer grind and tamped harder today and it still came through in 20 seconds with my old basket. It was also the best shot I have pulled since getting the Gaggia. It seems all the cleaning and replacement of parts has paid off when I don't use the new basket. So I'm quite happy with this now, especially as I can justify getting a nicer tamper next.

This might not be the place to ask but I have an off topic question for those who use bottled water. Do you fill the tank up and then leave the majority in there day after day and top up as it depletes? Also, could you remind me what type of water is recommended? Many thanks!


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Topping up for two or three days is OK then remove tank and wash in hot soapy water, rinse thoroughly dry and go again.

Volvic is reputedly one of the best but expensive, other brands should not be discounted. Waitrose essential has similar properties.


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