# My ECM Synchronika journey



## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

As most of you know, it all started with me joining up looking for advice. I then proceeded to blow my initial budget but got a good deal on a grinder that put the Synchronika in range.

After waiting a few days, the machine arrived on a pallet.

I then had the task of getting it up the stairs from the garage into the house. Whoever said they were heavy was not mistaken. After a little bit of help from the wife, the machine was removed from the box and set in place.

I then followed the instructions to fill the boilers, waited half an hour and made my first espresso. The finished article looked like a small glass of Guinness. Wow, this is easy I thought...

I thought wrong.

With the superb TP-Link plug installed, the machine was ready for me to have my usual espresso and cappuccino before I leave the house for work.

The espresso looked fine, but the puck was a bit damp so I have work to

do this weekend. The cappuccino was not a cappuccino at all. I was not prepared for the steaming power of the Synchronika. This thing is so powerful that I realise I have a lot to learn. Anyway, the resulting flat white tasted fine, but the complete lack of latte art shows up my lack of skills.

This lead me to the conclusion that although I can make perfectly presentable and tasty drinks, I have a lot to learn, and I am looking forward to the journey.


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

At least you know with that kit the only barrier to fantastic coffee is you! Enjoy the journey


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

I tried a milk drink again, but the result was still less than perfect.

Out of interest, how much coffee should I be aiming for in the ECM single basket? 7 to 8g?


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

CageyH said:


> I tried a milk drink again, but the result was still less than perfect.
> 
> Out of interest, how much coffee should I be aiming for in the ECM single basket? 7 to 8g?


Forget the single basket.......no one really uses them in the UK.......very difficult to master. Use the double.......you will need to weigh your ground beans out to see what weight the basket will handle........will be 14 to 18 gms......when tamped make sure it sits low enough in the basket so as not to leave an imprint of the group shower screen as there needs to be room for the water to enter


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

CageyH said:


> I tried a milk drink again, but the result was still less than perfect.
> 
> Out of interest, how much coffee should I be aiming for in the ECM single basket? 7 to 8g?


Forget the single basket.......no one really uses them in the UK.......very difficult to master. Use the double.......you will need to weigh your ground beans out to see what weight the basket will handle........will be 14 to 18 gms......when tamped make sure it sits low enough in the basket so as not to leave an imprint of the group shower screen as there needs to be room for the water to enter


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

CageyH said:


> I tried a milk drink again, but the result was still less than perfect.
> 
> Out of interest, how much coffee should I be aiming for in the ECM single basket? 7 to 8g?


You've said it 

7g or 8g.. When I push mine to 9g, most of the time the puck would be stuck on the shower screen when I remove the portafilter. I don't have a correct size tamper to do it perfectly.


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Ims shower screen and vst baskets work very well on ECM ;-)


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

I have the IMS 200 shower screen, and the VST basket will be here after Christmas (I need to let the family buy me something).

I am half tempted to try the IMS "single" basket for when I only pull a single shot, which is most of the time.

They look well thought out, although I see that VST have a 7g basket, but it still looks to have the problems of single baskets.

Out of interest, what size milk jug would you guys recommend?


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

I have one small milk jug and one medium sized. It's all I've ever needed though I rarely make more than 3 drinks at a time.

The small jug half full is cappuccino and full is latte. The medium is for making more than one milk drink


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

The first victim, I mean visitor was round today so espressos were made.

The wife even asked for an espresso as well, so I got to work.

The general consensus was that it makes very good coffee. It was my first time pulling a double shot on the big basket and with the grinder set to deliver 18g of coffee a couple of very nice shots were pulled into glasses over 30 seconds. I think the double basket is fine, but I think I am overdosing he single that followed it, so I need to try the grind with the coin fitted. After 30 seconds on the single, I had a ristretto, which would have been fine if that is what I wanted!

More work is required on the single for sure. From what I have been told above, it is more difficult so it will be an interesting challenge.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

The wife has just shattered my world.

She has finally told me that she does not like the coffee I made her!

Apparently it is too strong and she prefers the old machine. I think I need to pour a longer shot for her, as this was a 30ml espresso shot.


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## Obnic (Jan 14, 2014)

Get brew ratio right, then pull a fresh shot (at that same brew ratio) into a glass with some hot water in to make an Americano. If you just pull longer, you may over extract the shot making it bitter.


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

CageyH said:


> The wife has just shattered my world.
> 
> She has finally told me that she does not like the coffee I made her!
> 
> Apparently it is too strong and she prefers the old machine. I think I need to pour a longer shot for her, as this was a 30ml espresso shot.


If the coffee was too strong, then naturally it needs to be made weaker so that she can enjoy it too! 

Pulling it longer might not necessarily be the answer here... Ask her, if the flavour was ok but too strong (then it needs diluting with hot water, not pulling longer), if too bitter (adjust by making shot time shorter) or too sour (longer shot to balance, or raise pid temp).

I find non-coffee people can find the bitter and the sour to be part of "too strong" a coffee..


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Good advice. Thanks.

I have just fitted the IMS screen, and have ordered a couple of Cafelat 8.5mm group seals.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

CageyH said:


> Good advice. Thanks.
> 
> I have just fitted the IMS screen, and have ordered a couple of Cafelat 8.5mm group seals.


You need 8mm seals, the red ones.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

My handle locks in at about 5 o'clock. I went for the slightly thicker seal so hopefully it will lock at 6 o'clock so that the cups don't hang off the edge of the drip tray anymore.


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## CardinalBiggles (Apr 24, 2017)

CageyH said:


> I tried a milk drink again, but the result was still less than perfect.
> 
> Out of interest, how much coffee should I be aiming for in the ECM single basket? 7 to 8g?


I was advised to ditch the single basket, and they were right. Everything is so much easier and the outputs so much better with the double.

Of course you do drink twice as much coffee!

The Synchronika single basket has a sloping lower half. If you put 7gms in it, it barely covers the lower half and is almost impossible to tamp with the slope.


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

CageyH said:


> My handle locks in at about 5 o'clock. I went for the slightly thicker seal so hopefully it will lock at 6 o'clock so that the cups don't hang off the edge of the drip tray anymore.


Let me know how the 8.5mm (blue) goes for you. As MSR says, for our ECM's and Profitecs it should take the red 8.0mm gasket. But it's not a must, and since your brand new Synchronika is already locking at 5 o'clock, the blue one might remedy the situation. Understandably, your left cup will be on the cliff...

Just hope for your sake that you are the type who likes to lock it absolutely by cranking it to the maximum (5 o'clock). Mine, also relatively new, can go there, but I choose not to, by stopping at 6, which is sufficient.

I say this because just in case you have a thinner than usual oem gasket (slight variance maybe, or a slightly defective but functional gasket, requiring you to go to 5), the moment you get the 8.5mm you might have the exact opposite of a problem and now it would stop at 7 o'clock.

Mind you, all this could change on whichever non-oem basket you might happen to be using..


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

Actually, your post reminded me that I had a red 8mm gasket in reserve, so I thought why not..

Swapped it out.

Wow. It's tighter than the original rubber oem gasket.

It took a while for it to fit in smoothly. Obviously it's brand new, so it needs time to wear in. Let's see how it goes.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

I have ordered a couple of red gaskets to pick up from my parents when I am next back in the UK.

I should not need to change it anytime soon, but the Cafelat seals seem difficult to get in France.

Today I realised my mistake when frothing my semi-skimmed milk. I was putting the tip too deep to start off with.

I tried it closer to the surface, and it worked much better. I just need a bit more practice rolling the milk now.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

The 8.5mm seal has arrived and been fitted, and the handle now locks in at 6 o'clock.

Perfect...

I will measure the old one to see how much different it is.


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

What's the benefit of the cafelat gaskets? I have ims screen with standard black gasket.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

I don't think there is a major advantage if I am honest. It's a seal. If it works, then you don't need to touch it.

I only changed mine due to the porta filter spout positioning.


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

Hi CageyH

Did you get the red (8.0mm) or blue (8.5mm)?

You said you ordered red ones before you went to your parents. Today you say you got 8.5mm..sorry to nitpick..

If you now get it at 6 o'clock, nice one!

I'm just pointing this out, because surprising number of people lurk and get valuable info from reading our hands on experience.

I was one of them and read many threads on this, then proceeded to order the red 8.0mm online. For me, after 1 week of red gasket use, I still find it tighter than the factory standard 8.0mm black rubber gasket. Mine now stops at 6:30


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> What's the benefit of the cafelat gaskets? I have ims screen with standard black gasket.


I've yet to use mine long enough to verify, but supposedly longer life span.

You know that baked rubber smell? If your portafilter has been locked in for a while, the heat can make the oem rubber emit and transfer that smell to the basket. Well, this supposedly isn't supposed to happen with silicon gasket because.. Well it's silicon. But the weird thing is, I still get that burnt rubber smell (but admittedly to a lesser extent) . Maybe it's not silicon like they say it is?


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Ah ok makes sense


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## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

maybe the smell comes from some residues of the old gasket still there

silicone rubber really is the ideal material for these applications


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

u2jewel said:


> Hi CageyH
> 
> Did you get the red (8.0mm) or blue (8.5mm)?
> 
> ...


Yesterday I got the 8.5mm. It was after I ordered the 8.5mm that I was told the ECM took an 8mm seal. I also ordered the 8mm, but I won't pick those up until I go back to the UK.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

kennyboy993 said:


> What's the benefit of the cafelat gaskets? I have ims screen with standard black gasket.


Like Cagey said, if it seals, it seals. I bought a blue one from BB to replace the original black one on my R58 which had gone rock hard. What I noticed was that the Cafelat ones are so much softer that you only need light contact to get a seal (as long as they're seated correctly). One of my portafilters seems to be slightly different (original spouted one locks at 6, naked at 5) but with the blue gasket I can make the naked seal at 6 and still get the spouted one to go to 6 even though it would seal ok at 7 o'clock).


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Today I received my BWT water test kit, and tested my tap water. First pass took 4 drops, and the second took 5. I tested Volvic and I needed 4 drops for the same result.

Therefore I can conclude that it is a waste of time me buying Volvic, but I may look at a BWT filter jug to improve the flavour.

According to the kit (if I take the average) I have a hardness of 4.5 degrees KH, which seems fine to me. Since one degree KH = 17.848 mg/L CaCO3, my tap water appears to be very similar to Volvic, which was shown in the test.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

CageyH said:


> Today I received my BWT water test kit, and tested my tap water. First pass took 4 drops, and the second took 5. I tested Volvic and I needed 4 drops for the same result.
> 
> Therefore I can conclude that it is a waste of time me buying Volvic, but I may look at a BWT filter jug to improve the flavour.
> 
> According to the kit (if I take the average) I have a hardness of 4.5 degrees KH, which seems fine to me. Since one degree KH = 17.848 mg/L CaCO3, my tap water appears to be very similar to Volvic, which was shown in the test.


Lucky you! My tap water is so hard that the kettle is completely full of limescale after 2 weeks of usage.... :-(


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

My wife now tells me there is a full analysis on the bill!

I did not need to buy the test kit....


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

CageyH said:


> My wife now tells me there is a full analysis on the bill!
> 
> I did not need to buy the test kit....


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## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Lucky you! My tap water is so hard that the kettle is completely full of limescale after 2 weeks of usage.... :-(


The place in Slovakia where I come from has such hard water that the kettle was covered with limescale in two days







quite similar to the water in Copenhagen..the limestone bedrock is the culprit

Here in mountains with mostly granite bedrock with few sedimentary rocks there is some but not nearly as much. The town where I studied, Banská Štiavnica, lies in the middle of an ancient stratovolcano and the bedrock is pretty acidic there..the kettle was limescale free for the whole 5 years


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## Obnic (Jan 14, 2014)

Same here 37 degrees hardness. The BWT filter runs on setting 0. An XL canister is only good for 910 liters.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

I am still looking at using a jug filter to see if it will improve the taste.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Sme more visitors stayed last night, so I did the coffee this morning.

Americanos, lattes and espressos. Not a single complaint.

It has led me to the conclusion that the easiest way of avoiding the "burnt coffee" taste is to upgrade the wife.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Today I switched the beans to the Moka Nekemte I bought recently.

No complaints from the visitors, and when I asked if it tasted burnt I got a puzzled look and was told it tasted very good.

I think that my Mazzer Mini may still be bedding in, as according to the shot counter it has done less than 300 shots so far.


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## jerbla (Nov 13, 2017)

My journey in this world will start this week, awaiting delivery time frames from Bella Barista, but hope to be having my first shot mid late next week. Pour overs and Aeropress till then!

Will update re my experiences once machine is warm, set up and running!


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## jerbla (Nov 13, 2017)

Oh My, what a piece of kit.

So hand in hand with my new purchase and reading lots here I am now treading new ground, I appreciate I was very approximate in my approach before, and has used this new purchase to refine my approach. What a difference. My third shot and I have had the best cup of coffee I have ever made!

Still refining grind and tamp pressure.

This is a whole new world of improved coffee drinking and approach, quite simply you get out what you put in!


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Here are a couple of shots of my latest milk based coffees.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Well the naked portafilter has been an interesting experience.

First shot produced a spritzer of mighty proportions.

The second shot was spot on (after I manually increased the dose of

coffee.

The third was just a mini spritzer as I believe that the dose is still too small for the basket.

i have been using my distribution tool and ESPRO tamper to keep those variations the same (as much as possible), so the good news is I seem to be getting closer.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

One week on, and the grinder is dialled in with respect to time and grind, so spritzers are a thing of the past, until later this week when I change the beans again!


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Out of interest - what's your recovery time on the synchronika cagey?

I've always been intrigued by double boiler e61 machines as I've assumed the groups run quite a bit cooler than the e61 hx machines eg like mine.

If you're pulling more than one shot how long do you have to wait for the second or even third and fourth?


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

kennyboy993 said:


> Out of interest - what's your recovery time on the synchronika cagey?
> 
> I've always been intrigued by double boiler e61 machines as I've assumed the groups run quite a bit cooler than the e61 hx machines eg like mine.
> 
> If you're pulling more than one shot how long do you have to wait for the second or even third and fourth?


Here's some info from my Synchronika.

Room temp 25°c. PID for brew boiler set at 94°c.

I pull a shot (36g)...from the moment shot is finished (0sec) to 35 sec after the shot, pid reading is 94°c.

From 35 sec to 50 sec, this period always displays 92°c to 93°c. From 50 sec onwards (usually at least 93°c by then), I need to wait to 1min 15sec for it to return to original 94°c.

Since my shot prep takes 45-50sec, I did (just now) this experiment. I didn't want to make 5 espressos, so I weighed the output water to 36g, and waited in between to allow for the imaginary basket preparation.

I ran 5 consecutive cycles. Pulled 36g hot water, started stop watch, waited 50 sec, then repeat...

Every time, like clockwork, around the 30 sec mark (+/- 2sec) the pid reading dropped to 92°c. But at 45 sec mark, came back to 93°c. Just in time for my 50 sec cycle experiment.

For the 5 cycles, every time, brew temp reading at pid at beginning of shot was 93°c. That is, except for the very first shot, which began at 94°c.

I raised the setting to 95°c..it seems to do the same thing. Always off but constantly pumping out at 1°c less..


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

So, I changed the beans and I am getting a small amount of spraying.

What am I doing wrong and where do I need to improve?


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## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

CageyH said:


> So, I changed the beans and I am getting a small amount of spraying.
> 
> What am I doing wrong and where do I need to improve?


I'd grind finer and take care to stir the grinds well before tamping


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

As Stanic says, if you keep your current dose, grind finer. WDT will for sure help. Whatever tool is of your choice, with it give all coffee grinds in the basket equal stirring.

You may choose to WDT or no-WDT. Try both and compare to see for yourself.

I personally think, the most important part is to make sure that pre-tamp, your grinds inside the basket is as level and flat as possible. When doing wdt, you can devise a way to achieve this as part of wdt. If no wdt, then achieve the flat bed by redistributing the grinds around by shuffling the portafilter or tapping the sides of it.

Then collapse the fluffy coffee bed, and remove air pockets buried and hidden by knocking /tapping the pf down against something. If the (above mentioned) wdt or redistribution by tapping was done well, this collapsing should still maintain that level, flat surface.

Then proceed to tamp, making sure it's level. From the YouTube, it seems you are doing this well already.

What I also suspect from the YouTube is that maybe you have under-dosed. Isn't that the IMS h28. 5? How many grams is your dose?


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Thanks for the feedback.

I have adjusted the grinder a little finer.

I will weigh the dose again, as I do not remember what it was.

I use a distribution tool before I tamp.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

The dose in the video would be around 17g.

A little low perhaps?


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## Jony (Sep 8, 2017)

What basket is it.


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## u2jewel (Aug 17, 2017)

Cagey might correct me, but I think it's the h28.5

I'm just going by the looks of the basket. And if it is that, then yeah, at the current grind size, needs quite a bit more.

Like 20g and over. But only if it is the basket I think it is.

There is laser inscription on the side 

If the basket is h28.5, it's supposed to take anything from 18g to 22g.


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## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

(hiccup)


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## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

u2jewel said:


> If the basket is h28.5, it's supposed to take anything from 18g to 22g.


I'm not sure if you can say 'anything between', more like from 18g of a very dark roast to 22g of very light roast









I've used the same with Rancilio Silvia and usually dosed 20g of the medium roasts


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

It's a IMS E61 Competition Filter Basket 16/20g - B702TCH26E basket - to give it the full description.


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## Stanic (Dec 12, 2015)

Depends on the roast level and headroom to the shower screen then..you'll have to experiment what works best. I'd suggest 18 g of medium roast.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

I have upped the dose to 18g, and it seems to be a bit better combined with a finer grind.

Thanks for the help.


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## CardinalBiggles (Apr 24, 2017)

CageyH said:


> Sme more visitors stayed last night, so I did the coffee this morning.
> 
> Americanos, lattes and espressos. Not a single complaint.
> 
> It has led me to the conclusion that the easiest way of avoiding the "burnt coffee" taste is to upgrade the wife.


Now THAT upgrade can be the most expensive upgrade of all!


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

It is just over a year since the machine was delivered.

The wife still prefers my old machine, but that now lives at work.

i really think it may be down to the switch from conical to flat grinder, so I am tempted by a Niche.

The only thing stopping me is that I like the coffee, so I am reluctant to change anything.

The machine has been faultless and has averaged about 4 coffees a day.

Not a lot of use, but weekdays it only normally does the first coffee of the day.


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## WayneW (Nov 24, 2018)

Great read and great machine - congrats, I've had mine for just over a year now too.

I read a few times in this thread that someone suggested to forget about the single dose basket. With the size cup I use the single basket provides the perfect strength coffee so it was something that I needed to master. Not only that I only use half the coffee so it works out cheaper.

To get the single dose to work you need to get everything close to perfect and get an intimate feel for the relationship between the bean type, grind size, humidity, tamping pressure and weight. I had to purchase an accurate scale and ended up getting the Brewista, I also purchased a tamper that tamps to 30lbs. Generally the weight that works for me is 9.6 grams (note: this doesn't produce enough grounds to be level with the top of the basket (before tamping)).

The weight varies slightly depending on humidity and time since roasted, but it usually doesn't vary enough to cause a failed shot. I purchase the same blend of beans from a local roaster who knows the importance of consistency and roasts this blend fresh every day. 750 grams lasts me roughly two weeks, and that is sealed in air tight packaging.

I had to replace the original black gasket for the blue after finding the red not quite thick enough. The blue actually made a difference to the final shot of coffee, so seals in this case do matter because they serve to keep the porter-filter a certain distance from the screen. The original black gasket shrunk enough to allow the coffee to touch the screen which caused problems for the single shot. Once I installed the blue gasket the porter-filter handle was tight at 6 o'clock and the coffee no longer touched the screen.

So with this set up I'm able to get a consistently great tasting single dose. W.


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## xpresso (Jan 16, 2018)

Hello Wayne.

Its a good idea to list your equipment in your profile, it helps in respect of people giving advice and the like.

Is it a Sychronika that you have ?.

Jon.


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## WayneW (Nov 24, 2018)

Hi Jon, Indeed it's a Synchronika.


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## xpresso (Jan 16, 2018)

WayneW said:


> Hi Jon, Indeed it's a Synchronika.


Welcome to our world ... a tad belated but it'll soon be Christmas







.

Jon.


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## AlexCoffee (Dec 17, 2018)

CageyH said:


> The wife has just shattered my world.
> 
> She has finally told me that she does not like the coffee I made her!
> 
> Apparently it is too strong and she prefers the old machine. I think I need to pour a longer shot for her, as this was a 30ml espresso shot.


I know exactly how you feel. Took me months to get it to the liking of my wife!


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## xpresso (Jan 16, 2018)

CageyH said:


> It is just over a year since the machine was delivered.
> 
> The wife still prefers my old machine, but that now lives at work.





AlexCoffee said:


> I know exactly how you feel. Took me months to get it to the liking of my wife!


Eventually I finally solved the discrepancy in our coffees, or should I say the consistency of Madams by using a pair of scales.










Depending how her taste buds are on any particular day I can adjust the next brew either way, its worked for us.

Incidentally I changed the double outlet socket with a one fitted with USB outputs to power the scales and the scales ideally slip under the machine perfectly.

Jon.


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## AlexCoffee (Dec 17, 2018)

Great idea!

What was the discrepancy? Just different weights? How do you adjust it differently for your wife separately from your own?

Those scales look neat - what are they?


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## xpresso (Jan 16, 2018)

Morning Alex. the system works well for us as Madam does not like her coffee to strong.

I have two of theses .......

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Digital-Backlight-0-01-500g-Operated-Jewellery/dp/B07L2SNGPQ/ref=pd_sbs_107_40?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B07L2SNGPQ&pd_rd_r=2983552b-4633-11e9-a7db-130ec618c342&pd_rd_w=jRzlb&pd_rd_wg=QPBcG&pf_rd_p=18edf98b-139a-41ee-bb40-d725dd59d1d3&pf_rd_r=VX157KCV70Z4B9P3V2X2&psc=1&refRID=VX157KCV70Z4B9P3V2X2

(Where's Ash when I need him)

They really go under the name of 'Digital scale' and then many of the suppliers apply their name and charge what they think the market will stand or what profit they are content with.

Like I said they slip under the machine very neatly, the difficulty I had was getting L/H out mini USB cables, I had to settle for white in the end and not the best of cable, so that search goes on.

Our current 'Fix' is 22g in a 20g VST basket, double spout P.F. and when Madams cup reaches 12g @ 20 sec, I slide my cup and scale across to enjoy the rest at approx 45g @ 40 sec.

It really helps the atmosphere and Marg is quite happy that any change in supposed strength are where her taste buds are subject to what she may have consumed earlier.

She will comment if I change the beans and ask me to adjust either way which I find 2g works fine.

Jon.


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## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

xpresso said:
 

> Morning Alex. the system works well for us as Madam does like her coffee to strong.
> 
> I have two of theses .......
> 
> ...


You rang?


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## xpresso (Jan 16, 2018)

ashcroc said:


> You rang?


A message from Heaven to realise a gross error in my wording, or the omission of said ' Madam does like her coffee to strong' SHOULD READ ' Madam, (Marg) DOESN'T like her coffee to strong' ....... hence I can vary subject to feed back, between 8 - 12g for Marg's cup, as usual I get the dregs !!!.

Thank You Ash for allowing me to put the record straight







.... not till breakfast.

Jon.


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

I am wondering if part the reason is going from a conical grinder to a flat at the same time as changing the machine?


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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Do a question, and I relise that this may not be the best place for it, but it is still part of my Journey.

The current grinder is a Mazzer Mini electronic, with super jolly (?) burrs fitted to reduce the grind time. What would be the difference (apart from €560 missing from my bank account) if I were to buy a Niche zero?

I don't really want to drop large amounts of cash on a grinder right now, as I am planning to replace one of the cars soon.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

CageyH said:


> Do a question, and I relise that this may not be the best place for it, but it is still part of my Journey.
> The current grinder is a Mazzer Mini electronic, with super jolly (?) burrs fitted to reduce the grind time. What would be the difference (apart from €560 missing from my bank account) if I were to buy a Niche zero?
> I don't really want to drop large amounts of cash on a grinder right now, as I am planning to replace one of the cars soon.


Is the car more important than the grinder? Keep the mazzer.

The Niche zero is a single dose grinder, designed as such from the ground up. It's workflow is dead simple, and likewise the maintenance and cleaning. It's also more kitchen friendly. It has conical burrs unlike the mazzer mini flat burrs.

If you see happy with the mazzer and 650 euro will make a difference financially, save up until you are happy to spend the money.

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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

The car is not an urgent replacement. I have just started to think about replacing it.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

CageyH said:


> The car is not an urgent replacement. I have just started to think about replacing it.


If you have the money, then why not?

IMO, it will be an improvement.

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## CageyH (Oct 8, 2017)

Yes, but which grinder? So much choice, and so little chance of trying them all.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

CageyH said:


> Yes, but which grinder? So much choice, and so little chance of trying them all.


What's your usage? If you are a home user, and don't make 4 coffees in s row, the Niche is the way to go, in my opinion. If you do make lots of coffees in one go, then you better off keeping the Mazzer.

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## xpresso (Jan 16, 2018)

I have a Mazzer Super Jolly at a second location and I'm impressed with its ability, the down side for me at the moment is the doser that's fitted, hopefully I'll get round to making it as near as damn it into a single doser, yes it will have retention but having now managed to find a roast we're content with it will not be a major problem.

At home we have the ECM Titan with Titanium burrs.

Jon.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

xpresso said:


> At home we have the ECM Titan with Titanium burrs.
> Jon.


Which is a very similar design to the super jolly or mazzer mini. I used to have the T-64, the no frills, Profitec version of that. I liked it, great grinder. 

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