# Help Ceado 37s not responding



## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Hello all;

Came to do my usual morning long black with 16grmd MALABAR double dose 4 secs and NOTHING.

Hit the button with PF nothing.

The machine is on display on but nothing, no noise NOTHING!!

Tried hitting the set button for 3 secs - no beep. The display scrolls between last reset and total number of shots but won't give me my morning fix.

Tried the manual setting NOTHING.

GUTTED.

Who repairs these Goliaths???

Help: no backup grinder either.

Going into a coma soon .


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)




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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

I know this is an obvious one but have you tried rebooting it by turning the main power off and back on again?


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

If the screen is showing live but push button is not activating possible contamination on push button switch or faulty worn switch.

Coffee grounds tend to escape and fall down onto P/B switch.Remove top burr carrier and carefully vac / brush inside particularly arond switch.

OR turn it upside down , remove the rubber feet and access the 4 screws holding base on, again vac and brush.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

lake_m said:


> I know this is an obvious one but have you tried rebooting it by turning the main power off and back on again?


 Done that till I'm blue in the face.!!


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

El carajillo said:


> If the screen is showing live but push button is not activating possible contamination on push button switch or faulty worn switch.
> 
> Coffee grounds tend to escape and fall down onto P/B switch.Remove top burr carrier and carefully vac / brush inside particularly arond switch.
> 
> OR turn it upside down , remove the rubber feet and access the 4 screws holding base on, again vac and brush.


 Thanks Frank, Going shopping now in a sulk, but will try that later.!


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Gilly said:


> Thanks Frank, Going shopping now in a sulk, but will try that later.!


 Buy a tin of contact cleaner while you are out ??


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## Stox (Jul 19, 2020)

If it's anything like my E37 (not an S) it's easiest to access the portafilter switch from the bottom. If you decide to disconnect it for cleaning take careful note of which terminals are connected - there should be two wires going to three terminals on the switch. Usual safety warnings apply...


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Ok this is what I've found so far.

Retained dark roast grinds (lots)

Wooden dowel; one whole,and suspiciously bits of one???

Long time since I ground any dowels!!

mmmh. I'll clean and reinstall.

If the switch is still dormant and after my blue funk, I'll post you all further for advice.

Thanks Gill


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## Stox (Jul 19, 2020)

If/when you look at the bottom end you should find the portafilter button acts on a long strip of spring steel which then acts on the switch, which is mounted on a plate at the bottom of the grinder that holds all the electronic components. With a bit of luck your problem is that some piece of debris is physically blocking the action of the steel strip and the switch itself is fine.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Stox said:


> If/when you look at the bottom end you should find the portafilter button acts on a long strip of spring steel which then acts on the switch, which is mounted on a plate at the bottom of the grinder that holds all the electronic components. With a bit of luck your problem is that some piece of debris is physically blocking the action of the steel strip and the switch itself is fine.


 Thanks I'll give this a go tomorrow hopefully.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

@Gilly Did you ever get this issue sorted out?


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Hello again

Ive not had time to look at the grinder till today.

Ive enclosed some pics with the bottom plate removed.

Where do I start as this is not my forte!!

What do I unscrew first?

Any help would be greatly appreciated as I'm sick of using my Lido!

Thanks again Jill


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

More pics!!


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

From the first pic the fat white cylinder is the capacitor, this is what can be charged up, note the position of leads then pull them off by the insulated covers ( it is the cylinder that can be charged up) with the terminals pulled off, use an insulated s/driver and touch it across both connectors.

( there wont be any spark or anything to see ) this just discharges any residual power left in it) OK to touch now.

Looking down the front you will /can see a small white rectangle, this is the micro switch that is operated by the push button, this is what you need to access. Release the screws holding the metal carrying the electronics and lift to one side ( taking care not to ""bash"" it against anything.

Access and remove the switch (noting / photoing connections / fitment) =for reference. Thoroughly clean the switch and its little push button / knib

Do you have a test meter ? = yes = use continuity to test across the terminals to see if it is working OK NO meter battery + bulb +bits of wire to make up a test circuit. Also clean around the mechanical push button and everything else while you have it apart.

Enough for now, glad you are having a go :good:


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

@GillyThinking back to your previous post when you cleaned out the base and found a piece of dowel.

I do wonder if the dowel was wedging something into place eg something to do with the switch / push button/ metal finger.

As the movement on the micro switch is very small (2- 3 mm) this could be why the problem has appeared ?

Try to observe the action of the push button /metal finger / contact with the micro switch.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Ok discharged the capacitor as you said. Got in with a softish brush and throughly cleaned.

Tried to undo the tiny nut off the screw x 2 holding the switch and can't get into it properly. At this point cleaned the inside with a vacuum and replaced things and decided to see if it now works.

In short no; it's just as before, so what tool will I need to get onto those tiny nuts?

I will need to remove the switch anyway should this prove to be faulty so it's got to come off regardless.

Depressing the switch manually does contact the knib ok and so on.

Thanks again Jill


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Does pressing the button operate the knib effectively ? Do you have a test meter ? If you can access the M/switch terminals you could check the action using continuity on the meter.

To undo the nuts securing the switch a small ring spanner or 1/4 '' drive socket on a knuckle bar or extension with a flexible joint.long nosed pliers.

,

I do not know how easy / difficult it would be to remove the entire motor to give access.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Ok Frank I'm so far down the rabbit hole now there's no going back!

Removed the entire pcb and the plate above the motor to access the switch which is incredibly fiddly to get off as the nuts/screws invariably fall into the machine; what fun, plus it is 45c in my conservatory!!

Anyway I've sent more pics.

What do I do now with the switch??


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

More pics


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Firstly looking at the spring arm attached to the switch it looks to be bent / curved in the middle, if it was originally straight this would. move it away from the external push button= not fully depressing the switch / possibly causing arcing in the switch. You will need a meter to test the switch, set it to low ohms and connect to the terminals on the switch and operate the switch , this should cause the meter to indicate the switch opening and closing.

Providing the switch is sound, bending the sprung metal arm straight may be all that is required, unless there is another problem or the switch is burned / damaged.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Utter electrical numpty here;

never used a meter before, where do I set it from the photo? and which terminals do I place the red and black test needles?

sorry🤪🤪🤪


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)




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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Set pointer to200 ohms (6 oclock)torn on meter then touch both probes together, should read zero but may read a single digit and probably will buzz indicating completed circuit ( for your purposes you can ignore the single digit if it appears)

With the meter in this setting it is testing for continuity=(complete circuit) and for any resistance in the circuit (the switch in your case)

For this test it does not matter which probe goes where, apply probes to switch terminals and press the nib on the switch, if the switch is OK

the reading should be the same as when touching the probes together, a higher figure in the reading would indicate a resistance at the switch contacts.

Take a look online for vids using a test meter,


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Thanks Frank you are a gent!!


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Hello again Frank.

Right; after dissembling the grinder and using my small hands to remove the switch and then cleaning it and trying to test it, I then spent Saturday afternoon reassembling.

After all that effort Frank nothing has changed. I still have a display that won't change from manual setting and I can't get into reset mode and also there's no beep.

Im now thinking it's not the switch but a problem with the electronics?? via the display.

Any thoughts; I'm not enjoying my coffee anymore using my loaned Iberital doser

Where can I get it looked at Frank, any ideas from the forum etc?

Thanks again Gill


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## Stox (Jul 19, 2020)

I have a rather old E37 (not S) where the electronics expired. The cost of replacement parts is prohibitive, so I bypassed the circuit board and display, added a bellows and use it as a single-dosing grinder with the portafilter button only. If you can work out what wire is doing what it's actually very easy to do, and no additional parts are required: you just re-route the wiring using the existing spade connectors.


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Gilly said:


> Hello again Frank.
> 
> Right; after dissembling the grinder and using my small hands to remove the switch and then cleaning it and trying to test it, I then spent Saturday afternoon reassembling.
> 
> ...


 From your early post's I thought a good chance it would be switch /contacts / pushbutton related.

As @Stox said the electronic component is prohibitively expensive (£250 + ?)

I do not know anyone that specifically works on these and I am not into electronics.

I believe @Coff Hey works on coffee grinder/ electronics, possibly reach out to him.

Sorry I cannot help further.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Thanks to both for their input on this especially Frank.

Stox; is their anyway you could talk me through this with pics etc. Do you just completely remove the PCB??

Any advice would be welcomed as now months have gone by and my coffee just sucks.!


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

The cost of a new PCB is horrendous and not that easy to find. I agree, your best bet is to hot wire the electronics and just go with a on/off manual solution. If you're struggling to get someone local, I'll be happy to take a look for you. That would mean shipping the grinder to and fro which you may not want to do. There will probably a local shop/general repair nearby who could easily do the work for you.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Hi Lake

Wit's end so would be happy to pack up and post to you.

Pity to lose the electronics but a manual grinder is fine by me.

Thanks again


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

OK, no problem, I'll PM you my details.

(Still might be worth doing a quick search of local repairers and save on postage.)


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## Coff Hey (Mar 19, 2021)

Sorry all playing catch up here.

No response from touch buttons or Portafilter button is that correct?

prior to the fault it had just been working as normal or has it previously been apart I.e. is wiring known correct?


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Hi

yes working as normal.

The display won't let me in to the menu; it just scrolls to total number of shots, and number of shots since reset. The beep as gone also. It's stuck on manual but get nothing when the PF button is depressed.


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## Coff Hey (Mar 19, 2021)

Okay sorry to ask but let's just check things step by step can you tell me behaviour when when:

1) pressing both the single and double shot buttons simultaneously

2) turning the motor by hand

3) turn the grinder on with the serial cable to the display is disconnected

4) the + and - and set button is held for 20 or more seconds simultaneously


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## Coff Hey (Mar 19, 2021)

Any news mate?


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Thanks for the reply.

After lots of faffing around with it dismantling to get at the switch etc and rebuilding, it's just the same, so it's off to one of our members who's kindly going to hopefully bypass the PCB to make it just a manual on off grinder if the PCB has a unrepairable problem.


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

@GillyAny progress with the repair ?


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

El carajillo said:


> @GillyAny progress with the repair ?


 It's at my place - safely arrived on Tuesday. Just waiting on me getting home later in the month to make a start on it.

I'll document everything on here so that you guys can follow along.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

Hi Frank

Did what i could but the problem seems to be with the PCB so I've sent it off to Lake a member on here to see if he can work something out. He may have to by pass the electronics so it just becomes an on demand only which really doesn't bother me.

I'll keep you posted!!


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

I did see his post and await his findings.

Unless I am sticking to one coffee I tend to use mine on the push button and can dose pretty close to target.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Finally got the E37s on the bench tonight.









A quick test confirmed just as @Gilly said, the display is frozen on 'Manual Dose READY' It doesn't matter which combinations of buttons, it doesn't do anything. Nor does the grinder start when the dose button is pressed.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Here is the PCB disassembled with pins cleaned and new ribbon cable connected - no difference.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Tried all the usual things. The touch pads buttons are fine and passed continuity tests back to the pin header. All voltages check out fine. All earths are good. It's not a bad connection, or a dodgy cable.

I think (as originally thought), the PCB is goosed.

I'm not totally beat yet, but not to waste any more time.......on with the surgery!









To make the modification totally reversible (should one day we can find a replacement PCB), I made up some short jumpers with spade terminals and connected it up in the following sequence:

Power On/Off switch live to dose button in

Dose button out to motor winding in (run capacitor / auxiliary winding is wired in parallel so no additional connections to be made there).

Motor winding out to Neutral and back to Power On/Off switch.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Back together and working with PCB bypassed in full manual mode.


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## Gilly (Jul 29, 2019)

> 9 hours ago, lake_m said:
> 
> Back together and working with PCB bypassed in full manual mode.


 Wow what a star!!

There's some really good/nice knowledgable folk on here and I'm blessed.

Big up to Andy for his time and effort, what would we do without this forum.

Thanks to Frank also for his input on here.


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## Stox (Jul 19, 2020)

That's good news. I was able to do much the same thing to my E37 (not an E37s) that looks very similar, but I didn't need any jumpers - it was just a matter of re-arranging the existing connectors and taping some redundant wires out of the way once the board had been taken out.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

If anyone spies an Ebay bargain with the same display as this one (not necessarily an E37/s), shout up! We can rob the board from it.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Update&#8230;..

Although the grinder is back with @Gilly I've been doing more testing with the PCB. Using a home made lash-up and a cheap LCD from EBay, the board is functioning OK and switches between modes by simulating button presses - pulling the designated pins to ground. So from that I can only assume that the fault is actually on the membrane keypad itself, which connects to the PCB via a ribbon cable. My guess is that one or more of the tiny SMD coupling caps on the double/single buttons has shorted to ground (PCB thinks button is pressed) causing the grinder to go into forced manual mode. (To get the grinder into manual dose mode you hold both the single and double buttons down together).

And the reason the grinder isn't spinning is because the PCB 'thinks' the buttons are still be held down so won't 'do' anything until released. 
Should be a relatively straightforward fix if we can get the keypad off. Whether it's worth doing or not is up to @Gilly and does come with some risk involved in getting the keypad off (it's glued on).

BTW - I priced up a new keypad&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;around £300!!!!!!

Very frustrating considering the high value of the grinder and low cost of the electrical components involved.


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