# First Impressions: Eureka Helios 80



## Philip HN (Nov 7, 2019)

Hello all

Now that I have had three days to play with the Helios 80 I thought I should try to describe how it has been. I should say straight up that my benchmarks are very limited: this is only my third grinder - my previous grinders were a Rancilio Rocky and a Mazzer Super Jolly Electronic - so the things that matter to me are mostly reflective of the things that have irritated me in the past and which may not be important to you. People with much more experience than me are likely to have a different set of benchmarks and priorities.

The first impressions of the Helios is that it is big and beautiful. While (hopper aside) it is not significantly taller than my Mazzer, it's overall shape looks and feels much bigger on account of being broader and deeper especially at the top. It has lovely lines and a very tactile finish. It weighs 35.5 lbs or 15.2k and it looks it. It is actually rather huggable (no I haven't).

The touch screen interface is excellent, there is absolutely no lag and the menu system is nicely intuitive, allowing for three pre-programmed (by time) grinds and a continuous grind setting. Pre-programmed settings can be locked. The display brightness and colour scheme (choice of blue, green, yellow and red) can be changed and the sub menus include a comprehensive counter history.

Grinding is a joy, although it takes a bit of time to adjust to a world in which all of your ground coffee emerges more-or-less immediately. Or at least that is how it feels because the 19g dose I am currently using takes 2.55 seconds to grind. This is tricky to get used to if only because I have been in the habit of placing a dosing funnel on my portafilter but the helios does not have the space available between the (adjustable for rake) shute exit and the portafilter supporting forks. The forks can be raised and lowered and may be removable but I haven't tried: I'm just getting used to taking a bit more care with how I position my basket under the shute, which also has its own light.

Grind adjustment is incredibly easy, especially after the Mazzer. The adjustment knob has just the right weight to it and all that matters is that you remember which direction you are supposed to be turning it in (the lower/"smaller" the number, the finer the grind). The fact that the adjustment raises and lowers the bottom burr is also a huge deal for me, although other Eureka owners probably take that for granted. Cleaning will no longer require recalibration from scratch. And what comes out of the grinder can only be described as a big fluffy mountain of coffee. There is no clumping at all.

I would love to be able to say lots about the impact of the Helios on what happens in the cup, but I don't have the language skills or palate experience to do that justice. Sufficient to say that my current coffee is Formula 6 from James Gourmet Coffee and switching from the Mazzer to the Helios has made me immediately decide that I need to buy more of the Formula 6. I was enjoying it before but now there is a complexity and depth to the espresso which is new to me and I love it.

As I mentioned in one of my earlier posts, the grinder cannot function without a hopper in position. The top plate or collar which is retained by magnets has a slot on one side (see my photos) which contains a microswitch which is engaged by a moulded lug on the side of the hopper funnel. If you switch on the machine without a hopper in place, the on/off switch on the bottom right hand side of the grinder lights up but the touch screen remains dark and so no grinding is possible. Insert the hopper and the screen comes to life and the grinder is ready to go.

Lets talk retention, because I haven't read anything yet about how the Helios performs in that department. So this morning I ran the grinder to empty. I noted that there was almost no popcorning: one tiny piece of coffee did one circuit of the bottom of the hopper and disappeared. I then removed the top burr and weighed everything I found in the burr chamber and in the shute. The top burr carrier has an internal ledge (see photo) which was carrying 0.49g of assorted material, what I would describe as bits and pieces (including quite large ones) which had obviously not passed between the burrs but which had probably exited back up towards the hopper in a part-ground state. There was nothing significant in the burr chamber, but the grinder shute contained 4.77g of ground coffee. I recognise that this could be a big deal for some people but I have never been too bothered about the need to purge my grinder between bean changes or first thing in tne morning. I therefore intend to set my pre-programmed single dose to 0.5 seconds and will use that to do the necessary.

And now to the one thing that I don't think is quite right about the Helios. That microswitch. I do understand the safety considerations behind the use of a switch linked to the presence of a hopper, but there is a strong whiff of afterthought about the way it has been located. See my photos, but when you lift off the beautifully machined top cover, you find that your instinct to place it to one side is thwarted by wires which have been positioned with a pair of clips around the top of the grinder. The wires run to to microswitch which is located in the cover. So now you have to pull the cable out of the switches and you see that there is an in-line plug which once undone should allow you to remove the cover. Except that you have the cover (with its rounded but still vaguely sharpish corners and edges) still in your hand and threatening to scratch the body of the grinder. I ended up wrapping the cover in a tea towel and placing it on the hopper next to the grinder. I then spent a fruitless 5 minutes trying to separate the on-line plug before giving up. Maybe I was missing something (and I'm not without experience of messing around inside computers and cars) but I couldn't disconnect it. But with the cover to one side I was perfectly well able to remove the top burr and had I needed to, I could have cleaned the burrs without any problem. But I would have much preferred to just lift off the cover and put it down.

The only other very minor issue is also linked to the microswitch but to do with the fact that the grinder cover is magnetised. I do actually really like that Eureka use magnets but unless you are machining to very high tolerances, something that is attached to something else with magnets is likely to be capable of being moved. And so it is with the grinder cover. Push it to the right and it will move a few thousands of an inch. And the screen will switch off. Push it back and the screen will come back on. You do need to reach out and engage with the cover and push it deliberately to cause this to happen: it does not do it otherwise. But if you are reinserting a hopper and the screen does not come on, this is the likely cause. Push the cover to the left and it will move fractionally and the screen will wake up.

I think this covers off my first impressions. I hope any of you thinking about the Helios finds it interesting. Microswitch wiring aside, it is a lovely machine and I am still very smitten.


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## B-Roadie (Feb 29, 2016)

Looks like an awesome bit of kit, glad you're happy with the results. Certainly fast!

Micro switch does appear to be a little odd in its positioning, it could have been placed in the bottom half of the unit and actuated through the top but the switch itself not actually in the top.

I like your idea of setting your single dose to a purge setting. Never thought of that.

I am curious to see if they come out with a compatible ~250-350g hopper to drop the overall height.

Can you grind hands free with a bottomless PF?


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## Philip HN (Nov 7, 2019)

I've seen somewhere this morning that made reference to a smaller capacity hopper for the Helios, but now I can't find it and there's nothing mentioned on the Eureka site. Maybe I dreamed it.. It seems more than likely that there will be one.

And as to hands free...


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## B-Roadie (Feb 29, 2016)

Nice one, thank you.

That sure is a decent dose in 2.5s 😳


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## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

It's probably easy to deactivate that microswitch.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

Thanks for the review

I picked up one yesterday

I noticed that my top plate is not magnetic. It has a single screw.

Very strange because most online videos show a magnetic top plate.


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## WillC (Dec 9, 2014)

hedonist222 said:


> Thanks for the review
> 
> I picked up one yesterday
> 
> ...


 The one i bought in September wasn't magnetic either. Must have changed the design


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## Geezercdg (Dec 29, 2018)

hedonist222 said:


> Thanks for the review
> 
> I picked up one yesterday
> 
> ...


 How are you getting on with it? I'm torn between this and the Specialita.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Geezercdg said:


> How are you getting on with it? I'm torn between this and the Specialita.


 Buy the Helios. They are miles apart. The Helios is huge, it's a beast, and has 83mm burrs. The Specialita only goes up to 75mm burrs - providing you are talking about the Atom. The Mignon Specialita it's 55mm. I've used the Helios at BB it's great. But do bear in mind its size!


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## Geezercdg (Dec 29, 2018)

Yes I was referring to the Mignon Specialita. The helios I was going to go for was the 65, but it's so big. I'm upgrading from a sage oracle (thought I'd do the grinder first!) Then Im after something decent but not sure what yet, possibly up to 2k. So open to ideas for that too.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Geezercdg said:


> Yes I was referring to the Mignon Specialita. The helios I was going to go for was the 65, but it's so big. I'm upgrading from a sage oracle (thought I'd do the grinder first!) Then Im after something decent but not sure what yet, possibly up to 2k. So open to ideas for that too.


 I'm not sure the overall size change significantly as a function of the size of the burrs. 🙂 - I think the Helios will be better, no doubt about that. But it will be like buying a VW Polo or a VW Passat? - Different things, very different things 🙂


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

Geezercdg said:


> How are you getting on with it? I'm torn between this and the Specialita.


 I had some terribly large clumping.

I use a naked portafilter - the extraction was absurd.

Spewing, spattering, and spraying all over.

I ended up picking up that need thing to break up clumps.

I was VERY unhappy having to add a step to my process.

Especially since I useda Sette 270 for 1.5 years. I realize the sette is a vertical chute, but someone, please remind me why I paid much more to upgrade to the Helios 80?

I'm not being sarcastic.

Since then I've ground about 4 or 5 kilos and the clumping reduced but it still there.

I need to use a pick to break up the clumps otherwise I'll have two or three streams of coffee extraction with torrential sprays.


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## B-Roadie (Feb 29, 2016)

Have you tried a different coffee?

What else is in your workflow? Are you using a distributor or leveller before tamping? What machine are you using?


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

B-Roadie said:


> Have you tried a different coffee?
> 
> What else is in your workflow? Are you using a distributor or leveller before tamping? What machine are you using?


 I always get 4 different beans 250 grams each.

Clumps the same.

I grind 20 grams and try to extract within 30 seconds.

So much clumping.

So much spraying while extracting.

With my sette,I use a leveled only and it was bliss. Frankly the leveler was unnecessary.

Now I have to use the needle thing to break up the massive clumps.

I'm using my almost two year old rocket Appartamento.

What do you mean by workflow?


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## Rincewind (Aug 25, 2020)

hedonist222 said:


> ...What do you mean by workflow?...


 Your coffee making process...i.e. Switch machine on, grind beans, fill porta-filter, distribute with distribution-tool, level, tamp, fit porta-filter to machine, steam milk, extract coffee etc. etc. .....each person's workflow is unique to them; usually.....some may have an identical workflow to someone else.


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## Philip HN (Nov 7, 2019)

hedonist222 said:


> I had some terribly large clumping.
> 
> I use a naked portafilter - the extraction was absurd.


 I'm surprised. I got almost no clumping straight out of the box; I also use a bottomless portafilter but once I had sorted out my puck preparation, channelling became a rare thing. I put that down to three things, firstly I'd had very similar problems to yours after buying my first bottomless portafilter. My grinder then was a Mazzer Super Jolly. So bad was the experience that I went back to my old portafilter. But then I did some research and upgraded the basket to an 18g Baristpro from IMS which had much straighter sides. That made a considerable difference. Then after acquiring the Helios I stumbled upon a YouTube film about dosing cups and was sufficiently intrigued to give that a try (my Mazzer had always clumped badly so my workflow included use of a funnel and a homemade distribution tool which out of habit I still used after the Helios arrived). Anyway, the dosing cup was a revelation: it seemed to take all the inconsistency out and I haven't looked back (if you're not in the UK my post on that will be of limited use but see it on this forum under "dosing cup hack"). I should add that I do use a basic Motta levelling tool prior to tamping.

The third thing was was perseverance... As I said, I had bought my bottomless portafilter while I still had my old Mazzer and the experience of moving from my old portafilter had been a disaster. I'd been making espresso for decades so got very fed up very quickly. But after a time I decided that it had to be something I was doing, so I started the research that ended up with me changing the basket, then after the Helios came, starting to use the cup. I honestly can't remember when I last experienced channelling. That's not me being smug; the wall next to where the Mazzer used to sit has forehead shaped indentations in the plaster. But I got there.


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## John Yossarian (Feb 2, 2016)

This grinder has the look and obviously does the job as intended. I might have missed it but has anyone mentioned what retention it has compared to other grinders?


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

When I used one at Bella Barista, the Helios had no clumps. Just a perfect mound of grind coffee, dispensed in something silly like 3 seconds. Doses were incredibly consistent too.


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## BlackCatCoffee (Apr 11, 2017)

I wonder if the clump smasher is missing off the chute on your Helios @hedonist222?


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

Rumpelstiltskin said:


> Your coffee making process...i.e. Switch machine on, grind beans, fill porta-filter, distribute with distribution-tool, level, tamp, fit porta-filter to machine, steam milk, extract coffee etc. etc. .....each person's workflow is unique to them; usually.....some may have an identical workflow to someone else.


 My coffee machine is turned on an hour before use.

I turn on the grinder, push the grind button and grind.

There are clumbs. I'll use a clump disperser thing and then use a leveler to level the grounds. Then I'll tamp it.

Then put in the grouphead and extract.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

Philip HN said:


> I'm surprised. I got almost no clumping straight out of the box; I also use a bottomless portafilter but once I had sorted out my puck preparation, channelling became a rare thing. I put that down to three things, firstly I'd had very similar problems to yours after buying my first bottomless portafilter. My grinder then was a Mazzer Super Jolly. So bad was the experience that I went back to my old portafilter. But then I did some research and upgraded the basket to an 18g Baristpro from IMS which had much straighter sides. That made a considerable difference. Then after acquiring the Helios I stumbled upon a YouTube film about dosing cups and was sufficiently intrigued to give that a try (my Mazzer had always clumped badly so my workflow included use of a funnel and a homemade distribution tool which out of habit I still used after the Helios arrived). Anyway, the dosing cup was a revelation: it seemed to take all the inconsistency out and I haven't looked back (if you're not in the UK my post on that will be of limited use but see it on this forum under "dosing cup hack"). I should add that I do use a basic Motta levelling tool prior to tamping.
> 
> The third thing was was perseverance... As I said, I had bought my bottomless portafilter while I still had my old Mazzer and the experience of moving from my old portafilter had been a disaster. I'd been making espresso for decades so got very fed up very quickly. But after a time I decided that it had to be something I was doing, so I started the research that ended up with me changing the basket, then after the Helios came, starting to use the cup. I honestly can't remember when I last experienced channelling. That's not me being smug; the wall next to where the Mazzer used to sit has forehead shaped indentations in the plaster. But I got there.


 I use two baskets.
Either my 18 g or my 20. Both IMS.

And again, with my sette 270 wi, I never had clumping.

So I don't think its the basket.

Its the excessive clumping.

Here is a photograph from early on:


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

BlackCatCoffee said:


> I wonder if the clump smasher is missing off the chute on your Helios @hedonist222?


 Maybe?

I need to find out


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## Rincewind (Aug 25, 2020)

Philip HN said:


> ...the wall next to where the Mazzer used to sit has *forehead shaped indentations* in the plaster...


 oh dear...


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## Philip HN (Nov 7, 2019)

John Yossarian said:


> This grinder has the look and obviously does the job as intended. I might have missed it but has anyone mentioned what retention it has compared to other grinders?


 I can't speak for the retention of other grinders not designed to be single dose, but my Helios 80 retains 4g.


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## RobDGio (Jun 17, 2020)

Are you single dosing? Not saying this is the reason but wondering if not having the weight of a full hopper could be causing this clumping??


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

RobDGio said:


> Are you single dosing? Not saying this is the reason but wondering if not having the weight of a full hopper could be causing this clumping??


 Yes, single dosing.

18 to 20 grams.

Primarily because I use different beans and only have an espresso or two per day. Leaving anything in the hopper means I either take it all out to change beans. Plus it'll go stale because I average 140 grams per week.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

hedonist222 said:


> Yes, single dosing.
> 
> 18 to 20 grams.
> 
> Primarily because I use different beans and only have an espresso or two per day. Leaving anything in the hopper means I either take it all out to change beans. Plus it'll go stale because I average 140 grams per week.


 Did you try filling the hopper with at least 150g of beans, or maybe more, and see if the clumping goes away? Otherwise you are not using the grinder as intended, as it's not a single dose grinder.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Did you try filling the hopper with at least 150g of beans, or maybe more, and see if the clumping goes away? Otherwise you are not using the grinder as intended, as it's not a single dose grinder.


 fair

ill try that


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

hedonist222 said:


> fair
> 
> ill try that


 Yeah, do try that. Empty 250g on the hopper and see if improves over a few days. Main issue with flat burrs as such is that they are designed to operate with a weight of beans on the chamber, so it keeps things consistent. You'll find that you'll need to grind much coarser in order to keep the shot time you had before. That alone will most likely eliminate static clumping.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

Yes, I noticed grinding coarser yielded virtually no clumping.

But then any suggestions on how to rotate between beans on a daily basis?

And a 250 gram bag of coffee lasts me about two weeks.

Beans will definitely go stale in that long in the hopper?

Also, how do I go about grinding exactly 18 or 20 grams with the Helios 80?

Other than weighing the portafilter ? Then adding or culling.

Because on the Sette 270wi, I had a built in scale.

Thank.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

hedonist222 said:


> Yes, I noticed grinding coarser yielded virtually no clumping.
> 
> But then any suggestions on how to rotate between beans on a daily basis?
> 
> ...


 It feels to me... You are using the wrong tool for the job. The Helios is a commercial grinder. A big beast. It has a pretty accurate timed dose feature when used as intended. You want to use the Helios as not intended and expect it to perform miracles. You should buy a single dose grinder, or another Sette. 🙂

The only way to rotate beans on a daily basis is to empty the hopper and the end of the day. But, consequently, you'll need to purge until the new beans are in, which is rather wasteful.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

Purge some new beans or purge without beans in the hopper/chamber? Till nothing comes out.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

hedonist222 said:


> Purge some new beans or purge without beans in the hopper/chamber? Till nothing comes out.


 You need to purge with beans in the hopper so they push the old beans out. You can spin the burrs without beans in the hopper, but some will remain in there.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

I tried filling the hopper and grinding - still clumping.

I tried at least 100 grams worth of beans.


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## John Yossarian (Feb 2, 2016)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> It feels to me... You are using the wrong tool for the job. The Helios is a commercial grinder. A big beast. It has a pretty accurate timed dose feature when used as intended. You want to use the Helios as not intended and expect it to perform miracles. You should buy a single dose grinder, or another Sette. 🙂
> 
> The only way to rotate beans on a daily basis is to empty the hopper and the end of the day. But, consequently, you'll need to purge until the new beans are in, which is rather wasteful.


 This problem stands not only with Helios but all commercial grinders on demand that people are trying to "tame" and turn them into a single-dose grinders.

I modified a Mythos, another beasty grinder for home use, by cutting a plastic bottle that fits the hopper outlet, adding a heavy load (with the shape of the bottle I have used) that I place on top of the beans (to ensure the gravity push) and I add around 100-120 g that goes through for a couple of days. I tried using it for a single dose by weighing the beans and run it for longer until no beans were left but somehow (reading about people's experience) I decided against it. Currently I get great consistency, plus/minus 0.2g per go when I grind 18 g which is not that bad.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

John Yossarian said:


> This problem stands not only with Helios but all commercial grinders on demand that people are trying to "tame" and turn them into a single-dose grinders.
> 
> I modified a Mythos, another beasty grinder for home use, by cutting a plastic bottle that fits the hopper outlet, adding a heavy load (with the shape of the bottle I have used) that I place on top of the beans (to ensure the gravity push) and I add around 100-120 g that goes through for a couple of days. I tried using it for a single dose by weighing the beans and run it for longer until no beans were left but somehow (reading about people's experience) I decided against it. Currently I get great consistency, plus/minus 0.2g per go when I grind 18 g which is not that bad.


 in my post above yours - I mention that I filled the hopper with 250 grams

and I extracted about 100 grams

2 x 20 g individually

then a whole 60 grams

clumping with the hopper filled


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

hedonist222 said:


> clumping with the hopper filled


 How long have you used it like so? Did you check whether it has improved after a couple of days without removing the hopper from the grinder?


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> How long have you used it like so? Did you check whether it has improved after a couple of days without removing the hopper from the grinder?


 I filled the hopper

extracted those 100 grams within a minute

then removed the beans from the hopper

How will having it in there for days be different than extracting 100 grams on the spot?


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

hedonist222 said:


> How will having it in there for days be different than extracting 100 grams on the spot?


 I don't know exactly how the clump crusher mechanism works on that particular grinder. But my understanding, generally speaking, is that the grinds compact behind the clump crusher/anti-static screen and then the new grinds push that compacted grinds through. If you remove the hopper snd in the process clean the chamber thoroughly, then you are not helping much. If you just remove the hopper, replace with other beans and out the hopper back, then it should not make any difference.


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## John Yossarian (Feb 2, 2016)

hedonist222 said:


> I filled the hopper
> 
> extracted those 100 grams within a minute
> 
> ...


 By picking up a bit of moisture from the air in the room for example.

Is it possible to take pictures to visualise the extent of clumping so everyone is on the same page?


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

Here's a video and a photograph:


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

But the hopper is empty, or very close? Dump 250g of beans in it and use all up like that and see what happens. Remember, those are commercial grinders. You are not using it as by design.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

It's your clump crusher in place , it is knackered and needs replacing ?

These had a very short shelf life or were quite flimsy on the early mythos models.

Is it actually a problem when you are pulling tasting a shot , or is it just visually unappealing ?

Other than that stir it .

Conversely my niche which is a single dose grinder but is not designed to grind into a pf , actually gives a clump free dose into the pf , better than nearly any other grinder ive owned.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Mrboots2u said:


> Conversely my niche which is a single dose grinder but is not designed to grind into a pf , actually gives a clump free dose into the pf , better than nearly any other grinder ive owned.


 I agree on that. It does have more static on the Niche, as expected. i.e.: if I* don't* use a PF funnel and grind directly into the PF with the Niche, the grinds spill all over the show.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> But the hopper is empty, or very close? Dump 250g of beans in it and use all up like that and see what happens. Remember, those are commercial grinders. You are not using it as by design.


 Yes, it was empty in the video/photo.

But its like this even with the hopper with 250 grams.

I'll try the 250 grams with cheaper coffee soon.

When I used it by design - it still clumped.


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## hedonist222 (Apr 19, 2020)

Mrboots2u said:


> It's your clump crusher in place , it is knackered and needs replacing ?
> 
> These had a very short shelf life or were quite flimsy on the early mythos models.
> 
> ...


 This machine is about two months old.

Its been clumping from day one.

People said the burrs/chamber need to break in.
I assumed by chamber break in, they meant it needs some retained coffee to occupy some space before it stops sending out clumps.

Its a major problem if it I dont break the clumps, there are several streams from my naked portafilter & massive spraying/spewing.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

hedonist222 said:


> This machine is about two months old.
> 
> Its been clumping from day one.
> 
> ...


 Your clump crusher could have been defective from day one


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## B-Roadie (Feb 29, 2016)

Mrboots2u said:


> Your clump crusher could have been defective from day one


 It's worth a look. Get the top off and take a look at what's going on.


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