# Gaggia Classic Pro new starter advice please



## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Firstly, I have lurked and read many useful threads, but my issues don't seem to be quite covered, so here goes.

I have my new Gaggia Classic Pro 2019 and I'm waiting for a proper grinder - it's stuck in Hong Kong. In the meantime I've shifted from Illy pre-ground to putting some other (cafetiere) pre-ground coffee through my Hario slim mini to play around. I've fitted the Shades 9-bar spring, which helped a lot, and I can get reasonable shot times, quite nice looking spent pucks, and I'm drinking them, so it's a start. I'm using a bottomless portafilter (also from Shades) with the original traditional single and double baskets, looks okay, no spurting. Can't wait to start grinding fresh roast beans, but not with the Hario slim, not in one go...

I tamp flat and after extraction pucks come out slightly concave - is that normal?

The double basket seems to extract uniformly with a nice even coloured puck. The single looks to be a mix of under and over extracted - the one in the photo was sitting on the knock box and caught my eye for the dark zone where I suppose not much flow had bothered to go?









I'm interested to persevere with singles and wondered: is this par for the course?

I'm steaming milk in a Motta Tulip 500ml, but I feel it's just still a bit too deep for the reach of the GCP wand, at least for steaming for a single cup, so I already want something a little smaller, maybe 350ml? Does anyone who's persisting with the standard quite short wand have a particular jug recommendation?

I bought a blind basket for back-flushing, but it doesn't fit and got stuck on the head block - see picture! The headblock measures at 58.4mm across, but the shallow blind basket was only 58.2mm approaching the bottom, hence the issue.









Does anyone have a recommendation for a blind basket for GCP?

And finally, yuck. Today I pulled the tank and there was small dead moth floating in it. Has anyone else had this?

I see there's a big ( >6mm tall) letterbox gap between the top of the tank and the stainless body. Maybe the critter got in that way, or maybe through the vents at the back? Thinking about a pickup filter just in case (https://www.lsengineers.co.uk/stainless-steel-suction-filter-6mm-hose-tail.html) and/or putting something under the tank to close up that gap, or even adding a bugscreen round the back - more essential mods?


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## Evergreen88 (Jun 7, 2021)

Welcome to the forum

I also got a GCP, in 2020. Personally I gave up on the single basket, it never produces a great shot and it's too difficult to tune.

When I steam milk just for myself I use a 350ml jug, when I want to do 2 drinks at the same time I use a 600ml one. Personally I don't get to the bottom of the jug with the wand so I never found a problem with it, but perhaps my technique is wrong!

Also never had any problem with bugs, but I can see that the 'letterbox gap' is actually there.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@bbstrikesagain a lot of people believe espresso machine tanks are self cleaning, because the water is topped up, or changed, so often. I clean mine with dish soap every week.


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

DavecUK said:


> @bbstrikesagain a lot of people believe espresso machine tanks are self cleaning, because the water is topped up, or changed, so often. I clean mine with dish soap every week.


 Haha, yes, but not in this case.

Think I've only had it just over a month, cleaned most weeks, but that's a few days of floaty bug. Did it add mouthfeel? Not that I could tell! Just a little extra body...

I had a good look at the machine and the big 6x200mm opening at the front had to have been the culprit so I've put pads under the tank to practically close that off:









Other route in are fairly tight clearances around the inlet and OPV pipes and the fill funnel. Seems less likely the devil was inside the upper casing and found one of those ways out?

Anyhow, belt and braces:


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Evergreen88 said:


> Welcome to the forum
> 
> I also got a GCP, in 2020. Personally I gave up on the single basket, it never produces a great shot and it's too difficult to tune.
> 
> ...


 Thanks.

I'm not trying to get to the bottom, it's just that for the Lance Hedrick half and quarter (big hand at three o'clock) tip position, which is otherwise great, my jug is slightly too tall, or wand too short, for a single macchiato or small cappuccino. I don't know if I need a smaller jug so much as a slightly shorter one. Not sure how much shorter a 350ml is, but it has to be a step in the right direction right?

I'm moving towards 14-15g in the double basket, and ditching the 7-8g in the single too, unless I come across a coffee with a wide enough window.

Mind the gap


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Blind basket recommendation for GCP anyone? Needs to clear 58.4mm and not get stock on the block.

Or should I use a silicone disc in a regular basket?


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Blanking discs work fine. At least you will know it will fit OK.


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## Stox (Jul 19, 2020)

bbstrikesagain said:


> Blind basket recommendation for GCP anyone? Needs to clear 58.4mm and not get stock on the block.
> 
> Or should I use a silicone disc in a regular basket?


 Part of my backflush routine involves loosening the portafilter with the pump running to allow water to flush out of the sides. This will usually push a slightly oversize blind filter out so it remains with the handle. I think I got a blind basket as part of a cleaning kit from ebay and found it was a better fit than one I had purchased specifically for backflushing, so I use that one now.


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Stox said:


> Part of my backflush routine involves loosening the portafilter with the pump running to allow water to flush out of the sides. This will usually push a slightly oversize blind filter out so it remains with the handle. I think I got a blind basket as part of a cleaning kit from ebay and found it was a better fit than one I had purchased specifically for backflushing, so I use that one now.


 I thought that might be worth a try, but no. My blind basket is so under-size it doesn't fit over the shower head block far enough to seal on the silicone ring above. Even with the lightest PF twist, a few degrees, it got stuck (again). No backflush in evidence, zippo down the vent pipe, because no seal. Pumping did eventually pop it off, but only after filling it with water and piddling over the edge for a good while. Doh.

First little worktop flood... Which is of course what a feared, based ona few reviews, might happen with the silicone discs.

So, 58.38mm shower head








into a blind basket that tapers rapidly to 58.26 mm, will not go...









So, still wondering if there is a known source of blinds that will fit (surely I can't be the only one) or if a silicone disc is the only answer?


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Still waiting for the "don't back-flush that, it'll go back in the boiler mate". No. It won't.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

I had a gaggia Classic in the past. A box standard E61 blind basket fits just fine. I don't understand what the issue is.

also, you need an 8.5mm gasket, blue. From the picture above, you have a 8mm gasket, red. Wrong gasket.

if your shower head is 58.35mm, according to your measurements&#8230; and baskets are usually&#8230; 58.5mm inner diameter, there's something wrong somewhere.

The gaggia shower screen is approx. 54mm in diameter, according to this:

https://www.theespressoshop.co.uk/en/GB/IMS-Gaggia-Precision-Shower-Screen-ø-55mm---GA200IM/m-2010.aspx?PartnerID=22&utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=UnitedKingdom&gclid=CjwKCAjwybyJBhBwEiwAvz4G72r33rpd0ZmrrHyvFVXQ_2ovlXnnyGRK3Td5QB3pUEqFrresMHe3MBoCiMkQAvD_BwE


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

@MediumRoastSteamThe plot thickens.

That micrometer has proven accurate over the years. My new Gaggia Classic Pro 2019 (RI9480/18) has a shower holder assembly that is essentially *58.4mm* across, give or take 20 microns.

The shower screen is smaller than the block, maybe even 54.7 mm as mentioned in your link, but what surely matters is that the shower block assembly must fit inside the top of the basket.

Now I think I get why 58.4mm tampers are so often mentioned. They will fit any basket that fits the machine head. Surely shower head and tamper are both supposed to be a good fit in the basket?

As for the gasket, I'd go as far as to say the red, as supplied when new, is perfect for the group as originally installed in my machine, especially with the OEM dual spout portafilter. It provides a good seal with the handle shy of 6 o'clock, and did so even when I choked the machine with original OPV. I don't even go to six o'clock. The aftermarket bottomless PF rotates a little further, but seals perfectly at 6 o'clock, especially to at most 9-bar now. I know you're trying to help, and I appreciate it, but while a thicker gasket might be right for other Classics, it seems it's not needed for mine. Did you have a different model? Maybe over the years the group heads Gaggia used have changed, and with it gasket dimensions? Or maybe some folk are using slightly different portafilters needing a thicker gasket? I don't know, but clearly we can't generalise about "Classics".

So, I really don't know why the anonymous ebay blind basket is so much smaller, but for sure it is totally incompatible with my GCP 2019, and I've seen similar comments in Amazon reviews for other "standard" 58mm blind baskets.

Ideally I'd just like a blind back-flush basket that actually fits over the 58.4mm head, as do the three OEM baskets Gaggia supplied, and as does the triple basket Mr Shades supplied with a bottomless portafilter. I'm wary of buying a collection that don't fit.

Failing that, it's rubber disc time, but I can imagine that might not always seal - several reviews suggest it's not plain sailing for everyone, so again, how to locate one that works?


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

The last Classic I refurbished and sold I had to swop the 8.5mm thick group head gasket for an 8mm gasket. I put it down to the form of the basket lid profile allowing lock at

6 o'clock rather than the 'portafilter ear positions. But of course it could be a mixture of the two factors. Different baskets seem to lock at different positions. I also sent the blue 8.5mm thick silicone gasket as a spare, or in case of basket or portafilter change.

I have noticed this previously with 8.5mm seals that usually lock at 7 o'clock on Classics, with the baskets I use, and have tried an 8mm seal previously but locking position was before 5 o'clock so I didn't use it. On the last refurbishment the 8mm thick gasket worked perfectly and locked at 6!

*Edit:* The basket I used with the 8mm group head seal was a VST 18g that locked at 6 o'clock.


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## Stox (Jul 19, 2020)

The blind filter that works best for me came as part of a brush/cleaning set. The specific ebay item isn't available any more but there are lots of others that look identical, e.g.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/254997275769

It measures 58.5x70.1mm (IDxOD) while the 'sticky' basket is more like 58.4x70.7mm, so maybe it was jamming on the internal face as well.

Some 'standard' E61 filter baskets have the same issue, although I don't think I've (knowingly) had one where the internal diameter is too small. IMS and VST have specific baskets in their ranges for Gaggia machines, but I've found that 'standard' La Marzocco baskets (made by VST) fit beautifully.


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Stox said:


> The blind filter that works best for me came as part of a brush/cleaning set. The specific ebay item isn't available any more but there are lots of others that look identical, e.g.
> 
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/254997275769
> 
> ...


 Nailed then. No more than 70.0 externally, no less than 58.5 internally. They have to be out there, but how to source?

I've read that gaggia did widen the block versus previous models, and that commercial may be more like 58.3. So when is "58' not 58? When it's coffee and its really more like 58.5... Seems no one told the factory that churned out my blind.

I haven't dared to order anything direct from the Far East on eBay recently, as I expect to be hit with import duty and the courier's handling fee, so at least another £8-12? Not sure if some packages get through, but the ending of the small value exemption might have created a brief opportunity for couriers to profit massively?

Maybe just buying from one of the UK coffee specialists will ensure it fits real machines, if I can get it past the financial controller


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

@bbstrikesagain - this is some interesting reading for sure. So, is the issue you are having he fact the blind basket is getting stuck after a backflush? Does it get stuck if you don't backflush? I.e.: lock the PF with the basket in place and remove it. What it could be is that it is forming a vacuum (e.g.: solenoid pipe / path partially blocked) and when you try to remove the PF the PF spring is not strong enough and can't keep it with it.

when you brew a double shot, with the stock basket, do you ever get a stuck puck, I.e.: the puck is left behind attached to the shower screen rather than being, as expected, inside the basket?

failing that, I'm clueless.

@ratty makes a good point about gasket vs basket. I think the Gaggia PF has a thick PF rim where the basket sits, and standard E61 baskets will often sit on top of it rather than around it. there's even a thread on this somewhere, in the old classifieds (link below). How do I know? I had the basket, someone bought from me, it didn't fit the Gaggia Classic and I bought it back. 🙂 However, as an example, IMS brochure quotes:








so that *might *explain the reason, if you are not using the original basket, why you need a thinner gasket.

Source: http://www.imsfiltri.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/IMS-Competition-Catalogue.pdf

page 4.

Thread discussing this:

https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/57323-ims-basket-b702th265m-ridged-16-20-gram-%C2%A315-posted-to-uk/?tab=comments&do=embed&comment=809052&embedComment=809052&embedDo=findComment#comment-809052


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## Nightrider_1uk (Apr 26, 2020)

@bbstrikesagain On your second photo, I noticed that you haven't got the vent pipe fitted (nut with hole in it at the bottom left of the photo). Makes more of a mess without it.


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## Dusk (Feb 19, 2021)

I had the same issue with the blind baskets sticking, I couldn't even get the portafilter to lock into place with a "standard" 58mm blind basket. I eventually found a gaggia specific one on eBay that is much deeper and with straighter sides than the generic one you have


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

@MediumRoastSteam and @ratty

Here's my GCP 2019 scenario. Shower plate holder is cylindrical 58.4mm. Depth into basket taper depends on the gasket compression, let's call that depth D. At depth D the basket must be wider than 58.4, and all mine are, except the ebay blind...






​
My ebay blind is only 58.26mm at the bottom of the taper, and I suspect the taper isn't deep enough to accommodate the required D either. It certainly never reached the gasket, sticking instead on the bottom of the shower plate, hence water all over, and blind difficult to remove. It also comes in at around 72mm externally, but surprisingly that wasn't an issue - there's obviously more clearance for external flange on these machines, even though the OEM baskets are only about 68mm external.

Last night I put duct tape over the exit hole in my redundant ORM pressurised (crema perfetta finta?) basket. Small area, not a lot of force. Of course it fitted perfectly. I managed to backflush about 3 times, before the pressure bubbled and split the tape. Tape etc on the inside should hold perfectly, but need to keep it clear of the sides. A possible workaround for sure.

I ordered one more blind this time from bottomlesscoffee and claimed to work with almost anything except Pavoni, so let's see if that is wide and deep enough internally to accommodate the GCP 2019. An 8.5mm gasket would mean I could knock 0.5mm of my need for depth, but I'd then be extracting with handle at 7 o'clock unless I put the 8mm back on, and I'd probably want to up my doses too...


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Dusk said:


> I had the same issue with the blind baskets sticking, I couldn't even get the portafilter to lock into place with a "standard" 58mm blind basket. I eventually found a gaggia specific one on eBay that is much deeper and with straighter sides than the generic one you have


 @DuskHurrah! Thank you. I'm not alone. I don't suppose you can find link from purchase history?


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Nightrider_1uk said:


> @bbstrikesagain On your second photo, I noticed that you haven't got the vent pipe fitted (nut with hole in it at the bottom left of the photo). Makes more of a mess without it.


 @Nightrider_1uk thanks, but I'd just pulled it and the drip tray out to get better access while mopping up...


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

And finally, doh, why didn't I see that @MrShades has it covered?!?!

https://www.shadesofcoffee.co.uk/blind-filter-basket-for-backflushing

If the next one doesn't workout, I think know where to buy one that will!


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## Dusk (Feb 19, 2021)

@bbstrikesagain I've just checked and the ebay seller I used isn't doing them any longer.


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## Stox (Jul 19, 2020)

bbstrikesagain said:


> I haven't dared to order anything direct from the Far East on eBay recently, as I expect to be hit with import duty and the courier's handling fee, so at least another £8-12? Not sure if some packages get through, but the ending of the small value exemption might have created a brief opportunity for couriers to profit massively?


 Ebay prices are the price you pay, at least on low value items. You could certainly order the item I linked without worrying about additional costs. When you place an order you will notice that the reported item price is *lower* than price you have paid: this takes account of VAT that Ebay handles on your behalf. I believe this also works for Alibaba but I've never tried ordering from there.


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Stox said:


> Ebay prices are the price you pay, at least on low value items. You could certainly order the item I linked without worrying about additional costs. When you place an order you will notice that the reported item price is *lower* than price you have paid: this takes account of VAT that Ebay handles on your behalf. I believe this also works for Alibaba but I've never tried ordering from there.


 Thanks for that, good to know. I hadn't realised they were now charging the VAT. That's good news on small items, as no risk of being hit with the £8-12 duty handling fee from the courier. I just read up on it, it seems the only case that might throw people is auctions, you bid net, but pay inclusive. I ordered the next blind from a UK specialist, prefer to when possible


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## bbstrikesagain (Aug 15, 2021)

Blind basket from the bottomlesscoffeeshop.co.uk arrived today. Perfect fit over shower head and in portafilter. Should've gone with a survivor company to stay with. Mr Shades must be good too as they have the same legend as his 21g basket that comes with the bottomless PF, and he's a bit of a gaggia specialist. So, just avoid nameless sellers on ebay/amazon...


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