# Machine tripping fuse board



## GingerBen

This morning the rocket has caused the fuse to trip under the stairs. I will obviously get an electrician to come and have a look but is this fairly common with espresso machines or is there something easy I can do to fix it or test it?


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## Tsangpa

It's probably an earthing problem, that's usually the cause of trips. Check the plug or inside the carcass of the machine for any loose wires.


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## Tsangpa

or bits of metal touching terminals where the wires are attached, or bits of water


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## GingerBen

Will do thanks


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## DavecUK

GingerBen said:


> This morning the rocket has caused the fuse to trip under the stairs. I will obviously get an electrician to come and have a look but is this fairly common with espresso machines or is there something easy I can do to fix it or test it?


When you say get an electrician to come and look at it, do you mean the machine or the fuse box?

When you say the fuse do you mean the fuse, or do you mean any whole house RCD?

Is the fuse a standard MCB or RCCBO?

If it's an RCD tripping does this nuisance trip occasionally, when you plug the rocket in, or when you switch the Rocket on?

Has the Rocket ever "tripped the whatever it's tripped" before?


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## GingerBen

DavecUK said:


> When you say get an electrician to come and look at it, do you mean the machine or the fuse box?
> 
> When you say the fuse do you mean the fuse, or do you mean any whole house RCD?
> 
> Is the fuse a standard MCB or RCCBO?
> 
> If it's an RCD tripping does this nuisance trip occasionally, when you plug the rocket in, or when you switch the Rocket on?
> 
> Has the Rocket ever "tripped the whatever it's tripped" before?


sorry my technical language isn't great I know. It's tripping the circuit that a few other things are connected to such as the fridge, oven, radio in the kitchen. It's been working fine where it is the last week or so but today after being turned on for about 5 minutes the trip switch went and all those appliances turned off. I wondered if it might be the machine as it's the new boy to the kitchen so left that turned off and the trip switch was fine and all was working. Turn the rocket back on and it all tripped again. This is the first time it's happened in around 4 weeks of using it.

By electrician I mean my neighbour who is a sparky and will be able to tell me if there is anything going on with the fuse board


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## GingerBen

Tiny bit bit damp inside the machine on the bottom but all connections from the power cable look solid and aren't loose or corroded.


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## jj-x-ray

My classic tripped the RCDs when the ceramic insulator bit of the heater element got damp during a dismantling and clean. It was enough to leak voltage to the body, RCDs only need a tiny leak to trip. I don't know if the rocket has similar elements?


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## 9719

Not related but worth checking just incase, new cooker, use oven, turn off, within 5mins rcd trips. Cooker checked twice, no probs found, turns out the rcd in the fuse box was nacked, replaced by sparky all's been well since.


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## GingerBen

********** said:


> Not related but worth checking just incase, new cooker, use oven, turn off, within 5mins rcd trips. Cooker checked twice, no probs found, turns out the rcd in the fuse box was nacked, replaced by sparky all's been well since.


Thanks. My neighbour said he would check ours as he's replaced a few on our estate recently that are all getting to the same age and some are failing.


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## GingerBen

Would it be daft to blast a hairdryer around the damp areas to dry them out? Not on really hot of course.


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## MildredM

I would dry it out, yes, then examine closely to see why it has some dampness. Is anything leaking slightly, or a spill when filling maybe?


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## GingerBen

MildredM said:


> I would dry it out, yes, then examine closely to see why it has some dampness. Is anything leaking slightly, or a spill when filling maybe?


I wondered if it was a spilling fill. Weird how it worked fine yesterday though and then flicked it on today and it's not working. Haven't filled it during that time but it's still possible I suppose. Will get the hair dryer out!


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## El carajillo

If it is DAMP inside the machine , where is it coming from? As stated above it only requires a very small amount of moisture to allow the electricity to track giving the result you are getting. Have your sparky check the circuit breaker but find out where the moisture is coming from inside your machine.

Another photo of damp spot ?


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## DavecUK

I'm still not getting the answers I need.

Is it an RCD that is tripping or an MCB, or RCCBO?

Clear photo of fuse box, arrow to what is tripping will tell me....and might save you time and money.


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## GingerBen

DavecUK said:


> I'm still not getting the answers I need.
> 
> Is it an RCD that is tripping or an MCB, or RCCBO?
> 
> Clear photo of fuse box, arrow to what is tripping will tell me....and might save you time and money.


sorry Dave. It's the RCD in the picture below that is tripping


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## GingerBen

El carajillo said:


> If it is DAMP inside the machine , where is it coming from? As stated above it only requires a very small amount of moisture to allow the electricity to track giving the result you are getting. Have your sparky check the circuit breaker but find out where the moisture is coming from inside your machine.
> 
> Another photo of damp spot ?


ive had a look and can't see any water dripping or evidence of it so I'm thinking filling spill. I'll get it dry and see what happens


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## DavecUK

Disconnect the heating element wires to the service boiler(make sure ends are not shorted against metal or eachother....start the machine and let it run up to temp, see if it trips, reconnect em and do the same with the brew boiler heating element. If it trips on both elements whichever is disconnected...check out the SSRs in the machine and limit stats for arcing/damage.

If it does trip on one or other element, it still could be the specific element or the circuit associated with that element e.g. SSR or limit stat.

These are easy first steps to do. If the RCD has not had any history of "nuisance tripping"..... tripping for no reason ie no blown bulbs, no damaged appliances. Then RCD replacement is probably unnecessary.

As an aside examining the photo, I can't see if the RCD is 60A or 80A. If it is 60A, then I would recommend if replacing you replace with one of a higher value (80 ir 100 amp)....as it looks like it protects all the circuits in your house. Straight RCDs have a rating, but it's a current carrying rating NOT a trip rating (IT WONT LIMIT CURRENT!)....unless they are RCCBOs. This means if you have say an electric cooker, electric power shower and some heaters plugged in, you could draw some 50 amps. Which although within a 60A RCDs limits, will probably shorten it's life. Electricians like to use something called Diversity which calculates the average load, but with an RCD you know better than anyone what's likely to be the max draw in your house. Although most things are fine with the Diversity calculation applied for loading...I personally don't believe RCDs are and last/work better somewhat below their maximum current carrying capacity. The higher capacity RCDs are around £25 and really have little price difference to lower capacity ones.

P.S. I am not a qualified electrician


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## GingerBen

Thanks Dave, as it happens it seems drying it out with the hair dryer has worked well and I'm back in business. If it happens again I will refer back to your post and follow those steps. Thanks.


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## MildredM

The 11th CoffMandment: Thou shalt not spill when filling the tank !


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## GingerBen

MildredM said:


> The 11th CoffMandment: Thou shalt not spill when filling the tank !


Indeed! Hopefully that's all it was and I'm good to go from here. Was fun taking it apart and having a nose around though, good chance to give the external panels a good polish too so it's now mega shiny and working!


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## DavecUK

GingerBen said:


> Indeed! Hopefully that's all it was and I'm good to go from here. Was fun taking it apart and having a nose around though, good chance to give the external panels a good polish too so it's now mega shiny and working!


Excellent news and if your neighbour is a sparky and the RCD is 60 amp, I am sure he can come over and replace it in 5 minutes. it's simply a din rail clip in and a few wires to connect...but like I say get an 80 amp or more.


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## GingerBen

DavecUK said:


> Excellent news and if your neighbour is a sparky and the RCD is 60 amp, I am sure he can come over and replace it in 5 minutes. it's simply a din rail clip in and a few wires to connect...but like I say get an 80 amp or more.


just had a look, it's an 80


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## DavecUK

GingerBen said:


> just had a look, it's an 80


Then yer good...the camera, or it might be my eyes...not so much.


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## jrling

I've just had a similar experience with my ECM Giotto Classic (2006) - still going strong!

Went away for a few days and turned the central heating off. Came back and turned on the Giotto and it immediately tripped the master RCD protecting the whole house. Repeated several times with same result. Actually, to be entirely accurate, it tripped about a second after turning on the switch, just after I heard a relay clicking, which I guess is turning on the boiler heating element.

When I opened it up, there was no sign of any water leak or water in the bottom of the case. But then I saw that several metal parts were beaded in condensation. Whipped out my hot air gun on lowest setting and gave it a few minutes of hot air to dry off the condensation and that did the trick. Result.

So it must have got a thin layer of water condensation on some exposed metal electrical terminals (caused by the cold temperature in the house) which was causing a short to earth and the sensitive RCD (30mA 80A) picked that up as a fault and tripped.


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