# My Oracle Adventure



## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

I recently purchased the Oracle by Sage. As I posted in my introduction post, I am not new to coffee but I'm new to good coffee.

On this thread I intend to log my progress, good, bad and ugly. I hope to create useful dialogue between sage and non sage owners to try and improve my skills and enjoyment whilst giving others an idea of the pros and cons of the machine. I'm sure all machines have quirks and as I improve it will be interesting to see what this ones are.

I'll attempt to give as much information as I can, with reference to dose (it can vary slightly with this m/c I have noticed), yield (I'm thinking best by weight), shot time, maybe length if time machine has been on, coffee beans, age etc etc. Basically a thorough overall view of coffee making on this machine.

I have only tried a few shots so far and I'm currently on holiday so not much in the way of brewing at the moment but all that will change on my return to the Uk.

Maybe I should start the next post off with some of my initial thoughts on the Oracle... trying to be as objective as I can!

Then, in a week or so's time I will begin a log of my brewing experience and also my thoughts on sages WG Service which I will get booked in during the next week or so.

Hopefully it will be of interest to people!

It will be a good outlet for me, my wife is sick of hearing the words coffee and espresso and is certain I am crazy, something I don't deny.

Thanks for taking the time to read and if anyone has any suggestions on things to include in the log feel free to shout up as it's a blank canvas at the moment!


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Looking forward to your diary with the Oracle. Not heard much about this machine but it looks a real whizzy piece of kit.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

I won't go into much detail on looks etc as that really is subjective.

I soon had this out of the box and in position, I placed it away from overhead cupboards as this would make it easier to fill the hopper.

Filling the water tank was very simple, neat little filter required fitting and I was away.

The LCD display indicated heating was in progress and once at 93 degrees (after only a few mins) the machine would allow brew making. Although, I do intend to play around with running an empty shot through first to normalise everything including the portafilter.

My first extractions ranged from bad to worse, I don't take milk so nothing could be masked. Beans were 25 days old and not sure of their quality so maybe a factor. I'll go into more detail when I start the brewing part of this log next time.

Overall I get the feeling that this machine can produce very good tasting coffee. I do, however, think that it will take me time to get to that stage.Things like understanding brew temperatures, adjusting grinds, volumetric etc.

I'm sure things will become a little clearer once I've had the white glove service.

How the single vs double button works intrigues me, it uses (and has to) the same dose with less water. My understanding is less coffee for a single. I only really have doubles anyway so no big deal, just an observation that I missed when researching.

In summary, I know I can great coffee from this machine but as yet don't know the best way to do it, I did mention it was an adventure!


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Is the built in grinder a 'Smart Grinder Pro' as in the Barista Express? or something different.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

I will find out


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

I'm not sure about the grinder. I'm on holiday at the moment but when I get back I shall be arrange the WGService and I'll ask the question.

I have purchased some scales, I intend to have a good play around with the grinder and different yields. I found some useful articles on the internet as well as this very forum thanks to mrboots2u.(thank you)

i did wonder whether I was being a bit over analytical by purchasing the scales. I did then think that I only have 2/3 espressos a day and I want them to be right. Whilst I get used to he machine I'm accepting that I'll 'waste' beans but once I'm set up I imagine I will have a good idea on how to get the best from it and waste less beans.

having said that I'm guessing I'll always have to dial it in, so I may become more proficient at that in terms of time but have to use a few beans in that process in order to get myself a consistently good coffee every time.

after all, why would I buy this machine and then accept the first coffee that comes out of it when the dialled in espresso will be so much better?

when I'm back off hols I will share my first experiences.

thanks for reading


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Sounds good. Having the scales will help with getting brew ratio - dose/yield right. But doesn't the machine tamp the coffee as soon as it is ground into the basket? You'll struggle to add/remove coffee to get your dose right bang on once it's been tamped (unless the machine weighs it as well?)


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Your right, it does grind then tamp automatically in one procedure. So the dose is set at roughly 21g. I understand that this can be altered relatively simply and the wgs can cover that.

however, after I watched this video and others





 , they seem to 'lock in' the dose first and then play around with yield and finally time. The volumetric settings on the oracle should come into their own with this.

So in essence, I won't play around with the dose at all but scale the other variables around it.

what do you think?


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

If you can set the dose to a particular weight e.g. 21g on the machine, then it must be weighing it as it is being dispensed into the portafilter surely.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Yes it weighs it but cannot be adjusted with a dial like on the barista express.

apparently it's too difficult to design in along with the tamp function. I've heard that adjusting tamp pressure on the settings can change the dose by a gram or two.

ive heard otherwise you'd need an Allen key, which I'm happy to play around with if it's easy to get at.

does that answer your question or am I misunderstanding?


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Yes - that's impressive. Just read MrBoots2u review and it's written in there about the dosing function. Apparently it can be changed.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Yes it's a good review isn't it.

As I progress I will make sure I report back on the dosing, possible adjustment, consistency etc.

ive noticed that more people seem to have the DB and BE, much less information is out their about the Oracle as far as I can see.

I intend to change that!

ill also try to include other things such as - when the autodosing is in action, whether a shake on the Portafilter is required to try and even the dose or whether that's taken care of. I can maybe taste test etc


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

I very nearly bought one of these - amazing bit of kit eh, no real competitor anywhere I believe.

Looking forward to learning more from your feedback Wes ;-)


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Wes78 said:


> ill also try to include other things such as - when the autodosing is in action, whether a shake on the Portafilter is required to try and even the dose or whether that's taken care of. I can maybe taste test etc


I just realised this is taken care of as the auger fan used to tamp also distributes the grinds evenly around the PF.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Just a quick update.

i got back from holiday yesterday and my dad had been and bought some beans! Bless him, he went to cafe Nero and got me some.

however, they sold him some that were roasted on December and told him they are fine as they've been hermetically sealed! They then told him they use beans that are roasted a couple of days before.

im new to good coffee but that seems strange to me, why sell beans roasted months ago and say 'we don't use them though'?

anyway, I tried them this morning and the pour seems really fast even on quite a fine grind. Is that to be expected?

i have 2 kg of Rave Italian job that's 5 days post roast so another few days and I'll be onto them, playing around.

oh and @Mrboots2u or anyone with Oracle experience did you find that when you were putting the filled portafilter in the group head it seemed to touch the top where the water comes out (don't know technical term) if I put the PF in then remove, the coffee grounds are slightly damp. Just an observation.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Had a play with IJ this's afternoon again.

As stated in my show of setup post I was favouring

21g for 42.5 in 36 seconds , the 1:2 ratio seemed to work best for me.

so I stuck with 1:2 (ended up being slightly under) but inadvertently had ground finer. The shot started at 11 seconds rather than 8-9 from memory. It was the first shot and I had cleaned out the burrs.

As a consequence it took longer , as I had already made my mind up to keep the yield the same.

So I got :

21g for 41g in 40 seconds This was the most balanced shot I've done.

im thinking that once I had nailed the ratio 1:2 which I did a couple of days ago, I could then play around with grind settings to maintain the ratio but increase/decrease the extraction time.

I've learned that im finding that the time of the extraction in terms of seconds wasn't much of a factor in the process,, the yield ratio was the key thing for me initially. Then came the grind adjustment whilst maintaining the ratio I liked. This affected the time of the extraction Which I noted down as a point of reference for repeatability.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

*White Glove Service*

*
*

I had this experience yesterday and after playing around with the Oracle for a couple of weeks I had questions.

The gentlemans name is Josh, he phoned before he arrived and was on time.

Josh starting by asking me a few questions, asking about how I used to brew my coffee, what I liked, didn't like, why I chose the Oracle.

He went through the workings of the machine, cleaning, descaling, volumetrics, tool usage, etc. He was happy for me to interrupt at any time and answered my questions in detail.

One of the main things I wanted to ask was about dialling in a coffee. So far Ive tried coffee with robusta (IJob) and coffee which is quite acidic to me (red brick). I did not know if I was on the right lines with what I was tasting, was it how the coffee was supposed to taste and I just didn't like it or was I getting it wrong. I was pleased when Josh dialled my beans in close to what I had done.

Josh brought along 250g of CCBarista Mistura-Se-Com which were really smooth and different to what Ive tasted before, in fact I can see me purchasing some of these. All in all, in terms of dialling coffees in, this was just what I needed and has given me the confidence to dial new beans in. He also discussed fine tweaks to the grind in order to try and improve the extraction. While some emphasis was put on weighing the yield, we also discussed the importance of actually enjoying the coffee rather than stressing too much about weights etc. Advice was also given on options for ordering beans, quantities, subscriptions, that kind of thing. We also used the single basket which doses 11g and I found that to produce a very nice single drink.

Milk Texturing was covered and really helped me understand the manual aspect of there process whilst providing tips for the auto feature, including jug placement in reference to the wand. Even got some tips on Latte Art!

Advice was also given on bean suppliers, interesting internet links, filter and cleaning product suppliers. This was really useful and gives me links to places I may not have otherwise found.

We talked about workflow, specifically cleanliness, cup warming and timing the espresso with the auto milk frothing.

All in all, the white glove service was just what I needed. Josh was a knowledgeable friendly gent and nothing was too much trouble. After he had been to me (spending 2 hours with me) it was 14:30 and he still had to travel to Leeds (60 miles away) to do one more white glove service before heading back to Derby! Yet he never worried about time once. His company are doing around 12 Sage WGS a week, mostly Oracles.

Very impressive service, hats off to him and Coffee Classics Direct!


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Sounds great ! Don't let the idea that weighing stops you enjoying coffee, all your doing is measuring and adjusting , based on the taste . If you stick with one coffee all the time , then the vols could be set up to be reasonably consistent . It's up to you . Good that a company had people to help you get set up machines , training is vastly under rated as a path to tasty coffee


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Mrboots2u said:


> Good that a company had people to help you get set up machines , training is vastly under rated as a path to tasty coffee


I couldn't agree more. Actually having someone present who has the knowledge as well as the ability to convey it is priceless. That 2 way conversation is done via email and text message nowadays!.

Incidentally, Josh teaches barista skills up to level 2.

In terms of weighing, I just made myself a coffee and slipped the scales underneath almost automatically. Seems to have become part of the process.


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

This sounds really, really great! What a huge help - being shown how to do things, and being able to ask questions, is such a confidence giver









Thanks for letting us know how it went, I feel I would recommend it now if anyone asked.

I am so pleased it was so helpful to you. Well done, Josh!


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

Just came actoss a thread where Josh had done another 'white gloves', back in 2013!

It sounds quite an interesting job actually!


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

MildredM said:


> Just came actoss a thread where Josh had done another 'white gloves', back in 2013!
> 
> It sounds quite an interesting job actually!


Yes, I think I came across that one too. Interesting reading.

I wonder if they would offer it for someone who just wanted that service, regardless of what machine they have. Obviously would depend on knowledge of a wider range of machinery but surely it would be useful.


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

@garydyke1 is well versed on a wide range of equipment, super knowledgeable and offers home training.


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## Plasse (Apr 9, 2017)

I am new to the forum - planning to upgrade my current gaggia baby. Thinking about a sage and the reviews seem positive. What does the build quality "feel" like? Is it robust feeling or more like a premium item like an apple computer?


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Plasse said:


> I am new to the forum - planning to upgrade my current gaggia baby. Thinking about a sage and the reviews seem positive. What does the build quality "feel" like? Is it robust feeling or more like a premium item like an apple computer?


The oracle is both robust and premium

What model are you thinking about?


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## Plasse (Apr 9, 2017)

The oracle is sadly maybe too premium for me, i have seen a few second hand single boilers on the bay, but ideally looking for dual.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Let us know how you get on.

the internet is great for information but as I always find - It causes me to go round in circles!


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## Benjijames28 (Mar 29, 2017)

Plasse said:


> The oracle is sadly maybe too premium for me, i have seen a few second hand single boilers on the bay, but ideally looking for dual.


You get what you pay for my friend. I learnt the hard way there's no cheap way to quality espresso.

Grinder is probably where you should put a good chunk of your money.


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## Plasse (Apr 9, 2017)

Too true! Have a Bezzera BB105 which grinds pretty consistently I think, but I'm debating changing the burrs or upgrading. But that's a different story.. thanks for the helpful replies.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Good Evening all, Just a quick update

Ive now had the Oracle for about a month now and thought I would update on my progress. Hopefully it may be of use to folk.

So I have been thoroughly enjoying myself, buying fresh beans, playing with grind settings, weighing in and out, purging, the list goes on. Basically I enjoy the process. The good thing for me is that the machine gives me the option to play around or to just press buttons when I'm too busy making breakfast, feeding 4 dogs, getting ready for work etc etc.

I have come to realize that my pallete needs refining, I cant pick flavours out other than to say, like that or don't like that. I'm sure it will come over time. Having read posts about people who don't like espresso and they say things like "its bitter" I'm starting to think they may just be tasting neat coffee and that's what it is like. Not bitter but correct and you'll either like that particular bean for it or wont. Just my take.

Back on topic..The dosing is a fairly consistent 21g and as I said I weigh out. Typical yields take 30-40 seconds if Ive got it right although I'm going to run them a touch longer and see what the taste is like. I find the grinder to be consistent, the difficulty of course is keeping all variables the same, humidity, temperature etc. I generally find I can dial this in with maximum 1 shot waste of. But the wasted shot would need to be terrible for me to throw it.

I know some people reading this will want more info on the grinders capabilities and taste compared to higher end grinders but I have no experience of that so wont comment. All I will say is that I'm enjoying the coffee from it and it does grind finer when I turn the knob to finer! I can tell with the shot time compared to weight. Let's not forget I come from supermarket coffee and blade grinder! I find most beans naturally require a tweak on grind settings as they age, this is no different. New beans about 7 days post roast seem to dial consistently in around 15-20 mark and so not difficult to modify and correct from their. 2 digital numbers change is quite significant I find.

If the burrs need altering with use, probably years rather than months then this can also be altered and each division is about 15 numbers difference on the digital readout.

I am religious about cleaning the machine and the grinder is something I strip out and clean regularly, Mrboots2u has a nice video on this.

If this machine hasn't been on long then, even though its up to temp I will flush with portafilter in,big difference to get everything heated. Some set the single cup button for this which is a good idea.

Americano setting is very useful once your beans are dialed in, make sure cup is wide enough!

I tend not to leave beans in the hopper, they can get a little warm but if you really want then the cooling fan can be turned up.

The cup heater is a little slow to get going but when it does its mega warm! As i say though, this doesn't really transfer through to the beans.

The milk steaming is simple or difficult depending on manual or automatic. The auto doesn't really get it swirling but still seems velvety so seems to work well. Defined difference in milk between cappuccino and latte selection.

Dose cant be altered, other than small tweaks. I know some people complain about this, but I think the difficulty in having this adjusted manually had something to do with the auto tamp feature but i could be wrong. I'm not having any problems and I instantly know my weight in so I'm happy with it.

All in all I'm very happy with this machine, having read people's experiences with b2cup machines, I wouldn't class this as such in the sense that the physical process is more realistic and the end result seems better. Just my thoughts though

Anyway, just a few thoughts to bore you all with! I'm happy to answer any questions on it.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

I have also naturally been using the manual double cup button to start and stop my shots.

that way I have good control over the end weight as opposed to just using time.

this may be where volumetrics comes in but even that way I am presuming the grind will have to be right.

once I am more consistent maybe I'll give them a go but I like the control!


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## filthynines (May 2, 2016)

Thank you very much for the information - I'm finding it all very interesting


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Going to move the burrs over to the coarsest setting (physically) and then set to the most coarse setting digitally. Basically as coarse as the machine will grind then see if it will work for my cafetière.

apparently each numbered setting on the burrs is equivalent of 15 digital movements so I've got about 60 on top of the original 45 so will be much coarser but not sure if coarse enough.

ill try it as We're starting to have cafetières on a weekend mornings now, coffee is evolving us!

i can see a separate grinder coming next for pour overs etc! I was warned about this hobbies expense!  good fun though and the coffee is marvellous so far .


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## Benjijames28 (Mar 29, 2017)

Wes78 said:


> Going to move the burrs over to the coarsest setting (physically) and then set to the most coarse setting digitally. Basically as coarse as the machine will grind then see if it will work for my cafetière.
> 
> apparently each numbered setting on the burrs is equivalent of 15 digital movements so I've got about 60 on top of the original 45 so will be much coarser but not sure if coarse enough.
> 
> ...


Get a hand grinder for coarser grinds.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Benjijames28 said:


> Get a hand grinder for coarser grinds.


Yes I think something like that and fairly inexpensive will be a good solution. I darent mention spending more money to SWMBO


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

Wes78 said:


> Yes I think something like that and fairly inexpensive will be a good solution. I darent mention spending more money to SWMBO


Do you have a Birthday, anniversary, early Christmas, late Easter, jovial Bank Holiday, or some such coming up? Plenty of handy days for issuing present lists


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

MildredM said:


> Do you have a Birthday, anniversary, early Christmas, late Easter, jovial Bank Holiday, or some such coming up? Plenty of handy days for issuing present lists


Apparently the oracle covered all those :-D


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Benjijames28 said:


> Get a hand grinder for coarser grinds.


Those wilfas look great? Aeropress champion used one apparently


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Thanks @kennyboy993 that looks absolutely ideal.

As I say I am thoroughly enjoying the oracle so a separate grinder for other types such as French press is what I'm after. That certainly seems to fit the bill. I would probably only use it once/twice a week too.

thabks again


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

You're welcome Wes. Had my eye on one for immersion myself


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Just a little update.

I have used the Oracle for around 6 weeks now and I'm really happy. I have stuck to the same beans for the last 2 weeks (Crankhouse ch7) and I've found the grinder to be very consistent. Usually within 1 digital adjustment of dialled in, although generally remains the same. This is providing I run a sink? shot through to heat through first. Without this sink shot, I found consistency suffered.

I also clean the auger fan and chute after each use.

I also find keeping the bean hopper topped up helps consistency. the machine has been left on and restarted when auto switched off several times and the beans don't seem to gather much excess heat,certainly not enough to make any difference to the grind ( I know not too scientific)

i made notes on the consistency of the dose and was surprised with the accuracy (+\- .2) as long as chute is cleaned.

so with minimum prep and attention to cleanliness I'm finding the machine absolutely perfect for my needs. The coffee tastes fantastic, I'm finding my best results with these beans is a 1:2 ratio in around 35/40 seconds. I am finding I like the extraction to take time toget going if that makes sense. I weigh every shot and don't find it a hassle at all.

i clean the burrs 2/3 times a week and find that keeps things right.

After I bought the oracle I did have at the back of my mind 'should I have bought separate grinder). Having used the machine I know that for my needs, this is the right machine. There have been times when i fancied a coffee but didn't have the time or inclination for the effort it takes. The quick warm up and auto features persuaded me every time. With a separate set up I would probably have 1/2 less coffees over a 3 day period. That's not to say I won't want a different set up in the future, upgraditis will set in im sure! Just saying that at the moment this is right for me.

i would be be even happier if the machine would display the time rather than the brew temp but we can't have it all.

hope this helps anyone desiring more information on the oracle and if it doesn't, well tough, it took me ages to write this out ! Ha!

EDIT : I should add that I have had the odd (probably 1 in 6 ish) shots that extract over/under enough to not drink. However I am finding that this tends to be that I haven't ran a shot through/ cleaned chute etc. My instinct tells me that this will probably continue to happen but less often as I get used to the machine. A few shots I've had have been less than optimal but I knew that 1 notch on the digital grind it would be ideal.


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

That's great! It sounds like a really positive experience in every respect. Well done on your choice - and comment!


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Really good review over a number of weeks. Sure to help anyone considering the Oracle.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Another week or 2 has passed and so thought I would update this thread with a few new thoughts.

I have tested out the volumetric function on this machine and I will list the resultant yields from 9 subsequent cups.

(Volumetrics can be found in the advanced menu and is known as 'Flo', toggled from 'sec'.

The 1cup and 2 cup button can then be set up for volumetrics as opposed to duration

Dose set at 21g ,* yield set at 44g*

The results were over the course of several days with the same bean at different times of the day

38g

42g

39g

39g

37g

35g

42g

35g

39g

The lowest result of 35g was on quite a tight grind and the highest result of 42g was a coarser grind (not deliberately).

For me personally, I just like the control of manually weighing and therefore stopping each shot and don't find it inconvenient at all so that's what I will continue doing i.e I don't really use the 1 or 2 cup buttons other than to heat the group head and portafilter and when back flushing.

As extra info, general consistency has improved since I started storing beans separately to the machine. So I fill and empty the hopper for each use. Just part of the process. I do fill the hopper, better consistency when weight in hopper I find.


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## caffeinejunkie (May 29, 2017)

Wes78 said:


> Your right, it does grind then tamp automatically in one procedure. So the dose is set at roughly 21g. I understand that this can be altered relatively simply and the wgs can cover that.
> 
> however, after I watched this video and others


Found the video useful - thank you for sharing


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

A couple of things a to update based on further usage.

As I stated in the last update, the volumetrics doesn't seem to be too bad, certainly accurate when using the same bean on the same setting which makes sense. As a result I am finding that when I'm in a bit of a hurry I tend to just click the 2 cup button that is set to volumetrics not bother with weighing it.

When making Americans, ensure your cup is placed in the correct position, if it isn't then when the hot water starts to pour, it soaks your scales!. As the Americanos are automatic, it would be nice to have the option to pour the water first, surely it can only be software, as could the LCD display which displays brew temp and cant be changed to time.

I still achieve good consistency with grind settings, even when switching beans and referring to an old setting.

The augar fan that spins when the ground coffee comes down the chutes from the burrs (I'll include picture) may also help with consistency. It spins and therefore evenly distributes the coffee grounds into the PF and then acts as the tamper finishing off with a nice clean polish. I could be wrong but it looks like the underneath of those distribution tools.

In terms of cleaning the, the machine reminds you after 200 shots (I think) that a dishwasher type tablet needs to be put through the machine. This only counts the amounts of shots, therefore if you use a shot or two to heat the group then bear in mind that these count towards that tally. The idea is that these blank shots shouldn't be needed as the group head is separately heated but if the machine hasn't been on for long then it will need a shot putting through.

I would quite like to see the extraction just out of interest really. It's a 58mm PF but as their isn't anything I can do about the distribution and tamp to change anything. Just curiosity really.


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

> When making Americans, ensure your cup is placed in the correct position, if it isn't then when the hot water starts to pour, it soaks your scales!. As the Americanos are automatic, it would be nice to have the option to pour the water first, surely it can only be software, as could the LCD display which displays brew temp and cant be changed to time.


I have never found the auto americano repeatably accurate.

For americano I always input the water 55 grams into the cup & top out with the usual circa 22.5 grams shot.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Just to be clear, the machine does not make Americans as I previously stated


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## Pseudonym (Aug 31, 2016)

Just read this thread. Will be following with Earnest while developing my own thing with my Oracle. Not really ventured out of the WGS much until now. About time I did. Cheers!


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Pseudonym said:


> Just read this thread. Will be following with Earnest while developing my own thing with my Oracle. Not really ventured out of the WGS much until now. About time I did. Cheers!


Let us know how you get on when you start to play


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Well my adventure continues.. I feel like I'm much more familiar with the machine now.

I have not really experimented too much, mainly because I'm enjoying the coffee, nothing is wrong so I'm not going to try fix it if you see what i mean.

Heres a link to a guy who has tried using a 15g VST basket to try get a smaller dose (19g ish). Whilst I'm not bothered myself, some others may be interested

http://coffeegeek.com/forums/espresso/0/631748?LastView=1498593575&Page=10

Next time I have a play I will be sure to report back.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

As I generally drink quite a lot of Americano's I have a few of the manual buttons programmed for varying sizes.I thought I would weigh them and show the results here to show the consistency (or lack of it).

So my Set 2 button is at 42g of coffee with an overall weight of 176g after the water is poured in.

Last 10 results.

180g

178g

176g

176g

174g

178g

182g

181g

183g

179g

The weight of the initial espresso is hard to gauge as you have to keep an eye on the scales and I tend to be gazing into space or getting a dog out from under my feet so I don't catch them all. Most seemed to be around the set42g mark.

If the cup is in the right place, the water slips underneath and you get a nice looking Americano ready for a stir. If it isn't you ruin your scales

One slight annoying thing is the positioning of the water spout. It's very close to the brew head. If you don't quite get the PF where you want it, it bangs it and can also get caught when you remove the PF. Doesn't happen often but worth noting. Obviously it has to be close but just an observation


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

Great journal of insight you're building for potential oracle owners here Wes - can imagine this being invaluable.


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## fosterjacob (Apr 17, 2017)

Well this has been very enlightening thanks very much Wes78! I think I may go and purchase one finally tomorrow!


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## The Asgard (Aug 1, 2017)

Great thread. Very interesting machine, coming from a Delongi bean to cup I like the automation and it makes it easy for the wife to use in the day. Seems like lots to go wrong but the Delongi done 10K shots so far.....


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## DaveP (Jul 14, 2017)

> So my Set 2 button is at 42g of coffee with an overall weight of 176g


At first I thought the results didn't look that good... but then I thought about it, lol

Americano = shots + a lot of water for dilution, so the consistency of a vastly diluted drink being + / - a bit is kinda not a problem

The % difference in the dilution of the actual good stuff is a lot less


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## AGcoffee (Sep 25, 2017)

SAGE ORACLE Descale problems. De-scaled my Sage Oracle unit and then found the unit would not get up to temp and water ran out of the boiler. Spoke to Sage who told me the ???? fuser had gone and asked if I remained watching the unit for the entire 20 cycle. No I hadn't as the manual didn't say one needed to and suggested it was automatic. Apparently the unit calls for you to press a button at a certain time (no indication of this in the manual) if you dont the fuser blows out - now why wouldn't they mention this?! Sage repair service is 2 weeks away, I offered to send the unit to them - no quicker. Pretty rubbish for a premium product.


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## Wes78 (Apr 18, 2017)

Seems strange, I have Descaled several times and not watched it.


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## GingerBen (Sep 7, 2017)

Very useful thread thanks. Kicking around the idea of getting one of these. Any further updates/thoughts?


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