# Fracino Cherub - Questions from new owner



## FilipK (Jun 14, 2015)

Hi guys,

So the big day is here - I have chopped in my Rancilio Silvia for a Fracino Cherub. Machine looks much more professional and I can't wait to use it.

I got a hold of the manual, since using it appears to be a wee bit different from my old machine. I've not got round to pulling a single shot yet though because I have a problem with the pressure. The manual says I should wait until the pressure reaches 1-1.2 bar, but the machine stops pumping as soon as it reaches the green field (0.8 bar).

Then, when I go round to steaming milk, as soon as I open the valve for the steam the pressure drops and the machine boiler comes on. I am a bit confused if that's correct operation - HX machines are meant to be for simultaneous steaming and brewing and it does not seem possible with my Cherub.

Can anyone also talk me through their standard operation for getting a milk coffee from Cherub - when do you switch on, do you release water from the group first etc?

Thanks


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## Jony (Sep 8, 2017)

I would do shot first, then wait until pressure is back up then steam milk.


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## FilipK (Jun 14, 2015)

Thanks for your reply. Are you saying that this behaviour with the pressure is completely normal?


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## SimonN (Feb 4, 2016)

FilipK said:


> Hi guys,
> So the big day is here - I have chopped in my Rancilio Silvia for a Fracino Cherub. Machine looks much more professional and I can't wait to use it.
> I got a hold of the manual, since using it appears to be a wee bit different from my old machine. I've not got round to pulling a single shot yet though because I have a problem with the pressure. The manual says I should wait until the pressure reaches 1-1.2 bar, but the machine stops pumping as soon as it reaches the green field (0.8 bar).
> Then, when I go round to steaming milk, as soon as I open the valve for the steam the pressure drops and the machine boiler comes on. I am a bit confused if that's correct operation - HX machines are meant to be for simultaneous steaming and brewing and it does not seem possible with my Cherub.
> ...


I'm a little confused when you say the machine stops pumping at .8 bar. This is the boiler pressure which is to do with temperature and nothing to do with the pump. Do you mean that the boiler switches off? If that's the case it sounds like the pstat is set too low and needs adjusting. 
It's normal for the pressure to drop when you steam, you are releasing pressure from the boiler, so the boiler should then kick in to build the pressure back up. 
Running the pump to make an espresso may cause the pressure to drop slightly, but only because the boiler is cooling. As I say, this isn't brew pressure, it's boiler pressure which relates to temperature (the pressure comes from the boiling water)

I hope this helps,
Simon

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## FilipK (Jun 14, 2015)

SimonN said:


> I'm a little confused when you say the machine stops pumping at .8 bar. This is the boiler pressure which is to do with temperature and nothing to do with the pump. Do you mean that the boiler switches off? If that's the case it sounds like the pstat is set too low and needs adjusting.
> It's normal for the pressure to drop when you steam, you are releasing pressure from the boiler, so the boiler should then kick in to build the pressure back up.
> Running the pump to make an espresso may cause the pressure to drop slightly, but only because the boiler is cooling. As I say, this isn't brew pressure, it's boiler pressure which relates to temperature (the pressure comes from the boiling water)
> 
> ...


 Hey SimonN,

You're right, I am not 100% on the ball yet with the Cherub, thanks for pointing this out.

The machine pumps sometimes when I switch it on, but as you rightfully point out this has nothing to do with the gauge.

Yes, the boiler switches off as soon as it reaches .8 bar. I understand that the pressure drops when I release steam (or water for that matter), but with the setting at .8 of bar I cannot even pull a shot out of it without it dropping below and the boiler switching on - is this an issue, as it affects the brew temperature I understand?

Thanks,


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## SimonN (Feb 4, 2016)

The pump running when you switch the machine on is just the boiler filling, so don't worry about that - it's normal.

A small drop in pressure when brewing is also normal, so don't worry about that either.

The only issue I can see is that the pressure (temperature) is too low at idle. This in turn means that when you are brewing a coffee the boiler pressure is dropping low enough to kick the boiler in. Again this isn't actually a problem (the boiler being on) but you will almost certainly be brewing with the water temp too low. This will obviously affect taste.

I'd just adjust the pstat - it's simple to do. Google or youtube is your friend here  . I should probably ask if the coffee tastes ok, and if it does then don't worry about it, but I'm pretty confident that turning the pressure and temp up will help a lot.

Cheers

Simon


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## Oblivion (Mar 5, 2018)

Give Fracino a call and see what the factory setting should be. They will also tell you how to adjust if required.

My Classico is set at 1 bar from the factory. Pressure fluctuates but the element is very powerful and builds pressure quickly. you should find you have more than enough pressure to brew and steam at the same time as the boiler is large carrying lots of steam for any given pressure.

As stated before all the clicking on and off is normal and part of the operating cycle. These machines to take a good 30-45 mins (if not more as there is a lot of metal to warm up) to settle down so make sure you allow plenty of time before attempting your brew.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

As you negotiated a discount you can no get it looked at by a professional as per the for sale thread


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## FilipK (Jun 14, 2015)

Aye I will do just that, don't want to risk damaging it. The moment I open the steam wand the pressure drops by .2 bar within milliseconds. No chance of steaming and brewing concurrently.


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## SimonN (Feb 4, 2016)

FilipK said:


> Aye I will do just that, don't want to risk damaging it. The moment I open the steam wand the pressure drops by .2 bar within milliseconds. No chance of steaming and brewing concurrently.


FilipK , I think you misunderstand how an hx machine works. It is completely normal for the pressure to drop when you open the steam wand, you're releasing the steam which is under pressure in the boiler.

When you brew coffee it is not using this pressure to make the drink, and a pressure drop like this won't affect the brew temperature. Again, I'll stress, it's normal behaviour for any hx machine. I've owned a cherub and it did exactly the same thing, now I own a rocket Giotto and it does it too.

Simon

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

FilipK said:


> Aye I will do just that, don't want to risk damaging it. The moment I open the steam wand the pressure drops by .2 bar within milliseconds. No chance of steaming and brewing concurrently.


 I think k you are just not familiar with these machines, adjust the pressure stat yourself and increase the boiler pressure, as had already been suggested on the forum and you will have more success


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## Drellis (Aug 31, 2018)

Hi FilipK,

I know it has been a little time since you purchased your Cherub so you may have already sorted out the issue. I have owned a Cherub for just less than a year. The pstat is quite easy to adjust. Just unscrew the top panel and lift it off and then use a flat head screw driver to turn the valve on top of the motor. (there is a PDF manual on the Fracino website.) Do it a half turn at a time and see what the changes are. This will increase the boilers pressure threshold. Since water at higher pressure boils at a higher temperature you should also notice your water temperature increases slightly and will give you more steam power (this was an issue with mine initially). If the temperature isn't getting to where you want it may be worth descaling it as this can interfere with the heat transfer from the boiler element. Finally, makes sure the "pin" on top of the boiler is pushed in fully. This is the water level censor and may have moved during transit which can effect how much water the motor draws into the boiler. Hope this helps.


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