# New owner, lots of questions!



## Franks (Mar 27, 2013)

Hi guys, great forum - very informative so far.

I have recently bought a new Classic and it's great. Here's the best bit - I don't drink espresso straight. I mainly drink milk based or Americano with a touch of skimmed milk.

I bought the machine because we had a pro machine at work and I got into proper espresso based coffee drinks there. My Classic is also used to make great Ovaltine and Hot chocolate (for my little girl) It's an all rounder.

After reading the net about proper espresso and the sheer levels of accuracy and time that can go into producing a shot, is it really, really REALLY going to make a huge difference to my usage of the machine when I'm adding frothed milk or water/milk?

Like most things in life, If I have the tool to make something better through time and effort, I'll make it better. I currently use pre-ground Gaggia Espresso blend and have used Taylors via the pressurised double basket I got with the machine (as it came without the non pressured baskets). I can produce a 60mm shot with a nice amount of crema in 25 seconds so all seems well in terms of extraction time.

Since I don't drink espresso neat, am I going to REALLY notice a huge improvement in my milk/water based drinks by investing further in whole beans, a good burr hand grinder, a 58mm non-pressurised double basket, proper weighted tamper and of course all the extra time it will take to prepare each shot?

I'm not looking for an excuse due to laziness, simply an honest answer. I love spending time and effort on things if there is an improvement to yield. I don't fancy investing money AND more time and effort in to something if it doesn't give positive results.

Also, I have noticed something odd regarding the pannarello steam wand. I leave the machine to warm up for a good 30 mins usually. During this time I'll purge some water, clean the group-head and preheat the PF. Once I've extracted a shot and then used the wand to steam some milk, it seems to hiss and leak a tiny amount of steam even when the steam knob is fully off and steam switch is not selected? If I run the shower, lots of steam comes through the group-head before water emerges. I asume this is normal venting of the steam pressure but my wand will still hiss to a certain degree afterwards? (I can feel it with my fingers too)

Any help/advice with that lot will be gratefully received!

Thanks!


----------



## forzajuve (Feb 2, 2011)

Short answer - yes it will make a HUGE difference from what you are currently doing and even in milk. If you don't think it will matter with milk then why not drink instant? Seriously though the difference is so vast from where you are now. Of course there are cheaper brewed alternatives if you are not actually going to ever drink espresso.


----------



## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Franks said:


> Since I don't drink espresso neat, am I going to REALLY notice a huge improvement in my milk/water based drinks by investing further in whole beans, a good burr hand grinder, a 58mm non-pressurised double basket, proper weighted tamper and of course all the extra time it will take to prepare each shot?
> 
> Also, I have noticed something odd regarding the pannarello steam wand. I leave the machine to warm up for a good 30 mins usually. During this time I'll purge some water, clean the group-head and preheat the PF. Once I've extracted a shot and then used the wand to steam some milk, it seems to hiss and leak a tiny amount of steam even when the steam knob is fully off and steam switch is not selected? If I run the shower, lots of steam comes through the group-head before water emerges. I asume this is normal venting of the steam pressure but my wand will still hiss to a certain degree afterwards? (I can feel it with my fingers too) Any help/advice with that lot will be gratefully received! Thanks!


Will you notice a difference - short answer - *yes*. Try a coffee from an independent coffee shop if you can - one using fresh roasted beans. You'll notice the difference in quality straight away.

Steam and spluttering through your brew head after steaming milk is normal. Carry on doing this as your Classic's boiler is only 100cc and can quickly run dry when steaming - the boiler doesn't refill during steaming. So it's a good idea to run water through the brew head to make sure the boiler is refilled. This will make the heater element last a lot longer.


----------



## series530 (Jan 4, 2013)

Welcome to the forum.

I started out with just a classic and used to buy illy ground coffee. Like you, my preference is milk based drinks. In the space of three months, having sampled fresh beans, I have purchased a powered grinder, installed a proper steam wand and now replaced the Gaggia with a Fracino Cherub.

So, if there is a lesson here, the lesson would be that you need to take a measured approach moving forward: fresh beans will make a huge difference to your coffee and you may find yourself exposed to the weaknesses of the Gaggia. With a bit of will power you can fight it and the Gaggia will continue to be the great machine that it is. If you have any spare cash burning a hole in your pocket, the improvement in your coffee could quickly cause that spare cash to part company with you.

Please don't see this reply as negative. It really isn't. There is a huge new world out there once you sample fresh coffee and yes, even with milk based drinks. You could be about to start a wonderful journey. Brace yourself and be ready for the ride!

You also picked a great forum. There's a huge amount of knowledge on here.


----------



## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

Hi Franks, welcome to the forum









As the others have said, the difference between fresh/ground is really night and day..

The good news is that you can get very good shot of coffee out of your gaggia.

I would recommend buying a small porlex hand grinder (about £30) and some good fresh beans

(if you prefer a darker roasted style, perhaps something from union roasted, e.g. revelation blend)

The pressurised basket will introduce a "fake" crema (espresso is forced through a tiny hole)

So if you want to try beans, i'd probably ditch that too









Hope that helps

Regards


----------



## Steve_S_T (Dec 7, 2012)

Franks said:


> Once I've extracted a shot and then used the wand to steam some milk, it seems to hiss and leak a tiny amount of steam even when the steam knob is fully off and steam switch is not selected? If I run the shower, lots of steam comes through the group-head before water emerges. I asume this is normal venting of the steam pressure but my wand will still hiss to a certain degree afterwards? (I can feel it with my fingers too)
> 
> Thanks!


Hi Franks, welcome aboard.

If you mean that the wand hisses for a short while after use then that's not a problem. However, if the hiss is permanent until you switch the machine off then it's faulty imo. I had two Classics between November and the end of February and both developed a leak from the wand (albeit Silvia wands in my case) that required a drip catcher to prevent a mini flood on the worktop. Furthermore another forum member had similar problems recently so it does occur to me that there is a pattern emerging that is, perhaps, evidence of a faulty batch of components or Classics. If I was in your position and the steam escape is a perma-feature then I'd exchange the machine (if you bought through Amazon that's a surprisingly painless procedure).

Steve.


----------



## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

hi franks and welcome to a great forum

i suspect many people on here started from the same place as yourself. i started with a dualit and when that clapped out i bought a new classic. i carried on using pre-ground illy with the pressurised basked that came with the classic. the coffee was always ok, but i was never really that happy with it, particularly when compared to the coffee i could get at local independents. so, i think the best advice as given by the systemic kid above is, find a good quality independent and see if you prefer the coffee they give you. if you find no appreciable difference, then carry on as you are. but i'm almost certain you'll notice a HUGE difference.

once you take the leap of faith and buy a decent grinder (manual or electric) and start buying freshly roasted beans, you will find a whole new and exciting world opening up which is so far removed from the two-dimensional 'pre-ground' world you are in now. coffee is like wine, there are so many varieties and so many variables, but at the moment you are just limiting yourself to the cheap house red.

as for the steam thing, it could be a fault, but make sure, when you've finished, to run some water through the group head. i also bleed off all the steam from the steam wand once the machine is off.


----------



## Franks (Mar 27, 2013)

Thanks for all the great replies and tips regarding boiler/element care.

I too had a Dualit which was on offer from Costco. I took it back a week later to replace it with this Classic which is by far a superior machine. I just need proper peripherals to make it even better.

I'm thinking about the Porlex for my own use. (I'll get in some pre-ground for visitors if they don't want to grind there own







)

I'll certainly get a blank for back-flushing and a double non-pressured basket along with some Puly and a proper 57/58mm tamp. While I'm here, can anyone recommend a good bean from Happy-Donkey or a decent roaster in the Manchester area?

I think the wand is okay as it's only hissing lightly after use. I don't want to over-tighten the steam shut off valve.


----------



## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

Happy Donkey "Italian" is pretty well thought if you like that style.

I actually found their Brazilian a bit nicer (HD beans are very very dark - almost charcoal







).


----------



## Franks (Mar 27, 2013)

I was mooching around a local store at lunch and came across a Krups GVX burr grinder for £35. It looks just okay, so probably isn't up to much and having looked on the net reviews seem mixed from awful to great so long as it's looked after. Some say it's great for espresso some say it isn't (welcome to the internet!).

Will this unlock the taste floodgates into my new world of coffee? I don't mind it if it's just for a year or so to prove to myself that it is worthwhile in spending a bloody fortune on a conical burr grinder with doser etc.

Two things really. I can't see myself manually grinding beans with a Porlex or initially spending upwards of £200 on a grinder. Is there a middle ground with a grinder such as the Krups GVX?


----------



## omega (Jan 5, 2011)

I have the Krups GVX burr grinder and find it is good for the money and I get very good results with beans from Has Bean, Union and the super market beans I think if you like the coffee you make then that's the main fact.


----------



## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Franks said:


> While I'm here, can anyone recommend a good bean from Happy-Donkey or a decent roaster in the Manchester area?


Here you go:

http://mancoco.co.uk/epages/950003025.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/950003025/Categories

Worth a punt.


----------



## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Franks said:


> Will this unlock the taste floodgates into my new world of coffee? I don't mind it if it's just for a year or so to prove to myself that it is worthwhile in spending a bloody fortune on a conical burr grinder with doser etc. Two things really. I can't see myself manually grinding beans with a Porlex or initially spending upwards of £200 on a grinder. Is there a middle ground with a grinder such as the Krups GVX?


A decent grinder will give you consistency of grind - less important for, say, french press and other brew methods using coarser grind. But, with espresso, it's a different story - consistency of grind is *crucial*. Remember, your Classic is pumping water at high pressure through the puck. If the grind is inconsistent, you won't get an even extraction which means you won't get all the flavour and aroma out of the dose. The good thing about buying a grinder is you can get a decent one second hand for around £120-£140 if you look around and are prepared to wait. In this class, Eureka Mignon and Iberital MC2 are the ones to think about.


----------



## Franks (Mar 27, 2013)

omega said:


> I have the Krups GVX burr grinder and find it is good for the money and I get very good results with beans from Has Bean, Union and the super market beans I think if you like the coffee you make then that's the main fact.


Are you using it to produce espresso grind or for french press? (looking at your signature)


----------



## omega (Jan 5, 2011)

Both and no issue


----------



## Franks (Mar 27, 2013)

That's good news. For £35 it may be worth a punt as I tend to drink french press in the morning (I find frothed milk based drinks too much first thing). It wouldn't be a total loss if I found the Espresso grind inconsistent for my Classic.

I need a proper double basket and tamp first.


----------



## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

You will struggle to get a mignon in this price range


----------

