# The Sage Dual Boiler and Smart Grinder have landed



## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

Well they have just arrived on my doorstep just as I had made myself a coffee so will be unboxing and taking some photos shortly.


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## Mike mc (Apr 10, 2012)

Interested in your views on the grinder


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I do not think he has the grinder, just the espresso machine. I have the grinder though!


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

Nope they also sent me a grinder too, just been unboxing the machine and decided to actually read the instructions as isn't mine lol. May not get to the grinder for a couple of days yet though, but the MC2 (Shudders) is still relatively fresh in my mind so will be able to compare those 2 and to my RR55, and if I'm feeling energetic the Porlex too.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Really glad you got your stuff as promised Charlie, would have been nice if they offered me the same courtesy! I have not hear a thing or had an email, bit ignorant really. Perhaps they are worried I might actually put it through its paces thoroughly.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

coffeechap said:


> Perhaps they are worried I might actually put it through its paces thoroughly.


I bet thats exactly why Slayer & La Marzocco ignored my repeated demands for loan of a machine too


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> I bet thats exactly why Slayer & La Marzocco ignored my repeated demands for loan of a machine too


Bugger forgot to ask them...


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## Sunil (Nov 19, 2013)

Hi Charlie, would be curious to know what beans you are planning to use to test them? And also to get your view on the smart grinder dosing with the single unpressurized basket. Thanks!


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

Sunil said:


> Hi Charlie, would be curious to know what beans you are planning to use to test them? And also to get your view on the smart grinder dosing with the single unpressurized basket. Thanks!


 Well for the next few days I will be using the 1kg I have of our Darker Side of Life subscription club on here which is a special roast of Coffee Circle from Manchester's Barnraiser Blend, also got some Rave Java Jampit and Jagong Village, and if I run out will take a trip to my local roastery Roberts and Co and choose something there.

So my initial impressions of the DB so far now I've had a few shots from it.

When unboxing it, it comes with a nice set of accessories, a 408ml well made stainless steel milk jug, a Razor dosing tool, a double and single normal basket and pressurised ones too a tamper and in the storage drawer behind the drip tray 2 cleaning tablets ( something like puly caff) a tool to unblock pressurised basket holes and the steam wand and also take the steaming tip off and a quick start guide, the full instruction manual and a kind of amusing "Heston's Coffee Tips and Techniques" booklet which pun intended contains the sage advice to use fresh roasted coffee beans to make the most of your machine and always use cold milk to steam and/or keep your jug in the fridge too between sessions. I say kind of amusing as Heston's restaurants use nespresso pods for their coffee but hey thats the world. I would also be remiss if I did not add here I don't know why people who haven't even seen one in the flesh are slating the machine as being "plasticky" my initial impressions are that it is very well made in the same way a top end kitchen appliance like say a dualit toaster is made and again I'm not sure why it's being criticised for being more like a kitchen appliance than something like the Expobar Brewtus after all it's very common to be using these prosumer machines as kitchen appliances. I will email my contacts at Sage and ask about top off pictures of the machine.

I spent a little time on setting it up properly, used the included water hardness test, which pleasantly said the water here was softer than I thought. It comes up to temperature pretty fast, the inbuilt timer is a very nice function as are the shot timers etc, what is kind of annoying is there is no override for the auto off function and no way to adjust the length of time.

So on to the coffee itself I'm just finishing off a bag from Pact of their Espresso #2 which they describe as "full of chocolate and cherries with hints of apple and sweet finish " with the Classic I was getting the chocolate and cherries but that was about it from the DB I have had the hints of apple, they're there more in the way a freshly made farmshop filtered apple juice sweetness kind of way not an acidic contribution but sweet and juicy, very nice as both espresso and in flat whites its very much like someone removed a blanket from the coffee in taste terms over the Classic.

Steaming milk is an absolute doddle due to the 3 hole tip creating a vortex all on its own, the 1st time I did milk it seemed to take longer than the Classic but easier to texture, so I then went into the advanced settings and turned the steam boiler temp up to max so the 2nd go at steaming was nice and quick but still enough time to texture the milk very well without a great deal of effort for a lovely shiny and smooth microfoam.

Reading through the manual the machine also has some nice built in programs for backflushing and descaling which does a lot of it on its own, with some just following on-screen prompts which seem to be very nice functions. I also set the pre-infusion time and pressure to be a little less than default settings after my 1st coffee.


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## big dan (Apr 11, 2012)

Glad to hear you are getting on with the Sage Charlie. I must admit i went into John Lewis again the other day and had another look at the machine. It's fit and finish is very nice and i was one of the people who called it "placticky", i guess i should take that back a bit by saying that it does have a nice brushed steel exterio, however this is just a skin or plating over a plastic or composite material as opposed to the all chromed steel of some other prosumer machines. It does look well put together though, my criticism is that the Brewtus or other machines have a more industrial/arty look as opposed to the Sage which still looks like a normal kitchen appliance. However this is simply aesthetics.

Looking forward to seeing how you get on with it. I'm interested to see how helpful the PID/Pre-infusion settings are in practice or if it will tend to be a set it and forget kind of thing.

As an aside is the Jampit still available from Rave as i couldn't see it on their site?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Nope jampit has gone , try the Sumtran jajong from their instead ......


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

I think I must have gotten one of the last lots of Jampit, the machine is very easy to use and change temps, the coffee I'm drinking at the moment I decided to take the temp up to 95 just to see what effect it had in the cup, not drunk any yet. Again the preinfusion is easy enough to play with as well, I think that maybe it would be nice if you could drop that lower than 5 bar and again the timing setting are easy to adjust. The only niggle is the advanced menu which is accessed from the machine being in standby, by holding the 1 cup button and powering it up, however once you change a setting it goes back to being on and you have to repeat the procedure to access another advanced function, but there isn't that much in that menu you would want to adjust all the time and many menu driven devices suffer from this type of niggle and it is just a niggle. I haven't touched the flow and volumetrics yet that will wait for another day I didnt even change the grinder setting to dial in for the DB as I only had a few shots worth left of the Pact blend.

Also just to cover another point before my Dad reads this and takes me to task ( he's a well renowned materials scientist) there is nothing wrong with the use of composites if done properly they are good enough for the aerospace industry and military uses in vehicles and armour for both personnel and vehicles so should be fine for an espresso machine that is unlikely to spend it's life being knocked around and moved frequently.


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## mfaller (Sep 16, 2013)

big dan said:


> I must admit i went into John Lewis again the other day and had another look at the machine. It's fit and finish is very nice and i was one of the people who called it "placticky", i guess i should take that back a bit by saying that it does have a nice brushed steel exterio, however this is just a skin or plating over a plastic or composite material as opposed to the all chromed steel of some other prosumer machines. It does look well put together though


I too had a look at this in JL. I'd say that my main observation is the the knob on the side that adjusts the grind size doesn't have a nice feel to it - it did not feel very smooth to me - and it's not as heavy as it looks: also the grind scale is not very clear; all the ticks are the same size - it would be nice to have a "5" marker for instance like you get on a ruler. Nice and quiet though I thought as the nice lady ran some beans through it (but she didn't make me a coffee)


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## specialpants (Jun 25, 2013)

Behold... the naked handle for the Sage.

I picked the BES920 last week and still using the beans that were thrown in as a bonus. I cant wait to get fresh beans and start using the naked handle


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Where did you get the naked from?


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## specialpants (Jun 25, 2013)

garydyke1 said:


> Where did you get the naked from?


Hey Gary. I had one from my BES900 back in Aust. The bad news as I found out yesterday this morning is that it doesnt fit perfectly on the BES920.

I'll take a photo whenever I get around to it, but the stem (connection between basket holder + plastic handle) is shaped like a cylinder on the BES900. The stem on the 920 has a small section cut out which leaves it with a flat surface... which provides clearance for the portafilter to lock into group head.

I might take it into a key cutter to see if they can do something. If anyone has any other ideas, please let me know


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Sage sent me one for their scace which I was using for a while. Maybe email them and ask


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

How many do you get with the Sage? Could always get a spare machined.


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

You get one stainless steel portafilter and 4 baskets 3 of which will never see any use lol, the single normal and the 2 double wall pressurised ones. I think I'm going to give BB a call to see if they have found a naked that will fit the Sage now it's mine, my HD Gaggia naked will fit and doesn't leak but goes in at a very peculiar angle. I also fancy trying to find a different steam tip with slightly bigger holes, just need to measure the thread.


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## Jon12345 (Dec 2, 2013)

Charlie, what do you mean now its yours? Did you buy the Sage?


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

Jon12345 said:


> Charlie, what do you mean now its yours? Did you buy the Sage?


Yes Jon they made me an offer that would have been crazy to say no to pricewise.


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## Jon12345 (Dec 2, 2013)

Oh lucky you! Well, that is too of us then but I paid full price, unfortunately.


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## DarrenH (Jan 11, 2014)

I bought this machine and been playing around with all week. The beans aren't the most fresh (roasted about a month and a bit ago, was a free sample) but pretty good nevertheless. Steam wand is great, very powerful and easy to get microfoam. Beautiful machine!


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## Glenn (Jun 14, 2008)

Welcome to Coffee Forums UK DarrenH

Is this your first machine or is this an upgrade?

Please answer in an introduction thread. I'm sure you'll have a lot of interest from members as you get to know your machine


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