# Why not offering choice between dark and light roasts in cafes?



## mambro (Dec 7, 2013)

I happened to realise that most of the good cafes offers mostly light roasts.

Even when more than a kind of bean is offered the choice is usually between two light roasts, often between a blend and a single origin.

Being Italian I am used to very dark coffee, but I also appreciated a good light roast once in a while. Now I wonder, why there is no cafe offering both the styles?

Offering both the style is a good idea for two reasons:

1) For those who appreciate good coffee a wider choice is offered, which is always good

2) For those used to Costa and Cafe Nero, a coffee less shocking than an acidic light roast is offered. That would be a good way for an independent coffee to attract people uneducated about coffee offering something similar to what they expect, but of a much higher quality.

So why you think most of the place don't offer the choice between dark and light roast? It looks like a perfectly reasonable choice and it would also improve the business. attracting costumers of coffee chains.


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

I think you need to check out te Jay Rayner thread, this discussion occurred there and was done to death!


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## mambro (Dec 7, 2013)

You mean this? http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?17107-How-Hipsters-ruined-your-coffee


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

Yeah, that's the one. Enjoy the read


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)




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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

Charliej said:


>


My thoughts exactly.


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## mambro (Dec 7, 2013)

Yeah, I kind of read the thread (got tired at page 15).

Basically those who are against offering dark roasts states that darks roasts are bad and it is better to offer a wide choice of light roasts with different flavours.

On the other hand there are many good roasters selling dark roasts (Rave, Union, Coffee Compass). I don't see why they should be allowed to sell what some people like while coffee shops should stick on light roasts...


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

mambro said:


> I don't see why they should be allowed to sell what some people like while coffee shops should stick on light roasts...


Because it's a ( relatively) free market


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Ah no here goes another 199 page marathon


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## Thecatlinux (Mar 10, 2014)

garydyke1 said:



> Ah no here goes another 199 page marathon


only if other people reply to other peoples posts.


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## mambro (Dec 7, 2013)

jeebsy said:


> Because it's a ( relatively) free market


You are right, "should be allowed" is not the most correct choice of words.

What I am trying to understand is why we see many roaster selling dark roasts but basically no coffee shops offering them, and how come no coffee shops understood the potentially successful business of offering quality dark roasted espresso.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

mambro said:


> You are right, "should be allowed" is not the most correct choice of words.
> 
> What I am trying to understand is why we see many roaster selling dark roasts but basically no coffee shops offering them, and how come no coffee shops understood the potentially successful business of offering quality dark roasted espresso.


Did you read the other thread?


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## mambro (Dec 7, 2013)

aaronb said:


> Did you read the other thread?


Have you read my post #7?


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

''how come no coffee shops understood the potentially successful business of offering quality dark roasted espresso.''

Some coffee shops do.

The ones that don't - Perhaps that's not what they enjoy themselves?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

I'd say tastes up here are slightly darker - Lab Espresso have their own house blend but do guest espresso too. They had some Koppi on recently which differently didn't go down too well but the dark volcano coffee flew out the door. Avenue G use Monmouth (used to sell has bean too but don't any more) which is darker and papercup 's house blend is more dark choc flavours. Just depends what sells I suppose.


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

garydyke1 said:


> Ah no here goes another 199 page marathon


Groundhog Day - it's 6.00am!


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## Flibster (Aug 15, 2010)

*hugs knees and rocks backwards and forwards*


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## mambro (Dec 7, 2013)

garydyke1 said:


> The ones that don't - Perhaps that's not what they enjoy themselves?


That's something I don't undestand.

Let's compare it with pubs. We can roughly divide pubs in two categories: pubs with good beer, and pub serving just random industrial lagers.

Now usually pub with good beers in UK have a good selection of ales and at least one quality lager, even though I am sure most of the beer experts prefer ales over lagers. Why that? Because if I enter a pub with a friend who has always had just carling and carslberg maybe he wants to try a good lager before getting a complete different drink (an ale).

Even brewdog started to serve their lager...

With coffee it is usually not like that. Either you go to costa or to a light roast third wave coffee. There is nothing in the middle.



The Systemic Kid said:


> Groundhog Day - it's 6.00am!





Flibster said:


> *hugs knees and rocks backwards and forwards*


It is because of posts like these that the other topic became unreadable. So please stick to the topic.


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

mambro said:


> That's something I don't undestand.
> 
> Let's compare it with pubs. We can roughly divide pubs in two categories: pubs with good beer, and pub serving just random industrial lagers.
> 
> ...


You've just not been going into the right places, simply to avoid this discussion ad nauseam just do a forum search on the subject and you will find months worth of reading regarding the reasons why people disagree over 2 approaches to roasting coffee. TL: DR version horses for courses, it's fine to like what you like, if you don't like the coffee on offer simply don't go back there again, try somewhere else next time, try discussing your tastes with the barista, maybe they will have some form of brewed coffee to your taste or a guest espresso.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

mambro said:


> With coffee it is usually not like that. Either you go to costa or to a light roast third wave coffee. There is nothing in the middle.


You meant you want a semi-independent selling medium roasts? ;-)

Independent cafes are not synonymous with light roasts, at least not round here. I'd rather whatever the café sold, it did it with care & passion. Then I'd decide whether I liked what they did & return there, or not.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

There is a coffee shop here using Coffee Compass and doing well from it too.


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

Brewdogs lager is not lager!


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Neill said:


> Brewdogs lager is not lager!


It is a lager , well a Bohemian Pilsner.


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

garydyke1 said:


> It is a lager , well a Bohemian Pilsner.


Ok fair enough. The origin of a lager?


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Bottom fermenting yeast, developed in the Alpine regions ~400yrs ago, was typically darker than today, in fact many Bavarian breweries offer a dunkel (dark) variant of their lagers & wheat beers.

Lager/ale doesn't really have anything to do with colour of the beer, it's about whether the yeast sinks during fermentation, or floats on the top. Either can be dark or light. Not comparable to espresso roast really.


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## Scotford (Apr 24, 2014)

This again. Yay.

Rolled eyes at the ready.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Troll..........


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)




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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

you can lager an ale too, something like a cream ale benefits from extended lagering


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

garydyke1 said:


> you can lager an ale too, something like a cream ale benefits from extended lagering


What process does lagering actually refer to?


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Neill said:


> What process does lagering actually refer to?


https://byo.com/recipes-tag/item/1488-the-lowdown-on-lagering-advanced-brewing


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

garydyke1 said:


> https://byo.com/recipes-tag/item/1488-the-lowdown-on-lagering-advanced-brewing


Thanks. I understand a small percentage of the words in that but kind of get what it means. Particularly the lagering bit.


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

mambro said:


> I happened to realise that most of the good cafes offers mostly light roasts.


Errr... you hit the nail on the head, you've noticed that all of the good cafes offer lighter roasts, therefore light roasts are better. Fact!


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## mambro (Dec 7, 2013)

Xpenno said:


> Errr... you hit the nail on the head, you've noticed that all of the good cafes offer lighter roasts, therefore light roasts are better. Fact!


Err.. that is an UK situation. Go to Italy and all the good cafes serves dark roasts. Is that proving anything? NO!

We are not discussing which way of roasting is better. The point here is about choice. Why in the globalization era I to have to Italy to get a good quality dark roast?

You are from Birmingham. Birmingham is the second biggest city in UK. Still there is no cafe serving a good dark roast in Birmingham...


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

His comment was tongue in cheek I suspect


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Flibster said:


> *hugs knees and rocks backwards and forwards*


this comment was funny

we need more funny....


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

mambro said:


> . Still there is no cafe serving a good dark roast in Birmingham...


Last time I visited Urban coffee near snow hill, they had a very Italian-esq blend on.


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## Xpenno (Nov 12, 2012)

mambro said:


> Err.. that is an UK situation. Go to Italy and all the good cafes serves dark roasts. Is that proving anything? NO!
> 
> We are not discussing which way of roasting is better. The point here is about choice. Why in the globalization era I to have to Italy to get a good quality dark roast?
> 
> You are from Birmingham. Birmingham is the second biggest city in UK. Still there is no cafe serving a good dark roast in Birmingham...


Ok dude, take a chill pill, my comment was certainly tongue in cheek.

If you want a Darker Roast then head to somewhere like Booboo coffee in Harborne, they serve allpress redchurch which is pretty dark roast and is very nice on the Linea. There are also places such as Fallen Angel Cafe, Urban Coffee also serve darker roasts in Harborne but are slightly more generic (same as I've experienced in Italy TBH). If you are in town then there is also Urban Coffee and Coffee Lounge (out the back of New Street Station).


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## Thecatlinux (Mar 10, 2014)

Mrboots2u said:


> this comment was funny
> 
> we need more funny....


You mean, let me understand this &#8230; cuz I &#8230; maybe its me, maybe I'm a little f****d up maybe. I'm funny how? I mean funny, like I'm a clown? I amuse you? I make you laugh? I'm here to f*****' amuse you? Whattya you mean funny? Funny how? How am I funny?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Clown funny...


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

mambro said:


> Err.. that is an UK situation. Go to Italy and all the good cafes serves dark roasts. Is that proving anything? NO!


It proves Italy is still in the dark ages


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

jeebsy said:


> It proves Italy is still in the dark ages


Ha. Pun intended?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Aye, works on so many levels (two)


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## Neill (Jun 26, 2013)

jeebsy said:


> Aye, works on so many levels (two)


I guess it was the two levels that confused me


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