# Egg on my face - Barrista Express shot timer



## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Not totally sure about this but thought I would set a very short shot time on my BE so set it for 15 sec without the portafilter being fitted.







Then I ran a shot with coffee and wondered why I had to cancel the shot after 45 sec or so due to it being too long.

Looked in the manual and it states default shots 30ml for a single and 60 ml for a double.. Only conclusion I can reach is it works on volume not time. I hadn't noticed because I usually set it up while actually pulling a shot.

John

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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Not the actual number I wanted to achieve as the scales didn't keep up with the weight change so 35ml turned out to be about 38.5ml. That's what comes out if an empty pressurised basket is fitted or ordinary basket with coffee in it brewed at a higher pressure than the pressurised basket gives.








So looks like it's fitted with some sort of flow meter just like all rotary pump commercial machines seem to be. I've not really checked what happens if the OPV opens but it may be the same or maybe not.

John

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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Different bean, different basket, 14g instead of 10 and a bit, same grind and 43ml came out.

I have had the impression in the past that something seems to help keep the output volume constant but not perfectly so am still inclined to think it makes use of volume some how.

John

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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

It seems to be pretty consistent but one shot decided to give 48ml.








So looks like more different settings are needed to find out if it does work this way.

John

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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

I usually set up with coffee in the portafilter but will be trying another way. I used an empty pressurised basket and set for 15 sec shot time. Later I will see what that does with my grinds in it.

15 secs is a rather extreme ristretto setting but on a BE I think it's best to set that volume out rather than some ratio and reducing the shot time. The shot time will be longer with coffee in a basket. How much longer - need to find out. It could turn out to be too long.

John

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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

15sec is more likely to work for a long shot (lungo, caffe crema), ristrettos will generally need more shot time.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

It gave about 17 secs with coffee in. I also reduced the grinds weight to 13.4g. Oddly that's close to where the Sage razor tool would set it. 22ml came out. This is with the Sumatra bean. Interesting result. Nice light drink and no water after taste. It's herbal aspects were muted, slight acidity a bit more noticeable and syrupy - not that means it feels like I'm drink syrup. The puck showed that expansion was full but a bit more coffee could be added. 14.3g didn't allow full expansion really and resulted in a heavier drink.







I'll probably be working up to that again with this setting.

I'll try the same weight with the monsooned later. With that one 13.4g may be too much. I know that 14.3 is.

John

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## Missy (Mar 9, 2016)

I'm finding this utterly fascinating. It's good to see people making new forays into technique development.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Missy said:


> I'm finding this utterly fascinating. It's good to see people making new forays into technique development.


It's strictly on a BE really, maybe a DTP after fashion if the OPV setting is the same. I'd assume that one does use timed shots.

With 13g of monsooned the same setting gave 20ml and a pretty boring drink. Way too light for the bean. So set up the same way for 20 sec with the empty dual wall basket. 40ml came out, shot lasted a bit over 30 sec. The tasting description for this one is "Rich, smoky and earthy coffee with a monotone smoothness and a sweet spicy kick." I've no idea where smoky and earthy comes from. Rich and monotone yes no problem with that. Getting the sweet spicy kick is elusive. This shot had a bit of that but masked somewhat by the general taste. Some sites use the word bitter but it isn't, Also seen one that says indescribable. I'd say it tastes how some might expect strong rich coffee to taste but it does lack bitterness and no signs of acidity.

So breakfast shot will be set the same way for 17.5 secs.







I do like what comes out when I hammer 9.3g in the normal Sage single - finer grind and some going out of the OPV. I've never been happy about the spicy kick aspect though. It gives none of that at all really. I have obtained it with a darker medium roast that wasn't oily at all in that but it wasn't strong enough.

The difference in output for increasing the time is down to each having the same 10 sec infusion. Followed by "10 sec at full pressure in one case and 20 secs for the other so more came out, infusion more or less the same in both cases. I'm trying to work without opening the OPV.

John

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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

17.5 sec set that way gave me 30ml out which I think does fit in with ristretto.







Problem though - a too much coffee unbalanced taste even having gone down to 12.8g.







Afraid I forgot to time it.

So that's the end of the 14g basket and monsooned. Wet pucks would start cropping up much below 12.8. I wont put up with that. They mess the machine up and lead to channelling when that happens.

John

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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

ajohn said:


> 17.5 sec set that way gave me 30ml out which I think does fit in with ristretto.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


"Ristretto" is subjective, if we take ml as a proxy for grams, your ratio is about 1:2.34, or about the same as a typical, long-ish, EK43 shot. The problem with the coffee tasting off surely means that, whatever you call it, it didn't work? What % of the population want unbalanced coffee tastes, you clearly don't.

Ristretto, normale, lungo, drip, French press - it's all supposed to taste nice. You can make any of them with a defect.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Back on the 10g basket with 10 in it. Same setting, 25 sec, 33ml and what I would call a slightly weak monsooned compared with what I normally drink. 10g is a bit light for the basket. Much more complex taste though.

The problem with a too much coffee taste is that it kills more subtle tastes that the coffee may be able to give. Hence no more monsooned in the 14g, I wont achieve a half way house with it reliably. It's will either have the too much coffee taste or be far too weak and chances of hitting anything between are remote. So yes - worth going through it but it wont work. The Sumatra bean has worked out.

I also tried higher loads in the 14g, over filling, That when it changes taste give a drink that can be obtained with a slightly over filled 10g using less coffee - that is what I will probably finish up using. Or go back to hammering it really hard with the OPV opening. On a BE that means a grind that restricts flow at 15 bar.

John

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