# Eureka Mignon Specialita Vs Niche Zero



## Russjmills (Aug 30, 2016)

For those that have used both. Is the Niche so much better that it justifies the extra £150.

I produce about 4 shots a day which from next week will be on a lelit Mara

Thanks


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Russjmills said:


> For those that have used both. Is the Niche so much better that it justifies the extra £150.
> 
> I produce about 4 shots a day which from next week will be on a lelit Mara
> 
> Thanks


well the genuine Mazzer Kony burrs in the Niche cost £110+ if you see them cheaper they will be Italmill non OEM burrs and the Italmill ones are nowhere near as good and failed testing. The 55mm burrs in the Eureka cost around 4 times less. A 63mm conical is pretty much the equivalent of a 75-80mm flat. So is it worth the £150 extra, for sure. Will you like it more and flat vs conical...only you can know. I know which I would choose.

Plus the lack of purging alone means the Niche pays for itself after 8 years vs the other grinder....based on your consumption and the fact that it will save you wasting around 4.5kg of coffee per year (@15 per Kilo) due to not having to purge and getting exact weight out.

P.S. It's harder than you think to get genuine Mazzer burrs and a lot of places who list them as genuine are selling non OEM inferior Italmill ones, I know this from the testing I did!


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## Nikko (Aug 20, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> well the genuine Mazzer Kony burrs in the Niche cost £110+ if you see them cheaper they will be Italmill non OEM burrs and the Italmill ones are nowhere near as good and failed testing. The 55mm burrs in the Eureka cost around 4 times less. A 63mm conical is pretty much the equivalent of a 75-80mm flat. So is it worth the £150 extra, for sure. Will you like it more and flat vs conical...only you can know. I know which I would choose.
> 
> Plus the lack of purging alone means the Niche pays for itself after 8 years vs the other grinder....based on your consumption and the fact that it will save you wasting around 4.5kg of coffee per year (@15 per Kilo) due to not having to purge and getting exact weight out.
> 
> P.S. It's harder than you think to get genuine Mazzer burrs and a lot of places who list them as genuine are selling non OEM inferior Italmill ones, I know this from the testing I did!


Care to share the results of your tests? What did you test, in what way did the Italmill burrs fail. How do you define burr quality?


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

No experience with Eureka grinders, but if you are happy to run the same bean with a hopper and prefer lighter roasts, you might be better off with Niche.

Niche had rounded/muddy taste profile compared to other flat burr grinders I have tried (albeit larger burr size, 83mm/98mm).


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## Nikko (Aug 20, 2014)

According to the Niche review the Italmill burrs did not fail the test. It was the Niche which failed because it is too weak and flimsy for these burrs. The Niche's failure to drive the Italmill burrs says nothing about the quality of the Mignon grinder.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

When you design something, you design it to produce the best outcome that you can achieve, within the confines of design, price and the likes. The Niche was never designed to take Mazzer burrs. It came with other burrs but the reviewer suggested that it would be a better advert for the product if genuine mazzer burrs were used, as after all they are well considered within the industry. When the two sets of burrs were compared, the Mazzer burrs produced a better set of results than the others, so despite the obvious cost disadvantage, they were selected.

Stop talking your usual vitriolic bollocks Nikko. if you do not like this forum then piss off


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Russjmills said:


> For those that have used both. Is the Niche so much better that it justifies the extra £150.
> 
> I produce about 4 shots a day which from next week will be on a lelit Mara
> 
> Thanks


Cup quality is quite a subjective thing, but there are some other differences.

Ive used other mignon grinders if not this one. Alot seems to be made of the digital interface and timer, those things seem to be "noise" to me.

Niche - If you drink brewed it's easier to dial back and forth, I don't like the adjustment mechanism on the eureka grinders.

It's retain less , well practically nothing , and is a true "single doser".

DO you want to single dose?

Is this enough along with some potential in the cup benefits to warrant £150, depends how much cash you have.


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## Nikko (Aug 20, 2014)

dfk41 said:


> When you design something, you design it to produce the best outcome that you can achieve, within the confines of design, price and the likes. The Niche was never designed to take Mazzer burrs. It came with other burrs but the reviewer suggested that it would be a better advert for the product if genuine mazzer burrs were used, as after all they are well considered within the industry. When the two sets of burrs were compared, the Mazzer burrs produced a better set of results than the others, so despite the obvious cost disadvantage, they were selected.
> 
> Stop talking your usual vitriolic bollocks Nikko. if you do not like this forum then piss off


You are making it up. Davecuk says quite clearly in his review that Niche adked him to test 2 sets of burrs and his findings were that the Niche could not manage set B, later identified as Italmill. Why do you need to distort?


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## Russjmills (Aug 30, 2016)

Ended up getting neither . Bought a nearly new mazzer mini from coffeeguy who I bought my last grinder from.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Nikko said:


> You are making it up. Davecuk says quite clearly in his review that Niche adked him to test 2 sets of burrs and his findings were that the Niche could not manage set B, later identified as Italmill. Why do you need to distort?


Rubbish, the report suggests two sets of burrs were tested. Niche were in favour of the cheaper set (obviously). After testing the advice was to put in the dearer burrs. Do you want a grinder that is capable of self destructing


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## Fez (Dec 31, 2018)

Really don't know why you entertain Nikko @dfk41

At least we all get a chuckle from these comments


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Nikko said:


> Care to share the results of your tests? What did you test, in what way did the Italmill burrs fail. How do you define burr quality?


Most of them here but not the reasons for dismissing the stainless burrs - assuming they were stainless.

https://www.nichecoffee.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Niche-zero-review.pdf

There are all sort of swings and roundabout concerning the OP's question as to if it's worth the extra. Just 2 of them.

People might be inclined to think that a grinder with a timer on it will always generate the same dose of grinds. For the accuracy people often want the time setting will need changing from time to time. Also there will be stale grinds left in the grinder when ever there is a period such as over night when the grinder isn't being used. This means wasting some grind before the first shot of the day to get rid of them. If this isn't done the shot very probably wont pull as it does when they aren't there. So people often decide to weigh a dose of beans into a grinder and grind the lot and then attempt to get all of the grinds out leaving none behind. I have been achieving that for several month, what went in came out and extremely low retention ( a certain amount that one way or the other remains in the grinder). It's an extremely tedious process involving several spin up of the grinder and several uses of a small brush plus a rubber lens hood that in my case often doesn't add to the process but sometimes does. I wouldn't even contemplate trying to do this on a mignon as I don't think I would get the same precise results.

Niche apart from when certain items in it are cleaned what goes in comes out. The change when parts have been cleaned is small and soon goes away - takes just one shot in my case so I added an extra 2 beans on the first one. A more thorough clean might need a few more.

Then comes quality of the grinds. Nice fluffy ones that are free from clumps tend to be favoured. Clumping if firm enough interferes with water flow through the puck and it's variable. People do all sorts with some grinders to minimise it such as stirring up the grinds. With the beans I use most that makes the clumping worse - that wont be true of all beans. I'm currently not stirring Niche grinds. I have done and it didn't cause any problems probably because it would be a bit extreme to call what it puts out clumps even with the bean I am using.

Niche gives very fluffy grinds as it comes.

Last taste of the coffee. Difficult. There have been comments - lacks the "punch" that big flat burrs give. Earthy taste clearly apparent. Personally I found that when I change any piece of the equipment I use to make my coffee some retuning is needed to get the taste I want. In my case a slight change to tuning has produced more "punch" compared with 64mm burrs. Also on another bean I am using that is well known for a level of acidity it's easier to control and may require a higher ratio than I usually use. Grind setting changes even tiny ones are very easy to make on Niche. Not sure another grinder I use that has a worm wheel type adjustment can match it for that - it also has no scale so rather difficult to reset to different places.

Another aspect largely based on a totally different conical burr grinder I have used is that conical are less susceptible to several things that can have an effect on flat. It will take months to find out if Niche is the same. I'm inclined to feel it will move things in the right direction for easier use.

John

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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

People can compare to "big flat burrs" and lack of pucnch or taste differences but most people wo are after one of these are not in the market for a big commercial flat burr grinder.

Would people make a similar comparison between a small eureka grinder and a mythos , probably not. So why make it between a Niche and an Ek...


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## Nikko (Aug 20, 2014)

dfk41 said:


> Rubbish, the report suggests two sets of burrs were tested. Niche were in favour of the cheaper set (obviously). After testing the advice was to put in the dearer burrs. Do you want a grinder that is capable of self destructing


Glad to hear that you agree with what I wrote. I can well imagine that Niche were initially in favour of the cheaper burr set but went along with the more expensive one because their grinder could have self destructed with the cheaper burrs as you correctly say. That is not a reflection on the cheaper burrs but on the Niche grinder, particular as the reviewer found the grind quality of both burrs to be the same. To make a virtue out of using the more expensive Mazzer burrs on account of the Niche's flimsyness to handle the Italmill burrs is misleading.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Nikko said:


> Glad to hear that you agree with what I wrote. I can well imagine that Niche were initially in favour of the cheaper burr set but went along with the more expensive one because their grinder could have self destructed with the cheaper burrs as you correctly say. That is not a reflection on the cheaper burrs but on the Niche grinder, particular as the reviewer found the grind quality of both burrs to be the same. To make a virtue out of using the more expensive Mazzer burrs on account of the Niche's flimsyness to handle the Italmill burrs is misleading.


You don't seem adverse to doing a little misleading yourself.

Niche had a choice of 2 burrs, one presented greater loads on the motor with no advantage in any other respect. Which would you want in your grinder?


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## Nicknak (Aug 10, 2018)

I have just read the review again .. But from what I read the Niche ( which I don't have) has a device to stop the motor when it jams .. One burr set did jam on a very hard lightly roasted bean at a finer grind than any of us espresso head would use on a bean that you might not use in an espresso machine .. One burr set was recommended because it didn't jam on the same setting because of the way it breaks the beans before it grinds them .. At no point in the review does it mention the Niche was going to break because of the safe guard on the internals and motor ..


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

If that is your interpretation, then that is fine. Please can you confirm your interest in all of this. Why do you seem hellbent on attacking both the Niche project and the reviewer. Are you miffed that no one asked you your opinion on a £500 grinder aimed at use solely in the domestic market and actually fulfils its stated aims.

If you are not careful, people might simply think of you as bitter and twisted with an axe to grind


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## Nikko (Aug 20, 2014)

MWJB said:


> You don't seem adverse to doing a little misleading yourself.
> 
> Niche had a choice of 2 burrs, one presented greater loads on the motor with no advantage in any other respect. Which would you want in your grinder?


Indeed, one burr set presented a greater load on the motor in return for greater throughput. Whether you consider greater throughput an advantage is up to you, but clearly the Niche grinder could not handle that burr set reliably. I do not believe there is anything misleading in what I said.


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> When you design something, you design it to produce the best outcome that you can achieve, within the confines of design, price and the likes. The Niche was never designed to take Mazzer burrs. It came with other burrs but the reviewer suggested that it would be a better advert for the product if genuine mazzer burrs were used, as after all they are well considered within the industry. When the two sets of burrs were compared, the Mazzer burrs produced a better set of results than the others, so despite the obvious cost disadvantage, they were selected.
> 
> Stop talking your usual vitriolic bollocks Nikko. if you do not like this forum then piss off


Bit strong Dave - too strong for me, I have to admit.

No need for the final paragraph? fair play to Nikko to keeping objective and respectful.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Nikko said:


> Indeed, one burr set presented a greater load on the motor in return for greater throughput. Whether you consider greater throughput an advantage is up to you, but clearly the Niche grinder could not handle that burr set reliably. I do not believe there is anything misleading in what I said.


Faster grind is related to how aggressive the burr cuts, which increases load on the motor, it's swings & roundabouts.

You haven't quantified "flimsyness" with a part life, or failure rate (which would be irrelevant, as this change was made prior to production).

Flimsy - unsubstantial, easily damaged. Your data on this comes from where?


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

kennyboy993 said:


> Bit strong Dave - too strong for me, I have to admit.
> 
> No need for the final paragraph? fair play to Nikko to keeping objective and respectful.


Yes, I should have added......and don't come back.......there is nothing objective or respectful about his attacks and you are mad if you think they are.....what did you think of his use of the word 'schill' then in relation to @DavecUK Kenny


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## kennyboy993 (Jan 23, 2017)

It didn't jump out Dave - unlike your direct suggestion a forum member should 'p*ss off'.

Certainly made my 5 mins break from work with a nice cuppa not what I expected. In my head - seeing your user ID on a thread usually means cutting through lots of bull sh*t and helping me learn something - not on this one :-(

I'll come off the thread.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

It's a coffee grinder.....

Take a chill pill Dave


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

kennyboy993 said:


> It didn't jump out Dave - unlike your direct suggestion a forum member should 'p*ss off'.
> 
> Certainly made my 5 mins break from work with a nice cuppa not what I expected. In my head - seeing your user ID on a thread usually means cutting through lots of bull sh*t and helping me learn something - not on this one :-(
> 
> I'll come off the thread.


Kenny, I have no beef with you. however, you cannot really have a pop at me if you see nothing wrong with his comments re schill....

A shill, also called a plant or a stooge, is a person who publicly helps or gives credibility to a person or organization without disclosing that they have a close relationship with the person or organization. Wikipedia

Puts you rather in the position, of agreeing or disagreeing, unless of course you hide


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## Nikko (Aug 20, 2014)

dfk41 said:


> If that is your interpretation, then that is fine. Please can you confirm your interest in all of this. Why do you seem hellbent on attacking both the Niche project and the reviewer. Are you miffed that no one asked you your opinion on a £500 grinder aimed at use solely in the domestic market and actually fulfils its stated aims.
> 
> If you are not careful, people might simply think of you as bitter and twisted with an axe to grind


you misunderstand if you think I am attacking the Niche - I have no financial interest in promoting or dissing any grinder. I was simply pointing out that recommending the Niche over the Eureka by making a virtue out of the Niche's inability to drive the Italmill burrs is misleading.

As it happens the OP chose a Mazzer mini. Not a bad choice in my view but not a popular one with many on this site, largely due to another davecuk review for Bellabarista, where he was using some very dodgy science to prove the superiority of the Eureka 65 over the Mini because it was absorbing more power. His reviews are rather lacking in consistency would you not say. Still good to hear that he is now a big fan of Mazzer burrs.


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## Nikko (Aug 20, 2014)

MWJB said:


> Faster grind is related to how aggressive the burr cuts, which increases load on the motor, it's swings & roundabouts.
> 
> You haven't quantified "flimsyness" with a part life, or failure rate (which would be irrelevant, as this change was made prior to production).
> 
> Flimsy - unsubstantial, easily damaged. Your data on this comes from where?


My data on this comes from the Davecuk review, where he says that with the burr set B the grinder stalls. The reason for stalling is a motor of insufficent power and the consequence is self destruction. I said the Niche was flimsy with respect to the burr set B.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Some of the above is pointless in some ways. Niche is not intended to be as wear robust as a commercial grinder. It's aim in life is simpler home use as their web site mentions. It looks to me that it succeeds in that respect. Spares will also be readily available so parts that can wear or get damaged can be replaced. I can hazard a guess as to which part I might find myself replacing first - doesn't worry me providing pricing isn't at a level that says buy another grinder. Eg I found some where far away that sells Sage O rings for around $10 each. Much cheaper than buying a new machine but clearly ridiculous. The cost of Dyson filters is very likely to cause me to stop buying the brand.

There has been a sort of query about motor protection. We know from comments that it's a 10k rpm motor which sets it's type, probably not brushless. Motor design is a pretty specialised subject but essentially a motor will try to take as much current as it needs to get it to turn. The limit is the resistance of the windings which for various reasons can't be too high related to the power the motor needs to provide and also it's size. So if one is stalled best thing to do is switch of quickly. Protection from stall currents isn't something I have often seen other than when it's been designed in. The result is a lot less power from the same volume of motor. Lots of things are protected from long term use or overloads of sufficient duration to cause the motor to heat up to worrying levels. The usual way is via the heat of the body of the motor. It generally y results in a fairly long period before it resets as motors can gain heat quickly but only loose it slowly. The manual suggests Niche uses that but who knows some one some where may have come up with a little box of tricks. Personally I would wonder about the use of a fuse.

John

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## webdoc (Jan 22, 2019)

Nikko said:


> My data on this comes from the Davecuk review, where he says that with the burr set B the grinder stalls. The reason for stalling is a motor of insufficent power and the consequence is self destruction. I said the Niche was flimsy with respect to the burr set B.


Have you ever heard of the famous K30? Well it stalled like a [email protected] on light roasts and it kept happening over and over again, brand new grinder. It went as far as the roastery not using the PEAK on these roasts as it jammed it too. They have an EK43 for these kinds of roasts.

So please don't tell me about a 500pound grinder that jams with a set of TESTING burrs, no matter what burrs, its irrelevant, the end product works. That is just smearing from your part and a lapse in logic, that is all.


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## Rnash (Jul 20, 2018)

Russjmills said:


> For those that have used both. Is the Niche so much better that it justifies the extra £150.
> 
> I produce about 4 shots a day which from next week will be on a lelit Mara
> 
> Thanks


-----

on the look look out for a grinder myself. Drink mainly espresso but have recently got into drip etc. Thought about the Perfetto originally as I wanted an all purpose grinder and the larger burred Specialita is apparently a devil to go from espresso to drip grind size. Then I heard about the Niche and the ease with which one can go from fine to coarse. I definitely like the more fruity coffee but will try everything. Has anyone here had an experience with the perfetto; there are lots of niche reviews. Is it better quality at the coarser end than the fine?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Rnash said:


> -----
> 
> on the look look out for a grinder myself. Drink mainly espresso but have recently got into drip etc. Thought about the Perfetto originally as I wanted an all purpose grinder and the larger burred Specialita is apparently a devil to go from espresso to drip grind size. Then I heard about the Niche and the ease with which one can go from fine to coarse. I definitely like the more fruity coffee but will try everything. Has anyone here had an experience with the perfetto; there are lots of niche reviews. Is it better quality at the coarser end than the fine?


I would be focusing on the ease of use aspect of going from coarse to fine and back again with the niche.snd the subsequent saving of coffee through the lack of retention.

Both should make tasty drip when dialled in accordingly


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## Egglet (Apr 16, 2014)

Sorry to start this thread again, I've narrowed my choice of grinders to these 2 + the new atom. Anyone got any insight/impressions of the new atom? I'm generally a lighter roasted coffee bean producing a espresso or a lattebor somewhere in between person.

Egglet


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Egglet said:


> Sorry to start this thread again, I've narrowed my choice of grinders to these 2 + the new atom. Anyone got any insight/impressions of the new atom? I'm generally a lighter roasted coffee bean producing a espresso or a lattebor somewhere in between person.
> 
> Egglet


Is single dosing a primary concern to you? Do you want to chop and change beans over the course of the week or do you stick to one bean for a period of time.

The atom will be designed to run with some beans in the hopper.


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## Egglet (Apr 16, 2014)

Not hugely so. Generally I put enough beans in the hopper to last me 2d or so. Haven't really tried single dosing so I can't comment much, but I don't really see myself doing it!

Would your suggestion likely then be the new atoms?

Egglet.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Egglet said:


> Not hugely so. Generally I put enough beans in the hopper to last me 2d or so. Haven't really tried single dosing so I can't comment much, but I don't really see myself doing it!
> 
> Would your suggestion likely then be the new atoms?
> 
> Egglet.


Well that is one of the major features of the niche.

Niche , weight beans , add to grinder grind into a cup, transfer to pf.

Atom . grind direct into pf ( i would weigh dose from here, but you may not currently do that )

Probably a case of which suits your workflow better to me.


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## Egglet (Apr 16, 2014)

I do currently weigh my pf for dosing, give a nice stir for the clumps, tamp and away we go.

Single dosing is an interesting proposition I have to say. But in terms of complaints about the atom I take it there isn't any?

Egglet


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

if it helps anyone here, I've had a chance to use the Specialita at length and I think its a superb little machine. So much so that i'll probably put my money where my mouth is and buy one.

Build quality is lovely, has a great solidity to it, and with the new touchscreen interface its a delight to use.

Grinds are fluffy, non clumpy and fast. In fact it seems to grind almost as fast as my Mazzer Super Jolly but with less mess and hassle.

Quiet, easy to adjust, good looking.... enough for me.

The niche doesn't do it for me, as it doesn't suit how I work with coffee. I always have a little coffee in a hopper and I tend to use the same blend day in day out, so for me being able to put 100g in the hopper of the specialita and just make small adjustments as I go, is much more my style.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

shrink said:


> if it helps anyone here, I've had a chance to use the Specialita at length and I think its a superb little machine. So much so that i'll probably put my money where my mouth is and buy one.
> 
> Build quality is lovely, has a great solidity to it, and with the new touchscreen interface its a delight to use.
> 
> ...


Nice feeedback, they two grinders as you say suit different workflows and brew methods. That would be one of the primary reasons for choosing ne over another. If they workflow don't suit you , why buy a grinder that doesn't fit it.


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## Steve_S_T (Dec 7, 2012)

I tried my new Specialita out for the first time last night. Previously I've single dosed, weighing 17g of beans then grinding them in the Gaggia MDF. However, I do tend to work through one bag of beans at a time, so filling the Eureka hopper then just grinding as required will be a change but not a hardship. I'm retaining the MDF for grinding for coarser brews (saves making major adjustments to the Specialita, which would be a pain), so could easily adjust that for any single dosing requirements.

Loving the Specialita by the way, grinds are lovely and fluffy, no heavy clumping, and it's really quiet too. As Shrink says above, it's got a very solid feel to the build, is nicely weighty and looks great (I went for a chrome finish to match my Heavenly). Can't offer a comparison (other than to a very old Gaggia), but would happily recommend it.

*Steve*


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