# Gaggia Classic pre-2015 - Time to give up?



## PLug1n (Dec 15, 2019)

I have a Gaggia Classic bought for me as a Xmas present ~2005. It was imported from Italy and unusually is "gold" plated.

I've never succeeded in getting a non-bitter espresso with a reasonable crema. So this machine has probably not drawn more than 200 shots in its lifetime.

Over the years I have spent days reading Internet advice, descaling, sourcing fresh beans, etc.

Everything works almost as expected, but the result is bitter and almost crema-free.

Even with 14gm+ in the double basket, well tamped, and a grind as low as 3 in the MDF grinder, I get a fast flow, bitter espresso and no crema.

As this could be the common "too high" factory pressure setting, my latest effort was to adjust the OPV valve to try for a measured 9 bar.

I ordered the Ebay "Clip-in Pressure Gauge for Gaggia Naked Bottomless Portafilter Handle".

As this handles a max of 11 bar, I turned the OPV adjustment screw a couple of turns anti-clockwise before using to try and avoid death and destruction of the new gauge.

To my surprise, the highest pressure I can obtain is 8 bar, even if the adjuster is is screwed in to compress the spring completely. I even took the OPV Valve assembly off and soaked in citric acid solution for a while, This only allowed the adjuster screw to move more freely.

I just don't understand how a low pressure produces such a strong flow - maybe the gauge is off?

Is there anything I should consider before giving up? The only things I can think of are a new solenoid and/or OPV valve - but these still look almost new.

Thanks for any pointers.


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## Jollybean (May 19, 2013)

Do you let the machine heat up for at least half an hour, ideally 45 minutes before using? You need to weigh your shot and the time it takes to be able to see how fast the flow is. Try grinding finer and see how it tastes ?


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## MrShades (Jul 29, 2009)

Where are you based? Perhaps someone with good knowledge of Classics and is local would pop round and help

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

For the bitterness have you removed and cleaned the shower screen and the dispersion block behind. These tend to get heavily coated in stale coffee oil and will give a bitter off taste.

Is the grinder adjustment " stepped" ? can you grind finer or does this produce chokers?

How are you storing your fresh beans ? For how long in use ?

Try increasing the dose to 16 gms and stop it short.

PS Is the seal on the OPV nicked / hard or damaged ? Is the seat ( where the seal sits) damaged ?


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## PLug1n (Dec 15, 2019)

Thanks for the ideas but have tried most of these.

I just tried 16gm in the bottomless portafilter after a 40 minute warm-up. Grind on the MDF set to 6 (5-8 seems to be the recommendation for espresso) Draw for a double shot was 20 seconds before the flow turned blond.

Only semi-bitter but hardly a hint of crema. Grinding smaller (2 or 3) becomes very bitter, flow is slower but still relatively quick.

OPV seal is not damaged. I've been replacing the top cover firmly using a 17mm socket and wrench but do not see much water in the return tube, so maybe the pressure is low.

I actually get much better results on a Rok.

I've cleaned the screen and holder, flow is coming through all 4 holes in the screen holder.

Beans were roasted 6 days ago and I keep them in the freezer. I've tried all grind settings and pre-ground such as Lavazza Espresso.

Really stuck!


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

One of the biggest problems is the Gaggia MDF grinder...I had one more than 20 years ago, couldn't believe how much I got for it on ebay my gain someone else loss. Replacing the grinder would be a sensible first step (and yes the grinder is stepped) to make as a good grinder will benefit your current machine and any future machines/coffee prep methods.

Now it may be that your MDF was brand new with the machine and has only ground 200 times....this would be the reasonable *assumption* we would all make based on your post. Or it may be you got the machine and then purchased a used MDF. Sadly it doesn't matter which. It's will just be bad and badder.

Lack of crema, quick flows inconsistent flows, poor taste....each one can have different reasons, but the combination usually indicates grinder. I exclude coffee because you state it's fresh roasted again we are forced to* assume* is it's from a reputable roaster, packed properly when you receive it and with a roast date on the bag.

Temperature, warmup, prep, pressure etc.. unless all these are very much out of kilter, Occam's razor applies.....*change the grinder and then work the problem from there.*


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## PLug1n (Dec 15, 2019)

DavecUK said:


> .....*change the grinder and then work the problem from there.*


 The MDF was new a few years later than the Classic but has been used a lot for family filter coffee.

Beans are from Café Hormozi via Ebay, current batch has date of 09/12/2019, i.e. 6 days ago!

I have a Rok grinder so will try that for the Classic.

Heads off to the attic......


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## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

The MDF has 2 major flaws for espresso. The steps are too large (which can be mitigated somewhat by modding to stepless so you can stop between numbers but even so, the rate of adjustment is still very aggressive) & it has a killer retention so you'll be finding about 4g of coffee from your previous grind exchanging each time. I struggled for just under a year with mine (usually somewhere between 1 & 3) before upgrading to a Eureka Mignon MK2. Even though it's burrs are the same size (50mm), the differences are night & day. Still use the MDF for Syphon where grind isn't so critical.


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## PLug1n (Dec 15, 2019)

Many thanks to all, one major problem is indeed the MDF grinder.

With a first try on the Classic using the Rok grinder, the draw increased to 60 seconds and produced a reasonable crema. Maybe this was too fine on the grind, but I will experiment.


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

Yeh the MDF grinder isn't great. If you are blonding after 20 secs the grind is too coarse/inconsistent. 
The classic should have more than enough pressure, you just need to learn how to surf the temp.

FWIW I use 18-19g in a double basket on the gaggia and get a great crema.

also why are you keeping your beans in the freezer? Don't do that! 
It's an odd myth that doesn't die. Keep them air sealed in the dark. A one way valve if less than a week old to allow degassing.


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## Bean2Trail (Jan 14, 2020)

Damn, I've been getting the same issues for quite some time now and also have the MDF Grinder. Time for a change by the sounds of the above. Any preferences in which direction I should go to find a new suitable grinder?

Thanks in advance!


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## davewuff (Oct 26, 2012)

I'm curious. All this rubbishing of the MDF, does it apply to both versions? I have an earlier one, no idea of the date but built like a tank and extremely heavy. It looks more squat and the bean hopper is wider and not as tall. The burrs are a couple of years old.

Anyway the point is, it grinds perfectly and makes great coffee with perfect crema. I zeroed the scale (no, I have not bothered making it stepless) and grind at four. Even with supermarket beans I get great crema everytime with my totally unmodified (yet) classic. No bitterness. I make sure to pull water through (to warm the cup) and pull the shot when the light first comes back on. Other than that no fuss and bother. I am aware of the retention issue but I drink so much coffee the grinds would only ever be less than 12 hrs old! Am I just lucky or is it just the second gen MDF that is rubbish?


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## Batian (Oct 23, 2017)

TomHughes said:


> Yeh the MDF grinder isn't great. If you are blonding after 20 secs the grind is too coarse/inconsistent.
> The classic should have more than enough pressure, you just need to learn how to surf the temp.
> 
> FWIW I use 18-19g in a double basket on the gaggia and get a great crema.
> ...


 This thesis may provide food for thought?

https://www.nature.com/articles/srep24483

It was one hell of a way to get a Phd!


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