# recommended grinder for around £150



## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

i want to get a grinder just for my gaggia classic, so i'm not bothered whether it's stepped or not - would seem that stepless might give me greater control.

i've searched the forum a bit but i'm still not sure as to the best option. from glenn's very helpful sticky, it would seem i should be considering:

Fracino Piccino

Iberital MC2

Baratza Maestro Plus

Ascaso i-Mini

however, i'm looking for a grinder that is relatively compact, and hopefully not too noisy.

having done a small amount of research, it seems that the fracino piccino/i-mini are likely to be too noisy, the iberital (though obviously very good) too large (and to be honest not that attractive). this seems to leave the baratza maestro plus, but does it grind fine enough?

and is the gaggia mdf any good? seem to have read conflicting views on that.

does anyone have any views on this list based on what i'm looking for and are there any other options i should consider? any advice greatly appreciated.


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## chimpsinties (Jun 13, 2011)

I have the Baratza Virtuoso because I specifically want to get one that was stepped due to my grinding needs. It was about £175. It'll definitely grind fine enough for the Classic as that's what I use every day. It's small, powerful and reasonably quiet.

I do however wish I had the precision of a stepless grinder sometimes. Usually when a certain type of bean is being awkward to dial in and I just don't have the control I need but that doesn't happen very often cos you can just tamp a bit less/more etc.

I'm tempted to go up a level and trade in my Virtuoso for the Virtuoso Preciso which is both stepped and has fine tuning so best of both worlds. It gives 11 smaller steps between each bigger step effectively giving you over 400 steps or something. That is a very nice grinder but sadly it's always twice the price at about £300+


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

Personally I love my MDF. I have an Iberital MC2 at the moment too, as well as a Mazzer Super Jolly, so I'm able to make a few comparisons. For me the MDF is head and shoulders above the MC2. It is a much more sturdy piece of equipment, the motor quite simply sounds stronger, and it is (in my view) better to look at. I also think that if you get the base unit, the MDF and the Classic look good next to each other. The grind is very good for both espresso and brewed coffees, and it is very easily changed to become stepless. I wouldn't say it is quiet, but it's not hugely noisy either. It is the same size as the MC2.

Like all grinders though, you need to ensure the burrs aren't old and blunt.


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## coffeebean (Jan 26, 2010)

Fracino Heavenly grinder is worth considering too......http://www.thecoffeebean-vanandroaster.co.uk/Heavenly---Cherub.html


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## Flanners (Mar 21, 2011)

MikeHag said:


> Personally I love my MDF. I have an Iberital MC2 at the moment too, as well as a Mazzer Super Jolly, so I'm able to make a few comparisons. For me the MDF is head and shoulders above the MC2. It is a much more sturdy piece of equipment, the motor quite simply sounds stronger, and it is (in my view) better to look at. I also think that if you get the base unit, the MDF and the Classic look good next to each other. The grind is very good for both espresso and brewed coffees, and it is very easily changed to become stepless. I wouldn't say it is quiet, but it's not hugely noisy either. It is the same size as the MC2.
> 
> Like all grinders though, you need to ensure the burrs aren't old and blunt.


Good post I have an MDF and a Classic great combo and has been great for 13months I was looking around for a possible upgrade to the MDF I am not now going to bother as the ones you have were on my shortlist. Seems now not to be worth it.


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## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

thanks for all your advice and feedback. i'm sort of leaning towards the virtuoso even though it's a little bit more than i was aiming to pay. the francino heavenly is a bit too expensive and can't really find much info on it. i'm sure the mc2 is a great grinder but it looks a bit big and a bit industrial to me. still considering the gaggia mdf, but it may be a bit too big for my kitchen (limited space) and i think i'd rather have a doserless grinder.

is the virtuoso worth the extra over the maestro plus? some seem to think the maestro plus doesn't grind fine enough so i assume the virtuoso grinds finer than the maestro plus.


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## chimpsinties (Jun 13, 2011)

I'm pretty sure I've read somewhere that the Maestro isn't good enough too. I'm almost positive you wouldn't regret getting the Virtuoso, however, read my previous warning about always wanting more precision. In the future WHEN you get to be more of a perfectionist, you might want the extra settings that the MC2 provides and wouldn't care about the look of the thing to get it







That might be some way off in the future though. Can't you get a doserless MC2? I bet that looks smaller.

Over all though, I'd say go for it. You won't be disappointed. What's £25 now when you're enjoying perfect espresso for the next 10 years?

PS there is an easy way to adjust the virtuoso to give the finest grind possible using a small calibration screw. If you need it I'll dig the link out for you.


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## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

you're right, what's £25 over 10 years (not a lot! - even i can do that calculation - the price of one wishy washy starbucks abomination per year - still don't get why people keep going there!)

i've done a quick google - is this the link you were referring to?

http://www.espressotec.com/media/downloads/10/virtuoso_recalibration.pdf

by the way, why is the gaggia mdf not in glenn's price list? does he not rate it that highly?


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## chimpsinties (Jun 13, 2011)

Yeah. that's what I did with mine. There's a video on youtube of this woman doing it too.

I only did it after about 4 months. I think once the newness wears off it just needs a little tweak. It basically turned my zero setting to where -1 would probably have been if that makes sense. Now I tend to grind on setting 1 for a 25-30sec shot. So I have zero there if I've got some particularly "flat" beans or I want a ristretto but never really need to use it. I think my tamping/distribution style got much better around the same time so that might have been something to do with it too.

I don't know why the MDF isn't on the list. I seem to remember it not being that good compared to the others.


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## gazbea (Jul 11, 2011)

+1 for the Iberital MC2

I was in between the MC2 doserless and the Virtuoso but the money went on the MC2 in the end.

Decision for this? Well I decided that the extra control for espresso was what I wanted. Yes the Virtuoso looks pretty but I knew I would end up kicking myself if I needed a setting in between 2 steps. Espresso grind is very picky! Lol

In the end you need to weigh out the pros and cons of any of them. Decide what you want to use it for. Espresso only? Different brew methods? Would it be worth a cheaper second grinder for other coffee grind types?

Where the Virtuoso beats the MC2 is being able to switch between grind settings easily. But if you are only going to be doing Espresso, is the £80 premium (after freebies at Happy Donkey) actually worth it as you won't use the other grind settings and you will probably need granular control of the grind.

I agree that the MC2 isn't too pretty (it is better in the flesh than it is in the pictures) but it is a workhorse and with a load of freebies on offer too from Happy Donkey it brought the machine price down to about £120ish. I couldn't justify the extra £80 just because it looked nice and would be able to easily move between grind settings (but no guarantee though of it being exactly the same as you left it). Instead I spent a further £60 for a Cuisinart DPM8U @ John Lewis (with a great 5 year guarantee) for all my other grinding requirements









The thing I find most irritating is the timer calibration but I'll get there in the end either perfectly or an easy workaround.

In conclusion, happy as Larry with the decision and I got two good grinders for the same price as the Virtuoso and the freebies thrown in with the grinder wear a group head brush, 2 x 2oz shot glasses and a 500g bag of Italian Roast beans









I'm not trying to persuade you one way or another, just work out what you will be using the grinder for and weigh out the pros and cons.

If I had the choice again I wouldn't do anything different. If I had more money I would have gone for the Virtuoso Preciso or Vario


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## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

thanks gazbea, appreciate the advice and i guess if i go with the mc2 i can always stash it in a cupboard when not in use if i find it too unattractive. i only really want a grinder for espresso for the classic so the ability to easily switch between grinder settings is not relevant. form v function debate in my head - as a designer, form often wins but in an ideal world you get both. ultimately, what do i want a grinder for - a) to grind coffee beans or b) look pretty on a kitchen work top - it would be pretty silly to go for b) i guess


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

chimpsinties said:


> I don't know why the MDF isn't on the list. I seem to remember it not being that good compared to the others.


Funny thing about this forum is that there's a lot of 'received wisdom' and one opinion can quickly be perceived as fact if enough people repeat what they've read. The MDF is a good grinder. Better than MC2 IMHO. But the MC2 is doserless and that seems to appeal to people so it gets more votes. The stepless factor doesn't enter into it for me since making the MDF stepless is so easy.

I'd love to see stats on how many MC2 owners soon upgrade versus MDF owners.


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## gazbea (Jul 11, 2011)

MikeHag said:


> I'd love to see stats on how many MC2 owners soon upgrade versus MDF owners.


Did you upgrade to your Mazzer from an MDF Mike?







hehe


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

gazbea said:


> Did you upgrade to your Mazzer from an MDF Mike?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Glad you mentioned it







No. My mazzer is for my cafe business. The MDF is for home. I only have the mazzer at home until the cafe opens

I used the MDF for espresso fot a while at a cafe I worked at over summer, whilst their commercial machine was being fixed. The difference in espresso quality was not large. The main benefit of a commercial machine was speed.


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## gazbea (Jul 11, 2011)

Lol... Was just intrigued after seeing your signature


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## gazbea (Jul 11, 2011)

I've heard positive and negative for the MDF. At the end of the day it is down to personal preference.

To me the MDF is dosered, I actually think it looks uglier than the MC2 and it was out of my price bracket as new. The MDF price new is the same as the Baratza Virtuoso and if I was to pay that for the MDF, I'd have gone for the Virtuoso.

I know you can make the MDF stepless but this would probably invalidate you warranty.

Not only that, why buy a stepped grinder only to fudge it to make it stepless and invalidate the warranty in the process. If you want a stepped, get the Virtuoso. If you want stepless, get the MC2. The problem I see with the MDF as new is that it is out there in a world of its own and not knowing which direction to go in and is beaten by it's competitors in one form or another.

MDF vs Virtuoso - Price same, grind control is 1 better on the Virtuoso, Virtuoso is prettier and more versatile as it has a collection bin and for a small upgrade can be turned in to doserless without invalidating warranty.

MDF vs MC2 - MC2 is stepless by default without invalidating warranty giving greater degree of control. Doserless and easier to keep clean. MC2 is cheaper.

On a side not, does anybody else think that the MDF looks like a character from the Dire Straits - Money for Nothing music video?


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## MikeHag (Mar 13, 2011)

Oh I wouldn't suggest buying an MDF from new. But I'd rather have a 2nd hand MDF than a new MC2.

(BTW, the stepless mod on the MDF is completely reversible. All you basically do is remove the two step pins. They aren't even fastened in anyway, and can be put back in at any time)


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

You might find a Mazzer Mini or Super Jolly on fleabay for 150


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## gazbea (Jul 11, 2011)

just done a quick search nothing on the bay at the moment


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## gazbea (Jul 11, 2011)

In the end, it's your choice. All we can actually recommend is our actual experience of a product and our thought processes around choosing a product. There is no definitive right or wrong as everybody is different and this would be a boring forum if we all thought the same and had the same amount of money.

If you decide later on that it isn't quite what you need then there is always eBay.

Anybody can big up or play down products but whatever you choose it's gotta be better than the pre-ground supermarket tripe.

Would it be worth looking at hand grinders for a snip of £30 to get you started whilst you decide and see how you get on? Hario or porlex here. I haven't got either yet but will get a Porlex at some point in the future. Easily stored in a drawer, and out of sight. Or one of them box-drawer-style manual grinders. They look really nice and traditional but with the added bonus of being cheap and small


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## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

> All we can actually recommend is our actual experience of a product and our thought processes around choosing a product. There is no definitive right or wrong as everybody is different and this would be a boring forum if we all thought the same and had the same amount of money.


very true, and i am trying to get away from the 'supermarket tripe' as you put it. to the extent that i dug out what must be a 30 year old electric blade grinder that belonged to my mother and gave that a try. even though it doesn't really grind finely or consistently enough and it's clearly murdering the beans, the end result is still better than illy, lavazza or any other pre-ground stuff i've tried. which makes me realise i really should get a half decent grinder that can do the job properly.


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## gazbea (Jul 11, 2011)

Something is always better than nothing.

Completely agree with you on the pre-ground stuff... Just lacks so much flavour and definition. The blade grinder might be OK afterwards to keep for a french press on the delicate christmas and new years mornings... Might want to grind the night before though so it doesn't sound like a pneumatic drilling going off in your head!


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

gazbea said:


> just done a quick search nothing on the bay at the moment


keep an eye on this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/mazzer-srl-mini-timer-coffee-grinder-/150718721737?_trksid=p3286.m7&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D1%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D4866726954777736223


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## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

good spot, i'll keep an eye on that one


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