# 2nd Grinder (Conical)



## BH471 (Sep 25, 2020)

So, I tend to switch beans quite a lot and often have a low-caffeine coffee on the go along side. At the moment I have a Eureka Mignon Specialita but the switching between beans is growing tedious. My plan is to keep the Mignon but want another grinder to go along side it. I fancy a conical grinder and my initial thoughts were to get a hand grinder (Kinu M47) but I like the convenience of and on-demand grinder and some space.

So, my question is - the Mignon is a really great value flat burr grinder but what's is the conical equivalent?

F.Y.I, I'm ruling the the Niche out as I don't really fancy single dosing and the looks are important to me (yes I'm vain) and I prefer the transitional looks.

Any suggestions or talking points would be much appreciated.


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## profesor_historia (Sep 1, 2020)

BH471 said:


> So, I tend to switch beans quite a lot and often have a low-caffeine coffee on the go along side. At the moment I have a Eureka Mignon Specialita but the switching between beans is growing tedious. My plan is to keep the Mignon but want another grinder to go along side it. I fancy a conical grinder and my initial thoughts were to get a hand grinder (Kinu M47) but I like the convenience of and on-demand grinder and some space.
> So, my question is - the Mignon is a really great value flat burr grinder but what's is the conical equivalent?
> F.Y.I, I'm ruling the the Niche out as I don't really fancy single dosing and the looks are important to me (yes I'm vain) and I prefer the transitional looks.
> Any suggestions or talking points would be much appreciated.


Good question, somehow I am in the same situation, I always wanted to compare a big conical with a big flat, I have a Compak K10 conical and a Mazzer Super Jolly and my plan, unfinished yet, is to use them both for espresso, the conical for let's say some medium dark roast and the Mazzer with red speed lucidate burrs ( in the future) for lighter roasts and special coffees etc. During these years of buying second hand and owning many grinders I noticed that it's quite difficult to find a conical for a decent price, I had several Mazzer Major, Super Jolly, Compak etc and a big Compak E10 conical, a huge, I mean huge grinder. I have never seen for example a Mazzer Kony used, for sale. Maybe I am mistaken but the good conical burrs in general are very big and expensive.


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

Mazer Kony is one sweet grinder. Rare as hens teeth in the UK.


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## BH471 (Sep 25, 2020)

profesor_historia said:


> BH471 said:
> 
> 
> > So, I tend to switch beans quite a lot and often have a low-caffeine coffee on the go along side. At the moment I have a Eureka Mignon Specialita but the switching between beans is growing tedious. My plan is to keep the Mignon but want another grinder to go along side it. I fancy a conical grinder and my initial thoughts were to get a hand grinder (Kinu M47) but I like the convenience of and on-demand grinder and some space.
> ...


 Unfortunately, I am coming to the same conclusion on the size. It can obvious be done - Sage Smart Grinder, Baratza Sette or Etzinger.



lake_m said:


> Mazer Kony is one sweet grinder. Rare as hens teeth in the UK.


 Yeah, It would dwarf my Mignon that's for sure.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Having had a few grinders, I can tell you that most big conicals, unless designed for single dosing retain a lot of coffee. I had a K10 (not the Fresh) which retained something like 20 gms. That meant if you made an adjustment, you did not see the benefit until the shot after the next one! Folks have been spoiled by the Niche, which as I am sure you know, uses Kony burrs


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## profesor_historia (Sep 1, 2020)

dfk41 said:


> Having had a few grinders, I can tell you that most big conicals, unless designed for single dosing retain a lot of coffee. I had a K10 (not the Fresh) which retained something like 20 gms. That meant if you made an adjustment, you did not see the benefit until the shot after the next one! Folks have been spoiled by the Niche, which as I am sure you know, uses Kony burrs


The K10 retaining 20grams? Wow. What exactly do you mean by retaining? I have never noticed a retention so big....


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

The big conical tend to retain a lot when they are used with the hopper on. Flat retain more too when used like that but not so much. It's not just what's in the grind chamber it's also grinds up to the antistatic grid or clump crusher. That is another variable on retention as well. Depends on how long and large the path out of the grinds chamber is.

Both are *rather* different when used for weighing in.  Plus the need for the usual puff of air to blow the residuals out.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

profesor_historia said:


> dfk41 said:
> 
> 
> > Having had a few grinders, I can tell you that most big conicals, unless designed for single dosing retain a lot of coffee. I had a K10 (not the Fresh) which retained something like 20 gms. That meant if you made an adjustment, you did not see the benefit until the shot after the next one! Folks have been spoiled by the Niche, which as I am sure you know, uses Kony burrs
> ...


 I meant if for example, you made a change to the grind level, you would have to pull off 18 gms before you noticed the alteration that you had just made. In a cafe, so what but in a domestic environment that is the price you have to pay. I accept it is possible to try and single dose using lens caps and puffers and the like, but that is just a Total pain in the arse to go through. I had an E92S set up for single dosing and it was just a joke having to run through everything from saying a prayer to puffing the puffer for 30 seconds.....then along came the Niche


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## profesor_historia (Sep 1, 2020)

dfk41 said:


> I meant if for example, you made a change to the grind level, you would have to pull off 18 gms before you noticed the alteration that you had just made. In a cafe, so what but in a domestic environment that is the price you have to pay. I accept it is possible to try and single dose using lens caps and puffers and the like, but that is just a Total pain in the arse to go through. I had an E92S set up for single dosing and it was just a joke having to run through everything from saying a prayer to puffing the puffer for 30 seconds.....then along came the Niche


Thank you, I will have to run some test, I know I have a price to pay but for the moment it was the best option and I wanted for long to have this grinder. Niche is out of the question, first due to its higher price in UE and second, they don't even ship to Spain anymore after the problems with the shipping company with the batch of February, so if you want one you have to provide another address in Europe at least until a solution is found. I know, it's strange...


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

@profesor_historia I should add, the K10 with an L1 using Java Jampit (nice and dark) produced the best tasting coffee that I ever produced........but eventually the waste coupled with my desire to try every bit of kit I could, meant I just moved it on


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## BH471 (Sep 25, 2020)

dfk41 said:


> Having had a few grinders, I can tell you that most big conicals, unless designed for single dosing retain a lot of coffee. I had a K10 (not the Fresh) which retained something like 20 gms. That meant if you made an adjustment, you did not see the benefit until the shot after the next one! Folks have been spoiled by the Niche, which as I am sure you know, uses Kony burrs


 The larger form factor and the retention is a no for me in my home environment too. The Baratza or Smart Grinder burr size but in a more traditional style and build is kind of what is was hoping to find. The etzMax Lite grinder looks to be in that category but something more budget friendly like the Mignon would have been nice😂


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

profesor_historia said:


> dfk41 said:
> 
> 
> > I meant if for example, you made a change to the grind level, you would have to pull off 18 gms before you noticed the alteration that you had just made. In a cafe, so what but in a domestic environment that is the price you have to pay. I accept it is possible to try and single dose using lens caps and puffers and the like, but that is just a Total pain in the arse to go through. I had an E92S set up for single dosing and it was just a joke having to run through everything from saying a prayer to puffing the puffer for 30 seconds.....then along came the Niche
> ...


 My E92 is far better for single dosing since I installed the puffer mod. With the lens hood, as @dfk41 said it was a pain and didn't work as well. I can more or less get out what I put in. Sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less. It's not as good as the Niche in that respect but I prefer to use it now over the Niche for espresso.


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## profesor_historia (Sep 1, 2020)

lake_m said:


> My E92 is far better for single dosing since I installed the puffer mod. With the lens hood, as @dfk41 said it was a pain and didn't work as well. I can more or less get out what I put in. Sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less. It's not as good as the Niche in that respect but I prefer to use it now over the Niche for espresso.


I have to try this and to find the right bellow, which type are you using?


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## lake_m (Feb 4, 2017)

profesor_historia said:


> lake_m said:
> 
> 
> > My E92 is far better for single dosing since I installed the puffer mod. With the lens hood, as @dfk41 said it was a pain and didn't work as well. I can more or less get out what I put in. Sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less. It's not as good as the Niche in that respect but I prefer to use it now over the Niche for espresso.
> ...


 Info is on this thread: You'll will need a Perspex or Boroscillicate glass tube to go in the neck which the bellows then goes over.

https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/54631-compak-k10-pb-vs-niche-zero-vs/?tab=comments&do=embed&comment=776523&embedComment=776523&embedDo=findComment#comment-776523


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## profesor_historia (Sep 1, 2020)

lake_m said:


> Info is on this thread: You'll will need a Perspex or Boroscillicate glass tube to go in the neck which the bellows then goes over.


Thanks a lot, that's great, I'll do it.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

I nosed at converting a Robur to single dosing. Other than puffing there didn't seem to be a problem. I bought a Niche instead so no point carrying on with it. Put a mini hopper on and the wastage problem crops up. A lot of that is down to the length and size of the exit path from the grind chamber. Leaning tower of Pisa grinders get around that as they reduce it's length and still have space for a portafiter to be used - in theory anyway. In practice they may not be ideal for that hence the cup. On conventional layouts the length has to be sufficient to get past the diameter of the motor or I suppose they could use one with a very long spindle and make big grinders even taller.

The slope doesn't really help get grinds out. Centrifugal force does that. On Niche for instance they go out of 2 thin slots. These aren't very deep and once through they are in the spout thanks to the grinder leaning.

There is another factor as well. With hopper on and clump crushers and anti static grids etc the grinds are compressed when they come out and in a commercial sense as often seen in coffee shops put an even low pile of grinds into the portafilter. Covert to weighing in and low retention and that no longer happens and a different grinder setting is needed for the same flow rates. The heap of grinds in the portafilter can get huge and not easy to handle. How huge depends to some extent on the grinder.


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## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

BH471 said:


> So, I tend to switch beans quite a lot and often have a low-caffeine coffee on the go along side. At the moment I have a Eureka Mignon Specialita but the switching between beans is growing tedious. My plan is to keep the Mignon but want another grinder to go along side it. I fancy a conical grinder and my initial thoughts were to get a hand grinder (Kinu M47) but I like the convenience of and on-demand grinder and some space.
> 
> So, my question is - the Mignon is a really great value flat burr grinder but what's is the conical equivalent?
> 
> ...


 Probably a Baratza Sette. Longevity possibly an issue though.


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