# what about a good old fashioned hand grinder?



## coolbeans (Dec 8, 2014)

Hi All,

Sometimes I get coffee ground fine at the shop, sometimes I grind beans on our hand grinder (sometimes I just buy ground coffee- shock horror!







) . I would like to ask whether I am missing something here? At the shop I can ask for the coarseness I want, at home I can grind as coarse or fine as I like. The hand grinder is pretty simple. Is there anything inherently better about snazzy electric grinders?


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

I think there are accurate hand grinders, like the Hausgrind thingy and those Pharos ones - but they're more pricey...

The 'normal' ones aren't as accurate or consistent as they'd need to be from what I understand...

Having said that many will be better than pre-ground I'm sure!


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## coolbeans (Dec 8, 2014)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VINTAGE-SPONG-Co-COFFEE-GRINDER-No-1-Wooden-handle-Tin-/201236186466?pt=UK_Collectables_Kitchenalia_RL&hash=item2eda9c8562

that's what I'm talking about. Maybe under a microscope you could find differences in consistency but I really can't tell


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

Sure - it'll make a big difference to extraction volume, consistency, taste when pulling shots though.

I imagine that ol' thing won't be at all consistent in terms of grind size.


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## coolbeans (Dec 8, 2014)

how best to check? Visually I would say a fine grind is uniform. Are we talking microscopic differences here?


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

What hand grinder do you have at home?

The word vintage should be a good clue as to why you should not pick one of those up, unless you want it to look nice in your kitchen of course!


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## coolbeans (Dec 8, 2014)

hi froggystyle







I have the grinder in the picture! Although mine has no gold and a red handle it's the same mechanism. It is actually very robust, it grinds to a fine grind very quickly which seems consistent to the eye, it's adjusted by a nut at the front. It is far superior to other hand grinders I have seen with very little to go wrong. At the time I got it I had no electric for a grinder and this was the best type of hand grinder I had tried, £15 from a junk shop. I do think your point about vintage is valid, though- often it's a stand in for clapped out.


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

Pretty sure the burrs (does it have burrs?!) will not be machined in any majorly accurate way. Not hating but pretty sure the consistency will be non-existent - even if it looks or feels it.


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## coolbeans (Dec 8, 2014)

Hi jonc, if you're interested I'll have a proper look over it when I get in and report back







Not exactly sure what you mean by burrs though... The reason I'm interested mainly is to ascertain whether you can get as good results off a reliable hand grinder over a low-end electric grinder. As with anything to do with proper coffee I gather the best results are from expensive high end grinders but I'm not ready to invest in one right now.

What I'd really like to know is at what level do we check or measure consistency? - e.g. would sieving the ground coffee have an effect on it, or are we talking about microscopic differences?


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

I'm not a grinder expert, but I'm sure one'll be along soon enough!

Microscopic I would imagine, but I'm pretty sure you don't need to worry - I'm 99% sure it'll be bad!

Entry level electronic grinder (e.g. Iberital MC2) could be had for £70ish used I guess / £120 new - or a decent espresso level hand grinder is around £100 I think.

p.s. I'm not an expert...


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

coolbeans said:


> Hi All,
> 
> Sometimes I get coffee ground fine at the shop, sometimes I grind beans on our hand grinder (sometimes I just buy ground coffee- shock horror!
> 
> ...


The distribution will change as you go coarser & finer there might be one or two zones where you get a really good grind. The idea of grinding as coarse or as fine as you like, without changing the grind quality/distribution is a bit illusory.

If grinding large doses, very fine, like espresso/Turkish, then an electric grinder is a godsend (there are a couple of very capable espresso oriented hand grinders like the OE Pharos & HG1), the better hand grinders (Lido/Hausgrind/Feldgrind) can be good for large doses for drip & immersion brews, the smaller, cheaper ceramic burr grinders require a lot of arm work for doses over 20g.

I grind pretty much all my French press & Sowden brews on a hand grinder (40-70g), Turkish too (6-7grams at a time, in around a minute), 30g doses for a Clever are 50:50 hand (but a work out)/electric, same for drip (10-30g), espresso - anything bigger than a single dose and electric (excluding the previously mentioned Pharos/HG1) is by far the most practical.

We're not necessarily talking microscopic, but say your average size is a quarter of a mm, you could still have the most common grind size at twice that size, and even particles up to 1mm+) & another smaller peak under a tenth of a mm. At coarser grinds you tend to get more of a single peak of larger grinds, but a bigger spread from tiny to large, though the really tiny bits make up a smaller proportion of the ground weight.

Have a look at this grind distribution from a Baratza grinder for a typical example of what happens as you go fine to coarse...

https://www.baratza.com/wp-content/uploads/VARIO-Graph.pdf


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

Glad to see someone who knows what they're talking about giving advice; I was struggling.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Sound advice from Mark.

Have a read here...

http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?17071-Grinders-what-do-you-get-for-your-money


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## coolbeans (Dec 8, 2014)

Ah, thanks for all the replies. It took me a while to click through to page 2. Thanks also for those links I will have a look..



MWJB said:


> The distribution will change as you go coarser & finer there might be one or two zones where you get a really good grind. The idea of grinding as coarse or as fine as you like, without changing the grind quality/distribution is a bit illusory.


I see, because really although I think my hand grinder is better than others that I've tried (limited to box types and a pepper mill style one) it really is best for very fine grinding; I have noticed a greater inconsistency if I ever attempt a coarse grind (which I almost never do). I guess there is something to be said for getting the kit that suits you- whether it works for everything is another matter.



MWJB said:


> I grind pretty much all my French press & Sowden brews on a hand grinder (40-70g), Turkish too (6-7grams at a time, in around a minute), 30g doses for a Clever are 50:50 hand (but a work out)/electric, same for drip (10-30g), espresso - anything bigger than a single dose and electric (excluding the previously mentioned Pharos/HG1) is by far the most practical.


Glad to see that there still is room for elbow grease on the coffee forum!


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