# Where does the natural flavour lie?



## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

I've got a Kenyan from alchemy coffee, it's very fresh, I think roasted Friday. It's got interesting flavour notes but so far I've brewed it twice in a kalita wave and I mainly get "natural" rather than subtler flavours. With notes of raspberry, nectarine & honey. I find natural flavour hard to describe but hope that's making some sense.

I'm sort of asking a question about that natural flavour extraction and also my brewing with it.

So that made me wonder if some compounds or other clever things cause that natural sort of flavour. If so then maybe are they expected to extract equally alongside any other notes or if they'd be more prominent in certain situations. I'm hoping I might, for example, grind coarser and get more other flavour etc...

I brewed it today and refracted and it's come in at 1.45TDS and 22.93EY for those who are interested.

I'm maybe getting something more bitter than tangerine, kind of grapefruit like and thinking this one is a bit strong because the flavour is a bit overwhelming

It was 30g coffee, 509 brew water added. Took 3m25 for the water to not be visible on top, I added about 80g water to bloom, waited 30 second and then added about 4 more lots of just over 100ml, think last was in about 2.20?

I'm knackered so also a little fuzzy on the details :-/.


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## Step21 (Oct 2, 2014)

I'm assuming that it is a natural processed coffee?

As i understand it, the natural drying process causes a bit of fermentation of from the drying cherry which gets absorbed by the bean. This can result in whacky flavours. Some people describe the "natural" flavour as slightly alcoholic or fermented or "funky". It is certainly distinctive. Some people love it others hate it. Some naturals have more of it than others.

But you should certainly still get the fruit flavours coming through along with the funk.

I think your extraction above is too high for pourover (though if your using an EK grinder it might not be) and too low for immersion. Maybe aim for a TDS of 1.25/30 ish and a sub 21% extraction or 25% for immersion and see if the fruit flavours come out? Looks like your brew ratio is about 60g/l, i'd maybe bring that down to 57/58?


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

Yes it's naturally processed coffee.

Thanks for ideas. I did grind it on the EK. I intended to try 28.5g to 500ml water but somehow didn't do that. I'll give it a go tomorrow.

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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Did you try it a little diluted from 1.45 Tds ?

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## Glenn (Jun 14, 2008)

What temp are you brewing at Joe?

Try going a couple of degrees either side as there is usually a way to reduce the natural funkiness and get more delicate notes.

I find that a little hotter usually works, but for coffee from other regions it can be the opposite.


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

Mrboots2u said:


> Did you try it a little diluted from 1.45 Tds ?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I thought about it but didn't actually do it. I think was distracted by our little girl throwing a bit of a tantrum! That's what I'm blaming it on anyway .



Glenn said:


> What temp are you brewing at Joe?
> 
> Try going a couple of degrees either side as there is usually a way to reduce the natural funkiness and get more delicate notes.
> 
> I find that a little hotter usually works, but for coffee from other regions it can be the opposite.


I think the kettle was set to 95, but might have been just under that. Definitely tempted to try with temperature adjustment because I think I've hardly ever changed it!


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Try 26.5g/500g on the Brazen. 9.5 on 3FE dial. TDS 1.20-1.25 / 21-22% EY


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

garydyke1 said:


> Try 26.5g/500g on the Brazen. 9.5 on 3FE dial. TDS 1.20-1.25 / 21-22% EY


Thanks! I haven't put the 3FE dial on yet, so my approximation was just passed 6 on the classic dial (about 10 o'clock?). I think I had a part of the bed that either had less coffee or I need to check the holes - because it looked slightly washed through in one place. I'll try again in a little bit with a slightly finer grind - maybe after a recalibration.

This one ended up - @ 1.17 TDS / 20.88EY - it was definitely less in my face than the brews I've done in the Kalita (did one this morning which I wasn't able to extract but with 28.5g coffee still seemed a bit much). With this one in the Behmohr the natural flavours are much more alongside everything else but nothing is quite jumping out at me yet.

Grind size wise, I had ended up just passed the one I did for the Behmohr (somewhere like 6.5 on the Kalita) so I feel like I'm starting to get into the right areas.

Thanks all for the suggestions.


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

I had a look with manual release on the Behmohr and I think one of the holes is either slightly scaled or something else going on. The other streams were all pretty straight whereas that one was joining with another stream and that's why I had a washed out patch. I've run some descaler through and will try it again - in a bit.


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

jlarkin said:


> Thanks! I haven't put the 3FE dial on yet, so my approximation was just passed 6 on the classic dial (about 10 o'clock?).
> 
> This one ended up - @ 1.17 TDS / 20.88EY


After descaling, I used same grind and coffee etc. and got 1.27TDS and 22.66EY. Definitely improving but I think I have more to enjoy still here, hopefully I'll nail it before I run out . Seemed slightly drying but really clean and more balanced.


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