# Barista Touch vs Oracle non touch



## Marlfox (Apr 14, 2019)

Have permission to get a nice, easy to use machine for the new kitchen. Will mainly be used for lattes, so auto milk is an essential. Not fussed about the auto tamping on the Oracle, but the mrs won't go for anything much more complicated, so rules out a separate grinder and a Rocket or anything.

Has anyone gone from an Oracle non touch to a Barista Touch, or vice versa? With the Sage rebate and Easter offers, the prices are basically the same.

Is the older Oracle better with the dual boiler, or the newer Barista Touch? Like the fact the Oracle can be programmed on in the morning, but the BT is good to go in 10 seconds so hardly an issue.

(Have searched the forum but couldn't see any threads apart from BT vs Oracle Touch)


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## fuziduck (Nov 14, 2018)

Hi. I've had both machines. Albeit the Barista Touch very briefly as I couldn't get on with it.

My personal opinion is that the Oracle is a much better machine. If they are now the same sort of cost I would strongly suggest going for the Oracle as it is a dual boiler.

Despite not having a touch display it is actually much simpler to use with less variables to effect your coffee. In my opinion the touch display is slow and clunky and gives no more useful information that the oracle non touch.

The oracle you can steam milk and brew coffee simultaneously

The touch has to switch between modes which takes a few seconds.

The oracle removes the variable of tamping. This can make a difference to the quality of drink and makes it easier to tune in.

Whilst the grinders may be the same, the oracle has a knob and the touch has a thumb wheel which isn't as easy to use.

The oracle is however much bigger and does take up a lot of counter space. I'd suggest viewing both in store side by side first.

The oracle also has a heated group head which helps to get the porta filter hot. The touch you need to run water through the machine to do this.

The oracle steam wand is different to the touch. Some people including myself had a regular problem with the touch where it would stop steaming and say it is blocked which meant you had to stop and clean it. I've not had this problem once with the oracle.

There are a few negatives to the oracle though.

It does take 3 mins to get the boilers up to temperature. The group head will not be hot in this time either so you will also need to run water through or leave it for 10-15 mins.

Unfortunately it also has a self turn off timer that can't be set to more than 20 mins. (Something to do with the EU imposing auto off on machines that have the ability to auto turn on and 20 mins is the maximum.

The descale process takes a little longer because you have to empty the boiler etc.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

fuziduck said:


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> There are a few negatives to the oracle though.
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> ...


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## fuziduck (Nov 14, 2018)

Mrboots2u said:


> fuziduck said:
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> > .
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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

fuziduck said:


> Mrboots2u said:
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> > Are you saying the group head isn't independently heated?
> ...


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## fuziduck (Nov 14, 2018)

Mrboots2u said:


> fuziduck said:
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> > Poor typing on my part, the group head should be ready to use after three minutes, its a heated group , not like an e61 group that needs longer to heat up.
> ...


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Since I switched to an open bottomed portafilter on my Dual Boiler I have found no need to preheat the portafilter. I did preheat the ordinary one my usual way. Run a shot through an empty pressurised filter basket with does it in say 30sec using little water.

One the ordinary BE I always preheated it the same way. I would suspect the touch would need the this as well.

I briefly flush the DB. All machines should have at least a bit of a flush to ensure internals are hot. No need if the portafilter has been heated the way I did it.

Before buying a machine people need to consider how hard their tap water is. They may need to use certain brands of bottled water in it.

Given very soft tap water I have seen reason to descale my BE more often than I did. i'd suggest once a month. It doesn't take that long to do. The dual boiler machines will tell the owner when to descale via entering a number from a hardness testing strip. I've found that in order to be sure of a descale doing what it should do, remove all of it that I needed to set the hardness 2 number harder than the strip suggested. I get very soft water and have never ever needed to descale a kettle even after several years of use of the same one. Descaling a dual boiler machine takes 20min plush flush time. In my case 2 full ones so an hour in total.







Done in the evening while watching telly. Each one needs a trip to the sink.

One of the machines you mention uses a thermothingy to heat the water. These are more prone to scale but I covered that. The other is a dual boiler. I don't think that anyone would argue about that being the one you should go for.







Personally I wouldn't but can appreciate that some people want the automation. The BT in my view is also obviously over priced or was last time I looked.

John

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