# New Barista Pro User, Day One.



## Caffeinated_fiend (Apr 15, 2020)

Hi all, so I originally bought a Jura S6 during lockdown as I was missing my daily Americano, I quickly found that I didn't like it though. I could only even on the lowest grind setting get an Americano with say 150ml of water, anymore and it tasted far too diluted.However I have had a little experience with the Barista Express, it was in an Airbnb I stayed at. Over the course of the week I was there I bought some supermarket beans as you do, not knowing anything and not surprising anyone I didn't get anything but disappointment with shots pulling in 10 seconds on the finest grind.

So back to the present day, I had the opportunity to swap the Jura and thought about the express again, but stumbled on to the Pro, more grind settings and quicker heat up got my attention. I do already have a grinder but it's not suitable for espresso, it's the baratza virtuoso.

So I got the machine today, I have read the helpful post from Tom Hughes on how to get the best out of the Sage machines, so here's how I got on, on day one.

I have some fresh Rave fudge beans roasted on the 16th of April and some Brown Bear New Latin beans that I bought for use in an Aeropress but decided to try them in the Pro. They were bought from Amazon though so aren't fresh, I would assume nitrogen flushed.

Rave - Grind 5 = 19g in 44g out in 27 seconds (I tried courser before reaching 5 on the grinder)

Brown Bear - Grind 5 = 19g in 41.5g out in 33 seconds (Left it on 5 from the rave setting as a staring point)

I find it a little weird that the manual states to use 19-22g when the Express was 15-18g and they seem to use the same portafilter, I double checked the manual on that one, I wonder if the razor tool is different or still set to 18g?

I was sort of surprised that the Rave and Brown Bear are so close in terms of grind size, I thought using the fresh Rave beans that I would be much higher on the grinder and I wasn't expecting the Brown Bear to work at all, but it did. Unfortunately when I made the rave fudge blend I frothed some milk, but then got distracted and by the time I got to try it, it was lukewarm at best. I am more of a Americano/Long black drinker and I don't normally have milk in my drinks so will have to see how I get on with the rave beans. I enjoyed the Brown Bear as an Americano and it was pleasing to me that I could get a strong tasting Americano from the Pro, I put around 280ml of water on top of the 19g shot and it was plenty strong tasting and had no bitterness or astringency. Most of my coffess and dialling in for that matter are going to have to be done if possible from an Americano, as I not one for drinking straight espresso.

I am hoping that my current settings for each bean are somewhere in the ballpark, I know that you shouldn't go off of time alone and it's not the easiest factoring in when to stop the shot, as you get those extra drips of coffee after the button is pressed, I was trying for a 1:2 ratio. For the Rave coffee I just used the double shot button, for the Brown Bear I used the custom shot as I didn't know how long I would need it to go.

I am using 19g on each shot, trying to be consistent with the dose and breaking up any clumps in the grounds, tamping is relatively new to me but after watching plenty of YouTube tutorials I feel like I'm doing alright consistency wise. I am weighing the shots with my Hario scales and measuring the dose in the portafilter. I am also putting my dose into the grinder each time and not filling up the hopper, weighing the beans in and out.

Anyway looking forward to having a play with this machine and hopefully get some good results


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

Yes I found the 19-22g very odd and I'm not sure it's correct.
As you say the BE is 15-18g, and more importantly so is the barista touch, which I believe is pretty much the same on the inside to the BP.

I use mine with a range from 16.5 (very light bean density) to 19.5g (very very dense Guate SHB) all producing a similar volume in the basket. Whilst I use weight to consistently get shots I do think that volume matters, which is why the razor is actually quite clever.

The razor tool is the same for all models.


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## JK10 (Apr 21, 2020)

Please keep us posted! I'm also a new BP owner so interested to see how you get on!

I agree with the dosing - I can't seem to get close to that amount of coffee in the basket - I tend to be around 17g too.

I will check out the beans that you've ordered, although I've tried multiple and got nowhere close to a grind setting of 5. Anything less than 9-10 on mine chokes the machine up


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## Caffeinated_fiend (Apr 15, 2020)

TomHughes said:


> Yes I found the 19-22g very odd and I'm not sure it's correct.
> As you say the BE is 15-18g, and more importantly so is the barista touch, which I believe is pretty much the same on the inside to the BP.
> 
> I use mine with a range from 16.5 (very light bean density) to 19.5g (very very dense Guate SHB) all producing a similar volume in the basket. Whilst I use weight to consistently get shots I do think that volume matters, which is why the razor is actually quite clever.
> ...


 Hi and thanks for the replies!

I have tweeted Sage and Breville but haven't heard anything back yet, I'm assuming that they will just say to use 19-22g anyway as that is what the manual states. Do you aim for weight then or just eyeball a volume?

Doesn't make a massive amount of sense and I havent tried it yet but getting 22g in the basket would be hard work, 19g is without a dosing funnel, I have one ordered as its not easy to get the amount in. Some of my 19g shots have stuck to the group head after they have finished, I take the portafilter out and the puck is stuck to the group head before falling off. The puck only has a small indent from the screw however. You would really have to tamp hard to get 22g in and then not have the razor remove a huge amount.



JK10 said:


> Please keep us posted! I'm also a new BP owner so interested to see how you get on!
> 
> I agree with the dosing - I can't seem to get close to that amount of coffee in the basket - I tend to be around 17g too.
> 
> I will check out the beans that you've ordered, although I've tried multiple and got nowhere close to a grind setting of 5. Anything less than 9-10 on mine chokes the machine up


 Will do, I have ordered some decaf beans but I have plenty of caffeinated to practise with at the moment, have to be careful though as I only had a few yesterday and one was after 8pm so it was an unintended late night for me.

I took the bean hopper out and once I had got some beans out that were stuck round the edge of the unit I had a look to see what the grinder was set to, the wire on the grinder was set to 6 which I think looking at the manual seems to be the default number. I just found it weird like I said above that Amazon bought beans and fresh beans were so close in grind setting.

Do you guys try and go for a 1:2 with a specific time in mind? I might try 18g today and use the dosing tool and see what I get from there.

I tried the razor tool with a 19g grind and it took only the slightest amount of coffee from the puck.

Here is the shot that was pulled again about 33 seconds at grind 5, if I get chance later I will film a shot on the pro.


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## JK10 (Apr 21, 2020)

Caffeinated_fiend said:


> I took the bean hopper out and once I had got some beans out that were stuck round the edge of the unit I had a look to see what the grinder was set to, the wire on the grinder was set to 6 which I think looking at the manual seems to be the default number. I just found it weird like I said above that Amazon bought beans and fresh beans were so close in grind setting.
> 
> Do you guys try and go for a 1:2 with a specific time in mind? I might try 18g today and use the dosing tool and see what I get from there.
> 
> I tried the razor tool with a 19g grind and it took only the slightest amount of coffee from the puck.


 I'll take mine out once empty and let you know - I haven't adjusted it though so my guess is it should be the same? A mate of mine also has a brand new BP and is using the same beans (from Lindfield Coffee Works, roasted around 10 days ago) and is seemingly able to grind much finer while able to pull a shot that doesn't just drip for 40s. I think there must be some variance between the grinders.

I aim for 1:2 for about 30 seconds. I'm sure there will be members far more experienced that can say if that's too long/short/other but so far i'm enjoying what i'm getting out of it - also trying to restrict myself to nothing too late in the afternoon!


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## Caffeinated_fiend (Apr 15, 2020)

Afternoon all,

Further adventures aren't going that well today, I ordered some decaf espresso beans from rave, they were roasted on the 20th of April. I thought I would try 18g today in the basket, here are my three attempts;

Grinder at 7 - 18g in 40g out in 18 seconds

Grinder at 4 - 18g in 39g out in 18 seconds

Grinder at 4 - 19g in 39g out in 20 seconds

I am also noticing that my puck is stuck to the brew head most times after pulling a shot, using the dose tool it rarely removes anything but a tiny bit of grounds so I don't feel like I'm overfilling

Being down already at 4 it doesn't give me much room to dial in, I'm thinking I may have to adjust the grinder setting to finer.


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

Caffeinated_fiend said:


> Afternoon all,
> 
> Further adventures aren't going that well today, I ordered some decaf espresso beans from rave, they were roasted on the 20th of April. I thought I would try 18g today in the basket, here are my three attempts;
> 
> ...


 20th April? As in 4 days ago?
If so STOP NOW!
Put them away sealed in the bag if possible and come back to them in a few days-week.

I have personally found most of the decaf I roast, and especially the columbian I get from Rave takes about 5 days to stop gassing off, then a further 2-3 to mature. At day 7 it's ready to consider drinking and it just gets better between 1-2 weeks, more nuts and caramel in the cup.

Also, i find this coffee is pretty much one of the finest I have to grind. So yes, when you come back to it you may need to alter your grinder, but at least try setting 1 first.

I also found 19g worked very well. 1:2.5 ratio in around 35 seconds total 10 seconds Pre and 25 seconds full


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## Caffeinated_fiend (Apr 15, 2020)

TomHughes said:


> 20th April? As in 4 days ago?
> If so STOP NOW!
> Put them away sealed in the bag if possible and come back to them in a few days-week.
> 
> ...


 Thanks for the reply,

Are you on the default grinder setting on the pro or using another grinder? I didn't drink the shots as I had heard the 5-15 days after roast but thought they might choke the grinder, they didn't. The flow was the fastest I've seen at these lower settings.

I will give my older rave a go and see where they are at now.

I am using a custom double shot, I haven't changed the pre infusion but let the time go as long as possible, I wish I could just pull a manual shot that has the default infusion time that I can then stop when it gets to my desired volume.


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

Caffeinated_fiend said:


> Thanks for the reply,
> 
> Are you on the default grinder setting on the pro or using another grinder? I didn't drink the shots as I had heard the 5-15 days after roast but thought they might choke the grinder, they didn't. The flow was the fastest I've seen at these lower settings.
> 
> ...


 Yes for the first 5 days its all gas so will run really fast.

I use a mignon for anything lighter as the sage grinder isn't great.

I do it all manual, so hold down the button to hit 10 seconds of pre-infusion then release and run till I have the weight in the cup.


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## Caffeinated_fiend (Apr 15, 2020)

TomHughes said:


> Yes for the first 5 days its all gas so will run really fast.
> 
> I use a mignon for anything lighter as the sage grinder isn't great.
> 
> I do it all manual, so hold down the button to hit 10 seconds of pre-infusion then release and run till I have the weight in the cup.


 I will give the manual a go, I think the default is 6-7 seconds.

I went onto my older Rave Fudge beans and gave them a go. Grinder setting 4 was super slow so I went to 6 and got a 33 second extraction of 39g. Then I took it to 7 and the first shot choked which was weird but it may have been my ramp as by this time the technique was pretty bad.

I looked at my portafilter after the next tamp and it wasn't level, I have been pretty good up to now. I re tamped the shot and it came out at 27 seconds and I made it into a cappuccino which was pretty good. Although milk based drinks cool down so fast, and I am making a proper mess each time I brew at the minute.

I should stick with dark and medium then for the moment with the sage? At some point next year I will look to get a espresso grinder

Any tips for a good decaf that I could order in day 1kg and really have a go out would be appreciated. I can't do too many fully caffeinated drinks in a day.


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## Caffeinated_fiend (Apr 15, 2020)

So today I tried my Rave decaf beans without much luck. I changed the grinder hopper number from 6 to 4 and I was able to get the beans to extract in a decent time but the resulting Americano was pretty weak with about 270ml of water In as well.

So I moved back onto my rave fudge just to practise, I seem to be having inconsistencies as sometimes the flow is perfect and sometimes it starts in one side of the spout and not the other.

The shot that I have included here is the first one I did manual with 10 seconds of pre infusion. Although the time wasn't bad it gushed which normally isn't the case.

https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/index.php?app=core&module=system&controller=embed&url=https://twitter.com/YorkshireLion_/status/1254490652706037761


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## TomHughes (Dec 16, 2019)

That shot looks like a load of gas still. 
Give it more time.

I think I use 19-20g in a decaf. They are never quite as strong. In a few more days try a marginally higher dose

Spouts? Check your machine is level


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