# Upgrade Advice



## Andy Blyth (Jan 1, 2011)

I'm on the prowl for an upgrade. Currently running a Gaggia Baby and Iberital MC2. I just about have my heart set on the Brewtus IV unless anyone can convince me otherwise (but I doubt it, I've spent about 5 hours watching Youtube clips of this machine - Amazing!!).

I'm also looking at (but not so determined about) perhaps a Mazzer Mini or Mazzer SJ. Other grinder recommendations welcomed.

My question is, what should I look to upgrade first, machine or grinder? I'm concerned that if I upgrade my machine first, the MC2 won't be able to provide the Brewtus what it needs to work its magic properly. Grinder first, then machine?

Cheers

Andy


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

My preference would be to get the grinder right first followed by the better machine.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

ronsil said:


> My preference would be to get the grinder right first followed by the better machine.


Personal preference would the same ( Ron currently has the most skewed grinder to machine set up ek43 and gaggia lol )


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

An MC2 though is almost there?

Machine then save for a better grinder, no?


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## Andy Blyth (Jan 1, 2011)

So am I in the right ball park with the Mazzers to compliment a Brewtus? Or should I be looking at others?


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## Thecatlinux (Mar 10, 2014)

Plus three ....no brainer..... Grinder first


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Think the op should tell how long between buying a machine and grinder?


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## Jason1wood (Jun 1, 2012)

I'd upgrade grinder to a Mazzer, loads go on here for around £250 which is a fantastic price for the quality.

Mazzer with Classic = much tastier shots

MC2 with Brewtus = shots not as good as the Classic.

Imho


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## Top Cat (May 26, 2014)

Thecatlinux said:


> Plus three ....no brainer..... Grinder first


Love that cat going round in circles! how do i copy it (if you don't mind!)


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## Andy Blyth (Jan 1, 2011)

froggystyle said:


> Think the op should tell how long between buying a machine and grinder?


Not sure Froggy. Could be a couple of months, could be a year. Depends what the combined cost of the upgrade turns out to be.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

froggystyle said:


> An MC2 though is almost there?
> 
> Machine then save for a better grinder, no?


Grinder can have a more dramatic taste effect than a machine

You can learn ways around a classics short comings , temp surf possible pid ,, making it more stable and consistent .

With a grinder you stuck with what you have

The burrs are the burrs ......


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## Daren (Jan 16, 2012)

Andy Blyth said:


> So am I in the right ball park with the Mazzers to compliment a Brewtus? Or should I be looking at others?


GS11 had a Mazzer/Brewtus combo and I had some cracking coffee from it. They work well together.

Spend as much as you possibly can on the grinder as your return for pound in the cup is far better compared to an espresso machine.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Where's jeebsy

he used to run a classic and which grinder ?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Classic and mignon

Oscar and mignon

Brewtus and mignon

Brewtus and royal

Brewtus and EK43


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## Daren (Jan 16, 2012)

jeebsy said:


> Classic and mignon
> 
> Oscar and mignon
> 
> ...


Which upgrade made the biggest difference? Grinder or Espresso machine?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Coffee machine helped loads with consistency, ie being able to make a shot taste the same over and over, but the grinder helped those consistent shots taste better and better.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

I would buy the machine first. It will be far more expensive to buy than the grinder. The mc2 we all know is no good in the long term but will do whilst you save up a couple of hundred quid for your grinder.


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Grinder first for me. Makes a bigger difference £ for £.

Also if you were running a Brewtus with a MC2 I think I'd start losing sleep at night it just wouldn't do it justice. The other way round I would be fine in my books...sorry that's just me.


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

When I stepped up from an MC2 to a Brasilia RR55 OD (64mm burrs the same as a Mazzer SJ but a much better grinder though) the difference was night and day, I was finding new flavour notes in coffee that I thought was familiar with, it was the single biggest jump I made with that setup. Conversely when the Sage 1st arrived on my doorstep along with the Smart Grinder I thought it was only fair to give it a try for the review and the biggest thing I noticed was the muted or missing flavour in the cup compared to the RR55, it just seemed as thought the coffee had lost some its sparkle, almost the same as it if was long past it's best.

Then this year stepping up to a Mythos from the RR55 I was prepared for another leap in quality but was stunned by just how much better it was than, what is an excellent grinder anyway.

So my response takes no guessing really, go for the good grinder, if you are one of the people who has a hang up about buying used then Bella Barista are offering a very good deal on the excellent Eureka Zenith 65-E for £499 plus carriage, which is a superb price for a brand new on demand grinder of that class.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Andy Blyth said:


> I'm on the prowl for an upgrade. Currently running a Gaggia Baby and Iberital MC2. I just about have my heart set on the Brewtus IV unless anyone can convince me otherwise (but I doubt it, I've spent about 5 hours watching Youtube clips of this machine - Amazing!!). I'm also looking at (but not so determined about) perhaps a Mazzer Mini or Mazzer SJ. Other grinder recommendations welcomed.
> 
> My question is, what should I look to upgrade first, machine or grinder? I'm concerned that if I upgrade my machine first, the MC2 won't be able to provide the Brewtus what it needs to work its magic properly. Grinder first, then machine?


Well there is something people are not asking you and that's whether you want to buy used or not for the machine, grinder or both. The other key point is what things are important to you from a machine, space considerations, budget (in terms of I won't spend more than x, even if I had it) and type of drinks preferred. This materially affects the advice you should be given.


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

jeebsy said:


> Classic and mignon
> 
> Oscar and mignon
> 
> ...


Is that a quadratic equation??


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Jeebsy coffee journey offers a great example of how you can go from decent to top drawer set up in a series of stages where, at one point, the espresso machine outdoes the grinder until there is a decent pairing of machine and grinder.

Guess, if you want to avoid the dreaded upgraditis and cost, buying used is a sensible option. If a Brewtus is your dream machine, go for the best grinder you can afford that would do that machine justice - space and cost permitting.


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

DavecUK said:


> Well there is something people are not asking you and that's whether you want to buy used or not for the machine, grinder or both. The other key point is what things are important to you from a machine, space considerations, budget (in terms of I won't spend more than x, even if I had it) and type of drinks preferred. This materially affects the advice you should be given.


Dave as the OP already said he wants a Brewtus IV I guess we all went with the notion that is what he wants and advised on his question regarding grinders.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Charliej said:



> Dave as the OP already said he wants a Brewtus IV I guess we all went with the notion that is what he wants and advised on his question regarding grinders.


That's not what he said in his original post...it's what you think he said.....2 different things.


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## Charliej (Feb 25, 2012)

DavecUK said:


> That's not what he said in his original post...it's what you think he said.....2 different things.


I didn't think that saying



> > I just about have my heart set on the Brewtus IV unless anyone can convince me otherwise (but I doubt it, I've spent about 5 hours watching Youtube clips of this machine - Amazing!!).


 Was at all equivocal so as I said he seemed confused on the grinder front so people advised accordingly. The advice of get the better grinder 1st is borne out by more than just my own personal experience of stepping up from an entry level grinder with a Classic to an ex commercial grinder with a 64mm burr set, which in my case was less than a used Mignon would have cost me and did/does still urinate on a Mignons performance from a great height. Again my own experience of trying out a less than optimal grinder (the Sage Smart Grinder) on both the Sage Dual Boiler and a Gaggia Classic compared to a Brasilia RR55 and anyone could tell the difference in terms of results in the cup. A Gaggia Classic paired with a good grinder can produce better espresso than an expensive machine with an entry level (and I would personally include the Mignon here) grinder, a good machine with a low end grinder might mean consistent espresso but more than likely consistently mediocre than excellent.


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

Charliej said:


> A Gaggia Classic paired with a good grinder can produce better espresso than an expensive machine with an entry level


Gotta agree with that one.

I have a current case in point. I'm getting excellent espresso out of the Classic which has always been very acceptable but not the fine quality & sweetness as now using the EK.

Could do without having to 'temp surf' though


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