# 1st roast



## h1udd

Yay my first roast ... Panicked at 13:30 and hit cool about a minute into 1st crack 234deg (set to 236 but never got there) ... A tad lighter than I wanted, and a few of the beans MM are a lot lighter ... Is this normal for MM .. I was roast mind 230g MM in a gene 101


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## ronsil

MM. Is not the easiest bean to roast.

They move from light to dark very suddenly & quickly

Something like a Brazilian or Yirg is probably easier


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## froggystyle

Was going to suggest dropping to 230g, but then remembered I only gave you 250g!

Did you give the vent underneath a wipe? Bit strange you couldn't hit 236g as I was hitting it ok a couple of weeks ago on a yirg.

You roasted by that window in your kitchen? Was the kitchen warm?


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## froggystyle

If you want some yirgs to play with I can stick 250g in the post?


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## johnealey

Did you measure the voltage at all as gene can be sensitive to lower voltages? if well below 240v then ccan struggle to get up to full temp.

Either that or possibly huge amounts of chaff collecting around the bottom of the roast chamber which can lead to a lower temp reading than actually is, which can happen with aged beans such as MM, hence lower quantities in at the start

John


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## h1udd

It was cold in the kitchen ... Another couple of mins and it would have hit 236 I am sure. Next time I'll warm things up a bit ... And I did forget about the vent

I'll get through the greens I got first I think I have an extra 3k of mixed coffee compass beans to play with .. So by the end of next week I am sure I'll have a better idea what I am doing

just had to post the 1st roast as I was excited


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## h1udd

How do I measure the voltage ? .... Without killing myself ?


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## johnealey

An "eco" plug or measuring plug that plugs into the socket before you plug the gene into it. Lots of options out there from the type sold at maplins to belkin ones with remote displays.

Will help to identify when best to roast and when you take the next step of power control will be invaluable.

( you can even get them with cost functiond to work out how much your roast hasn't cost  )

I think this one is one that @DavecUK has mentioned before as being more accurate than some others:

http://www.maplin.co.uk/p/15a-plug-in-energy-saving-monitor-l61aq

John


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## h1udd

Thanks for that I was expecting to have to poke my multimeter in to the plug socket .. And that scares me


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## DavecUK

h1udd said:


> Thanks for that I was expecting to have to poke my multimeter in to the plug socket .. And that scares me


yeah..no don't do that, get that Maplin plug thru monitor, I've had mine 10 years and it's great and as someone has said accurate. The others on the market have tried are well inaccurate.

Also power control turns it into a completely different...and better roaster. If you don't have a good solid 240V, then (ONLY IF YOU HAVE POWER CONTROL) swap out the element as well for a 230V. Then you can roast in any voltage, just don't exceed 1230W too often, in fact I found best results using around 1160 - 1180 watts, then reducing power during 1st to maintain the temp reached. For monsooned Malabar, I might well have decided not to let it get above a temperature chosen from a range of 220-227C. Remembering that with no on off of the element, much more heat energy is applied to the beans, but at lower max temps.

I can't emphasise enough the importance of power control on electric roasters, it's the easiest cheapest way to improve any roaster no matter how good it is already. My CBR 1200 is modified for full power control and when I get the revised Amazon Roaster I will keep it standard long enough to write the manual, installation guide and check the settings for the controllers....After all that work, I will then mod it for power control (I already have the components required). For the Amazon (assuming the mod works OK), it's a very cheap and easy modification costing less than £10 and should take approx 20 minutes, using a HSS drillbit and drill, small spanner and hex key set.

Effectively cheap SCR power controllers give all the benefits of a fully modulating gas train found on only the more expensive and high quality gas roasters (and even then it's an expensive option, not available on small roasters).


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## mathof

Gven the benefits, why don't roasters such as the Gene come equipped with power control?

Matt


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## DavecUK

mathof said:


> Gven the benefits, why don't roasters such as the Gene come equipped with power control?
> 
> Matt


Well this is all generalities, but most true to a varying degree

1. Keeps the price down

2. While they still sell em they won't bother

3. Cost of redesign

4. Manufacturers don't like to listen re design changes

That last one, for some it's pride for the Asian manufacturers, in general they think we are not that well educated or that smart any more. From their point of view, we don't produce much hi tech stuff, our education system is failing, bad in maths and hard sciences...not exactly people they think we should listen to.* I have suggested this to Genesis on many occasions*, because it actually has some huge benefits for them and potentially cost savings over future years. I thought last year they were coming to see me in the summer...but never did.

You have to remember, regardless what was said in a thread a month or so ago,....manufacturers generally don't *really listen* to consumers when developing products and during the product life cycle. They tend to hear only what they want to hear.


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## h1udd

Why does the 230v element lend itself to the power control mod but not the 240v ??? Where do they differ ?


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## johnealey

Having power controlled a 240v you definately can and it works quite well especially in stopping the roaster kicking in and out the heater element, I think what you gain with the 230v heater is a little better control vs the 240v.( am sure DaveC can explain better)

Should I ever get to the point of replacing the heater will replace it with a 230v as much to see what difference it makes as at the moment am more than happy with the kilo and a half I roast every week.

Power control did make a big difference in repeatability and back to back roasting. Not that it was in any way substandard before mods just a lot better after if that makes sense and the input voltage is now largely irrelevant as controlling the wattage the heater is drawing rather than the voltage driving the wattage the heater draws (smooths out peaks and troughs and allows to hold at a desired temp once first crack reached extending the time to second crack out)

John

p.s. had the gene since April 2014 and see no reduction in performance of the heater so suspect the change to 230v heater won't happen in the near future!


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## DavecUK

The reason for the 230V is:

1. Allows an overboost if roasting outside in very cold weather

2. Allows roasting even with a main voltage as low as 222-225V and even in winter outside.

3. The dimmer uses up about 20-30W, the scr controllers will use a similar amount.

4. Allows you to correct a bugger up, at the expense of slightly reduced element life.

5. Even if you use a very long crappy extension cord, you can still roast.

In general failure is due to the element getting too hot too many times, but sensible use makes the roaster super flexible. e.,g. don't use more than 1200W, unless your in -6 or below, then you can progressively use more power.

So not super essential if you have good mains voltage and/or roast indoors.


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## PaulL

I echo Daves's wisdom as usual, he pushed me to mod my Gene Cafe with power control when I got it a few years ago even though I'm not very technically minded (to the point of being a reference point at times - if Paul can do this then others can!), my Quest has power control and I have been using that for 3 years now. A power control sits indoors ready for the move to the Amazon roaster soon as well. I can't imagine roasting without the flexibility and control it gives and I record the inputs and temps at time points in the my roasting logs on every roast. Over 10 years it allowed me to build up reference points and typical adjustments needed for different beans in each season whether roasting at 0c or 25c. Dave's long-used analogy of driving on a motorway at 70mph is a good explanation of why power control makes sense.


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## h1udd

Just bought a voltage monitor ... Immediate help ... I never realised having the oven on or the washing would reduce line voltage so much !!! ... Ok, re-roast with appliances turned off


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## ronsil

h1udd said:


> .. Ok, re-roast with appliances turned off


Don't forget to include coffee machines. They'll cause your power to surge like no other.


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## h1udd

What .... Ok, I guess that's the excuse I need for a stove top mocha pot


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## froggystyle

The one thing you can do is fit a new socket next to your consumer board on its own circuit breaker if you have the space, you can then run an extension lead (of good quality) to the roaster, you might get a little voltage drop but not a lot, if you use decent cable like artic 2.5mm the voltage drop should be low.


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## h1udd

I do have a single socket wired up like that in the hall, it's also on a 32a breaker, no idea what the previous owners were doing in the hall I'll try a roast from there

also tried my 1st roast today, set the grinder, 1st ground at 4seconds gave me exactly 12g .... Perfect pull on the la pavoni, impressed was an understatement, it must have been a fluke roast, was expecting big chocolate, but it's come out so creamy, it's like a galaxy bar


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## froggystyle

Wins all round mate!


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## froggystyle

Keep some of the MM's, chuck them in with one of the other beans i gave you, 30% MM into 70% other, or if you have some brazilian in the CC greens mix with them, you should get the deep choccy plus the thick creamy, heavy taste from MM. Top drink!


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