# Sage Dual Boiler - £600 - Wimbledon



## Fevmeister (Oct 21, 2013)

Saw this and thought some may be interested

https://www.gumtree.com/p/coffee-machines/sage-dual-boiler-bes920uk.-good-condition.-/1123845122


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

That's a pretty good price. Should still have one year of warranty (provided seller has the original receipt).


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## risky (May 11, 2015)

DoubleShot said:


> That's a pretty good price. Should still have one year of warranty (provided seller has the original receipt).


I'd say it's a great price. A year old and half price? Plus these don't come up for sale second hand very often, probably a testament to what the owners think of them.

Regarding the warranty, aren't these a lifetime warranty if bought from lakeland?


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

risky said:


> I'd say it's a great price. A year old and half price? Plus these don't come up for sale second hand very often, probably a testament to what the owners think of them.
> 
> Regarding the warranty, aren't these a lifetime warranty if bought from lakeland?


Lakeland told me over the phone that the warranty was only available for the original purchaser. This is because the item does not have to be broken. You can simply ask for a refund without any reason at any point


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## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

Well, that didn't last long.. advert is now unavailable.


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

Posted 51 days ago - surely it can't still be available? Tried to send an email and gumtree helpfully said "sorry that page can't be reached. Here is a picture of a cat in a tie"?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

risky said:


> I'd say it's a great price. A year old and half price? Plus these don't come up for sale second hand very often, probably a testament to what the owners think of them.
> 
> Regarding the warranty, aren't these a lifetime warranty if bought from lakeland?


The pedant behind the till corrected me when i changed a mincer recently, it's not a lifetime guarantee, it's a satisfaction guarantee - you can exchange/get a refund if you feel you haven't had your money's worth.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Their Guarantee keeps on changing. it now is a price match guarantee whilst returns they simply say

RETURNS

If for any reason, you're not 100% happy with your purchase(s) please tell us so that we can put it right - it's all part of the Lakeland guarantee plus all returns are free.

To do this, it would be really helpful if you could call one of our friendly Customer Services Advisors on 015394 88100 first, as there are occasions when it may not be necessary for you to be inconvenienced by sending a product back to us.


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

dfk41 said:


> Their Guarantee keeps on changing. it now is a price match guarantee whilst returns they simply say
> 
> RETURNS
> 
> ...


When I've looked at the Lakeland guarantee of late I've been told it's a satisfaction guarantee not a lifetime one i.e. "It would still apply if you felt the item hadn't lasted as along as it should have."

Which is open to huge amount of interpretation. I could see you maybe able to push it to 3-4 years but after that I could see them not playing ball.

If they honour anything past this then they won't be around as a company for very long surely.


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

Or look at it from a different point of view...

By offering such a guarantee, they gain far more sales than the amount of refund requests they receive from customers dissatisfied with their purchase(s).

They mention every single product is extensively tested prior to them stocking it, ensuring high quality products to their customers.

It's refreshing to see this type of thought behind a companies 'customer satisfaction' promise instead of just following the herd of other 'box shifters' out there.

(I am in no way affiliated with Lakeland btw).


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

urbanbumpkin said:


> When I've looked at the Lakeland guarantee of late I've been told it's a satisfaction guarantee not a lifetime one i.e. "It would still apply if you felt the item hadn't lasted as along as it should have."
> 
> Which is open to huge amount of interpretation. I could see you maybe able to push it to 3-4 years but after that I could see them not playing ball.
> 
> If they honour anything past this then they won't be around as a company for very long surely.


Isnt that essentially the sales of goods act?


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

DoubleShot said:


> It's refreshing to see this type of thought behind a companies 'customer satisfaction' promise instead of just following the herd of other 'box shifters' out there.


I completely agree, it's good to see companies putting service as high priority.

I just don't think they could sustain guaranteeing goods for more than 3-4 years(at no additional cost) without making a huge loss overall.

I just think the customer satisfaction guarantee is a bit ambiguous.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Lakeland are slowly moving away from that that they used to promise. The Guarantee used to be that you could change your item for a full refund as long as you had the receipt, whenever that might be.

I was in my local store when a woman brought a manly frying pan in with her receipt, and this was several years old going by looks, gave it to the assistant and said I want a smaller one, and it was exchanged in 60 seconds!


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

The main products at Lakeland that get talked about here are electrical appliances, namely Sage Duo Temp, Barista Express, and The Dual Boiler.

As has been mentioned a few times recently, Lakeland's lifetime guarantee is a satisfaction one not one against an electrical breaking down outside of its standard manufacturers guarantee.

Now, let's say for a moment a customer purchased a Sage DB and it broke down 2.5 years after it was purchased. Customer has 3 or 4 possible options.

1) pay to have the product repaired.

2) try getting it repaired f.o.c. under the sales of goods act

3) move the item on

4) return it to Lakeland stating you're dissatisfied with the product and would like it replaced or refunded.

No guesses for which option most customers of Lakeland would choose. Now given how much less stress that will involve compared to the other options, in my mind, said person will remain a happy customer of Lakeland.

Win win?


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Valid point


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

urbanbumpkin said:


> I just don't think they could sustain guaranteeing goods for more than 3-4 years(at no additional cost) without making a huge loss overall.


It's probably not the sort of thing people take the piss with - DFK's frying pan example notwithstanding, not many people would have the brass neck to try and get a manky old pan swapped. Also cost price to them will be tiny, they could likely swap stuff two or three times over and still be up


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

jeebsy said:


> It's probably not the sort of thing people take the piss with - DFK's frying pan example notwithstanding, not many people would have the brass neck to try and get a manky old pan swapped. Also cost price to them will be tiny, they could likely swap stuff two or three times over and still be up


Markup isn't that high, if they weren't able to reclaim any of the value of the item from the manufacturer or however tax works on returns then one replacement would see them down on most items.

I think its a question of how much extra business the peace of mind guarantee gives them versus the people with the audacity to return something years later and at Lakelands cost. I agree that I think that number would be low, and I certainly think Lakelands garuntee, however ambiguously worded, is winning them business.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Dylan said:


> Markup isn't that high


You think? Across all their products?


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

jeebsy said:


> You think? Across all their products?


I think most, but only from watching Dragons Den where a markup of 300% is laughed at by the Dragons. Its a rock solid source of information I know.


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

I'm not sure how long Lakeland have been running their lifetime satisfaction guarantee (maybe @dfk41 has some idea?) but if they were losing huge sums of money over it, I'm sure it would not still be in place.

The great British public, unlike their cousins across the pond (USA) in general don't like to complain when products (or services for that matter) are not up to scratch. Would not surprise me in the least bit if this important fact wasn't taken into consideration when the idea was first thought about.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Lakeland name was made on selling exclusive things you would not readily see elsewhere so they could charge what they like. Not the same with branded stuff but it all goes into the same pot


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Dragon's Den is a load of pish and I try to avoid it, but in the instances I have seen it the 'what do you sell this to the retailer for' price always seem quite low compared to the retail price. Certainly the prices with the wholesalers I use online are really cheap compared to retail prices.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

But with all the overheads accounted for you think they would still be up after 2-3 returns? That would seriously surprise me, it would make the markup in the region of 3-400%.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Maybe not on big ticket electronics but ceratinly shit like frying pans and fish slices


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

I guess I can see that with 'exclusive' brands, like Joseph Joseph at JL, and if thats the case with Lakeland as dfk said above then I guess it applies to them too.


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

Not sure Joseph Joseph is exclusive to JL (certain products, possibly?) as Amazon stock some.

I bet the percentage of Lakeland customers that actually know about the lifetime satisfaction guarantee isn't that high. Then the amount who put it to the test by returning something outside of the standard manufacturers guarantee is even lower. I don't see how they are losing thousands or tens/hundreds of thousands by doing so.

The actual numbers would make for an interesting read though...


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

DoubleShot said:


> Not sure Joseph Joseph is exclusive to JL (certain products, possibly?) as Amazon stock some.


Bad example then...

But products that of a slightly higher quality but have a much higher price tag.


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## Fevmeister (Oct 21, 2013)

lakeland pricing is certainly at a premium to other high street stores, there aren't many similar businesses around but its clear Lakeland offer premium service/guarantee for a premium price - very similar proposition to John Lewis if you ask me!


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

I thought similar regarding JL & Lakeland.


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

I worked at a camera retailers many years ago. They used to sell a standard warranty for cameras for £25. Covered the item for three years, repair or replace.

I can't remember the exact statistics of % claims, but the warranties worked out at 90%+ profit.

I reckon that Lakeland have just done the same thing but relied on the satisfaction guarantee as a selling tool to get customers in rather than something to make money out of.

It obviously works. How many people on here (and elsewhere) have boght their Sage gear from Lakeland rather than Amazon or JL for precisely this reason.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

NickdeBug said:


> I worked at a camera retailers many years ago. They used to sell a standard warranty for cameras for £25. Covered the item for three years, repair or replace.
> 
> I can't remember the exact statistics of % claims, but the warranties worked out at 90%+ profit.
> 
> ...


In fairness tho, the Lakeland price has often been very keen, and sometimes far better than Amazon, and especially JL.


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## Fevmeister (Oct 21, 2013)

The price match is another less well known lakeland policy

They would assume the majority of buyers dont know about either the price match or their warranty/satisfaction/guarantee


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

I put Lakeland's price promise to the test last week after another member mentioned it to me.

After exchanging a couple of emails, they were prepared to match a cheaper price available elsewhere (£120 cheaper!) but insisted the order had to be placed that same day (there were only 3 business hours remaining at the time!) and over the phone.

Needless to say I didn't go ahead on that occasion.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Why is it needless to say?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

And only three business hours left in the day. Out of eight. Jesus. How do they expect you to make a decision in that time?


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