# Best descaler for Gaggia Classic?



## espresso_a_day

I've bought some Puly "Cleaner/Descaler" to descale my Gaggia Classic. Bought it from Happy Donkey, who sell it as "Puly Baby" and sells is as "not a citrus based descaler".

However, the ingredients are: "citric acid, malic acid, sodium citrate".

Does anyone have long-term experience whether this causes problems with the aluminium boiler?

Would Gaggia own-brand descaler be better? (recommended by the instructions booklet; no surprise) Does anyone know whether that is essentially the same thing as the Puly, or is it based on different chemicals?

Thanks


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## Glenn

Have had no issues with using Puly Cleaner Baby on my Gaggia Classic for the past 4 years. Still going strong. Started out using Gaggia branded descaler but when i found it out of stock more often than not I switched with no noticeable issues.

The product I use is here


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## BanishInstant

I've used Puly Baby on my Gaggia Coffee without ill effect.


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## espresso_a_day

Thanks for the quick replies.

This is good news provided the product I have is the same. Package design is exactly the same as the link provided by Glenn and on "Puly Baby" on Puly website, but my package says "Descaler" where the others say "Baby". I think it's very very likely that this is the same product. Maybe this is a new English product name?

If one of you actually wants to take the trouble to check the ingredients of your Puly Baby, I'd be interested whether they match what mine says, but this is low priority.

Take it as a good sign that I'm enjoying the espresso from the Gaggia so much I want to make sure I keep it in top shape


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## Glenn

Post a pic of the box and we'll soon tell you

Each side of the box in the pic linked has instructions in different languages and mentions Descaler and Baby


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## espresso_a_day

Hmm file upload fails.

Anyhow, mine looks exactly like the one at the xpresscoffee link, *except* it has "Descaler" where the other says "Baby". "Baby" isn't on the package.

But I think it's not implausible they simply changed the name, so if mine has the same ingredients as the "Baby" I'd guess it's the same.


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## BanishInstant

espresso_a_day said:


> If one of you actually wants to take the trouble to check the ingredients of your Puly Baby, I'd be interested whether they match what mine says, but this is low priority.
> 
> Take it as a good sign that I'm enjoying the espresso from the Gaggia so much I want to make sure I keep it in top shape


I will check tonight.

It is a good sign indeed. My sister's Gaggia has not been descaled in over 5 years, and its output is positively turgid.


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## The Judge

For the record, you may want to stay away from the official Gaggia liquid 'decalcifier' since it is ridiculously expensive. I bought a bottle for about £7 thinking it could be used at least a couple of times but the instructions state that the whole bottle should be used for one descaling process :S.


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## BanishInstant

My packet does say Baby on it. There is not an ingredients list either.


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## sandykt

I use the Puly Cleaner/Descaler and have experienced no problems at all. I also use a sachet to clean the portafilter and trip tray.


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## Osh

I buy tartaric acid powder on ebay, which is recommended for aluminum boilers. Less harsh than citric acid apparently.


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## david

If anyone's still interested, the Puly Baby Cleaner (great name!) contains Citric Acid, Malic Acid and sodium citrate.


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## Pdalowsky

Is this the same product Glen?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Puly-Baby-Espresso-Machine-Cleaner-Descaler-10pk-/181101934372?pt=Coffee_Machines_Makers&hash=item2a2a843724

it just seems way cheaper than the link earlier in this thread?


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## HDAV

Being old fashioned are there any shops that sell this stuff (Wilkinsons/tesco/lakeland etc) or where you can get it (Chemists/cookware/home brew shops etc)


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## Glenn

Not sure what machine you have Pdalowsky but yes, it seems to be


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## Pdalowsky

Thanks, I just have the simple old Classic so was worried after reading a lot of talk about the aluminion boiler being damaged, so ideally wanted to follow your advice.


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## Big Tony

Pdalowsky - I use Puly Cleaner Descaler here - http://www.amazon.co.uk/Descaler-Baby-Puly-Cleaner-Sachets/dp/B002EJ6EHS

this is obviously for descaling.

I use puly caff for cleaning and soaking the external parts - here http://www.amazon.co.uk/Puly-Caffe-Cleaning-Powder-900g/dp/B0033FYR0I/ref=sr_1_1?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1364219301&sr=1-1

Both work a treat


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## Pdalowsky

Thanks....

i bought the Puly Caff so will be having my maiden descale and backflush session this weekend......


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## Tony Maloan

The Puly Descaler and Urnex Dezcal are suitable for aluminium boilers (you'll see this repeated in various forums and product reviews). Yes the Gaggia Descaler is more expensive, but what would it cost to replace the boiler (if at all possible)


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## oracleoftruth

Boiler replacement is the cost of a broken machine with same boiler so roughly ten to twenty quid. You'd also get plenty of other bits in case you need them.

I've heard a weak citric acid solution is fine for gaggias and is way cheaper. If you do a search you can find the right ratio.


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## Charliej

the Puly Baby I have just bought for people also just says Puly Cleaner Descaler and has the same picture of a machine on the box, they are the same product it contains a buffering agent to ensure that there is no damage to the aluminium of the boiler.


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## innatelogic

Charliej said:


> it contains a buffering agent to ensure that there is no damage to the aluminium of the boiler


Nice to see some chemistry coming out here. I don't know much but I sense we're being fleeced when we buy branded descaler.

The easy route is to buy citric acid off e.g. ebay and make an acidic solution to descale with. I've seen suggestions ranging from 12-60g of the acid powder to 1l of water and would love to know more about what 'concentration/time in the boiler' combo would be safest.

The 'next level' is to take the buffering seriously. The fact is that malic acid and (tri)sodium citrate are in puly descaler. I know nothing about malic acid unfortunately. Since trisodium citrate is harder to buy in small quantities (and more expensive) than citric acid so I decided to make my own. If I recall correctly from A level Chemistry: sodium bicarbonate + citric acid -> sodium citrate + water + carbon dioxide. Thus to 'home brew' some buffered descaler stick some citric acid and a tsp of baking powder (both cheap and easily available) in the tank, stir and flush.

I'd really appreciate some help deducing the right quantities of the above though. Any chemists reading? Is the malic acid necessary for the buffering?


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## michaelg

I'd stick with a sachet of the approved stuff personally even as a former lab chemist. They've spent the time researching the ideal combination and quantities to perform the job properly. Wouldn't use sodium carbonate or sodium bicarbonate at all as not the most soluble and you could end up with chunks of it clogging up the boiler for years to come. Plus all that CO2 given off in a confined space? No thanks! Better paying for a sachet than a new boiler (or face!)


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## Charliej

I bought myself a dozen sachets of Dezcal when sorting out the group buy stuff, it's to use with the Sage and as it has stainless teel boilers most things should be fine to use, it came in at under £3 inc VAT so will do for me lol.


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## craig01nire

I'm just about to do the first descale of my gaggia using dezcal sachet.

When using dezcal, am I supposed to purge the solution through for a few secs, turn the machine off for twenty mins then flush the whole thing, or just purge for a few more seconds, turn off for twenty mins then repeat until empty?

I've seen both methods explained but I'm not sure which one I am supposed to do.


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## gaggiamanualservice.com

the best descaler for these machines is the gaggia/saeco LIQUID descaler, its formulated for enclosed boilers, wrong descaler will destroy boiler. don't use powder descaler, if not fully desolved it blocks the solenoid, that's why gaggia stopped using it


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## DavidBondy

What about the other way around? Is it OK to use the Gaggia liquid in regular HX machines? DB


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## gaggiamanualservice.com

oh yeah, perfect for all espresso machines. just make sure instructions are followed.


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## Roger120

According to the Phillips Safety Sheet for Gaggia Descaler Every dose contains -

Citric Acid 62.5g

Lactic Acid 25g

and water.

Mix with water (Do it a bit early as it takes some time to dissolve) pour into coffee machine's water container and top up to required level.

No need to measure water because the water container does that.

When descaling I use one large enough container. In order to stop splashes when discharging through the steam wand I place a washing up brush to catch the stream = no splash.

file:///home/roger/Pictures/NoSplash.JPG


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