# The purpose of forum selling rules



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Having just come out of a ban for messaging sellers directly, I was told that the rules exist so that in the event of a problem, there was an audit trail so the forum could intervene and assess. If you choose not to follow those rules, then you have no protection and th forum does not need to get involved. Whats all the hassle about?


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## Missy (Mar 9, 2016)

I would assume that by offering a forum for sale/wanted there's a risk of liability for the forum owner if things go wrong, plus the obvious potential damage to the reputation of the forum.

It's one thing being a known face, but it's unfair to have one rule for one and another for others, and with such a low post count needed to access the sales forum...


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## Drewster (Dec 1, 2013)

{Repost - to comply with rules/suggestion ;-) }

I understand that viewpoint - However you are using (whatever medium) to widen/expand your market and above and beyond any "protection" offered by that medium curtesy suggests you should respect the norms of that medium.

In the case of eBay obviously you pay for the service/protection and bypassing the system is "doubly" bad in that you gain the exposure etc and then renege on the payment (pay back) side....

Forum wise I personally don't agree 100% with the "rules" but generally accept and follow them in good grace


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## jimbocz (Jun 5, 2015)

I always thought that the point of the forum rules was not to offer any sort of adjudication or protection, but simply so that everyone is on the same page with expectations. For example, if I am negotiating on the for sale thread I know that the seller is not also taking offers by PM. It's just to make things easier for everyone.


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

I think that a ban was a bit harsh.

Not everyone wants the world to know the details of their transactions, although I think that is easier to defend when responding to Wanted ads rather than conducting off board negotiations in response to a item advertised for sale.

If someone mentions in a thread that they might be interested in purchasing an "x" then I see no problem with sending them a message. I have to admit that I have not fully studied the rules to know if that contravenes them, but if it does then I apologies and will happily serve out any ban seen fit as I have done this on a couple of occasions (although one was in the full knowledge of a moderator)


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

The rule exists to protect the forum, and quite rightly so.....but, if both parties decide for whatever reason, that they do not want forum protection, then what harm is being done. I am sure it is done many times, but only every now and then does it come out. And if there is a post sale issue, the forum simply states, rules not followed.....sort it out yourself


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## Drewster (Dec 1, 2013)

dfk41 said:


> The rule exists to protect the forum, and quite rightly so.....but, if both parties decide for whatever reason, that they do not want forum protection, then what harm is being done. *I am sure it is done many times, but only every now and then does it come ou*t. And if there is a post sale issue, the forum simply states, rules not followed.....sort it out yourself


This is very true.... many "For Sale" threads just fade into oblivion - many possibly where the item may have sold "outside the rules" but "unknown"....

At the end of the day this isn't a "crime" but taking your own booze into a Pub so that you can use the other facilities "cheap" isn't a "crime" but..........


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

dfk41 said:


> Having just come out of a ban for messaging sellers directly


How was this discovered?

are private messages monitored ?

You dont have to say if you dont want to,, but im intrigued


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> How was this discovered?
> 
> are private messages monitored ?
> 
> You dont have to say if you dont want to,, but im intrigued


It is no secret. I told the forum member (who never ever posts) to state sold off forum. He decided to say sold to a forum member. To protect him, I held my hands up


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> How was this discovered?
> 
> are private messages monitored ?
> 
> You dont have to say if you dont want to,, but im intrigued


All

Communication is monitored on here . Dfk is the coffee forums Assange. I actually know what colour trousers your are wearing .


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## Drewster (Dec 1, 2013)

Mrboots2u said:


> All
> 
> Communication is monitored on here . Dfk is the coffee forums Assange. I actually know what colour trousers your are wearing .


Ahhhhh does that make you my (long lost) Big Brother?


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Mrboots2u said:


> All
> 
> Communication is monitored on here . Dfk is the coffee forums Assange. I actually know what colour trousers your are wearing .


Private Messages are not usually able to be monitored. If thats the case, I am off......perhaps we can have some clarification on this please....(monitoring of pm's not this thread)


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

it is a bit disturbing to hear private messages are monitored.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> it is a bit disturbing to hear private messages are monitored.


You think I am being serious ?


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

you was a moderator,, so you would know either way if PMs are being read by anyone other than the intended recipient.

Where you joking ?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> you was a moderator,, so you would know either way if PMs are being read by anyone other than the intended recipient.
> 
> Where you joking ?


Yes I was ...

Joking that is

You need to get out more .

Your wearing jeans btw


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

This is a coffee Forum , not wiki leaks . You guys really need something more important to talk about , think about .


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

Mrboots2u said:


> Yes I was Joking


thanks for clarifying that.



Mrboots2u said:


> This is a coffee Forum , not wiki leaks . You guys really need something more important to talk about , think about .


says the man with 20,000 posts to his name


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## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

The site owners have put in place a (very comprehensive) set of rules for buying & selling on their forum. This protects them as it shows they are acting with due diligence as well as trying to make that part of the forum as fair as possible for all. That's their choice & I'm pretty sure it causes not a small amount of extra work moderating the threads. It doesn't reallly matter if you agree with them or not. You have the choice to follow them, disregard them but suffer the consequences if found out or ultimately buy & sell your stuff elsewhere out of their control (e.g. gumtree etc).

As for others being able to read your pms. I wouldn't be surprised if some level of admin has access to them even if the modetators don't. It was at least the case on forum I used to frequent but instead of being moderated was only ever rarely accessed if someone made a complaint ( for trolling/bullying mostly).


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## jimbocz (Jun 5, 2015)

Nothing you do on the internet is private. If you are using work computers, your boss can most likely see your PMs as well.

I'm surprised that anyone has any expectations of privacy on this or any other forum. Let's imagine that the forum administrators read through your PMs, saw what kind of equipment you were considering and sold that knowledge to manufacturers so they can send you spam. That's essentially what Google does!

I'll tell you something else, your mobile phone is constantly broadcasting your location all day long and there's a log being kept of everywhere you ever go.

I'm afraid that your expectations of privacy might be out of date.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> thanks for clarifying that.
> 
> says the man with 20,000 posts to his name


I am an over posting Twaddle meister.... of that there is no doubt .

I'm just not a massively paranoid one that thinks people have the time , effort , inclination, energy and will to read people's pms on a coffee forum.


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## filthynines (May 2, 2016)

Would be interested to know what liability the forum's owner(s) could incur by virtue of being a mere conduit to a third party transaction. With authorities, not just based on speculation.


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## MartinB (May 8, 2011)

Clarity is key, the community (whether it be purely online or members who actually know each other face-to-face) all need to be responsible users on this forum. The rules are there to protect everyone, not just buyers in my opinion. I've had times when users have messaged me directly to buy equipment and for everyone's benefit I have pointed them towards the thread to formally make the offer. I genuinely see no problem with the rules that are in place on the forum?


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## MartinB (May 8, 2011)

As it stands, under English law, an agreement/contract can be with at least one party, however the offer and acceptance of a legally binding agreement are between two parties (when trading on this forum): Buyer and seller, therefore the forum/owners bear no liability as far as I can see. However as per my previous note, the clarity between buyer and seller is captured, which is key.


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

dfk41 said:


> Having just come out of a ban for messaging sellers directly, I was told that the rules exist so that in the event of a problem, there was an audit trail so the forum could intervene and assess. If you choose not to follow those rules, then you have no protection and th forum does not need to get involved. Whats all the hassle about?


Glenn sets the rules and I'm sure he would be happy to consider alternative rules - but I think you should probably PM him and voice your concerns before posting a thread.

Ultimately he'll decide the rules - and my philosophy is if I don't like them I can leave...


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Jon said:


> Glenn sets the rules and I'm sure he would be happy to consider alternative rules - but I think you should probably PM him and voice your concerns before posting a thread.
> 
> Ultimately he'll decide the rules - and my philosophy is if I don't like them I can leave...


the thread was Rons idea, and i thought on a forum everything was up for discussion


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

dfk41 said:


> the thread was Rons idea, and i thought on a forum everything was up for discussion


You mean @ronsil suggested this?


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Does that make it any less so if you put @ronsil, @Jon ? @ronsil suggested moving to another thread


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## Drewster (Dec 1, 2013)

Jon said:


> You mean ronsil suggested this?


Basically yes.



ronsil said:


> Sorry to disagree David. The Forum is not like eBay
> 
> This is a free forum & should be regarded as a privilege to offer items to sell on here.
> 
> ...


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

Let's be clear about this.

For Sale or Swap is for negotiation based on a member offering an item for sale.

Any post which is not within that scope referring directly to that item should not cloud the sale negotiations and should be posted elsewhere.


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## dan1502 (Sep 8, 2012)

There's a huge variety of rules on different forums but I think the main rule that people have different views on relates to whether price negotiations should be open or private. There are pros and cons of both but I think the current rules generally work pretty well.


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## Drewster (Dec 1, 2013)

ronsil said:


> Let's be clear about this.
> 
> For Sale or Swap is for negotiation based on a member offering an item for sale.
> 
> Any post which is not within that scope referring directly to that item should not cloud the sale negotiations and should be posted elsewhere.


Well let's obfuscate a little bit - Most people reply/comment directly to a post "wherever that may be" rather than break it out of context into another thread...

even though that might bend the rules a bit.....

99% of responses wouldn't "survive" being transposed to a different thread. of course arguably that might be a good thing (although it would cut down forum posts dramatically)


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## badger28 (Jan 5, 2013)

I don't post often, but read a lot on this forum but this is simple...

This forum is controlled / owned / run by Glenn. He made the rules and this site exists because he allows it.

We agree with the terms and conditions when joining. And so agree to abide by the rules.

In my opinion Glenn allows a fair amount of discussion about things, but ultimately it is his all down to his decision. I assume you have spoken to him about it in private, and his decision has not changed. Job done.

Accept the rules and use the for sale section, or don't. Simple.


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

badger28 said:


> I don't post often, but read a lot on this forum but this is simple...
> 
> This forum is controlled / owned / run by Glenn. He made the rules and this site exists because he allows it.
> 
> ...


Couldn't agree more.


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