# Scepticism all gone? I think...



## rmblack78 (Oct 9, 2014)

Just accidentally improved my morning coffee...

Have always used 18g with same routine with the aim of getting consistency in what I produce. This morning I only put 17g in the basket...

Very surprised at the difference, the fruity flavours in the coffee were more muted (which I preferred), but now I'm concerned that the fruit was actually sourness.

Not sure how I would know. I'm using a gaggia classic with no mods, has be an Blake's espresso pre ground (no grinder yet its on the list). Getting a bit of crema, enough to cover the surface of the coffee with a couple of mm in a long black. The double I'm getting is taking around 27s.

Anyone have experience of these beans and know if they have a fruity after taste?

I'm may go full on coffee geek and do a video...

Thanks


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

I think a lot folk confuse sourness/tartness for "fruity", especially citrus flavour in coffee. The fruit flavours that appeal most to me are like sweet, ripe fruit...there can be acidity, like in peaches, grapes, plums etc. but excessive sourness is usually seen as a malfunction.

Your smaller dose may have pushed on extraction & lifted you out of the sour zone?

Never knock the "happy accident"


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

MWJB may be right , it's would be a little harder to tell the effect if you are measuring volume of your shots as opposed to weight and establishing a brew ratio you can repeat

. You may have reduced your dose to 17g and gotten the same output out or not . This is one of the drawbacks of measuring shot volume , it's hard to tell what you did and now to repeat it ...

Anyway if you enjoy it then that's most Important thing , next would be replicating it if you did ....


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## charris (Feb 17, 2014)

Also I noticed the following: For some beans I have much better results using the 15g basket rather than the 18g or 20g (All VST). I have opened another thread to discuss this (on dosage) since I would like to understand much more in the subject.

P.S. Mark (MWJB) I would love for some thoughts on this on my thread:

http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?19344-Dosage-Principles&p=221404#post221404


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## rmblack78 (Oct 9, 2014)

My Mrs thinks I'm mental now I'm talking about putting scales under the portafilter...

So what weight am I aiming for as a start point? (Or is that not how it works?).


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Do what you did to get the preferred shot, record the weight of the shot when it tastes good. That is then the weight you are aiming for.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

The scales business is just so you can figure out how 'long' the shot is, i.e. the ratio of grounds 'in' to espresso 'out'. It could be that the lower dose resulted in a slightly weaker or longer shot which would change the taste further from the acidic end. But judging output by eye is impossible, hence the scales - it's the only way to get the accurate brew ratio.

I also have a classic and used scales for a while to learn what 18g looked like, but generally just crack on with it most of the time. I do get them out when dialling in a new bean, or if I want to discuss a particular result with the folks on here. Otherwise I don't bother as long as what I'm getting is tasty.

Trying to get consistency on a classic is a bit hit and miss anyway - I get some great shots, but not always repeatable.

I have also stuck to roughly 18.5g for approx 38-40 out for ages, and have also been pleasantly surprised when I've tried longer shots or lower doses. Or even changing temperatures (mine has a PID).


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