# ECM Heidelberg Barista or Fracino Cherub



## chandlercoffee

Looking to upgrade from Delonghi bean to cup machine and want to spend approx 1k have seen these machines and like the look /features does anyone have any experience with them ? and am i going to enjoy my latte and espresso a lot more ?


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## Mrboots2u

Hello and welcome

Before you blow your budget , do you have a decent grinder to accompany either of these machines?


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## Dylan

Have a look here  to get an idea of what your money gets you with machines.

Consider looking at the Expobar DB, not quite as good looking as the ECM but gives you a PID to control brew temperature which is something that is great down the line when you are experimenting with your beans and types of roast.

Just to be clear ECM are a great make, and the machine is solid and will last you years, plus it is beautiful and will look great in any kitchen.

Also, you are going to need a grinder. Dont skimp, its more important than the machine itself when it comes to getting the very best out of your coffee, a budget of £5-800 would be realistic to match a machine of the caliber you are looking at.

Grinders - what you get for your money

It also may be beneficial for a mod to move this to the machines section!


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## chandlercoffee

I dont at moment because my machine has the inbuilt grinder but from the info on here i realise i need to get one to get the best from the machine,was considering the eureka mignon for new or possibly a used mazzer mini manual if i could find one but are their any better more budget conscious options?


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## Dylan

chandlercoffee said:


> I dont at moment because my machine has the inbuilt grinder but from the info on here i realise i need to get one to get the best from the machine,was considering the eureka mignon for new or possibly a used mazzer mini manual if i could find one but are their any better more budget conscious options?


In short, yes they are better. But really those are the budget conscious options when looking to pair them with a machine in the 1k range.

Maybe think about waiting for a good second hand HX to come up in our F/S section, and use the extra cash you have spare to put toward a really good grinder.


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## chandlercoffee

Thanks for the reply what grinders should i be looking at then ?


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## Dylan

There are a lot to look at.

But to give you an idea

A Mazzer SJ (S/H 250-300) or similar should really be the entry level of what you are looking at, if you can muster the cash a Mazzer Major (S/H 4-500) is a worthy upgrade.

A Eureka Zenith (£500new, rare S/H at the mo) is a great easy to use at home grinder, as capable if not slightly more so than the Mazzer SJ, benefits from electronic on demand dosing which improves at home usability.

If you can work out your budget to let you get a grinder in the 7-800 range then you can get a really great S/H grinder... there are others who can advise better than me in this range.

take a look at the link i posted in my first post in this thread as well.


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## Glenn

I would choose the ECM Heidelberg Barista over a Fracino Cherub if I had the choice

They are in different price brackets though

The ECM Heidelberg Barista steams milk beautifully too.

Both will need to be paired with a decent grinder

You could get away with a Mignon for both options


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## chandlercoffee

Thanks for the advice. I have been looking at the sj there are a few on ebay but i was concerned that most are the auto variant does this create problems when only making a few coffees a day?


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## Dylan

chandlercoffee said:


> Thanks for the advice. I have been looking at the sj there are a few on ebay but i was concerned that most are the auto variant does this create problems when only making a few coffees a day?


When using an ex commercial you either waste a bit of coffee each time 'guessing' when to turn off, or you weigh in your dose of beans to get the correct output. Unless you blow quite a lot extra on an electronic times output version. The 'E' denotes this in the Mazzer family.

Buying an ex commercial often means a few simple mods to reduce retention. The advantage is getting a very solid grinder that is very capable for a very good price.


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## chandlercoffee

Thanks for the advice


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## DavecUK

Glenn said:


> I would choose the ECM Heidelberg Barista over a Fracino Cherub if I had the choice
> 
> They are in different price brackets though
> 
> The ECM Heidelberg Barista steams milk beautifully too.
> 
> Both will need to be paired with a decent grinder
> 
> You could get away with a Mignon for both options


Totally agree with the above. I did do a review of the ECM Barista....I thought it was a pretty good HX machine, also as someone said, you could get in at the bottom of the dual boiler ladder for that money with the Expobar Dual boiler...although the 2 machines are a world apart in build quality. BB don't seem to have the review on the machine page (some bug), but it's in the list of all the reviews. Have a good read if you have not already, it will tell you all you need to know about the machine. I have also added the link to the Expobar DB review. It's an older version, the latest is version 6, (was done around 3.5 years ago, however the machine has not changed much.

http://www.bellabarista.co.uk/downloads/dl/file/id/9/closer_look_ecm_barista_review.pdf

http://www.bellabarista.co.uk/pdf/ExpobarOfficeLeva-DualBoilerv4CoffeeMachine.pdf


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## icom102

HI what Espresso machine did you go for?


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