# Spring Lever Machines on the Market



## PortafilterProcrastinator (Aug 26, 2020)

Being new to all of this and liking the idea of a spring lever more and more I decided to put together a list of what's available.

This is what I've come up with so far. I have tried to keep to home/ prosumer machines, but there are a few in there that have snuck in...

Conscious they are all very different. At some point I might do a more comprehensive table, but there's plenty more procrastinating to do before then.



Ponte Vecchio 

Export


Lusso



Londinium 

Compressa


L1


R24


Vectis (TBC)



QuickMill 

Rapida



Bezzera 

Strega



Izzo 

Alex Leva (Commercial/ Plumbed only)


Valexia Leva (Commercial/ Plumbed only)



Fracino 

Retro (Commercial/ Plumbed only)



ACS 

Vostok



Bosco

Sorrento


Posillipo



Fiorenzato 

Piazza San Marco (Availability??)



Profitec

Pro800



Salvatore 

Compact



Olympia 

Cremina



Elektra 

Microcasa Leva



La San Marco 

85 Leva (Commercial/ Plumbed only)


20/20 Leva (Commercial/ Plumbed only)



What others are there out there?


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Cremina is not sprung matey.......also you might like to further sort them into single/dual spring and pf or group size

Apologies, the new one is!


----------



## AliG (Aug 12, 2015)

Elektra microcasa leva


----------



## adamk (Jan 8, 2020)

There is also a one group version of the La San Marco 85 Leva or the newer 20/20 Leva (Commercial/ Plumbed only)


----------



## Rincewind (Aug 25, 2020)

Vostock 1 *(TBC)*


----------



## PortafilterProcrastinator (Aug 26, 2020)

dfk41 said:


> Cremina is not sprung matey.......also you might like to further sort them into single/dual spring and pf or group size
> 
> Apologies, the new one is!


 Absolutely. That's the plan. And a lot more besides. When I get some time.


----------



## PortafilterProcrastinator (Aug 26, 2020)

Rincewind said:


> Vostock 1 *(TBC)*


 Pre-orders taken and product shipping in weeks/ month or two - seems real enough not to need that.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

PortafilterProcrastinator said:


> Pre-orders taken and product shipping in weeks/ month or two - seems real enough not to need that.


 As has proved to be the case. Perhaps he was assuming (as usual) it would be the same as the Londinium Compact, regarding delivery timescales.


----------



## danielpugh (Oct 26, 2016)

Just noticed that the compressa should have a note to say that is plumbed in.

For the izzo leva etc - yes plumbed in, but not commercial specific to my knowledge - they are the same casing as duetto and available from @BlackCatCoffee for home use.


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

danielpugh said:


> Just noticed that the compressa should have a note to say that is plumbed in.
> 
> For the izzo leva etc - yes plumbed in, but not commercial specific to my knowledge - they are the same casing as duetto and available from @BlackCatCoffee for home use.


 You say the Izzo is not commercial, but do you happen to know what size the boiler is on it?


----------



## danielpugh (Oct 26, 2016)

dfk41 said:


> You say the Izzo is not commercial, but do you happen to know what size the boiler is on it?


 I do - yes it's blooming massive - that's good isn't it? Same size box as a duetto still. I'd have one at home now if it wasn't for the Vostok. Marketed in the same range as the duetto (http://www.alexduetto.com/). Plenty at homes in the USA, Europe and Australia. Still I bow to the opinions of others...


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Not knocking the Izzo.......it is well respected in the coffee van community in the UK, which made me presume it was a commercially orientated machine. I had a Bosco once and that had 6 to 7 litre boiler......to me it just meant a longer warm up time!


----------



## PortafilterProcrastinator (Aug 26, 2020)

danielpugh said:


> I do - yes it's blooming massive - that's good isn't it? Same size box as a duetto still. I'd have one at home now if it wasn't for the Vostok. Marketed in the same range as the duetto (http://www.alexduetto.com/). Plenty at homes in the USA, Europe and Australia. Still I bow to the opinions of others...





dfk41 said:


> Not knocking the Izzo.......it is well respected in the coffee van community in the UK, which made me presume it was a commercially orientated machine. I had a Bosco once and that had 6 to 7 litre boiler......to me it just meant a longer warm up time!


 I put it down as commercial due to plumb only and the 5ltr boiler. Not just the time taken to heat up, but the time to get through 5ltr!

Assuming a few drinks a day, all that boiling and re-boiling can't be good can it?

At some point I will get around to doing the actual table with spring configurations, portafilter size and boiler size. But just haven't had a chance.


----------



## danielpugh (Oct 26, 2016)

PortafilterProcrastinator said:


> I put it down as commercial due to plumb only and the 5ltr boiler. Not just the time taken to heat up, but the time to get through 5ltr!
> 
> Assuming a few drinks a day, all that boiling and re-boiling can't be good can it?
> 
> At some point I will get around to doing the actual table with spring configurations, portafilter size and boiler size. But just haven't had a chance.


 That's cool - the compressa is plumb only...


----------



## TomR (Feb 2, 2020)

regarding the large boiler on the Alex Izzo Leva - and I have one on order - my understanding is that boiler size is not a major determinant of overall heat up / readiness time ( a kettle can boil a litre of water in a small number of minutes,) which is determined by passive group heating, conceivably faster with a larger thermal mass of water heating the group. The actively heated group on the Vostok is the feature that nearly turned me in this direction.

Many home espresso machines have brew boilers that mean water will be hanging around for at least a good few days with light domestic use unless you flush genorously- the Izzo Leva certainly takes this to extremes ( the 5 L boiler has I think about 2-3 L of liquid in it, the remainder being steam space, as it is a dipper ) and I have decided to handle this by emptying out a litre or so of hot water via the HW outlet every day or two to avoid the boiler water getting too stale. Does this seem like a reasonable approach?


----------



## danielpugh (Oct 26, 2016)

TomR said:


> regarding the large boiler on the Alex Izzo Leva - and I have one on order - my understanding is that boiler size is not a major determinant of overall heat up / readiness time ( a kettle can boil a litre of water in a small number of minutes,) which is determined by passive group heating, conceivably faster with a larger thermal mass of water heating the group. The actively heated group on the Vostok is the feature that nearly turned me in this direction.
> 
> Many home espresso machines have brew boilers that mean water will be hanging around for at least a good few days with light domestic use unless you flush genorously- the Izzo Leva certainly takes this to extremes ( the 5 L boiler has I think about 2-3 L of liquid in it, the remainder being steam space, as it is a dipper ) and I have decided to handle this by emptying out a litre or so of hot water via the HW outlet every day or two to avoid the boiler water getting too stale. Does this seem like a reasonable approach?


 I believe that's right. Group heatup will take longer (solution being a timing switch). Group cartridges are a bonus for me, the main pull was the ability to adjust brew/group temps while maintaining steam (we drink a lot of milk drinks). That and the group manometer which I think will be handy.


----------



## Levvieman (Sep 14, 2021)

The Izzo Alex Leva is a prosumer machine by the look of it.Small footprint.


----------



## 29244 (Feb 8, 2021)

danielpugh said:


> Just noticed that the compressa should have a note to say that is plumbed in.
> 
> For the izzo leva etc - yes plumbed in, but not commercial specific to my knowledge - they are the same casing as duetto and available from @BlackCatCoffee for home use.


 From memory the Alex and Valexia were developed in response to requests, including from DaveCUK, for a prosumer version of their multiple group head levers. (I have a Valexia on order with an ETA of September 30 ... counting down the days). So yes, pretty sure they are not intended as being suitable only in a commercial setting.


----------



## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

tompoland said:


> From memory the Alex and Valexia were developed in response to requests, including from DaveCUK, for a prosumer version of their multiple group head levers. (I have a Valexia on order with an ETA of September 30 ... counting down the days). So yes, pretty sure they are not intended as being suitable only in a commercial setting.


 @tompoland I asked them to make the Izzo Alex Duetto back in the day and did the top level work for the design and specification. I loved the Pompeii Levers and wanted them to make a smaller 1 group for the home, they only had a 1 group with a huge boiler. Their concern was tipping, so they wouldn't do it. The 2 levers mentioned were nothing to do with me.😉


----------



## 29244 (Feb 8, 2021)

The Izzo Valexia has arrived and I'm loving it. Thanks for the inspiration


----------



## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

@tompoland Thats one big boy!


----------



## 29244 (Feb 8, 2021)

dfk41 said:


> @tompoland Thats one big boy!


 Indeed, 46kg. Just about did me in getting it up onto the bench. I think my days of wrestling with Italian Heavyweights may be over.


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

How much am I looking at for the cheapest sprung lever machine?

I was hoping to change from my europicolla but looking at Londinium for example it looks like I'll have to spend £3k+.

Thanks.


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

The strega prob one of the cheapest.

https://www.blackcatcoffee.co.uk/collections/domestic-coffee-machines/products/bezzera-strega-s

Then the profitec

https://www.bellabarista.co.uk/brands/profitec-800-hand-lever-machine-with-pid-control.html

Londinium do a plumb only machine around 2k but id highly stay away from that one.


----------



## mathof (Mar 24, 2012)

Cuprajake said:


> Londinium do a plumb only machine around 2k but id highly stay away from that one.


 Why? I have read several posts on other forums from content owners of that one.


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

its alot of money for what it is, and its not just a few bits short of an lr24

i know a guy who has one, and regrets getting that now, as he was going to add the pump to it at a later date, as he was shy on money at the time, londinium wont sell him the bits,

its a direct water feed too, and has to have a drain fitted, so needs a safe filtered water supply with carbon block, aswell as a valve if you want to adjust the pressure to brew, its also always under mains pressure


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Cuprajake said:


> The strega prob one of the cheapest.
> 
> https://www.blackcatcoffee.co.uk/collections/domestic-coffee-machines/products/bezzera-strega-s
> 
> ...


 Thanks for this. Looked at both - quite like the look of the profitec and how basic it is. I have a europicolla at the moment and I like the silence and simpleness. I just want a sprung lever - not so fussed about lots of toys.

Anyone want to caution me against the profitec?


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

@haz_pro - have you seen the size of the boiler on the Profitec? It's also a dipper, so you'll need to refresh the water quite often, or it will sit there for&#8230; weeks. @khampal had a QuickMill Rapida (or is it a Veloce)? Which has a similar design. I'm sure he should be able to give you some insights.

I'm mainly hanging around https://*********************.com these days.


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> @haz_pro - have you seen the size of the boiler on the Profitec? It's also a dipper, so you'll need to refresh the water quite often, or it will sit there for&#8230; weeks. @khampal had a QuickMill Rapida (or is it a Veloce)? Which has a similar design. I'm sure he should be able to give you some insights.
> 
> I'm mainly hanging around https://*********************.com these days.


 Yeah I'd seen the boiler size - the impact being a longer warm up time/increased energy cost right? Or is there more to consider?

Interesting point about the water sitting there and needing to be refreshed. Is that not just if it's not being used? In which case if I didn't use another machine for a few weeks the water would also just be sitting there? Or do you mean - because of the size of the tank it means the water is likely to spend a lot more time in the boiler rather than a machine with a smaller boiler?

Seems I have some more to learn!😂


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

haz_pro said:


> Yeah I'd seen the boiler size - the impact being a longer warm up time/increased energy cost right? Or is there more to consider?
> 
> Interesting point about the water sitting there and needing to be refreshed. Is that not just if it's not being used? In which case if I didn't use another machine for a few weeks the water would also just be sitting there? Or do you mean - because of the size of the tank it means the water is likely to spend a lot more time in the boiler rather than a machine with a smaller boiler?
> 
> Seems I have some more to learn!😂


 It will also leave behind a lot of minerals as you use it. I'll let Kiran reply as he actually has first hand experience with a similar setup.


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

depending on water used of coarse.

none of these levers will be silent as there is some pump action with them


----------



## BlackCatCoffee (Apr 11, 2017)

As Cuprajake rightly points out, both the Bezzera and Profitec use a pump so both will make a noise (although they are quite different in the way they do so).

Both have their pros and cons but if you are interested in the Bezzera given me a shout as I went a bit loopy on Stregas in my last order and I can probably come up with one at an even more attractive price for you.

David


----------



## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Cuprajake said:


> depending on water used of coarse


 Of course. But even when I drank some water for an Americano the other day, using the steam boiler of the Elizabeth, the water wasn't great, taste wise.


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> It will also leave behind a lot of minerals as you use it. I'll let Kiran reply as he actually has first hand experience with a similar setup.


 Ah I see... Hmm.



Cuprajake said:


> depending on water used of coarse.
> 
> none of these levers will be silent as there is some pump action with them


 Bottled water at the moment but looking into filter options. Considering getting a zero water and then mixing with some tap water. I live in Norfolk so very hard water.

My understanding with the profitec is that the pump is used to refill the boiler rather than to push water into the brewhead, so hoping it shouldn't come on too often. Sounds like if I plumb it will be silent - though this wouldn't be an option for now. Point noted



BlackCatCoffee said:


> As Cuprajake rightly points out, both the Bezzera and Profitec use a pump so both will make a noise (although they are quite different in the way they do so).
> 
> Both have their pros and cons but if you are interested in the Bezzera given me a shout as I went a bit loopy on Stregas in my last order and I can probably come up with one at an even more attractive price for you.
> 
> David


 Thanks David, I'm not going to be buying until February/March so probably miss out on any deals you might be able to do unfortunately.

How long have you been selling the Strega for? Had many issues? I'll check out your site.


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

I think they recommend draining water from the steam boiler regularly.

Must admit i drink quite a few black drinks, so use the steam boiler tap quite regular.

If there like the londinium then yes just the boiler gets filled with the pump. The later londinium used rotary pumps to actually manipulate brew pressure. The acs goes ones step further with a gear pump.

I love the look and action of a lever but there not the be all end all, and some of the more basic machines can almost be a one trick pony. So think very carefully as youe on the brink of top dual boiler machines that would give alot more than a vibr pump hx machine imo


----------



## danielpugh (Oct 26, 2016)

Cuprajake said:


> depending on water used of coarse.
> 
> none of these levers will be silent as there is some pump action with them


 Just a note - profitec p800 and Izzo Alex/Valeria leva are totally silent when plumbed in - no pump at all...


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Plumbing isnt always simple, sadly esp in hard water area's, very costly filtration is needed inline, i looked into it when we moved with the l1


----------



## SimonB (Sep 12, 2013)

Cuprajake said:


> Plumbing isnt always simple, sadly esp in hard water area's, very costly filtration is needed inline, i looked into it when we moved with the l1


 Yeah but it often is and even a RO setup need not be that expensive. It might not be the right solution for many but there's no need to dismiss it out of hand.


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Ro and plumbing are kinda different though.

I make rodi and then re mineralise, where as a tap feed to a block to make machine safe water tends to get more expensive.

Think thats my alot go for the osmio thing, but again in my eyes they too can be a tad expensive, but tbf to them its a very convenient solution


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Cuprajake said:


> I
> 
> think they recommend draining water from the steam boiler regularly.
> 
> ...


 Thanks all for the replies.

I just don't have the same feeling about non-lever machines - they don't interest me. That being said I've never properly looked at the more expensive non-lever machines, maybe I need to. What would you recommend? 2 to 3 ish grand.

I got a price back to the ACS Vesuvius lever, which looks interesting, but I'm not sure how I feel about the screen/additional tech. I do like simplicity.

Decisions decisions eh


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Its a trick choice because each machine brings different things to the table.

If you take the older levers

Londinium 1, strega, profitec then they all work at a set pressure of the spring

Then you move to the lr24, acs leva and they have a pump to change pressure so you can change to use different beans.

The acs is dual boiler were the londinium is slightly older tech where you cant really adjust temp.

Then if you look at dual boilers like the profitec 700, or the bianca you can add flow control to the mix with the dual boilers,

Theres the decent which allows you to change every setting under the sun, and theres the all too expensive la marzoco linea which is a fixed rotary machine,

Ive also not mentioned a host of bezzera and izzo machine

But and a big but non of the pump machines can slam a puck like a lever can, they can deliver so much water in such a short time.

What sort lf beans do you drink? How many drinks are made at a time and do you use alot of milk/steaming

I think its best to set out what you want then find a machine that ticks most the boxes.

While i loved my l1, and would happily have another, id say i can make better drinks with my bianca, but my l1 was old tech, not that an e61 is any newer😂


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Appreciate you taking the time to keep responding.

I like medium and light roast beans, I wouldn't buy dark on purpose.

One drink at a time, maybe 2 at a time once in a blue moon. And I pretty much always drink a milky coffee, espresso by itself very rarely.

Based on that, any lever and non-lever suggestions? I am 99% sure I'll end up with a lever, even if there is a compromise, simply because I enjoy the interaction and theatre. 😂


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Ok, so you need to check the pressure the lever runs at

The l1 ran off a boiler pressure of 1.3 bar so it would infuse at 1.3 bar then the spring would kick in around 7bar

Something like the lr24 can be set, so most run 3bar up to 5bar for really light roast.

Not sure on the strega, what pressure does it infuse with @BlackCatCoffee?

The acs is twin spring but also a 53mm group

if you like med to light id be looking for a machine that can manipulate temp, and pressure.

so spring that only leave the acs or lr24 i think,

you could look at a acs Vesuvius which is a pressure profiler for around 2k if you speak to paulo from acs


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Thanks - I've looked at the Lr24 again and price is only a few hundred more than the ACS... I'm sure when I looked before the LR24 was coming out at over £4k - I wonder what I was doing differently... I guess this is before shipping for the LR24 too as it won't give me a quote.

I suppose I need to look into these two machines a bit more. It seem that my wish for simplicity is in contradiction with the types of beans I like. I want this to be an end-game machine for me, so better get it right.

Edit - I'm an idiot. The ACS price was in euros. The LR would work about about £900 more!


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Yeah its a tough choice one i had to make, i bought 3 machine intotal supposed to be end game 2 were faulty.


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Cuprajake said:


> Yeah its a tough choice one i had to make, i bought 3 machine intotal supposed to be end game 2 were faulty.


 Gees. Which 2 were faulty?

Based on your previous messages one was an lr24?


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Yeah, crem one profiler, and an lr24😭


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Cuprajake said:


> Yeah, crem one profiler, and an lr24😭


 With my luck I'll end up having to do the same.😂 Are you pretty settled on the Bianca now? No itch to get another lever?


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Yes very settled, the bianca just works. Its got great adjustability, looks nice, comes with everything you need in the box.

I visually love levers, but live not missed it enough to want to sell the bianca


----------



## pips (Aug 3, 2012)

Cuprajake said:


> Ro and plumbing are kinda different though.
> 
> I make rodi and then re mineralise, where as a tap feed to a block to make machine safe water tends to get more expensive.
> 
> Think thats my alot go for the osmio thing, but again in my eyes they too can be a tad expensive, but tbf to them its a very convenient solution


 I've just purchased an rodi for my marine tank. My understanding is I could either tee off (after the membrane and before the DI resin) or after. I was under the assumption that you add bicarbonate of soda but I think there's more.

Mind explaining how to re mineralise?


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

Yeah, simple as peas

You make a concentrate with potassium bicarbonate, you then add this to your main water and all done

If you'd to read about it, google Dr pavlis water.

To make it you add:

10g of potassium bicarbonate to 1litre of rodi

You then add 10ml of the concentration to 1l of rodi water, this then goes in the machine.

I keep my water in a 5l container and add 60ml.

There are plenty of different ways to re mineralise, but this is belived to be the easiest and least taste changing way


----------



## haz_pro (Apr 4, 2013)

Cuprajake said:


> Yes very settled, the bianca just works. Its got great adjustability, looks nice, comes with everything you need in the box.
> 
> I visually love levers, but live not missed it enough to want to sell the bianca


 Been looking at the Bianca (and also the profitec, when it had a flow control - seems it doesn't any more).

Well, damn it ... Now my decision is even harder. Looks like a lovely little machine.


----------



## cuprajake (Mar 30, 2020)

In terms of value for money its a great package.

The 700 again is a good machine, but the flow control is another £200 ontop which is what put me off, i did look at the bezzera machines, they have a electronic group and also e61 group, i decided against in the end due to knowing had i spent 2k and had no options to add flow control id of kicked myself.

Dont discount the acs Vesuvius as its also a great machine, has some quirks in terms of filling the water res, and im not a fan of the noise of a gear pump.

You're lucky your budget lends its self to so many machines

Have you thought about grinder and also water?


----------



## Sharkie (Apr 29, 2013)

@haz_proit might help getting some time on the levers that you are interested in, I am a londinium owner, albeit the L1-P commercial plumb only one group. I love the simplicity of this and get great results with it, my suggestion to throw into the mix is the londinium compressa, provided you can plumb in, as if you have an adjustable PRV on the line in, you can create similar results to the LR but cheaper and cheaper than the ACS as well. That said the ACS and LR24 are both very capable machines.


----------



## danielpugh (Oct 26, 2016)

Cuprajake said:


> In terms of value for money its a great package.
> 
> The 700 again is a good machine, but the flow control is another £200 ontop which is what put me off, i did look at the bezzera machines, they have a electronic group and also e61 group, i decided against in the end due to knowing had i spent 2k and had no options to add flow control id of kicked myself.
> 
> ...


 Coming from a rotary pump, I was worried about the noise of the gear pump. It runs for about 2-3 seconds (only while filling the chamber, i.e. unlike an e61 not while the shot is extracted) and is not particularly noisy or unpleasant.


----------

