# MaraX - water going from the tank straight to the drip tray



## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

Hello,

My MaraX has developed a problem since I descaled it yesterday. I followed the descale instructions as available on the Lelit support site, using the recommended descaler (Puly espresso).

The descale was recommended by Bella Barista support following some strange behaviour over the past couple of weeks (steam pressure varying all over the place, the machine filling the boiler very frequently).

I'm not in a position to send the machine back to them as I no longer live in the UK (moved to France late last year about 6 months after buying the machine). I've also only used bottled water with this machine (Tesco Ashbeck in the UK and Volvic here in France).

Anyway, the hassles I had before seem lesser than what happened after the 4th tank-full run-through.

I filled the tank again, switched the machine off, and then back on some 10-15sec later. The pump started, but then, instead of filling the boiler, all the water just started dripping into the drip tray. Lifting the lever, makes the pump stop (??), pushing it down, it starts again with the water pouring into the drip tray at the rate it seems to be coming out of the tank.

I've switched the machine on and off multiple times, and then also left it off for a while.

Today, when I switched it on, it again started emptying into the drip tray, but lifting the lever led to some flow from the group head. Following one more on/off cycle, things went back to how they were yesterday.

I am guessing that there is a blockage somewhere, would appreciate any suggestions. I'll try to contact Bella Barista as well, but the only reliable way seems to be by phone which makes it difficult when working.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Possibly crap in the group jet (gicleur), remove the top nuts and check that jet.

http://coffeetimex.wikidot.com/e61-group-servicing

The bit you want is the top section...should only take a few minutes, use an adjustable spanner with jaw protectors.


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

I've read and re-read the fault description several times and could it be that the boiler fill valve is stuck or full of scale so the water is getting discharged via the OPV into the drip tray?

Assuming the only time the pump normally runs, with the handle down, is when it is topping up the boiler?


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

DavecUK said:


> Possibly crap in the group jet (gicleur), remove the top nuts and check that jet.
> 
> http://coffeetimex.wikidot.com/e61-group-servicing
> 
> The bit you want is the top section...should only take a few minutes, use an adjustable spanner with jaw protectors.


 Thanks for the suggestion. I opened it and it looks all clean, including the gauze filter. There's a little bit of clean water in there as well.










with gauze filter










without the gauze filter. The white speck is lens artifact


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

woodbar said:


> I've read and re-read the fault description several times and could it be that the boiler fill valve is stuck or full of scale so the water is getting discharged via the OPV into the drip tray?
> 
> Assuming the only time the pump normally runs, with the handle down, is when it is topping up the boiler?


 Well, it runs with the handle down, and normally this would be to top up the boiler, but instead all the water seems to be getting discharged into the drip tray


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

nikv said:


> Well, it runs with the handle down, and normally this would be to top up the boiler, but instead all the water seems to be getting discharged into the drip tray


 I think what @woodbar said is favourite for your fault. I missed the bit where you said it did it on autofill.


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

Hopefully something I'll be able to replace myself once I get the part...


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@nikv You can probably open the solenoid up and clear the blockage.


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

@DavecUK would you be able to point me to a diagram / photo as to which part it is? I've yet to open the machine (was planning to do it this weekend).


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

I cover that part in the internal tour

https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/2020/03/10/lelit-marax-review-in-progress/


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

Hopefully @DavecUK will excuse me nicking a still from his video 😉

This assumes that you have not had the OPV re-route modification done?

Hope that helps.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@woodbar It does, I'd forgotten myself, I don't even remember doing those ever so nice labels 🤣


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

DavecUK said:


> I don't even remember doing those ever so nice labels 🤣


 No, they appeared as if by magic 😎


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

@woodbar @DavecUK thank you both! Very much appreciated.

I'll have a look this weekend and hopefully get back to you with good news. 🤞


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

Well, I could not figure out how to take the solenoid out. I couldn't even loosen the nuts above and below it. I also suspect the only way to get it out is to take out all 3 of those valves on that side, take the whole thing apart and then put it back together. I'm afraid that is way outside my comfort zone.

Have to say I'm quite disappointed by this machine. I bought it after having another Lelit (Pl41TEM) which served me well for 9 years. Much simpler machine that's certain, but also very reliable.

For parts of MaraX to start failing after about a year of light use is disappointing.

I think I'll have to contact a local reseller here and find out how much they'll charge me for a service.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

The solenoid is made to come out by loosening nuts above and below....then loosening the 2 screws a little, so it can move up and away from the supporting bracket to be lifted out for service.

the compression type fittings above and below are best removed using a well fitted open ended spanner on the nuts and a sharp raps with a light metal object e.g. tack hammer, or larger spanner. Tappy tappy, not a big swing ...and they will shock loose quite easily....there shouldn't be any threadlocker used on those fittings. refitting it the reverse and a bit of tappy tappy to get them tight.

I assume you have checked the wires to the solenoid and they are all connected, as well as connected to the Gicar box? If you have a multimeter, it's even worth checking the solenoid is getting power....you might even hear it click, or place a dry wooden lollipop stick or similar on the case and see if you can feel it operating.

P.S. You may have to remove the top pipe completely, if you can't get the solenoid to pass it.


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

All was connected - this was the first thing I checked.

Managed to take it out, thanks to your advice. No crud in either of the side inlets/outlets. Cannot actually open the central part - don't have a vice and just cannot budge it using two spanners. 

The valve is in closed position.

Don't have a multimeter either.

Managed to put it back together, but now I have 2 problems - I also have a little leak at the inlet into the solenoid valve as I of course don't have either the teflon tape or Loxeal sealant.

The behaviour has also changed. Switching the machine on now leads to:

- Pump not starting, so not even trying to fill the boiler.

- Heating of the boiler starting (there should be only a tiny amount of water in there, maybe in the heat exchanger)?

- Lifting the lever now leads to the pump starting and a little bit of water coming out of the group head. Obviously I don't dare running this longer than a couple of seconds, and the leak isn't helping.

I now regret doing the descaling procedure. That obviously hastened the problems / failure elsewhere, and I am highly doubtful that my original problems were due to scale build-up.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

nikv said:


> All was connected - this was the first thing I checked.
> 
> 1.Managed to take it out, thanks to your advice. No crud in either of the side inlets/outlets. Cannot actually open the central part - don't have a vice and just cannot budge it using two spanners.
> 
> ...


 1. Good, were they compression fittings or was sealant used (I hope you took photos as you went)?

2. I know, they are a "Normally Closed" solenoid

3. you need to get one...not too cheap, something like this https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01N9TRQI1?th=1

4. see question 1

5. If the boiler is full it won't try to fill it, if the boiler is full, it will start to heat. If you have accidentally disconnected the wire somewhere to the autofill probe...,these things will happen when the boiler is NOT full!

6. *Does a little bit mean not the normal amount*, if so that's a bit odd as it would indicate that water might still be going to the main boiler...or somewhere else?

7. Possibly

All it means that *once you have a multimeter*....you need to work the problem, one logical step at a time....and be very precise in your feedback to us...as you can see by my questions. Good post, but didn't tell me enough to help you. If you have not used a multimeter before...this will help.


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

Bella Barista are sending a new solenoid valve to me. I'll report back when I got it.

Sealant was used for connections. I've ordered that as well.


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## nikv (Oct 27, 2021)

A quick update from me.

Received the solenoid valve and the sealant a couple of days back. Today is a public holiday here, the weather was fairly rubbish, so I had a go at replacing the original this morning. The tricky bit is not taking it out, it is definitely in putting everything back together, before the sealant sets on the threads of various bits! 😅

An hour later, having managed to put things back as they were and having given a bit of time for the sealant to set, I switched on the machine with some trepidation. All seemed well, and about 20 min later it was up to pressure around 1.5bar. Discharging some hot water via the hot-water part, as well as some steam didn't show much drop in pressure, and eventually the boiler re-fill kicked in, with the water going into the boiler and not straight into the drip tray - i.e. as expected.

This afternoon made 2 cappuccinos for the first time in a couple of weeks, and it was bliss!

@DavecUK @woodbar thank you for your help!

I've also sent an email of thanks to Bella Barista for their support.


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

That's good to hear - pleased you are back working.

Unfortunately my machine has gone faulty now!

It warms up, brews a coffee, then the steam pressure goes up to about 1.5 bar (which I don't use) - all normal so far - but 25 minutes later, when I want to make another espresso it is still at 1.5 bar and I get water and STEAM out of the brew group!

If I switch off and leave it to cool for a few hours it starts up normally - temp light stops flashing - steam at about 0.5 bar and it will make one brew then we start over again - heats up to 1.5 bar but never drops from that point!

Have not thought it through or looked at anything yet (been sorting problems with the car) but I assume it maybe a temperature sensor playing up?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@woodbar Check the temp sensor wiring and that nothing is loose right the way back to the Gicar box.


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

DavecUK said:


> Check the temp sensor wiring and that nothing is loose right the way back to the Gicar box.


 OK, will do, thanks for that.

Which one is likely to be iffy - the boiler or the HX one I wonder?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@woodbar Could be either...


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

Lifted the top panel just for a quick check - will have to take the case off tomorrow - the temp sensor wiring on the service boiler looks all in order.

I did notice that in your inside look at the Mara X there was a combined fitting for the level probe and temp and a spare banking plug -









Whereas in mine the blanking plug now has a separate temp sensor and the level probe is all on its lonesome









Other notable differences -only one of the over temp sensors has a reset button and there is no rear support bracket for the boiler - only the front one?

You can just see the manufacture date of the boiler as 05/21 - probably week 5?

Is temp sensor actually in contact with the water or just inside a pocket?


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

BB are sending me a temp sensor - hopefully get it tomorrow.

They seem confident that it will be the top one gone west?

I hope so, at least that is slightly easier to fit than the HX one at the bottom.


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

Got the sensor today - fitted this afternoon - still the same!

So I am leaving it all dismantled to cool down and will swap the bottom HX sensor later.

In theory, if fitting the new sensor made no difference than that means the one I removed is good and I will fit that to the HX and see.

I know there are lots of holes in that theory for sods law to creep in and destroy my theory!

Not that impressed as when I heated the machine I noticed there was a leak from the level sensor adapter!

You can just see some discolouration in the photo above and a closer version, showing the water tide mark, below.









It was quite bubbly to start with but I took this as the boiler was getting hotter and the water had evaporated.

Luckily it seems to seal itself when it gets hot but not brilliant QC on assembly I think.

If replacing the bottom sensor does not fix it then maybe the control box is up the creek as there seems to be only three things controlling/sensing the temperature in the machine?


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

woodbar said:


> Not that impressed as when I heated the machine I noticed there was a leak from the level sensor adapter


 Was it always like that or was it due to the installation you performed? Anyway, I think a few turns of PTFE should fix the problem.


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

MediumRoastSteam said:


> Was it always like that or was it due to the installation you performed?


 Well, I did have to use a blowlamp, Lump hammer and my compressed air operated Impact driver to get the temp sensor out but I don't think that should have affected anything else?

Anyway, whilst pondering how to get a spanner on the level sensor to remove and reseal it it looked like I would need to remove the steam pipe to enable the use of a deep socket. Just I case, I first tried an open ended, at an acute angle, and to my surprise it was very easy to turn the fitting - not too much more than finger tight!

It did not have any tape or sealer on it - just a green fibre gasket - so I cleaned it off and refitted it - tight this time.

Contrary to the assurances from BB "it's always the top sensor" - fitting the new one there had made no difference so when the machine had cooled I replaced the bottom HX sensor with the "old" one from the top.

Let it heat up, check for leaks, brewed a couple of "simulated" coffees using the flow control - on both I got no steam from the group and the boiler pressure ramped up to 1.5 bar after each one then after 15 minutes had dropped back to about 0.5 bar - the very thing it was NOT doing before!

Hopefully, job done. I will find out in the morning for sure with my pre and post breakfast brews!


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## woodbar (Aug 28, 2020)

My breakfast brews went fine - all OK and back to normal, phew.

I don't have to drink "after dinner" Nespresso this evening - NB - only got it as my wife finds proper espresso (even diluted to a semi Americano) too intense. I will also drink it, under protest, when/if the main machine fails!

This sequence of events got me thinking about the different experiences between my previous Sage Oracle and the Mara X.

Sage Oracle:

Attractive, nicely finished and engineered (externally at least) - very user friendly - can make excellent coffee

Precise user control of brew and steam temperatures - no facility to display or adjust brew pressure

Obtaining parts for repairs extremely difficult (if not impossible) - need to send whole machine to an importer selected third party company.

DIY servicing and repairs therefore not really possible other than replacing O rings etc. - not needed until.....

Inbuilt grinder starting to fail at about 15 months old - which is why I returned it and got the.........

Mara X:

Attractive (as far as E61 units go), nicely finished and engineered - not particularly user friendly - can make excellent coffee

Rather vague and imprecise control of brew and steam temperatures - has display of brew and steam pressures - can adjust brew pressure

Obtaining spare parts (and service information) relatively easy

DIY servicing and repairs possible, with a modicum of tools, capability and common sense - just as well as this 6 week old machine has required 2 repairs so far - failed temp sensor + leak from level sensor!

Just my take on the 2 machines - in hindsight I would probably have been better off with either a single boiler machine (only use steam every other "blue moon") or a twin boiler with the facility to turn the steam off.


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