# Cherub brew group problem



## Lex_B (Apr 1, 2013)

Hi,

I'm after a bit of advice about my Cherub. It has been out of action for a few months while I moved house. When I finally got round to sorting the machine out and making my first coffee I found that no water would come out of the group head. The steam wand and hot water tap work fine, and the pump also comes on as normal and after a few seconds sounds like it is working against resistance to flow (the same sound as when back flushing). I have taken out the screen and brass bit but still no joy. Has anyone else experienced this or have any tips? I assume it has somehow blocked but I have no idea how to find/remove the blockage.

Fracino quoted me rather a lot to have it looked at so I will either try to fix it myself or sell it on for someone else to fix/ or parts, though it seems a shame for a machine that has had so little use.


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## destiny (Jun 4, 2015)

Based on what you said this sounfs like a block (calcification?) in main heat exchanger pipe or earlier.

Otherwise it could be a selonoid failure which directs water to heat exchanger.

Is there a metalic sound when you flick the brew pour button?


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## espressotechno (Apr 11, 2011)

Probably the group solenoid valve' piston has stuck. Tapping the valve body might jolt it loose.

If you're good at DIY, then you can remove the valve, split the body open & descale it....

If not' then buy & fit a new 3 way solenoid valve (Ebay is your friend)


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## Lex_B (Apr 1, 2013)

Thanks for the replies. Sounds like it's worth investigating the solenoid valve first. I've not had the cherub to bits before but I'll give it a go!


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## Lex_B (Apr 1, 2013)

So I've had a look and the solenoid seems to be ok (holes all clear, springs ok), unless I'm looking for the wrong thing? Could it be the coil? Here's some pictures:









If that's not the issue I'll have to start taking pipes out and checking for blockages. Any tips which pipes to take out first?


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## espressotechno (Apr 11, 2011)

* The coil can be checked with a multimeter. Or when the machine is switched on, a small screwdriver held close the the coil/valve shaft will detect the magnetic field if the coil is OK.

* Under the "mushroom" on the top of the grouphead is a small brass jet (FC129A). Descaling it may work (a 1/4" socket set is needed to unscrew the jet pillar)...try flooding the cavity with neat descaler solution.

* It's usually the top HX pipe - boiler to group head - which scales up first.


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## destiny (Jun 4, 2015)

This selonoid releases the back pressure after the shot, so its not the one you are after. There is another one inside the machine.


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## destiny (Jun 4, 2015)

Check instructions with the page that shows the manifold.


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## Lex_B (Apr 1, 2013)

espressotechno said:


> * The coil can be checked with a multimeter. Or when the machine is switched on, a small screwdriver held close the the coil/valve shaft will detect the magnetic field if the coil is OK.
> 
> * Under the "mushroom" on the top of the grouphead is a small brass jet (FC129A). Descaling it may work (a 1/4" socket set is needed to unscrew the jet pillar)...try flooding the cavity with neat descaler solution.
> 
> * It's usually the top HX pipe - boiler to group head - which scales up first.


Thanks for the tips, I'll try the brass jet after the manifold solenoid. I may not need to take pipes off the boiler but I'll see how it goes


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## Lex_B (Apr 1, 2013)

destiny said:


> Check instructions with the page that shows the manifold.


Cheers. Just saw the manifold solenoid! Oops. Bit trickier to get to but looks doable.


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## destiny (Jun 4, 2015)

You should at least be able to check if it flicks at all. Dissasembly is a bit tricky unless you take the whole of the cover off, than everything is nicely exposed. Get some correct size spanners to not damage the brass and ptfe joint tape to seal if you do go disassembling.


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## NewboyUK (Jul 14, 2018)

Reviving an old post - is it fixed now?


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## gwapenut (Nov 5, 2011)

I have similar issues with my cherub. It does not sound like the noise when you are backflushing - there is some flow, but it is quite weak, and the pump noise fluctuates.

I descaled 6 weeks ago, so could well be a bit of dislodged scale which has stuck somewhere?

How should I best investigate? Is it ever worth descaling again to try to get rid of a partial blockage? I know a full blockage does not let descaler get into the places it needs to get, but with partial there may be a chance?


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## Lex_B (Apr 1, 2013)

NewboyUK said:


> Reviving an old post - is it fixed now?


Hi there, yes mine is fixed now (got round to it yesterday!). I disassembled and checked the inlet solenoid first, but realised after that it is in the line to the boiler fill (not hx pipe) and is closed when deenergised so shouldn't be causing no flow at grouphead. Also took off the manifold to hx pipe which was all clear.

Next up was the jet at the top of the brewgroup. The jet was blocked so I cleared it all up and now its running fine again. Thanks for all the tips.


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