# Instant Specialty Coffee



## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

An interesting development, Kalle Freese who has been in the world barista champions a couple of times has set up a company doing Instant Specialty Coffee.

https://www.suddencoffee.com

Clearly it isn't a replacement for coffee at the level we are doing but it's an interesting development nonetheless.


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

really not much information on that site.

just didnt pull me in to look further


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Is it Freese-dried instant coffee? ?


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> really not much information on that site.
> 
> just didnt pull me in to look further


It seems to be a bit of a trend currently and I don't really understand why. I find sites like that very irritating...but I guess they're pretty easy to get set-up.


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

They're recruiting personnel so could be an opportunity for someone looking to get into the commercial side of coffee

https://www.suddencoffee.com/pages/work-at-sudden


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## ShortShots (Oct 2, 2013)

Something we always joke about here at the roastery, but really only as laughable as capsule speciality (which if done right could be great). So I for one am intrigued. If done with proper nerdiness I dont see why its not worth trying! (Not that I personally would buy it, except out of curiosity)


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

I cant imagine its a cheap alternative to actually making your own coffee with fresh ground beans, with the individual test tube packaging i can only imagine it would be more expensive


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## ShortShots (Oct 2, 2013)

This is definitely not a product for the discerning coffee geek, more an experiment to see whether its possible to maintain the clarity and rigid quality of speciality throughout the freeze drying process. I certainly plan to try it, kind of a 'file in the back of my head for a while' kind of experiment.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Yeah but to some people it'll be a step up and let's face it, everyone who buys into Nespresso has made a decision to place themselves at a particular point along the continuum of {faff/quality Mellow Turds/just add water}, and that business model is successful.

It's not for me, but there could be people willing to pay more to get instant that isn't totally revolting. I agree about the packaging adding to the cost and also I hope they will ensure it's recyclable.

Don't think Freese-dried is going to spell the end of the speciality coffee scene any time soon but it could even get more people into it, who then want to take the next step. Classic/Mignon anyone? !


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## gcogger (May 18, 2013)

Maybe it's just me, but I can find no info about pricing on that website...


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

gcogger said:


> Maybe it's just me, but I can find no info about pricing on that website...


I couldnt either,, i guess you need to sign up for their newsletter for that.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

gcogger said:


> Maybe it's just me, but I can find no info about pricing on that website...


I suspect pricing isn't fixed but variable based on the beans used for each batch, hence no prices available right now (last batch sold out). Keep an eye on the website for the next batch.

The facebook page actually looks quite interesting with positive reviews

https://www.facebook.com/suddencoffee/?fref=ts


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

Pricing and new batch available to order online right now.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Wow! US$6 per cup and $10 shipping? Better not be mellow birds then... It's cheaper to drive to a coffee shop and order at the bar.


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

hotmetal said:


> Wow! US$6 per cup and $10 shipping? Better not be mellow birds then... It's cheaper to drive to a coffee shop and order at the bar.


Thats ridiculous.

With prices that high they will go out of business in no time.

Looks like they have taken on some new premises which dont look cheap, their overheads and lake of return customers I doubt they are sustainable.

I guess a few people will buy some just to try it, , but at those prices no matter how good it is its still instant


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

It got a shoutout on the latest Barista Hustle, where MP predicted more companies will follow suit so we'll see.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

aaronb said:


> Pricing and new batch available to order online right now.


$6 per cup...<chuckle> and only $10 shipping....wow what a bargain for instant coffee. So does marketing and a Barista champion make for great instant coffee...<lol>, but even funnier will be the people who actually buy it. I can't wait to read the glowing reviews.</lol></chuckle>


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

Not one for me (id try it at a cheaper price) but it's an interesting idea nonetheless.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> Thats ridiculous.
> 
> With prices that high they will go out of business in no time.
> 
> ...


The prices seem high (seems at more being aimed as a stopgap for coffee whilst travelling?), but if they can get them down, instant has the potential benefit of not allowing you to screw up extraction (the most common fault in brewing), only the strength.


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

DavecUK said:


> I can't wait to read the glowing reviews.


have a look on their facebook page for some reviews,,, the words awesome and amazing get used too frequently for my liking

apparently "it doesnt suck"


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

I probably will buy some just to try it and how it compares .... I'll probably buy a maxwell pod as well to see how that fares .... Even if it did taste as good I don't think I would convert though 50% of the enjoyment for me is the theatre of making coffee, the process, the shiney chrome and wood


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> have a look on their facebook page for some reviews,,, the words awesome and amazing get used too frequently for my liking
> 
> apparently "it doesnt suck"


Just read their facebook page and a few thoughts did spring to mind.

1. People who use the word awesome too many times (once is once to many) annoy the ^&*& out of me

2. "You know that awkward little pocket on your chinos... Boom just found a use for it. I can store 3 cups of @suddencoffee up in there", Yeah well I know where else he can store them, and he doesn't need to be wearing chinos.

3. Stay away from me, you look strange and frightening

4. "super stoked for my first cup of @suddencoffee - instant coffee that doesn't suck" People who say super stoked also annoy the ^&*( out of me.

Apparently it's sorcery!


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

Oh Dave I actually laughed out loud at that. Number 2 in particular (appropriately numbered in this case!)

I didn't even know chinos had an awkward little pocket, but if I did I think it unlikely that I would insert test tubes of overpriced 'Freese-dried' instant coffee in them.

"Saucery" surely? As in "tastes like the bit that ended up in the saucer- hmm tastes a bit saucery".


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

hotmetal said:


> Oh Dave I actually laughed out loud at that. Number 2 in particular (appropriately numbered in this case!)
> 
> "Saucery" surely? As in "tastes like the bit that ended up in the saucer- hmm tastes a bit saucery".


Heh... and as for saucery, I tell you what's even more amazing....that real coffee lovers even take this seriously. I swear if La Marzocco designed a coffee machine that looked like a turd, people would claim it looked wonderful...wait they did..the Linea Mini.

I bow at the throne of your pods and instant coffee...........hahahahaha!


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## kallefreese (Feb 18, 2016)

DavecUK said:


> Just read their facebook page and a few thoughts did spring to mind.
> 
> 1. People who use the word awesome too many times (once is once to many) annoy the ^&*& out of me
> 
> ...


Hey Dave!

I appreciate your feedback. If you'd like I'd be happy to send you a sample to try out. Just email me at kalle a suddencoffee com


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## kallefreese (Feb 18, 2016)

Love to see all the discussion on here! Just briefly about Sudden and my background:

I'm Finnish Barista Champ 2013 & 2015 and placed 9th in WBC last year. My passion is to make great to fun, easy and accessible

for everyone and what would be a better way than making instant coffee that doesn't suck?

I fully admit that it's unlikely to be better than what you can brew at home. The point is to enable you to drink *good *

coffee when you can't brew your own - traveling, camping, some offices etc.

Right now we use really good coffee, grind it on EK43's and brew it espresso-style on Linea PB.

AMA - let me know if you have any more questions!

- Kalle Freese, Co-founder


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

kallefreese said:


> Hey Dave!
> 
> I appreciate your feedback. If you'd like I'd be happy to send you a sample to try out. Just email me at kalle a suddencoffee com


What you have done now, is make me feel bad..........







I don't want to be seen as unwilling to try something new (I appreciate the offer), but I have not drunk a single cup of instant coffee for more than 37 years. This means I would have to "gird my loins" before making the decision









The problems I see:

1. People who have expensive machines/grinders are probably not your market, or only a validation market e.g. to say it tastes great

2. Price per cup seems too much

3. Not sure how practical the packaging is long term

4. If you are successful with the product, the big boys will copy you.

Is there a market for it....possibly the smart set who like to be hip and kool and those who worship at the alter of industry, SCAA etc..but for a hardened coffee drinkers, I can't see them with 40 tubes of this in the kitchen at $120-200 per week

Dave

Would the scary guy deliver it, is this you, ear defenders and a hidden hand gun perchance, shoot me thru the coffee as a makeshift silencer? Oh and your logo is reminiscent of another coffee purveyor......


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

I have a question @kallefreese

What method are you using to produce this instant, are you freeze drying, is that what causes the cost to be so high?

I understand it says top secret on the site, but i would guess looking at your instagram photos you are freeze drying...

I wonder though how this varies from nescafe, they use the same ingredients and process, but maybe they add something else to make it taste crap that your not adding??


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## Glenn (Jun 14, 2008)

Welcome to Coffee Forums UK @kallefreese - have been following your launch with interest


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

This is interesting to me. Not at £4/cup. But more the concept.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

jonc said:


> This is interesting to me. Not at £4/cup. But more the concept.


Exactly! Firstly I hope I'm right in thinking we haven't offended Mr Freese with our banter. Instant has a bad rep for obvious reasons. I guess we're about to see how good it's possible to make instant, with serious coffee knowledge and care rather than the boss of Nestlé and corporate shareholders driving it via mass production and commodity beans. I too am curious to see if instant is bad by definition or just needs to be done right. However, as has been said - the prices are in the region where you'd just go to a café (assuming that's possible) and as Dave pointed out, us lot of fussy drinkers with the means to good home coffee are not really the target market. I think for the right group of people it could mean getting better coffee (at a price) but I hope that if it takes off, the big boys don't muscle in and rip off the entrepreneur/inventor.


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## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

Personally I'm looking forward to something which can be brewed easily, doesn't have to be ground and is ready rather quickly. We've all (or most) been there when all you want is something as easy as a cup of tea (from a bag), without all the faff and ceremonial f*ckery.

T.


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## Jon (Dec 3, 2010)

dsc said:


> Personally I'm looking forward to something which can be brewed easily, doesn't have to be ground and is ready rather quickly. We've all (or most) been there when all you want is something as easy as a cup of tea (from a bag), without all the faff and ceremonial f*ckery.
> 
> T.


In the meantime: how's that grinder of yours coming on?


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## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

I need that instant to keep me going whilst designing new parts for something that doesn't exist. It's damn hard you know









T.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

hotmetal said:


> Exactly! Firstly I hope I'm right in thinking we haven't offended Mr Freese with our banter. Instant has a bad rep for obvious reasons. I guess we're about to see how good it's possible to make instant, with serious coffee knowledge and care rather than the boss of Nestlé and corporate shareholders driving it via mass production and commodity beans. I too am curious to see if instant is bad by definition or just needs to be done right. However, as has been said - the prices are in the region where you'd just go to a café (assuming that's possible) and as Dave pointed out, us lot of fussy drinkers with the means to good home coffee are not really the target market. I think for the right group of people it could mean getting better coffee (at a price) but I hope that if it takes off, the big boys don't muscle in and rip off the entrepreneur/inventor.


I don't think he's offended, besides, he would simply shoot you if he was. As you say it would be a way of giving a better "instant" coffee to the masses, but the real problems are it's cost and the big boys ripping off the idea. This coffee has to be better than Nespresso, because believe it or not, Nespresso has the theatre coupled with the convenience. Now you might say Mr Freezee coffee is going to be loads better than Nespresso, but trouble is it won't be. Nespresso comes in flavours, with origins etc.. and other wonderful things that we might puke at...but in the mind of JP, make it better!

https://www.nespresso.com/uk/en/Order-Capsules?icid=B2C_UKen_CAROUSEL_POS1

Then we got the cost...lets assume he gets the cost down to £3 per cup....well he has to compete with this Delongi Magnifica bean to cup at £259 delivered!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B001EOMZ5E/ref=s9_hps_bw_g79_i1?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-2&pf_rd_r=1QQG9WVYPEPHPGVXKR7J&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=733517827&pf_rd_i=368204031

This means that 86 cups of instant and you can buy this machine.....not an attractive proposition for instant and public perception would see this as way above any instant.

So it's main market appears to be people who understand what they are doing and are away from home for whatever reason....usually though, people have other things on their mind than packing bags of powder in their luggage for airport security to enjoy.


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## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

I'd say lets just wait and see what it is, rather than shooting it down altogether. It might work, who knows. And packing instant packs in a bag is still quicker and takes less space than a bag of coffee, grinder and whatever brewer you fancy.

T.


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## hotmetal (Oct 31, 2013)

For luggage purposes for a few days away a few test tubes would be more convenient than an aeropress, Feldgrind and beans that's true. Dave's point about airport security made me laugh though - too true, as a frequent flyer I can testify to that. They'd probably take you to a cupboard and you'd hear the snap of latex gloves being donned!


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## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

I doubt they would do much, there's no rule against taking coffee on board (in solid form), I've had bags of Urnex taken with me on board, white powder in zip lock bags and never once got stopped. If its not against the rules they cannot take it away.

T.


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

Coffee is used regularly to mask the smell of hidden drugs, sniffer dogs are now even being trained to be alerted to the smell of coffee

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=coffee+used+to+mask+the+mell+of+smuggled+drugs&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&gws_rd=cr&ei=4PDGVv2zJMb2-QHG7LOADQ


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## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

How many sniffer dogs have you seen at the airport last time you flew anywhere?









T.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

dsc said:


> How many sniffer dogs have you seen at the airport last time you flew anywhere?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


They are behind the scenes checking the Luggage on the conveyors before it's loaded. Also, if this coffee is so good, it's going to attract them like anything....Nespresso pods...not so much.


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

dsc said:


> How many sniffer dogs have you seen at the airport last time you flew anywhere?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


They even have them at tube station entrances and exits now.

Seen them loads of times at walthamstow central.


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## AMCD300 (Feb 11, 2016)

It is aimed at the US market clearly. I am sure that people will buy something labeled as a 'premium' product, especially if marketed well. Will fresh coffee last the freeze dried process and taste good? Compared to instant Folgers/Maxwell House coffee expect it will.


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

its no biggy, I get stopped regulary when traveling .... percentage thing I guess, if you fly a hundred times a year you will get stopped a lot.

dog sniffs your bag, or just get pulled going through customs, you put your bag on the table, they say "can you open this bag for me sir", you say "sure" and open it. They say "are you carrying anything you shouldn't be?", you say "no" ... they rifle through your undies and pull out some coffee and if they are truly stupid they say "whats this", you say "coffee" .... they ask a few more questions about where you have been traveling to, where you are going, they feel the case lining, but it all back in and let you go.

it adds a whole 7-10mins extra to your 15hr travelling day

sometimes they are even slightly amused when they open your case and its just jars of hot sauce wrapping in your dirty underwear so it doesn't break and nothing else ... "errr, where are the rest of your clothes sir" .. I am heading back out next week, left them at the hotel so I dont need to carry them and then there is more room in my case for the hot sauces !

they understand ... they stop thousands a year, they have seen everthing ...... you are certainly not the first coffee snob that has travelled


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

dsc said:


> How many sniffer dogs have you seen at the airport last time you flew anywhere?


pretty much ALL american baggage claim halls have a massive security dude walking around weith a beagle that likes to stick his nose in your crotch as you walk past


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

oddly enough, whilst reading my free and "unbiased" (har har) BBC news website...I came across this.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35605927

Interestingly Germany refers to any "single portion" coffee packaging


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## Obnic (Jan 14, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Just read their facebook page and a few thoughts did spring to mind.
> 
> 1. People who use the word awesome too many times (once is once to many) annoy the ^&*& out of me
> 
> ...


Vintage Dave!


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## Obnic (Jan 14, 2014)

If I could make instant coffee that tasted good, properly good, I'd try to replace the higher end office coffee pod machines. I wouldn't market to the 'speciality coffee' drinking cognoscenti (probably the only ones prepared to pay such a price for a hot drink) - it's screwing with their religion. Just too hard a sell.


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## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

h1udd said:


> pretty much ALL american baggage claim halls have a massive security dude walking around weith a beagle that likes to stick his nose in your crotch as you walk past


Mostly had UK ones in mind, never seen dogs at the ones I've used so far. Policemen with those funny "everything-but-the-sink" vests and guns - plenty, but I'm sure they could sniff coffee from a mile

T.


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

no, its only in the US I have seen the dogs, no other country


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## dsc (Jun 7, 2013)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> They even have them at tube station entrances and exits now.
> 
> Seen them loads of times at walthamstow central.


Curious if thats for show or if the dogs are trained to trigger on certain smells. Or perhaps they use them only when they stop and search someone?

T.


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

dsc said:


> Curious if thats for show or if the dogs are trained to trigger on certain smells. Or perhaps they use them only when they stop and search someone?
> 
> T.


They block off some exits to get people to go past the dogs.

The dogs sniff everyone going past.

I would imagine they are trained to sniff out drugs and explosives.

http://www.guardian-series.co.uk/news/wfnews/10658144.Sniffer_dogs_help_to_make_drug_arrests_at_Walthamstow_Central/

https://www.londonbanter.co.uk/london-transport/4130-only-me.html


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

More explosives i would imagine on the tube.

They went through a period of having them outside night club doors for drugs a few years ago, no idea if they still do it as im to old for nightclubs !


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

you had to go through walk through metal detectors too, so imagine they where also looking for offensive weapons


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

lol as apposed to a non offensive weapon....


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

the yoot dem buying ceramic knives now


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## SimplyMyLove (Feb 14, 2016)

I found the price. $30 for 5 cups plus $10 shipping to the UK, and it works out to be $8 per cup delivered. Very expensive.


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## Luc_ cI_I (Jan 25, 2016)

I've read they are going to lower the price from $6 to.... well, who knows how low below that, but they had production issues, they didn't have their own space, now they got it so that ratio is supposed to get better. However, the challenge I believe is to make it lower than a Nespresso or at least the same price so the lazy people will find it attractive.


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