# Which Sage is best?



## trenchn (Oct 30, 2011)

Hi All,

I am looking for a new machine, preferably bean to cup, and am considering one of the sage models.

I can't decide between the Barista Express and the Barista Pro.

Money is a factor so if the cheaper one is good, that would be handy.

Has anyone owned both? is the Pro noticeably superior to the Express? What are the main differences?

Is there an alternative at a similar price?

Is anyone selling anything suitable?

Any advice would be really appreciated.

Thank you.

Cheers

Nick


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## M_H_S (Jun 6, 2018)

What do you currently have?

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## trenchn (Oct 30, 2011)

A Delonghi Magnifica S which is starting to play up.


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## M_H_S (Jun 6, 2018)

And grinder?

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## trenchn (Oct 30, 2011)

The Magnifica is a bean to cup with built in grinder, sorry. I should have said.


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## M_H_S (Jun 6, 2018)

If the choice is between the two Sages I'd go with the classic Barista. Decent ones go for £300 used on Ebay.

The only improvement in the pro appears to be that it has 9bar pressure and faster heat up of 3 secs. Otherwise it looks different and has a LCD as gimmick.

The Old Barista has a pressure guage which I like.

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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

M_H_S said:


> The only improvement in the pro appears to be that it has 9bar pressure


 Are you sure about that ? Be curious to know where the info came from.

John

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## M_H_S (Jun 6, 2018)

ajohn said:


> Are you sure about that ? Be curious to know where the info came from.
> John
> -


Breville intro video

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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

*Hi @trenchn*

you may want to have a look at the linked to here which may help to explain the differences. Not normally one to direct towards Seattle Coffee gear reviews but may help.

Other option may also be duo temp pro and smart grinder pro if you can get at a reasonable price, remembering warranty is key. If you want auto frothing then bambino plus looks interesting and some threads on here ref that option.

John


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

p.s. just don't take any pointers from how they make their coffee.... 

John


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

or a Canadian review here

Hope of help Nick

John


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

@trenchn

given you looking to go down the new route, review of Bambino plus here which if bought from John Lewis and add a Smart grinder pro comes to same price as Barista express. You can always add non pressurised single wall baskets later once you've used up your stock of Italian beans.

Happy to natter again if needed

John


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Interesting. Some one asked about brew pressure on Bambino on HB and some one chimed in 15bar. If they have shifted to 9 bar there isn't any need for the gauge but loss of some flexibility. I often used my BE brewing at very close to 15bar but it's tricky to set up so that the volumetric aspect works as it should. One video claims that the ordinary Express isn't volumetric - it is. Looks like Pro buyers are paying for some new tooling for the chassis. Probably a lot of tooling by the look of it.

There is a crew review comparing the 2 models. Not the usual lady. They aren't even dosing the filter basket correctly. It way way off on the BE hence why the pressure gauge wobbles about. The coffee she tasted would have been awful and at least nothing remotely like it should be.

If it a true 9bar machines and has the flow meter in the normal place that in some respects is an advantage. Amazing actually when the price is compared with a commercial machine with the same features. The problem with the BE is that the flow meter is before the pump which actually works pretty well providing the 15bar Over Pressure Valve doesn't open much. It's plastic so can't take 15bar. Many bean to cup machines work the same way. If it's like the BE and just grinds set the brew pressure I would want the gauge. Looks like the dual boiler can be used that way as well but I've never used it like that.

The BE dumps water from the OPV into the drip tray. Some makers have got round that by feeding it back to the water tank inlet so they may have done that or changed the tank.

More grind steps as they have put the Smart Grinder Pro mechanism in the Pro. Just the adjustment knob arrangement changes really. Having used both the Smart Grinder does have finer steps but I wouldn't say they are that much finer but it could help. The steps are counted digitally and are steps. When setting coarser there is a need to go too coarse and then fine to the change that's wanted.

The timer knob on the BE is "rather" tricky to use to make tiny adjustments to the grind time. It can be done with practice. A digital display with 0.1sec resolution is likely to be a lot easier.

Only other thing I can add is based on comments from people who have bought a thermojet machine and are used to making coffee out of a kettle. As per the BE the hot water isn't that hot. I switched to thinner wall borosilicate mugs to get round that. Not the dual wall things as they break too easily. The dual boiler gets around that and while it starts at brew temperature averages at about 85C. The Oracles are probably the same.

So all together - if some one wants to use a Barista as they would fully expect to use one, totally auto the Pro is probably the best bet but they will still need to get a grip with tuning and grind timer setting. I wish some of the reviewers would stick portafilter pressure gauges in machines and also measure flow temperatures. When people look at these reviews remember their main aim is to sell them. Personally I would always favour thermothing machines over tiny boilers but that's on theoretical factors. The main problem with them is the need for regular descaling. Scale can be a pain on any form of espresso machines even bean to cup.

Flow meters aren't precise devices - that's why they can be set for a volume. Change say the grind and all of the types I am aware of would give a different output.  Careful grinds prep is still needed but they can cope with a certain amount of variation.

John

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## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

> Which Sage is best?


 Which is not in your house. Sorry coudnt help it.


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