# Scales, stuff and bloody hell!



## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

Right my scales came today, little pocket ones. They look cool and all that, were cheap so why the hell not.......

Well I got home tried them and realised I was close in one respect, the amount of beans. However this time was precise 18g, smack on.

The pour time yeah ok I timed it that was good but my finish weight pffft just over 45g. Hmmmm work to be done so out came the decaf to experiment or I'll never get to sleep!

So logic tells me beans are right but flows to fast. Been grinding fine and tamping lighter to good effect and flavour, or so I thought.

Now I lightened my tamp previously as I had managed to choke the machine (messy) and then I tried a more coarse grind to compensate but didn't like the flavour so much. So stayed fine with light tamp.

So to the adjustments made tonight. Three attempts/espressos in and I've doubled the tamp pressure I'm putting on but only moved one click up on the grind rather than the amount I tried before. Also changed my finish polish slightly.

End result, **** me!!!!!!

Now I'm toward the end of this particular bag so thought I new it well.

Flavour of dates now smacking through with a well rounded caramel sweetness, acidity up making it way less bitter and leaving the mouth feeling silky smooth and a fresher finish.

Ok so you got me! Tiny adjustments like that made due to having the scales and following a rough guide to ratios/weights/time giving an end result that has basically stunned me. I mean the tiniest of tweaks 1 CLICK!! Then the other adjustments to compensate that click due to the logical thinking from the results the readings from the scales and realising I was out on the end part coming from inaccuracies at the beginning effecting flow rate........THATS RIDICULOUS ISN'T IT?.........well quite obviously not.

You'll have to excuse my excitement and the fact I'm not lost for words but I had to share.

Now I am hurriedly looking through coffee subscriptions, telling myself no don't do that as you haven't tried enough different roasters yet but you could do a small subscription and still buy from others....... 1K bags of!...... oh I need to try that Wondo again that could be even nicer now couldn't it?????? Don't I have two new varieties due to come tomorrow yes I flipping do!!!

A very very excited I really have just found coffee and my anorak

SK8


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## GCGlasgow (Jul 27, 2014)

Ha Ha your post made me laugh...in similar boat with weight/time ration and just recently been getting it right, and wow the difference is amazing....now want to rush out and buy every coffee bean out there to taste the different flavours...mmm slighty addictive!


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Cheap sales a little bit of time spent dialling can make a world of difference and help make it repeatable

I know people get put off by the "buy some scales and weigh your espresso " ( i should have it in my signature ) but it is a great way to have a common language to share a recipe with...... get out there , try different roasters and beans ..remember that one ratio might not work for everything , and above all , enjoy making the coffee and whats in the cup !


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## DoubleShot (Apr 23, 2014)

What a great feeling when things finally work out. It's often the small changes that make all the difference with so many things in life.


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

GCGlasgow said:


> Ha Ha your post made me laugh...in similar boat with weight/time ration and just recently been getting it right, and wow the difference is amazing....now want to rush out and buy every coffee bean out there to taste the different flavours...mmm slighty addictive!


Seriously thought I was doing ok and getting good flavours and results mate. Wow I was wrong, very very wrong. The difference those scales have made is nothing short of a delightful.

Also now thinking hmmmmm I really should own a proper grinder haha I've only come in at the basics end with a Classic and Porlex Mini Grinder, the latter of which now accompanies me to work ever day used alongside a press.

Totally lost to it all and spend the evening listening to music as usually but scanning roasters sites also now.....well once dad duties allow etc

I an laughing at myself too but loving it!


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Great stuff,

It's funny how your definition of "good coffee" changes as you get better at it yourself!


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

View attachment 11634


First of the day and new ratio, very tasty, well happy!


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

The first "Eureka" shot is a bit of a revaluation.....well done. It's a steep learning curve.


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

The crema is totally different Urban but the flavour is way way better. Don't get me wrong I love the look of a good clean, thick and creamy crema and I was getting that but now its 'flecked' if that's a good description and not so thick or consistant looking.

I'll take the flavour over look any day as that's what I am after. Still loads to learn yet and can tweak a little more as you say steep curve but I have just started up it......two new bags should be home waiting when I arrive. Loving it.

Still that's at home. In work on the press now with the porlex......no looking back!!


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## NJD1977 (Dec 16, 2014)

The crema inconsistency and flecking on the shorter shots (i.e. the ones you've weighed as opposed to eyed in) is quite possibly because the beans are a little too fresh still. I find that I get quite an open textured flecky crema on beans that are less than 7 days post-roast, and after about 10 days the crema becomes far more consistent in colour, rich, creamy and dense. I guess it's all down to the CO2 in the young beans "over inflating" the crema.

I've now got an arrangement with my local roaster to put me a bag aside 7-10 days before I need it so it's ready to go when I pick it up. I'm not sure why more roasters don't offer this option as they could use it as a way of marketing 10 day old beans rather than them going to waste.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

NJD1977 said:


> The crema inconsistency and flecking on the shorter shots (i.e. the ones you've weighed as opposed to eyed in) is quite possibly because the beans are a little too fresh still. I find that I get quite an open textured flecky crema on beans that are less than 7 days post-roast, and after about 10 days the crema becomes far more consistent in colour, rich, creamy and dense. I guess it's all down to the CO2 in the young beans "over inflating" the crema.


Do you think the ops crema is defective in some way? Is flecking undesirable?


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## The Systemic Kid (Nov 23, 2012)

Some view flecking as a sign of pukka extraction but it can also indicate over-extraction. Roast level is a factor too with lighter roasts producing little if not any flecking.


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## NJD1977 (Dec 16, 2014)

jeebsy said:


> Do you think the ops crema is defective in some way? Is flecking undesirable?


If I'm being critical it looks a little bubbly and looks like the shot has blonded a little before cutting it.

Whether the flecking is good/bad/indifferent I don't know but I can say from my experience that I see flecking and bubbly crema in young beans and the taste of the shots seems better in 10day old beans at which point the flecking seems to lessen/disappear and the crema becomes denser and more closed textured.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Illy (old school, granted) thought flecking/mottling was an indicator of a good shot.

I'd be more inclined to go by taste and if the op is happy with it all power to him.


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

I dont think the crema actually tells you anything about the shot other than your cup contains some crema.


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

NJD1977 said:


> The crema inconsistency and flecking on the shorter shots (i.e. the ones you've weighed as opposed to eyed in) is quite possibly because the beans are a little too fresh still. I find that I get quite an open textured flecky crema on beans that are less than 7 days post-roast, and after about 10 days the crema becomes far more consistent in colour, rich, creamy and dense. I guess it's all down to the CO2 in the young beans "over inflating" the crema.


Brilliant bit of info thank you and you may well have hit the nail on the head!!!!

These beans are indeed a bit 'young/fresh' only just four to five days since roasting. I had already asked about leaving them to rest and had replies in another thread 'Rave' but got impatient and had to try so very very possibly that. So this batch may improve yet which is also good news.

Must be more patient........

*Thanks again NJD!* This place is brilliant!!!

Yet again through a trial, post, questions and feedback something has been learned with the evidence right in front of me!


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

I think its time to get me a porlex mini grinder and some scales ! A good advert for them


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> I think its time to get me a porlex mini grinder and some scales ! A good advert for them


Scales without doubt Ratty if you don't they have made a massive difference for me in three attempts. Grinder hmmmm Porlex is good I can't knock it but there are loads out there don't just pin yourself to that. But if you do want a Porlex buy one here (UK) I got stung for import tax making getting it fom Japan pointless, longer delivery and no saving lol.

*But scales YES! If you don't, DO!!*

*
*


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## wilse (Nov 14, 2013)

OK, sk8

I read your post, and have ordered some!

I'm new to 'fancy' grinding etc, and have been underwhelmed by my previous attempts.

If I still get bad results once the scales arrive... I will forward the invoice to you!

hahaha...

Cheers for the post.

w


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> I think its time to get me a porlex mini grinder and some scales ! A good advert for them


What's your budget?


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

wilse said:


> OK, sk8
> 
> I read your post, and have ordered some!
> 
> ...


Well done mate, you won't regret it! After all its only you who will benefit.

You may not get spot on straight away, but wheres the fun in that?!!?! Look at others or basic: bean weight - flow rate/time - end/shot weight.

See what you get..... if off (you will be) then work out (logic) to adjust your grind, tamp etc to suit till your close and see if you can taste an improvement. I'll be blooming surprised if you can't!

But that's just the start, I'm not telling you to get spot on just get it in the ball park of someone else. That way you know your along the right lines, *THEN* well then you tweak till you get whats best and it looks like that could be for each individual bean/roast type. That's where I am now and its an open field for your taste buds and tweaks to run. Just get the basics then experiment and find what *YOU* like









I've never been one for strict rules or to adhere to them but you need the 'basic' guidance then skill to expand. The rest its up to you and your tongue......

signed anon (no invoices please......)

Scales are just a tool for your in depth experimenting (and keeping things consistent once you find the sweet spot) and gonna make you happy but don't take my word for it, try it. I'm no expert or guru just starting out same as you but posting up my results and experimenting with interest, a grin and a happy mouth.

Let us all know how it goes bud


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

jeebsy said:


> What's your budget?


I was looking at the Iberital MC2 which is recommended by *Glenn* on the home page for £136.80, but in all honesty cost is only one factor, size seems to be important too as the Mrs is not so happy with this route im going down, although I doubt im the only one whos ever faced this opposition to losing a part of the kitchen over entirely to the making of coffee. So right now the small hand grinder seems an attractive proposition.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

The porlex isn't really ideal for espresso. Something like a Hausgrind would be better if you need to go hand grinder route but they can be tricky to get hold of. Lido maybe too.


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

I want a proper grinder its just I need to save hahahahaha its a git!


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## Jumbo Ratty (Jan 12, 2015)

The hausgrind in walnut looks amazing and I would want to put it in sideboard as an ornament not unseen in a cupboard after use !


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

Jumbo Ratty said:


> The hausgrind in walnut looks amazing and I would want to put it in sideboard as an ornament not unseen in a cupboard after use !


wow that does look nice, so long as it works well..........but I want a electric one as now bringing Porlex in and out of work which is handy but I want a proper one. I met Coffeechap when he dropped of my tamper and when I said what I had grinder wise his reply and said in no way demeaning was "You'll soon get bored of that" lol he was dropping it off on the way back from buying a grinder as well hahahaha. He was right but more due to the fact I am a total convert and now work, home one grinder, its a hand one etc etc Though I have issues with electric also but thats for another thread......

I swear Coffeechap though is gonna be on TV, some hoarders show and they'll go in his house and it will be wall to wall coffee equipment, coffee beans and very select cups and mugs!! lol


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Sk8-bizarre said:


> wow that does look nice, so long as it works well..........but I want a electric one as now bringing Porlex in and out of work which is handy but I want a proper one. I met Coffeechap when he dropped of my tamper and when I said what I had grinder wise his reply and said in no way demeaning was "You'll soon get bored of that" lol he was dropping it off on the way back from buying a grinder as well hahahaha. He was right but more due to the fact I am a total convert and now work, home one grinder, its a hand one etc etc Though I have issues with electric also but thats for another thread......
> 
> I swear Coffeechap though is gonna be on TV, some hoarders show and they'll go in his house and it will be wall to wall coffee equipment, coffee beans and very select cups and mugs!! lol


And just enough room for a bed!


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Sk8-bizarre said:


> wow that does look nice, so long as it works well..........but I want a electric one as now bringing Porlex in and out of work which is handy but I want a proper one. I met Coffeechap when he dropped of my tamper and when I said what I had grinder wise his reply and said in no way demeaning was "You'll soon get bored of that" lol he was dropping it off on the way back from buying a grinder as well hahahaha. He was right but more due to the fact I am a total convert and now work, home one grinder, its a hand one etc etc Though I have issues with electric also but thats for another thread......
> 
> I swear Coffeechap though is gonna be on TV, some hoarders show and they'll go in his house and it will be wall to wall coffee equipment, coffee beans and very select cups and mugs!! lol


Let me know when you are ready, I like deals that don't involve posting!


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## Sk8-bizarre (Jan 22, 2015)

coffeechap said:


> Let me know when you are ready, I like deals that don't involve posting!


SEE!!!! hahaha

So do I, will do mate though prob not for a while but will do. Its the hopper thing see but I'll expand on that at a later date.......oh and the cash......

I am getting better at my shots with practice and equipment purchased, that tamper is the bomb (I dropped it yesterday and nearly had heart failure, was fine though, phew!!!) and well if the grinder is holding me back......... lol

I didn't ask what grinder you got when I dropped of my tamper. Very rude. Was excited with my new Torr see, apologies.


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