# Silvia V2 + PID issue



## DannyCollinsMCR (Nov 21, 2021)

Hey,

I bought a V2 off eBay which is from an enthusiast who upgraded to a new machine. I fitted a PID kit from Auber immediately and checked it was all working. I pulled water through the boiler and out of the steam wand to make sure it wasn't running dry.

It was maintaining the temperatures nicely and I tested for around 45mins then turned it off and went to bed.

The next day I popped to my friends coffee shop to pick up some freshly ground coffee and rush home to try it. When I turned it on it seemed to start boiling violently so I turned it off immediately. In the PID settings AL1 was set to 600C!!! PID reading when violently boiling was 120C

Now the power switch doesn't illuminate when I turn it on nor does the water heat. PID displays room temp water now.

I've tried to reset the thermostat but it's still not working.

I don't understand why even if AL1 was incorrectly set so high that it would try to heat to this temp when the steam button wasn't pressed. Surely it would just try to go to the boiler temp that I had set to 95C?

I am going to check the element with a multimeter later today but not sure what's happened or what changed overnight from testing and then trying to use the machine.

Any advice?


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## DannyCollinsMCR (Nov 21, 2021)

I should probably add that when I checked the thermostat reset switch it did need resetting and I felt the click when pushing it back in.

It didn't resolve the issue though.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

DannyCollinsMCR said:


> I should probably add that when I checked the thermostat reset switch it did need resetting and I felt the click when pushing it back in.
> 
> It didn't resolve the issue though.


 @DannyCollinsMCR

The PID probably read an incorrect temp and the limit stat popped off because it went too high, I think they are probably set to 140 or 145. it will say on the limit stat. In all likelihood, the heating element may be shot.

the real question is what happened, find that out, and you identify the problem, so it doesn't happen again. Now I like to be precise, because without that, fault-finding and fixing becomes much more expensive and time-consuming.



> *1. I bought a V2 off eBay which is from an enthusiast who upgraded to a new machine.* I fitted a PID kit from Auber immediately and checked it was all working. I pulled water through the boiler and out of the steam wand to make sure it wasn't running dry.
> 
> It was maintaining the temperatures nicely and I tested for around 45mins then turned it off and went to bed.
> 
> *2. The next day I popped to my friends coffee shop to pick up some freshly ground coffee and rush home to try it. When I turned it on it seemed to start boiling violently so I turned it off *immediately. In the PID settings AL1 was set to 600C!!! PID reading when violently boiling was 120C


 OK lets take two areas;

1. I never believe anything people say on Ebay, so it may have had a fault already that he knew about and didn't tell you about, or had no understanding of. Or it might have been fine

2. Here's a bit of a clue, analysis purely based on what you said and the missing precision of information required.

*When I turned it on it seemed to start boiling violently so I turned it off *immediately. - Was this when you turned it on, or later on, if it was later on, how long and was it making any noises on as it heated to to 120C?? Was the heating gradual, linear and normal, did it take the normal length of time or was it faster?

*In the PID settings AL1 was set to 600C!!! PID reading when violently boiling was 120C* - Are you sure you set AL1 correctly, can it have any relevance as things will have melted by then. So it wasn't violently boiling (by sound), until it reached 120C then it started, or was that when you really noticed?

As you can tell, I am unclear on exactly what happened and so will else be when giving advice....which then costs you time and money. If I had to guess and it is a guess. It might be that the boiler was not full of water (for whatever reason), you switched it on and by the time the PID detected the temperature (because the probe was not under the waterline...the unit was well above the limit stat temp, which popped (probably because it's close to the heating element or getting more heat from conduction via the metal as it sits on top of the boiler.

The limit stat may have popped at its safety limit, but that only really works when the boiler is full of water...things need to get a LOT hotter to pop em on a boiler with very little water in it. hence why I think the heating element may have blown.

of course I could be wasting your time and unless you opened the machine immediately after the problem, you may not be aware of any leak as it could have dried up by now.

Just a guess...........


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## DannyCollinsMCR (Nov 21, 2021)

Hey Dave,

Thank you for the response.

When I turned it on after picking up coffee I immediately pulled water through to ensure a full boiler then went in to the PID settings to set the pre-infusion, delay and pull times. So within 2 minutes I was in the settings changing these. I then wanted to set both AH1 and AL1 and the same moment I noticed the normal heating noise becoming overly violent and heard a clicking/expanding sound coming from the machine was when I reached AL1 in the settings and saw it was on 600. I turned the machine off at that moment to avoid doing any damage and the clicking continued and sounded like retraction.

I did quickly flick it on for 3 seconds to load the initial PID boiler reading which was displaying 120C. I noticed the power switch didn't illuminate at all.

This is when I opened it up to investigate and hit the thermostat reset button. There were no visible leaks at all.

My thoughts are similar to yours. Even though I had pulled water through to ensure the boiler was full it most likely wasn't for whatever reason that could be. And the violent boiling sound was due to lack of water and clicking sound could be retraction/expansion of the element. I imagine this is why the noise started so quickly because it didn't have much water to heat up. Noises started between 1.5 - 2.5 minutes from switching the machine on (best estimate I can provide now the moment has passed unfortunately).

It does seem odd though that I'd filled the boiler the day before and monitored temperatures for around 45mins with no issues. I didn't go to any PID settings that day as I wasn't sure what each abbreviation related to so wanted to wait until I'd done some research. This is how I know I didn't set AL1 to 600 by mistake myself.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@DannyCollinsMCR Is it possible, while you are changing the PID settings, it doesn't control the temperature?

If not, it might be that the PID and or Probe is faulty


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## DannyCollinsMCR (Nov 21, 2021)

DavecUK said:


> @DannyCollinsMCR Is it possible, while you are changing the PID settings, it doesn't control the temperature?
> 
> If not, it might be that the PID and or Probe is faulty


 As far as I can tell, if you're in the PID settings it still continues to control temperatures as there is no way to start the PID without activating the boiler (turning the machine on).

I have just taken a multimeter reading of the heating element connectors and it's showing 050ohms but I imagine it should be around 20?

I'm not getting a reading from earth to heating element so doesn't look to be cracked.


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## DannyCollinsMCR (Nov 21, 2021)

I have a final update and a fix for this issue for anybody that finds themselves in a similar situation.

I am not sure why AL1 was set to 600 but this did cause the machine to start overheating but the thermostat safety kicked in.

Ultimately though the reason why the machine then failed to light up and initiate the boiler element after resetting the thermostat was due to a requirement within the PID settings.

Upon noticing that AL1 was set to 600C I did change it to 135C to match AH1.

AH1 and AL1 can NOT be the exact same temperature. They both relate to steam temp however AL1 must be 1-2 degrees higher than AH1 in the settings for the boiler element to initiate. I now have AH1 at 135C and AL1 at 137C.

Regarding my previous response. The correct reading of electrical resistance between the two element connectors is 050.

My machine and PID now operate as normal!


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## 29243 (Feb 8, 2021)

Hi @DannyCollinsMCR. I'm glad you got it sorted.

I don't know your specific wiring, but issues like this are why it's always worth keeping the steam thermostat in the circuit. That way, if the pid ever plays up, when it hits 140°C the steam thermostat would cut out the power and prevent any damage.

Obviously, an empty boiler would still over heat and trip the safety.

Just though I'd mention. Enjoy the coffee again.


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