# Bean to cup machines



## jryans10 (Nov 16, 2012)

Hi,

I'm just wondering: what are your thoughts about bean to cup machines? Only I want a new espresso machine set, and I could buy a Delonghi bean to cup machine for just under £300, where as if I purchased a Gaggia Classic and good grinder it could work out a bit more.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks.


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## rmwkenefeck (Nov 25, 2012)

I don't have much experience with Bean to cup machines but I cannot recall ever having had a decent cup of coffee from one. Maybe I have never seen a good one.

In contrast you could probably get some decent second hand stuff for that kind of money if you tried hard.

It depends really on what you want and how much hunting and fiddling you are willing/wanting to do.

My portugese friends had a good machine which had a grinder built in but I still don't know what it was. It made decent espresso.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

The only one I've ever seen a positive review of is the one Londinium sell, and I think they tested quite a few some email Reiss and ask him what he thinks?

My personal opinion: if you want to just press a button and get a coffee in the morning go for it. If you want to learn about espresso and refine your skills to produce an excellent coffee you are better off with the MC2 and Gaggia.


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

my mate has a Jura F90 which I think cost him the thick side of £1200. He left it in his flat when i was renting it, so used it quite a lot. It was not bad at all. My main complaints were:

-poor steam power, so making latte's took ages!!

-coffee was never massively hot

-if you ask it to do a large cup of coffee, it basically just keeps pouring water through your coffee grounds, e.g. massive over extraction. That can't be helping flavour. I think with a machine like that, it should have a small second spout that just dispenses hot water into your drink to top it up.

That said, it made nice tasting coffee. Using Lavazza Espresso (black packet in most supermarkets) beans, it made lovely tasting drinks. But not sure i could justify the cost what what it does. I'd rather have a lovely Rocket Giotto and enjoy the aesthetics and involvement.


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## chimpsinties (Jun 13, 2011)

You'll never get as good espresso out of a bean-to-cup as you will from a classic/grinder combo. We have a Delonghi Magnifica (approx £400) and althought it makes a drinkable drink it's not great. It just lacks all the complex flavours you can get from a classic with practice. I spent ages tweeking the bean-to-cup to get the best out of it but they're severely limited.

Really depends what you want. To practice and eventutally be making fantastic coffee. or to press a button and never have to think about it at the expense of quality and flavour. No one can answer that but you


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

Don't do it









You look inside them and you see how poorly most of them are built, with cheap crappy plasticcy bits that break easy and are impossible to clean.

Buy a used classic and mazzer grinder. Less than or ~300. Easy to repair, clean, maintain and will produce far better coffee.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but you're a student, with plenty of time to spare. That = semi automatic machine to me


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## jryans10 (Nov 16, 2012)

Thanks guys - will most probrably go for a Classic and Iberitial MC2. I was looking on Amazon, and they have a brand new Gaggia Classic for £179 or a used one for around £117. Is it worth paying more to get brand new or will you just get the same results anyway?

Reason I like Amazon is because of their next day guaranteed delivery. I hate staying in and things not turning up!

Thanks for the information everyone







.


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

jryans10 said:


> Thanks guys - will most probrably go for a Classic and Iberitial MC2. I was looking on Amazon, and they have a brand new Gaggia Classic for £179 or a used one for around £117. Is it worth paying more to get brand new or will you just get the same results anyway?
> 
> Reason I like Amazon is because of their next day guaranteed delivery. I hate staying in and things not turning up!
> 
> ...


No reason not to buy used unless it's been treated like crap.

Ebay you'll do even better no doubt.


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## jryans10 (Nov 16, 2012)

Thanks, also just one more thing:

Would you go for a Ascaso i-Mini or this? http://www.amazon.co.uk/Graef-CM80-Brushed-Coffee-Grinder/dp/B002P9CFCK/ref=pd_sim_sbs_kh_6

Thanks.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Look for the slightly older Classics. Since Gaggia were taken over by Phillips, the build quality has really plummeted. Gaggia UK have their own site selling recon machines. Give them a ring and ask them when the are expecting to have some original Classics

http://www.gaggia.uk.com/gaggiaspecialists/10080.html


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

jryans10 said:


> Thanks, also just one more thing:
> 
> Would you go for a Ascaso i-Mini or this? http://www.amazon.co.uk/Graef-CM80-Brushed-Coffee-Grinder/dp/B002P9CFCK/ref=pd_sim_sbs_kh_6
> 
> Thanks.


Neither. Used mazzer, compak, macap on the bay.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

jryans10 said:


> Thanks, also just one more thing:
> 
> Would you go for a Ascaso i-Mini or this? http://www.amazon.co.uk/Graef-CM80-Brushed-Coffee-Grinder/dp/B002P9CFCK/ref=pd_sim_sbs_kh_6
> 
> Thanks.


Seriously, these odd grinders you keep finding aren't going to do it!

Iberital MC2 or Ascaso iMini (which I wrote you a long review of in your other thread) are perfect for a Gaggia Classic.

Rising Power makes a good point too, but you may need to give them a good clean and change the burrs which bumps up the cost. They're a bit overkill for a classic as well, unless you want to upgrade to a better machine down the line when it will also ne necessary to upgrade to a better grinder.

Happy to answer any other questions about the Ascaso if you want, just let me know. Good Luck


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## jryans10 (Nov 16, 2012)

Thanks guys







.

In the end I ordered a used Gaggia Classic and an Ascaso iMini, cost me £263 in total with one-day delivery tomorrow.

Also from the Espresso Shop I ordered one of these Rancilio Steam wands as I hear they're great on the classic.

Is there any other mod or equipment I should purchase for the classic?

I'm just really fed up of having cheap equipment with the espresso always tasting bitter all the time







.

Thanks







.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

That's a great price for new equipment!

Yes, you want to look at replacing the pressurised basket that you get with the Classic for a non pressurised one. The pressurised one creates a kind of fake crema that I don't think you will be happy with.

Get a tamper as well, no need to go all out but something with a nice metal base (usually you get a rubbish plastic one with the machine that is useless).

Take a look in the Gaggia subforum, sure someone can recommend suppliers for the above.


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

aaronb said:


> Seriously, these odd grinders you keep finding aren't going to do it!
> 
> Iberital MC2 or Ascaso iMini (which I wrote you a long review of in your other thread) are perfect for a Gaggia Classic.
> 
> ...


Oh cmon, burrs cost sod all on most mazzers, compaks, macaps, they're all really easy to clean too.

They may be overkill for a classic, then again i'm not entirely sure. I did notice the difference between the k10 and the mini on the classic, before I got the izzo.


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

jryans10 said:


> Thanks guys
> 
> 
> 
> ...


A decent tamper. Happy donkeys are ok, reg barber and the likes are better.

The usual puly caff cleaning fluid and a bottomless portafilter.

You'll see why I said a used mazzer when you try the bottomless portafilter.


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## jryans10 (Nov 16, 2012)

Thank you all so much for your help.

I just received my used Gaggia Classic (described on amazon as damaged box but excellent condition) today. Funnily enough my grinder is also coming today but they put it on another van - not sure why the courier didn't put them on the same van.

Actually with my Gaggia Classic, the box didn't even look open (I had to remove the sticker, and break the connection points) then things such as the paranerllo, scoop, plastic tamper was still wrapped up! The cup heater still had the wrapper on so it is really good condition!

At the moment whilst I am still waiting for my grinder, I tried my cheap burr grinder and I can instantly taste the difference!

I have one slight question though - does anyone know what this black plastic bit is (I put a ? next to it)? Also the manual reads "mod. Classic", what does the mod mean?









Thank you all very much for your help! I am really pleased with how the Gaggia classic looks and feels! I just want my grinder to hurry up now so I can start enjoying espresso making!

Thanks =].


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

Think that's the bit that sits in the drip tray.

Mod = model?


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## shinsplint (Oct 18, 2012)

jryans10,

Well done on your new purchases









I also got my Classic (about a month ago) from Amazon Warehouse and found the same, hadnt even been opened









I ended up going for the Iberital MC2 as so many here recommend it. Its on Santas list so I can't touch it yet.

I hadnt heard of the Ascaso at the time, but do let us know what you think of it.

So far i've been using the supplied pressuires basket (the larger of the two) and I personally don't have any issue with the crema as described above, I like it, but then its all I know. I will try a standard basket at some point. I've also only used ground coffee from Ouesburn which I ordered online. Its nice stuff. I am expecting better things though with the new grinder and fresh beans.

Let us know what you decide with upgrades i.e. baskets, portafilter etc.

I got the Rancilio steam wand as well. Much better than the supplied plastic one, if a bit LOUD in use.

Enjoy.


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## jryans10 (Nov 16, 2012)

shinsplint said:


> jryans10,
> 
> Well done on your new purchases
> 
> ...


Thanks







yeah was a bit strange seeing it unopened! An absolute bargain though! I can only presume maybe the box was damaged.

Now, the grinder. It looks nice, but is really noisy and an absolute pain to adjust the grind. It is a cheap grinder, I got mine for £145 from Amazon so roughly the same price of an MC2 from Happy Donkey if you include the VAT and postage. It is a stepless grinder, but my fingers are already worn out from twisting so much! I still haven't got the grind perfect, but I will eventually







.

As for the standard pressurised baskets. Now, this caused me A LOT of problems. I thought it was my grind or tamping which sometimes choked my machine because I watched so many videos, seen how fine they grounded their coffee and how much they put into a basket. Yet when I did it, the machine would just choke / water would not come out. I have just ordered a non-pressurised double basket (from ebay: £5 with P&P) as apparently that will allow me to grind really fine and get a really good few shots with it. So yes, I guess it is the pressurised 'perfect-crema' thing which has been causing me problems. Even with pre-ground espresso it would choke the machine.

I did watch some espresso videos (one of which I bought a DVD called the kitchen barista), and he explains that the crema shouldn't be thick, it should just be a thin layer with tiger stripes. Now, a problem with my espressos with this is that the crema is thick. I guess some people like this; but in my opinion it makes the espresso taste 'salty'.

But I mean yeah, I really do think the pressurised baskets are a bit of a pain. I guess they're okay if you don't really want to bother with getting the correct combination of grind and tamp, but I actually want to understand espressos and really get into making a perfect one.

Please do correct me if I'm wrong.

Thanks =].


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

you are correct, the pressurised basket is more forgiving and forces crema.

If you want to understand grind and tamp replacing it is the way to go.

If you are just using that plastic tamper that comes with it its worth investing in a metal base one even if its only £10, the plastic ones are completely useless.

It will take a while to get everything just right but that's all part of the fun


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