# Which in-line filter?



## rogher (Nov 22, 2020)

My machine is plumbed-in. There's an in-line (pressure reducer and) 10" filter which I replace annually. I've no idea if I should change it more frequently nor if it's doing anything at all (just a placebo?). This raises two questions:



How should I determine when to change the filter?


What qualities/specification of filter should I be using?


Please point me to the correct thread if this has been covered before - I failed to find it.


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## BlackCatCoffee (Apr 11, 2017)

I always suggest putting a flow meter in line when fitting a. They cost peanuts and help to protect your investment as you know exactly when to change.

When you purchase a filter I would suggest getting a water test kit. You can then test you water and refer to the chart that comes with it and work out the actual useful life of the filter in litres for your specific water hardness.

That way you can change it when it has reached its throughput limit or 12 months (the filter media starts to degrade when wet) whichever is soonest.

Scale is the quickest way to kill a machine and a new filter every so often cost a lot less than repairs.

ETA - I personally tend to fit Brita Finest in the domestic environment but Pentair Everpure are decent as are BWT. The key thing is to make sure it is suitable for espresso machines. Most of the companies suggested have a calculator on their site so you can input expected volume of water to be used and they will suggest one that will be suitable for your annual consumption.

David


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## rogher (Nov 22, 2020)

Thank you David, that's very useful.

I hadn't thought about a meter. One may not be so easy to fit because the plumbing is behind new units that I cannot move. Access is not easy, but maybe the filter could be removed and plumb extra from there...

I have an electronic descaler ahead of the filter (belt and braces?) but, apart from a flashing display, have no idea if it does anything! The filtered water feeds a sink (for kettle) as well as the coffee machine.

I'll take a look at your suggested filters and see how they compare.

Routine testing would seem to be a reasonable approach. Is it just hardness that needs to be watched? I'm no chemist but am willing to try and learn if there is anything else that's important to watch.


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## NewboyUK (Jul 14, 2018)

Evening

Theres quite a few different filters and work in different ways. As far as i know - knowing how hard your water is currently is the starting point as to what type of filter you fit and what to set it to and use that to determine how many litres it will treat.

Ion exchange filters are calculated on how hard the water is and what the bypass is set to to work out how many it treats.

Other types of filters will "treat" (not soften) the water and work on a set number of litres but not all of them are good in hard/very hard water areas. Theres a word for it but cant think unless someone wants to tell me

Just my 2p anyway


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## NewboyUK (Jul 14, 2018)

Ps - can you take a picture of what you currently? So we can all best advise.

The first half of your postcode will help a little as we can get a ball park of how hard your area is.

Personally if it's one of these inline filters that are about the same size as a kitchen roll cardboard tube - 9/10 times I bin them in favour of something more substantial. Like @Black Cat Coffee suggests - those brands are very good 👍


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## rogher (Nov 22, 2020)

We use a water softener for washing water but not for drinking (nor toilets or garden) because I had read that drinking (artificially created) soft water was not good for you. The softener is set to 20° on the Clarke scale (I think). I've not tested what comes out of my filtered water for the coffee machine but scale in the kettle (which uses the same source) is only slight.

Postcode area WV12


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## NewboyUK (Jul 14, 2018)

I have read that using a salt softner isn't great for you but also you would have to drink a lot of it to make any difference.

So is it that you have a softner on the whole house with seperate taps for unsoftened water? Thats kind of the way it read


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## rogher (Nov 22, 2020)

"Kitchen roll" describes the size of my filter housing rather well, but a whole roll rather than just the centre. It's about 12" tall 4" diameter. It takes any standard 10" (actually about 9.75") tall cartridge. I'd provide a photo if I could but space and light in the cupboard is restricted. It looks a bit like this.


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## rogher (Nov 22, 2020)

NewboyUK said:


> I have read that using a salt softner isn't great for you but also you would have to drink a lot of it to make any difference.
> 
> So is it that you have a softner on the whole house with seperate taps for unsoftened water? Thats kind of the way it read


 Yes, that's it. Even hard water to the tap we brush our teeth from.

(Sorry - went to try and measure the housing between posts).


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## NewboyUK (Jul 14, 2018)

We really need a make and model of the filter that feeds the machine to give a insight as to working out the literage it will treat


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## rogher (Nov 22, 2020)

I have one like this but was thinking that this one may be better?

Obviously, a more expensive filter should do more than a cheaper one - but is that necessary?


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## mr-bean (Nov 26, 2018)

If you don't want to fork out for or don't have room for a water softener there is an alternative.
Template-assisted crystallization (TAC) is a filter system that converts calcium crystals to stop them sticking to hard surfaces such as kettles and coffee machine boilers.

BWT make a system called Bestmax Premium, not to be confused with Bestmax water filters. These filter cartridges fit the same mounting head as the non TAC ones so it is easy to get them muddled when buying.

Finer Filters UK also makes one which does the same job at a lot less money, this is the one I have been testing for the last month in my kettle. They claim not only does it prevent lime scale but it will also remove any scale already there. So I started my test with a scaled up kettle and after a month I have a kettle with no scale whatsoever, it's a glass & stainless steel one and there is no water marks anywhere.

Both systems fit under the sink and are easy to plumb in, I did mine with pushfit conectors. They have a domestic life of 1 year per cartridge.


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## rogher (Nov 22, 2020)

I'm a little confused that you suggest a water softener, because I'm of the belief that it is not recommended to drink softened (by salt) water. That's why I took a separate supply to the kitchen, for drinking. I then had to drop the pressure because the coffee machine (and filter housing seal) could only take 3bar or something like that. Having got what I believe to be a standard housing, I was hoping to find the best solution in terms of a filter to put into that. I'm short of access and space under a large Belfast sink, so prefer not to attempt more plumbing work there. I could use the 'flying lead' from that to my coffee machine to add something else there (think it has a small diameter female thread on the end) and connect an extra filter before continuing to the machine. If I can use the existing filter housing, however, I'd get the benefit when using the kettle as well. I don't use much water through the machine - only one shot on average per day - whereas we brew loads of tea! I don't think filters last indefinitely so making better use of the filter within its lifespan would be a bonus. Cheapest solution would be a jug and use the reservoir but fully plumbed is so much easier and I'd rather avoid faff.

It's interesting that your kettle has cleared up. I've used solutions in the past that claim to do that but not had the same result.

I'll take a look at the BWT offerings (Bestmax and TAC). Thanks very much!


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## mr-bean (Nov 26, 2018)

rogher said:


> It's interesting that your kettle has cleared up. I've used solutions in the past that claim to do that but not had the same result.
> 
> I'll take a look at the BWT offerings (Bestmax and TAC). Thanks very much!


 I thought it best to go to the manufacturers about their products and see what they had to say.

I have been in touch with Osmio about the Zero, BWT about the Bestmax Premium, Eddy about electronic scale induction and two local plumbing engineers about magnetic devices they all fit with new boiler installation. I asked them all on how to combat my very hard water with a CaCO3 level of 371.12 ppm, they have all replied.

All of them have been very honest with me, all have suggested a salt based softener is my best option as none of their products are built to handle this extreme hardness at a reasonable cost, ie the time between replacing filters or the amount of calcium an inhibitor can convert, so although my TAC filter is still doing the business it is likely that it too will fail before the estimated time as the resin becomes saturated.

I am also testing a BWT Penguin jug on another kettle, this too is doing as BWT said it would and I have no lime scale build up after 2 weeks and with my water that's saying something.


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## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

I'd be very cautious about using vague technologies to treat a water supply for an espresso machine, especially if the water is somehow able to dissolve scale. A kettle is a poor indicator of performance as it operates at 100c for short periods of time whereas espresso machines operate at 105-145c for extended periods. Everything can be calculated when you know what is in the water, which is easy before you filter it, not so easy after it unless you know exactly what the filters are adding and removing.


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## mr-bean (Nov 26, 2018)

Rob1 said:


> Everything can be calculated when you know what is in the water, which is easy before you filter it, not so easy after it unless you know exactly what the filters are adding and removing.


 The Osmio is removing almost everything to create RO water, but the other devices I mentioned are not adding or removing but are changing the molecular construction of the mineral so it cannot adhere to a hard surface hot or cold, what goes in as a mineral comes out as one. I have tested the pH of the water prior and after the exchanger and the level remained the same, but so far the TAC exchanged water is not showing any build up of lime scale on my glass kettle, and that is miraculous given my water level of 371 ppm. Don't get me wrong I'm not contradicting you, I am merely stating what I have researched and been told.


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## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

mr-bean said:


> The Osmio is removing almost everything to create RO water, but the other devices I mentioned are not adding or removing but are changing the molecular construction of the mineral so it cannot adhere to a hard surface hot or cold, what goes in as a mineral comes out as one. I have tested the pH of the water prior and after the exchanger and the level remained the same, but so far the TAC exchanged water is not showing any build up of lime scale on my glass kettle, and that is miraculous given my water level of 371 ppm. Don't get me wrong I'm not contradicting you, I am merely stating what I have researched and been told.


 Ok but this is my point. How is it changing the water?

You say it changes the molecular construction of calcium and magnesium, how so?

As far as I can tell it causes the minerals to crystallise which is exactly what they do in conjunction with carbonates (i.e form Calcium Carbonate crystals) which is the same as scaling. The only difference is the crystals float around in the water (they are insoluble) and don't form on hot surfaces where the drying takes place. In other words these filters just dry the minerals so they form crystals on the filters rather than on hot surfaces like pipes and heating elements.

How does it affect taste of coffee; does it extract like RO water/low hardness/alkalinity water? How does it affect conductivity? If scale potential as dropped but hardness is the same, how does that alter the corrosion risk? Will hardness measure the same with a drop test kit? How do you keep track of how effective this tech is? If the hardness measures the same pre and post filter, is the only way to measure its effectiveness to visually watch out for scale?


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## mr-bean (Nov 26, 2018)

Rob1 said:


> You say it changes the molecular construction of calcium and magnesium, how so?


 I have copied and pasted this article:

The mission of the Water Research Foundation is to conduct and promote applied research on the reclamation, recycling, reuse and desalination of water across the USA and evaluate domestic ion exchange water treatments.
Water treatment devices can prevent scale formation without the addition of salt. One such system is called Template Assisted Crystallization (TAC). This ion exchange water treatment is a product for reducing water hardness in the home. The ion exchange process starts when water enters the container that's filled with polymeric beads (resin) that are saturated with a monovalent cation solution (positive charged ion solution). The calcium and magnesium ions change places with sodium ions on the beads. The water still retains the same level of TDS, but the scale forming minerals have been changed and the water is considered soft.
Once the resin beads have been saturated with calcium and magnesium ions and are in a sealed filter with a membrane they are disposed of, if the resin can be accessed it can be cleaned and regenerated with a heavy solution of monovalent cation which removes the calcium and magnesium from the beads, the TAC systems in our tests reduced scale by more than 90%.


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## Rob1 (Apr 9, 2015)

mr-bean said:


> I have copied and pasted this article:
> 
> The mission of the Water Research Foundation is to conduct and promote applied research on the reclamation, recycling, reuse and desalination of water across the USA and evaluate domestic ion exchange water treatments.
> Water treatment devices can prevent scale formation without the addition of salt. One such system is called Template Assisted Crystallization (TAC). This ion exchange water treatment is a product for reducing water hardness in the home. The ion exchange process starts when water enters the container that's filled with polymeric beads (resin) that are saturated with a monovalent cation solution (positive charged ion solution). The calcium and magnesium ions change places with sodium ions on the beads. The water still retains the same level of TDS, but the scale forming minerals have been changed and the water is considered soft.
> Once the resin beads have been saturated with calcium and magnesium ions and are in a sealed filter with a membrane they are disposed of, if the resin can be accessed it can be cleaned and regenerated with a heavy solution of monovalent cation which removes the calcium and magnesium from the beads, the TAC systems in our tests reduced scale by more than 90%.


 So it doesn't change the molecular structure at all, it's just and ion exchange resin...


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Rob1 said:


> So it doesn't change the molecular structure at all, it's just and ion exchange resin...


 TAC does seem a valid method of scale reduction (not softening). It's not the same as RO either. It doesn't change the mineral content and needs to be used with a chlorine reduction filter. I have thought of moving to TAC for the house if/when the Harveys twin tank dies.

The main issues are high flow rate situations where it might not soften well, a lot of the systems have no meter, so it's a bit of guesswork as to when the media isn't able to perform it's function any more. Prefilters have to be changed every 6 months or so and the TAC medium ever 1.2.3 years? Depending on usage.

Certainly something I will consider one day...just not sure yet the systems I have seen are mature....probably need a basic flow meter and some electronics on them. One of the key concerns is the flow rate and how the media handles it. it can vary greatly depending on whether you have a megaflow, loft tanks, traditional ballcock or high flow quick top ballcocks etc.. Higher flow rate systems have much larger cartridges and more medium, simply so there is enough contact for the system to work.


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