# La Spaz Vivaldi II



## Nod (Sep 7, 2013)

Hi I have the chance to get a preinfusion kit for my vivaldi II... Do people think it is going to make much difference and is it worth it?. It will be about £60 ish... Thanks


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## Firochromis (Oct 26, 2014)

Hey, Vivaldi II has programmable pre-infusion, doesn't it?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Firochromis said:


> Hey, Vivaldi II has programmable pre-infusion, doesn't it?


Programmable passive dribbling from a hot brew boiler...not exactly preinfusion. It's fairly worthless, hence the kit that came (eventually) from LS.


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## malling (Dec 8, 2014)

But the LS kit doesn't do much more then what a E61 preinfusion chamber dos, call it useless if you want to.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

malling said:


> But the LS kit doesn't do much more then what a E61 preinfusion chamber dos, call it useless if you want to.


Read my post again, the original preinfusion is useless, the modified kit at least stops the pressure hammering the puck at the beginning of the shot....always a problem with the LS machine.


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## malling (Dec 8, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> Read my post again, the original preinfusion is useless, the modified kit at least stops the pressure hammering the puck at the beginning of the shot....always a problem with the LS machine.


I have owned professional machines without any real preinfusion! And any of those would do better in the cup then a vivaldi with this kit.

The only thing this kit dos is muting the flavors. Just like the chamber on an E61 dos.

I actually owned one, so I should know

And no machine is hammering the puck, it takes time for pressure to build up, above the coffee, even with a rotary vane pump


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## Nod (Sep 7, 2013)

Thanks all

To clarify my vivaldi is a II but the model before the programmable pre infusion was introduced. The kit bolts onto the boiler and then this needs to fill before the pressure builds. I understand a professional machine will be better but the choice I have is whether this is going to make my coffee any better or not... I assume it must otherwise Chris coffee would not have developed it. Sounds like malling though has tried it and doesn't think it is worth it?


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## malling (Dec 8, 2014)

If you want real pre-infusion, then it's better to mod your machine, so there is a delay before the pump kicks in. Allot of people have done this on rotary pump machines without any pre-infusion capabilities.

the chamber doesn't do anything close to real pre-infusion.


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## Nod (Sep 7, 2013)

\ said:


> If you want real pre-infusion' date=' then it's better to mod your machine, so there is a delay before the pump kicks in. Allot of people have done this on rotary pump machines without any pre-infusion capabilities. the chamber doesn't do anything close to real pre-infusion.[/quote']
> 
> Interesting... Maybe I need to have a hunt on the Internet and see if My skills are up to this mod...do you know how hard it is or can you point me to any reference to it?


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## ronsil (Mar 8, 2012)

If its anything Vivaldi it will be in the 'S1 Cafe' Forum


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

malling said:


> I have owned professional machines without any real preinfusion! And any of those would do better in the cup then a vivaldi with this kit.
> 
> The only thing this kit dos is muting the flavors. Just like the chamber on an E61 dos.
> 
> ...


Ah well, there's me told then and I'm learning something new about the E61 every day


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## Firochromis (Oct 26, 2014)

Hi everybody,

Like the OP I have a Vivaldi without any pre-infusion ability. These days I'm searching to add that and reading a lot in the S1 Cafe. My impression up to this title was programmable pre-infusion is the way to go; but for those who lacks it there is an easy install solution: passive pre-infusion. In this thread you people say both are useless. Please don't take my words offensive, I'm trying to learn and save money.









In the S1 Cafe I haven't see any mod to make a "real" pre-infusion, but I'll dig deeper.

If I understand correctly, programmable pre-infusion is: To program the solenoid to open but give a delay (between 1-8 seconds) to the pump. This way, the solenoid opens the way, and since Vivaldi is a plumped in machine, the pressure on the home water circuit gives the first gentle pressure on the ground (portafilter). After the pre-set delay, rotary pump kicks in. I can regulate my home water circuit between 1 bar to 4 bar, so I thought this one is u pretty good pre-infusion.

Passive pre-infusion is: the solenoid and pump kicks in the same time but, when the water reaches the ground and built some pressure, the spring in the chamber takes the pressure and when it is done the full pressure goes to the portafilter.

Any mistakes on those?


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