# new baratza sette series



## "coffee 4/1" (Sep 1, 2014)

Might be worth the wait before thinking of new grinder, the new baratza sette out very soon, if not strong money might be considered.


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## canuckcoffeeguy (Mar 29, 2016)

Baratza has finally revealed their new toy. Very interesting.

http://www.baratza.com/grinder/sette-270w/

Conical, but the inner burr is fixed. Developed over 8 years, and they boast about precision alignment. 40mm burrs. Low retention. And Bluetooth and weight functionality.

The Vario was already a great value for the price.

I think these will fly off the shelves. Just need to taste its espresso to compare.


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## Jason1wood (Jun 1, 2012)

Looks interesting. I do like the form.


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## froggystyle (Oct 30, 2013)

Nice looking that is.


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## Dallah (Jan 31, 2015)

If it is any good, I could probably get that past SWMBO. Assuming that they don't screw us too much on the UK price.


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

Preciso is still around £300! I paid that much 5 years ago and it hasn't come down at all. Chances are this will be overpriced when it hits the UK. Looks great though and I'm a huge fan of baratza!


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

Wonder what the UK price will be, and if it will be marketed under the Mahlkonig brand in the EU like the Vario?

On the comparison graph they seem to put it on the same level as the Vario, with the main difference being the conical vs flat burrs.


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## cricketer (Mar 20, 2016)

Looking at the USD price in the link I'm guessing £449....


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

Timed version is cheaper, $379 vs $499.

Sette has a similar burr size compared to a Feldgrind/Hausgrind/Lido. Grind adjustment seems a little bit awkward to access, I wonder how good it would be for both brewed and spro.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

cricketer said:


> Looking at the USD price in the link I'm guessing £449....


bet not......

http://www.chriscoffee.com/Baratza-Forte-Coffee-Grinder-p/forte.htm

http://coffeehit.co.uk/baratza-forte


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

Mrboots2u said:


> bet not......
> 
> http://www.chriscoffee.com/Baratza-Forte-Coffee-Grinder-p/forte.htm
> 
> http://coffeehit.co.uk/baratza-forte


$129 vs £149. That is unfair in so many levels!

http://www.amazon.com/Baratza-Encore-Conical-Coffee-Grinder/dp/B00LW8122Y/

http://coffeehit.co.uk/baratza-encore


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

I'm assuming all is good, especially after 8 years!, but it doesn't look very well balanced. Maybe the low power means it doesn't need to be 'planted' on the worktop with a heavy base.

Looks like it will be in competition with the Sage Smart Grinder Pro in terms of functionality, but at 2-3x the price. The grind quality better be something special.

Still, probably a good option for the space-limited domestic user, just like the Vario is.....hang on a sec....


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## Orangertange (Jul 4, 2013)

Best thing about it looks like the grind path, just a shame i'ts not step less........and got much bigger burrs


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

Orangertange said:


> Best thing about it looks like the grind path, just a shame i'ts not step less........and got much bigger burrs


The micro adjustment is stepless.


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## canuckcoffeeguy (Mar 29, 2016)

There's more info here. Looks quite innovative:

http://dailycoffeenews.com/2016/04/01/baratza-reveals-the-sette-one-rotating-ring-to-rule-them-all/


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Seriously interesting, will be very interested to hear how it road tests.


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

I wonder how the actual burrs (not the mounting system) will defer to the 40mm conical burrs in the Preciso, which were also developered in Lichtenstein.

On closer inspection I really think they've nailed it on the looks front. It would look right at home next to some Brewista kettles, and some high end espresso equipment.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

I remember Frank (Terranova) stating a while back that burr size is not the key to grind quality (although it has a clear correlation), and that tolerance and design play much bigger parts.

Anything more than the vague reference above would be speculation, but I am always interested to see if novel designs and combination of other factors apart from burr size can produce results comparable in quality to the somewhat accepted bigger=better approach.


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## Orangertange (Jul 4, 2013)

Frank has told me that too, unfortunately I've never tried one of his grinders, but from the ones I've owned would defiantly say bigger is better

and I believe the micro adjustment is still stepped, just small steps


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

Orangertange said:


> and I believe the micro adjustment is still stepped, just small steps


What are you basing that on?



> The Sette has a macro adjust of 30 steps, grinding from espresso to manual brew. A stepless micro adjust with 9 indicators, allows the user to accurately dial in a perfect espresso.


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## Orangertange (Jul 4, 2013)

on the vario

But didn't read that bit


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

The name 270(W) could be misleading as 30*9=270 though.


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## canuckcoffeeguy (Mar 29, 2016)

They're really sticking to the 7 theme. Not only does Sette translate to seven, but it weighs seven pounds, and the side profile resembles a 7 in shape.


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

canuckcoffeeguy said:


> They're really sticking to the 7 theme. Not only does Sette translate to seven, but it weighs seven pounds, and the side profile resembles a 7 in shape.


7 buttons on the (ugly) panel too. Seriously, that panel looks like a calculator from 1990s.


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## canuckcoffeeguy (Mar 29, 2016)

PPapa said:


> 7 buttons on the (ugly) panel too. Seriously, that panel looks like a calculator from 1990s.


Yep, I agree. It's the one thing I don't like. The buttons look very narrow and unsatisfying to use. I can foresee situations where you're working quickly and you don't hit the buttons squarely.


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

canuckcoffeeguy said:


> Yep, I agree. It's the one thing I don't like. The buttons look very narrow and unsatisfying to use. I can foresee situations where you're working quickly and you don't hit the buttons squarely.


Some people complained about the looks of Vario.

I really like the looks of Sette. It's something extraordinary and slightly resembles EG-ONE. Sage did a lot better at designing the user interface with their smart grinders.


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## Zephyr (Apr 19, 2015)

I wonder if its worth consider this, instead of Mazzer Super Jolly Electronic, which I own right now. I'm happy with it, its a tank. But how happy can you be when you only used Jolly or Mini.


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## antonrod (Nov 21, 2011)

Heres a video, skip to 2:30 to see how it works -


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

Looks good, but I want to see someone compare it to the Vario.

Wonder if it would be suitable for single dosing?


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

Despite the cheap looking panel, this does look like a really well thought out machine for home use.

I guess it will come down to what it produces in the cup. Clever features are all well and good but it still has to deliver on its primary function!

Watching with mild interest.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

NickdeBug said:


> Despite the cheap looking panel, this does look like a really well thought out machine for home use.
> 
> I guess it will come down to what it produces in the cup. Clever features are all well and good but it still has to deliver on its primary function!
> 
> Watching with mild interest.


And the U.K. Price


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## risky (May 11, 2015)

Orangertange said:


> Frank has told me that too, unfortunately I've never tried one of his grinders, but from the ones I've owned would defiantly say bigger is better
> 
> and I believe the micro adjustment is still stepped, just small steps


Stepped is the future. The EG-1 is stepped. The argument for it makes total sense. Repeatability is massively improved as you can go exactly back to where you were. Stepped grinders are actually far more user friendly, the issue is that until now none of them had fine enough adjustment.


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## PPapa (Oct 24, 2015)

risky said:


> Stepped is the future. The EG-1 is stepped. The argument for it makes total sense. Repeatability is massively improved as you can go exactly back to where you were. Stepped grinders are actually far more user friendly, the issue is that until now none of them had fine enough adjustment.


Is EK43 Barista going to be stepped? It seemed to have hundreds of notches too, but I assumed it was stepless.


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## risky (May 11, 2015)

PPapa said:


> Is EK43 Barista going to be stepped? It seemed to have hundreds of notches too, but I assumed it was stepless.


They've abandoned that fine adjustment dial on the latest prototype.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Looks like CoffeeHit will be retailing this at ~£500.

http://coffeehit.co.uk/baratza-sette-270w

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

One thing I don't get it though: The Sette 270 is currently being advertised at £379.90, and the 270w at £499.90. With all the hype around this new grinder, being "A game changer", "no retention", "revolutionary" etc etc etc, Why is the Forte AP priced at almost double the price, at £800? Doesn't make sense to me.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

pessutojr said:


> One thing I don't get it though: The Sette 270 is currently being advertised at £379.90, and the 270w at £499.90. With all the hype around this new grinder, being "A game changer", "no retention", "revolutionary" etc etc etc, Why is the Forte AP priced at almost double the price, at £800? Doesn't make sense to me.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I'm not sure where they're putting the Sette in the series of grinders, they positioned the Forte grinders as being for commercial use. So the parts might be different? Not sure what else apart from if they either don't mind not selling the Forte or they haven't done a price review yet?

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

pessutojr said:


> One thing I don't get it though: The Sette 270 is currently being advertised at £379.90, and the 270w at £499.90. With all the hype around this new grinder, being "A game changer", "no retention", "revolutionary" etc etc etc, Why is the Forte AP priced at almost double the price, at £800? Doesn't make sense to me.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Above the préciso ( or replacing it ) and below the Vario . Game changer for the home user and features in that price bracket. You have a 40mm conical grinder and a 58 mm fault burr one. Pretty well differentiated to me

Forte here is incredibly over priced for want it is ( it's like 699 dollars in USA )


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

Mrboots2u said:


> Above the préciso ( or replacing it ) and below the Vario . Game changer for the home user and features in that price bracket. You have a 40mm conical grinder and a 58 mm fault burr one. Pretty well differentiated to me
> 
> Forte here is incredibly over priced for want it is ( it's like 699 dollars in USA )


I agree - take the Forte out of consideration and the Sette is starting to make more sense.

Impressively fast for a small conical.


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## scottgough (Feb 9, 2016)

Looking forward to seeing some good reviews on this, a definite game changer at this price point. More interesting for me will be seeing who adopts some of the tech / design into their products. Will we now see a glut of 'grind by weight straight into portafilter' grinders? I hope so, it's been long overdue.


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## malling (Dec 8, 2014)

Mrboots2u said:


> Above the préciso ( or replacing it ) and below the Vario . Game changer for the home user and features in that price bracket. You have a 40mm conical grinder and a 58 mm fault burr one. Pretty well differentiated to me
> 
> Forte here is incredibly over priced for want it is ( it's like 699 dollars in USA )


Yeah true, but americans do not have to pay 20% so in VAT - that said the grinder is excessively overpriced in the UK, in the neighbouring countries is listed at £600

the main reason why we haven't seen weight based grinders yet is that it expensive to make it reliable, consistent, fast and rigid enough for commercial use. Just imagine what Mahlkonig would charge for such a feature


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## jlarkin (Apr 26, 2015)

On the hustle slack somebody said they have a Forte they use for espresso. They were at the scaa and asked at the Baratza stand, should I get rid of it and get a couple of Settes instead? Apparently no, was about the size of it.

Which could still explain why the Forte is there and more expensive...

Don't judge me


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

There are some impressive videos from Chris Coffee with the grinder in use:






Looking very good for a straight grind / tamp pour.


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## bronc (Dec 10, 2012)

Doesn't really say much. My SJ extractions look the same with a non-VST basket. Now that I have one wdt or a similar technique is a must, otherwise 1/3 of the shot is all over my counter.


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

This will be retailed for half the price of the SJ, is an OD grinder with virtually no retention, it is half the size and is much more feature rich. It maybe not as durable, but as a home grinder, that's just great. I'd love to see one of those in the flesh to see what the hype is all about. There is a 43 page long thread of Home Barista about this!


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

43 pages about a grinder no one has used yet ....


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## MediumRoastSteam (Jul 7, 2015)

Mrboots2u said:


> 43 pages about a grinder no one has used yet ....


Almost true. Most of the tread is speculative, and dates from a month ago when not even the prototypes had been sent out for testing.

Recently, some US shops like Chris Coffee and Whole Latte Love, as well as some Coffee Geek and Home Barista members (Dan Ken and Mark Prince) had been evaluating it.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Retailers and two sites that rely heavily on sponsors ...

Hb commercial guideline are pretty strict on equipment


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## "coffee 4/1" (Sep 1, 2014)

Hb are making all the right noises to want one, it will certainly looks slick on the work top.


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## Dallah (Jan 31, 2015)

So it's now on Coffeehit website priced at £428, although not in stock yet. Has anyone seen any impartial reviews? I hope it lives up to the hype. Put it next to my Sage DB and listen to the howls of derision.


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## DiscoYou (Jul 27, 2015)

Do we have any idea when they are going to be shipping in the UK?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

DiscoYou said:


> Do we have any idea when they are going to be shipping in the UK?


Why not ask a supplier like coffee omega or coffeehit


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## NickdeBug (Jan 18, 2015)

Coffee Hit website says "register interest for shipping in September"


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

this must be due out soon?


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## Kyle T (Jan 6, 2016)

I thought Baratza announced a while back there would be a delay and that they are looking closer to end of October/November for release?


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## CantGetNoSleep (Sep 4, 2016)

Any UK / Euro price yet?


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

£499 on Coffeehit for the weigh version apparently


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

NickdeBug said:


> Coffee Hit website says "register interest for shipping in September"


Now changed to shipping in January


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## steveholt (Jan 6, 2016)

Would anyone smarter than I care to try interpret Jim Schulman (on Home Barista) comments on the Sette's ability to 'change flow' while not changing extraction??

His model for this seems to be built upon the idea that fines only modulating flowrates, and are not impacting taste beyond the fines' contribution to mouthfeel.

This seems to fly in the face of the leading model of the EK43 where we 'know' it has an unusually tight distribution of grinds at peak size, and is accompanied with a larger total number of fines than other grinders.

While the EKs mechanism of (extr)action is not agreed upon, what is seen in the cup is that EK shots are faster flowing, full of flavour, at measurably higher extraction and are noted for a relative lack of mouthfeel.

Taking the above two worldviews together, I am having difficulty wrapping my head around how he cans state that the sette can be seen to modulate flowrate, but 'not extraction' (and thus I infer, does not modulate taste) in the 'espresso range', or how he can observe the sensation of such on his palate and not see if it correlates to any objective measure of extraction.

I guess one way it could work is that the magic of the EK is down to narrow distribution of peak size, where the EKs fines are so fine the do not impact flow rate - so we get fast flowing shots, but with a lack of mouthfeel due to............?????


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

I think you're wasting your time trying to compare the Sette & EK-43.

The EK tends to be set finer for the same shot parameters, it's not a given that it makes more fines with respect to the median, or mode.

It's possible that the Sette hit its ceiling of extraction in the context of Jim Schulman's shots, going coarser or finer (over a reasonable range) may not have greatly impacted.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

I don't get what schulman is trying propose either . If and when if get my hands on one , then I'll make my own mind up in its in the cup performance v £ value against an Ek.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

he is selling it.....


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

dfk41 said:


> he is selling it.....


?


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## steveholt (Jan 6, 2016)

MWJB said:


> I think you're wasting your time trying to compare the Sette & EK-43.
> 
> The EK tends to be set finer for the same shot parameters, it's not a given that it makes more fines with respect to the median, or mode.
> 
> It's possible that the Sette hit its ceiling of extraction in the context of Jim Schulman's shots, going coarser or finer (over a reasonable range) may not have greatly impacted.


I am not trying to compare the EK and the Sette. I am trying to understand Jim's claims in the context of what is the current state of knowledge on grinders and their effect on extraction wrt espresso.

If we leave aside the state of fines in the EK43. We know that the EK has a tight range of sizes for the 'selected' grind size, and that changing this grind size will change flow rate and extraction.

We all implicitly accept that for espresso grinders in general, when we change the space between burrs, we change the flow rate and extraction of the resultant shot.

Coming from this worldview, the statement that the changes in grind setting on the Sette changes flowrates but does not change extraction really irks me. It's a question, that would beg someone to measure these seemingly unchanged extractions.

Furthermore - what is implied by saying that Jim is 'selling' it?? Does he have a financial interest in the sette/baratza?


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

steveholt said:


> I am not trying to compare the EK and the Sette. I am trying to understand Jim's claims in the context of what is the current state of knowledge on grinders and their effect on extraction wrt espresso.
> 
> If we leave aside the state of fines in the EK43. We know that the EK has a tight range of sizes for the 'selected' grind size, and that changing this grind size will change flow rate and extraction.
> 
> ...


Changing the grind size changes shot time, but it only changes extraction if it changes extraction. If, say, you can only hit a small range of extractions at your highest extraction/brew ratio, then grind & shot time might vary, but your actual extraction may not change significantly. Too coarse & you under-extract, finer & you extract more (maybe just a little in this case?), finer still & you under extract again, despite longer timed shots. Finer still/overdosed, you might even get massive edge channelling a low extraction & faster shot.

Nobody really seems to have any useful info on "flow rates" for espresso, I don't know why this factor is discussed as much as it is as some kind of diagnostic. I may have missed it, but I didn't see any shot data, in terms of brew ratio, dose & time for each shot so we can only speculate on the scenario, and each shot, as it is. We have no details of any of the extractions at all.


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## steveholt (Jan 6, 2016)

MWJB said:


> Changing the grind size changes shot time, but it only changes extraction if it changes extraction. If, say, you can only hit a small range of extractions at your highest extraction/brew ratio, then grind & shot time might vary, but your actual extraction may not change significantly. Too coarse & you under-extract, finer & you extract more (maybe just a little in this case?), finer still & you under extract again, despite longer timed shots. Finer still/overdosed, you might even get massive edge channelling a low extraction & faster shot.
> 
> Nobody really seems to have any useful info on "flow rates" for espresso, I don't know why this factor is discussed as much as it is as some kind of diagnostic. *I may have missed it, but I didn't see any shot data, in terms of brew ratio, dose & time for each shot so we can only speculate on the scenario, and each shot, as it is. We have no details of any of the extractions at all*.


Bolding mine.

I didn't see any details either. Just very curious if I was 'missing' something.

Re: Flow. I think flow can be seen (generally) as a proxy for water contact time in puck. Keeping dose, and brew ratio the same, but grinding increasingly finer will give us shots that take a long time to hit target brew ratio. If this time is 'too long' (say a minute on a non OPV corrected gaggia classic for example) , our shot tends to taste seriously over-extracted. If we grind way too course, water moves through puck very quickly. We have low water contact time and our shot will be thin and under extracted.

What Jim seems to be saying is that - for some set of parameters, on some machine, at some grind settings ..all of which are undisclosed - that changing grind setting is seen to speed up or slow down flow, but this is not changing extraction.

I guess this can be valid *if* the range in which he is changing grind setting is quite small and this range is still in an extraction sweet spot, which if this is the case - why has he not reported out any useful supporting information, or objective measurements?

Thanks for bouncing this comprehension exercise back and forth by the way.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

He has been quite outspoken with regards to existing methods of objective measurement. In other words, it ain't gonna happen.


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## Nikko (Aug 20, 2014)

It is not easy to understand what he's saying - the possibility that it is load of bol..cks should not be discounted.


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## steveholt (Jan 6, 2016)

MWJB said:


> He has been quite outspoken with regards to existing methods of objective measurement. In other words, it ain't gonna happen.


I know *he* isn't going to measure extraction/TDS of his drinks - I don't mind him following his palate (and tbf, there is merit in his QC vs PCS argument), but even in his gushing about the Strega he gave the readers some directions (shot conditions) wrt how to replicate his experiences. His claims re: the Sette really beg further objective investigation/characterisation, even by a 3rd party.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

It is a sales pitch......how many Strega owners would there be on HB without his help.....take a distinctly under average machine and big it up


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## steveholt (Jan 6, 2016)

As in he owns/has an interest in an retailer, or as in he has been potentially bought off, or as in HB has been encouraged to publish a good review??

Genuinely curious.

Eureka grinders seem to have strega type cache on this forum, for example.

Could it just be the case of a 'forum' bigwig's positive opinion organically stimulating sales?


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

steveholt said:


> As in he owns/has an interest in an retailer, or as in he has been potentially bought off, or as in HB has been encouraged to publish a good review??
> 
> Genuinely curious.
> 
> ...


There is no evidence to suggest he had been bought off or that he works for Baratza , how a person views reviews like this on there own is a function of how cynical your world view is to some degree . But This is a £300 coffee grinder we are talking about here not watergate . Take all reviews with a pinch of salt and you'll be ok . If there are enough reviews of a similar nature to suggest that there is a consensus ( good or bad ) around a product then hey perhaps there is consensus around a product .

Apart from that it's just not worth anyone getting they knickers in a twist about .


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Mrboots2u said:


> There is no evidence to suggest he had been bought off or that he works for Baratza , how a person views reviews like this on there own is a function of how cynical your world view is to some degree . But This is a £300 coffee grinder we are talking about here not watergate . Take all reviews with a pinch of salt and you'll be ok . If there are enough reviews of a similar nature to suggest that there is a consensus ( good or bad ) around a product then hey perhaps there is consensus around a product .
> 
> Apart from that it's just not worth anyone getting they knickers in a twist about .


Personally I prefer boxers....anyone who is swayed by the threads from over the water is daft. America is a commercial world where the $ rules and everything has its price. It is the way they do things, which is a little different to us. Makes me wonder why the L1 was never reviewed by one of their top table team


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Guys we have a problem there is a guy in the uk who has uncovered the international coffee conspiracy and iS about to unmask schulman As the illuminati wizard ... Send in the hitmen ......

Crap wrong forum ....


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## steveholt (Jan 6, 2016)

I'm just curious if I missed anything else, or historical context.

Cheers anyway folks.


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## Kyle T (Jan 6, 2016)

So a fair few people over at home-barista are beginning to receive their Sette 270/270w grinders, overall seems really well received. However i went to Coffeehits website and they now list it as "back in stock date 26-01-2017" so me still might have quite a wait for one of these.


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## Craig-R872 (Apr 4, 2016)

I too are waiting patiently. Hope it lives up to all the hype! I have cleared a space ready too.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

I think US coffee forums certainly take a different view on certain products. I don't know about specifics made in this thread, but certainly many people involved.. tend to earn money from the industry. As for this particular grinder I would hope people would have learned from the Vario when it came out. I finally got to review a vario some time after it was launched and my own opinion of it was that it had certain problems and the potential for problems, was not as fantastic a grinder as claimed and didn't produce as good a grind as claimed..

I did get accused of rubbishing it because "it wasn't an impartial review it was a sales review and Bella Barista didn't really sell them, just pretended to" and loads of other crap like that. But BB did sell them and still sell them....so go figure.

This Sette may be fantastic, it may not be, but people should really wait until someone competent gets to review one, someone who isn't in a position of gain (for a positive or negative review). This way, only personal bias comes into play.

New owners will love it because (and this goes for any new product not just grinders):

1. They never used anything better

2. They bought it and see it through new owners glasses, have not had a problem yet

3. Want to justify their decision

4. realise it's a dog, but don't want to damage resale value.

5. Once they have sold it, don't want to say anything negative about it (because it makes them look bad)

After what happened with the Vario, I wouldn't be rushing to get one of these. Wait and see how it pans out for a year or two. There is nothing wrong with a used SJ, or other commercial grade grinder...in fact you have to be real careful with "domestic" grinders.

As for me, unfortunately after enough people on forums get them before an impartial review, it becomes difficult to review. I had a lot of "hate" after the Vario review and didn't enjoy the experience. Manufacturers also get rather upset. I had one of the BTC machine manufacturers very unhappy with me a while ago, because I really didn't like their machine and told them why. Will it ever get published...no of course not, for fear of litigation as there is a lot of money involved. Also, all the owners really would hate me with a passion and huge vested interests would be gunning for me. So no published review and there never will be.

*I've even been asked to do an under the table review to be e-mailed to people who ask...and no I'm not going to do that either, because I have a real concern for this large manufacturer taking legal action against me ! *Negative reviews are really hard to do. Of course if you want to understand some of the Issues, go watch my Melitta Varianza tech tour videos and listen very carefully to what I say...there's everything you need to know when trying to choose a BTC machine, it's all there about some other machines, just read between the lines.

It's rather like a certain new roaster....will I ever review it now...no probably not, I think I would politely decline....the user base is already too large and my view is, let them lead the others by the hand. A review would either confirm what they all believe (hence valueless), or bring out points they would rather not hear about, in which case it simply upsets, as the manufacturer is not going to do anything about it. Unlike the Amazon Dalian, where I was able to say it's not good enough, this is what you need to change before I can advise the company I am reviewing it for to stock and sell it.

I do sometimes think we are too willing to jump on the latest thing...


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

I'd like to see more grinders/ opinions out in the wild before i buy into some of the hyperbole around this grinder .

Better than an ek / k10is bold claim .


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## Dallah (Jan 31, 2015)

I think Dave makes a very good point. Especially here in the U.K. with our libel and slander legislation, before you go and accuse a person or manufacturer of anything, you best have all your facts completely locked down. Even then, and again Dave has pointed this out, if they decide to get litigious and have the money to spend on legal fees they could litigate you into bankruptcy. Sure you might be right but it's a Pyrrhic victory at best.

Stick to the facts and make sure you do not imply or state that anyone has done anything untoward.


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## Kyle T (Jan 6, 2016)

@DavecUK I understand what you are saying but I meant that the paying public have started to receive their orders and it is well received by most of them, though not everyone has had a great experience so far with one person saying after owning the machine for only 1 day it developed a fault where it would just run the grinder constantly for no reason. He had it replaced. Like all new things they will have teething problems. But the problem is I want all new things! If I eventually get my kitchen sorted to accommodate a larger grinder than i have now I will take a punt on the Sette knowing the risks.

I think all reviews have to be taken with a pinch of salt, after all it is purely someones opinion and its the buyers responsibility to gather as much info as they require to help with buying any product.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Kyle T said:


> @DavecUK I understand what you are saying but I meant that the paying public have started to receive their orders and it is well received by most of them, though not everyone has had a great experience so far with one person saying after owning the machine for only 1 day it developed a fault where it would just run the grinder constantly for no reason. He had it replaced. Like all new things they will have teething problems. But the problem is I want all new things! If I eventually get my kitchen sorted to accommodate a larger grinder than i have now I will take a punt on the Sette knowing the risks.
> 
> I think all reviews have to be taken with a pinch of salt, after all it is purely someones opinion and its the buyers responsibility to gather as much info as they require to help with buying any product.


Sure, but remember exactly the same happened with the Vario...


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Here is a little video that might be worth a look.....

[video=youtube;-VC2fXkujIw]






After watching the video, think hard about how the grinder works mechanically, the rather unique top burr spins, not the bottom.....also why this may not be a fantastic solution over the long term, compared to the normal conical burr motor arrangement..


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

DavecUK said:


> Here is a little video that might be worth a look.....
> 
> [video=youtube;-VC2fXkujIw]


Why would that be a disadvantage over the machine driving a flat burr by the same mechanism (belt?)

How much wobble is an issue, how much wobble are we seeing?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

MWJB said:


> Why would that be a disadvantage over the machine driving a flat burr by the same mechanism (belt?)
> 
> How much wobble is an issue, how much wobble are we seeing?


Looks like quite a lot if you watch it all the way through and listen really hard to what the guy is saying.....as for how much is an issue, that's for potential new owners to decide for themselves...personally I'd prefer to see a lot less, or none. I wouldn't find it acceptable to me and would worry that it will get worse over time.

The mechanical issues would take too long for me to explain.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

The wobble in conical burr hand grinders seems to be less of an issue...and some wobble way more than that but still make great cups at coarser settings, maybe it's traded off against the grind distribution becoming tighter at coarse settings?


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

I've been reading the threads on HB and some people are having great success with it, and others coming across problems like the burr wobble or inconsistent shots / trouble dialling in. At least one member there has it against a K10.

This is really troubling:

"After the first few pounds of coffee, the grind produced at the lowest setting may not be fine enough for espresso. To shift the grind range finer, a small washer (included) can be installed below the cone burr."

I do have to commend Baratza though as begin one of the few companies actually trying to produce a prosumer grinder at a reasonable price point. Hopefully it paves the way for more improvements and better grinders to come.


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