# Starting refurb on another 2013 Classic



## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

First job was to replace the bulb in the brew switch.

Following closely the excellent video by Naprawa, which anyone that has worked on the Classic switches will know.






A very fiddly job but managed it eventually.

Starting the strip down and checking of all parts next.

Photos to come in a day or two.

Dropped lucky with another one owner from new machine again.


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## Blue_Cafe (Jun 22, 2020)

What are the boiler innards like on these old aluminium machines after 8 years sat in water?


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Scaled up and need a fair bit of cleaning.

Mind you 8 years is relatively young for Classics that most people want.


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## Blue_Cafe (Jun 22, 2020)

ratty said:


> Scaled up and need a fair bit of cleaning.
> 
> Mind you 8 years is relatively young for Classics that most people want.


 I look forwards to your reports. Most interesting


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## Blue_Cafe (Jun 22, 2020)

just on the bulb thing. Could this be changed for LEDS?


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Not sure about that one?

Electrickery not really my forte, I avoid where possible!

Purely a Mechanical man. 🤣


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

Blue_Cafe said:


> just on the bulb thing. Could this be changed for LEDS?


 LEDs typically run off of DC, so you would need an AC to DC transformer and LED driver stuffed somewhere in the case.

Not impossible I imagine, but it's annoying and doesn't seem worth it.

Those switches are hell though. They're the one item on the machine that's almost not worth servicing as they have itty-bitty pieces. That video ratty linked is super helpful but I give an additional tip: tape the switches quite tightly as you definitely don't want them popping out.

Are the 2019 switches better to maintain?


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

I agree with you there phario.

The first Classic I had, as I removed the switch bank from the machine it exploded firing everything everywhere, never to work again!


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

So a couple of pics from the first job on the 2013 Classic;

As mentioned the case needs to be taped especially well, I taped and then used strong elastic bands on top of the tape too!

First picture shows the brew switch removed and the bulb needing replacing.

Second picture shows the switch bank back together at last!


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## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

Having done hundreds of Classics I would say it is better to buy something for cheap as not working and have a room to make a proper refurbishment. One from yesterday made in 2001, internals were like new, and the pump was dead!


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

L&R said:


> Having done hundreds of Classics I would say it is better to buy something for cheap as not working and have a room to make a proper refurbishment. One from yesterday made in 2001, internals were like new, and the pump was dead!


 Wise words from L&R .

I bet out of the hundreds you have worked on in your business, you've not had many boilers as clean as that one?

This was the 2013 I'm refurbing;


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

OPV and Solenoid stripped down and cleaned and lubricated

Steam Valve removed and new gasket fitted and lubricated

All new Stainless steel bolts, marine grade fitted with food grade anti-seize and lubricating paste.

New o rings fitted with molykote 111.

New Cafelet silicon seal.

Tomorrow will cut hole for the front oil filled pressure gauge.


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## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

This one i acceptable. A small advice from me, never disconnect leads from the main switch this way you won;t need to write on them.


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

I'm going to hijack this thread for a question. Have any of you had to reflare the ends of the ptfe tubes? See below image. This is for the pump to OPV section.

Is it important to reflare?

Also, have any of you bought temperature resistant water tubing? Can you advise on a type and source?


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

L&R said:


> This one i acceptable. A small advice from me, never disconnect leads from the main switch this way you won;t need to write on them.


 Not a problem to write on wire connections for me but thanks for the tip and it could be useful. However, writing on the connections makes it easier for some persons who want to refurbish their own machines and if they are like me, a bit electric 'blind', it may help

It's not seen once the top is on!

Just trying to open up information to all comers. I had enough years working with 'engineers' that liked to keep information secret, so they were the only ones that could do the particular job.

More tips tomorrow that I've found might make life a little easier for those people that might want to buy a used Classic and work on it themselves.


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

phario said:


> I'm going to hijack this thread for a question. Have any of you had to reflare the ends of the ptfe tubes? See below image. This is for the pump to OPV section.
> 
> Is it important to reflare?
> 
> ...


 I just rounded it off with pliers and have never had a problem with leakage afterwards.

I've not bought temperature resistant tubing, if you find a source please share


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

ratty said:


> I just rounded it off with pliers and have never had a problem with leakage afterwards.
> 
> I've not bought temperature resistant tubing, if you find a source please share


 Here is a video of how the pipe can be flared.

I do wonder to what extent we need to worry about this if not properly seated. I noticed my opv side tube leaking. I think it wasn't seated well and the heat combined with improper screwing did this. It's not a big deal, but in general because the compression fitting uses that flared end, I guess I should try and produce a proper lip.

This video explains how it might me done.


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Oil filled pressure gauge is now fitted.

Lots of original Classic portafilters do come slightly loose after time.

This can be problematic to fix.

I suggest replacing the M6 x 16mm Flange head hexagon bolt. These bolts have a tendency to seriously corrode and 'lock' into the female thread.

What I try and do is remove the plastic end cap of the handle, stand the portafilter up on its head and squirt some GT85 into and around the bolt head overnight. It's also worth hitting the bolt head with a bar and hammer to try and break the 'seal'.

You will need a thin 10mm socket as a normal socket will not fit onto the hexagon, it's OD is too big and fouls on the plastic handle!

This is when the head could shear off from the bolt and leave the thread still in the portafilter but at least you can pull off the handle!

I was lucky today and managed to remove the bolt see pics.

The new bolt is like I said M6 x 16mm.

I just bought stainless steel and also some zinc plated steel bolts to compare them.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/M5-M6-M8-M10-FLANGED-HEXAGON-HEAD-BOLTS-FLANGE-HEX-SCREWS-A2-STAINLESS-STEEL/282418747553?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=581554381802&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

The stainless did not have the serrated flange like the Zinc plated ones did, although serrations were shown in the sales pictures. Could I be arsed to follow it up for £3 odd quid? Not really!

This is where a decent anti-seize and lubricating paste comes into its own when fitting the new bolt. I use Rocol Foodlube Multipaste on both threads as per instructions.


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

Another liquid filled shock_waves_shop one, ratty? You happy with this one as well? It looks like it's centred about the left power switchbank edge---perhaps more centred than your last refurb. Have you considered putting it slightly lower on the machine or too risky?

I guess to remove the portafilter handle you need some specific tools (mainly a long 10mm socket). What about those portafilters where the back (handle side) doesn't have a hole?

I enjoy these threads. I would suggest that you 'backlink' your other threads in the first post of this one (and every subsequent one) using a bulletted list. I guess we can all learn something from each machine, and it helps. keep all the previous threads sorted as your adventure continues.


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

phario said:


> Another liquid filled shock_waves_shop one, ratty? You happy with this one as well? It looks like it's centred about the left power switchbank edge---perhaps more centred than your last refurb. Have you considered putting it slightly lower on the machine or too risky?
> 
> I guess to remove the portafilter handle you need some specific tools (mainly a long 10mm socket). What about those portafilters where the back (handle side) doesn't have a hole?
> 
> I enjoy these threads. I would suggest that you 'backlink' your other threads in the first post of this one (and every subsequent one) using a bulletted list. I guess we can all learn something from each machine, and it helps. keep all the previous threads sorted as your adventure continues.


 Yes as you say a shock waves gauge.

Could go slightly lower but I don't think it makes a big difference. It's also slightly more centred as you say.

You need a spark plug type socket for the portafilter bolt (only thing I use it on!)

Will look at what you suggest tomorrow with linking threads.


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Following on from this thread the previous refurbishment threads by ratty were;

Wasn't sure how to link to all posts so added a post here!

There are also some earlier refurbishing Classic posts by me probably can be found in the search facility.



Refurbishing 2001 Classic


https://coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/52034-refurbishing-2001-classic/#comments


Gaggia Classic 2013 refurb


https://coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/52816-gaggia-classic-2013-refurb/?tab=comments#comment-753575


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

New rancilio Sylvia steam wand arrived.

I just need to change the gaggia steam wand nut, for the nut on the new wand and it's a straight swop then. Lots of videos available to see the procedure.

Also arrived now, an ordered steam thermostat.

This is an upgraded thermostat at 155°C rather than the original that was 145°C.

The new one allows some more steam for improved frothing. The wire connections can go either way round on the steam thermostat.


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Not a good day really!

Put everything together to test out machine and brew light failed to come on although it was activating.

Removed and stripped down switch bank again.

A small spring had not located correctly when I put it back together and had become jammed inside the steam switch.

All good now after a few hours of head scratching 😲😅😒😌😁


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## Mulligrub (Jun 24, 2020)

Looking good.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

Those darn switches again.

Is it my imagine or is the case for this one a bit more scratches up?

Out of curiosity have you tried to refinish cases (by wet sanding?). Not much talk about that around these parts.


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

phario said:


> Those darn switches again.
> 
> Is it my imagine or is the case for this one a bit more scratches up?
> 
> Out of curiosity have you tried to refinish cases (by wet sanding?). Not much talk about that around these parts.


 Bit scratched up but seems to be the order of the day at the moment. I'd guess it's down to owners trying to clean them before selling and not researching methodology. Shows up when the light catches them but looking face on they disappear by eye sight!

Arthritis in both hands makes it painful sanding etc, so I don't do it! 😀


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Classic running well now.

Here's a short video with the slim drip tray and scales underneath.

I have the two drip trays with the machine and the two different lengths stainless steel exhaust tubes

More pics to follow!

(video a bit larger than I wanted!) Edited now!

https://streamable.com/t828m0


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Checking the OPV pressure with blind basket in the portafilter

https://streamable.com/q1655o


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

Nice! Is that a freshly purchased MrShades slim dip tray, or are you sourcing them yourself? I'm currently undecided of whether I like the expensive stainless steel slim version or the plastic one---certainly the plastic one is growing in popularity.

So this one looks pretty much done? Off to another buyer and then another one?

You getting bored yet? 😴


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Got a couple more in me then will have a break.

I've picked up a 1998 black and gold version for my own use, (at least for a while)

Might buy a new boiler and group head for that one.

It will be like Trigger's 22 year old broom!

Drip tray from MrShades


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

ratty said:


> Got a couple more in me then will have a break.
> 
> I've picked up a 1998 black and gold version for my own use, (at least for a while)
> 
> ...


 I think he is referring to this:






In our case, this is probably what we would call the The Gaggia Classic of Theseus.


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Very Interesting the Theseus paradox.

Although I still think they all copied Trigger! 😲🤣


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Machine has been switched on for at least 5 hours today all is good.

I've checked the new steam wand in water, to not get any milk residue in it.

Everything is working as it should.

I am having a beer now and letting machine cool down.

Will put lid back on and finish off by taking a few pics tomorrow.


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## ratty (Sep 22, 2019)

Going up on Sale thread now.

First pic shows no corrosion at back of Water tank.


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## BBBean (Jul 31, 2020)

Have owned Classic for 13 years with no issues, I am now trying to resurrect the 2012 machine which i bought as a wedding present for my nephew and his wife in 2012. Machine has been out of action for 2 years. He thought the pump had failed.

From tests I've carried out fairly I was sure that it is the solenoid. Tried various attempts to de-calcify but did'nt really improve, so have stripped machine down. Mostly fairly clean but when took solenoid apart the inlet is completely furred up. Thought I might as well do full strip down and replace all seals. However have a problem in that I cannot undo the boiler. Any suggestions?

Also advice on good place to purchase seals welcome

Thanks


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

The four boiler bolts are notoriously bad in terms of corrosion.

Do a search a Google and you'll get a ton of advice. Standard ones are to heat it up with a blowtorch or similar. You can also try better anti-seize liquids (like PB Blaster). Also take a larger punch tool and tap with a hammer to try and shock the bolt and break the corrosion.

If you strip it, you can either cut a slot and try and use a flathead. Or use Torx bits. Or cut the head of the bolts off.

Assuming you want the full set of seals just buy the set off ebay.


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## BBBean (Jul 31, 2020)

Thanks Phario, any particular supplier or they all from similar source. Apologies but as a newbie I seem to have set up two threads. I originally posted this but then couldn't find it so set up a new thread *Gaggia Classic2012 Cleanup*


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## Nightrider_1uk (Apr 26, 2020)

ratty said:


> Not a problem to write on wire connections for me but thanks for the tip and it could be useful. However, writing on the connections makes it easier for some persons who want to refurbish their own machines and if they are like me, a bit electric 'blind', it may help
> 
> It's not seen once the top is on!
> 
> ...


 Very true Ratty. I worked for 35 years in the power Industry, where the motto of a lot of the workers was "I Know But I'm Not Telling You"


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## phario (May 7, 2017)

Nightrider_1uk said:


> Very true Ratty. I worked for 35 years in the power Industry, where the motto of a lot of the workers was "I Know But I'm Not Telling You"


 I was just speaking to my partner about this exact thing.

It's really weird the electricity business. Yes it's true that it can be dangerous working at mains voltage but the information on electrical wiring and principles is so often hidden and frustratingly kept as a 'trade secret'.

@ratty's point about working with engineers is really quite apt and is exactly what bugs me about electrical engineering.

The infuriating thing is that it's often couched as a question of "safety". We're not going to explain to you how something is done because if we do, you might do it yourself.

Instead, it's important to explain how to do it and what parts of the procedure are tricky and dangerous (and why they're tricky and dangerous). Give people the procedures they need to make their own decisions.

Electricity and wiring is often pitched as a "magic" thing that you shouldn't do yourself. Youtube and the Internet has made it a bit easier to find information but it can still be scattered.

As it concerns coffee machines, someone needs to write a clear guide of assembling and wiring a PID from scratch and from components that can be bought on Aliexpress.


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## jj-x-ray (Dec 31, 2017)

phario said:


> I'm going to hijack this thread for a question. Have any of you had to reflare the ends of the ptfe tubes? See below image. This is for the pump to OPV section.
> Is it important to reflare?
> Also, have any of you bought temperature resistant water tubing? Can you advise on a type and source?
> <img alt="IMG_20200716_170859.thumb.jpg.fe860df8dfedf952dd4a1e1390492593.jpg" data-fileid="42897" data-src="<fileStore.core_Attachment>/monthly_2020_07/IMG_20200716_170859.thumb.jpg.fe860df8dfedf952dd4a1e1390492593.jpg" src="https://www.coffeeforums.co.uk/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png">


The flaring is caused by the ferrules. It's not something you need to create yourself. If you have a problem of leaking from a refitted ferrule then you should cut the plastic pipe back square to a non flared bit...then refit

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


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## Nightrider_1uk (Apr 26, 2020)

phario said:


> I was just speaking to my partner about this exact thing.
> 
> It's really weird the electricity business. Yes it's true that it can be dangerous working at mains voltage but the information on electrical wiring and principles is so often hidden and frustratingly kept as a 'trade secret'.
> 
> ...


 All domestic stuff is based on BS7671 which is available online. (It ain't cheap though even to the trade). All joking aside though, 240v can and will kill if not respected; You will be surprised the amount of people that don't understand that. I've unplugged a table lamp in somebody's house before now and found myself just holding the plug, no cord attached. To make matters worse, the insulation was stripped right back to the cable grip, which was extremely loose, (thats why I ended up just holding the plug) good job I switched it off at the socket first.

I understand that most people on this thread fully understand that poking about under the cover of a Classic whilst it was switched on is extremely dangerous so no Slur was meant to members on this forum here.

Good point about wiring the PID. A list of the optimum settings would be good. I need to tweak mine when I get time so will be asking for the optimum settings for the REX C100 later. (Once i've sorted its issue out).


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## Blue_Cafe (Jun 22, 2020)

Nightrider_1uk said:


> All domestic stuff is based on BS7671 which is available online. (It ain't cheap though even to the trade). All joking aside though, 240v can and will kill if not respected; You will be surprised the amount of people that don't understand that. I've unplugged a table lamp in somebody's house before now and found myself just holding the plug, no cord attached. To make matters worse, the insulation was stripped right back to the cable grip, which was extremely loose, (thats why I ended up just holding the plug) good job I switched it off at the socket first.
> 
> I understand that most people on this thread fully understand that poking about under the cover of a Classic whilst it was switched on is extremely dangerous so no Slur was meant to members on this forum here.
> 
> Good point about wiring the PID. A list of the optimum settings would be good. I need to tweak mine when I get time so will be asking for the optimum settings for the REX C100 later. (Once i've sorted its issue out).


 It worries me no end that espresso machine hacks are sometimes encouraged to one and all as easy without much in the way of warning or highlighting of risks, not least of which can be death.

A pressurised, electrified boiler is not a forgiving machine.


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