# Vibiemme Domobar or Bezzera BZ07 or £2.99 plastic cup filter - newbie help required!!



## mark.drums

Good evening!

Like many, I have gone from looking at Gaggias to Silvias, and have become thoroughly confused by the comments about stepping up to HX / double boiler machines...

What I want to do is make myself three or four espressos or americanos a day, and the wife a few lattes. Then be able to cater for the infrequent family invasion. I think I have the grinder sorted out. I am really struggling with a machine. Or do I stick with the 'over the cup' plastic jobbie and filter paper?!!

Criteria:

-something with a small footprint

-something that has good solid components, particularly a brass boiler

-I can get it repaired in this country (UK)

-Ideally under a grand

-opportunity to boil milk for hot chocolates, etc

The Vibiemme Domobar single boiler and 'Junior' double boiler have small footprints. Lovely looking machines as well.

The Bezzera BZ07 is difficult to get in the UK - a price quoted to me was £1000 (yes - a grand!) more than the price in EU - Germany for example. I am concerned about the operation of the guarantee and whether it is complex to fit a UK plug on a continental machine though.

Have any of you bought your equipment from the continent?

Any thoughts on Vibiemmes or Bezzeras? I'd love to hear from you...

Thanks

Mark


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## Glenn

If the budget will allow then the Vibiemme is certainly head and shoulders above the Classic or Silvia.

There are UK suppliers for these machines, and servicing / repair is not an issue

Almost all espresso machines with a steam wand are capable to steaming milk for hot chocolates (the hardest choice you will have is powder or syrup to start from)

Try to avoid continental imports (cheaper models of UK machines) - check their power rating, plugs and fuses etc too


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## mark.drums

Thanks.

I am intending to make my mind up and order something by the end of this week.


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## RisingPower

Izzo vivi perhaps?

http://www.bellabarista.co.uk/coffeemachines/izzo-vivi-mk-ii.asp

Or the izzo alex for a little more?

http://www.bellabarista.co.uk/coffeemachines/izzo-alex-mk-ii.asp

When you said you had the grinder sorted, what did you have in mind?


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## BanishInstant

Great - a nice thread to watch to see how it develops.

What about the Expobar machines such as the Expobar Leva Dual Boiler?


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## mark.drums

Rising Power:

I am purchasing a Vario grinder from a friend. Hope to be picking it up weekend after next.

I have looked at the Izzos and Expobars with interest, and haven't discounted them, but the size of the Vibiemmes is a major plus for me. Ridiculous as it sounds, the Vibiemme's inch-smaller size is significant for me.

This is what it comes down to:

-Vibiemme Domobar single boiler machine is less than £700 from UK supplier.

-Bezzera BZ07 is about the same price, but from Germany. So it doesnt have a UK plug!

-Vibiemme double boiler is about £1200, ffom a UK supplier. This is above my budget but if having two boilers will make a significant difference in terms of ease of use and speed of use and flexibility I will stretch myself and get it.

However if someone said that the single boiler is 'more than you will ever need', than I will get on the phone, order the Vibi and will have it for the weekend. From the amount of forum debates about single/HX/double merits, though, I will need a lot of convincing - but I'd appreciate it if users on here have the time to help me out...

Thanks!


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## BanishInstant

You need to think about how many milk drinks you need to bang out, or how long you want to wait to steam the milk. A double boiler is what I am looking for because 80% of the time we have lattes in my household. A good HX machine is also being considered. From my experience, and watching YouTube, I don't want to wait to steam milk and therefore I have eliminated a single boiler (as my current machine).


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## DavidS

Francino Cherub (HX) + rocky grinder comes well under budget (so money for accessories etc.) and should be capable... ???


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## mark.drums

DavidS said:


> Francino Cherub (HX) + rocky grinder comes well under budget (so money for accessories etc.) and should be capable... ???


It is apparently a great machine, but is absolutely huge! Too big for my kitchen.


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## RisingPower

Isn't the expobar leva the same width even with the dual boiler? Though, an inch is a bit of an odd issue to have









I think you should really rule out single boiler machines, it's just not practical for large volumes of milk drinks or americanos.

I also think you'd have to consider the domobar super, the other ones seem to have tiny boilers which will have no temperature stability whatsoever. I mean a 0.5 litre brew boiler?!?!


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## mark.drums

RisingPower - thanks for the advice. This has thrown me a bit, as when I spoke to the sellers of the Domobar Jr, I used my 'I want a machine that will enable me to serve x drinks' line - so that the seller was recommending a setup - not me saying "I want this machine..."

Two stockists of Vibiemme said that the Domobar single boiler at 0.75l would cater perfectly adequately for me. One may argue that they would say that - they want to sell their stock.

So, do I spend the £700 now, or go with a Bezzera from Germany at the same price (the BZ07 is an HX machine).

Regarding your comment about the 0.5 liter brew boiler - I take your point, but surely they wouldn't make a machine that cannot justify its hefty price tag? Or is that naive of me?

Btw, The Expobar Leva is a good inch and a half wider, and 3 inches taller than the Vibiemme! (Trying and failing to think of a witty 'how do you use that inch' comment...)


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## RisingPower

Did you say in a line or over the course of the day? I just think if you were to draw off enough water for an americano it would take time for the boiler to recover.

I think it could justify its hefty price tag, it's a well built, nice looking, very good machine, but as to whether you could use it to reliably produce a large number of drinks in succession is another matter. I think it would struggle, but I wouldn't mind being proved wrong.

You're basically talking the difference between the alex with it's 2.6 litre boiler in the mk2 dual water, or the mk2 duetto with the .8 litre brew boiler and 1.8 litre steam boiler (I think the hot tap comes off the heat exchanger between the steam boiler and brew boiler so you always have masses of hot steam/water to play with)

I guess in your case it may be how you use those inches that matters







The only thing that struck me about the bezzera was that hot water tap and that it's not a proper e61 brewhead, how are you supposed to get a cup under the hot water tap?


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## mark.drums

RisingPower said:


> Did you say in a line or over the course of the day? I just think if you were to draw off enough water for an americano it would take time for the boiler to recover.
> 
> I think it could justify its hefty price tag, it's a well built, nice looking, very good machine, but as to whether you could use it to reliably produce a large number of drinks in succession is another matter. I think it would struggle, but I wouldn't mind being proved wrong.
> 
> You're basically talking the difference between the alex with it's 2.6 litre boiler in the mk2 dual water, or the mk2 duetto with the .8 litre brew boiler and 1.8 litre steam boiler (I think the hot tap comes off the heat exchanger between the steam boiler and brew boiler so you always have masses of hot steam/water to play with)
> 
> I guess in your case it may be how you use those inches that matters
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The only thing that struck me about the bezzera was that hot water tap and that it's not a proper e61 brewhead,* how are you supposed to get a cup under the hot water tap?*


I agree about the Bezzera hot water outlet. I presume you use a thimble under the tap.

In terms of drink quantities - an espresso or two in the morning, a couple of americanos for Elevenses(!!!), two lattes or cappuccinos in the afternoon. That would be the standard demand.

In terms of infrequent extras - the option to do a selection of drinks that visitors like (in my experience they like milk-based drinks) - so americanos with a bit of hot milk, cappus, lattes etc- it would be nice do cater for a dinner party of,say, four to six guests.


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## ChiarasDad

Pardon my inexperience - is there a technical reason to draw hot water from the machine rather than pouring from a kettle? (As I have a teensy-boilered Gaggia the kettle's a much better option for me for preheating cups, etc., but I'm curious about what I would be looking for should I someday move up to a more deluxe machine.)


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## RisingPower

ChiarasDad said:


> Pardon my inexperience - is there a technical reason to draw hot water from the machine rather than pouring from a kettle? (As I have a teensy-boilered Gaggia the kettle's a much better option for me for preheating cups, etc., but I'm curious about what I would be looking for should I someday move up to a more deluxe machine.)


It's convenient? Especially for americanos.

It's just handy to have larger boilers so you can just knock out lattes/americanos/milk drinks consistently with ease when you have guests imo. Might be overkill but I prefer it


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## mark.drums

Well, as you might be able to see from my sig, I am the proud owner of a Vibiemme Domobar Junior double boiler machine.

Thanks for the advice. I am now enjoying coffee on a significantly different level from the freeze-dried granule stuff I used to drink!

I am off for a day's barista training at the end of the month. All's good so far...


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## ChiarasDad

Congratulations!


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## sandykt

"Well, as you might be able to see from my sig, I am the proud owner of a Vibiemme Domobar Junior double boiler machine."

Don't forget to post a pic of your set up on the My Set Up Thread - then we can all have a look at your new machine.

Enjoy.


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## mark.drums

Will do - does it require a photobucket page, or something similar?


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## sandykt

Upload your photos in to My Documents on your computer and follow instructions when you get into the Thread. You will get there. If I can do it....


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## Glenn

Nice machine, a pleasure to use. You're sure to get years of enjoyment from it

PM me if you get stuck uploading any images


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## BanishInstant

A very nice machine - well done!


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## DonRJ

Wow, straight in at the deep end - dual boiler machine with a relatively small footprint, very nice as Banish says.

Don


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## mark.drums

The small footprint was really significant. I was afraid the wife was going to hate the machine, with its 'knobs and hot metal bits'. Funny, that... she absolutely loves it - it has become part of the kitchen and as we are both spending more time drinking coffee, we are sitting down and chatting more.

Tight - my own grinder next (I am borrowing one at the moment from a neighbour). A toss up between a Vario and a Eureka Mignon. Oh, and a day's barista training at the end of the month.


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## BanishInstant

Any pictures yet?


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## Glenn

Hmmm, my choice is the Vario.


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## mark.drums

My goodness, I am consuming sooo much coffee!!!

I've got a day's barista training coming up; I'll report back with how well I get on.


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