# New to this coffee making and need advice please



## M9G (Jul 10, 2017)

Hi

So I have a delonghi EC820B espresso machine and some Lavazza beans, I grind the beans to fine as I understand this will give me a stronger flavour?

I put it into the filter and compact it down, did read on the instructions the harder i compact it the stronger the taste, Is this true or not necessary to compact it?

I like to fill a mug and then top with cold milk or a bit of steamed milk, what ever i try it just doesnt seem really strong. What is the best way to do this please

Many thanks

M9G


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## GCGlasgow (Jul 27, 2014)

You'll find most people weigh the ground coffee usually 15-18g for a double and lavazza beans may not be fresh, plenty of good online roasters you can try and read about on here.


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## M9G (Jul 10, 2017)

I grind enough to fill a filter to the top but i find the water running through turns clear within a few seconds, is this right coz for some reason i expected the water to stay brown pretty much filling the whole cup.

Should i continue to fill the cup with the water running through the filter or should i run a small amount (til the water turns clear) and then top with boiling water from the kettle?

Im not into the latte's and cappacinos and like a good ol americano, so hows best to make one?

By running a whole mugs worth through one filters worth tastes a bit watery, i expected it to be stronger

The lavazza beans im using are the ones in a red packet from supermarket with rossa on the side and rated a 5


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## RDC8 (Dec 6, 2016)

There's plenty of good advice here ; just keep an open mind on some of the things you might be told! Also, be prepared for some fairly negative opinions on the machine you are using.

Can you provide a bit more information; what sort of grinder do you have? Also, when you say you compact it down, are you using a proper tamper? while the coffee needs to be compacted, the force used is only one of the inputs into the quality of the resulting coffee.

Are you using a single shot or a double shot basket? An americano made from a single-shot espresso will lack the intensity (strength) of a double shot. Single shots use about 7-9 grams of coffee, while doubles will use 16-18 grams.

Have you viewed any youtube clips on the making of espresso/americano? Watching a "hoe to" can be quite beneficial.

Good luch in your journey.



M9G said:


> Hi
> 
> So I have a delonghi EC820B espresso machine and some Lavazza beans, I grind the beans to fine as I understand this will give me a stronger flavour?
> 
> ...


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## Jacko112 (Oct 29, 2015)

If you're filling a mug then I'd consider a v60 with some freshly ground beans


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## Tiny tamper (May 23, 2014)

Jacko112 has given you a brilliant and extremely affordable option there to a good if not brilliant cup o joe.

If however you are looking to get a great espresso you will have to spend a bit more, not the stars and the moon as others will agree, the sage range can supply some brilliant quality for the cash out lay, there are of course other options the gaggia Classic paired with a eureka mignon, another example of an affordable L plate kit, but trickier to master Imo than the sage options.

But all that don't mean a thing with out knowledge and practice = experience, you need to treat coffee as you would any other hobby you won't turn a masterpiece the first time you use a lathe for example it will be a mess and you won't know why or how to stop it happening again unless you research it learn its ways.

Or you can buy a bean to cup machine and let it do it all for you.

All the help you need lyes in this forum no matter what you decide you just need to look about it.


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## M9G (Jul 10, 2017)

Hi Thanks for that. The grinder I have is an electric delonghi one which has number of cups setting on it and lights that come on for course, medium and fine ground.

Im grinding to fine.

The tamper is on the other end of the measuring spoon.

The filter im using is a single, which i believe holds 7grams, there is a changeable filter that is for 2 cups. I think thats where my problem lies. I think for an americano I need to put the 2 cup filter in to get double the shot.

Thanks for your help 

M9G


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## M9G (Jul 10, 2017)

Jacko112 said:


> If you're filling a mug then I'd consider a v60 with some freshly ground beans


Yeah thanks, im not looking to get another machine as ive just got this one but thanks anyway i'll consider this for the future


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Some hard answers here sorry. You are trying to make espresso with not the freshest coffee and a grinder and machine that are not really up to the job, "if you are looking for something beyond a Starbucks latte. Any techniques and skills we try and impart will be hampered by this so its best to keep this in mind when you are doing your technique and skills research.


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## Jacko112 (Oct 29, 2015)

M9G said:


> Yeah thanks, im not looking to get another machine as ive just got this one but thanks anyway i'll consider this for the future


A v60 will cost £5 + filter papers and will give a much cleaner, fresher cup. You can then vary the grind yourself depending on taste levels. http://www.hario.co.uk/hario-v60-dripper-01-white.html

Alot of roasters sell coffee & v60 combos


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## M9G (Jul 10, 2017)

Well thanks for all your help peeps, no its not the preference machine for alot of people and im sure your machines and plastic cups are also not a preference for others, including me.

Ive never owned an espresso machine and was looking for more advice on how to get the best out of the machine i have, mainly techniques of using an espresso machine, amount of powder, tampering, how course the beans should be, Sorry i thought i put this in my original post at the top


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

No problems getting advice in here , again the problem is that it will relate to using a machine and grinder that is capable of having that advice applied to it and being appropriate to it's use.

The espresso machine and grinder you have a consumables, the machine uses a pressurised basket to create a fake crema , the grinder is designed to use with said basket. Even if you can get a non pressurised basket for the machine then you reach the problem that the grinder simply isnt capable of going fine enough or being consistent enough to deliver espresso . I speak from experience , i bought a similar machine at the start of my journey .

So the advice on dose and grind setting will only get you so far , as you as limited by the equipment you have.

Yes the manufacture and consumer websites list these as being able to make espresso and there will be lots of " consumer reviews " telling you so but hey ho....

They will make a brown drink , coffee like, and it potentially tasty, can we sit there talking about dose and brew rates and weighing your coffee to obtain extractions similar to what you see on here ... we can but again to what end given the gear you have .

Anyway to help , try and get the same amount of coffee in the basket each time ( this is why people have scales and weigh ) . It came with a scoop presumably try and accurate with that.

The tamp you have will also be crappy and plastic and ill fitting , but again try an do the same thing with it each time , press until you have no more resistance in the coffee for example .

re how much water you use to make a coffee , it should be based on and proportional to the amount of coffee you are using ...

Perhaps @MWJB may have more time and patience than me with this machine and scenario......Im sure he can help


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

As @MrBoots says, weighing is the key to finding what works & repeating it.

If you're trying to always fill a mug, stop.

Use the double basket, use the same weight of grounds each time (to 0.1g) then try different weights out (twice the ground coffee weight, 3x the ground coffee weight, & so on), see where the coffee tastes best. You can then top up with a weighed amount of hot water & see how much it takes to get the strength how you like, e.g. you might use 16g of coffee, find that a 48g shot tastes good and add 100g of hot water from the kettle for 148g total in the cup? (I have no idea whether these specific weights will work for you, just an illustration, you'll have to do a bit of testing).


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## M9G (Jul 10, 2017)

MWJB said:


> As @MrBoots says, weighing is the key to finding what works & repeating it.
> 
> If you're trying to always fill a mug, stop.
> 
> Use the double basket, use the same weight of grounds each time (to 0.1g) then try different weights out (twice the ground coffee weight, 3x the ground coffee weight, & so on), see where the coffee tastes best. You can then top up with a weighed amount of hot water & see how much it takes to get the strength how you like, e.g. you might use 16g of coffee, find that a 48g shot tastes good and add 100g of hot water from the kettle for 148g total in the cup? (I have no idea whether these specific weights will work for you, just an illustration, you'll have to do a bit of testing).


Ok thanks for that, so it is trial and error depending on personal taste. I have doubled the amount of beans and find a much better coffee than what i was doing.


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## M9G (Jul 10, 2017)

Mrboots2u said:


> No problems getting advice in here , again the problem is that it will relate to using a machine and grinder that is capable of having that advice applied to it and being appropriate to it's use.
> 
> The espresso machine and grinder you have a consumables, the machine uses a pressurised basket to create a fake crema , the grinder is designed to use with said basket. Even if you can get a non pressurised basket for the machine then you reach the problem that the grinder simply isnt capable of going fine enough or being consistent enough to deliver espresso . I speak from experience , i bought a similar machine at the start of my journey .
> 
> ...


Thankyou I appreciate you taking the time to try and explain how to get the best out of my crap machine, trial and error is the key and maybe one day i can get a grown up one, cheers


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## Si macc (May 24, 2017)

Hi M9G, I too have a delonghi machine, I bought before discovering these forums. I have a modified Hario skerton to grind too. I wanted to get the best out of these two before embarking on any upgrades to make sure I really could justify upgrading and have since made a depressurised basket and bottomless portafilter to help. I do weight coffee before and after and time the shot too, so following the normal process as everyone has explained above. This forum along with the barista hustle blog were key to my getting this far. I can say I'm actually quiet pleased with the coffee my basic setup can produce and I'm even creating some very basic latte art! I find 12g for a delonghi double basket worked for me but see what works for you, I also don't tap 30lbs or force, probably half that. Try, try and try again but it is possible to get something drinkable out of a delonghi machine.

I feel now that I can justify an upgrade so am in the process of finding a classic and mignon setup.

If you have any questions I'm more than happy to help.


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## martinc (Sep 17, 2017)

I started with Lavazza beans (memories)! I'd definitely follow the advice re the pour over, and if also say find a good roaster whom you can order coffee beans on demand and it will make all the difference to your results. I recommend hasbean.co.uk, or if you can wait for the roaster's roasting day, try workshop coffee, or even colonna coffee. Good luck!


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## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

Just reading about your machine..



> PROFESSIONAL FILTER HOLDER
> 
> The professional filter holder, with integrated crema device is suitable for ground coffee(1 and 2 cups) and E.S.E. pods.


Which means it's got a pressurised portafilter and not see through baskets?

Also, I get the impression that you are running it until you near enough fill your mug? Instead you should weigh your input (eg 15g of ground coffee) and try to get around double the output (30g from 15g) then top up with water etc. If you are using ore-ground, it will more than likely pee through the portafilter - which isn't good (hence the use of pressurised ones to get a better extraction from pre-ground). Using a grinder to grind fine enough usually ends up in killing the coffee machine...

[video=youtube;Uv-_AJO5Vo0]






This was my old Dualit Espressivo when I used freshly ground coffee in a pressurised portafilter.. It couldn't handle it and blew through the gasket instead! I was a newbie to proper coffee at the time.

A few times when I've been bought Whittards selection boxes, I've put it through the Dualit and filled a cup. It's come out more like brewed this way.

You'll soon get the hang of it, episcopally if you get something like a good, used Gaggia Classic - which is about as basic you can go for a proper coffee machine. All depends on what you want to do.


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

Si macc said:


> Hi M9G, I too have a delonghi machine, I bought before discovering these forums. I have a modified Hario skerton to grind too. I wanted to get the best out of these two before embarking on any upgrades to make sure I really could justify upgrading and have since made a depressurised basket and bottomless portafilter to help. I do weight coffee before and after and time the shot too, so following the normal process as everyone has explained above. This forum along with the barista hustle blog were key to my getting this far. I can say I'm actually quiet pleased with the coffee my basic setup can produce and I'm even creating some very basic latte art! I find 12g for a delonghi double basket worked for me but see what works for you, I also don't tap 30lbs or force, probably half that. Try, try and try again but it is possible to get something drinkable out of a delonghi machine.
> 
> I feel now that I can justify an upgrade so am in the process of finding a classic and mignon setup.
> 
> If you have any questions I'm more than happy to help.


Lots of helpful advice here (and from others too). It is hard to advise (when you can't chat face to face) in many ways as there's such a lot to get across!

Keep practicing, keep a record of weights (beans/espresso out/hot water added) and keep tasting!

Keep us updated


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