# Grinder with the least grind retention



## Steve_S_T (Dec 7, 2012)

I'm generally happy with my MDF at the moment but will upgrade my grinder in the future having seen how much difference it can make simply to the pour through a bottomless PF. The lack of spitting from the basket, in spite of not doing any additional messing with the grounds prior to tamping, on the Slayer at Hasbean Towers was something that only struck me days after I'd been there, but to me it was more noticeable than any taste variation. However (and forgive me I can't remember what grinders we used there), when we came to change coffee we had to discard the first two double shots from the new beans because the first was almost entirely the grounds of the previous beans, and the second was about fifty percent of old and new. This to me is the key element when I do choose the next grinder. I usually have a couple of different beans on the go plus some decaff ones, so I change coffee frequently enough to put me off a machine that retains 3 shots (I don't want to have to discard almost 15% of a bag of beans every time I switch). So, after that lengthy and slightly pointless introduction my question - which grinder retains the least grounds or which grinder makes it easiest to access and brush out all retained grinds?

Thanks,

Steve.


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

I've changed coffees between shots on my supposedly massive grind retention k10 sooo many times, doesn't take more than a few grams, maybe a double at most.

The thing is, you clean it out the chute between shots before pouring more beans in, if you're changing beans.

I think the roburs burr chamber is even bigger though.

If it's really a critical issue wasting less than a double shot of beans, buy a hg one or versalab or something.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

What's ya budget?

The Versalab is possibly one of the best grinders on the market, but you would need a big budget http://www.versalab.com/

The HG One is slightly less expensive sue to lack of motor, but similar principle http://hg-one.com/the-hg-one-grinder/ still very expensive however.

I do believe they are the best when it comes to grind retention however, and some of the best when it comes to the actual grind


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

Pretty sure the Vario has minimal grind retention. Also the Mazzer Royal once all the gaps between burrs and burr carrier has been filled in (about 3 shots). Same as SJ; I only purge about 3g between beans or big grind adjustments although this probably isn't necessary

Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk HD


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

fatboyslim said:


> Pretty sure the Vario has minimal grind retention. Also the Mazzer Royal once all the gaps between burrs and burr carrier has been filled in (about 3 shots). Same as SJ; I only purge about 3g between beans or big grind adjustments although this probably isn't necessary
> 
> Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk HD


This is the thing, the whole 3 doubles makes no sense to me whatsoever, even with the roburs bigger burr chamber.

If someone can actively tell the difference after 60g is pulled through instead of just 10, maybe 20g, I must say I'm amazed.


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## aaronb (Nov 16, 2012)

I'm not really a fan of having different coffee's on the go for espresso at once, due to retention and having to dial in each coffee differently.

If you really want no retention you probably want the HG One.

I can confirm minimal retention on my Vario, but there is a bit and this will impact on your shots on flavour and grind size if you are constantly swapping coffees (although probably less so than the MDF)


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## CamV6 (Feb 7, 2012)

I get little or no retention with my Brasilia RR55od


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

Vario has very little retention


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Why not wait until after the £250 grind off event in may? Retention is just one of the issues, surely what is in your cup is more important.and before you ask. Eureka Mignon gets my vote and no, I do not own one!


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

dfk41 said:


> Why not wait until after the £250 grind off event in may? Retention is just one of the issues, surely what is in your cup is more important.and before you ask. Eureka Mignon gets my vote and no, I do not own one!


You'd have thunk so wouldn't you?

Seems grind retention of a couple of grams is a massive bubonic plague to be avoided.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

As it is sooooooooo important I will make sure it is in the criteria. mythos retains pretty much nothing


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## tcr4x4 (Jan 2, 2013)

Do I need to bring an endoscope too stick into each grinder and we how much is left in there?


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## forzajuve (Feb 2, 2011)

Have you tried adding a drop or two of water to your beans prior to grinding, this helps prevent retention from static build up. I would say that prior to doing this my retention was 0.1g-0.2g, now it is almost nothing


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## Steve_S_T (Dec 7, 2012)

RisingPower said:


> Seems grind retention of a couple of grams is a massive bubonic plague to be avoided.


Not for me, as per my op I'm just looking to avoid 20 or 30g of retention. I can live with 2 or 3g and wouldn't be bothered by any effect that has on taste (if I even notice it).

Steve.


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

Steve_S_T said:


> Not for me, as per my op I'm just looking to avoid 20 or 30g of retention. I can live with 2 or 3g and wouldn't be bothered by any effect that has on taste (if I even notice it).
> 
> Steve.


There will be 10-20ish grams in a large burr chamber. Does it mean that you need to put 30g through it to clear it? No. 20g? Doubtful.

What about deposits on burrs, are you really going to clean the burrs each time you use them?

If putting 10g through at probably most is an issue, you'll need a grinder like the hg one. However, i'd argue that coffee isn't that valuable a resource yet that you're going to miss those 10g on the odd occasion you do change beans.


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## Steve_S_T (Dec 7, 2012)

RisingPower said:


> There will be 10-20ish grams in a large burr chamber. Does it mean that you need to put 30g through it to clear it? No. 20g? Doubtful.


That's the reason I started the thread, to clarify and get facts. I don't know or care which grinders have a large burr chamber and as I've said twice already, it's larger amounts I'm talking about not the few bits left on the burrs. All I can tell you is that the guys at Hasbean "waste" over 30g for every change of beans, 2 full shots, that's a fact, and whether coffee is a scarce resource or not it's more than I want to waste myself thanks.



RisingPower said:


> What about deposits on burrs, are you really going to clean the burrs each time you use them?


See previous paragraph, I don't know when I ever intimated that the small amount of coffee on the burrs was a problem.



RisingPower said:


> If putting 10g through at probably most is an issue, you'll need a grinder like the hg one. However, i'd argue that coffee isn't that valuable a resource yet that you're going to miss those 10g on the odd occasion you do change beans.


I'd argue that it doesn't matter how invaluable a resource you consider coffee to be, I asked a question based on my own thoughts and preferences and - I'll write it AGAIN - I was talking about 20 or 30g per change, not 10, not 2 or 3, and certainly not the few grains on the burrs. For the record by the time I shut my machine down tonight I'll have changed beans four times today and that would increase over the weekend. That's not "the odd occasion" in my mind and even at 10g a time represents over a bag of beans a week. I'm sure that's acceptable waste for some but for me, if I can avoid it I will - just a personal preference. Thanks for your replies though.

Steve.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Steve, there a plenty of grinders out there that will meet your needs, the huge conical burrs will not suit, but something like the Brasilia rr55 od as bought recently by a few on here would be great, the mazzer royal will pretty much give you everything if you don't mind using a brush to get the last few bits out of it. Provided you record which beans require which grind settings and mark them on your grinder, switching between beans and brew styles will not be a problem. Hope this helps.


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## Steve_S_T (Dec 7, 2012)

Thanks Dave. I think it is becoming imperative that I attend the grind off in May







, I'm keen to have a look at the Mignon in particular. When upgrade time comes I'll give you a shout and see what you have in stock anyway if I can't afford new, although I hold out no hope of getting a pre loved HG 1 which seems to be my perfect grinder ha ha.

Steve.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

i cant wait to see the results of the grind off. I think i'm on the lookout for a new grinder later this year and interested to see what the outcome is.

taste is of course always the number 1 criteria, but things like noise, retention, ease of use and looks all play a part.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

I think it might be a while before a second hand hg1 springs up!!


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

shrink said:


> i cant wait to see the results of the grind off. I think i'm on the lookout for a new grinder later this year and interested to see what the outcome is.
> 
> taste is of course always the number 1 criteria, but things like noise, retention, ease of use and looks all play a part.


Get your ideas on the grind off thread as that will be my point of call for setting the criteria


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## RisingPower (Dec 27, 2009)

Steve_S_T said:


> That's the reason I started the thread, to clarify and get facts. I don't know or care which grinders have a large burr chamber and as I've said twice already, it's larger amounts I'm talking about not the few bits left on the burrs. All I can tell you is that the guys at Hasbean "waste" over 30g for every change of beans, 2 full shots, that's a fact, and whether coffee is a scarce resource or not it's more than I want to waste myself thanks.
> 
> See previous paragraph, I don't know when I ever intimated that the small amount of coffee on the burrs was a problem.
> 
> ...


Hmm, I wonder what grinder they use as that does seem like an awful lot.

The thing is, coffee sits in the burr chamber and doesn't really come out with the newer beans at least in the k10, so, the grind retention isn't directly related to the grounds that you get out.

You get big clumps on the bottom of the upper burr set, but i've never noticed these to have any impact on taste(it's at least a few grams)

The change is probably ~10g on the k10, which if you're changing coffees a significant amount during the day, I can see the issue, but really, isn't dialing in the grind four or more times a day going to waste grounds? The big conicals are far better at consistency, so maybe the hg one is better for this, especially with the lack of retention.

I lose more grounds through changing the coarseness than through grind retention normally.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Precisely so forget the retention hungry conicals and get a fab flat burr grinder like the royal, or if you can stretch to it the eureka mythos and kiss goodbye to retention.....


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## garydyke1 (Mar 9, 2011)

Use a brush, single dose = say good bye to retention on many a grinder...so long as you can access the grind path and pulse the motor a couple of times


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