# Complete Gaggia Classic history with model numbers, manufacturing site and year



## Borgeklungerbo

Hi,

After researching espresso machines for 2 days, I have come to the conclusion that I need a Gaggia Classic that was made in Italy before Philips acquired the company. It appears that Philips have done as many large companies do, acquire a strong brand and replace with cheaper parts just to make money.

Is there a source for model numbers linked to country of origin and manufacturing year? I have mapped out that the new 9403 is terrible and manufactured with cheap parts in Romania, and that the 8161 seems to be a better version. Can someone help here? Which model has the solenoid problem and has to be upgraded to the larger solenoid valve, costing about 35 GBP?

If there is no list, maybe we can start one here.

Thanks,


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## jeebsy

The solenoid doesn't have to be upgraded, lots of people run them without problems but if you backflush or descale the newer ones then they could be more prone to a bit of debris getting stuck.

If you want an older one then hang about, post a bit more and when you have enough posts PM gaggiamanualservice


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## mremanxx

jeebsy said:


> The solenoid doesn't have to be upgraded, lots of people run them without problems but if you backflush or descale the newer ones then they could be more prone to a bit of debris getting stuck.
> 
> If you want an older one then hang about, post a bit more and when you have enough posts PM gaggiamanualservice


I agree Jeebys I have had not issues with mine what so ever, don't know what the fascination is with the other solenoids I bet it doesn't make any noticeable difference to the shot. Might be wrong.


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## Borgeklungerbo

Are there anything else that is very different that I am missing? The solenoid problem might be solved by descaling frequently (or just using bottle water, as I will) as you say.


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## Rhys

Only other difference might be the badge on the front - older ones are printed on, newer ones are badges.


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## kadeshuk

And the wattage, though I don't think that's an issue either.......


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## Rhys

kadeshuk said:


> And the wattage, though I don't think that's an issue either.......


There is a thread that I did a bit of delving into different models... I'll see if I can find it...


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## Rhys

Found it... The older models have a higher wattage. The newer ones are 1200 watts, the older ones 1300 watts (looks like they were 1300 w at the time they switched from Italy to Romania) and the old ones are 1425 Watts. Mine's a pre Philips 2003 1425W model.


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## urbanbumpkin

Borgeklungerbo said:


> Are there anything else that is very different that I am missing? The solenoid problem might be solved by descaling frequently (or just using bottle water, as I will) as you say.


Using water that's less likely to scale is a good option IMO


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## Pompeyexile

Well mine has the printed Gaggia Classic on the front but as to what wattage, there are absolutely no labels on or inside my machine to give me any indication what that is so I have no idea if it's pre or post Philips.


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## Daily_Grind

Pompeyexile said:


> there are absolutely no labels on or inside my machine


Not even underneath? Every classic I've seen of all ages (admitedly not a vast number) has a label there


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## Rhys

Pompeyexile said:


> Well mine has the printed Gaggia Classic on the front but as to what wattage, there are absolutely no labels on or inside my machine to give me any indication what that is so I have no idea if it's pre or post Philips.


Have a look at the link I put up.

Sounds like a pre-Philips and 1425w (same as mine)

Also have a look at the spot welding and the way it's put together - the bottom section of mine (which the grouphead is fastened to) has the tabs on which are spot welded to the body, later ones have the tabs on the body with the bottom plate sat on them and welded. I noticed this after nearly buying one on fleabay which had come u welded at one side.


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## Pompeyexile

Mine is the same as your Rhys, the tabs are part of the plate and welded to the body.

I have looked underneath inside in fact everywhere and the only label is for a service engineer who I'm guessing may have been the person who the previous owner had to put the PID on. So a pre Philips one then.


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## les24preludes

Can someone explain the numbering please:

- The 2015 is 19303, right? Embossed 'Gaggia' in the front right, with smaller 'Classic' underneath. No down pipe on left.

- The 18161/40 is the one with the down pipe on the left, 'Classic Gaggia' on front right. What years was this one made?

- Which is the 9403/11 seems to have embossed 'Gaggia' in the front centre, with smaller 'Classic' underneath. No down pipe.

- Which is the model with a picture of a coffee maker on the front left and 'Classic Gaggia' on front right. What years was this one made?


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## ashcroc

les24preludes said:


> Can someone explain the numbering please:
> 
> - The 2015 is 19303, right? Embossed 'Gaggia' in the front right, with smaller 'Classic' underneath. No down pipe on left.
> 
> - The 18161/40 is the one with the down pipe on the left, 'Classic Gaggia' on front right. What years was this one made?
> 
> - Which is the 9403/11 seems to have embossed 'Gaggia' in the front centre, with smaller 'Classic' underneath. No down pipe.
> 
> - Which is the model with a picture of a coffee maker on the front left and 'Classic Gaggia' on front right. What years was this one made?


Most of the differences & model numbers are in this thread


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## les24preludes

The thread mentioned doesn't answer the questions I asked, unfortunately. So again,

- Which is the 9403/11 which has embossed 'Gaggia' in the front centre, with smaller 'Classic' underneath. No down pipe. Is this 2009 on or what?

- Which is the model with a picture of a coffee maker on the front left, down pipe and 'Classic Gaggia' on front right. What years was this one made?

I'm still not clear exactly between when and when the much loved 18161/40 with the down pipe was made, or which is the model with a picture of a coffee maker on the front left, and when that was made.


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## ashcroc

I'm not sure anyone has done a more difinitive list of the differences between model numbers. Sometimes the only difference was the badge on the case but the wattage did progressively go down over the years too. The earliest ones are1425w going down to 1300w & built in Italy. Then production moved to Romania (I believe the smaller solenoid began being used at this time too but could be wrong) where the wattage was 1300w then 1200w. 2015 gets the major design change with the 1050w SS boiler, no 3 way valve ( push buttons instead of toggle switches.

If my memory is correct, the ones with the coffee pot badge are somewhere around 1998 & could be either chrome or gold finish. They're definitely Italian made 1425w versions.

Unfortunately the lack of drain pipe on photos won't tell you much as sometimes it's been removed to take out the tank & not put back before the pic was taken. Thankfully the switches are the big givaway as the pre2015 models have a large steam switch in the middle where on the post2015 all three are the same size.


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## les24preludes

Useful information - thanks! Yes - the coffee pot badge is clearly the early version. Might be nice to have one if it's not too worn out - it's quite retro. Take your point about the drain pipe. I'm just going on the visual appearance, since this is what you see on eBay photos where I'd probably be buying one.


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## Badgerman

I think the coffee pot is only on the polished gold limited edition from late 90s to early noughties.

I would aim for a 1425 watt regardless of year.


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## ashcroc

les24preludes said:


> Useful information - thanks! Yes - the coffee pot badge is clearly the early version. Might be nice to have one if it's not too worn out - it's quite retro. Take your point about the drain pipe. I'm just going on the visual appearance, since this is what you see on eBay photos where I'd probably be buying one.


Just to throw a spanner in the works Mr Gaggia decided to use the same shell on a couple of other machines like the Gaggia Coffee & the Selecta Delux. Niether of these have a 3 way solenoid although they share the same drip tray with the hole for the drain pipe.

I'm a bit biased as I have one but the Tebe (or the Paros which includes a grinder) is also worth keeping an eye out for as most of it's internals are shared with the 1425w classic. It pretty much just has a different body, switches & steam valve assembly due to the knob being on top instead of the side.


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## ashcroc

Badgerman said:


> I think the coffee pot is only on the polished gold limited edition from late 90s to early noughties.
> 
> I would aim for a 1425 watt regardless of year.


You may well be right. There's been so many different finishes it gets a bit confusing.

Annoyingly there,s a chrome selecta delux on ebay with one on at the moment.


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## les24preludes

ashcroc said:


> You may well be right. There's been so many different finishes it gets a bit confusing.
> 
> Annoyingly there,s a chrome selecta delux on ebay with one on at the moment.


There's a thread on converting a Coffee, which it seems the Selecta basically is, to a Classic. Here:

https://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?4507-Old-School-Gaggia-Coffee-to-Gaggia-Coffee-Classic-Conversion

Not sure if it's worth taking that on unless the Coffee was pretty mint or stupid cheap or both... But it can be done at least. I'm on the inevitable road to a Classic so looking at options.


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## Shaf

From what I understand under the base is a label. Hope this helps


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## jfdrummond

Hello everyone, might be too old a thread but any help greatly appreciated,

I'm also looking to get a Classic, see one near me for sale which has the toggle switches (larger steam centre) is listed as pre 2015 but also says made in Romania.

Did they use some of the older parts but assembled them in Romania for a time?

All the codes on the label are...

SIN035 (Classic) 1200W TW901341528830 41/2013 RI8161/40 886816140150

Made in Romania CE

9307GB0B0011


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## Alfieboy

That one will be fine - you'll be able to tinker/update/mod to your hearts content with ease and with readily available spares


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## Sillibet

jfdrummond said:


> Hello everyone, might be too old a thread but any help greatly appreciated,
> 
> I'm also looking to get a Classic, see one near me for sale which has the toggle switches (larger steam centre) is listed as pre 2015 but also says made in Romania.
> 
> Did they use some of the older parts but assembled them in Romania for a time?
> 
> All the codes on the label are...
> 
> SIN035 (Classic) 1200W TW901341528830 41/2013 RI8161/40 886816140150
> 
> Made in Romania CE
> 
> 9307GB0B0011


Similar to above; have just been sold a SIN035 1200W 39/2014 886930311010 RI9303/11 10004371

Ebay ad stated it was the 2009 Italian model so am now wondering whether I've got a dud and should make a fuss (I was looking for an Italian one) or give up the good fight and live with it (given lockdown and a lack of caffeine energy levels). N.B. It's had the steam wand replaced with a Silvio (apparently) one.


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## Alfieboy

Normally it will say where it is made on the rating plate underneath - the Romanian ones will still be able to be worked on as the Italian ones with some components slightly different but essentially the Classic we know and love

Site below has lots of parts diagrams but the V1 is shown as a single entity be it Italian or Romanian

Its the V2 you want to avoid - it says 2015-2018 but I obtained one that was 2014 where I pulled it's guts out and reinvented it as a V1

https://www.mrbean2cup.co.uk/spare-parts/gaggia


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## Blue_Cafe

Uncletits said:


> Its the V2 you want to avoid


 Why?


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## Acorn

Sillibet said:


> Similar to above; have just been sold a SIN035 1200W 39/2014 886930311010 RI9303/11 10004371
> 
> Ebay ad stated it was the 2009 Italian model so am now wondering whether I've got a dud and should make a fuss (I was looking for an Italian one) or give up the good fight and live with it (given lockdown and a lack of caffeine energy levels). N.B. It's had the steam wand replaced with a Silvio (apparently) one.


 I can understand the annoyance because you tend to pay a premium for the Italian ones.

Just from my personal experience on 3 or 4 Classics: I have opened up and taken apart a few Italian 2000-2010 ones and a Romanian 2014 one and the Romanian was identical to the Italian ones on the inside as far as I could tell. (Was the aluminium used to make the boiler inferior? Who knows. Aluminium is not the best boiler material to start with anyway). The older models might have a different component fitted here or there from factory but not necessarily a better one. And they will both take the same upgrades and spares. Perhaps more important is how it's been treated. A 2014 Romanian Classic that's had good water and regular servicing would be a great machine, I reckon.


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## Alfieboy

Blue_Cafe said:


> Why?




The opinion of 100's of people who I greatly respect who are/were on this forum


Sheer difficulty for "normal" people to work on them - I can strip down a V1 completely in 10 mins


Their value is lower than V1 so it's not practical to renovate and sell on


Quality of the parts inside is poor - the steam valve is plastic!


I know you'll mention the boiler but it is a bugger to get to and get out


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## Sillibet

Acorn said:


> I can understand the annoyance because you tend to pay a premium for the Italian ones.
> 
> Just from my personal experience on 3 or 4 Classics: I have opened up and taken apart a few Italian 2000-2010 ones and a Romanian 2014 one and the Romanian was identical to the Italian ones on the inside as far as I could tell. (Was the aluminium used to make the boiler inferior? Who knows. Aluminium is not the best boiler material to start with anyway). The older models might have a different component fitted here or there from factory but not necessarily a better one. And they will both take the same upgrades and spares. Perhaps more important is how it's been treated. A 2014 Romanian Classic that's had good water and regular servicing would be a great machine, I reckon.


 Thanks so much for your helpful response, I really appreciate it.


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## Acorn

Sillibet said:


> Thanks so much for your helpful response, I really appreciate it.


 Let us know how you get on with it, if upgraditis gets the better of you then the Forum is always here to recommend mods, upgrades or replacements


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## MisterKevster

Rhys said:


> Found it... The older models have a higher wattage. The newer ones are 1200 watts, the older ones 1300 watts (looks like they were 1300 w at the time they switched from Italy to Romania) and the old ones are 1425 Watts. Mine's a pre Philips 2003 1425W model.


..The "Found it..." link takes me to a Dog related page....which doesn't seem right!!


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## Jonathon White

ashcroc said:


> I'm not sure anyone has done a more difinitive list of the differences between model numbers. Sometimes the only difference was the badge on the case but the wattage did progressively go down over the years too. The earliest ones are1425w going down to 1300w & built in Italy. Then production moved to Romania (I believe the smaller solenoid began being used at this time too but could be wrong) where the wattage was 1300w then 1200w. 2015 gets the major design change with the 1050w SS boiler, no 3 way valve ( push buttons instead of toggle switches.
> 
> If my memory is correct, the ones with the coffee pot badge are somewhere around 1998 & could be either chrome or gold finish. They're definitely Italian made 1425w versions.
> 
> Unfortunately the lack of drain pipe on photos won't tell you much as sometimes it's been removed to take out the tank & not put back before the pic was taken. Thankfully the switches are the big givaway as the pre2015 models have a large steam switch in the middle where on the post2015 all three are the same size.


I had a 1300watt one and it had the down pipe 🤷‍♂️ It was a 2010 machine and excepted all the mods great. Just didn’t have the spring in the pressure valve just the hex key.


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## Rincewind

MisterKevster said:


> ..The "Found it..." link takes me to a Dog related page....which doesn't seem right!!


You are correct, it didn't sound right...checked...link removed :- Reason; the post was from 2015 and the forum has undergone a few changes/migration of data etc. etc. and sometimes the odd post gets eaten by those pesky Gremlins, chewed up and spat out as something completely different (this case a dog)...nothing to worry about. PM the member and politely ask if they can remember the information; please bear in mind the post was 7 years ago.


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## Bhodgson

Jonathon White said:


> I had a 1300watt one and it had the down pipe 🤷‍♂️ It was a 2010 machine and excepted all the mods great. Just didn’t have the spring in the pressure valve just the hex key.


not having that “ spring in the pressure valve just a hex key” means you have the superior machine. Adjusting the hex allows you to set any pressure you like. so you don’t have to buy silly springs. Though yo do need a pressure gauge. But as a rough rule of thumb, turning the hex 360degrees counter clockwise will give you very close to 9bar at the basket.


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## Jonathon White

Bhodgson said:


> not having that “ spring in the pressure valve just a hex key” means you have the superior machine. Adjusting the hex allows you to set any pressure you like. so you don’t have to buy silly springs. Though yo do need a pressure gauge. But as a rough rule of thumb, turning the hex 360degrees counter clockwise will give you very close to 9bar at the basket.


Yer thanks. I know all that. I have a pressure gauge etc and have been modding this machine for a while but recently sold it. I was just advising the thread that the 1300watt machine isn’t a bad one but the opposite if you read through the whole thread of messages.


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## Bhodgson

As all Gaggia classics have the same boiler, whatever their date of manufacture or voltage they work on, I’d agree. the wattage claimed, seems more smoke and mirrors, than fact, anyway.
isn’t it where it’s made, that’s more important, anyway. Ive always considered it so..
Italian good, Rumanian from bad to downright awful.


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## larkim

Bhodgson said:


> As all Gaggia classics have the same boiler, whatever their date of manufacture or voltage they work on, I’d agree. the wattage claimed, seems more smoke and mirrors, than fact, anyway.
> isn’t it where it’s made, that’s more important, anyway. Ive always considered it so..
> Italian good, Rumanian from bad to downright awful.


Don't the 2015-2018 models have a completely different boiler? The one with the integrated shower screen holder and the single water outlet pipe etc.


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## Bhodgson

larkim said:


> Don't the 2015-2018 models have a completely different boiler? The one with the integrated shower screen holder and the single water outlet pipe etc.


Quite right, good catch, my bad.


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