# Fracino Cherub vs. Piccino or other option(s) ?



## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

Hi all, new forum member (David) here

I'm ready to replace my aging Gaggia Selecta (cut-down Classic I believe, without 3-way valve) and have a budget of c.£600 - give or take say £100.

I've read the (excellent) New Members guide on here which suggests the Fracino Cherub or Fracino Piccino being potential options for me - though I'm open-minded about other brands/options. I recognise these are different types of machine (HX vs. Dual Boiler) but I'm not sure which is most relevant for me or to what extent it matters. I'm also aware that the more I look the more I'll find other machines at same price-point and just get more unsure what to buy!

I've also looked today (online) at Isomac Zafiro IIII (£640) and Isomac Tea III (£750 so stretching my budget limit) which look very cool but not sure how these compare with the Fracino machines.

The machine will be used most days, one or two cappuccinos in morning and 2 or 3 longer americano type drinks in the afternoon.

The Cherub and Piccino are listed at similar prices in the New members guide (£650/£600) but from a quick google the Cherub seems more expensive at more like £700 - I've seen another recent thread on here (started by sandykt a few days ago) mentioning £630 for the Cherub but I haven't seen it anywhere at that price. The Piccino seems to be more like c.£550 - seems counter-intuitive for it to cost less?

Anyway, my questions are:

1. Are there other serious options at my price point that i should be considering?

2. If I go for Fracino, how do I choose between the Cherub or Piccino? (it's probably coming down to appearance at the moment! - the Cherub looks much better to me / Piccino looks a bit 'dull' but difficult to tell from pics)

Grateful for any comments!

ps. I already have an Iberital MC2 grinder


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

Hiya,

I've also been doing some research into the fracinos you mention.

I think you are going to get different answers from different people (some people would say get a dual boiler, some an HX).

IMHO I think a dual boiler by design is a better design, but is generally a more expensive option (just my opinion).

The Piccino is obviously a dual boiler design, but it is marketed more towards the domestic market.

I believe the quality of some components will be less than Cherub/Heavenly (e.g. I don't think you get E61 group, smaller boiler etc.)

However, its a dual boiler! (at a bargain price).

The Cherub/Heavenly are HX, and more people seem to be interested in these 2 models (not exactly sure why).

(You do the well admired E61 design with these).

I think it probably comes down to personal choice..

If it helps, I am also torn between all 3









And there is also the Quickmill Silvano if you want more options....

p.s. Isomac Zaffiro is single boiler only (non HX) - i.e. similar design to Gaggia/Silvia.

Tea would be a better option for me.



beedj said:


> Hi all, new forum member (David) here
> 
> I'm ready to replace my aging Gaggia Selecta (cut-down Classic I believe, without 3-way valve) and have a budget of c.£600 - give or take say £100.
> 
> ...


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

beedj said:


> Hi all, new forum member (David) here
> 
> I'm ready to replace my aging Gaggia Selecta (cut-down Classic I believe, without 3-way valve) and have a budget of c.£600 - give or take say £100.
> 
> ...


You should be able to get a Cherub for around £630 if you take a look at Espresso Underground and fire Peter (owner) an email or call and mention my username he'll sell you a cherub at that price. I'd recommend you get some custom coloured panels like I got for a little extra.

I ultimately chose the cherub because of the e61 group head which offers great thermal stability during the extraction. Also the Piccino will require temperature surfing to get the thermostat cycle at the right point. I think newer models do have a boiler light to indicate when the brew water is being heater (allowing you to temperature surf) but the older model and the one I looked at didn't have this feature making it tricky to temperature surf meaning inconsistent brew temperature and no stability from a thermosyphon brew group (e61).

Other similar machines to the Cherub or Piccino are approximately 25-30% more expensive and not necessarily better. Fracino offer great value for money and exceptional customer service from a UK based company.

I called them up yesterday for a new group gasket and it should arrive today









Also for Americanos you'll want the hot water tap of the Cherub over the Piccino which doesn't have one. The Piccino is also impossible to descale without sending back to the factory. The Cherub can be descaled at home because it has a hot water tap.

Steam power is better on the Cherub also due to the much bigger boiler.

Hope this helps.


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

Good advice, surely you need to temp surf an HX machine too though?

I don't think descaling a piccino is impossible, but fatboyslim is right, the Cherub will give you that dedicated hot water tap.

I think you would get better support from fracino than anything from italy.



fatboyslim said:


> You should be able to get a Cherub for around £630 if you take a look at Espresso Underground and fire Peter (owner) an email or call and mention my username he'll sell you a cherub at that price. I'd recommend you get some custom coloured panels like I got for a little extra.
> 
> I ultimately chose the cherub because of the e61 group head which offers great thermal stability during the extraction. Also the Piccino will require temperature surfing to get the thermostat cycle at the right point. I think newer models do have a boiler light to indicate when the brew water is being heater (allowing you to temperature surf) but the older model and the one I looked at didn't have this feature making it tricky to temperature surf meaning inconsistent brew temperature and no stability from a thermosyphon brew group (e61).
> 
> ...


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

you dont really need to temp surf the cherub.. for several reasons.

there is water being circulated around the group head, so its always up to temperature (once the whole machine is warmed up).

The water for the brew comes from the steam boiler and is passed through the heat exchanger to get down to brew temp, so as a result theres never water in the heat exchanger thats too hot, and the machine will always try to keep the boiler up to steam temperature, so you're not dealing with water thats too hot or too cold.

you could flush a little water through the group head of the cherub just to make sure you were pulling fresh water from the boiler, but otherwise, it will stay pretty temperature consistent from shot to shot, with or without steaming.


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

that's interesting - i think that would probably swing it for me then



shrink said:


> you dont really need to temp surf the cherub.. for several reasons.
> 
> there is water being circulated around the group head, so its always up to temperature (once the whole machine is warmed up).
> 
> ...


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

its whats pushing me towards it... a HX almost seems like a better solution for the home than a dual boiler. Less power needed, less need to control the temperature of a seperate boiler as the HX takes care of all that. But the benefits of a large boiler for steam pressure and recovery time.


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## RoloD (Oct 13, 2010)

Fatboyslim makes a good point here - although it might seem that a dual boiler is the best way to achieve a stable brew temperature this may not be the case in practice. What we want to achieve is not stable boiler temperature, but stable temperature of the water as it passes through the group and the group itself - that's why a thermsiphon/HX design like the Cherub can give more consistent results than the cheaper dual-boiler Piccino.


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

aphelion said:


> Good advice, surely you need to temp surf an HX machine too though?
> 
> I don't think descaling a piccino is impossible, but fatboyslim is right, the Cherub will give you that dedicated hot water tap.
> 
> I think you would get better support from fracino than anything from italy.


Sure you can descale the brew boiler on the Piccino but how would you drain the steam boiler after it fills with descale solution?

I always flush a small amount of water out of the group before I grind/dose/tamp etc just so I always have a standard point where I start my shot, more consistency.



shrink said:


> The water for the brew comes from the steam boiler and is passed through the heat exchanger to get down to brew temp, so as a result theres never water in the heat exchanger thats too hot, and the machine will always try to keep the boiler up to steam temperature, so you're not dealing with water thats too hot or too cold.


Actually if you leave the machine on all day the water in the exchange circuit does become too hot and you would need to flush some out. Not really a problem since this usually only happens after the machine has been idle for at least 2-3 hours.

Easily solved by flushing about 2oz from group.


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

RoloD - really interesting, agree with the temp stability at group..

so, is the thermsiphon design the key here?

would a machine with dual "large" boilers be an improvement over an HX design?



RoloD said:


> Fatboyslim makes a good point here - although it might seem that a dual boiler is the best way to achieve a stable brew temperature this may not be the case in practice. What we want to achieve is not stable boiler temperature, but stable temperature of the water as it passes through the group and the group itself - that's why a thermsiphon/HX design like the Cherub can give more consistent results than the cheaper dual-boiler Piccino.


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

fatboyslim said:


> Sure you can descale the brew boiler on the Piccino but how would you drain the steam boiler after it fills with descale solution?
> 
> I always flush a small amount of water out of the group before I grind/dose/tamp etc just so I always have a standard point where I start my shot, more consistency.
> 
> ...


Fatboyslim - Can you not just steam it out? (admittedly it would take a while)...or could this damage something?


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

aphelion said:


> Fatboyslim - Can you not just steam it out? (admittedly it would take a while)...or could this damage something?


No because steam is just water vapour and so you would leave some the citric acid residue inside the boiler (probably as crystals or scum or something bad)....probably









No way to drain it properly anyway which is why Fracino recommend you use the water filters they provide which fit into the Piccino water tank, then send it back to them to descale (I think every year or something).


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

fatboyslim said:


> No because steam is just water vapour and so you would leave some the citric acid residue inside the boiler (probably as crystals or scum or something bad)....probably
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Wow, that would be a pretty annoying design feature..









I wonder if you could reduce the boiler temp enough to jet hot water instead?


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

or just not buy a dual boiler that doesnt have a water dispenser on it. Its one more reason the cherub is a better buy, easy home de-scaling.


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

shrink said:


> or just not buy a dual boiler that doesnt have a water dispenser on it. Its one more reason the cherub is a better buy, easy home de-scaling.


yep cherub it is


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

As a forum sponsor we will try and price match all like-for-like deals on the Fracino Cherub or Piccino.

Drop us a PM


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

Many thanks all. Following this thread has been really helpful to a newbie to this forum and I think I will also go for a Cherub if I can get a good price. I'm hoping to see an improvement in quality and consistency from my Gaggia Classic.


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

lol think with all these potential cherub buyers, we should get a group buy on


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## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

Hi all, OP here, thanks so much for the very helpful, clear and prompt comments!

Thanks to aphelion, fatboyslim, shrink & RoloD (where is the forum "Thanks" button so I can do this properly?!)


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)




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## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

Ok that button wasn't showing for me, but I've logged out and back in and it is now !

Thanks


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## lespresso (Aug 29, 2008)

fracino make exceptional machines - you should not think you are settling for second best on the grounds that they are less expensive relative to better known brands

compare the specification of the element, for example - that gives you endless steam & almost unheard of boiler recovery rates

i could go on but there are many satisfied fracino owners of both the models that you are considering to explain their merits in detail

personally i think fracino machines are significantly under priced relative to their specification

reiss.


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## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

shrink said:


> lol think with all these potential cherub buyers, we should get a group buy on


Now that sounds like a plan!......


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

I wonder if we could talk someone into it.. i wonder how many units we'd need to get on song with, and with verified cash ready for the transaction, in order to get some meaninful discount.


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

I'm interested!

Shakey


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

I should have added that as a newbie I cannot respond to PMs!


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## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

Same for me


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## Antibubble (Oct 23, 2011)

This is either terrible or brilliant, I have been hoping to pick up a 2nd hand cherub from the Bay, but interest seems to have picked too much









I don't think I can afford new even as a group buy. Maybe?

I think we should be bigging up the Londonium so that all the Cherub owners jump ship and there is an abundance of 2nd hand machines swamping the market.

Has anyone watched eBay over an extended period? What a reasonable (average) price for a 2nd hand Cherub?


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## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

Funnily enough I looked on eBay earlier - there are no sales showing on a "Completed Listings" search - according to eBay this would show any items sold within the last 90 days or 30 days for items that didn't sell .... so doesn't look like you're likely to pick one up on eBay

Though having said that there is one 2nd hand machine listed now - currently £350 with 5d to go


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

Buy new....you won't regret it.


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

can someone take a lead in this and gather all confirmed order's and PM with the total? I can than take it to the Manager for a discount approval.

Thanks


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## Antibubble (Oct 23, 2011)

A 'Francino' cherub sold for £331 just before Christmas

- which is the price I bid upto









I think you should buy the Londinium, a much shinyer and taller machine for the true connoisseur of glam coffee.


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## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

coffee_omega said:


> can someone take a lead in this and gather all confirmed order's and PM with the total? I can than take it to the Manager for a discount approval.
> 
> Thanks


CoffeeOmega - e-mails sent to mailto:[email protected] are being rejected and PM's not able to be sent from this forum - error message "coffee_omega has exceeded their stored private messages quota and cannot accept further messages until they clear some space"


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

i think the issue here CoffeeOmega, is that people would want an idea of what discount can be offered on a bulk order such as this before they commit to a yay or nay.


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## Geordie Boy (Nov 26, 2012)

beedj said:


> Funnily enough I looked on eBay earlier - there are no sales showing on a "Completed Listings" search - according to eBay this would show any items sold within the last 90 days or 30 days for items that didn't sell .... so doesn't look like you're likely to pick one up on eBay
> 
> Though having said that there is one 2nd hand machine listed now - currently £350 with 5d to go


One went just before Christmas for around £330 with a few extras thrown in, though you might not find it as it was spelt wrong in the listing!

Just noticed Antibubble beat me to it.


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Sorry all, some issue with our email system. IT tech on the case to solve the problem.

email: [email protected] (managing director's personal email) got his permission first so your safe to email!



beedj said:


> CoffeeOmega - e-mails sent to mailto:[email protected] are being rejected and PM's not able to be sent from this forum - error message "coffee_omega has exceeded their stored private messages quota and cannot accept further messages until they clear some space"


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Shrink before any discount is applied the quantity has to be confirmed, price for 3-4 units will be different to say 5+. With out any confirmed orders Manager wont authorise any discount



shrink said:


> i think the issue here CoffeeOmega, is that people would want an idea of what discount can be offered on a bulk order such as this before they commit to a yay or nay.


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

i see a catch 22 happening here


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

No catch or strings attached. Like any wholesale or quantity orders price for 1 pc will be significantly different to 5 pc's, basic maths more you order more discount applied!



shrink said:


> i think the issue here CoffeeOmega, is that people would want an idea of what discount can be offered on a bulk order such as this before they commit to a yay or nay.


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## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

I am interested.


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

I'm interested


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

yes i understand completely coffeeomega.. and realise i'm not being difficult here. but what you're basically saying is that people need to confirm that they "will" spend the money, before they have even found out what its going to cost. meaning that regardless what cost you provide, people become obliged to stick with it. under such circumstances I would find it impossible to commit without actually knowing what im commiting too.

I've done many group buys in my time (and for items with a single unit value far higher than this machine), and most businesses are perfectly capable of giving at least some notional idea of what discounts would be applied based on quantities. Without a need to "confirm" the order in advance.


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## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

I think Shrink has a point, yes I am interested, but I would like to know what the deal is i.e. how much and what the terms are.


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## jimbow (Oct 13, 2011)

I have had my Cherub for a little over a year now and still love it to pieces. I completely agree with Fatboyslim and lespresso - similar specified machines from other manufacturers cost substantially more money.



shrink said:


> ...
> 
> The water for the brew comes from the steam boiler and is passed through the heat exchanger to get down to brew temp, so as a result theres never water in the heat exchanger thats too hot, and the machine will always try to keep the boiler up to steam temperature, so you're not dealing with water thats too hot or too cold.
> 
> you could flush a little water through the group head of the cherub just to make sure you were pulling fresh water from the boiler, but otherwise, it will stay pretty temperature consistent from shot to shot, with or without steaming.


This description matches the way that lever machines work but HX machines tend to work slightly differently. On most lever machines, both brew water and steam is fed from a (steam) boiler which maintains the water at approximately 125 degrees. The brew water passes through the group head which cools the water to brewing temperature due to its large thermal mass. If too many shots are pulled in quick succession then the group head will become heated and unable to effectively cool the brew water until it has cooled down again.

Like lever machines, the HX design also uses a steam boiler maintaining water at approximately 125 degrees for steaming and hot water (from the hot water tap). Unlike lever machines, the HX design does NOT feed the brew water from the steam boiler. The brew water is on a separate, sealed circuit fed directly from the water tank. This circuit is made from copper tubing and passes through the middle of the steam boiler so that the water inside is passively heated by the hotter water in the boiler surrounding it as it passes along the tubing towards the brew group. If the machine is sat idle, the water inside this circuit will continue to heat and may become too hot for brewing. This is why HX machines usually require a "cooling flush" prior to brewing.

Some HX designs, like the Cherub, feature a thermosyphon. In this design, the water in the circuit is allowed to flow around the circuit, so that a convection current is setup inside the circuit with water being heated inside the HX, flowing upwards to the group head where it loses heat through radiation and then travels back down to the HX where it is heated again. This helps regulate the water temperature to an extent. Furthermore, the group head is heated through this process to a temperature approaching the desired temperature for the brew water and so will correct/dampen any minor temperature inconsistencies in the brew water as it exits from the group head during brewing.

Some thermosyphon designs are even tuned to mix the water from both the hotter and cooler (return) sides of the circuit to balance the temperature. I believe that Fracino have finely tuned their thermosyphon design in this way so that little or no cooling flush is required on their machines.

For a brew boiler (as found on single and double boiler designs) to be more thermally stable (and not require "temperature surfing"), usually requires a PID to more precisely control the heating element (to keep the water within 1 degree of desired temperature rather than 10 degrees with a thermostat). More expensive machines also incorporate heat exchangers onto their design to pre-heat the cold water entering the brew boiler so as not to cool the hot water already in the boiler.


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

isnt that what i said lol


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## Antibubble (Oct 23, 2011)

Can I register my interest please


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Ok Shrink, Manager has been informed of this forum discussion and his working on a discount structure now (hopefully i can give you some prices before he leaves for the day!)

watch this space..............


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

Excellent.


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Good news









5+ units of Cherub £659 all inclusive

Cherub Stainless steel finish or colour option +£40

Terms:

* 5-10 days waiting time

* payment made via business bank transfer

* warranty 12 months back to base (as standard)

* offers expires Friday 11th Jan 2013

Feedback would be appreciated


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## lespresso (Aug 29, 2008)

& every fracino machine has a forged brass group (strength, no risk of porosity) - crappy cast brass groups are quietly being added to some espresso machines.


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

So, if I've got it right, that's a £20 saving on another on line supplier of the Cherub.


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Shakey, who's that oneline supplier? do u mean cheaper than what we are offering?


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## Antibubble (Oct 23, 2011)

Its also £10 more than the offer made on the 10th of December. Not that I want to appear discourteous but it does seem to confirm my expectations of the forces of supply and demand.

Did I say how much I like the Londinium?


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## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

I can order the stainless steel option (through another online distributor) all in for £699 delivered. How is this a good deal especially if a group of members intend to purchase?


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Antibubble, offers expiry and new offers are placed.

Here is what we can do, order the CHERUB and make payment by Friday 4th Jan 2013 and we will do it for £639 all inclusive.

All the best


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

Apologies - your offer is £20 cheaper than the best price I can find for the Cherub having trawled the net the last few days.


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Shakey we have reduced it even more @ £639 all inclusive only until 2rmow



Shakey said:


> Apologies - your offer is £20 cheaper than the best price I can find for the Cherub having trawled the net the last few days.


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

coffee_omega said:


> Shakey we have reduced it even more @ £639 all inclusive only until 2rmow


Is £639 with the stainless?


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

Ok - that's £40 cheaper than I can find today.


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Stainless steel option extra £40



aphelion said:


> Is £639 with the stainless?


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

Now I would go for that - £639 stainless!


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Please PM orders or email the MD with your details

[email protected]

An invoice will be emailed to you to complete the transaction - 5+ orders


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

coffee_omega said:


> Stainless steel option extra £40


That's only a £20 saving on a stainless model available online.


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## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

I agree, its a £20 saving and the offer now expires tomorrow instead of next Friday. Its a bit like having a gun held to your head. Please don't think I am sounding ungrateful because I am not. If the offer is £639 for the stainless steel option, you would be inundated with offers, believe me.


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Offer of £639 expires tomorrow and reverts back to £659 until Fri 11th Jan 2013.

This is our FINAL and last offer


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

sandykt, good offers dont last a life time it will defy purpose!

Stainless steel option +£40

All the best



sandykt said:


> I agree, its a £20 saving and the offer now expires tomorrow instead of next Friday. Its a bit like having a gun held to your head. Please don't think I am sounding ungrateful because I am not. If the offer is £639 for the stainless steel option, you would be inundated with offers, believe me.


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

Its a saving of £40 on standard model but only £20 on stainless model based on best prices I can find.


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## Padder (Dec 14, 2012)

Antibubble said:


> This is either terrible or brilliant, I have been hoping to pick up a 2nd hand cherub from the Bay, but interest seems to have picked too much
> 
> 
> 
> ...


As has been said, one went for £331 recently and one is currently on the bay at £350. That's certainly at the top end of what I'd pay for a machine you have no knowledge of and could come with problems. It gets to a point where the price 2nd hand gets too close to the new price and makes the lure of unused and warrantied goods more appealing.

There was a heavenly recently sold on ebay for about £180 but it had a fault - looked a good buy but too far away for me to consider as they would only do a pick up in person. This one would interest me if it wasn't so far away. Looks like a tank fed Fracino Little Gem to me

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/commercial-coffee-machine-/140901782069?pt=UK_BOI_Restaurant_RL&hash=item20ce669235

I would be interested in a new Cherub as part of a group buy if the price is right


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

Shakey said:


> Its a saving of £40 on standard model but only £20 on stainless model based on best prices I can find.


agreed - its a £40 saving if you want the standard model

most people want the stainless though


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

£639 was the absolute max discount I was allowed to give.

Here is what I am personally prepared to do: £645 all inclusive with stainless steel option - waiting time may increase and will be confirmed tomorrow.

As a forum sponsor Iam sure you all won't back down as we help maintain this wonderful forum partially by offering these low prices.

Now if this doesn't start off a mass order spree than iam NOT sure what will..........!!!!


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## fatboyslim (Sep 29, 2011)

That is an excellent price! Does it include delivery?


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

all inclusive price.

offer valid until 2morow 4th Jan 2013


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## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

I took the "all-in" comment to mean delivery was included...

at £645 stainless, delivered, I am in. I will email full details later this evening.

So next four buyers please...

just a thought, should we start a new thread with group buy in title as it won't be obvious from this thread title...?


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## beedj (Jan 2, 2013)

And presumably as first to commit I am first in queue for delivery lol!


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

I'm in - and second!


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Please email your order across with delivery address.

Kindly make sure when you receive invoice payment clears bank by fri 4th Jan 2013


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

coffee_omega said:


> £639 was the absolute max discount I was allowed to give.
> 
> Here is what I am personally prepared to do: £645 all inclusive with stainless steel option - waiting time may increase and will be confirmed tomorrow.
> 
> ...


thanks coffeeomega - this is an excellent price

unfortunately i can't afford one until April (hopefully will still be around this price then..)

best of luck to the 5+ winners!


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## lespresso (Aug 29, 2008)

guys, you can't have a machine that has a cut-throat RRP to start with & then expect a significant discount off that

the margins just aren't there. this guy is really trying to put something on the table for you

i am in no way connected with the vendor - never met, never spoken to him, never emailed


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

I'm in at that price but my e-mail to [email protected] is getting bounced back and I have attempted a pm to [email protected]

Hope this has got through. Can you acknowledge confirm please?


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## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

Terms are for monies to be transferred to Coffee Omega's business account by tomorrow (cleared funds). Credit cards, it would seem, are not accepted on this offer.


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

lespresso said:


> guys, you can't have a machine that has a cut-throat RRP to start with & then expect a significant discount off that
> 
> the margins just aren't there. this guy is really trying to put something on the table for you
> 
> i am in no way connected with the vendor - never met, never spoken to him, never emailed


I think the deal is very appreciated


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## coffee_omega (May 21, 2012)

Shakey, received an email from someone called David Cawthorn, is that you?

Thanks



Shakey said:


> I'm in at that price but my e-mail to [email protected] is getting bounced back and I have attempted a pm to [email protected]
> 
> Hope this has got through. Can you acknowledge confirm please?


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

affirmative!


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

I'm afraid when I spoke to a few guys in Pm's I said I wouldn't be ready to move forward until start of feb. so this is just too quick for me to push forward. The discount is appreciated and certainly a good move, but not a significant enough change that it will push me into making a bad financial choice at the mo.


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## Shakey (Jan 2, 2013)

Does anyone know if we still have a deal? I have limited opportunity to get to my bank today!


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

so far i think only 2-3 people so far have got the money to push forward on coffeeomegas timescale.


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## sandykt (Dec 3, 2009)

I sent a PM to Coffee Omega this morning asking for clarification on one or two points, I have not heard anything and until then I am a "maybe". It looks as though 5+ orders have not been placed/confirmed so they offer may be pulled by Coffee Omega.

Let's see what happens.


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## Antibubble (Oct 23, 2011)

The time line is just too short for me, whilst I am definitely going to be taking the HX route, most likely Fracino, I just can't do that on a days notice.

Disappointment for me but I sincerely hope those who have committed to pay CoffeeOmega today will be able to realise the great deal on offer.


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## shrink (Nov 12, 2012)

yeah i agree that its a good deal, and good play to those able to get involved. I just can't turn around £650 on a days notice, one week after christmas!


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## aphelion (Nov 23, 2012)

shrink said:


> yeah i agree that its a good deal, and good play to those able to get involved. I just can't turn around £650 on a days notice, one week after christmas!


yep unfortunately i'm in the same camp


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