# Pressure Gauge



## Noangel72

Hi,

I was looking at ways to add a pressure gauge to my Silvia and the only resource I came across is on pidsilvia.com which sells a kit, however it's expensive and it would have to come from the US.

I have a general idea of what gauge, fittings and pipes I would need for this. Question is: does anybody know where I could get all parts needed for the project?....from UK-based suppliers (preferably online)?

Thanks!


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## Wando64

I have bought these two items from eBay:

http://r.ebay.com/yJpyVS

http://r.ebay.com/3KilcG

They (you need both) can be screwed at the bottom of a standard portafilter after unscrewing the double spout (I used an old Gaggia portafilter, but the Rancilio should be the same).

If you live in the Chippenham/Cirencester area you could come and borrow them if you want, but I rather not post them.


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## Noangel72

Wando64 said:


> I have bought these two items from eBay:
> 
> http://r.ebay.com/yJpyVS
> 
> http://r.ebay.com/3KilcG
> 
> They (you need both) can be screwed at the bottom of a standard portafilter after unscrewing the double spout (I used an old Gaggia portafilter, but the Rancilio should be the same).
> 
> If you live in the Chippenham/Cirencester area you could come and borrow them if you want, but I rather not post them.


Already sorted out something similar! But thanks nonetheless for your reply.


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## Mrboots2u

What happened to the gaggia you had , you seemed stoked when you first got it ?


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## Noangel72

Mrboots2u said:


> What happened to the gaggia you had , you seemed stoked when you first got it ?


The Classic was REALLY good at making good espresso but it stopped there. Steam wand (even with Silvia upgrade) didn't perform very well, especially the feel and design of it! Drip tray was awful, too much plastic. Internals were all aluminum. Temperature and pressure power were not particularly good (especially noticeable when pulling more than 2 shots consecutively).......so, I exchanged it for a Silvia V3 to which I immediately added PID, insulation and flat shower screen: now finally VERY happy with every aspect of machine!


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## Noangel72

Adding to Wando64 reply: indeed I decided to use a portafilter gauge set-up. I tested a connection between pump and opv but soon realised that only function is only diagnostic and so it's more practical to test pressure via portafilter set-up periodically rather than with a permanent set-up!


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## Mrboots2u

Noangel72 said:


> The Classic was REALLY good at making good espresso but it stopped there. Steam wand (even with Silvia upgrade) didn't perform very well, especially the feel and design of it! Drip tray was awful, too much plastic. Internals were all aluminum. Temperature and pressure power were not particularly good (especially noticeable when pulling more than 2 shots consecutively).......so, I exchanged it for a Silvia V3 to which I immediately added PID, insulation and flat shower screen: now finally VERY happy with every aspect of machine!


Excellent , putting a pid on it certainly makes it easier to use and more stable .


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## Charliej

By the time you've done all that a Silvia you're into NS Oscar and 2nd hand HX territory though and I think that would be money better spent.


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## Noangel72

Charliej said:


> By the time you've done all that a Silvia you're into NS Oscar and 2nd hand HX territory though and I think that would be money better spent.


Silvia £370 + upgrades £200 is still a lot cheaper than an Expobar Lever at £799 (which has no PID) or a Breville DB at £899-1200 (which has everything, including dubious reliability) or a Bezzera BZ10 at £950 (again no PID)....I would not consider second hand, so as one can see the Silvia makes a lot of sense even after upgrades!....at least in my opinion (and I have looked at ALL machines sold on the UK market below £900).


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## Charliej

Noangel72 said:


> Silvia £370 + upgrades £200 is still a lot cheaper than an Expobar Lever at £799 (which has no PID) or a Breville DB at £899-1200 (which has everything, including dubious reliability) or a Bezzera BZ10 at £950 (again no PID)....I would not consider second hand, so as one can see the Silvia makes a lot of sense even after upgrades!....at least in my opinion (and I have looked at ALL machines sold on the UK market below £900).


No you haven't looked at all the machines under £900, any tales from HB of dubious reliability of the Sage/Breville Dual Boiler should be taken with a pinch of salt for a couple of reasons:

1. The original version the 900XL was conceived and designed in Australia with input from former highly placed WBC champions, various coffee experts and some forums, it was designed to run on 240v, and was never originally intended for the North American market, as they run on 110v 60Hz mains supply a lot of it had to be redesigned and re-spec'd as when you more than halve your voltage you more than double your current load, which in turn can create more internal heat and I don't care what the product is or where it is made heat is the enemy of electronics. You also have to factor in the general tendency towards moaning about anything in public that seems inherent in the American character, as well as the tendency to yell loudly about any faults all over the internet before actually trying to resolve the matter with the manufacturer, as well as the fact that like it or not the voices heard most loudly about a product are the ones who have some issue with it as most who have no problems never say anything.

2. The Sage on sale in the UK is a redesigned product the 920XL which currently isn't even on sale in the USA.

I would respectfully suggest that running your mouth off in this was could make you look incredibly ill informed at best. If you genuinely had looked at every machine available here in the UK you would have come across the Nuova Simonelli Oscar, which wees on the Silvia from a great height, there are also various Vibiemme machines as well. But quite frankly your refusal to even consider a used machine is ridiculous as you are going to void the warranty on your Silvia anyway. But hey whatever any of us say you are going to go and do the polar opposite anyway for the record £570 would get you an Oscar from Elektros.it with the mods that make it almost as good as the Musica already performed and still with a full warranty, but again what do any of us know.

You can't expect to just buy a machine and make great espresso it takes practice I had a Gaggia Classic for just over 7 years and it worked fine for me and steamed milk with enough power as well, as the old saying goes a bad workman blames his tools. What grinder have you got this paired with anyway?


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## Mrboots2u

He's happy with his machine Charlie , let him enjoy the coffee he is making with it , no one has to buy a gaggia or a sage or a londinium.

Opinions are opinions everyone has em


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## Charliej

Mrboots2u said:


> He's happy with his machine Charlie , let him enjoy the coffee he is making with it , no one has to buy a gaggia or a sage or a londinium.
> 
> Opinions are opinions everyone has em


But unlike the arseholes most people have , come Sunday mine will be different I'll have 2 holes in it lol.


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## The Systemic Kid

Charliej said:


> But unlike the arseholes most people have , come Sunday mine will be different I'll have 2 holes in it lol.


Far too much information, Charlie, far too much.


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## Noangel72

Charliej said:


> No you haven't looked at all the machines under £900, any tales from HB of dubious reliability of the Sage/Breville Dual Boiler should be taken with a pinch of salt for a couple of reasons:
> 
> 1. The original version the 900XL was conceived and designed in Australia with input from former highly placed WBC champions, various coffee experts and some forums, it was designed to run on 240v, and was never originally intended for the North American market, as they run on 110v 60Hz mains supply a lot of it had to be redesigned and re-spec'd as when you more than halve your voltage you more than double your current load, which in turn can create more internal heat and I don't care what the product is or where it is made heat is the enemy of electronics. You also have to factor in the general tendency towards moaning about anything in public that seems inherent in the American character, as well as the tendency to yell loudly about any faults all over the internet before actually trying to resolve the matter with the manufacturer, as well as the fact that like it or not the voices heard most loudly about a product are the ones who have some issue with it as most who have no problems never say anything.
> 
> 2. The Sage on sale in the UK is a redesigned product the 920XL which currently isn't even on sale in the USA.
> 
> I would respectfully suggest that running your mouth off in this was could make you look incredibly ill informed at best. If you genuinely had looked at every machine available here in the UK you would have come across the Nuova Simonelli Oscar, which wees on the Silvia from a great height, there are also various Vibiemme machines as well. But quite frankly your refusal to even consider a used machine is ridiculous as you are going to void the warranty on your Silvia anyway. But hey whatever any of us say you are going to go and do the polar opposite anyway for the record £570 would get you an Oscar from Elektros.it with the mods that make it almost as good as the Musica already performed and still with a full warranty, but again what do any of us know.
> 
> You can't expect to just buy a machine and make great espresso it takes practice I had a Gaggia Classic for just over 7 years and it worked fine for me and steamed milk with enough power as well, as the old saying goes a bad workman blames his tools. What grinder have you got this paired with anyway?


WOW....what a reaction! Chill out....it's only an espresso machine!


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## Mrboots2u

Your right its only a machine, enjoy the coffee it makes No Angel, thats the important thing .

Have you found a roaster you like currently ?


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## Noangel72

Mrboots2u said:


> Enjoy your machine No Angel, . Have you found a roaster you like currently ?


I've been buying mostly from coffeebeanshop.co.uk and love the Santos/Java blend and the Monsoon Malabar single. I've tried hasbean too but didn't like their selection very much!


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## Mrboots2u

Possibly a bit light for your taste buds.

The Jampit Mahogany roast from coffee compass might suit your tastes. A Big and bold darker roast a lot of forum members enjoyed it recently .


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## Noangel72

Mrboots2u said:


> Possibly a bit light for your taste buds.
> 
> The Jampit Mahogany roast from coffee compass might suit your tastes. A Big and bold darker roast a lot of forum members enjoyed it recently .


Thanks! I will give it a try with my next order.

(I bought a couple of espresso blends from Hasbean and I couldn't find a single grind/dosing/tamping combination that would give good espresso! The 2 varieties from coffeebeanshop are the only ones that gave me good, consistent results so far)!


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## Charliej

The Hasbean espresso blends are very marmite coffees. I tried their espresso starter pack not long after I joined the forum and it took me until late last year to try them again, but with some SO beans. Rave are well worth a try and and I can seriously recommend Coffeebeanshop's Peruvian Yanesha, Coffee Compass as mentioned also do some excellent coffee and if you're feeling flush give Londinium a go as well.

Your previous post about machines really got up my nose by paraphrasing some very opinionated and unsubstantiated anecdotes off HB and passing this off as absolute fact, you then went on to say you had looked at all machines available in the UK under £900 which wasn't the case, and as I previously said a Nuova Simonelli Oscar from Elektros.it with the added anti vac and OPV valves and the professional Sirai Pstat would have given you a machine that is on a whole different level entirely to a Silvia (whether fitted with a PID or not), in fact an Oscar with those mods prefitted by Elektros is still covered by a full warranty as well.

A PID on a single boiler dual use machine isn't a universal panacea for this type of machines inherent issues, there is a body of observation online that opines even with a PID fitted neither the Classic or a Silvia are that accurate in terms of the displayed temperature, and that they aren't a stable either as you still have to heat the boiler further to get ready to steam. To me rather than spend ~£600 on buying a brand new machine and pimping it I would have spent the money on something like an Oscar, a Cherub or Heavenly if you get the retailer on a good day is just about in range and there is also the Fracino Piccino, I guess you could probably fit a PID to the brew boiler on a Piccino, but it would have to be one made up from parts sourced by yourself rather than an Auber kit.


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## Mrboots2u

Can we keep the personal out of this please, people are allowed to have different opinion on machines to each other .

Life is too short , lets keep the debate and the posts out of the personal arena

Agree to disagree please.

If the OP he happy with his coffee and machine , he is allowed to have a different opinion to someone else.


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## Noangel72

Mrboots2u said:


> Can we keep the personal out of this please, people are allowed to have different opinion on machines to each other .
> 
> Life is too short , lets keep the debate and the posts out of the personal arena
> 
> Agree to disagree please.
> 
> If the OP he happy with his coffee and machine , he is allowed to have a different opinion to someone else.


I second that! I also enjoyed very much shopping for and fitting the upgrades....I think that added to the experience!



> The Hasbean espresso blends are very marmite coffees. I tried their espresso starter pack not long after I joined the forum and it took me until late last year to try them again, but with some SO beans. Rave are well worth a try and and I can seriously recommend Coffeebeanshop's Peruvian Yanesha, Coffee Compass as mentioned also do some excellent coffee and if you're feeling flush give Londinium a go as well.


Anyway, thanks for advice on coffee! And I should add, sorry if I offended your Breville!


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## Olliehulla

Noangel72 said:


> I second that! I also enjoyed very much shopping for and fitting the upgrades....I think that added to the experience!


ditto, I took the same route as you, Silvia plus PID plus other upgrades, many reasons really, some positive and some less so and with hindsight I may have done a couple of things differently. That said it's been and continues to be a great journey, it suits me, my budget, my home environment, my level of patience and time I can devote to coffee etc etc. I hope you find it equally as rewarding.


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## Noangel72

Olliehulla said:


> ditto, I took the same route as you, Silvia plus PID plus other upgrades, many reasons really, some positive and some less so and with hindsight I may have done a couple of things differently. That said it's been and continues to be a great journey, it suits me, my budget, my home environment, my level of patience and time I can devote to coffee etc etc. I hope you find it equally as rewarding.


It's been a fairly long journey for me! I started in November with a Sage/Breville which proved nearly impossible to master, then a Gaggia Classic and finally a Silvia. I was able to return the first two machines and so I effectively tried them for free. The Silvia with PID is really bringing together the positives of the previous two machines: technology, build quality and performance while dispensing me from their disadvantages: poor performance and poor attention to details to name a few.....at least in my opinion!

After returning the Classic I was nearly going to buy an Expobar Leva (or similar HX machine) but, FORTUNATELY, I resisted the urge and decided that I'm really not prepared to spend £800+ on a machine (especially when it doesn't even have PID) and so landed on the Silvia + upgrades. Obviously the Silvia cannot be returned and I wouldn't anyway....


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## The Systemic Kid

Enjoyed reading your posts and thoughts on why you went the Silvia route. Silvias are certainly well built - only domestic unit Rancilio make. Fact it's in its third incarnation is a testament to its popularity and Rancilio's commitment to it.


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## Charliej

Noangel72 said:


> It's been a fairly long journey for me! I started in November with a Sage/Breville which proved nearly impossible to master, then a Gaggia Classic and finally a Silvia. I was able to return the first two machines and so I effectively tried them for free. The Silvia with PID is really bringing together the positives of the previous two machines: technology, build quality and performance while dispensing me from their disadvantages: poor performance and poor attention to details to name a few.....at least in my opinion!
> 
> After returning the Classic I was nearly going to buy an Expobar Leva (or similar HX machine) but, FORTUNATELY, I resisted the urge and decided that I'm really not prepared to spend £800+ on a machine (especially when it doesn't even have PID) and so landed on the Silvia + upgrades. Obviously the Silvia cannot be returned and I wouldn't anyway....


The thing here is HX machines don't need a PID for temperature stability and not all commercial machines have them either, it's not a necessary feature, sure it's nice to have but plenty of people the world over are making excellent coffee without one, the Rocket which is the prize in the current Raffle doesn't have a PID either and thats over £1.2k. So don't let lack of a PID make you think a machine isn't worth having.


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## Noangel72

Charliej said:


> The thing here is HX machines don't need a PID for temperature stability and not all commercial machines have them either, it's not a necessary feature, sure it's nice to have but plenty of people the world over are making excellent coffee without one, the Rocket which is the prize in the current Raffle doesn't have a PID either and thats over £1.2k. So don't let lack of a PID make you think a machine isn't worth having.


How come then you have a machine that not only has pid but has so many other features that it nearly tells you where you left your car keys??


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## Charliej

Because Sage made me an offer to purchase the machine I was reviewing that only a moron would have turned down, if they hadn't I would still be using my Gaggia Classic that worked fine for close to 8 years and now it's on it's way to a new life in Thailand. If I hadn't had the chance to buy the Sage I would have bought the already modded NS Oscar from Elektros.it in April which was when I was planning to upgrade. For me and many others the Silvia isn't significantly better than a Classic to warrant spending around 3 times more on one. I would have also checked to see what I could have picked up in the used market, buying from someone on here that is upgrading is pretty much a guarantee that it has been looked after. My grinder was bought used and I stripped it down and cleaned it and got a really good grinder for not much more than the price of a new MC2. In fact once you take the stuff I sold to upgrade my setup has probably cost me less than you have spent on the machine alone. It's horses for courses but at the end of the day a Silvia isn't as good as an Oscar or as forgiving as a Classic. At then end of the day good espresso in your own home is a case of practice makes perfect far more than what machine you have.


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## Daren

Charliej said:


> At then end of the day good espresso in your own home is a case of practice makes perfect far more than what machine you have.


You've got the nail on the head there Charlie. The main aim here is to produce coffee were happy with. The OP is very happy with his personal choice of machine and has his own reasons for choosing the Silvia/PID combo. Let's not spoil the honeymoon period for him. It's a nicer forum if we encourage and help.

Enjoy the Silvia Noangel. I'm looking forward to hearing how you get on.


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## Charliej

All I've been trying to say really is that even given the best machine and grinder available if you haven't got the basics sorted, grind, distribution tamp etc then you'll be making bad coffee.


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## Noangel72

I think the dosing/tamping/grinding theory falls a bit in the alchemy branch of science....it is loosely founded on science but it belongs more to philosophy! At least in my limited experience/opinion! Isn't that what "chasing the god shot" is all about, anyway? I think what is REALLY interesting is how you get to the best possible coffee for your own personal taste buds...i.e. machines, upgrades, gadgets, techniques, etc..........


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## The Systemic Kid

You're challenging some coffee shibboleths there and rightly so when opinion, however learned, is passed off as fact.


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## Mrboots2u

If it tastes good to you thats all that matters

Might not taste good to me though









There are generalrules which help people get there if they are struggling. These include brew ratio s etc and can reallyy helpul to people trying to aspire to a certain taste.


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## Noangel72

Mrboots2u said:


> If it tastes good to you thats all that matters
> 
> Might not taste good to me though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are generalrules which help people get there if they are struggling. These include brew ratio s etc and can reallyy helpul to people trying to aspire to a certain taste.


I agree there are rules/guidelines and rightly so...but at the end of the day we are talking about a recipe! Such and such amount of correctly sieved flour mixed in a certain way will give you the perfect sponge! But surely one cannot talk about only sponges all the time and so, IMO, it's more interesting to talk about the oven, the mixer, the silicone accessories, etc......


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## The Systemic Kid

Silicone accessories?? What on earth are you referring to?


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## The Systemic Kid

Noangel72 said:


> .....IMO, it's more interesting to talk about the oven, the mixer, the silicone accessories, etc......


Up to a point, but surely the equipment is only the means to an end and not the end itself?


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## Noangel72

Some people use Teflon coated jugs!....will you not forgive me for using a silicone spatula to mix my cakes??


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## The Systemic Kid

Of course - I admit to doing the same


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## Noangel72

The Systemic Kid said:


> Of course - I admit to doing the same


of using Teflon jugs or silicone spatulas?


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## The Systemic Kid

Only the latter, well, in public


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## soundklinik

Noangel72 said:


> Hi,
> 
> I was looking at ways to add a pressure gauge to my Silvia and the only resource I came across is on pidsilvia.com which sells a kit, however it's expensive and it would have to come from the US.
> 
> I have a general idea of what gauge, fittings and pipes I would need for this. Question is: does anybody know where I could get all parts needed for the project?....from UK-based suppliers (preferably online)?
> 
> Thanks!


I don't know if you sorted it out yet...?

I built one for very little, you need a 3/8" elbow, a reduction bit 3/8"Male to ??Female =size of the gauge thread and 10 bar gauge for LIQUID, the air ones don't work as well.

All available at DIY store...if not here is a pro version

Portafilter Pressure Gauge TESTER Kit ø 3/8" 0÷16 bar | eBay


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## Ian S

I saw this recommended on Coffeegeek or somewhere; Wika liquid filled higher precision, USA dealer: http://www.valworx.com/category/industrial-gauges-2-front-flange-panel-mount

My Silvia came with a 300psi one of these Wika gauges fitted to the rear side panel. I might change to this 160 PSI 11 Bar one, or maybe just BAR reading, to give more accuracy and cover the working range: http://www.valworx.com/product/front-flg-panel-mt-gauge-2-160-psibar-liq-filled

UK main dealer: http://www.wika.co.uk/213_53_en_co.WIKA

Gauges mainly made in Germany.


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