# Need help with my saga barista express i am using single portafilter



## george_rudd (May 26, 2018)

Why am i over extracting what grind setting is best mine is at 5 i am using fresh roast coffee 28th it was roasted cheers


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Why do you say you are over-extracting?

Use 10.0g dose.

What shot weight in the cup are you getting, in what time?

Maybe best to let the beans rest a few more days.


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## Dumnorix (Dec 29, 2017)

From your picture the needle seems to be only just above the 'recommended' range and the coffee seems to be flowing OK, so if it tastes all right I wouldn't worry too much. However, if it is tasting bitter then try dosing slightly less and/ or moving the grinder one step coarser. When I had a BE I always weighed in just the amount of beans I needed- usually 18.5g for a double, so would agree to try 10g for a single. A guy on here (ajohn) has used the BE single basket extensively and am sure will be along soon to give you some more advice- to be honest I only every used the double!


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

I wondered about commenting but really would need to know weight in and weight out. I will say that when the single is being used I wouldn't expect to be able to get the pressure gauge behaviour shown in the manual.

No point mentioning a grind setting as it will vary machine to machine but 5 doesn't sound out of order.

If your new to the machine I would also suggest that you check the dose you are using with the razor tool. You may find you need to use more than that indicates. Trying say 0.2g steps up from that may help but not so much that the portafilter gets stiffer to put on.

John

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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

I sometimes wonder what happens to people who pop up and post and then disappear.

There is one odd aspect about the BE that I should have cottoned on to quickly but didn't. I found that the default setting of the double shot button could give a much better drink than the single when the single basket is being used. I used the machine like that for some time and just altered grind and the dose always with the single basket.

Later I started programming the buttons using time. As it's a programmable machine I just used the seconds hand on a wall clock to set and that was that - no need to check shot by shot. I have always had the feeling that the time varied a bit shot by shot but didn't check. Odd ones taking longer seemed to crop up now and again. I sometimes make 5 or 6 drinks a day so the subconscious gets used to how long things take. Then I programmed a shot without the portafilter on = lots of water flow. Then used the setting with a loaded portafilter. The shot went on and on and on trying to get the same volume / weight out.

So it looks like the machine is volume based not time. The double button tries to generate a 60ml shot. What may be happening when say the single is used for a 30ml shot via the double shot button is something like 30ml is being diverted out of the over pressure valve into the drip tray. In practice I don't think it's as simple as that. What ever mechanism they use to detect flow ends up with a 30ml shot and there may be a couple of hundred ml going into the drip tray. A certain amount of that is due to the 3 way valve. Can't remember the amount but it's consistent.

Shot time and weight out I used - pass I did it entirely on taste. Weight in varied according to the bean. When I finally did look at weight out it always gave a ratio that was greater the 1 in to 2 out. I found that to be a fact even to achieve the taste a bean should have. Time something like 30 sec give or take ???. I'd say it was invariably longer.

I took a lot of trouble over fill height. Too much and strength drops off as the grounds can't expand. On the other hand if I set a fill height that left a puck that showed a tiny pimple in the centre due to the hex socket in the screw that holds the shower screen in place that could be used to maintain the dose out of the grinder. It needs tiny tweaks of the timer knob. Pimple bigger, reduce a touch, gone or smaller increase. I checked the weights for a while and found that they were consistent so just used that eventually for several kg of the same bean. It's a good idea to stick with the same bean and supplier if possible. That way there is no fiddling about with settings for particular beans and getting into a mess having never really sorted one out. The pimple idea may not work out with some beans or grinder settings but worth a try. Some people have problems with grinds going all over the place - the answer is to set the timer for a 1/2 dose and then tap down before topping up with the 2nd grind. Sage forgot to add a pause and the grinder seems to be very good at producing huge fluffy heaps of grounds - better than the SGP actually going on mine.

The picture the OP posted shows where the needle on the gauge will be when the OPV is open. As the gauge doesn't show bar I decided to get an idea what it represented in bar so knocked up a portafilter pressure gauge. It turned out to have a very slight leak - great as that allowed trapped air to get out.Strange things were happening when there was air in the system probably down to hot water causing it to expand and the use of a vibrator pump. The gauge on the machine went higher than it even had before. It looks like the OPV doesn't open unless there is flow.

If people then try to use the double as above with the gauge going that high they will probably find they get drinks that are way to strong with with many beans. That's what I found. What I should have done is looked for gauge behaviour more similar to the ones shown in the manual.







Instead I had a bad case of upgradeitus. Not down to the machine making crap coffee - far from it.

There is also the other single - the pressurised one. With a coarse grind the basket wins and sets the pressure. As the grind is made finer that begins to take over and the brew pressure goes up. It might be used to make a different style of drink - a light one from a strong bean but with a high degree of clarity. That can also sometimes be done by brewing just short of the OPV opening or lower.

As some one has already mentioned what we are all after is taste and that's what people should brew for so don't worry about anything else. It can take a while to sort that out. I'd still buy a BE rather than a DTP as I don't want to faff about with timers. It also looks like there may be more differences than people realise. Grinder - well Oracle users are probably using exactly the same set up, burr wise they are but they may have finer adjustments. People seem to be pretty happy about the drinks that machine produces. The BE grinder is restricted to the espresso range so more steps on other models may not be as advantageous as people might think - most of them will be intended for other brew methods.







But yes the BE one does probably go both coarser and finer than needed for espresso but that is true of all of them.

John

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