# Niche number 20 is wearing away.



## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

OK, have had the NZ now for over 6 months, and i've been trying a few different beans which typically live in the 11-18, probably approaching 10kg of use. So i adjust it a little but often.

Noticed today the number 20 where my thumb will rub against, is starting to wear away and is noticably smother (and fainter) than the 30.

I haven't cleaned it with anything apart from th brush now and then.

I'll post a picture over the weekend... and it is still a thing of wonder!







:good:









edit: the weekend has started


















It's kind of status badge, how many numbers have you worn off?


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## joe (Nov 13, 2014)

Someone else posted about this problem on here somewhere.

Niche need to look at the issue I think.


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## jonners (Apr 26, 2013)

I noticed exactly the same thing. I'm keeping my thumb clear of the numbers now.


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## ashcroc (Oct 28, 2016)

It does appear a little early for the numbers to start rubbing off. Think if I had one I'd be putting a ring of sticky back plastic on sharpish to protect it.


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

dare I add an observation which as always will not go down well. Out of the 1100 or so owners, this has been reported a couple of times. So, is it down to poor quality control or owner misuse? I am not suggesting intentionally but what else can it be.

Reminds me of an old story of a pension who bought a brand new motor home in the good old US of A. He left the showroom, stuck it on auto control, went in the back to make a cuppa and then successfully sued the manufacturers when it crashed and was destroyed.......because he thought auto control suggested it would drive itself yes, this was the late seventies!).


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## L&R (Mar 8, 2018)

This happened before, sorry reminded me of Gaggia


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Can't say that my thumb etc touches it when I adjust. Don't make any effort at all to avoid it touching either.

John

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## jonners (Apr 26, 2013)

dfk41 said:


> dare I add an observation which as always will not go down well. Out of the 1100 or so owners, this has been reported a couple of times. So, is it down to poor quality control or owner misuse?


I can't imagine in what way I could be said to have misused it.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

jonners said:


> I can't imagine in what way I could be said to have misused it.


Turning the adjustment ring With your thumb on the dial and numbers

Not misuse but numbers waring would be caused by friction , presumably from a finger or thumb.


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

Count yourself lucky to have numbers! Those early HG-1s didn't have anything whatsoever!


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

I'll bet they won't send you a new number 20









I remember those letter transfer things we used to get as kids, rub them on or something....sounds like a few stick on numbers are the order of the day or at the very least number sized clear sticky plastic dots as protectors.

Somthing like these, but perhaps smaller

https://www.amazon.co.uk/STOBOK-Stickers-Cookies-Envelopes-Scrapbooking/dp/B07PLZQK8H/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1552686393&sr=8-5&keywords=clear+circle+dot+stickers%2C+13mm


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## jonners (Apr 26, 2013)

MildredM said:


> Count yourself lucky to have numbers! Those early HG-1s didn't have anything whatsoever!


HG-1? Luxury! When I were a lad an' I were lucky enough to snag a coffee bean, I 'ad to roast it on t' fire and grind it wi' my teeth.......


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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

dfk41 said:


> dare I add an observation which as always will not go down well. Out of the 1100 or so owners, this has been reported a couple of times. So, is it down to poor quality control or owner misuse? I am not suggesting intentionally but what else can it be.
> 
> Reminds me of an old story of a pension who bought a brand new motor home in the good old US of A. He left the showroom, stuck it on auto control, went in the back to make a cuppa and then successfully sued the manufacturers when it crashed and was destroyed.......because he thought auto control suggested it would drive itself yes, this was the late seventies!).


Feel free to say what you please, perhaps you enjoy stirring the pot - your signature suggests so, and that bemuses me, i'll touch on that later.. Normally i'd not consider this worthy of a reply, and please i won't be at all upset if you use this use this link 

I have explained how i use the NZ and how it has occurred but if you imagine me deliberately rubbing off number 20 off with an angle grinder or nail-file so i can seek attention in the forum, wonderful. If you have been peeking through the windows of Niche owners and have photographic evidence - better still share it with everyone.

Allow me to share some knowledge, and debunk your anecdotal urban Winnebago legend, as i clearly have triggered a childhood memory you hold dear.

Sorry to say, it's been a lie or urban myth at best, for nearly 50 years, please check here and here 

Dare I also make an observation which may not go down well, and a little off topic (but not as far as a Winnebago) but you do bring it in your post, perhaps you might consider your signature, it reminds me of the recent tragic events in Christchurch NZ (interesting coincidence there) and elsewhere. It's a both crass and sadly technically untrue.


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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

DavecUK said:


> I'll bet they won't send you a new number 20
> 
> 
> 
> ...


LOL how dare you suggest - pimping a NZ - heretic. Badge of honour i say.

I'm going to ask the Niche team to Email me a "20" in an attachment and then i can safely Photoshop all future photos, and i can be part of the Niche-TwoZero indigogo campaign. A fortune awaits.


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## joe (Nov 13, 2014)

DavecUK said:


> I'll bet they won't send you a new number 20
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Or maybe Niche could be informed and, if it is an ongoing issue , they could look into it and maybe do something about it?

As many many people now own NZ's probably solely due to your review of it and that Niche now use that review in their marketing don't you think that it ill behoves you to be glib about any issues that people report about the product that you are a shill for? You can be considered in no way neutral in this...you lost that privilege when you agreed to write the review and let it be broadcast.

( full disclosure..... I bought a NZ based on reading your review and I am very happy with it... no problems so far )


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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

joe said:


> Or maybe Niche could be informed and, if it is an ongoing issue , they could look into it and maybe do something about it?
> 
> As many many people now own NZ's probably solely due to your review of it and that Niche now use that review in their marketing don't you think that it ill behoves you to be glib about any issues that people report about the product that you are a shill for? You can be considered in no way neutral in this...you lost that privilege when you agreed to write the review and let it be broadcast.
> 
> ( full disclosure..... I bought a NZ based on reading your review and I am very happy with it... no problems so far )


I didn't read it as glib at all, and "shill" please @joe check the meaning - saying @DavecUK is a trickster or conman, you really need to think carefully about the consequences of saying that about anyone in a public forum.


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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

Meanwhile back to my beloved Niche, i looked at it this morning and noticed it said FILTER DRIP .

I don't like drips i thought, maybe the Niche is sending me wisdom.









So i gave it a little finger rub while pouring my morning Tanzanian Onion










Now it would have been crass to share my middle finger, so just to confirm it's my index finger


















Finally, try taking a photo of the finger you normally take photos with, it is not easy....


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## 4085 (Nov 23, 2012)

Agentb said:


> Feel free to say what you please, perhaps you enjoy stirring the pot - your signature suggests so, and that bemuses me, i'll touch on that later.. Normally i'd not consider this worthy of a reply, and please i won't be at all upset if you use this use this link
> 
> I have explained how i use the NZ and how it has occurred but if you imagine me deliberately rubbing off number 20 off with an angle grinder or nail-file so i can seek attention in the forum, wonderful. If you have been peeking through the windows of Niche owners and have photographic evidence - better still share it with everyone.
> 
> ...


Oh dear, someone has really spat their dummy out of the pram! Not being a statistician, I understand in probability of the majority. Since the majority have not suffered this problem, then what is the cause. It can only be your methodology. I did say quite clearly it would not be intentional but that aside, perhaps you can eloquently offer another suggestion as to the cause.

As for the rest of your diatribe, fair games. It bothers me not that you leap on the back of a tragic event in New Zealand (strange that is shares the shorter NZ as well) to try and ridicule or criticise me in that ever so popular social media sort of way by appealing to the masses. What is wrong with urban myth? it gives us something to laugh about, so thank you very much for pointing that out to us all. So, to sum up, because I dare to suggest the the fault might be user error, you go into hyperdrive.......maybe it is time to grow up.......and for the record, reply in any way that you like, but I will not comment further on this thread


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Agentb said:


> I didn't read it as glib at all, and "shill" please @joe check the meaning - saying @DavecUK is a trickster or conman, you really need to think carefully about the consequences of saying that about anyone in a public forum.


Because like me, you have a sense of humour.....I have no idea why numbers are rubbing off on a few grinders. I have not had the issue on the US test grinder in over a year, perhaps I use it differently, perhaps a few only are affected, I really have no idea. You are the 2nd person I have seen mention it and of course, it's not within my gift to do anything about it, fix it or be anything but neutral about it. Presumably you will (or have already) mention it to Niche, because I am sure they would want to know....It may then be they can come up with some quality solutions going forward and even some ideas for any existing owners with the problem.

Thanks for your comments as well because you do get some people making rather unsavoury and ignorant comments on forums....who have no idea about the things I have done in the past, the stuff I refuse to review or absolutely slate and then they never see the light of day, at least in the UK market (I've given up trying to help the poor souls who insist on importing them).. It's also the reason why I do so few reviews now, limiting it to the really interesting products or things I directly use myself

P.S. I actually think it's absolutely not OK for them to make the sort of comments they do and I believe it seriously drags the forum down. I suspect the same person wouldn't want to make the comment face to face to another human being


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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

MildredM said:


> Count yourself lucky to have numbers! Those early HG-1s didn't have anything whatsoever!


I bet they didn't have lovely bar towels either


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Agentb said:


> Feel free to say what you please, perhaps you enjoy stirring the pot - your signature suggests so, and that bemuses me, i'll touch on that later.. Normally i'd not consider this worthy of a reply, and please i won't be at all upset if you use this use this link
> 
> I have explained how i use the NZ and how it has occurred but if you imagine me deliberately rubbing off number 20 off with an angle grinder or nail-file so i can seek attention in the forum, wonderful. If you have been peeking through the windows of Niche owners and have photographic evidence - better still share it with everyone.
> 
> ...


 Perhaps in real terms Dfk is suggesting you that you need to get a grip of things - in this case the Niche.







I might add your keyboard as well but wont.

As I mentioned earlier I find it rather hard to see just why some ones fingers or thumbs should rub on the numbers. In my case and I suspect many others I haven't worried about this happening or even thought about it. This crops up so I look how I grasp it -.no chance what so ever of the numbers being rubbed off this way.








Maybe @DavecUK should do a video on how to grasp a Niche.

John

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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

@ajohn


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

This thread has turned out to be . . . dare one say it? Gripping


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## J_Fo (Dec 24, 2017)

MildredM said:


> This thread has turned out to be . . . dare one say it? Gripping


With lots of twists!


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## 9719 (Mar 29, 2015)

Dare I say it's rubbing off on me


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

joe said:


> Or maybe Niche could be informed and, if it is an ongoing issue , they could look into it and maybe do something about it?
> 
> As many many people now own NZ's probably solely due to your review of it and that Niche now use that review in their marketing don't you think that it ill behoves you to be glib about any issues that people report about the product that you are a shill for? You can be considered in no way neutral in this...you lost that privilege when you agreed to write the review and let it be broadcast.
> 
> ( full disclosure..... I bought a NZ based on reading your review and I am very happy with it... no problems so far )


Shill , lol , life is too short for this kind of post on here


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## filthynines (May 2, 2016)

+1 for DaveC not being a "shill" or anything like it. You can review something and give it an independently positive review. Unsurprising that somebody who undertakes such a review would want to sing its praises.

Also +1 for report it to Niche. It's more likely to be a "for your information" rather than anything else, but I'm sure they'd be pleased to iron out any niggles in future production. It will also help them figure out how prevalent the issue is.


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

I sometimes wonder . . . Someone asks if their numbers are wearing off their grinder and mentions they will let Niche know the ones on their grinder are. Next thing, the thread goes off into goodness knows what direction. Of course Niche will want to know, and of course it matters. And of course there ARE bigger things happening in the world but the little things matter too! If there is a problem Niche will want to sort it out - if they have been assured the product for the numbers they are currently using is long lasting and it isn't they will want to change what they use.


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## jimbojohn55 (Jan 15, 2016)

the niche is in Mk1 form eventually a MK2 will appear where any production/ wear issues will be addressed its just part of ongoing product refinement, The good news is that the Mk1 will likely retain its value as do many products as the original version before the bean counters get involved and start cutting corners (im looking at you Pavoni with your wonky post 74 lever forks) at which point many will say that the Mk1 is a better machine as the oak was standard and not an expensive option.

Well this is the pattern that tends to accompany everything from Cars to Hi Fi


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

MildredM said:


> I sometimes wonder . . . Someone asks if their numbers are wearing off their grinder and mentions they will let Niche know the ones on their grinder are. Next thing, the thread goes off into goodness knows what direction. Of course Niche will want to know, and of course it matters. And of course there ARE bigger things happening in the world but the little things matter too! If there is a problem Niche will want to sort it out - if they have been assured the product for the numbers they are currently using is long lasting and it isn't they will want to change what they use.


Little things do matter , but not to the point where something like this ends up with shill being thrown around . Imho. We get so desensitized to people's behaviour on the net ( I need a mirror for this too ) but it's still worth pointing out when it's a bit off.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Oh...I tried a Mr rubby on the numbers and letters of the US test Niche and nothing came off...so either OP must stop drinking drain cleaner each morning, or it's peculiar to that grinder.


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

DavecUK said:


> Oh...I tried a Mr rubby on the numbers and letters of the US test Niche and nothing came off...so either OP must stop drinking drain cleaner each morning, or it's peculiar to that grinder.


Hehe! Confession time. I almost sent dfk's Niche on to the next recipient minus the numbers! Cleaned it ready to go and the first wipe showed smudges . . . . I meant to contact Martin @Niche but totally forgot.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

I guess I'm just too careful...I am quite gentle with stuff I suppose....it's why the cat likes me so much!


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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

DavecUK said:


> I guess I'm just too careful...I am quite gentle with stuff I suppose....it's why the cat likes me so much!


I'm very gentle when it comes to rubbing!

I expect there are different grades of wire wool . . .


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

MildredM said:


> Hehe! Confession time. I almost sent dfk's Niche on to the next recipient minus the numbers! Cleaned it ready to go and the first wipe showed smudges . . . . I meant to contact Martin @Niche but totally forgot.


Did you use paint stripper ?







Mk1 etc. Suspect there has already been some Mk's. Nothing dramatic as far as I know.








Maybe you used Cif etc - doesn't scratch. It does but they aren't easy to see. I use that one for lapping in cast iron lathe parts. Stainless cleaners are even better 0 if that's the right word.








Seriously it might be interesting to know what you did use???

John

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## MildredM (Feb 13, 2017)

ajohn said:


> Did you use paint stripper ?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just my damp cloth. Some kind of micro fibre sort.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

MildredM said:


> Just my damp cloth. Some kind of micro fibre sort.










No wonder you use bottled water. Your tap water must be extremely hard.

If I wanted to get rid of grease, finger prints and my amazon 6" square babies flannels didn't work I'd use window cleaner on the same thing. Alcohol (IPA), water and a wetting agent. I am curious about what could cause problems. All I have wiped a few times is the funnel - covered in bean oil so a few bits stick after a while. Just the flannel.







Had to buy a large pack and thought they wouldn't last long. More a case of thowing away as fed up with the colour.

John

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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

Thanks for the suggestions, and the comedy touches







(which i might add didn't wear off any further numbers) - i have had an email reply back from Martin earlier this morning, less than a business day after sending it which is impressive for a small issue - and they are reviewing print durability with their supplier.


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## Nopapercup (Nov 6, 2016)

Did anyone get a response from Niche about numbers rubbing off? I've just cleaned the burrs and when taking the the outer ring off and putting it back on I noticed a lot of the numbers are rubbing off.


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## Inspector (Feb 23, 2017)

For now just E is slightly rubbed off on FINE.

Rest of the letter numbers markings are still ok


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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

Inspector said:


> For now just E is slightly rubbed off on FINE.
> 
> Rest of the letter numbers markings are still ok


 Nothing to worry about it's perfectly fin.?

.. and you should a have a PM.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Mine is a Niche from the first batch when they were just about delivered on time. I may have wiped the numbers etc once. I have wiped the slope in the funnel several times with a damp cloth.

Recently I decided to clean it out and noticed part of the lower leg of the E in fine was missing. Also noticed that I could hardly see through the lid so wiped it clean with a cloth damped with IPA  that's when I may have wiped over the letters as well.

I think I can say my missing bit has nothing to do with wiping. Looking at the word FINE I can see that the entire bottom of the word isn't as it ideally should be and that the lid overlaps this area. There are very slight signs of marks on the main body in the same area. The only obvious damage is to the E. All of the other lettering is ok.

Tricky problem to solve but moving the lettering in a touch might help other than any eventual marks on the body - probably spoil the looks a little though. Smaller letters? pass. The grinder has done 2 or 3 shots a day since I have had it. The average would be closer to 2 than 3  mainly because I don't use new gear to make a drink for my wife until I am happy with it.

John

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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

ajohn said:


> I think I can say my missing bit has nothing to do with wiping. Looking at the word FINE I can see that the entire bottom of the word isn't as it ideally should be and that the lid overlaps this area. There are very slight signs of marks on the main body in the same area. The only obvious damage is to the E. All of the other lettering is ok.


 Nothing to worry about about it's perfectly finf.?

edit: like minf


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Agentb said:


> Nothing to worry about about it's perfectly finf.?
> 
> edit: like minf


 Not fine really. It needs fixing. We are buying prototypes and things like this will crop up  maybe worse to come. Hope not.

I'd suspect if some one looked at the design on paper the lid shouldn't touch the lettering but mouldings may not come out completely distortion free and there is play in the hinge. The lid is supported on 2 points so it can tilt. Probably what's happening, that might even be down to the lid closed detection switch pressing upwards on one side.

A designers lot is not a happy one on things like this, we're supposed to think of everything that might happen. I'm more concerned about slight signs of marks on the main body colour as that will probably get worse and more of fine will go. Rather than me trying to add some shallow stick on buffers to the body or lid I think I will try jacking the hinge up a bit, couple of layers of sellotape maybe. Good long term solution - pass. I suspect any other solution needs tooling mods- might not need new ones though. Just moving the letters leaves marks on the body.

John

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## tohenk2 (Oct 11, 2017)

Would some sort of screen protector film help?



ajohn said:


> Just moving the letters leaves marks on the body.


 How would you move the letters?


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

tohenk2 said:


> Would some sort of screen protector film help?
> 
> How would you move the letters?


 I wouldn't - it would have to be done when they are printed. The solution is up to Mr Niche. I'm doing something else at the moment but will see if a bit of packing under the hinge helps when I'm finished.  I'm a bit disappointed that the teddy bear part of my grouphead mirror isn't that apparent in use.

Anyway I wouldn't let this put people off. From a use point of view it's minor. The main thing about the grinder is the scale and how easy that is to use - a big advantage over all other options in some ways especially ones fitted with similar quality burrs. Even on flats they are a pain to set and even more so if the same setting is required again.

John

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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

ajohn said:


> I wouldn't - it would have to be done when they are printed. The solution is up to Mr Niche. I'm doing something else at the moment but will see if a bit of packing under the hinge helps when I'm finished.  I'm a bit disappointed that the teddy bear part of my grouphead mirror isn't that apparent in use.
> 
> Anyway I wouldn't let this put people off. From a use point of view it's minor. The main thing about the grinder is the scale and how easy that is to use - a big advantage over all other options in some ways especially ones fitted with similar quality burrs. Even on flats they are a pain to set and even more so if the same setting is required again.
> 
> ...


 John just let Niche know...must a problem with an early batch is my suspicion. I've seen tests of the printing with all sorts of liquids and rubbing and it doesn't come off, I never had any issue with any test grinders either and the long term US grinder has been fine.

It's important to let Niche know!


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Ok Dave

More interested in a quick fix at the moment. Mine is pretty late - later calibration ring version.

I've packed the hinge up with a strip of thin card ~0.4mm thick. If anyone does that make the hole for the screw first as the strip needs to be rather narrow - say about 6mm wide

Helps a lot and doesn't look to move the same elsewhere. Not by the Fine though. Pressure on the lid causes it to touch. It's lid touching that has caused mine grief not cleaning.  I'd only clean that sort of thing with window cleaner or IPA. I used IPA once so far as I drink what comes out. I'd be surprised if it caused the printing problems - very surprised. The wear was there before I did this anyway.

So at the moment I have stuck a narrow strip of a double thickness insulating tape between fine and 10. It goes around the edge. Might be able to thicken the packing but that might move wear on the letters to some where else. Lop sided packing via insulating tape on the card might be ok or might just move it to the other side.

John

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## Nopapercup (Nov 6, 2016)

DavecUK said:


> John just let Niche know...must a problem with an early batch is my suspicion. I've seen tests of the printing with all sorts of liquids and rubbing and it doesn't come off, I never had any issue with any test grinders either and the long term US grinder has been fine.
> 
> It's important to let Niche know!


 I emailed Niche about this yesterday and impressively they came straight back to me. They asked me to hold on a short while as they are having top casings made so those of us with the issue will be able to replace them.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Nopapercup said:


> I emailed Niche about this yesterday and impressively they came straight back to me. They asked me to hold on a short while as they are having top casings made so those of us with the issue will be able to replace them.


 You can't ask for more than that really.


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## ajohn (Sep 23, 2017)

Nopapercup said:


> I emailed Niche about this yesterday and impressively they came straight back to me. They asked me to hold on a short while as they are having top casings made so those of us with the issue will be able to replace them.


 Same here.  just hope it's the blackish version  Sure it will be.

John

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## phario (May 7, 2017)

@Nopapercup @Agentb @ajohn

This thread is from early this year. Can you all update the group as to what the eventual resolution was? Did anything result from the Niche support contact?

I ordered the White Niche but am wondering about this issue.


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## Nopapercup (Nov 6, 2016)

phario said:


> @Nopapercup @Agentb @ajohn
> 
> This thread is from early this year. Can you all update the group as to what the eventual resolution was? Did anything result from the Niche support contact?
> 
> I ordered the White Niche but am wondering about this issue.


 It was only an issue with a run of the very first white ones made so if you're buying a new one it won't be a problem. Niche are going to pick up my machine and replace the top casing for me. Their customer service has been excellent.


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## Agentb (Feb 11, 2017)

phario said:


> I ordered the White Niche but am wondering about this issue


 As @Nopapercup has said their service has been exceptional and matches the quality of their grinder.

Any issues that have appeared, (including this one) they have been quick to respond with a good solution.

Email them at the usual [email protected] and James or one of the team will reply.👍👍


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