# Is it normal for light roasts to stall a Mazzer SJ?



## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

My SJ has real trouble with lighter roasts, namely Hasbean but I'm sure other light roasts would do the same.

When I changed the burrs I fitted the more aggressive ones but I believe I was told that the agressive ones were for EU grinders and the less aggressive for US grinders. This stalling was very bad when the burrs were first changed and happened on most roasts and now only really on the lighter ones. Before I changed the Burrs I don't remember it happening at all.


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

That does not sound right Dylan, I have the Mazzer Mini E with S /J burrs in and with Hasbean's beans set exceedingly fine it does not stall or slow.









Could it be a winding problem ? that would reduce the power ?


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## monkey66 (Aug 8, 2014)

I have never managed to get close to stalling my SJ. Are the burrs you fitted made by Mazzer?


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

When my K30 was stalling some folks on HB said this was a common problem on SJs fitted with the more aggressive burrs.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Burrs are defo Mazzer, bought from a catering suppliers and came in the mazzer packet.

Jeebsy, thanks, that's interesting, I'll post up a pic of the burrs to see if those who have never had a SJ stall have a different cut. Do you remember the thread on HB?


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

I've not heard of this but I know a man who'll probably know. @coffeechap


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

The No on rear of standard S/J Mazzer burrs is 0033M


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## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

El carajillo said:


> The No on rear of standard S/J Mazzer burrs is 0033M


Could be wrong, but the other (33T) blades are for three phase, so the motor has more.. (was going to put oomph, but that's probably trademarked now) power?


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

i have never stalled an sj ever, have stalled the nino when using too heavy a weight when single dosing, I suspect that the power of the sj motor is just not up to the job on the burrs you have fitted.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

http://www.home-barista.com/grinders/mahlkonig-k30-jamming-t35792-30.html#p406738


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

coffeechap said:


> i have never stalled an sj ever, have stalled the nino when using too heavy a weight when single dosing, I suspect that the power of the sj motor is just not up to the job on the burrs you have fitted.


Just out of interest. Has anyone ever fitted more agressive burrs to Major? E.g Royal burrs


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Thanks Jeebsy and CC, I'll have a look at the burrs tomorrow to see what they are.

CC, does it sound right that there is one set of burrs for the American SJ with lower voltage and one for the EU version, as I didn't think the SJ came in a three phase version?


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

it certainly sounds plausible


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Cool, can't remember who told me that, but I remember asking when ordering as I couldn't figure out why there were two.


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## Rhys (Dec 21, 2014)

Mazzer website lists the burrs, and what phase they are for. Click Super Jolly and it shows the M & T burrs (for single and three phase)


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Dylan said:


> My SJ has real trouble with lighter roasts, namely Hasbean but I'm sure other light roasts would do the same.
> 
> When I changed the burrs I fitted the more aggressive ones but I believe I was told that the agressive ones were for EU grinders and the less aggressive for US grinders. This stalling was very bad when the burrs were first changed and happened on most roasts and now only really on the lighter ones. Before I changed the Burrs I don't remember it happening at all.


I doubt you fitted 3 phase burrs, but it's possible. What is more likely is the motor capacitor is going bad, which will reduce torque, especially starting torque. I would recommend changing it, especially if you have the correct burrs fitted.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

Capacitor is a cheap fix too.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Thanks Dave, I was worried it was a motor coil, so good to know that's more likely.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Had something similar with a fiorenzato which was the capacitor, however this was doing it under the lightest of load, switched it out and voila perfect again.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

Burrs say 033T on them, so looks like I have 3 phase burrs, makes sense as it happened after the change. I'll pick up some normal ones if I want to get some more light roasts.

Cheers for the help everyone.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Dylan said:


> Burrs say 033T on them, so looks like I have 3 phase burrs, makes sense as it happened after the change. I'll pick up some normal ones if I want to get some more light roasts.
> 
> Cheers for the help everyone.


Oops...still it's an easy fix, those 3 phase burrs may be faster, but need much more power. I was doubtful you would have fitted them, because most Vendors don't carry them, those that do, should no to warn/ask people if they really have a 3 phase grinder.

Perhaps after reading this, people will think twice about fitting standard super jolly burrs to the Mini E to make it grind faster....because I think it's a something that puts the mini E under more strain that it was designed for.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

DavecUK said:


> Oops...still it's an easy fix, those 3 phase burrs may be faster, but need much more power. I was doubtful you would have fitted them, because most Vendors don't carry them, those that do, should no to warn/ask people if they really have a 3 phase grinder.
> 
> Perhaps after reading this, people will think twice about fitting standard super jolly burrs to the Mini E to make it grind faster....because I think it's a something that puts the mini E under more strain that it was designed for.


with dave on this one, the power of the mini electronic is just not up too the requirements of the sj burrs, hence why they have the specific mini e burrs!


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

MINI E. With standard E burrs Initial draw 2.8 amps Running 0.5 amps MINI E With S /J burrs Initial draw 2.5 amps Running 0.6 amps. Using same beans and settings.


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

DavecUK said:


> Oops...still it's an easy fix, those 3 phase burrs may be faster, but need much more power. I was doubtful you would have fitted them, because most Vendors don't carry them, those that do, should no to warn/ask people if they really have a 3 phase grinder.
> 
> Perhaps after reading this, people will think twice about fitting standard super jolly burrs to the Mini E to make it grind faster....because I think it's a something that puts the mini E under more strain that it was designed for.


It was from a catering suppliers (lfspares), but what you say is true, imagine if I was a shop owner... many wouldn't have had a clue what was wrong... I certainly didn't for ages.


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## jeebsy (May 5, 2013)

LF isn't really for shop owners though so there's more onus on you to know what you're doing


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

El carajillo said:


> MINI E. With standard E burrs Initial draw 2.8 amps Running 0.5 amps MINI E With S /J burrs Initial draw 2.5 amps Running 0.6 amps. Using same beans and settings.


So exactly how are you measuring this?


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

DavecUK said:


> So exactly how are you measuring this?


Clamp meter with max read hold.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

El carajillo said:


> Clamp meter with max read hold.


Let me be direct then, I personally no longer own either of these grinders, but for the sake of others. Are you posting this to state that it's perfectly OK to put more aggressive SJ burrs in a Mazzer Mini and that I and coffeechap are wrong, because you have not said, just implied?

Is it a the clamp meter you have suitable for measuring the very brief inrush currents of these motors, most are not and don't measure it correctly, also what's the point you are making?

Does the motor have sufficient toque to properly operate with SJ burrs?

Do you know why Mazzer make 2 types of burrs for the SJ and Mini E?


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## El carajillo (Mar 16, 2013)

Dave you asked me a simple straight forward question, this I answered

I am not posting to say it is" perfectly OK "to fit S/J burrs in the mini E. I have fitted them and I know other members have also done this (And I believe on other forums)

I am not "implying " anything. I posted the "surprising" measurements / readings that I found.

The clamp meter is a CHAUVIN ARNOUX +/- 2% reading As it has a fast response I can only assume it is suitable / accurate.

I am not trying to make/ score points. I posted the measurements which appear to show little difference in the start and running load of both burr sets.

The motor would appear to have sufficient torque as I have not heard it slow or struggle or stall when grinding. Also the measurements I posted appear to show little difference in load.

If CC can get hold of a Mini E would you run some tests and give the forum your results please.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

El carajillo said:


> 1. I am not posting to say it is" perfectly OK "to fit S/J burrs in the mini E. I have fitted them and I know other members have also done this (And I believe on other forums)
> 
> 2. I am not "implying " anything. I posted the "surprising" measurements / readings that I found.
> 
> ...


1. So why did you post

2. why was it was surprising to you, you just posted a 1 liner with no explanation?

3. No idea, lots of models of that meter (I don't know which one you have) or whether yours is suitable for the measurement you are trying to make (whatever it is).

4. I wouldn't expect to see a huge difference...why did you?

5. Perhaps, perhaps not, but how did you measure the speed of the motor, or the time taken to come up to enough speed to come off the starting windings/cap? Mazzer don't think so, or they wouldn't make a specific burrset for the Mini E

*6. No really can't be bothered with that, I gave my advice, which is not to fit SJ burrs to a Mini E, you appear to disagree with that and if you want to reassure people who do it...fine.*





*
*One thing to think about is the possible effects of increased loading on the motors capacitor. Mazzer do suggest an on/off duty cycle to presumably prevent cooking the capacitor, I would imagine increased load affects this.


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## monkey66 (Aug 8, 2014)

I could be wrong but wouldn't the current draw be almost constant (regardless of load) on a sator type electric motor for any given voltage. Wouldn't this be dictated by the resistance of the coils relitave to the voltage?

On other words not particularly relevant to potential stalling issues.

I could be wrong here though.


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

Blimey Dave. I think that's a bit of an over reaction.

Whether you're right or wrong there no need to get quite so wound up.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

urbanbumpkin said:


> Blimey Dave. I think that's a bit of an over reaction.
> 
> Whether you're right or wrong there no need to get quite so wound up.


I'm not wound up...







..it's just a forum.


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## urbanbumpkin (Jan 30, 2013)

I'd hate to see you when you are then


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

urbanbumpkin said:



> I'd hate to see you when you are then


Well don't become a manufacturer, because I give them very short shrift sometimes. QuickMill really hated me for a few days, until their owner spoke to me and realised I had a point (s), I had been trying to make over and over and over again.....all for you guys of course, just so you get better machines..


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

In that case can you talk to mr eureka and ask him to add an easy way to go from dose 1 to dose 2 to manual on the 65e ... Going from 1 to 2 looks easy .... But switching to manual isn't an easy 3rd option .... Cheers


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## Dylan (Dec 5, 2011)

DavecUK said:


> Well don't become a manufacturer, because I give them very short shrift sometimes. QuickMill really hated me for a few days, until their owner spoke to me and realised I had a point (s), I had been trying to make over and over and over again.....all for you guys of course, just so you get better machines..


Our Hero.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

Dylan said:


> Our Hero.


Thx


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## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

h1udd said:


> In that case can you talk to mr eureka and ask him to add an easy way to go from dose 1 to dose 2 to manual on the 65e ... Going from 1 to 2 looks easy .... But switching to manual isn't an easy 3rd option .... Cheers


surely you just press the single and double dose buttons simultaneously which puts you into manual mode? or is that not what you meant?


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

Yes, that's what I meant ... But you have to hold both buttons down for around 5 seconds .... I know in theory it's a small matter ... But if you want a quick purge or to top up a shot, it's annoying (and this was just a demo I haven't bought one yet)

for the sake of another button so you can do a quick purge then grind ... Or grind and top up it would make buying one a no brainier ...... A lot of people use the dose buttons for a 1s shit and then there normal amount .... But because I switch between shot sizes regularly. I require the 2 dose buttons AND an instant manual

yes I know, petty !!!!


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## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

that's a fair point and the three button approach is better. i guess most people don't switch between single and double shots at home. however, when pressing both buttons simultaneously, it changes to on demand almost instantly - you don't have to hold the buttons for 5 seconds.


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## h1udd (Sep 1, 2015)

oh really ??? .... I wonder if there is a mk1-2 thing or the one I played with was mental ... because it took a good 5 seconds for it to lock in to manual ?

ach, its was easier buying a new coffee machine than grinder


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## reneb (Nov 2, 2011)

well, it's instant on my 65e. suspect the control panel on the 75e is identical as well, wonder if there was a problem with the one you tested or if they have changed the spec at some point. perhaps others with 65e/75es can comment, but this is a bit "off topic"







perhaps best to start a new thread.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

h1udd said:


> for the sake of another button so you can do a quick purge then grind ... Or grind and top up it would make buying one a no brainier ...... A lot of people use the dose buttons for a 1s shit and then there normal amount .... But because I switch between shot sizes regularly. I require the 2 dose buttons AND an instant manual
> 
> yes I know, petty !!!!


What I did was have one button programmed for the shots I wanted and the other programmed for a 1s burst. Perhaps you can fulfil the function of 2 dose buttons required by simply having 1 button set for a single dose and press twice for a double?


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