# Double or single espresso



## owain

I just have a few questions/observations apologies in advance if they are a little obvious.

So from what I can tell a double shot of espresso is 18g of coffee which takes about 25-30 seconds in a single glass 2floz?. So a single would 1floz each in 2 glasses?. I've just ordered some glasses with volume lines on to help out with this, but for now are the above observations correct?

Thank you


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## The Systemic Kid

Don't mix weight with volume. Weigh output. Start with a 1:2 ratio so 18grms of coffee to produce 36grms of espresso in 25-30secs.


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## Mrboots2u

Brew by weight not volume , aim for a tasty drink , not a particular size or name

reading here

http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?22879-Beginners-Reading-Weighing-Espresso-Brew-Ratios


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## owain

Mrboots2u said:


> Brew by weight not volume , aim for a tasty drink , not a particular size or name
> 
> reading here
> 
> http://coffeeforums.co.uk/showthread.php?22879-Beginners-Reading-Weighing-Espresso-Brew-Ratios


That's the article that got me thinking , I doubt my small scales will come for a few days so I was going to mark on my cup. I'll just be patient and wait until they arrive. Thanks


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## insatiableOne

I am currently using 12g in (double basket) getting 35g out.

That is.. ratio? Coming from my La Pavoni Stadivari Gran Romantica SGR


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## mathof

I use the Italian proportions: 7g in basket for a single, 14g for a double. I usually pull between 17g and 21g in the cup for a single, depending on the beans. I find the relatively large standard shots in third wave cafés too rich and caffeine-laden for my tastes; but only experimentation will lead you to your preferred measures.

Matt


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## Jumbo Ratty

insatiableOne said:


> I am currently using 12g in (double basket) getting 35g out.
> 
> That is.. ratio? Coming from my La Pavoni Stadivari Gran Romantica SGR


That would be a ration of almost 1:3 which is known as a Lungo

This is my preferred ratio.

And I also agree with the standard espresso dose being in multiples of 7 grams > 7g = a single 14g = a double.


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## h1udd

I dont believe in singles or doubles ... not sure I even believe in ristrettos

I just believe in espresso and a ratio


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## seeq

My standard dose is 18g (tends to vary between 17.5-19 depending on bean). Then I tend to pour around 21g out. For darker roasts I do a fairly longer shot. Technically that is a double dose providing a single shot. It's stronger than a single and too small to split for a double. But that's my preference, so as @h1udd said no such things as singles or doubles!


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## fluffles

seeq said:


> My standard dose is 18g (tends to vary between 17.5-19 depending on bean).


Why would the bean make you change dose?


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## seeq

fluffles said:


> Why would the bean make you change dose?


I prefer lighter roasts shorter and darker roasts longer. So I always start with a higher dose of a lighter roast to achieve roughly the same size drink each time. Probably completely unnecessary but I've always done it.


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## h1udd

I change the weight of the bean in the pavoni and microcasa ... But only because that's easier than trying to change the water dosage in these pesky levers


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## insatiableOne

Jumbo Ratty said:


> That would be a ration of almost 1:3 which is known as a Lungo
> 
> This is my preferred ratio.
> 
> And I also agree with the standard espresso dose being in multiples of 7 grams > 7g = a single 14g = a double.


Any more dose with this bean hits the screen with a light tamp. That & it is tooo strong, gets extremely bitter from over extracting due to the machine starting to choke.


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## Mrboots2u

insatiableOne said:


> Any more dose with this bean hits the screen with a light tamp. That & it is tooo strong, gets extremely bitter from over extracting due to the machine starting to choke.


Shorter shots (1:1 - 1:5 ) may tend to be nominally under extracted ( measured by specialty coffee association guidelines ) and strong - this doesn't mean that they aren't tasting bitter to someone ( or tasty to others - there is some sweetness under 18 percent extraction yield depending on the grinder used ) but it's also more likely than the strength of the shot produced coule be Masking any real notes this can also be read as over powering or bitter by some .

This is where deciding what to do in terms of adjustment to achieve balance can be difficult .

Tatste and extraction aren't liner ..


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## insatiableOne

I can go with that.

As you said..it is difficult to determine at times in what direction to follow. Drop the dose or open the grind.

Can definitely have you chasing your tail especially when you roasted the beans too. Just another factor to screw up.


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## owain

So I had 14 grams of coffee and 47 grams of espresso over 27 seconds, not sure what is but tastes full and fruity ️, as my small scales haven't arrived I couldn't weigh the shot as it was being pulled I had to weigh empty glass then I weighed after the 27 seconds


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## The Systemic Kid

Try tightening the grind and go for 28grms out from 14grms of beans in same amount of time and see what you think.


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