# Rave Colombia Suarez - Issues



## tommyp215 (Apr 2, 2016)

Has anyone had any of this recently? I've ordered this a few times and always enjoyed it however the lastest kg (roast date 15.10) has been awful. I would describe the taste as rancid, sour, metallic. I've never had any issues with rave and they are one of my favourite roasters. As such I was convinced it was my machine (gaggia classic) to the extent that I bought a new boiler thermostat but no improvement. I now think its the beans again as I dug a my V60 this morning and it tasted equally bad in a pour over. Has anyone had any issues with this bean recently? Im now going to order some other tried and tested beans to eliminate the machine as the cause.


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## ajh101 (Dec 21, 2013)

This has happened to me too with a different Rave blend. Beans are a natural product and will change during the year. The roastes will undoubtedly do what they can but are not magicians.


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## johnealey (May 19, 2014)

Two things:

1) have you contacted Rave to let them know of your issue?

2) given you have changed brew methods, have you tried changing waters to see if that is what is causing the issue ? (assuming all other variables the same)

John


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

tommyp215 said:


> Has anyone had any of this recently? I've ordered this a few times and always enjoyed it however the lastest kg (roast date 15.10) has been awful. I would describe the taste as rancid, sour, metallic. I've never had any issues with rave and they are one of my favourite roasters. As such I was convinced it was my machine (gaggia classic) to the extent that I bought a new boiler thermostat but no improvement. I now think its the beans again as I dug a my V60 this morning and it tasted equally bad in a pour over. Has anyone had any issues with this bean recently? Im now going to order some other tried and tested beans to eliminate the machine as the cause.


Did you try changing your recipe , do you have a recipe ?

Also contact Rave , im sure they will replace it .


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## tommyp215 (Apr 2, 2016)

Hi John, not yet as only tried v60 today. The water I use hasn't changed ( Brita) so made the assumption this was not to blame. I'll head to tesco though and get some ashbeck to discount this variable.


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## tommyp215 (Apr 2, 2016)

It's 2:1 17g in 34g out in about 25s


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

tommyp215 said:


> It's 2:1 17g in 34g out in about 25s


If it didnt taste good, did you change it ?


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## chimpsinties (Jun 13, 2011)

I had a bag of something from them a month ago I also just couldn't get it right using my classic. Think it might have been this bean. I was having a slight leak at the time with my Classic so sacked the whole machine off and bought a new one. Slight upgrade to a Rocket Appartamento. Haha. I've since re-calibrated my grinder as I think part of my issue was I wasn't getting fine enough and under-extracting. I've since had my regular 1kg of Itallian Job from Rave and have no issues at all. Makes me wonder if they just had a bit of a dodgy batch, a bad day, etc? Almost tempted to try again with it next time as I did used to like this bean.


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## jen1979 (Feb 20, 2012)

I have previously used a Columbia Suarez from my favourite coffee shop and loved it. I bought some from Rave a couple of months ago and didn't find it as good. Maybe they have had a bad batch. Definitely worth contacting them.


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## tommyp215 (Apr 2, 2016)

Just to update this- just received some Brighton Lanes and there was no sourness and smooth as I remember - therefore I'm concluding the Suarez I got was just a bad batch.


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

tommyp215 said:


> Just to update this- just received some Brighton Lanes and there was no sourness and smooth as I remember - therefore I'm concluding the Suarez I got was just a bad batch.


easy to blame the beans , did you adjust the recipe when it didnt taste optimal ?


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

tommyp215 said:


> Just to update this- just received some Brighton Lanes and there was no sourness and smooth as I remember - therefore I'm concluding the Suarez I got was just a bad batch.


It's still worth feeding back to the roaster.... in fact only fair to do so. People can post on forums, but really the first port of call should be the roaster.


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## tommyp215 (Apr 2, 2016)

The purpose of the post was not a moan fest and just wanted to see if I was the only one having issues with the beans, I like rave and will continue to use them, but if a forums only use is to discuss good points and not bad what's the points? Mrboots2u as said I tried it with pour over (I did try some other ratios to), it tasted plain wrong it wasn't a case of tinkering to bring out the intricacies of the taste. I will send it back to rave.


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

tommyp215 said:


> The purpose of the post was not a moan fest and just wanted to see if I was the only one having issues with the beans, I like rave and will continue to use them, but if a forums only use is to discuss good points and not bad what's the points? Mrboots2u as said I tried it with pour over (I did try some other ratios to), it tasted plain wrong it wasn't a case of tinkering to bring out the intricacies of the taste. I will send it back to rave.


It's not a case of discussing good/bad based on the info we have, it's just difficult for anyone to understand exactly what the tangible issue is if you don't discuss that ("different ratios/pourover" isn't enough to be informative). It's good that Rave will get the opportunity to evaluate the bag.


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## DavecUK (Aug 6, 2013)

tommyp215 said:


> The purpose of the post was not a moan fest and just wanted to see if I was the only one having issues with the beans, I like rave and will continue to use them, but if a forums only use is to discuss good points and not bad what's the points? Mrboots2u as said I tried it with pour over (I did try some other ratios to), it tasted plain wrong it wasn't a case of tinkering to bring out the intricacies of the taste. I will send it back to rave.


You post (as below) which although I am sure is a totally accurate rendition of what happened, is not hugely useful in getting help, because it's a broad spectrum comment that will receive a broad spectrum reply. e.g. temperature, grind, brew ratio, water, machine fault, grind, grinder, cleaning group, mine was OK, I had the same problem months ago (so a different batch), try another coffee etc...



> Has anyone had any of this recently? I've ordered this a few times and always enjoyed it however the lastest kg (roast date 15.10) has been awful. I would describe the taste as rancid, sour, metallic. I've never had any issues with rave and they are one of my favourite roasters. As such I was convinced it was my machine (gaggia classic) to the extent that I bought a new boiler thermostat but no improvement. I now think its the beans again as I dug a my V60 this morning and it tasted equally bad in a pour over. Has anyone had any issues with this bean recently? Im now going to order some other tried and tested beans to eliminate the machine as the cause.


I didn't imply it was a moan fest, I just said that go to the roaster first...if they say there was nothing unusual about that batch and they have not had any other reports of issues with the taste etc.. or any suggestions they offer don't work...then of course post on the forum. Your post would probably be something like the one below (with more details of course) and you may well not have had the aggravation of purchasing and fitting a new thermostat.

I am experiencing x and it's unusual/different to normal. I contacted Rave who said that there was no reports of a problem and the roast went normally for that batch. They suggested I try x and y and were happy to send me another bag/take the bag back etc... I tried X, Y and Z but it didn't help, so before I send the bag back I wanted to check if any of you guys noticed anything different with the coffee or have any suggestions.

They could equally have said there was a problem with that batch and they would like to send you another bag. Now I'm not trying to tell you to suck eggs here, but it seems a more detailed explanation was required so you would not take things the wrong way.

P.S. The roaster may even have a bag of the same batch in stock and would probably open one to try it for themselves before they even get yours back. this would allow them to offer some suggestions based on their bag.


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## Iris (Oct 29, 2018)

I buy Columbian saurez 1kg every month, I have never had a problem with it. I don't know if you maybe got a bad batch, contact Rave.


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## Grimley (Jan 18, 2015)

I've bought from Rave a fair few times in the past, not for over a year now. Colombian Suarez I liked a lot. A pity you are having problems, first call is with Rave as others have said here.


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## coffeechap (Apr 5, 2012)

Went into rave today and spoke to brook, he said they have received nothing via email from anyone re Suarez. Also said that if you contact them they will sort this out immediately!

Always best to go to the roaster first before putting stuff on forums.


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## tommyp215 (Apr 2, 2016)

Rave have been excellent they are sending me a new bag- great customer service.


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## chimpsinties (Jun 13, 2011)

I chucked a bag of it on my recent order. Now I've tuned my grinder a bit and got a new machine I'll give it another shot.


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## Craft House Coffee (Jan 13, 2017)

Its a tricky coffee. We bought a fair few sacks of the red association coffee. its a fantastic initiative to stabilise fair wages for producers who work with the project as well as being accessible to roasters all year round. Sadly we really didn't get on with a few of the harvest, some just couldn't shake this harsh metallic and astringent flavour, we could tame it, but it is always evident. A real shame but we had to stop using it.


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## 9719 (Mar 29, 2015)

Know the feeling, others 'Rave' about it, but when I have tried it on 3 or 4 occasions I have never gotten along with it. Good job there's plenty of other beans out there to try, including your good selves, looking forward to the b.friday beans I have resting at the moment.


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## chimpsinties (Jun 13, 2011)

I had a 250g bag with my last order and it was it was fine this time.


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## Rom (Jan 20, 2017)

I've had 2kg delivered over the weekend. I've bean (sees what I did there?







) using these as my regular go to bean for a long time now. Then I buy smaller amounts from other roasters.. mainly for brewed. I'll try them by the end of the week and report back..


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

What's the general consensus for ratios and extraction (using a gaggia classic) and just got a kilo of the saurez and it's been a year since I tried it and I remember having issues then although now my classic is armed with a PID so I'm hoping that will help.

it must just be Columbia's roasts in general as my current bean the Rio Magdalena has also proved very tricky!

id been interested to know peoples v60 recipes for the Suarez too


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## Rom (Jan 20, 2017)

I'm not using the Suarez in the above post at the mo, I ended up with about 4 kilos of beans so they went in the freezer. But on my old ECM machine I used to like mine at 18.5>34 in 32 ish


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## Rom (Jan 20, 2017)

With V60 I brew at 1:15 grinding with my Hausgrind but not 100% sure of the setting.


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

thanks for the info guys any info from fellow gaggia owners would be useful too so I can go into battle prepared!


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## Mrboots2u (May 10, 2013)

Breezy said:


> thanks for the info guys any info from fellow gaggia owners would be useful too so I can go into battle prepared!


A recipe will be based on personal preference not per se what machine you have.

I mean some of em wont have PID for instance so will be pulling at widly different temps anyway .

A pid will rule out temp this time .

Start where you normally start and taste , adjust or report back .


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## jj-x-ray (Dec 31, 2017)

I struggled with the Suarez beans on my gaggia......it currently sits bottom of my bean ranking.

I would love to taste it from people who have had success


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

jj-x-ray said:


> I struggled with the Suarez beans on my gaggia......it currently sits bottom of my bean ranking.
> 
> I would love to taste it from people who have had success


were you using it with a PID? as I know when I first used Foundrys Rio Magdalena which is similar I had lots of issues and it was completely different after a pid

I'm up for the challenge just hopefully not wasting a kilo of beans!


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## jj-x-ray (Dec 31, 2017)

No I have no pid and also typically struggled with foundry's beans...


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## Rom (Jan 20, 2017)

Shame because especially for the money I've found Columbia's Suarez a pretty good bean that quite forgiving. But as boots says, that's to my taste and also with my machine / grinder combo. I've been using it for about 3 years on and off, maybe more..

goid luck


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

Rom said:


> Shame because especially for the money I've found Columbia's Suarez a pretty good bean that quite forgiving. But as boots says, that's to my taste and also with my machine / grinder combo. I've been using it for about 3 years on and off, maybe more..
> 
> goid luck


Whats been your ratio and extraction preference ?


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## Rom (Jan 20, 2017)

Espresso and V60 are a few posts back


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

anyone else using the Suarez with a v60? atm I'm using a 1:16 ratio and getting an extraction time of around 3:15 but I'm not getting the sweetness and flavours coming through this is with 13.65g / 220ml

a slight sourness coming through which means I should be grinding finer? although reading the guides it seems there brew time to aim for is around 2:30 and I appreciate this can vary between beans

anyone else got some tried and tested recipes?


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Breezy said:


> anyone else using the Suarez with a v60? atm I'm using a 1:16 ratio and getting an extraction time of around 3:15 but I'm not getting the sweetness and flavours coming through this is with 13.65g / 220ml
> 
> a slight sourness coming through which means I should be grinding finer? although reading the guides it seems there brew time to aim for is around 2:30 and I appreciate this can vary between beans
> 
> anyone else got some tried and tested recipes?


Brew time is the biggest variable & has the least impact on a V60 (all else being equal).

2:30 can work 5:00 can work depending on your grind. 2:30 would need a fairly fine grind and a quick pour after bloom (this will also have the largest variation in time).

If you go coarse, just pour 20g every 20s in spirals (each pour take ~10s, bed may drain out between pours until the last 1 or 2), adjust finer until taste drops off.

What grinder & setting are you using?


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

MWJB said:


> Brew time is the biggest variable & has the least impact on a V60 (all else being equal).
> 
> 2:30 can work 5:00 can work depending on your grind. 2:30 would need a fairly fine grind and a quick pour after bloom (this will also have the largest variation in time).
> 
> ...


using my rhino hand grinder and a gooseneck kettle and 30sec bloom with 40g stir, 100g @ 30 secs, 40g @ 60 secs, remaining volume to 220g @ 90 secs

will try going coarser


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

went coarser but think it was too coarse as the grounds were cafitiere like, so tried coarser and the flavour improved but am i better off using the pusling method as supposed to 3 big pours?

seems the wrath of the suarez lives on even as a pour over!


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Breezy said:


> went coarser but think it was too coarse as the grounds were cafitiere like, so tried coarser and the flavour improved but am i better off using the pusling method as supposed to 3 big pours?
> 
> seems the wrath of the suarez lives on even as a pour over!


Sorry, you have lost me there. I brew cafetiere with finer or similar grinds as drip. For 20g every 20s pour you will be coarse, coarser that anything that will work in a cafetiere brew.

Why are you still doing 3 big pours? Grind size dovetails with pour regime - fine for big fast pours, coarse for small spaced out pours.


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

MWJB said:


> Sorry, you have lost me there. I brew cafetiere with finer or similar grinds as drip. For 20g every 20s pour you will be coarse, coarser that anything that will work in a cafetiere brew.
> 
> Why are you still doing 3 big pours? Grind size dovetails with pour regime - fine for big fast pours, coarse for small spaced out pours.


i tried the pulsed pours and i still wasnt getting good results tried a different bean which was still a medium to light roast same grind which was medium and about 6-7 clicks on the rhino.

pulsed pour - brew time around 4:10 tasted bitter

3 big pours and slightly coarser grind - brew time around 2:45 and a lot more depth of flavour so im guessing its just the variation in beans and grind

thanks for the help though still determined to crack the suarez although using my mignon to grind for the v60 may help but it just would be possible to switch between that and an espresso grind easily enough


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## MWJB (Feb 28, 2012)

Breezy said:


> i tried the pulsed pours and i still wasnt getting good results tried a different bean which was still a medium to light roast same grind which was medium and about 6-7 clicks on the rhino.
> 
> pulsed pour - brew time around 4:10 tasted bitter
> 
> ...


Getting a result you're happy with is the most important thing, so great you're seeing some improvement.

But a couple of things to bear in mind are:

If your recipe is sound, changing beans should not mean the wheels come off. Beans vary, sure, but not that much mechanically (the taste varies greatly with roast and origin but should only need minor tweaks).

The Rhino is perfectly capable of grinding consistently, no reason to think the mignon would be any moreso.


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

Glad to hear the rhino is perfectly suited for the job thanks again for the help, right Suarez take 2!


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## Breezy (Dec 16, 2014)

In other news I actually got round to trying this as an espresso with my haggis and mignonette and am please to say the recipe recommendations turned out great, it seems a right 2:1 shot is the way to go so I just had

17g > 30g in 27 seconds and I got the lovely sweetness, chocolate and caramel notes what a difference the PID makes on the gaggia along with giving the grinds a stir too.

beans were 4 weeks post roast too


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