# Sage Duo Temp Pro Review.



## ATZ

I've been thinking about writing this up for a while, so for the benefit of others looking to get into (or in my case back into) espresso thought it may be useful.

*Pros.*

1. Cost and value for money

Currently retailing at £379 from Lakeland with a 3 year guarantee, personally I think there isn't a machine in this price range as good. You can get it as cheap as £299 if you shop around but without the same level of guarantee as Lakeland, personally I think it's worth the extra for the piece of mind.

https://www.lakeland.co.uk/70535/Sage-The-Duo-Temp-Pro-Espresso-Coffee-Machine-BES810

2. PID and boiler purge

PID being fitted as standard the temp of the shots is very consistent. I've measured it using a cooking probe and the shot temp is usually very repeatable once the portafilter is nice and warm (more on this later).

Having the automatic boiler purge means there is no temp surfing between steaming and pulling shots. A big plus in my opinion.

3. Accessories

Coming with a tamper and inbuilt storage, a milk jug, backflush disk, cleaning tools and the razor dosing tool you have all the things you'd need to get started. For me the only unnecessary accessory is the razor, I've never used it or felt the need to.

4. Pre infusion and pressure ramp up

Once you have your grind dialled in the pre infusion then pressure ramp up of the vibration pump is pretty forgiving. I've managed to make shots on this better than most places on the high street, specialist shops aside.

5. Quick Heat up time

Press the button, let the pump purge, run a shot and you're pretty much set. That said I've found it best once a couple of shots have run though and the portafilter is nice and warm. To expedite the process you can run some water through the machine and into a cup and let the portafilter sit in it to really warm it quickly. Unfortunately you can't put the machine on a timer switch.

*Cons.*

1. 54mm Portafilter

More of an inconvenience than a big negative but it means accessories and extra portafilters are more difficult to obtain. Thanks to Joey from the forum I've been able to procure a naked PF that has helped with shot consistency, but this is a bespoke modification rather than something easily obtainable online or the high street.

2. Small drip tray

Collects both the drips and excess water but also the steam purge from the boiler. It fills up pretty quickly and although it has the indicator it's a little bit of a pain to be honest.

3. Steaming power

It's perfectly adequate and makes great micro foam once you learn the technique but it does take a while to heat up. I'm able to make 150ml of steamed milk in about 60-90sec so it's nowhere near the power a dedicated steam boiler would produce.

4. Lack of an OPV

Again an inconvenience rather than a straight negative. If you dial in your grind most of my pucks come out pretty dry and are removed with one quick knock. The exception is the finer grind decaff necessitates or if you choke the machine when dialling in a new bean - both can get pretty messy.

*Overall.*

I'm very pleased I went with the Duo Temp Pro as my first machine back into espresso. It's reliable, repeatable and convenient and makes great coffee once you learn its flow. I think it's excellent value for money.

It does lack the certain "wow" factor of shiny Italian machines but I wouldn't say it looks bad by any means, paired with a Niche you can have a set up for ~£750 that can rival some of the best coffee I've had.

Recommended.


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## pips

Great write up ATZ.

I'm in two minds currently between Sage Due Temp Pro paired with a Eureka Mignon or the Barista Express.


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## ATZ

pips said:


> Great write up ATZ.
> 
> I'm in two minds currently between Sage Due Temp Pro paired with a Eureka Mignon or the Barista Express.


Hey Pips,

I had the same dilemma initially but read some quite negative things about the inbuilt grinder on the Barista Express. The only advantage I see the BE having is the pressure gauge.

Personally I'd get the Mignon and a DTP.


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## ashcroc

Lakeland will price match most places. Their price has recently gone up too so expect a Black Friday deal that looks better than it is!


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## Amvantage

I think another minor con is the how long it takes to make multiple milk based drinks. Perfect for the odd latte in an instant whenever you fancy one and making two milk based drinks back to back is bearable but if youve got guests round and you need three or more it takes ages.

Brill machine but it does have its limits and I'm guessing the BE will suffer the same time issue.


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## ashcroc

Amvantage said:


> I think another minor con is the how long it takes to make multiple milk based drinks. Perfect for the odd latte in an instant whenever you fancy one and making two milk based drinks back to back is bearable but if youve got guests round and you need three or more it takes ages.
> 
> Brill machine but it does have its limits and I'm guessing the BE will suffer the same time issue.


To be fair, most thermoblock & SBDU machines suffer from this.


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## ATZ

Amvantage said:


> I think another minor con is the how long it takes to make multiple milk based drinks. Perfect for the odd latte in an instant whenever you fancy one and making two milk based drinks back to back is bearable but if youve got guests round and you need three or more it takes ages.
> 
> Brill machine but it does have its limits and I'm guessing the BE will suffer the same time issue.


In fairness I don't think the machine is pitched at doing this, but you're right, 300ml+ is a PITA.


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## adam85

Great Review!

As a 'newbie' with the exact same machine (also Black!), I finding that it does a fairly good job - and gives me coffee, at home, which isn't a million miles away from that in which I enjoy at the city down the road.

Realise that there's only so much quantity of milk you can process at once, but I've managed a couple of latte's fairly quickly on my machine!

Great to see the Niche... I only read about these things a few days back. Look interesting!


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## ATZ

adam85 said:


> Great Review!
> 
> As a 'newbie' with the exact same machine (also Black!), I finding that it does a fairly good job - and gives me coffee, at home, which isn't a million miles away from that in which I enjoy at the city down the road.
> 
> Realise that there's only so much quantity of milk you can process at once, but I've managed a couple of latte's fairly quickly on my machine!
> 
> Great to see the Niche... I only read about these things a few days back. Look interesting!


The niche goes really well with it, I've basically had zero channelling and much more consistent shots since it's arrived.

Someone much wiser than me on here once said spend as much (or more) on your grinder than your machine and it's stood me in good stead so far.


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## bubbles

Can I ask sage duo temp pro owners, have any of you backflushed your machine? I know the machine comes with the blanking disc to do it, but as this machine has no 3 way solenoid valve I thought backflushing was a no no and would damage the pump, but then again I sure SAGE wouldn't include the accessories to backflush if it might damage the machine?


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## ATZ

bubbles said:


> Can I ask sage duo temp pro owners, have any of you backflushed your machine? I know the machine comes with the blanking disc to do it, but as this machine has no 3 way solenoid valve I thought backflushing was a no no and would damage the pump, but then again I sure SAGE wouldn't include the accessories to backflush if it might damage the machine?


It's not a true back flush disk anyway, you get flow from the PF - The OPV will dump any excess pressure anyway.

I've never bothered personally as I regualry clean the head and take the distribution disk off about once a month for a deep clean.


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## PPapa

I backflush with water daily, backflush weekly with Cafiza and soak everything (basket, IMS shower screen, wand tip) in Cafiza weekly as well.

My usage is 2-4 drinks a day.


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## ATZ

PPapa said:


> I backflush with water daily, backflush weekly with Cafiza and soak everything (basket, IMS shower screen, wand tip) in Cafiza weekly as well.
> 
> My usage is 2-4 drinks a day.


Water hard your way Paul? Really soft water here so I don't bother.


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## PPapa

ATZ said:


> Water hard your way Paul? Really soft water here so I don't bother.


Soft water and filtered with BWT... I don't like smell of chlorine in water, but not really noticed much of a difference in coffee.


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## theclods

Hey ATZ, thanks for the great review on the DTP, I bit the bullet and bought one at the weekend. I got mine from Lakeland and they priced matched the John Lewis price of Â£299. I trialed a few shots at the weekend but definitely need to practice a lot more. I've upgraded from a Delonghi Icona so have never used a non-pressurised basket before. Next step is to look for a decent grinder as I am currently using a hacked Delonghi KG79 which just about grinds fine enough for espresso using the pressurised basket.


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## ATZ

theclods said:


> Hey ATZ, thanks for the great review on the DTP, I bit the bullet and bought one at the weekend. I got mine from Lakeland and they priced matched the John Lewis price of Â£299. I trialed a few shots at the weekend but definitely need to practice a lot more. I've upgraded from a Delonghi Icona so have never used a non-pressurised basket before. Next step is to look for a decent grinder as I am currently using a hacked Delonghi KG79 which just about grinds fine enough for espresso using the pressurised basket.


My experience with a less then ideal grinder is that you might need to up our dose a bit (18g) and make sure you distrubute well. With a good grinder a 16g dose works well in the standard non pressurised baskets. Best results for me have been with shot running around 30-40 seconds for your 2:1 weight to grinds output. Definitely weigh in and weight out if yo uhaven't been. Usually ending a shot 6grams short of target weight allows for the fact that the DTP doesn't have a 3 way valve.


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## theclods

Thanks, yeah I tried weighing the shots with my standard digital scales but i plan on ordering a proper scales that will fit on my machine. Managed to get the shot to come out at about 23 seconds with 10 seconds preinfusion with the current grinder so I reckon I'm on the right track and will get better with the decent grinder.


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## rsnidjik

Can someone tell me the dimensions of the box that the Sage Duo Temp Pro comes in? I'm talking about the original manufacturer's box, not the outside shipping carton. Thank you!


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## Carajillo Cortado

ATZ said:


> My experience with a less then ideal grinder is that you might need to up our dose a bit (18g) and make sure you distrubute well. With a good grinder a 16g dose works well in the standard non pressurised baskets. Best results for me have been with shot running around 30-40 seconds for your 2:1 weight to grinds output. Definitely weigh in and weight out if yo uhaven't been. Usually ending a shot 6grams short of target weight allows for the fact that the DTP doesn't have a 3 way valve.


 Hi,I have the DTP and the Smart grinder.

How comes that a double shot is 2oz,but we have to get 36ml of espresso out of the 18gr of coffee? I am a newbee,obviously,but using the double basket I aim to take out around 2oz for 36sec pre infusion imcluded,without any sourness or excessive bitterness.A bit confused,really.


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## Carajillo Cortado

bubbles said:


> Can I ask sage duo temp pro owners, have any of you backflushed your machine? I know the machine comes with the blanking disc to do it, but as this machine has no 3 way solenoid valve I thought backflushing was a no no and would damage the pump, but then again I sure SAGE wouldn't include the accessories to backflush if it might damage the machine?


 I did 3 times,and took the basket out lol


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